Ghosn: Bail refusal would not be normal in any other democracy

Despite what people think, Japan isn't really a democracy.

@

Ex_Res

"One thing I have always noticed about Japan, and it's people. They are never wrong, even when it is blatantly obvious that they are."

Interesting point, if you search about B cluster traits many match, including never being wrong.

Even if Ghosn is guilty, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if he is, his pre-trial treatment is shameful and abhorrent, and should not be happening in a country that desires to be seen as a democracy and a free society.

I think we've established that Japan's justice system is a load of cow poop. No point in arguing here.

Carlos is right , money is an obvious pretext :It was a plot and it smells deception from the very beginning'with the complicity of the Japanese judiciary system.the French government with its pants down thks to the Gilets Jaunes has been helpless.

Now Nissan has to face it, the bloke has not surrendered and Nissan is in it as well.

a Jolly good mess

The four main pillars of democracy are Judiciary, Executive, Legislature and Media.

Japan fails blatantly on two of them: Judiciary and Media.

On the Executive side, this is too hidden to have an obvious position.

Hence Japan is at best a half democracy.

@Hachidori

You don't have to blame Mr. Ghosn for the dismissal of thousand of employees and closing 5 unproductive factories, you have to ask Nissan at that time why they arrived to bankruptcy. 

The only mistake that Mr. Ghosn did, is helping and rebuild companies such Nissan & Mitsubish.

Shame.

In the Carlos case, the Japanese side ,forgot the normal procedures to cook the books are, one U need to understand ,that means read & write 120% the Japanese language, Two , u have to have the stamp of almost all of the department heads at Nissan and three, U must have some one Japanese very close to Carlos. Now, stop wasting tax payers money and get on with the correct way of work. We the fair Japanese are wondering ,what are u hiding ???.& besides, saikawa, who are u ???.

His face is a cartoonist's dream

Forced confessions to slide out like Kelly, fake bows no problem.. Many scandals have occurred lately in multiple industries, NONE have been imprisoned. So if you call our shogun run constitution a democracy, then your not in reality. Democracy is fair treatment, not destroying ones character to win public support. Ohayo to reality..

I am amazed to read from the Japanese themselves that their country is not a democracy. Perhaps many of you should travel and verify that you are very wrong.

Yeah the trains run on time - how could anyone say this is not a democracy?

Don't like aspects of Japan's police, prosecutorial, judiciary, or political system, and the knee-jerkery of those "defending Nippon"....BUT...I do have to ask those who say "Ghosn doesn't have a chance, this is Japan, a conviction is as good as done." ...Do you remember American Gregory Gumo from around 2015/16? Dumped his girlfriend's body in waters near Yokohama....got only 18 months because he refused to confess to murder, only to dumping her body after she killed herself with some kind of poison or medication or something. Prosecutors couldn't make him confess and had no proof beyond a reasonable doubt that he did kill her. Just saying....

Japan is no democracy. And Ghosn is pretty much doomed at this point. He will never receive bail unless he confessed (whether false or not). If goes to trial, he will be convicted because that's the way of Japan.

I am amazed to read from the Japanese themselves that their country is not a democracy. Perhaps many of you should travel and verify that you are very wrong.

Maybe it's Renault's who write and give positive feedback to Ghosn's comments.

It ok to be wrong from time to time ay. Even cooler if you can admit it!

Nice one Ricky!!!

Funny how some people here need to "defend Japan".

I believe that there was an American embassador in the 1960's who highlighted this syndrome (similar to the Stockholm Syndrome). Rather than represent USA interests in Japan, he began to re-ilterate Japanese interests in America.

Re. The Enigma of Japanese Power (Karel Van Wolferen)

Well, whatever, I would suggest that these Japan apologists, take off or change their rose tinted spectacles.

Americans wrote our constitution post WW2, which American law is being used for Carlos? none

Not sure Democracy has much to do with it.  What he means is "civilized country" - although even that one might be moot.

This whole thing has been a disaster for all concerned.

Funny how some people here need to "defend Japan". My American acquaintance throws trash all the time at me about my country Canada, but I never feel the need to respond, knowing what a great country Canada is, and the fact that the good outweighs the bad there. (That's another conversation... Plus the American dude has Trump as President!). So when Japanese feel the need to knee-jerk react to any criticism of Japan, I wonder if it is because deep deep down, they know the criticism is warranted. Hmmmmmm.......

It ok to be wrong from time to time ay. Even cooler if you can admit it!

@ Ricky Kaminski13

Before thinking of China, if we are talking about conspiracy involving the US, I would have thought of Ghosn clearly claiming that Renault factory will stay and will not close in Iran, despite US sanctions threats, in June 15th 2018.

Did the old hmmmmm thing and left it at that, but thought it was a very typical way to deal with the collective unease they must be feeling as this case drags on. 

One thing I have always noticed about Japan, and it's people. They are never wrong, even when it is blatantly obvious that they are.

John

HOW?? is it fabricated?? you've been watching way to many Hollywood and Yakuza movies...

In REALITY it's a different story EVERY FINANCIAL TRANSACTION IS TRACED

@ Kenji Fujimori

You are telling that since the begining, Tokyo prosecutors are, and are only fabricating charges and evidence ?

You surely don't have any proof all of this is fabricated, nor you have proof it is not.

These are 2 complete separate matters, and one does not preclude the other, after all.

Yeah sure but that does not mean that people should be allowed to do historical revisionism.

Because Ghosn saved Nissan back then, how is he entitled to steal money from Nissan, and to commit financial wrongdoings afterwards ?

Again so far nothing has proven that he is guilty of anything or at least that he did anything that Nissan did not know about it. For world sake, why the guy can't benefit of the presumption of innocence?

And again, it's always strange that people come to defend Japan here but did not show up for example when Japanese executives at Nissan admitted to have falsified data relative to car safety and fuel consumption for decades. Then the only sound we could hear are the crickets....

Carlos HIMSELF even stated: "I have an army of people throwing trash at me every day," he said.

"There are not only allegations of the prosecutors, but also those of Nissan. They take a lot of facts out of their context. It is a distortion of reality to destroy my reputation."

"there is not one yen that I have received that was not reported".

Here’s a bit of an interesting angle . Just had a chat over lunch with a fairly astute local business type fella, runs a hotel and has his own small construction firm and we got to talking about the Ghosn case. Top bloke. Was just saying it’s not a good look and he said that he’d heard somewhere that the Americans made Japan arrest Ghosn the way they did. Ghosn was going to open up a factory in China or something, and the yanks didn’t want that so they made Japan arrest him!

Very conspiracy I know, and at the same time very convenient to pass the blame and the whole mess onto a non Japanese entity I thought. Did the old hmmmmm thing and left it at that, but thought it was a very typical way to deal with the collective unease they must be feeling as this case drags on. Never a dull moment in the land of the rising sun ne! The story that keeps on giving.

Carlos fight yr case correctly to the end and get the correct results for yrself. No human being will allow any one to destroy their good name, destroy their honour and spit in their face , then selfishly put themselves as the good guy like saikawa did. If it was me, it will be a eye for a eye. Imagine the hurt as he was close to U.

Now he is the guy getting all the glory and U are in arrests. Such kind of people should have a taste of their own medicine. I know U saved Nissan the best U can but it is time , to move away from yr affection for Nissan, let Nissan die in its own course. That is one way to show, what can happen without U

U have proved what u can do , pls forget Nissan. I love Japan like U. U must take these 2 issues separately. After U fight yr case and win. U must stay in Japan and do , what U must for the good of yrself & yr family and

good Japanese people. U should work with Toyota or Suzuki to make a bigger group to combat Nissan and bring it to its knees. Carlos , U are a example for all foreigners in Japan. My friends and I , always imagine what if yr case happen to us too ???.

And he said Nissan was trying to "destroy my reputation."

It seems that Nissan are creating a martyr.

He said the lights were on even at night, and with no watch or clock, he had "no sense of time".

Sleep depdeprivation and sensory deprivation are classed as torture.

Japan inc will come out of this very, very badly. Good

 GHOSN SAVED NISSAN

The fact that Ghosn saved Nissan from bankrupcy does not prevent him from financial wrondoings.

These are 2 complete separate matters, and one does not preclude the other, after all.

Because Ghosn saved Nissan back then, how is he entitled to steal money from Nissan, and to commit financial wrongdoings afterwards ?

Beyond such flawed logic there is defenitely some kind of dubious taste idolatry.

John

You're the one with flawed logic boy.

I always criticize our judicial system, I don't mind none Japanese criticizing it's better to be in the international light then hiding under the radar.

HJSLLS

Is 110% correct, do read his books on amazon Japan folks, there's English also in the Japanese books and even a Manga of him.

Hachidori - GHOSN SAVED NISSAN. Japan wrote books on this man and how he turned around the company. Japan even made a cartoon of him because of his accomplishment. Let’s not try to deny what we all know is fact - Ghosn saved Nissan! Without Ghosn, Nissan would have — without a doubt — gone bankrupt! As part of turning around the company, he had to cut costs, which included cutting unnecessary staff. In return, he saved the jobs of thousands who stayed to rebuild the firm. Furthermore, Ghosn expands the company and hires thousands of people into Nissan in Japan and in many Nissan branches around the world. Get your facts straight!

@Aly Rustom

nothing soft about their fascism brother

I hear ya, i just meant its more Brave New World than 1984.

In France, off-camera operatives and executives are really concerned about Ghosn blowing on the embers, by reactivate the conspiracy and treason theories. It will inevitably bolster distrust between Renault and Nissan and make Jean-Dominique Sénard's mission extremely difficult at this crucial time.

Maybe Ghosn's rethoric is not only aimed against Japanese justice system, but also to scupper his succession at Renault, from which Ghosn has resigned (or was he forced to resign?).

So, Ghosn is saying that France in not a democracy, as Macron's regime still refuses bail for yellow vest protestors, whose trials are scheduled at least 3 months after their arrest.

That's nothing to do with the case of Ghosn. Some of the yellow west protestots being refused bail are charged with serious crimes involving serious violence against police, destruction of public facilities and action of violence against journalists. Trying to compare this with the Ghosn's case is simply ridiculous.

"There was a resistance from the beginning," he said.

During his sole court appearance Ghosn spoke fondly of Nissan, and he said that affection endured despite his situation.

"I love Japan, I love Nissan. I have dedicated so many years to revive the company, to rebuild it again," he said. "I have nothing against the company."

He himself stated everything I've been telling you folks from two months ago.

Bail refusal would not be normal in any other democracy

The words 'Japan' and 'democracy' should not be used in the same sentence unless 'not' is also used in the sentence. What they call democracy in Japan is a totally bastardised form that more closely resembles fascism. It is a country run by bureaucrats who are above the law. That is not democracy. It is a fascist state.

He needs to stop saying that he revived Nissan. He just fired tens of thousand or people and reported the salaries not paid as profits. That’s it.

Oh boy, Japanese revisionism in action. Let's check the numbers shall we. In 1999, Nissan had US$20 billion in debt, the situation was that the company was close to bankruptcy, as the banks had stopped lending it money.

So Renault and Ghosn saved it. How? Well, first Renault bought, you know with its own money, 36.8 per cent of Nissan back then. That's one thing. Second Ghosn did few things which can be summarized as: he put Nissan out of its Japanese misery with its typical Japanese inefficient management style which was ruining the company. Yes he did cut cost but I recall that he was saying that some plants were literally empty. Nissan had too many plans, too many suppliers and too many models. But he also radically changed the culture of the company ending the Japanese seniority system and made people work in cross-functional teams, which he had implemented at Michelin. This technique forced people with different functions - such as engineers and designers - and from different age groups and genders to work together on company problems. Radically different that the old-boy centric system that a typical old Japanese company as Nissan used. And he simply took right decisions, it was under his lead that Nissan went into electrical cars. He developed Nissan in US, Europe, Singapour. Etc, etc...

The result: in 1993, Nissan posted a US$1 billion loss; In 2001, less than two years after he had joined Nissan, Ghosn announced a profit of nearly US$3 billion, the most it had ever earned in a year.

So how dare you say that he did not revive the company? How dare you?

The idea that he was ousted because he was moving Nissan-MMC-Renault too close together is ludicrous. They have just reaffirmed committment to the alliance.

You are not understanding the difference between the alliance which is not questioned so far by anyone and the merger that Ghosn wanted but the Japanese did not.

Ghosn seems to blame everyone but himself. Legal System, Japan, Nissan executives etc. 

Again, you seem to always say that he is guilty but so far you and the legal system that you defend have failed miserably at providing strong evidence besides vague accusations which surely do not require him to be kept in jail like this. This is a violation of human rights by a nation which is obviously not democratic since it doesn't respect the right of the defense. I also do not remember you claiming that the executives at Toshiba, Takata, Olympus, Kobe Steel etc, were guilty even though they admitted their crimes but they were never put in jail for that. Also more recently, I don't recall you saying that Tsunekazu Takeda who was charged by French prosecutors for corruption in the attribution of the Olympics to Tokyo was guilty. Hopefully being hypocrite does not kill.....

So, Ghosn is saying that France in not a democracy, as Macron's regime still refuses bail for yellow vest protestors, whose trials are scheduled at least 3 months after their arrest.

Finnaly, this has been made crystal clear ! Thank you Mr. Ghosn !

Recommend Abe to give a special permission for bail. Ghosn isn't a bandit.

"I have an army of people throwing trash at me every day," he said.

More charges ?

"No phone, no computer... how can I defend myself?"

Talk to lawyers.

He should sue the Japanese legal system for wasting his time in Jail, when this mess is all cleared of course.

Dont know why this article is classified under "crime". Clearly this is politics.

Anyone defending this style of justice seriously needs their head examined. It really is the stuff you would expect from say China or North Korea, not our beloved Japan. The bright side of this whole mess is that it could (and should) be a fairly obvious catalyst for change. Ghosn may just end up turning his penance for any financial wrongdoings and end up a hero, changing the old stubborn guard forever! Gambare everyone!

Guilty until proven innocence, 23 days of detention without any charge, no contact with outside world even with your lawyer/family and forced confession.

He has every right to ask about Japan state of democracy.

 Due Process of Law

What Rights do Citizens Have in the Criminal Justice System?

In a democracy, anyone accused of a crime has the right to a fair, speedy, and public trial.

 Just because someone is accused of a crime does not mean that he loses his rights.  Anyone arrested is presumed innocent until proven guilty.  A person’s guilt must be proved in a court of law, through a fair, speedy, and public trial.  In a democracy, a person accused of a crime has the right to know the charges against him, to remain silent, to have legal representation, to participate in his defense, and to question witnesses for the prosecution.  No person who is acquitted of a crime may be tried again on that charge.  No one—under any circumstance—may ever be subjected to torture, or to cruel and inhuman treatment.  No one may be imprisoned or have their property seized without legal justification.

GoodlucktoyouToday 09:00 am JST

Exactly! Don't you think this is all a bit fishy?

The only thing we know for certain is that Ghosn himself doesn't decide on who he talks to, and in what language... so what does that tell you about these 'interviews' that are now popping up these past few days? Surely you are aware of Japan's capacity (and tendency) to produce propaganda...

No special favors? He had a cell upgrade, and menu change. Now the suspect is complaining he can’t speak to his wife, but instead chooses to speak to the media...while his case is being examined! And in English.

A bunch of friends and me visited a foriegn friend in detention (10 days in detention, forced to confess, paid hush money and freed), and it was 100% enforced, that only JAPANESE language was allowed. Why does he get special treatment?

Well, if Ghosn is going to fight back against the allegations, the legal process in Japan and the potential motivations behind his arrest and detention, he presented his side well. Not that it will make any difference, but....

What I am trying to figure out is this:

-- Why are they allowing him to be interviewed while still detained?!

This is extremely unusual, to say the least. And there has to be a reason why they are allowing this to happen.

I can't believe the prosecutors / police are allowing this just because they are being "nice". There has to be a reason that this somehow helps them.

Kobe White Bar Owner

Japan is soft fascism masquerading as a democracy.

nothing soft about their fascism brother

Ghosn: Bail refusal would not be normal in any other democracy

let me correct that: Bail refusal would not be normal in any real democracy

Nonetheless, Ghosn, speaking from behind a window and flanked by two guards, did not appear noticeably gaunt and walked confidently into the room.

Says who exactly? Why not just show some footage of that instead of...

Japanese authorities did not permit any cameras or recording equipment to be used during the interview.

... oh, never mind..!

Not a great idea to blast the folks that hold the keys to your freedom.

Not calling the reality of things is a Japanese cultural trait that any foreigner would be foolish to partake in, no matter how 'Japanese' they might feel.

Free Ghosn!

Well seeing as it's had one party monopoly except for a few brief moments, I'd say he's spot on.

Japan is soft fascism masquerading as a democracy.

Well said, Hachidori, well said. Ghosn seems to blame everyone but himself. Legal System, Japan, Nissan executives etc. The idea that he was ousted because he was moving Nissan-MMC-Renault too close together is ludicrous. They have just reaffirmed committment to the alliance.

You reap what you sow, Ghosn.

By the way, keep insulting the Japanese Justice system. I am not sure they will show leniency from now on.

We're not insulting it, but pointing out its many and obvious flaws.

It also shows the world that Japan is not quite ready to take its table at the table of the top nations, but remains tarnished by its rather backward social customs and legal system.

Don't fight the system they will just throw it back at you, fight the trumped up charges.

Sorry Ghosn can’t order people here. This is not Nissan/Renault Headquarters.

He is in detention. No special favors will be given to him.

He needs to stop saying that he revived Nissan. He just fired tens of thousand or people and reported the salaries not paid as profits. That’s it.

He needs to stop with the Messiah complex.

By the way, keep insulting the Japanese Justice system. I am not sure they will show leniency from now on.

Mr Ghosn now understands that Japan isn’t a democracy.....

@Yubaru

Not a great idea to blast the folks that hold the keys to your freedom.

No, but it takes guts. And I respect him for that.

Not a great idea to blast the folks that hold the keys to your freedom.

Ghosn, another idiot confusing Japan's political regime with democracy...