business

JAL, bankrupt two years ago, posts Y146 bil profit

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my contribution is there not as a JAL passenger but as a taxpayer !

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

So, JAL claimed bankruptcy in order to avoid creditors and paying off debts, was then bailed out by the government, made major staff cutbacks to the point that we've seen problems with the planes and errors, they've engaged with other companies in collusion to RAISE fuel taxes to the point where they almost surpass ticket costs (and no more of this 'they lowered fuel costs' crap!), and now they don't have to pay back any of the debt they forfeited on since they are making major profits?

I had a friend who once told me that the best thing you can do if you are in debt and paying that debt for long periods of time is to declare bankruptcy. So long as you can get a job and are a hard worker you'll start off by making a profit and will hopefully have learned from any past mistakes. That guy was a chain restaurant owner (now he's sold the chain and is a millionaire). I guess he's right.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

made profit from strong yen. i dont think so. more like cutting bonuses of 3x ur inflated salary annually and the likes.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

I think it may have been QANTAS management that entered JAL 2 years ago to teach them how to run the airline!

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

and now they don't have to pay back any of the debt they forfeited on since they are making major profits?

That's not how it works, smitty. You're confused with liquidation versus reorganization.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

I definitely have contributed to this profit - the ticket prices are insane! The taxes are so stiff that we have had to cut back on some of our traveling. Since 2007 the RT to the US has at least doubled.

Wonder if I canI get a discount now that they are doing so well. Nahhhh.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

So wait, they don't have to pay anything back enough though they are now boasting of profit? Something is wrong with this. Why bail them out? Give them a loan. Wrong, wrong, wrong. I don't fly JAL because I can't afford it and yet, they still manage to get my money.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

If and when JAL again sells its stock to the Puplic... I think the proceeds should go to all the previous stock holders that lost everything when it wend bankrupt.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Just bought tickets home costing just over 800,000 for the family. Of that, a whopping 250,000 is fuel surcharge! I dont believe that is necessary at all given that prices have actually gone down so yeah, no wonder JAL is making a profit now.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

No matter what, it is still admirable that an airline carrier, which got bankrupt two years ago, managed to recover with such a huge net profit shortly afterwards. Of course, a lot of reconstruction was needed to be done including wage and pension cuts. I am glad though that the service remains by far the best among the Japanese airline carriers. The disappointing fact is (as many already mentioned) the price of the tickets. Indeed, i don't understand why tickets from Japan are always way more expensive than tickets to Japan from abroad. This seems to be the case generally and not only with the two main Japanese airline carriers (ANA and JAL).

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Who in the right mind fly JAL? i was under the impression that only Japanese are naive to Flight they overprice Airlines in the name of National pride.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

nigelboy: "That's not how it works, smitty. You're confused with liquidation versus reorganization."

And you're confusing rhetorical questions with a genuine desire to know. Not surprising though, nigelboy -- in your constant avoiding of the thread itself and instead attacks on posters I don't expect anything less. I'm sorry the situation (both JAL and your attitude) don't bother you, but clearly many are upset by it.

Nicky: "Just bought tickets home costing just over 800,000 for the family. Of that, a whopping 250,000 is fuel surcharge!"

Exactly what I was talking about, and why their claims that they have reduced fuel costs is bogus. The worst is that they price-gouge now more on fuel surcharge than on ticket cost, and launch huge campaigns about how they've cut ticket costs by such and such percent! I was looking to fly to Peru as I've not been to South America and the surcharge alone, for pretty much every airline (again, collusion), is 100,000 per person in the off-season.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Chin up, mr smithjapan and other peeps. We don't need to go as far as howling for de-regulation of the airlines in Japan, especially not in an election year in America where the BIG issue is ensuring the government can nationalize as much as possible. Gas prices ARE high but the good news is the environment is better off for it. Obama recently decided not to take Canada gas and oil so that means China and Venezuela remain stronger and more able to influence the availability of oil supplies around the world. It is social justice. Try to broaden your mind.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Smith. Rhetorical? I doubt it very much. I just don't understand why you would be upset that JAL would turn a profit?? Would you be happy if they are at a loss and if so, why??

Airlines are very susceptive to fuel costs. In fact, both Delta and Northwest filed for bankruptcy because of the lack of recourse for increased volatile fuel costs. So if you want to complain about the current level of air fare, you might want to target a different collusion. (I.e cartel)

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

nigelboy: "Smith. Rhetorical? I doubt it very much. I just don't understand why you would be upset that JAL would turn a profit?? Would you be happy if they are at a loss and if so, why??"

Yes, it was rhetorical... or hey, 'sarcastic' if you like. But since I've got to spell it out for you go back and read the allegory I make at the bottom -- it's quite clear that I know when you succeed in declaring bankruptcy you do not pay back that which you owed beforehand.

Anyone with their head screwed on properly would be upset that their tax money went towards bailing out a company who could not pay their debts, only to see them turn that into a major profit while STILL price-gouging the customers. Sure, fuel costs money, and those costs are rising, in particular with problems in the Middle East, but not as much as they are raising the fuel surcharge! But hey, if it suits your fancy jump up and click your heels over paying more on top of what you paid them in tax money.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

great, can we bill them for the bailout money now?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

-- it's quite clear that I know when you succeed in declaring bankruptcy you do not pay back that which you owed beforehand.

Dear smith.

Your quote is as follows

"now they don't have to pay back any of the debt they forfeited on since they are making major profits? "

Declaring buankruptcy, in this case, a restructuring, does not mean you automatically forfeit (give up) the debt you owe. It simply means that the debt is on hold for creditors to where they cannot take recourse during the period of restructuring. To put it simply, they (as in JAL) will have to pay back the debt. Since they are no longer under bankruptcy, JAL in fact has paid the so-called bail out money from the government.

From Mainichi

"経営再建中の日本航空は28日、東京地裁から、会社更生手続きの終結決定を受けたと発表した。金融機関11行から約2550億円の融資を受け、破綻(はたん)後も残る借金約3950億円を一括返済。"

Basically, it states that 11 banks gave JAL a loan at a collective amount of 255 billion yen along with their own cash infusion to pay off the outstanding amount of 395 billion yen. (of which 350 billion yen was from ETIC Japan i.e. government)

Anyone with their head screwed on properly would be upset that their tax money went towards bailing out a company who could not pay their debts, only to see them turn that into a major profit while STILL price-gouging the customers. Sure, fuel costs money, and those costs are rising, in particular with problems in the Middle East, but not as much as they are raising the fuel surcharge! But hey, if it suits your fancy jump up and click your heels over paying more on top of what you paid them in tax money.

As I alluded in the previous paragraph, the money that was infused by the government is paid off. Secondly, your statement " but not as much as they are raising the fuel surcharge!" are based nothing but your subjective view of what the price range should be (i.e. wishful thinking as a consumer with very limited knowledge) and not what the industry can actually absorb based on the current climate.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Good post, nigelboy.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Kazuo Inamori is a business genius.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

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