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As foreign companies leave Russia, their assets could be seized

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If any country is big enough to be a self sustaining fortress, it's Russia.

Russia has natural resources in abundance and produces surplus food.

Moreover, if China and Turkey continue to trade freely with Russia they'll have practically everything.

The only thing Russia won't have is brands.

Russians will still have hamburgers, coffee and t-shirts, they just won't be stamped McDonald's, Starbucks and Gap.

I bet in 5 years, Westerner will flock to Russia on vacation to see what a non-corporate, non-Tiktok society is like.

0 ( +9 / -9 )

Any company's assets can be seized by any country. This isn't just in Russia.

However, it is more likely to happen in dictatorships and by autocrats in places like Russia where rule of law is often overruled or selectively applied on the whims of a single person.

Do any lawsuits against the Russian state ever have the plaintiff win? Are those instances just not publicized?

In 5 yrs, either Russia will still be at war in Ukraine, completely disconnected from the democratic world or Putin will have been ousted from power, living in Siberia and Russians will get a western-like democracy and be looking to join NATO. ;)

Ok, perhaps not. /s

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Yep like I’ve said all along Russia has China now , the sanctions are pointless . He has the western world by the balls and he’s squeezing.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

I bet in 5 years, Westerner will flock to Russia on vacation to see what a non-corporate, non-Tiktok society is like.

You mean Soviet Russia? Yeah, we’ve seen that already. Most Russians don’t want that again though someone could make money starting up a black market importing rock n roll and blue jeans again.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Russia has natural resources in abundance and produces surplus food

It depends. Russia is self sufficient right now for most foods except fruits and berries. Russia only produces a third of what they need of those. The problem for Russia is that there will be no spare parts available for their farm equipment as the manufacturers are mostly American or European and they have withdrawn from Russia and closed their facilities. Even if the Russians could run the factories they will not have access to the electronics used in them. Hard to imagine but modern harvesters, farm tractors and construction equipment have a shedload of computers to run different systems, including the engine management, harvester controls, security systems, and the climate control and stereo systems in the operators compartment. The same problem will affect their food processing industry which is likewise reliant on western electronics to control processes and inventory management.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Hard to imagine but modern harvesters, farm tractors and construction equipment have a shedload of computers to run different systems, including the engine management, harvester controls, security systems, and the climate control and stereo systems in the operators compartment. The same problem will affect their food processing industry which is likewise reliant on western electronics to control processes and inventory management.

Errr.. Ummm. Elephant in the room.

Where is your smartphone made?

Where is your computer made?

China.

Russians and Chinese both have put up their own space stations. I think they can figure out tractors and coffee brewers.

If little old Cuba can snub the Western "brands", Russia could do it easily.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

Any company who decides to do business in an authoritarian/dictatorship risks assets being seized. They knew who they were getting into bed with. The same is true with companies in China.

It depends. Russia is self sufficient right now for most foods except fruits and berries. Russia only produces a third of what they need of those. The problem for Russia is that there will be no spare parts available for their farm equipment as the manufacturers are mostly American or European and they have withdrawn from Russia and closed their facilities. Even if the Russians could run the factories they will not have access to the electronics used in them. Hard to imagine but modern harvesters, farm tractors and construction equipment have a shedload of computers to run different systems, including the engine management, harvester controls, security systems, and the climate control and stereo systems in the operators compartment. The same problem will affect their food processing industry which is likewise reliant on western electronics to control processes and inventory management.

@Desert Tortoise........They will get them from China until domestic manufacturers developed their own. It is not like they cannot reverse engineer anything regarding basic machinery.

They are insulated as long as China is on their side. China is the key. Put the pressure on them then you Russia.

These situations will just make Russia and China more daring unless something is done.

They should be thought of as too big to fail.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

The only thing Russia won't have is brands.

Or anything that requires modern technology.

I bet in 5 years, Westerner will flock to Russia on vacation to see what a non-corporate, non-Tiktok society is like.

We have some idea of that, from North Korea.

Where is your smartphone made? 

Where is your computer made?

China.

They are mostly assembled in China, but the actual production of everything in a smartphone or computer - all the microprocessors and other things - are developed and produced across numerous countries.

Even China can’t produce these things on its own and it has an economy and workforce vastly superior to Russia’s.

Russians and Chinese both have put up their own space stations. I think they can figure out tractors and coffee brewers.

Yeah, Russia has some expertise in aerospace and military technology - and ONLY in those areas. It lacks the ability to produce anything else other than raw materials, its economy is not diversified at all, nor does it have the potential to do so.

If little old Cuba can snub the Western "brands", Russia could do it easily.

Sure, if Russians are happy to drive 60 year old cars and have incomes 1/10th of what they were a month ago, Cuba is a great inspiration I am sure.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Sure, if Russians are happy to drive 60 year old cars and have incomes 1/10th of what they were a month ago,

If it means that their brethren in the Donbass stop getting shelled, then so be it.

Russia has suffered far worse.

You can not break the will of the Russian people by taking away Instagram.

Especially since Instagram's parent company, Meta, says it's wrong to make posts about killing people, unless you're talking about Russians, then it's ok.

The arrogance and sheer hatred of Russians from the West is only uniting them further.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

You can not break the will of the Russian people by taking away Instagram.

Nobody is trying to beak the will of the Russian people. We’re just destroying the economic basis necessary for Russia to invade its neighbors.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

Sure, if Russians are happy to drive 60 year old cars and have incomes 1/10th of what they were a month ago,

If it means that their brethren in the Donbass stop getting shelled, then so be it.

Russia has suffered far worse.

You can not break the will of the Russian people by taking away Instagram.

It’s a great sacrifice to give up all these things so that Putin and his rich friends can continue to enjoy every luxury the west has to offer. What patriotism!

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

Russians and Chinese both have put up their own space stations. I think they can figure out tractors and coffee brewers.

The vast majority of Russians wouldn’t take their own vaccine. Why would a crappy domestic smartphone be any different?

Space stations cost a lot of money, the rich billionaire money pipe is closed now. But before all that you’d better figure out something simpler like airplanes because the replacement parts aren’t coming.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

Let the situation with Russia be a lesson to anyone who is thinking to make a profit in dictatorship countries. I would suggest to anyone who has any investments in China to liquidate all their assets there. Because China will be next under global sanctions over Taiwan!

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

Because China will be next under global sanctions over Taiwan!

In which case, America would turn into a madmax zone after 2 weeks.

You could not survive without Chinese imports.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

That is one way to make sure no foreign company ever invests in Russia again.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

@rainyday

Russia has some expertise in aerospace and military technology - and ONLY in those areas. It lacks the ability to produce anything else other than raw materials, its economy is not diversified at all, nor does it have the potential to do so

Wishful thinking. Russia produces nuclear power stations, icebreakers and jet liners, do you really think they can't produce much simpler goods?

We’re just destroying the economic basis necessary for Russia to invade its neighbors

Yawn. Remember Obama in 2014 after Crimea? "Russian economy in tatters". Eight years ago. Yeah, sure. Amuse yourselves, keep destroying.

@Bob Fosse

It’s a great sacrifice to give up all these things so that Putin and his rich friends can continue to enjoy every luxury the west has to offer

Wait a minute, we were told the West confiscated all the spoils, all the gazilion of dollars Putin and his friends stacked in West, right? And they can't now come to the West, right?

The vast majority of Russians wouldn’t take their own vaccine

Another example of wishful thinking. To the contrary, the vast majority of Russians took their own vaccine, as well as millions of people around the world who took the Sputnik, not the Western stuff.

@Paul

Because China will be next under global sanctions over Taiwan!

All right. Will this happen before or after the flotillas of huge container ships stop coming to the U.S. ports? And what will replace the Chinese-made merchandise on the Western markets?

2 ( +6 / -4 )

Wishful thinking. Russia produces nuclear power stations, icebreakers and jet liners, do you really think they can't produce much simpler goods? 

Wishful thinking on your part. There is a reason Aeroflot’s fleet is 90% Boeing and Airbus. Russian goods suck.

Yawn. Remember Obama in 2014 after Crimea? "Russian economy in tatters". Eight years ago. Yeah, sure. Amuse yourselves, keep destroying.

Yeah, in 2014 Russia didn’t shut down its stock market, the Ruble didn’t lose half its value almost overnight, the government didn’t default on its sovereign debt, all Western companies didn’t dump their investments in Russia, Russian Central bank assets weren’t frozen, etc.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Wait a minute, we were told the West confiscated all the spoils, all the gazilion of dollars Putin and his friends stacked in West, right? And they can't now come to the West, right?

Don’t worry. You can build your own mega yachts.

To the contrary, the vast majority of Russians took their own vaccine, as well as millions of people around the world who took the Sputnik, not the Western stuff.

Simply not true, even according to Russia’s own statistics. You have to believe them, right?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

It says something about the American way of war that the Biden administration is pinning its hopes for a Russian retreat on the seizure of a few oligarchs’ yachts in the Mediterranean.

By this logic the keelhauled sailors, down to their last several billion in gold bars and Bitcoins, will rise up in rebellion against Putin’s autocracy and aggression and yet again make the world safe for August along Sardinia’s Costa Smeralda.

Needless to say, there are sanctions in force other than yacht impoundments, but again all those frozen bank accounts and trade blockades are based on the premise that only rich people can effect change in government—in Russia or, presumably, elsewhere. (Notice that no one grounded any of the paddle boats on the lake in Moscow’s Gorky Park.)

According to the received wisdom about Russia’s government and ruling class, Putin created an oligarchy so that it could manage his offshore wealth and so that he could place the Russian means of production in a small boyar class beholden to his munificence. By American and EU logic, the loyalty of that lumpenproletariat is now open to the highest bidder.

It would be nice to imagine that war is a variation on leveraged buyouts or a Sotheby’s auction, but the forces guiding any society into battle are more complex than the name on the back of a bearer bond, even if that name happens to be that of Vladimir Putin.

Question: would the United States have withdrawn from Vietnam in 1967 if the Russians had levied fines against chief executives of the Fortune 500?

3 ( +5 / -2 )

@rainyday

There is a reason Aeroflot’s fleet is 90% Boeing and Airbus

Yes, there is a reason, it is the very powerful lobbying from the part of Boeing and Airbus who resisted every attempt by the Russians to restart their own aircraft production. Now Boeing and Airbus are out, and the replacement is already on its way.

Yeah, in 2014 Russia didn’t shut down its stock market, the Ruble didn’t lose half its value almost overnight, the government didn’t default on its sovereign debt

So, "in tatters" again? We can expect the Putin's capitulation any time now? Anyway, it's so funny when a nation with the 30-trillion-and-ticking Ponzi scheme unsustainable national debt is telling others about financial problems.

@Bob Fosse

Don’t worry. You can build your own mega yachts

What for?

Simply not true, even according to Russia’s own statistics

All right, can you share the data?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Don’t worry. You can build your own mega yachts

What for?

Good point. Russian yachts won’t be going anywhere.

All right, can you share the data?

Would be a waste of time, you’ll deny it’s accuracy.

You stated the ‘vast majority’ of Russians took Sputnik. Just over 50% is not a vast majority, by any stretch.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

@Bob Fosse

Russian yachts won’t be going anywhere

Sure, keep them. Ordinary Russian citizens are happy with this decision of the West.

Would be a waste of time, you’ll deny it’s accuracy

I do not deny facts, but I can deny speculations.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Russians will still have hamburgers, coffee and t-shirts, they just won't be stamped McDonald's, Starbucks and Gap.

Are you serious?

9 traditional Russian dishes you must try

https://www.trafalgar.com/real-word/traditional-russian-dishes/

I have enjoyed Russian food cooked by Russian in Japan.

Hamburgers?

Bonkers

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I do not deny facts, but I can deny speculations.

Great. All available up to date data puts Russian vaccinations at barely over 50%. If you have some alternative facts be sure to share.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Russian yachts won’t be going anywhere

Sure, keep them. Ordinary Russian citizens are happy with this decision of the West.

It’s cute that you think ordinary Russian citizens have a say in any decision making. Bullied or hoodwinked but definitely not happy.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

There are differences between modern farm equipment and older equipment. I simple controller is within Russia's capability, but when the harvester dies mid-harvest, the crops remaining to be harvested will sit, waiting. These replacement controllers don't appear out of the air. At least 6 months of directed effort is required and they won't be nearly as efficient.

In America, there is a huge fight between farmers and the farm equipment makers happening in legislatures now concerning the right to repair. There are so many computers and links in farm equipment that the farmers can't take a mallet out, bang on the gear, to get it working as a quick fix for the next 10 days. All the computers control everything and manufacturers have been ordered to make access to the information available. That was interpreted as requiring a $20K/yr access license for the information, but not for replacement parts. Farm equipment is full of sensors and self-reports back to the manufacturer about conditions and less than optimal happenings around the vehicles. This is the price for having 1-4% more efficient vehicles and teams of vehicles that can link up, be controlled by a single farmer, but move together or continue working overnight, fully automated, using GPS.

Normal Russians aren't seeing the real news. They are being lied to by their govt. Even those with friends in Ukraine who they've spoken with don't believe their friends. Inside Russia, there is no invasion or war. It is just a relief effort with images of Russian soldiers giving out food and clothing to Ukrainians. Any killing happening is Ukrainian -on- Ukrainian killing.

Ref: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/03/activists-are-reaching-russians-behind-putins-propaganda-wall/

People outside Russia are using other, non-blocked, websites to provide the truth to Russians. Dating sites and restaurant review sites are being used, for example. The insulated Russians only know what their state-controlled media shows.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

A draft law could allow Russian courts to appoint external administrators for companies that cease operations and are at least 25% foreign-owned. If the owners refuse to resume operations or to sell, the company's shares could be auctioned off, the ruling United Russia party has said, calling it “the first step toward nationalization.”

Chris Weafer of Macro-Advisory, a consultancy specializing in Russia, said the Russian government "is adopting a carrot-and-stick approach to foreign business,” with talk of nationalization balanced out with government help for those who stay. A key reason, Weafer said, is the Kremlin's desire to avoid mass unemployment.

When it comes to social pressures or potential public backlash, what they understand, I guess, is that people will not take to the streets because they cannot buy a Big Mac,” Weafer said. “But they might take to the streets if they have no job and no income.

If they star doing that, Russian assets being held should be used to compensate the companies for their losses.

All of the million dollar houses and yachts owned by Putin and friends abroad could be auctioned off as a start.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Well, one area that average Russians may see business opportunities is in 'fast food'. American companies have conditioned Russians to such 'fast food' and I'm sure that there are creative types who could fill the roles of the American companies. MacDonsky's for example, or Colonel Boris' Siberian Fried Blinis, Peetza Gulag, Piroshki Hut, endless possibilities to fill the void. I wonder what kind of backroom bone crushing political arm twisting got these American Corporates to forego a large market and its profits like Russia just because people are murdering each other...very unAmerican behavior in my view...

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Russians and Chinese both have put up their own space stations. I think they can figure out tractors and coffee brewers.

If little old Cuba can snub the Western "brands", Russia could do it easily.

Cuba has normal diplomatic and trade relations with the rest of the world except the US. European and Chinese consumer goods are available if in Cuba if you can afford them. The are not doing without anything except maybe US agricultural products and tourists.

China relies on western electronics for the same things Russia does. China cannot forge the smallest microchips and doesn't have access to the necessary software to do so even if they had the forges as the softwar is American and controlled. It is currently prohibited to be transferred to China. China lacks many modern technologies and relies on western sources for these. China has no local avionics makers, cannot produce a reliable high bypass turbofan engine (or any reliable gas turbine engine for that matter). China makes stuff but it is not dependable. Most of their railroad locomotives, especially their freight locomotives, are US designs. What is interesting visiting China is that so much of what is made there and sold abroad is not available inside China. Western firms make things there but they control the output and often do a good job protecting their proprietary information. If China starts supporting the Russian war effort all of that could end and China could find itself in a situation similar to Russia, shunned and its products embargoed.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Where is your computer made?

Velocity Micro computers are built in Virginia using US and Taiwanese components. The only two parts sourced from PRC are the battery and plastic case.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

In which case, America would turn into a madmax zone after 2 weeks.

You could not survive without Chinese imports.

Gross exaggeration. Trade with China is about 2% of the US GDP. I don't buy from PRC. That has been my habit for over 20 years. What you find when you read labels and understand where products come from is that almost every product you might ever want to buy is made somewhere other than China. Sometimes you may pay a little more for the non-Chinese product but they are abundant. All of my footwear except some boat shoes I never wear any more are made in the US. The boat shoes were made in Dominican Republic. My bed sheets are from India. Many of our towels are made in the US, others in India or Pakistan. Velocity Micro computers is one of a half dozen US made computers and they use primarily US and Taiwan made components. Our major appliances are all made in the US. The mixer I bought my wife for Christmas is US made. Our cars are US (Toyota Avalons are only made in the US), Spanish (Ford Transit Connect) or German made (two vintage Audis). The US could embargo China tomorrow and it wouldn't be a big deal for most consumers.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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