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TV Asahi cancels performance of K-pop group BTS over A-bomb shirt

116 Comments

TV Asahi Corp said Thursday it has canceled a live performance of K-pop group BTS amid a furor over a member having worn a T-shirt reportedly celebrating the U.S. atomic bombing of Hiroshima.

The Tokyo-based TV Asahi said it has decided to call off their performance Friday night on its Music Station program after asking the band's agency about the member's intention in wearing the shirt.

A controversy erupted recently over photos of BTS member Jimin wearing a T-shirt commemorating the day that Korea was liberated from Japanese colonial rule in 1945.

The design, which went viral and drew flak in Japan, includes a photo of Koreans celebrating liberation and a photo of an atomic bomb exploding in Japan.

BTS, also known as the Bangtan Boys, is a seven-member South Korean boy band that debuted in 2013. In May this year, the group reached the top of the Billboard 200 album chart with its new release "Love Yourself: Tear."

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They should know better, this group is hugely popular here in Japan with teenage girls and young women. I guess no one ever taught them no to bite the hand that feeds them!

36 ( +40 / -4 )

It’s kinda stupid to like someone who actually hates you racially.

Imagine if a Japanese boy band had done the reverse. We would be hearing from the Korean government about it.

34 ( +39 / -5 )

Good for TV Asahi! The ultimate insult is to Sell your product to a people you hate and not let them even know it. This K-Pop kid should have been more careful.

31 ( +34 / -3 )

Insensitive like the Richland High Bombers with the mushroom cloud as their mascot.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

This is political censorship and political censorship is not good. Period.

-37 ( +5 / -42 )

This is political censorship and political censorship is not good. Period.

No, this is about band member Jimin being a *k.

31 ( +34 / -3 )

Imagine if a Japanese boy band had done the reverse. We would be hearing from the Korean government about it.

Korea never occupied Japan, raped its women, tortured its people. And scientists fleeing similar oppression around the world did unite to build a device that forced Japan into submission, a point emphasized in the Imperial Rescript of Surrender delivered by Emperor Showa, and thus aid in the liberation of Korea. Of course that was over half a century ago, but recognizing and celebrating freedom from oppression is never a bad thing.

-32 ( +8 / -40 )

American and European fans celebrate this news because this means more concert dates for BTS in the US and in Europe.

-32 ( +3 / -35 )

A photo is essential for this article.

32 ( +32 / -0 )

Disgusting behaviour by "Bangtan boys." How can you glorify the death of hundreds of thousands of innocent people, in the world's only nuclear attacks?

All the shops that sell their CDs should be picketed and customers shopping there challenged. SK Ambassador should be summoned to explain what the Government will do to stop this happening again.

11 ( +25 / -14 )

@Ganbare Japan!

All the shops that sell their CDs should be picketed and customers shopping there challenged. 

LOL, you think Japanese schoolgirl fans would care!

-23 ( +4 / -27 )

Very poor taste by this group. One would think they would have thought this through a bit....

@quercetum - wow! They still have that! I thought with all of the political correctness and removal of anything deemed offensive in the U.S. this would have changed, but no.....right there on the home page!

http://www.richlandbombers.us/

Interesting stuff

19 ( +21 / -2 )

Of course that was over half a century ago, but recognizing and celebrating freedom from oppression is never a bad thing

Yeah, but the Bangtan Soy Boys are paid to prance around on a stage, not “celebrate freedom from oppression”.

18 ( +22 / -4 )

I bet all those who defend the idea of "Freedom of speech" when the shoe's on the other foot will be pretty quiet on this one, or just outright hypocritical. The kid was stupid for wearing this shirt, and now his group is going to suffer for it -- as will the fans. People here are already angry enough that K-pop is outselling domestic music exponentially.

-24 ( +6 / -30 )

@Smith - I am all for freedom of speech, actually a huge advocate as I do not think one other human being should tell me what I can or cannot say or write.

On the other hand it in no way makes what these kids did smart or tasteful. Will be interesting to see if there is any fallout from this incident.

24 ( +25 / -1 )

Do these band members realize that an estimated 22,000 Koreans died from the Atomic bombings? The necessity and morality of which is hotly debated in the very country that dropped them? They are guilty of stupidity, ignorance and insensitivity. Anyone who celebrates human deaths is not human in my view.

27 ( +30 / -3 )

Asiaman7Today  08:34 am JST

Korea never occupied Japan, raped its women, tortured its people. And scientists fleeing similar oppression around the world did unite to build a device that forced Japan into submission, a point emphasized in the Imperial Rescript of Surrender delivered by Emperor Showa, and thus aid in the liberation of Korea. Of course that was over half a century ago, but recognizing and celebrating freedom from oppression is never a bad thing.

Celebrating the end of war is one thing, but celebrating atomic bomb killing  129,000–226,000  innocent civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki is totally another.

Here is your ignorant.

20,000 Koreans were killed in Hiroshima and about 2,000 died in Nagasak.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hibakusha

Shame on you!

25 ( +29 / -4 )

Do these band members realize that an estimated 22,000 Koreans died from the Atomic bombings

Good point. Most ‘Slebs aren’t all that smart.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

People here are already angry enough that K-pop is outselling domestic music exponentially.

Man, K-wave is in the past here. Only a few artists remain popular but not like 5-10 years ago.

18 ( +20 / -2 )

She expressed her right to wear and express what she wants, probably for publicity.

TV Asahi expressed their right to draw cosequences and cancel her performance, probably to save face.

Fair enough, but nothing worthy to write about. Both parties acted in their respective best interests and both parties weighed their options.

So nothing of value gained or lost.

12 ( +13 / -1 )

At least people are not forgetting their respective tragedies - that would be much worse if they did....,

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

Here is yet another Korean group, not BTS group, music video singing and dancing.

You can see burning dying civilians and hiroshima atomic bomb dome building.

What's the message there??

Would you enjoy watching music with people dying like Holocaust behind?

Absolutely distasteful and I can sense a hostility against Japan.

https://twitter.com/GNSIMAN/status/1055108239048622080

11 ( +14 / -3 )

An image search of the shirt turns up a design with the English words Patriotism Our history Liberation Korea printed repeatedly on it. Nope couldn't wear that on TV in Japan even without the horribly tasteless mushroom cloud graphic.

19 ( +19 / -0 )

Think about this.... As some of you might know, K-Pop Boy and Girl Bands have little to no say whatsoever regarding anything they do. Everything is dictated by their Agents and Promo People. Suppose they, the Promo People, noticed that overall interest in this group was on the decline in Japan and they could not expect to be profitable with the group here going forward. What better way than to stir an incident whereby the Band appears Patriotic to S. Korea and maybe increase sales. It might even increase the life of the band by a year. Maybe they've done this before... not sure but if I were running things... it might cross my mind. Play every card in the deck.

-10 ( +2 / -12 )

Good for K-POP. It could affect other K-'POP artists. Japanese market is really important for K-POP

-10 ( +0 / -10 )

What's even more tragic than the atomic bombs dropped on Nagasaki and Hiroshima is the Japanese role in war and invasions in the 20th century. It's pretty hypocritical to complain about the atomic bombs and yet have no problem flaunting WWII insignia and whitewashing Japanese war atrocities. BTS are far more popular globally. They could care less about Japan especially when they're still charting #1 in Japan.

-17 ( +4 / -21 )

LOL all these clueless comments about K wave being past and Japan being an important market. BTS has leapfrogged over Japan a long time ago. They're far more popular in the US, Europe and South America. Japan is a blip for these guys. They're not my cup of tea but welcome to 2018.

-18 ( +4 / -22 )

TV Asahi Corp said Thursday it has canceled a live performance of K-pop group BTS amid a furor over a member having worn a T-shirt reportedly celebrating the U.S. atomic bombing of Hiroshima.

Reportedly celebrating? Where's the proof?

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

melonbarmonsterToday  12:10 pm JST

LOL all these clueless comments about K wave being past and Japan being an important market. BTS has leapfrogged over Japan a long time ago. They're far more popular in the US, Europe and South America. Japan is a blip for these guys. They're not my cup of tea but welcome to 2018.

LOL back at you.

And yet the K-music industry needs Japan to survive. About 70% of their revenues come from selling their music and touring in Japan.

Were will BTS be in two years when all the hype dies?

13 ( +16 / -3 )

OssanAmeica: "Do these band members realize that an estimated 22,000 Koreans died from the Atomic bombings?"

Actually, according to logic you've used in the past, and companies like Mitsubishi Heavy, etc., STILL use today to avoid saying they were POWs and paying redress, technically they were NOT Koreans at the time, but Japanese, no?

Hachidori: "Were will BTS be in two years when all the hype dies?"

Same place they are now, or more popular, since not only is the "hype" not dying, but the popularity of Korean music in particular is growing exponentially. You guys were all angry and upset YEARS ago when it was shown that rental rates of music and movies from Korea outstripped domestic products by far, and many vowed never to listen/Watch it again. Yet here we are, in an age where you can ask ANY teenager in Japan what their favorite band is and almost every single one will give a Korean boy/girlband name. I haven't heard a single kid say a Japanese band or artist as their favorite in more than a year (actors, yes, though). Not one. This may make you angry, but it's pure fact.

-20 ( +3 / -23 )

"I haven't heard a single kid say a Japanese band or artist as their favorite in more than a year"

So you talk with Japanese kids about music?

16 ( +17 / -1 )

The shirt is in English. I wonder if he knew what it says.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Cancelling the concert is quite a petty reaction. They could have just forbidden the person to wear the T-shirt. In fact, I think the whole situation between Japan and SK is quite petty. They are like a pair of schoolyard brats and just as bad as each other.

-16 ( +2 / -18 )

BT who?

11 ( +13 / -2 )

Cryptic messages from the Koreans and they are still asking us for money, no.

12 ( +14 / -2 )

But I like PSY

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Nothing wrong celebrating liberation of your own country, but not celebrating a bombing that killed many. Thousands of Koreans were killed in the atomic bomb too. What a idiot.

He should put aside his ballet shoes for a bit and read some history books!!

16 ( +17 / -1 )

Kenji Fujimori: "Cryptic messages from the Koreans and they are still asking us for money, no."

Since you want to get into gross generalisations on a specific case here, they are still asking for the apology Japan refuses to officially give, too, as is China, and numerous other countries for Japan's atrocities while demanding the atomic bombings be acknowledged as atrocities and not forgotten or spoken ill of. What's your point?

-16 ( +3 / -19 )

I checked out the shirt. Dumb. Way to go, Jimin, and whoever designed the shirt. Not.

18 ( +18 / -0 )

Anyway, hopefully another broadcaster or organiser will tell the kid to lose the shirt, wise up, and hold the concert while TV Asahi loses out for the overreaction.

-17 ( +2 / -19 )

Had to happen, Jimin's always been into politics & History (and dyeing his hair yellow), and has never been shy about making political statements (always through clothes & hairstyle though).

When they wear leggings it actually means "never forget the Civil rights movement" (or something like that).

11 ( +11 / -0 )

That t-shirt is in a poor taste regardless whether you like Japan or not...

14 ( +16 / -2 )

Sensitive much? Some people need

to grow up, it's a tshirt.

-13 ( +3 / -16 )

Really? You're just jealous that BTS is getting so big and recognized in the whole world representing korea and none of your country men do no matter how big you thought they are. Thats so low Japan...MOVE ON you're a bully since world war 2 dont drag it in these generation, politics is politics entertainment is entertainment, I hope you knew the difference, how about bring back all Japanese kpop idols back in your country?

-16 ( +1 / -17 )

ASAHI TV given the Overreaction award.

-12 ( +3 / -15 )

This is an interesting one to consider. According to the description the angle of the tshirt in question (I have not seen a picture) is celebrating Korean liberation from Imperial Japan. Heady stuff for a pop group no doubt. The nuclear bomb image sounds like it was insensitive and heavy-handed but there are those who argue that without the bomb Japan would not have surrendered and therefore released control over Korea ultimately (I'm not making that argument myself keep in mind, just indicating it is a valid argument for many).

Yes, if the show was on the other foot of course the reaction would be the same or more dramatic. But that other foot was not the appendage of the oppressor was it? Surely that context is of some consequence here.

That being said, it does sound like the shirt was worn to elicit some kind of response from either or both sides. Perhaps that goal has been achieved then?

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

So if "it's just a tshirt", is wearing a tshirt with a swastika on it alright?

11 ( +12 / -1 )

So if "it's just a tshirt", is wearing a tshirt with a swastika on it alright?

The ones with the circle around it and the line striking through it are sometimes crudely inspiring.

Context is key

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

i didn’t ask about those. I’m asking about the ones with a straight up swastika, not in any kind a condemnation or irony. Is there nothing wrong with that since it’s just a shirt?

8 ( +9 / -1 )

International (and Korean) K Pop fans who think that K Pop groups don't need Japan makes me laugh... There is a reason why the like of SNSD, Bigbang, TVXQ, BTS, Twice etc all come to Japan for extensive tours. Its because they make a lot more money in Japanese album sales and tours than they do anywhere else.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

Fizzbit - BTS - like the biggest band since the Beatles, according to some screaming teenage girls. But since you don't know them, then that matters...not.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

From what I understand, the bands somehow make more money in Japan than Korea but the audiences in the Japanese concerts are primarily from South Korea. I might be misremembering that but it's what I heard from someone in the industry. Something about bigger venues in Japan.

I'm not sure why I'm trying to bring facts into this argument; it hasn't seemed to work for anyone else.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Hisashi T Fujinaka: "From what I understand, the bands somehow make more money in Japan than Korea but the audiences in the Japanese concerts are primarily from South Korea. I might be misremembering"

Please give us stats from your sources. In relation to the former you are correct; based on the agencies in both Korea and Japan (Johnny's and the Korean equivalent) they do make more money in Japan, but the idea that it's mostly Korean fans in Japan going to see the concerts as a trend is silly. Japan loves the K-pop.

KariHaruka: "International (and Korean) K Pop fans who think that K Pop groups don't need Japan makes me laugh... they make more money..."

Making more money and "needing" are not the same thing. Celebrities like Brad Pitt, DiCaprio, and David Beckham make HUGE amounts of money in Japanese commercials, but they don't "need" it. If they can make an extra buck where they can't get as much if any back home for the same, why not?

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

If anything, this storm in a teacup might show the Japanese how Korean people actually feel. But that is unlikely as anyone who is a "fan" of such garbage wouldn't know much about history or politics, let alone care less.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Everyone the world over prays that nuclear weapons are never used again.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

This news item going around the globe just lights up the cultural isolation in these parts. 

It will cost the Japan house campaign dearly.

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

Let's hope their careers bomb.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

To veejay and others who are hateful towards BTS or KPop in general because of this issue : BTS is not a garbage. They are more than just a KPop and they are learning. Just check them out. I don't think they had very intention to mock and celebrate the Hiroshima tragedy. I do believe it was just a carelessness (or you might want to call it as stupidity or insensitivity) by young men at that age. Some people definitely make a fuss over a celebrity's mistake and become an unforgivable moral judge. They will apologize if it is necessary and approved by their society/government. No one never makes mistake in life consciously or unconsciously, common random people or celebrity or even head of state. Human learns over time for being better, including you and me. On the other hand, in this case, I am doubtful if the main issue is the T Shirt alone. It is just a political agenda, given the fact that there has been political tension between the two countries recently. Btw, money..who needs money...everybody needs money...but how much and at what cost....something needs to consider. KPop groups coming to Japan to make huge money....yes...but do not forget, they come there because there is demand...huge demand. If there is no demand, they won't come over. They are not touring in Japan begging for money as beggars.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

Dumb kid. You know arrogance and ignorance come hand in hand. It's like somebody wear a shirt with the twin towers on 9/11 and see how the Americans react.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

No big deal considering it is prohibited in SKorea that Japanese artists appear in their TV.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

LOL, this incident backfired and is now making headlines across the globe.

https://twitter.com/i/moments/1060811763392937984

@Mike Wyckoff

Let's hope their careers bomb.

BTS is a Justin Bieber/Ariana Grande caliber artist in the US and Europe. They are way past what happens in places like Japan now.

@tinawatanabe

No big deal considering it is prohibited in SKorea that Japanese artists appear in their TV.

Huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1rykjD-Toc

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

Park Jimin is an d KOREAN artist. Is it such a big problem that he wore a shirt-That's supporting his country? i wouldn't thinks so. If Japan never treated them so bad (tortured, raped etc.) The hatred probably never sprouted the way it was. I am an ARMY and proud to be one. I am going to believe it was on accident, and he purposely didn't do i, but if he did i don't care i love all of BTS and all of you people that are haters well you can hate on someone else

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences. Just a dumb move for the artist and his band paid the consequences.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

BTS's agency says their Japan dome tour schedules are unaffected and will begin on the 13th as scheduled.

The elderly executives of the TV Asahi dismayed at the sight of sold out Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya, and Fukuoka domes after their "ban".

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

@smithinjapan

Making more money and "needing" are not the same thing. Celebrities like Brad Pitt, DiCaprio, and David Beckham make HUGE amounts of money in Japanese commercials, but they don't "need" it. If they can make an extra buck where they can't get as much if any back home for the same, why not?

Unlike major hollywood celebrities K Pop is still a niche market around the world. Their most important market is the Japanese market and I will use SNSD as an example (as they are the group that I follow). SNSD's highest selling Korean album was around 450K at £10 per album. Meanwhile their highest selling Japanese album was just under 1 million at $50 - $60 per album. The Korean market is mainly focused on digital sales whilst the Japanese market is still focused on physical sales.

Then there are the concert venues where most groups will perform at 6-8K venues, with some of the bigger acts maybe playing in 15K venues. However in Japan they fill out massive arena and dome tours. Some of the highest grossing girl group tours of all time came from SNSD who grossed between $20M - $30M+ from their Japanese tours.

This is why K Pop needs Japan. Because they can't reach these figures in Korea.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

@KariHaruka

Their most important market is the Japanese market

Not the BTS. BTS's main market is the US. This is why BTS is the different breed of K-Pop idol...

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

Lol some of you are really showing your age and delusional bubble. BTS became popular in a very different route than other kpop groups. Japan is irrelevant. Even Kpop scene is irrelevant to these guys. Talk about pointless bellyaching. You must think Sony makes the best phones.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

I'm in favor of this cancellation. Your rude attitude towards the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Cheerfully commemorating the atomic bombing is a lack of sensitivity especially for the victims who are still alive or their descendants.

I hope that this musical group K-pop will reflect on this issue in detail.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

Asiaman7Nov. 9 08:34 am JSTImagine if a Japanese boy band had done the reverse. We would be hearing from the Korean government about it.

Korea never occupied Japan, raped its women, tortured its people. And scientists fleeing similar oppression around the world did unite to build a device that forced Japan into submission, a point emphasized in the Imperial Rescript of Surrender delivered by Emperor Showa, and thus aid in the liberation of Korea. Of course that was over half a century ago, but recognizing and celebrating freedom from oppression is never a bad thing.

It's not the celebrating of Korean liberation from Japan's fascist regime that's so bad. It's the atomic bomb that's so offensive - that thing killed 100000's+ (more?) and that invention made possible for the first time the suicide of the human race. That is nothing to celebrate! Anybody with any sense ought to know that a nuclear war is unwinnable. Does anybody remember the summits between Reagan and Gorbachev?

The totalitarian government then ruling Japan was a bunch of fascists, war criminals and oppressive dirtbags - and they oppressed and lied to the Japanese people too. They also paid the penalty for their crimes against humanity. There's no need to bring up an ugly part of Japan's history and rub their faces in the sand with it, and wearing a T-shirt with a provocative symbol or picture from 73 years ago is not in good taste. Most people living today don't even remember WWII. Bury the hatchet, the past is the past - forgive, learn from it, don't forget, don't repeat it, don't rub it in somebody's face!

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Why is there no photograph or context in this article? Why does it end up in news feeds around the world just two days before Remembrance Day? Are we rebranding what happened at the end of World War 2, as some kind of atomic tragedy perpetrated against the people of Hiroshima and Nagasaki; something we should be so sensitive to that we can no longer commemorate the end of the war? Or is it just propaganda?

 

If I understand this correctly, some pop singer wore a t-shirt that celebrates the liberation of the Korean Peninsula at the end of World War 2. Apparently, he wore it, in Korea, on August 15, 2017. The t-shirt shows one of the mushroom clouds that ended the war in the Pacific; putting a stop to the needless slaughter of tens of millions of soldiers and innocent civilians in countries throughout the region. Many more people would have died if the bombs had not been detonated and the war had dragged on but, apparently, it's insensitive to wear a t-shirt that has a photograph of the Nagasaki mushroom cloud on it. It's a diplomatic insult to Japan and the people who died at Hiroshima and Nagasaki; people who were essentially sacrificed by the Imperial Japanese government that declared war in the first place; people who were no more or less dead than all the other civilians who died, in the Pacific Theatre, from lesser bombs, bullets and starvation and illness.

In 1945, people needed to celebrate the end of that war and, even, the bombs that hastened it. Seventy years later we still need to celebrate that armistice. And commemorate all of those sacrifices and deaths. We still need to remember and learn the lesson that it can't ever happen again and ... images of the bomb are, I think, very helpful in that regard.

 

This unnecessary t-shirt backlash is only a tempest in a teapot that merges into today's political propaganda. Pop stars, people observing Remembrance Day and the Japanese public, at large, shouldn't have to deal with it.

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

Are we rebranding what happened at the end of World War 2, as some kind of atomic tragedy perpetrated against the people of Hiroshima and Nagasaki; something we should be so sensitive to that we can no longer commemorate the end of the war? 

You may want to take a moment to research exactly which war ended on November 11th.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

Heck, if they're so big, they can leave Japan alone. It's not like they come due to the goodness of their heart to do free performances or anything. They come to make money. I doubt Japanese fangirls will fall over and die if they don't do business in Japan.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Lol NYT, BBC, Guardian, CNN, and other media reporting this and highlighting Japanese denials of Japanese war atrocities all while BTS is still incidentally topping Japanese music charts,

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

In 1945, people needed to celebrate the end of that war and, even, the bombs that hastened it. Seventy years later we still need to celebrate that armistice. And commemorate all of those sacrifices and deaths. We still need to remember and learn the lesson that it can't ever happen again and ... images of the bomb are, I think, very helpful in that regard.

Yes, images of the A-bombs are very important to remember it. But not to wear on a damn t-shirt. Completely tasteless. We should remember the Green River Killer, but I don't want to see his face on some band members back.

I was always ashamed to see people wearing those stupid shirts here in the US that said 'Made in America, Tested in Japan' with a image of the mushroom cloud in the background. I'm glad those shirts have pretty much disappeared.

It's something to commemorate, not celebrate.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

Are we rebranding what happened at the end of World War 2, as some kind of atomic tragedy perpetrated against the people of Hiroshima and Nagasaki; something we should be so sensitive to that we can no longer commemorate the end of the war? 

You may want to take a moment to research exactly which war ended on November 11th.

Ah, Strangerland ... you're not so clever to think that someone else is unaware.

In British Commonwealth countries, on November 11th, we commemorate all who have died ... in any war. It's not just about World War 1. For our Rememberance Day, we reflect on everyone's sacrifice beginning with a minute of silence at 11:11 a.m.

That's why it was, actually, pretty galling to find this in my news feed this morning ... while I was preparing a Rememberance Day lesson for my class. The timing of this company's decision ... is unfortunate.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

Yes, images of the A-bombs are very important to remember it. But not to wear on a damn t-shirt. Completely tasteless. We should remember the Green River Killer, but I don't want to see his face on some band members back.

I was always ashamed to see people wearing those stupid shirts here in the US that said 'Made in America, Tested in Japan' with a image of the mushroom cloud in the background. I'm glad those shirts have pretty much disappeared.

It's something to commemorate, not celebrate.

The t-shirts you describe are, as you say, completely tasteless but not all commemorative t-shirts are . The shirt in question here, commemorates and celebrates the day that a people were liberated. It's pretty clear, if you look at it, that it's factual and, definitely, not celebrating the many deaths that occurred when the bombs were dropped. So, why are people reading between non-existent lines to try to find that meaning?

-10 ( +0 / -10 )

@Elaine Carlton

The t-shirt shows one of the mushroom clouds that ended the war in the Pacific;.....

Russian invasion ended the war in the Pacific. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were simply cynical live human experiments on innocent civilians.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-japan-stalin-did/

...putting a stop to the needless slaughter.

A laughable ex-post facto rationalization by the very same people trying to justify the war crime of genocidally slaughtering hundreds of thousands of women and children with nukes.

As the historical record shows, six of the seven US WWII five star officers concluded that the nuking of hundreds of thousands of civilians was unnecessary.

As Brig. General Carter Clarke stated:

"... .we Brought them [the Japanese] down to an abject surrender through the accelerated sinking of their merchant marine and hunger alone, and when we did not need to do it, and we knew we didn't need to do it, and they knew that we knew we didn't need to do it, we used them as an experiment for two atomic bombs. "

... while I was preparing a Rememberance Day lesson for my class. 

I pity your students. You should reflect on the true meaning of Remembrance Day. It is not about promoting war propaganda and celebrating the mass murder of civilians.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

@elaine

Just no. By adding the mushroom cloud image to the T-shirt it is definitely celebrating the event as part of the liberation.

Bit I don’t care what reason you want to arbitrarily assign to it, using the image of the a-bomb going off on a T-shirt is 100% tasteless. It is basically a picture of a hundred thousand people being killed. You cannot put a justification on wearing that as a decoration.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

It's funny how sensitive people here get when it comes to Japanese people killed. The cumulative deaths over bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were terrible and tragic. How about recognizing the terrible and tragic deaths of 6 to 10 million civilians murdered by Japan? Trying to cry foul over offended sensibilities while ignoring your own far graver offenses is hypocrisy.

-7 ( +3 / -10 )

@utorse Hiroshima and Nagasaki were simply cynical live human experiments on innocent civilians.

ya mean like the Unit 731 experiments on live prisoners, like how Japan experimented on exterminating the entire Korean race, how they sexually experimented on hundreds of thousands of women from all over Asia and to this day claim most were paid prostitutes, how when the Japanese knew the end was near they experimented on helpless POW by inflicting all sort of sadistic karate blows to see which were fatal. Yeah, there was a lot of experimenting going on.

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

Always criticizing Japan is also an essential performance for K-pop idols. It is necessary to satisfy the vanity of the Korean people and spread false history around the world. Is the title of their next new song "Hiroshima and Nagasaki"?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Triggered bc Japan the ultimate victim narrative is called out compete with racist statements about "Koreans". Black van special!

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

Regarding the meaning of the now infamous T-shirt, it seems to be have been designed to commemorate Korean Liberation Day on August 15. (1) the nuclear bomb represents end of WW2; (2) the people celebrating at the bottom is an actual picture of ordinary Koreans celebrating the surrender of Japan and end of WW2; (iii) the words are Konglish, and I guess they are supposed to mean that Koreans should be patriotic about their country.

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

It's funny how sensitive people here get when it comes to Japanese people killed. The cumulative deaths over bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were terrible and tragic but how about recognizing the terrible and tragic deaths of 6 to 10 million civilians murdered by Japan? Trying to cry foul over offended sensibilities while ignoring your own far graver offenses is hypocrisy.

Thank you so much for saying this!!! For me, this crying foul behaviour is, by far, the most upsetting aspect of this dispute ... It clouds the full picture, while shutting down and shaming people who want us all to remember and talk about the lessons of the past.

Russian invasion ended the war in the Pacific. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were simply cynical live human experiments on innocent civilians. http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-japan-stalin-did/

I've encountered these arguments before but thank you for citing the article as I would like to share a passage from it. The author calls attention to the fact that the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings gave Hirohito two things. (1) a convenient excuse for an unconditional surrender (he was able to blame a new, miracle technology for defeat and capitulation rather than attributing failure to his own mistakes). And (2) it helped him to "appeal to international sympathy":

"Japan had waged war aggressively, and with particular brutality toward conquered peoples. It's behavior was likely to be condemned by other nations. Being able to recast Japan as a victimized nation - one that had been unfairly bombed with a cruel and horrifying instrument of war - would help to offset some of the morally repugnant things that Japan's military had done."

And I quote that in full because, in part, it describes what is happening here; covering the motive for a decision by recasting the victim and appealing to "international sympathy". The t-shirt can be seen as both a reason and an excuse for Tv Asahi's decision to exclude a Korean band from their programming. The picture on the pop star's t-shirt can take the blame for a decision that was just waiting to be made anyway.

As for the quagmire of moral questions that will, forever, be associated with the decision to bomb Hiroshima and Nagasaki? I think that the Americans and Allies were most desperate for a winning strategy that didn't involve a costly invasion (and division of Japan) by their own and Russian forces. Judging by what happened at Iwo Jima, alone, it could have been interminable and truly horrific struggle for everyone.

Just no. By adding the mushroom cloud image to the T-shirt it is definitely celebrating the event as part of the liberation. Bit I don’t care what reason you want to arbitrarily assign to it, using the image of the a-bomb going off on a T-shirt is 100% tasteless. It is basically a picture of a hundred thousand people being killed. You cannot put a justification on wearing that as a decoration.

We just have to disagree here. I don't see "celebration", where you do, and I don't see "decoration" either. I see a factual narrative that is important in the world's history.

I'd, actually, like to apologize for having this lengthy discussion here. People in modern Japan have no blame to shoulder for what happened during World War 2 and almost every country has done something that it must atone for. There is a lot of potential trouble hovering around Korea and Japan (namely China and North Korea) so, from afar, it would be nice to see more standing together without there being unnecessary little skirmishes like this one.

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

It's all staged for the publicity. Do you think every move these guys make isn't orchestrated? Do you think they have ANY say in what they wear? No.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

@Elaine

As for the quagmire of moral questions that will, forever, be associated with the decision to bomb Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

There is no quagmire. Nuking hundreds of thousands of women and children is morally repugnant. 

As the 31st President of the United States wrote in August, 1945: "The use of the atomic bomb, with its indiscriminate killing of women and children, revolts my soul."

I think that the Americans and Allies were most desperate for a winning strategy that didn't involve a costly invasion...it could have been interminable and truly horrific struggle for everyone.

I find your attempts to justify nuking civilians unconvincing. I place greater value on the six of the seven US WWII five star officers concluded that the nuking of hundreds of thousands of civilians was totally unnecessary.

The words of Fleet Admiral Leahy:

".....the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan......in being the first to use it, we had adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was not taught to make wars in that fashion, and that wars cannot be won by destroying women and children."

-Fleet Admiral Leahy

It clouds the full picture, while shutting down and shaming people who want us all to remember and talk about the lessons of the past

No one is shutting you down from writing your opinion. You are free to make whatever statements you please. However, freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences and criticism.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

I have engaged in an unpleasant search over internet about this issue, and here's what I found out.

This atomic-bomb T-shirt is a tip of iceberg and what's lying underneath is, as you expected, a quite amount of twisted Korean people with hatred against Japan.

I always thought anti-Japan,Han-Nichi, 反日, in Korea is limited to politics, but I was wrong.

"Love Line" from TouhouShingi 東方神起, 동방신기,东方神起

Original Video, there is no Japan island on world map, while I can even see Taiwan, British and Ireland.

No doubt this is on purpose, later, this video was edited with Japan added in it.

https://togetter.com/li/1215114

"Happiness" from Korean grils, Red Velvet

Video shows a controversial crop from news paper.

Please note that they didn't use just a simple newspaper article reporting Japanese surrender but chose particular ones that used derogatory words such as "NIPS" and "J#P" against Japan.

http://www.otoku-information.club/entry/2018/04/04/213936

"Im coming" from Korean singer group "P" in 2011.

Dancing and singing with burning civilians in Hiroshima.

The video was banned from youtube because it is offensive, and this is only remaining video.

https://twitter.com/GNSIMAN/status/1055108239048622080

BTS group and crowd gone crazy with NAZI resembling flag and costume. again, tasteless!

One member is wearing a hat with Swastika on it.

https://blog.goo.ne.jp/kentanakachan/e/3a5982627855a05a664961c0f598bd04

Blog critisizing BTS at holocaust in 2015

http://seoulbeats.com/2015/01/bts-holocaust-memorial-im-not-letting-go/

This type of K-pop harassment against Japan has been known to some limited Japanese K-pop fun, ( some lost faith and left K-pop). Some Japanese fun believe that singers didn't do it but their managers did it.

10 ( +10 / -0 )

If the Korean guy knew anything about the history of his own country, he would know that both Hiroshima and Nagasaki had large Korean populations both voluntary and involuntary. The nuclear weapons incinerated not just Japanese, but a number of Koreans, and other foreign nationals as well.

You would have to be extremely dense not to know this because over the years Koreans from Nagasaki and Hiroshima have repeatedly brought legal actions in an attempt to get compensation from the Japanese government for the effects of nuclear radiation.

His shirt was in effect saying "it's OK to kill Koreans as long as you kill Japanese at the same time."

8 ( +8 / -0 )

Ok

This is the source of problem.

There is a Japanese twitter acount TAro91217966 criticizing BTS with sources, but he is just getting hatred messages by Korenans one after another..

It is all about hatred. How sad..

https://twitter.com/TAro91217966/status/1060884791304716288v

2 ( +2 / -0 )

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Japan should delete their tours. I don't know them, but people are saying they are very popular in the US, so I think they don't care about the Japanese market, and this is why they thought it was a nice idea wearing such a shirt. They should pay the consequences for their shameful actions. I guess BTS = basically they suck?

Seriously, why Japan is feeding these men and women grew up hating their Country, is a mystery to me.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

SWC got furious about Japanese girls group but has been quiet so far this time.

https://twitter.com/TAro91217966/status/1060884791304716288

0 ( +0 / -0 )

But how old are these men? They look like some ladies in their 30s. Weird.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Not only BTS but many K - POP groups are coming to Japan to earn money while they criticize Japan in South Korea and naive Japanese teenagers support them.

BTS is also doing comfort women activities in South Korea.

And when the president of BTS announced collaboration with Japanese famous producer Akimoto Yasushi, their Korean fans called " Army" criticized Akimoto as extremely right wing and the plan was canceled.

However, Akimoto has never made any political remarks.

Maybe the Army hates Akimoto just because he had dinner with PM Abe,the most hated man in Korea.

Koreans are very good at pretending to be victims hiding the fact that they cause the problem first and when Japanese talk back, Westerners criticize it as "racism against the Koreans.

BTS also has suspicion to admire the Nazis but is yet to respond to it.Westerners will not criticize them?.

http://joehkoumk.seesaa.net/article/462670045.html?1541919809

7 ( +7 / -0 )

@Taka Yuki: as a western, I can.only say your Country (I guess you are Japanese) is stupid to support this Korean industry, full of anti-Japanese propaganda. Look at Korea. They banned your pop culture until the late 90s, and they continue to do like that to some extent. Look at China. They boycott both Korean pop culture and Japanese pop culture whenever they need it. I believe pop culture can be a bridge between different Countries, but not when it is used to spread political propaganda and hate. Apparently Korean artists pander to Korean anti-Japanese feelings in their Country, and later they go to Japan like if nothing happened. And you Japanese support them...

7 ( +8 / -1 )

I remembered right now I saw on Youtube a short video about a show, called "Produce 48". There were both Korean and Japanese girls, who apparently were competing to become a member of a new kpop girlband. Besides the fact everything looked obviously fake to me, and I think all of them were only playing a role, the Japanese girls were humiliated all the time. I wonder why Japan lets this happen. What kind of "cultural collaboration" is this?

5 ( +6 / -1 )

LiberationTshirtNotBombTshirt

the atomic bombing of japan signifies the liberation of korea from japan's imperialistic rule. there's nothing wrong with jimin wearing the shirt.T-shirt is actually not the reason. 1 or 2 years ago and for 2 sec on screen. Japan government just made a use of BTS because recently Korean court judged Korean captives during WW2 should be apologized and compensated by Japan. But Japan didn't but even planned to make innocent artist of Korea apologize to Japan reversely. It's so cruel and immature. The 2nd most victims of bomb were 90 thousand innocent Korean captives in Japan, criminal country of WW2. 50 thousand of them died then and only 40 thousands alive came back to Korea but still suffer with radiation disease now. So the bomb is also painful history of Korea, too. So it on the T-shirt as a history of Korean liberation day.

The shirt was meant to explain the Independence Day of Korea, hence they put 2 pictures on the shirt. one is a picture of the atomic bomb's mushroom cloud, and the other one is a picture of Korean people Hooraying at their independence day, August 15th of 1945. Those 2 pictures each symbolize the defeat of the Japanese Empire and the following Independence of Korea, and both are very commonly shown in the history textbook. Japanese haters claim that those pictures are meant to mock at the atomic bomb victims, which is distorting the truth. The picture of the cloud simply represents the end of the war. How can that be read as mocking innocent victims? Cooking up the story with the pictures without any harmful intention is very despicable. The problem is with the people who are trying so hard to mislead it as Korean people celebrating' the 'atomic bomb victims' when it's NOT. How can they drag on the 'innocent victim' of theirs to distort the truth? That's a shame. The bomb ended the war, it's undeniable. It brought numerous people freedom who were under the oppression of war criminals. Celebrating their independence cannot be separated from the end of the war. It's sad that civilians including 70,000 KOREAN (20,000 for Hiroshima)people were sacrificed from the atomic bomb, but that's a different story. (btw Japanese government excluded Korean bomb survivors from the atomic bomb survivor relief law with the reason that Korean survivors don't reside in Japan, even though many of the victims were bombed while working as the forced laborer for the munition factories in Nagasaki and Hiroshima.) Why don't Japanese think about why they get bombed? Did it fall from the sky out of sudden? without any reason? Why did the bomb choose to be dropped there? To END the war THEY broke out. Personally, It was very disappointing to see the Japanese people's reaction from the bomb picture, they directly recall their victims only, not the historical context of the situation Koreans are NOT fond of mocking innocent bomb victims in any degree since THEY were the victims during the war period. if BTS would have worn the shirt with that ill intention, Korean would be the first one to leave them.

[The real reason why JPN TV cancelled BTS' appearance]  

About this Asahi TV's BTS cancellation, it was already detected at the end of last October when the Korean Supreme Court made a ruling that Japanese war crime companies have to pay out damages to the Koreans who were forcefully drafted into the labor in Japan. In the Japanese newspaper, an article called "Block the Korean wave" emerged that day. And Japanese extreme-rights targeted BTS, making a issue of Jimin wearing a fan gifted LIBERATION T-shirt a year ago and RM's tweet "No future for the people who forgot history" made on Korea's Liberation day. Asahi TV, which has been under constant attack throughout the current Abe administration which is linked to the Japanese extreme right, maybe had to read the anti-Korea atmosphere now in Japan. In the backdrop of this Japanese extreme right-wing's continuous "anti-Korea protests", there is Japanese government's tacit support who had intentionally erased history of invasion throughout the past. Their recent Self-Defense Rearmament & Falsification in History Textbook clearly shows how they see their past history. There's no self-reflection sensed.

There are so many 9/11 terrorist monument in the United States but Muslims do not call it anti- Muslim. There is also Holocaust monument in European countries but Germans do not call it anti-Germans. In some Asian countries, including Korea, there are monuments to honour people who have been victimized by Japanese military crimes, but Japan calls them anti- Japanese. Even if Americans celebrate American Independence Day, British people do not call it anti-English. Even it Mexico celebrates Independence Day, the Spanish do not call it anti-Spain. When the Koreans celebrate thei independence, the Japanese call it anti- Japanese. Why?

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

The K-pop groups make money from the Japanese, then turn and stab the Japanese right in the back. It's below the belt but the Japanese allow that to happen to themselves. It's good to see the terrible things said by the the Koreans and the fans of this group. There you go, their true feelings.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

@김민주: in Europe, when we remember the end of WWII, we don't wear shirts with pictures of the bombing of Dresden. There's something really wrong with your celebrations, guys...

7 ( +8 / -1 )

If affirming the use of indiscriminate mass killing weapons,

Next nuclear weapons may be used on the Korean Peninsula.

It is not patriotic to celebrate that many people died in Hiroshima and Nagasaki when celebrating independence.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Didn't he wear that shirt years ago

1 ( +1 / -0 )

BTS should apologise to Japan and Nazi victims of the Holocaust says human rights organization The Simon Wiesenthal Center:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/nov/12/bts-should-apologise-to-japan-nazi-victims-says-rabbi-atomic-bomb

> "Wearing a T-shirt in Japan mocking the victims of the … A-bomb, is just the latest incident of this band mocking the past,” Rabbi Abraham Cooper, the associate dean of the Los Angeles-based centre, said in a statement.

Cooper referred to the release in early 2015 of teasers for a photo-book that showed a member of the band wearing a hat featuring the symbol of the Death’s Head Units – SS organisations that administered the Nazi concentration camps.

The statement also linked to images of band members posing at the Holocaust memorial in Berlin and to footage of them waving large flags on stage that were “eerily similar” to the Nazi swastika.

“It goes without saying that this group, which was invited to speak at the UN, owes the people of Japan and the victims of the Nazism an apology,” Cooper said.

“But that is not enough. It is clear that those designing and promoting this group’s career are too comfortable with denigrating the memory of the past. The result is that young generations in Korea and around the world are more likely to identify bigotry and intolerance as being ‘cool’ and help erase the lessons of history. The management of this group, not only the front performers, should publicly apologise."

>

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Celebrating when mass people die=inhuman. And I know people do it and feel justified out of hatred. But if you feel you really should do it, do it when nobody knows or else they'll think you're inhuman.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

bullfighterNov. 11 01:28 pm JSTIf the Korean guy knew anything about the history of his own country, he would know that both Hiroshima and Nagasaki had large Korean populations both voluntary and involuntary. The nuclear weapons incinerated not just Japanese, but a number of Koreans, and other foreign nationals as well.

You would have to be extremely dense not to know this because over the years Koreans from Nagasaki and Hiroshima have repeatedly brought legal actions in an attempt to get compensation from the Japanese government for the effects of nuclear radiation.

His shirt was in effect saying "it's OK to kill Koreans as long as you kill Japanese at the same time."

Atomic bombs kill everybody that's there. A-bombs do not discriminate. Koreans, US personnel, everybody - they ALL suffered when the Bomb dropped. The pilot who dropped the one on Hiroshima thought, 'My God!'. Radiation sickness affected everyone there. The Rev. Billy Graham had a Korean singer at one of his 'missions' who got blinded by an A-bomb blast. US personnel and Pacific islanders got sick from A-bomb testing during and after WWII.

ReturningGraceToday 12:55 am JSTCelebrating when mass people die=inhuman. And I know people do it and feel justified out of hatred. But if you feel you really should do it, do it when nobody knows or else they'll think you're inhuman.

It's totally insensitive and uncouth to celebrate nuclear bomb blasts no matter who/why/what/where/how the circumstances are.

'A nuclear war is unwinnable and must never be fought' - US President Ronald Reagan @ the 1984 State Of the Union address

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Hello @utorsa

As for the quagmire of moral questions that will, forever, be associated with the decision to bomb Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

... There is no quagmire. Nuking hundreds of thousands of women and children is morally repugnant.

Nuking people is repugnant!!! Killing people, by any means, is repugnant. So, are wartime deaths by nuclear attack worse than wartime deaths by any other kind of attack?

We know how many people had actually died by the time that the war ended. We even have good estimates about how many people went on to die of war related wounds and starvation as well as from radiation and other sickness but ...

we will never know what the death counts would have been if the war had raged on. We don't know how long it would have been before an armistice could be reached, and we don't know how many would have died; civilians and soldiers from all sides.

In short, we will never know whether they made the right or the wrong decision when they dropped the bombs. Make no mistake, I am thinking about aggregate deaths; Japanese and Allied. Would there have been more, or less, suffering?

The generals you are quoting were (personally, or, as a group) responsible for guessing and deciding what to do ... and some of them may not have been sociopaths. So, at the end of the day, they had to live with the horrible realization and guilt associated with what they actually did ... stacked against an unknowable, un-quantifiable, "might-have-been" where, maybe, fewer people died because of their decision making.

At any rate, it's easy for us to think we can judge (even with hindsight) but, I think that, the word quagmire is apt. It could not have been an easy decision; before or, especially, after the fact.

Look at how much condemnation and hatred this kid is getting for just wearing the t-shirt.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

By the way. Have you looked in other papers and online?

Is the amount of condemnation and hatred being leveled at this kid in any way comensurate with what he's actually done? Even if you think he was just dead wrong instead of careless or naive ... every major, international, and minor, local, news outlet has reported on this and people are clearly out for blood.

Journalists are playing a game of telephone with the facts. Headlines are inaccurate and inflammatory and the comments are incredibly ruthless and astonishingly angry. And this is all for the clothing choices of somebody that we don't know; somebody who may not even be making his own clothing choices.

I find this whole thing to be upsetting from many different perspectives so I went on line to look at some videos of BTS and the member who wore this shirt and, you know, if they're the bad guys, I think the world will be ok. After watching ten minutes or so, I'm much more frightened of the many, many people who are generating so much hate about them all over the internet.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@Elaine,

we will never know what the death counts would have been if the war had raged on. 

Speculation is irrelevant as Russian invasion ended the war. Nuking Hiroshima and Nagasaki was simply a cynical live human experiment on hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians. 

https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-japan-stalin-did/

we will never know whether they made the right or the wrong decision when they dropped the bombs.

I find your opinion unconvincing. I place greater value on the six of the seven US WWII five star officers concluded that the nuking of hundreds of thousands of civilians was totally unnecessary.

As Brig. General Carter Clarke stated:

"... .we Brought them [the Japanese] down to an abject surrender through the accelerated sinking of their merchant marine and hunger alone, and when we did not need to do it, and we knew we didn't need to do it, and they knew that we knew we didn't need to do it, we used them as an experiment for two atomic bombs. "

The generals you are quoting were (personally, or, as a group) responsible for guessing and deciding what to do ... 

Incorrect. The decision to use nuclear weapons on civilians was made by Truman and his Interim Committee.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

"Were will BTS be in two years when all the hype dies?"

Same place they are now, or more popular, since not only is the "hype" not dying, but the popularity of Korean music in particular is growing exponentially. You guys were all angry and upset YEARS ago when it was shown that rental rates of music and movies from Korea outstripped domestic products by far, and many vowed never to listen/Watch it again. Yet here we are, in an age where you can ask ANY teenager in Japan what their favorite band is and almost every single one will give a Korean boy/girlband name. I haven't heard a single kid say a Japanese band or artist as their favorite in more than a year (actors, yes, though). Not one. This may make you angry, but it's pure fact.

Most of these boy/girl bands will be here today/gone tomorrow, just like it is in the USA. A new crop of crap will pop up. Last year I saw a punk show that featured 5 bands - Methmatics + Little Orphan Anarchy both from the USA, 57 (pronounced 'oh chill') from South Korea, Svetlanas from Russia and Barb Wire Dolls from Greece. 57 stunned and awed everyone in the club - the guitar + drums duo were BOTH fierce and amazing with their melodic noisy high energy rock'n'roll. Pundits label them as 'K pop', 'K rock', 'K punk', whatever with the 'K' denoting 'Korean' but it really means 'Kick Ass'! Bands like 57 - that's where the talent from Korea truly is at! Critics need to look at bands like 57 more.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@utorsa

Speculation is irrelevant as Russian invasion ended the war. Nuking Hiroshima and Nagasaki was simply a cynical live human experiment on hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians.

By all means, take the last word but, I think we are, probably, done here. You are not convinced by my presented thoughts, I'm not convinced by yours and this isn't the most appropriate place for the discussion.

The argument you are using is also speculation; a good theory that cannot be proven unless you can probe the decision-making minds of Hirohito and his henchmen. Many things happened in fairly rapid succession after a long war that had begun to go sideways fairly quickly. Capitulation could have (and did) end the war. Capture was the only other possible end and that was still somewhere off in the future. Russia invaded Manchuria. They did not actually capture the seat of power in Japan proper. To actually win the war, without surrender, the Russians and other Allies would both have needed to invade Japan as they had done in Germany and that would/could ? have cost a great many lives.

As for the generals. You can't have your cake and eat it too. They could speculate, and only speculate, on the true reasoning behind the bombings if they were not, actually, involved in the decision. If they had no influence or responsibility, were not in the meeting and didn't receive the minutes (so to speak), they were in no real position to speak authoritatively about what the balance of motivational factors was.

To say that the bombings were a cynical live human experiment is an absolutely, extraordinary statement that requires extraordinary proof. Without such proof, it is just another historical conspiracy theory.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

extanker

 I was always ashamed to see people wearing those stupid shirts here in the US that said 'Made in America, Tested in Japan' with a image of the mushroom cloud in the background. I'm glad those shirts have pretty much disappeared.

It's something to commemorate, not celebrate.

I'm glad those shirts have largely disappeared. Nuke bombs have been tested in US deserts and Pacific islands + atolls. Many people, incl. Americans have become sick and/or dead from exposure and fallout. The Nazis were working on the Bomb and they would've used it fershure! South Africa built it during their apartheid era. Iraq was working towards one but never got there. India + Pakistan both have it. The USA and USSR leaders had the sense to not wage an atomic war - they buried the hatchet in the late 80s.

People have forgotten this. Dumpyboy wants to undo all that Reagan and Gorbachev did in the 80s. The mushroom cloud is a symbol of doomsday, the suicide of mankind by mankind. It is not something to be taken lightly and wearing it on a T-shirt like that is offensive - or at the very least ignorant, childish and stupid.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Apparently, BTS's management company has taken responsibility, apologized for any hurt and offense caused and committed themselves to not making such mistakes in future. I trust that Japan Today will report this accurately and thoroughly, and encourage other news outlets to do the same. I'm sure that there will be just as many articles reporting this as there were articles condemning the group of twenty-something singers.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

The worst part is the boy who wore the shirt doesn't think it's wrong to wear the shirt. And the blind fanatics (like some here) of course see nothing wrong with it. Then the company apologized out of obligation (implying ignorance of anything wrong) because some organization outside of Japan said something. And of course they think they're innocent victims being targeted just because.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

The worst part is the boy who wore the shirt doesn't think it's wrong to wear the shirt. And the blind fanatics (like some here) of course see nothing wrong with it. Then the company apologized out of obligation (implying ignorance of anything wrong) because some organization outside of Japan said something. And of course they think they're innocent victims being targeted just because.

You don't know what he, or they, think! Presuming, of course, that you aren't telepathic. And you don't know what the emotional and psychological fall-out might be for all of the hate that's been directed at him.

I'd never heard of BTS before this article appeared in my news feed last Friday but I feel really bad for this kid and all young people who live in this day and age of rapid internet defamation. At that age, there are very few people who have a skin that's thick enough to survive, let alone learn, through that kind of heated, public condemnation.

Were you a twenty-three year old, high school graduate, who could say "no I won't do it" to the bosses who were making or breaking your one career opportunity? Did you have perfect knowledge of historical and political issues at that age?

There are so many anonymous but keenly judgemental people commenting and roundly condemning everything that other people do; people they don't even know ... when they don't even have full knowledge of what's happening. What a world. No wonder so many kids suffer from mental illness. It's frightening.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

@Elaine,

To actually win the war, without surrender, the Russians and other Allies would both have needed to invade Japan as they had done in Germany and that would/could ? have cost a great many lives.

False dichotomy. No invasion was needed. Russian invasion of Manchuria had already forced Japan to surrender. 

Additionally, General Douglas MacArthur saw no justification for the dropping of the bomb. The war might have ended weeks earlier, he said, if the United States had agreed, as it later did anyway, to the retention of the institution of the emperor.

As for the generals......They could speculate, and only speculate, on the true reasoning behind the bombings

Factually incorrect. Brigadier General Carter Clarke was the military intelligence officer in charge of preparing intercepted Japanese cables - the MAGIC summaries - for Harry Truman and his advisors. 

The argument you are using is also speculation

Incorrect. It remains a fact that hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians were targeted for slaughter with nuclear weapons. 

To say that the bombings were a cynical live human experiment is an absolutely, extraordinary statement that requires extraordinary proof. Without such proof, it is just another historical conspiracy theory.

I find your opinion unconvincing. I place greater value on the six of the seven US WWII five star officers concluded that the nuking of civilians was an unnecessary atrocity. As Brig. General Carter Clarke stated: "..we used them as an experiment for two atomic bombs."

In relation to this matter I direct your attention to the following link:

https://www.cbc.ca/archives/entry/a-canadian-in-hiroshima

Truman's Atomic Bomb Casualty Commission studied Hiroshima victims without providing ANY substantive medical care. Koreans and Japanese were treated like lab rats. As the ABCC wikipedia page states: "The ABCC did not actually treat the survivors they studied, they just studied them over periods of time."

Your opinion that nuking civilians is justified because it may have "saved lives" requires extraordinary proof. Otherwise, anyone can justify nuking civilians during a conflict by claiming it "saved lives".

Without such proof, your opinion is just another historical conspiracy theory.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

There are so many anonymous but keenly judgemental people commenting and roundly condemning everything that other people do; people they don't even know ... when they don't even have full knowledge of what's happening. What a world. No wonder so many kids suffer from mental illness. It's frightening.

If I see a dude wearing an offensive T-shirt, I'm blaming the dude wearing it. I'm not going to wonder if he dressed himself that morning or worry about hurting his feelings by calling him out on it. It's a little something called personal accountability and people need to stop avoiding it. That's why so many kids are suffering from mental illness. Nobody makes them take responsibility for their actions so when they are finally held accountable for something, they snap.

While I in no way believe that this dumb kid didn't know exactly what he was doing, hopefully he will pay closer attention to what his handlers hand him to wear in the future.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

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