Toyota's recall fix clears U.S. regulators

“People can feel safe driving in the current situation,”

Only if you're not driving a Toyota!

I wanna know how and when the condensation occurs. Aren't there possibilities of Condensation for all cars?

"Only if you're not driving a Toyota!"

Of course, what you really meant to say was, "Only if you're not driving a Toyota made with potentially defective parts provided by U.S. manufacturers, since the very same parts provided by Japanese manufacturers in Japan have worked to spec with nary a problem for years."

Right?

caldina,

Yes, you're right. Condensation happens in all vehicles, regardless of make or model, when any sort of extreme temperature change occurs. It's why your windows fog up in the car on a cold winter morning, or why moisture builds up on the sides of a freshly-opened can of Coke in the summer. Condensation isn't something that can be avoided.

The problem isn't that condensation occurs, but rather that the part in question was particularly susceptible to condensation due to a manufacturing defect. Toyota is currently working with the part maker, Elkhart, Indiana-based American company CTS, to improve CTS's manufacturing techniques in order to bring the part quality up to the same level as that of the other gas sensor supplier, Japan-based Denso, whose parts have experienced no problems whatsoever.

Of course, what you really meant to say was, "Only if you're not driving a Toyota made with potentially defective parts provided by U.S. manufacturers, since the very same parts provided by Japanese manufacturers in Japan have worked to spec with nary a problem for years."

Right?

If your dumb enough to believe what the Japanese say. The Japanese are notoriously honest when it comes to protecting the consumer over the big business here.

Quest,

Are you aware of a defective gas pedal sensor problem occuring in Japan that the public is currently unaware of or that Toyota has effectively covered up? If so, please share.

And no, unsupported suspicions of cover-ups, or suggestions of a vast, underground shadow conspiracy don't count -- at least not without evidence.

Yes, make sure to throw your supplier under the bus. First it was the driver's fault, now the supplier's fault. I don't why we should believe Toyota on this at all and I do hope congress investigates as promised.

But let's ask the honest question: if it was a "quality in production" problem, why not shift the production to another maker? CTS is a guppy in this market.

How do I get reimbursment for all the speeding tickets that were NOT my fault?

It's too late. When the American legal system gets done with them, Toyota America will be no more. People I know are already saying Toyota should get out of America. BUY U.S.A. Protect American Companies. Keep 100% of our money in America. Can't play the quality issue. When you can't even design a floor mat.... what does that say about your protect.

Junnama,

Toyota isn't throwing its supplier under the bus. Quite on the contrary, they're working with CTS to fix the problem, as opposed to the highly public blame game played by Ford and Bridgestone a few years back over exploding SUV tires.

Toyota has been very up front about where the buck stops -- and it’s stopping with Toyota. They are paying for the recall in its entirety, and have laid no blame whatsoever at the feet of CTS or anyone else.

“First it was the driver's fault, now the supplier's fault. I don't why we should believe Toyota on this at all”

Let’s get one thing straight here. No one ever blamed the drivers of cars that experienced gas pedal sensor switch problems. You’re confusing the sensor switch problem with the floor mat problem, which was determined to be a valid issue when it was discovered that some gas pedals were indeed being blocked by non-factory floor mats that had slid forward from their proper positions.

Also, it was indeed determined that factory installed mats were being improperly replaced by users who removed them for whatever reason, e.g., cleaning, and neglected to properly re-fasten them to the floor-mounted retaining clips. This wasn’t an accusation leveled against police officer Mark Saylor who died with three others when the floor mat on the Lexus he was driving blocked his gas pedal, but rather against the Toyota dealership that had lent Saylor the Lexus while his was being serviced. Yes, that’s right, Toyota blamed its own dealership.

As for the faulty gas pedal position sensors, both the NHTSB and Toyota technicians were unable to duplicate the defect in controlled experiments, despite numerous attempts. And just as one would expect, such an incredibly rare defect has occurred in but a small fraction of the 20 million cars Toyota has sold in North America since 2000. That’s twenty million cars, equal to one for every man, woman, and child living in both L.A. and New York. If this were an endemic problem, statistically we’d see much higher numbers of accidents and fatalities than we have so far. But it isn’t, so we haven’t.

Also, as I stated above, Toyota isn’t blaming the supplier. But it is making sure the supplier produces sensor modules that perform with the same reliability as those made by Toyota’s domestic parts supplier, Denso.

“if it was a "quality in production" problem, why not shift the production to another maker? CTS is a guppy in this market.”

That’s a very good question that I’ve wondered about as well. I can only guess that it has something to do with maintaining an up-till-now fruitful and mutually beneficial business relationship, rather than, as you said, “throwing the supplier under the bus.” I would imagine it also has something to do with CTS providing the parts Toyota needs at a competitive price that Toyota can pass on to the consumer.

But what should be taken away from events over the past few months is that Toyota isn't washing its hands of the problem by blaming CTS or anyone else, but rather is stepping up to the plate and fixing it.

The fact is Toyota has produced nothing but quality, reliable cars for the American market for decades. It’s that proven record that makes this knee-jerk reaction against the entire Toyota brand so galling. Can people really be that petty or stupid as to think these faulty sensors that have been found in but handful of the millions of Toyotas on the road in North America are the result of some sort of willful malfeasance on the part of Toyota? Fair weather friends indeed.

With so many Americans are bellying up to the table with half-cocked, uninformed calls for boycotts, class action lawsuits, and congressional inquiries into a company that has had a nearly flawless track record in the American automotive market, one can’t help but suspect that most, if not all of the contrived anger is rooted more in a deeper and misplaced anger at the collapse of the domestic automotive industry and Toyota’s commanding lead in U.S. domestic car sales than in any genuine belief that Toyota is some irresponsible corporate monster.

Quite honestly, if the American public is going to presume to disparage Toyota, a company that has kept plants open and Americans employed when General Motors couldn't, they’d better be prepared to back it up with facts. What we've had so far instead is a lot of just plain ignorant comments, with the debate, such as it is, devolving into the equivalent of two drunken hicks at a bar beating the crap out of each other over the question of "Which kicks more ass, Ford or Chevy," because someone’s brother’s cousin’s best friend had an uncle who’s son’s car broke down once a few years ago. Yeah, the current dialog really does sounds that asinine.

That's a long post, but these are the key points:

Toyota designed the product incorrectly (size and material to be used - check the Asahi and Yomiuri today).

Rather than own up to this fact Toyota has not been up front about this: they can't say the other pedals made by other suppliers are ok and then say the ones made by CTS are not. That means that the production is the problem, which is throwing CTS under the bus.

Toyota has consistently ignored the unintended accelaration problem and has blamed the drivers. You may believe that the floormat issue and brake issue are unrelated, but many do not. Additionally, it has now come out that Toyota was aware of the problem for some time earlier than they have revealed.

Lies, cover-ups, blaming. You have the whole sordid lot here.

Junnama,

Actually, no, the articles you cite offer competing arguments on the issue, with "industry sources" claiming that Toyota knew of problems with the pedal in 2007, but Toyota saying that the problem they knew of was related to something unrelated.

In the meantime, while you keep going on about Toyota "owning up" to mistakes (which it has, based on a massive recall in response to 13 complaints --That’s thirteen confirmable incidents out of well over 20 million Toyotas on the road today), you seem to neglect the fact that the majority of information you're using as proof of an alleged cover-up comes from documents and material willingly and immediately presented by Toyota to the NHTSA in its investigations. So far, the NHTSA has found no evidence of misconduct on the part of Toyota.

Unless, of course, that's just another layer to the vast corporate/government conspiracy theory you're brewing up.

Doesn't sound nearly as sordid and conspiratorial when you put it that way, does it?

All right. let me try and get it down to one sentence and maybe that will be clear:

Toyota is sending a conflicited message by saying that the recall is their fault and not CTS's fault because at the same time they are saying the Denso made brakes are ok, but the CTS one's are not, which means CTS is at fault.

So which is it Toyota is at fault or CTS is at fault? Giving this conflicted message is not taking responsibility on Toyota's part.

LFRAgain at 04:10 PM JST - 1st February. The fact is Toyota has produced nothing but quality, reliable cars for the American market for decades. It’s that proven record that makes this knee-jerk reaction against the entire Toyota brand so galling. Can people really be that petty or stupid as to think these faulty sensors that have been found in but handful of the millions of Toyotas on the road in North America are the result of some sort of willful malfeasance on the part of Toyota? Fair weather friends indeed.

I agree with your article. Well written.

So far, the NHTSA has found no evidence of misconduct on the part of Toyota.

As a matter of fact, the NHTSA warned Toyota, a week before the massive recall and sales and production shut down, that Toyota was intentionally misleading Americans about Toyota's problems.

Misleading information is misconduct and criminal, as in cover up.

"Do you always jump from thread to thread after being proven wrong with your long winded arguments?"

Do you often follow me from thread to thread to how I'm doing? Thanks for the concern! :D

Meanwhile, I hope you see the irony in your choice of the word "proving" in your post, since you've neglected to actually produce any, well -- proof -- of a cover-up.

Perhaps you just don't actually understand the meaning of the word?

Just like you don't seem to understand that if the NHTSA hasn't chosen to file a criminal complaint against Toyota, then odds are fairly high that your reasoning, i.e., "Misleading information is misconduct and criminal, as in cover up," might be a bit off the mark.

Unless . . !

{ GASP!! }

No, no. It can't be. Are you suggesting that the long arm of Japanese corporate treachery reaches all the way to the hallowed halls of the National Highway and Transportation Safety Agency?! Ye gads!! We're doomed, one and all!

The first thing to do when you think you might have a car on the <a rev="vote for" title="The Toyota recall list – is your car on it?"href="http://personalmoneystore.com/moneyblog/2010/01/27/toyota-recall-list-2010/ ">Toyota recall list</a>, is not to panic. You should immediately call your dealer or failing that the Toyota recall hotline, and figure out if your Toyota has the gas pedal defect. If so, remove the floor mats, get some payday loans if you need to, and get to a dealer to get it replaced. If the accelerator sticks, put the car in neutral, pull over and shut off the engine. Remember, first and foremost, don't panic – it was only a portion of cars made at a particular factory that were affected.