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Heat waves can be deadly for older adults: An aging global population means millions at risk

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By Deborah Carr, Enrica De Cian, Giacomo Falchetta and Ian Sue Wing

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Many elders died in Japan, that's happened every year.

https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/13693478

https://japantoday.com/category/national/elderly-couple-found-dead-in-tokyo-home-heatstroke-suspected

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

When I get older and poorer and when the temps get insanely high and humid, I'm going to have my bathtub filled with cool water. Taking a dip in it three or four times a day would keep me feeling real nice like.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

When the weather is above 35ºC I will take a cold shower in the morning and again in the afternoon.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

A lot of things can be deadly for older adults. That's one of the realities of being old.

And besides, hot weather would only be worse for older people if the "climate crisis" screamers have their way -- they want us all to stop using (among other things) air conditioners.

If the "climate crisis" pushers got their way, then, older people wouldn't have the option of A/C and even more of them would suffer and die in the heat.

-9 ( +3 / -12 )

Environmentalists do not want older folks to stop using life-saving AC. Many just can't afford the energy bills and need help paying them.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

The government should pay 20% of the utility bills for retired people during the hot months. Then old folks can run their AC.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Millions at risk!

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

Many just can't afford the energy bills and need help paying them.

That's because the policies of climate alarmists and their fellow travellers are pushing up power costs.

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

Power costs have increased because of international fuel prices which are affected by world events like the Ukraine and Gaza wars.

Nothing to do with environmentalists.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

And besides, hot weather would only be worse for older people if the "climate crisis" screamers have their way -- they want us all to stop using (among other things) air conditioners.

Misrepresenting the scientific consensus as if it was unjustified is not an argument, even if you really want to keep acting without consideration of the consequences. Normal, regular people clearly understand that responsible use of the energy in no way means to run higher health risks, that is a false dichotomy.

So no, your claim is false and responsible action is perfectly possible without letting people die of heatstroke. dehydratation, etc.

That's because the policies of climate alarmists and their fellow travellers are pushing up power costs.]

Any reference for this? because the most important thing that are pushing up power costs are the companies that left modernization and maintenance of the infrastructure until it was no longer possible, specially in response to the expected natural disasters that come with climate change (including peaks of demand because of the heat). If modernization and switch to better sources of energy as the expert recommended the prices would be much lower by now.

1 ( +7 / -6 )

The government should pay 20% of the utility bills for retired people during the hot months. Then old folks can run their AC.

All of them?

A lot of the ‘golden generation’ enjoyed a lifetime of low taxes,high salaries and huge twice yearly bonuses not to mention a nice severance pay out and pension.

Seems unfair to make the current workforce ,who have never experienced the above, fork out for the pensioners a/c costs.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

wallaceToday  01:26 pm JST

Power costs have increased because of international fuel prices which are affected by world events like the Ukraine and Gaza wars.

Nothing to do with environmentalists.

C'mon Wallace, you're smarter than that. Wars affect prices, especially when it comes to oil, but policies have made energy costs insanely high. Australia used to have some of the cheapest power on earth, making mineral processing like aluminium and electrolytic zinc refining viable. Now, thanks to the net-zero insanity of forcing fossil fuel producers to subsidise unreliable and inefficient pipe dreams like on-grid solar and wind, prices have gone through the roof for industrial, commercial and residential customers. This puts enormous pressure on everyone. Those who can afford pay, but there's an opportunity cost to everything, so something else has to suffer. And if you can't pay, you get no juice.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

When I get older and poorer and when the temps get insanely high and humid, I'm going to have my bathtub filled with cool water. Taking a dip in it three or four times a day would keep me feeling real nice like.

Sounds like a good idea, thumbs up.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Any reference for this? because the most important thing that are pushing up power costs are the companies that left modernization and maintenance of the infrastructure until it was no longer possible, specially in response to the expected natural disasters that come with climate change (including peaks of demand because of the heat). If modernization and switch to better sources of energy as the expert recommended the prices would be much lower by now.

Do you have any argument that doesn't fall back onto consensus? It's in almost every post you put on this forum.

Use your own questionable powers of observation. The net-zero scam governments are pushing in the wake of the COPs is strangling power generation as fossil fuel companies are forced through heavy regulations and taxes/charges to subsidise inefficient and unreliable solar and wind projects. So they lack the funds to do sufficient intensive/preventive maintenance unless they keep upping the charges to end users. And there's only so much businesses can tolerate in rises to their overheads - power is a big one - before they shut up shop. And consumers, well they can shut off the lights and put on a blanket in winter or walk around half-naked in summer to save power, but people on a fixed income only have so much wiggle room if any. Maybe if you studied a bit of economics, this would be clearer to you.

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

Do you have any argument that doesn't fall back onto consensus? It's in almost every post you put on this forum.

When something is known beyond any reasonable doubt, it is clear and explains without problem anything then it can become a consensus. The problem is that you systematically reject these well proven things without giving any argument from your part nor evidence to refute it.

To say it more simply, the problem is not that things are proven and there is a clear consensus, the problem is that many of your personal beliefs can be proved mistaken so your only exit is to pretend everybody that is a recognized authority must be wrong just because you don't like what they can prove.

No part of your comment do anything to refute what you quote. Natural disaster drive up the costs of energy, means to reduce the costs have been available from decades, that power companies willingly choose to ignore the necessity of modernizing until it was too late is all their own responsibility.

I mean, either the best minds that study the topic are wrong or you are, when the experts easily produce the evidence to prove what they say and you bring nothing it becomes clear which side is right.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

"When I get older and poorer and when the temps get insanely high and humid, I'm going to have my bathtub filled with cool water. Taking a dip in it three or four times a day would keep me feeling real nice like."

Quite a chance you won't be able to get in the bath or even worse out of the bath.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

I always bang n the AC if I'm too hot, simple solution, problem solved.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

Japan imports all of the fossil fuels it needs. LNG, oil, and coal. The current cost of electricity is about ¥26/kWh for KANSAI electric. Last year the price was ¥27-30/kWh.

The price of propane gas (we don't have city gas) is about one-third more than last year.

Last year the government paid gas and electricity subsidies of 20% from February until September.

Japan's Liquefied Natural Gas Import Price is at a current level of 13.26, up from 13.19 last month and down from 14.37 one year ago. This is a change of 0.53% from last month and -7.73% from one year ago.

https://ycharts.com/indicators/japan_liquefied_natural_gas_import_price#:~:text=Japan%20Liquefied%20Natural%20Gas%20Import%20Price%20is%20at%20a%20current,7.73%25%20from%20one%20year%20ago.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

falseflagsteve

I always bang n the AC if I'm too hot, simple solution, problem solved.

The problem is only solved when you pay the bill but I think you are not one of the older folks living on a pension.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

First, temperatures are hotter than ever. The nine-year period from 2015 and 2023 had the highest average temperatures since global records began in 1880.

Would be helpful if they include the actual figures

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

wallace

Today 06:55 pm JST

falseflagsteve

> I always bang n the AC if I'm too hot, simple solution, problem solved.

> The problem is only solved when you pay the bill but I think you are not one of the older folks living on a pension

It's a bit inconvenient to carry an ac unit around

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Any extreme condition is more dangerous for old people than for young people. That is not limited to "heat waves", it is a basic observation about aging. The article tries to create a topic out of nothing.

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

Any extreme condition is more dangerous for old people than for young people. That is not limited to "heat waves", it is a basic observation about aging. The article tries to create a topic out of nothing.

Even the headline of the article is enough to refute your misrepresentation, the problem is that temperatures are going to be higher, as well as the fraction of the population at most risk, this means something already known is going to spiral out of control if nothing is done to act before it becomes more important.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Heat waves can be deadly for the old and very young. Taking enough water is critical.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Heat waves can be deadly for the old and very young. Taking enough water is critical.

Maybe staying out of the heat would help too.

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

"The new system was created as annual deaths from heat stroke have exceeded 1,000 in recent years in Japan. The nation's average temperature in the summer of 2023 was the highest since the Japan Meteorological Agency began recording comparable data in 1898."

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Maybe staying out of the heat would help too.

"Some 80% of the 86 people who died of heatstroke in Tokyo's 23 wards in July 2023 were found indoors either without air conditioning installed or turned on."

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Old people die from heat stroke even when they are using their AC.

Not if the temperature does not rise to the degree where they would get heatstroke in the first place.

Maybe if they are outside in the heat first, and then come inside to use the a/c--but again, you are making bizarre arguments to try and support your initial false premise.

Get out of the heat, or turn up the a/c/

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

Not if the temperature does not rise to the degree where they would get heatstroke in the first place.

The article is about how heat waves makes this situation much more common and dangerous than in the past, for several of the conditions described there is a serious risk of death before the person can react. This already happens frequently.

Do you have any evidence that the experts calling for attention about this very serious risk are wrong? because if not then they are simply much more likely to be correct and people should listen to them and take preventive measures to reduce the risk right now, not just expect for the temperature not to rise as predicted.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

I wonder how many of those who die from heat stroke are on high blood pressure meds or are restricting their salt intake.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Too many old folks cannot afford cooling in the summer and heating in the winter. The article isn't just about Japan but also many countries where an increase in temperatures is causing major problems. Poor people in India cannot sleep in their shanty houses with tin roofs because it is too hot.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

The increase in temperatures is drying up water sources.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

I wonder how many of those who die from heat stroke are on high blood pressure meds or are restricting their salt intake.

Since cardiac conditions such as hypertension mean the people are at a disadvantage at adapting to the increased heat, that is not surprising. The medical interventions are a consequence of the conditions that make the people be at increased risk. Is like being surprised that people under treatment for anemia die more from blood loss than people that are healthy.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

I wonder how many of those who die from heat stroke are on high blood pressure meds or are restricting their salt intake.

Since cardiac conditions such as hypertension mean the people are at a disadvantage at adapting to the increased heat, that is not surprising. The medical interventions are a consequence of the conditions that make the people be at increased risk. Is like being surprised that people under treatment for anemia die more from blood loss than people that are healthy.

Some experts have been saying for years that the treatments for high blood pressure were a major contributor to heat stroke deaths. The treatments (drugs, low salt diet...) can interfere with the body's ability to handle high temperatures.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Global warming has caused temperatures in South Asia to increase 5-8ºC above normal. Temperatures in Pakistan have reached 45-50ºC. 1,000 have been admitted to schools with heat stroke. Schools have closed early for the summer vacation.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

Some experts have been saying for years that the treatments for high blood pressure were a major contributor to heat stroke deaths.

Not as much as the direct effect of high blood pressure, and since the risks are much more easier to control that still means the patients are much better by being controlled than risking having high blood pressure under a heat wave. Your fallacy is pretending that patients under pharmacological treatment should be compared with perfectly healthy people, in reality they have to be compared with untreated patients, but since that makes it terribly obvious that being treated is better you go for the invalid and misleading comparison instead. People that are medicated and have double the risk of heatstroke are still much better than being unmedicated and having 5 times the risk.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

zibala

Get out of the heat, or turn up the a/c/

I am not young, and I disagree. What is wrong with simply using a fan instead of cooling your room and then risking catching cold?

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Skin cancer rates have increased.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Skin cancer rates have increased.

Totally irrelevant to this article.

Not as much as the direct effect of high blood pressure, and since the risks are much more easier to control that still means the patients are much better by being controlled than risking having high blood pressure under a heat wave.

This is a mischaracterization of the poster's remark, and is contrary to the medical experts' advice.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

zibala

Skin cancer rates have increased.

Totally irrelevant to this article.

Heat waves are caused by global warming and the increase in temperatures. With the increase in temperatures, and stronger sun comes an increase in skin cancer.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

"Climate change is hypothesised to increase skin cancer through multiple factors and mechanisms. These include rising ambient temperatures and the potential for increasing tumorigenesis due to air pollution. Furthermore, the rising ambient temperatures may alter human behaviours to increase UV exposure."

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S003335062300481X#:~:text=Climate%20change%20is%20hypothesised%20to,behaviours%20to%20increase%20UV%20exposure.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

wallace

Skin cancer rates have increased.

Did you read even the headline? Here again df:

Heat waves can be deadly for older adults: An aging global population means millions at risk

So in your mind, older adults are suddenly seeing an increase in skin cancer because of recent heatwaves?

"Climate change is hypothesised to increase skin cancer through multiple factors and mechanisms. These include rising ambient temperatures and the potential for increasing tumorigenesis due to air pollution. Furthermore, the rising ambient temperatures may alter human behaviours to increase UV exposure."

This says nothing about heat waves, or how recent heat waves affect older adults. Grasping at straws!

wallace

"Some 80% of the 86 people who died of heatstroke in Tokyo's 23 wards in July 2023 were found indoors either without air conditioning installed or turned on."

If they're indoors, they're cutting down on risk from air pollution, unicorn attacks, or whatever other nutty ideas you proposed.

ROFL!

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

This is a mischaracterization of the poster's remark, and is contrary to the medical experts' advice.

No mischaracterization at all, medication is used to reduce the risk for the patient which is what refutes the actual misleading claim, and it is not contrary to the medical expert's advice. that is just a personal claim you are making and trying to disguise as something said by doctors. There is no doctor that says a patient would be better with an uncontrolled hypertension.

The increase in temperature causes heat waves---ok........

Cause an increase on the frequency and intensity yes, as the scientific consensus clearly have concluded, this is even written in the article, what is the point of disagreeing without even making a single argument about it?

So, air temperatures on earth have the effect of making the temperature on the sun even hotter.

There is no way to interpret your quote this wrong, are you making nonsensical comments because you now understand you have been mistaken?

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Heat waves are caused by global warming and the increase in temperatures. With the increase in temperatures, and stronger sun comes an increase in skin cancer.

Yes, the hotter temps are more due to stronger solar activity, rather than the miniscule amount of CO2 produced by humans.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

the hotter temps are more due to stronger solar activity, rather than the miniscule amount of CO2 produced by humans.

Any links to scientific consensuses that agree with this or are you listening to the right wing podcasts?

1 ( +4 / -3 )

I'm not saying that one should ignore their high blood pressure. But many people who are restricting their salt intake don't need to do so. Also, people might want to consider alternative treatments or perhaps temporarily modify their treatment during heat waves.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Pakistan temperatures cross 52 C in a heatwave

https://japantoday.com/category/world/pakistan-temperatures-cross-52-c-in-heatwave#comment-4222459

0 ( +2 / -2 )

I'm not saying that one should ignore their high blood pressure. But many people who are restricting their salt intake don't need to do so.

Any scientific groups that agree with you on this, or is this more podcast doctoring?

0 ( +3 / -3 )

I'm not saying that one should ignore their high blood pressure. But many people who are restricting their salt intake don't need to do so.

Any scientific groups that agree with you on this, or is this more podcast doctoring?

I have questions about salt intake. It's always struck me as strange when general limits are suggested. I understand the issue is sodium intake. But do we not expel sodium when we sweat? And if so, should those who sweat more not intake more sodium? So do things such as local temperature and physical activities not affect how much we should consume? Or am I missing something more obvious? (Gentle answers, please.)

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Yes, the hotter temps are more due to stronger solar activity, rather than the miniscule amount of CO2 produced by humans.

That is completely false, at this point the argument has been so completely debunked it rings ridiculous even in science denialism circles.

I'm not saying that one should ignore their high blood pressure. But many people who are restricting their salt intake don't need to do so. 

Without any reference that proves so epidemiologically that is exactly what you are saying, hypertension has been conclusively correlated with abuse of sodium and to being specially vulnerable to heatstroke (as well as other things) so there is no value in saying people should not listen to their doctors and be instead at an increased risk, specially with the increase of temperatures expected.

Also, people might want to consider alternative treatments or perhaps temporarily modify their treatment during heat waves.

Which is something doctors are a much better qualified to do together with their patients, in cases much more strict control can be necessary because of the heat, which of course is the opposite to refuse to accept the medical consensus about the need for blood pressure control by medication or dietary advice.

But do we not expel sodium when we sweat? And if so, should those who sweat more not intake more sodium?

That depends on the level of activity, someone that is under treatment for hypertension for example should not be under the conditions of excercise and heat that would make it justified to add more sodium to the diet in the first place. For a common level of activity (specially for those under treatment) there is no need for adjustments.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

But do we not expel sodium when we sweat? And if so, should those who sweat more not intake more sodium?

Yes.

If your kidneys are functioning properly, there is no need to restrict salt (within reason), your body will eliminate the excess. For those with high blood pressure, not all need to restrict salt, it depends on what is causing the high blood pressure.

I believe salt has been overly vilified, and is being taken too far by many people who really don't need to.

BTW, other electrolytes (e.g. potassium, magnesium...) should also be considered, not just sodium.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

If your kidneys are functioning properly, there is no need to restrict salt (within reason), your body will eliminate the excess. 

The medical experts completely contradict this terribly misleading advice, part of the reasons for restricting the intake of sodium is to protect the function of the kidneys. Saying that you can take as much as you want as long as they function is like saying you don't have to take care of your levels of glucose as long as your pancreas is still producing insulin. Saying that patients should wait until having renal insufficiency to do something about the sodium intake is extremely irresponsible and puts in risk the health and lives of people by rejecting the medical consensus without any evidence to support that claim.

For those with high blood pressure, not all need to restrict salt, it depends on what is causing the high blood pressure.

Hypertension patients "need" to restrict sodium in the same way morbidity obese patients need physical activity, it makes control much more easy (and reduces the need to use pharmaceutical help) so any patient that is interested in controlling their health definitely benefit a lot from doing it. Even if they could alternatively let their blood pressure be much more difficult to control and deal with the multiple health problems that result from it.

I believe salt has been overly vilified, and is being taken too far by many people who really don't need to

The problem is that this is a personal belief that is completely contradicted by the medical consensus that have enormous quantities of data of good quality to prove the recommendation of controlling the intake of sodium. When the choice is between the best experts of the world and someone on the internet incapable of producing evidence to support a personal belief, then there is no real difficulty understanding who is much more likely to be correct.

BTW, other electrolytes (e.g. potassium, magnesium...) should also be considered, not just sodium.

Sodium is important because is a known factor that increases the difficulty of controlling blood pressure for most patients.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

I believe salt has been overly vilified, and is being taken too far by many people who really don't need to

The problem is that this is a personal belief that is completely contradicted by the medical consensus...

I doubt that's true. But if somehow the consensus opinion among medical institutions is that everyone should restrict salt, then I'm not surprised so many people die during heat waves...

When the choice is between the best experts of the world and someone on the internet incapable of producing evidence to support a personal belief, then there is no real difficulty understanding who is much more likely to be correct.

Normally someone on the internet would claim this after they themselves produce evidence...

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

I doubt that's true. But if somehow the consensus opinion among medical institutions is that everyone should restrict salt, then I'm not surprised so many people die during heat waves...

Why? Do they recommend limiting salt intake when you're low on electrolytes? Where are you seeing that? I've never seen this in any respectable medical information...

1 ( +4 / -3 )

In the summer when it is hot and I'm sweating all day, I sightly increase my salt intake.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

I doubt that's true.

Yet you are completely unable to support the claim you make with the opinion of any of the well respected institutions that deal with medical health in the whole world. It is difficult to be more clear on how the medical community in general disagrees completely with your personal belief and consider your recommendations dangerous and irresponsible.

But if somehow the consensus opinion among medical institutions is that everyone should restrict salt, ,

Only people that consume an excess of salt are the ones that need to restrict it, lots of people have perfectly normal and healthy diets without needing to take extra attention to the amount of sodium they consume.

then I'm not surprised so many people die during heat waves

Doctors either, with the huge difference that they can prove the reason using objective data and well supported explanations that do not depend on personal beliefs, for example letting blood pressure run wild because of an irrational opposition to sodium control is a perfectly well explained risk factor.

Normally someone on the internet would claim this after they themselves produce evidence

Yet you keep making claims without presenting any evidence, including exactly zero evidence any institution of medicine supports what you believe instead of explicitly calling that explanation wrong.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

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