crime

Banned from internet or not? Does Ghosn's tweet violate bail terms?

53 Comments
By Kwiyeon Ha and Ami Miyazaki

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53 Comments
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No his tweets don't, any social media is a form of freedom of expression. Something we have not learned here! RESPECT HUMAN RIGHTS

-1 ( +15 / -16 )

@KenjiFujimori

No his tweets don't, any social media is a form of freedom of expression. Something we have not learned here! RESPECT HUMAN RIGHTS

There are few countries with First Amendment rights (like those of USA). I doubt Japan has them given Japanese culture is centred around civil obedience (what makes it a civil, harmonious country).

In any case, even in the USA, inmates are not afforded First Amendment rights, amongst a plethora of other rights that's relinquished when in custody.

7 ( +16 / -9 )

Our Constitution is written by Americans post WW2 so there is a lot identical or supposed identical but not endorsed by what is the obvious.

-9 ( +6 / -15 )

a series of conditions, including no access to the internet and that he could only use a computer not linked to the web at his lawyer's office.

However, it was not clear how the internet ban would be enforced, and the bail terms were not made public - as is typical in Japan - making it difficult to determine details.

These two statements mean he did not break the conditions of his bail. He was permitted to use the internet in his lawyers office and there is no evidence to the contrary that he used the internet in any other place. Plus, there were no stipulations on what he could use the internet for. Perhaps, this is why they confiscated his wife's phone. They want to check if he accessed the net from it. If he did use her phone it means he is very stupid and breeched the conditions of his bail. However, I don't think he is that stupid.

-5 ( +8 / -13 )

Either it was a breach of bail or it wasn't? My guess as usual the terms were vague or decades old and reality of modern living escaped the courts. But the prosecution will use that same vagueness in laws, to suit their agenda.

-4 ( +8 / -12 )

None of us know the exact terms of his bail and whether what he did violated those terms or not.

However, one thing is for sure! The J prosecutors will use every dirty trick they can to convince the court that Ghosn did something to justify revoking his parole / bail.

They are determined that he lose his freedom until the trial. Not because they seek justice, but because they want to win!

I can well imagine that the career of the lead prosecutor on this case will be over if Ghosn is found not guilty! He might even commit suicide. Seriously! The stakes are that high for them!

-6 ( +7 / -13 )

He was told he couldn't access the internet, I'd say a Tweet written in first person sure looks like he did. Even if someone else sent the Tweet, he should have known better. Not very smart.

@disillusioned

and that he could only use a computer not linked to the web at his lawyer's office.

Unless I'm reading that wrong, he couldn't use the internet on that computer either. "not linked to the web"

11 ( +13 / -2 )

As stated in a previous post this is all very bizarre. The timing of his arrest relative to the Twitter feed. The fact Ghosn had predicted he would be rearrested. Taking the wife's passport. It is stranger than the Olympus scandal.

If he accessed the internet within the bounding conditions of his parole then it would seem this is not an issue. Also, I do not believe Ghosn can write Japanese so this was probably done by someone else. Finally, his Japanese attorney seems to be quite level headed and pragmatic about this.

@Zones - your comment may sound extreme but the pressures on Prosecutors for convictions in Japan are quite high which is not necessarily conducive to justice. These pressures may explain some of the radical (and strange) actions the Prosecution are taking. (I am not saying these pressures do not exist in other countries by the way).

Whether one agrees with what the Prosecution is doing or not it is a definite fact that Japan's image is being severely tarnished within the foreign business community in Japan and overseas.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

@Tokyo-Engr,

@Zones - your comment may sound extreme but the pressures on Prosecutors for convictions in Japan are quite high which is not necessarily conducive to justice. These pressures may explain some of the radical (and strange) actions the Prosecution are taking. (I am not saying these pressures do not exist in other countries by the way).

Indeed, the pressure on prosecutors / attorneys for the government is not unique to Japan. Losing a high profile case is never good for their careers.

However, in many countries (certainly in the U.S.), the courts / judges tend to have more independence to deny actions requested by prosecutors, particularly those that seem to overly infringe on the rights of the defendant. That does not seem to be the case in Japan.

-2 ( +9 / -11 )

The Tokyo District Court handling Ghosn's case said it does not disclose bail conditions and that it was impossible to say whether the tweet had violated the terms.

They can't do that but they can arbitrarily arrest someone for violation of the bail conditions that are not even disclosed??

Such decisions are left to the judges handling the case, it said.

As if they didn't know the outcome of the judges..

The Tokyo Prosecutors Office declined to comment, saying bail matters are handled by the court.

Yeah. The Kangaroo court

-10 ( +4 / -14 )

Aly Ruston, “They can't do that but they can arbitrarily arrest someone for violation of the bail conditions that are not even disclosed??”

Even if detailed bail conditions are not disclosed to the public they are most certainly disclosed to the person subject to them. But that is irrelevant at the moment because he wasn’t arrested for violating bail conditions.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

If his wife send tweet for him, he broke the deal. So...

8 ( +13 / -5 )

For two wild minutes, he suffered from Trump fingers!

13 ( +14 / -1 )

If the Japanese authorities thought Ghosn had broken his bail conditions they would have arrested him in an instant. They did not do that which strongly suggests Ghosn was in compliance with his bail conditions.

Now that they have him locked up again, i.e. no longer on bail, it will be possible to show his pre-recorded video next week without the persecutors being able to argue he is breaching his bail conditions by "influencing" people at Nissan.

-5 ( +7 / -12 )

Why the hell would you follow him on Twitter? Got to be pretty boring. Get a life people.

8 ( +14 / -6 )

Even if detailed bail conditions are not disclosed to the public they are most certainly disclosed to the person subject to them. But that is irrelevant at the moment because he wasn’t arrested for violating bail conditions.

Then what exactly was he arrested for?

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

his legal team said he had agreed to a series of conditions, including no access to the internet and that he could only use a computer not linked to the web at his lawyer's office

His bail conditions included no access to the internet. He used the internet while on bail. He is now guilty of breaking his bail conditions. Pretty simple if you ask me

7 ( +12 / -5 )

Then what exactly was he arrested for?

"On Thursday, Ghosn was subjected to a fourth arrest, this time on fresh charges of breach of trust at Nissan in what media reports linked to payments to an Omani vehicle dealer"

11 ( +14 / -3 )

"On Thursday, Ghosn was subjected to a fourth arrest, this time on fresh charges of breach of trust at Nissan in what media reports linked to payments to an Omani vehicle dealer"

Oh so another BS trumped up charge? I see.

-12 ( +4 / -16 )

Oh so another BS trumped up charge? I see.

Well, he's charged with making illegal payments of his company's money to his mates in shady companies and countries. Doesn't seem at all BS or trumped up and am glad this type of crime is actually prosecuted here. Back home in Germany they would let CEOs off in a heartbeat, so great are the ties to industry

10 ( +15 / -5 )

Sounds pretty clear that he broke his bail conditions. If his wife facilitated it, then she's in trouble too!

8 ( +12 / -4 )

I hope he keeps talking because we have been hearing voices only from the other side.

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

Doesn't seem at all BS or trumped up and am glad this type of crime is actually prosecuted here

Elsewhere, it has been reported that the Oman investigators is now in possession of a personal IOU to the Oman car dealer signed by Ghosn. Imho, even his collaborators are now jumping ship. I didn't kmow the French hold that much sway in the Persian Gulf.

12 ( +16 / -4 )

Aly Rustom, “Then what exactly was he arrested for?”

As Darmstadt already pointed out (and it’s also in the article if you’d care to read it), he was arrested on charges involving payments routed through Oman to paper companies run by family members etc. (which might explain something about his wife’s passport seizure etc). Money used to buy himself a yacht etc. Stay tuned.

15 ( +17 / -2 )

He couldn't have violated his bail conditions because they are invalid from the start. You can't deny access to the internet or restrict freedom of expression through tweeting which are both fundamental human rights, at least in more civilized countries

8 ( +14 / -6 )

Well, he's charged with making illegal payments of his company's money to his mates in shady companies and countries. Doesn't seem at all BS or trumped up and am glad this type of crime is actually prosecuted here. Back home in Germany they would let CEOs off in a heartbeat, so great are the ties to industry

As Darmstadt already pointed out (and it’s also in the article if you’d care to read it), he was arrested on charges involving payments routed through Oman to paper companies run by family members etc. (which might explain something about his wife’s passport seizure etc). Money used to buy himself a yacht etc. Stay tuned.

And what both of you fail to see is that they could have included that in the initial arrest warrant. That these are in fact trumped up charges and that japan inc is doing this to prevent him from speaking. He was out on bail. They didn't need to arrest him again. They're doing this to cover their corrupt behinds.

-11 ( +5 / -16 )

He couldn't have violated his bail conditions because they are invalid from the start. You can't deny access to the internet or restrict freedom of expression through tweeting which are both fundamental human rights, at least in more civilized countries

Another excellent point.

-12 ( +4 / -16 )

Aly Rustom, “And what both of you fail to see is that they could have included that in the initial arrest warrant. That these are in fact trumped up charges “

What is indicated in other media reports is that it has taken some time to gather definitive evidence across borders etc, which is why the charges are being brought now, not earlier with the others. There are also indications that these charges are more serious. But you are free to believe what you like.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

A question that invites wanton conjecture and promises no conclusion...

-8 ( +4 / -12 )

What is indicated in other media reports is that it has taken some time to gather definitive evidence across borders etc, which is why the charges are being brought now, not earlier with the others. There are also indications that these charges are more serious.

And what other media reports are also saying is that this is nothing more than economic nationalism and Japanese pride.

But you are free to believe what you like.

As are you. I don't think we'll square that circle.

-11 ( +5 / -16 )

He couldn't have violated his bail conditions because they are invalid from the start

Huh? The bail conditions were proposed by HIS lawyers as part of bail application and accepted by the court. Note tge prosecutors opposed it!

13 ( +16 / -3 )

Ipanema Beach,

You’ve never heard of for instance, a gag order by the courts?

13 ( +14 / -1 )

Another excellent point.

Because it demonstrate complete misunderstanding of the facts?

9 ( +13 / -4 )

That these are in fact trumped up charges and that japan inc is doing this to prevent him from speaking. He was out on bail. They didn't need to arrest him again. They're doing this to cover their corrupt behinds.

Yeah yeah we get it, it's all conspiracy theories and fake news right?

10 ( +14 / -4 )

Yeah yeah we get it, it's all conspiracy theories and fake news right?

Wrong. But its obvious that the government colluded with Nissan to lock him up real quick and try to get a confession. But sure, that's not conspiracy. Whatever..

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

Because it demonstrate complete misunderstanding of the facts?

No because it lays them out in front of the noses of the Japan inc and gov apologists no matter how hard they protest

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

But its obvious that the government colluded with Nissan to lock him up real quick and try to get a confession

When you say "the government", I assume you also include the French, and possibly even Oman, government too right? You know, the one that is also investigating Ghosn and also handing evidence to the prosecution team in Japan?

8 ( +12 / -4 )

When you say "the government", I assume you also include the French, and possibly even Oman, government too right?

Wrong. I mean the japanese gov.

You know, the one that is also investigating Ghosn and also handing evidence to the prosecution team in Japan?

Only they are INVESTIGATING and HANDING EVIDENCE, like you said. They are not simply locking the man up and just trying to get a confession

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

Only they are INVESTIGATING and HANDING EVIDENCE, like you said. They are not simply locking the man up and just trying to get a confession

The transaction in Oman doesn't break any law in Oman.

IMHO, they really don't need a confession any more, they are well into trial preparation, and their sole concern now is preservation of evidence.

Yes a confession would spare a trial and cost associated, but not really necessary anymore.

8 ( +13 / -5 )

The transaction in Oman doesn't break any law in Oman.

> IMHO, they really don't need a confession any more, they are well into trial preparation, and their sole concern now is preservation of evidence.

> Yes a confession would spare a trial and cost associated, but not really necessary anymore.

When why arrest him again?? LMAO. They're ready to go to trial, and they can serve him with fresh allegations. He's in the country. And he's going to court. There was absolutely NO reason to arrest him unless they wanted to gag him.

-10 ( +4 / -14 )

Pretty clear he violated his bail terms, he is a true fool for doing so. Very happy he's back in detention

6 ( +13 / -7 )

How is it "Pretty Clear'? Please explain. He has been arrested on new charges.

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

When why arrest him again?? LMAO

I thought that was clearly explained by the prosecutors for ALL cases not just Ghosn? ie to stop the accused from tampering with evidence. The Oman transactions represents a new charge, new evidence...

9 ( +14 / -5 )

I thought that was clearly explained by the prosecutors for ALL cases not just Ghosn? ie to stop the accused from tampering with evidence. The Oman transactions represents a new charge, new evidence...

How is he going to tamper with evidence when he's not even allowed to access the internet?? What a joke! Please! This is about punishing him through more forced interrogations.

-10 ( +4 / -14 )

How is he going to tamper with evidence when he's not even allowed to access the internet?? 

Wait what, so you now do accept that one of his bail conditions was that he was not allowed access to the internet? Do you also accept that there was a Twitter identity-verified post by him on the internet, as a fact stated in this article, thereby violating his bail? Perhaps a fake news conspiracy by Twitter?

10 ( +13 / -3 )

Yes. In most countries it is an offense to comment on an ongoing case. Especially on bail. More charges please.

9 ( +13 / -4 )

Wait what, so you now do accept that one of his bail conditions was that he was not allowed access to the internet?

No one ever denied that, myself included.

Do you also accept that there was a Twitter identity-verified post by him on the internet, as a fact stated in this article, thereby violating his bail?

Its not a fact stated by the article. the article also says:

I don't know if he himself wrote the tweet, but he didn't violate bail conditions," said Hironaka, nicknamed "the Razor" for many high-profile cases he has won in a country where the conviction rate is 99.9 percent.

It could have been someone posting a tweet dictated to them by him. But if that's the case, that means he didn't violate his bail conditions.

Perhaps a fake news conspiracy by Twitter?

Or maybe a cover up by Japan Inc's apologists.

-10 ( +3 / -13 )

This is about punishing him through more forced interrogations.

What ever the case may be, he is being dealt with under Japanese laws, and in the same way a Japanese would be dealt with. Some would argue he was afforded bail, which would not be afforded to a Japanese suspect based on stats.

Personally, the take away for me is, he played his cards poorly. Hindsight says to me if he had said 'Sorry, I am a busy man, I did not know Nissan paid me so much', he could have just asked for a chance to amend reporting, paid fines, say sorry on TV, bowed deeply and walked into the sunset and Renault would never have gotten involved.

12 ( +13 / -1 )

What ever the case may be, he is being dealt with under Japanese laws, and in the same way a Japanese would be dealt with.

Yes he is being dealt with under japanese law, but not in the same way.

> Some would argue he was afforded bail, which would not be afforded to a Japanese suspect based on stats.

He was afforded bail due to his lawyers appealing to the international court of human justice

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Agree with Aly 100% and all Carlos Ghosn's supporters agree 100% as well. This entire process has quite obviously been a conspiracy with fake charges and his tweet was faked by apologists, almost definitely ordered by Abe himself. Even all anti-Ghosn supporters and coverage is a fake news cover up

4 ( +7 / -3 )

Since its been sent from his solicitors office and they have checked it, he can't have broke any of his bail conditions, It seams that Japanese prosecutors or the police make stuff up as they go along ( allegedly )

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Brian WhewayToday  05:14 pm JST

“Since its been sent from his solicitors office and they have checked it, he can't have broke any of his bail conditions, It seams that Japanese prosecutors or the police make stuff up as they go along ( allegedly )”

Neither the prosecutors nor the police have made up anything regarding Ghosn’s bail conditions. Indeed if you read the article you’ll see the detail where the prosecutors declined to comment on that issue because it’s something handled by the courts. Note also that he was arrested this fourth time on new charges, not for bail violations.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

You can't deny access to the internet or restrict freedom of expression through tweeting which are both fundamental human rights, at least in more civilized countries

Since when is internet access a fundamental human right?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

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