business

U.S. firms, debt could be China's targets if U.S. plays hardball

18 Comments
By JOE McDONALD

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For many of Trump’s detractors, this is a curly one. Caught between not wanting to be seen as kowtowing to the Peking oligarchy, but at the same time not wanting their opposition to that regime’s blatant trade cheating to be taken as endorsing Trump’s hardline approach and repudiating that of his immediate predecessor, they’re caught between a rock and a hard place.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Another example of the failure to wake up to the fact that empire is officially in the waning end of it's life cycle.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

This idea that China is going to turn Europe or other U.S allies against the U.S is fanciful. When its all said and done, Europe and all other U.S allies are totally reliant on the U.S for their defense. Without the U.S, NATO is a quaint joke. Does China honestly think that Europe and other U.S friends. most of which share history and cultural ties dating back centuries, are going to turn against the U.S on this issue? particularly when the U.S has already abandoned nearly all their measures against U.S allies and friends. What reason would the Europeans and others now have to do this? The focus now is squarely on China and almost China to the exclusion of all others, other than Japan....

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

@Matt: are you forgetting that most European states joined the AIIB?

Don't think Europe is so "happy" of U.S. bullying, when all American wars and strategies of the latest years damaged heavily European interests. Especially the sanctions against Russia.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

@Matt: are you forgetting that most European states joined the AIIB?

Means next to nothing. Most European countries are members of multiple international development banks. Many joined the AIIB to influence Chinese decision making as well as turning a dollar and aiding in the development of Asia.

Don't think Europe is so "happy" of U.S. bullying, when all American wars and strategies of the latest years damaged heavily European interests. Especially the sanctions against Russia.

The Europeans might not be happy with Trump, the result of Wars in the Mid East I also accept have been pretty disastrous, although other than immigration, I'm not convinced it impacts Europeans too much. The oil has continued to flow and so not a gigantic economic impact compared to pre-war days. The E.U and the Mid East never had massive trade interests.

Sanctions on Russia? Necessary evil is how many see it, even if its to their detriment. It would be nice if it were different and if Russia pulled back from various activities, they would benefit more than anyone. Recently we have seen that the E.U has undertaken various measures to secure the E.U into the future, contrary to what Russia seems to want with a breakaway of E.U eastern states, but those states know where their bread is buttered and its in wealthy Western Europe for the most part.

None of that is going to translate into backstabbing your security guarantor, in America and a country with which you have massive business and cultural ties in favour of a country in which you have no cultural ties at all. A country which doesn't even speak English or any European language to any significant degree at all. A country which is not a democracy. And a country which many see as representing the prime threat to international order that America and the E.U created after WW2.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Hmm, its seems like Matt Hartwell gets so triggered just at the thought of any potential falling of any Western thing. It's just kind of funny to see a white person from the originally non-white land mass of Australia, who doesn't like "the Left", say this.

By the way, the American-lead wars is directly responsible to the mass refugee and immigration crisis that Europe is now facing. Now all of that centuries old Western culture is diminishing. Now being white is racist over there. That's why France has most Black people in their football team. Now you have a brown person as the mayor of London. What's next? A colored princess in the British Royalty? Oh wait minute!

If this continues, then it'll be easier for China to entice "Europe" to break their ties with the US. They're already doing quite the job with Vanuatu.

trigger alert.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

U.S. firms, debt could be China's targets if U.S. plays hardball

They are already in play, and have been for some time. The market for US treasuries swooned several years ag when China simply mentioned holding its rate of purchases steady. US companies are constantly harassed by Chinese authorites, who demand that they sell large stakes to local stockholders, divulge corporate data and intellectual property and assist their efforts to deprive their citizens of their rights.

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Maybe.  although not sure how China prevents massive currency appreciation unless it buys US assets - Treasuries pretty much the only thing they can buy with all their dollars.

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....a country in which you have no cultural ties at all. A country which doesn't even speak English or any European language to any significant degree at all. A country which is not a democracy. And a country which many see as representing the prime threat to international order that America and the E.U created after WW2.

Seems that someone is afraid to lose a privilege :)

Does China honestly think that Europe and other U.S friends. most of which share history and cultural ties dating back centuries, are going to turn against the U.S on this issue? particularly when the U.S has already abandoned nearly all their measures against U.S allies and friends. What reason would the Europeans and others now have to do this? The focus now is squarely on China and almost China to the exclusion of all others, others than Japan..

China is not naive and is just doing now in the EU and Africa and elsewhere what Western nations globally did for ages.

Sounds like Pauline Hanson going global, please keep it domestically :)

2 ( +2 / -0 )

debt could be China's targets if U.S. plays hardball

The US media from CNBC, CNN, NYT till the populist NY Post mentioned this possibility

but the Pentagon [Bloomberg] and other analysts have a different view. China could have caused real problems with such a measurement in 2008.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-chinas-treasury-hoard-isnt-much-of-a-weapon-in-trade-spat-with-us-2018-04-06

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Hmm, its seems like Matt Hartwell gets so triggered just at the thought of any potential falling of any Western thing. It's just kind of funny to see a white person from the originally non-white land mass of Australia, who doesn't like "the Left", say this.

Plenty of failings in the West, but we're talking about trade aren't we? and culture etc. I don't see anything failing here and I can't see the point at all.

By the way, the American-lead wars is directly responsible to the mass refugee and immigration crisis that Europe is now facing. Now all of that centuries old Western culture is diminishing. Now being white is racist over there. That's why France has most Black people in their football team. Now you have a brown person as the mayor of London. What's next? A colored princess in the British Royalty? Oh wait minute!

I mentioned immigration, did ya read the post at all? How can "being white" be racist?. Makes no sense. I dont care about black people on football teams, brown people as mayors of London, although Khan is doing a horrific job and will be very lucky to hold onto it and I don't about who marries who in the royal family.

Does any of this have anything to do with U.S/China trade at all? No. Does any of it have anything to do with U.S/China, Europe cultural relations, business ties? No again.

If this continues, then it'll be easier for China to entice "Europe" to break their ties with the US. They're already doing quite the job with Vanuatu.

trigger alert.

I don't see it. I don't see immigration or anything else you cite as relevant. If you want to talk about political outlook, culture, language, religious traditions, even the way business is conducted, you might uncover something useful, but you are going down a pointless rabbit hole here.

Vanuata, like other countries in the Pacific are taking advantage of Chinese loans and infrastructure programmes. Whether its good or bad for them depends on the terms, but considering what has already happened in Africa, Sri Lanka etc, they might want to think carefully. China knows if they setup a miitary base anywhere in those waters, they simply force Australia further to the U.S which would seem counter-productive from their point of view. They also risk a trade relationship that absolutely dwarfs, by a country mile, the trade relationship the could have with any country in Oceania.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

*....a country in which you have no cultural ties at all. A country which doesn't even speak English or any European language to any significant degree at all. A country which is not a democracy. And a country which many see as representing the prime threat to international order that America and the E.U created after WW2.*

Seems that someone is afraid to lose a privilege :)

How is a observation of a very obvious nature, ie the lack of cultural and language ties between the U.S and China have anything to do with the imaginary white privilege that the left keeps saying whites are suppose to have

China is not naive and is just doing now in the EU and Africa and elsewhere what Western nations globally did for ages.

Sounds like Pauline Hanson going global, please keep it domestically :)

China is doing what in Europe? Many European companies share IDENTICAL concerns to U.S companies when it comes to Chinese trade and investment practices. Ask Emmanuel Macron. I can't see the Europeans arguing with the U.S over the validity of the U.S arguments, when its one they share.

lol Pauline. Thanks for letting me know what I am dealing with.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Plenty of failings in the West, but we're talking about trade aren't we? and culture etc

Uh, nope. This article is just talking about trade. YOU are the one who brought in "culture" for some reason. I wonder why? I can understand the geopolitics of economics....but culture? Western this and Western that?

In any case, if you can bring up culture seemingly out of nowhere, then why can't further add to its discussion? Hmm?

 China knows if they setup a miitary base anywhere in those waters, they simply force Australia further to the U.S which would seem counter-productive from their point of view. They also risk a trade relationship that absolutely dwarfs, by a country mile, the trade relationship the could have with any country in Oceania.

Well, they'd at least still have one trade relationship with an Oceania nation by then- Vanuatu- right? Also, I'm sure the relations between the US and Australia by then wouldn't be different as they are now. It's just that the only difference by then would be that China would now have a base there for it. Maybe they'll start pointing lasers at passing aircraft like they're doing at their Djibouti base.

Ask Emmanuel Macron. I can't see the Europeans arguing with the U.S over the validity of the U.S arguments, when its one they share.

Or better yet, listen to what he said in front of the US Congress. Hint, he wasn't supportive of Trump's trade policies.

I don't see immigration or anything else you cite as relevant

It is relevant. In fact in the same post, you even said this:

I mentioned immigration, did ya read the post at all? 

So maybe it's you who forgot to read what you wrote? But of course it's relevant, as it's a direct factor in "political outlook, culture, language, religious traditions," of countries. It's one of the main sources of debate nowadays, and triggering people too. An Australian like you, above all else, should know that. It sort of brings us back to what you said:

a country with which you have massive business and cultural ties in favour of a country in which you have no cultural ties at all.

Well, tell that to Australian politicians who get those red envelopes from time to time, eh? Didn't you know that Chinese New Year is a uniquely Australian tradition? (trigger warning)

1 ( +1 / -0 )

How is a observation of a very obvious nature, ie the lack of cultural and language ties between the U.S and China have anything to do with the imaginary white privilege that the left keeps saying whites are suppose to have

Yep. text interpretation is difficult. This person seems to have problems to comprehend his own inconsistent writings. As someone writes :

*None of that is going to translate into backstabbing your security guarantor, in America and a country with which you have massive business and cultural ties in favour of a country in which you have no cultural ties at all. A country which doesn't even speak English or any European language to any significant degree at all. A country which is not a democracy. And a country which many see as representing the prime threat to international order that America and the E.U created after WW2.*

....it is obvious that this person is afraid for shifting powers in the world, a person who has no respect for other cultures and who believes that his culture is superior.

On cultural ties: the average white American or Australian knows nothing about their European heritage except that they share the same color. By the way: I'm not left.

China is doing what in Europe? Many European companies share IDENTICAL concerns to U.S companies when it comes to Chinese trade and investment practices. Ask Emmanuel Macron. I can't see the Europeans arguing with the U.S over the validity of the U.S arguments, when its one they share.

The EU is concerned about the lack of 'level playing filed' and IP but is nevertheless not only doing 'massive business' with the US but also with China.

And with a potential trade war coming up with this ally who, despite the shared European DNA, never was a friend, things may shift again.

Here some EU info about 'massive biz' : http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/docs/2006/september/tradoc_122530.04.2018.pdf

Ask Emmanuel Macron

About what? How wet his kisses were with The Donald ?

On Pauline:

People on this forum admit that they are racist or that they are a US nationalist.

At least one can have some respect for their honesty. Don't hesitate and join them :)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

....it is obvious that this person is afraid for shifting powers in the world, a person who has no respect for other cultures and who believes that his culture is superior.

Huh? Nothing to do with shifting powers, respect for other cultures or any feelings of superiority. It is a statement of fact. China is not a majority speaking English, German, Spanish, French etc language country. Do you deny that is the case? I fail to see how you could.

And with a potential trade war coming up with this ally who, despite the shared European DNA, never was a friend, things may shift again.

Don't you know anything about history? At all? The U.S entered the second world war to save Europe from Hitler. "Never was a friend"? What??? You should know this and the fact you don't suggests you know very little about the Western world.

People on this forum admit that they are racist or that they are a US nationalist.

At least one can have some respect for their honesty. Don't hesitate and join them :)

I'm not an American citizen so I'm not sure how I could be a U.S nationalist? Makes no sense. I am an Australian citizen and interested in the future of Australia and its prosperity and security going forward, while realizing that ties between the U.S and Australia are very strong and will continue to be. Anybody familiar with Australian politics knows this.

LOL @ trigger warnings. Is this some feeble attempt at reverse psychology or something? I've only ever seen juvenile leftists need trigger warnings and safe spaces. Even at university, at the age of 18 or more, they still need somebody to protect them from mere opinion or argument. Its sad. They failed to enter adulthood.

My arguments are consistent. I have no problem with any ethnicity that is not my own, including ethnic Chinese. If you read my comments on this site, you will realize that lazy assertions of racism are a joke.

I largely welcome immigration for its many benefits, particularly the economic benefits, but I do have a concern about mainland Chinese being indoctrinated with both hyper nationalist propaganda that is in part anti-Western, that plays up the victim mentality of China and the desire for revenge, not just against the West, but also Japan and I also don't want cultural marxists in my country. We don't need the 20th century to repeat and another 100 million body bags thanks. I don't want a civil war in Australia thank you very much. I am concerned the indoctrinated and resentful may eventually find their way to living in Australia on a permanent basis and they represent an obvious security threat at that point. They need to be identified and deported if acting against or planning to act against our interests and political traditions. We need a far more comprehensive approach to Chinese immigration as a whole to stop the problem before it can start. Its no easy task, because many are coming for education, for family reasons, are not indoctrinated. They may be coming for the very reason we are a Western nation state that places heavy emphasis on individual liberty and rights. We are a nation, unlike China, based in the notion of the sovereign individual. Its very attractive to those that want freedom to live how they chose and to share their thoughts, opinions and arguments without fear of persecution.

This is as far as my discrimination travels, its very limited and I think it is totally logical, sensible and justified. If you don't like it, that's fine. I don't care one way or the other.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

The U.S entered the second world war to save Europe from Hitler.

A wee bit more complex than that. Perhaps read up on American isolationism during the era. Also, see Pearl Harbour. And imperialist Japanese expansion.

Heck, go back to the Black Ships and Matthew Perry and see where it all started from. In regards to the Pacific War.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

More inconsistent writing and an obvious problem with text interpretation.

When this person has shown some interest in geopolitics he would have known that the US is an ally at most and no 'friend' despite their efforts of the past to liberate Europe from tyranny. When this person would know something about European history he would know that the Americans were not only involved and that for example the Russians had a big stake in that. The idea of a friend is probably like of those active on Facebook :)

So again:

People on this forum admit that they are racist or that they are a US nationalist.

At least one can have some respect for their honesty. Don't hesitate and join them :)

I'm not an American citizen so I'm not sure how I could be a U.S nationalist? Makes no sense. I am an Australian citizen and interested in the future of Australia and its prosperity and security going forward, while realizing that ties between the U.S and Australia are very strong and will continue to be. Anybody familiar with Australian politics knows this. Makes no sense. I am an Australian citizen and interested in the future of Australia and its prosperity and security going forward, while realizing that ties between the U.S and Australia are very strong and will continue to be. Anybody familiar with Australian politics knows this.

People on this forum  : other people than you

admit that they are racist or a US nationalist  : the opinions or beliefs of those other 

people

Don't hesitate to join them : encouraging you to join a privileged club

It's known that this person is Australian, how would I've come with Pauline Hanson in the first place?

Be happy as a citizen of an immigration country as I'm happy as a EU citizen :)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

@Netgrump

...it is obvious that this person is afraid for shifting powers in the world, a person who has no respect for other cultures and who believes that his culture is superior.

Bingo! Or should I say, Dingo!

@Matt Hartwell

Huh? Nothing to do with shifting powers, respect for other cultures or any feelings of superiority. It is a statement of fact. China is not a majority speaking English, German, Spanish, French etc language country. Do you deny that is the case? I fail to see how you could.

In the context of international trade, money is the only language. China is actually a good example of that because, indeed, they're not a European language speaking country, but they didn't/don't need to be, to be able to develop a globally-tied economy. Many Western people are actually learning Chinese now, isn't that funny? They're probably going into one of those "Confucius Institutes" to study it. (trigger warning)

So again, where's the relevance, or importance, of the list of European language you stated? It seems like it's such a random fact out of nowhere, or is it? I sense that there is an underlying sense of White/Euro there. Hmm.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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