health

Theories emerge for mysterious liver illnesses in children

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By MIKE STOBBE

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Possibly they are coming into contact with spike protein exuded from others

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34654691/

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.04.28.22274443v1.full

-4 ( +4 / -8 )

@Wobot: Idiot.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Covid behaved a lot like this - some people were bad with it, other family members were asymptomatic or didn't get it. It was often quite random.

Climate change was always going to move diseases (animal, plant and human) into new areas, finding new, more vulnerable hosts. We may all have to get used to increased mortality rates of the sort considered normal in warmer, developing countries. From experience, lengthy lockdowns are not an option going forward. But there may be something else going on and it should be checked.

Covid wasn't that far away from a flu virus, but the emergence of new variants so rapidly around the world, with many borders closed, defied logic. Monkeypox has been circulating off and on for years without any problems. It is difficult to get, vaccines exist, and it may have gone unnoticed without heightened levels of medical oversight. But suddenly it is popping up everywhere. Now this disease in children.

Someone may need to examine the possibility that persons unknown are deliberately spreading rare, novel or tweaked viruses around the world.

It could be a way of attempting to suppress human mobility and activity to mediate climate change. It could simply be a way to sell vaccines - enough people died in what amounted to an opioid sales push.

It's increasingly difficult to see it as a nation-state based act - conspiracy theories regarding China releasing Covid now seem daft given the mess China is now in. The problems are global. In case there is a malign agency doing this, some detective work is urgently required alongside the medical response.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

This may seem a little farfetched but no mention of the COVID vaccine status of the children is mentioned. COVID is an Adenovirus. If, for some children, a COVID vaccine or its adjuvant creates antibodies that weakly cross react with Adenovirus 41, even while providing a strong immune response against COVID, a condition called antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE) which can have seriously destructive effects on the Liver MIGHT result. ADE is not well understood and perhaps our Dr virusrex could look into this and weigh in with an opinion, and I say this collegially and in NO WAY disdainfully Mod.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

"Covid behaved a lot like this - some people were bad with it, other family members were asymptomatic or didn't get it. It was often quite random."

The fatalities associated with COVID-19 have not been quite 'random' and VERY often had another word on the Death Certificate: 'Co-morbidity'. And we have seen that many, if not most, of these 'co-morbidities' are associated with a 'Western lifestyle' which includes people saturated with an excess and great variety of prescription pharmaceuticals. This might partly explain, besides less lethal variants, that despite high numbers of infected, the much lower mortality rate we see in places like China and Bukhan rather than an inherent dishonesty in the reporters.

"Someone may need to examine the possibility that persons unknown are deliberately spreading rare, novel or tweaked viruses around the world."

Although my sympathies lie strongly with the idea that pharmaceutical companies or political actors could be responsible for emerging diseases given the ~2% clinical psychopaths our experts tell us are born among us every generation, it is really not unusual to see viral variants (see: H1N1, 'flu'), zoonoses, 'bacterial resistance' emerge in our dynamic living world as we have seen them throughout history however little they feature in popular historical accounts. And it was not that long ago that any family might have expected to sacrifice at least one child to such diseases.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

In the UK none of the children affected were vaccinated against covid.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

This may seem a little farfetched but no mention of the COVID vaccine status of the children is mentioned.

Yes, I would like to know their vaccination status, considering that the vaccine components have been shown to accumulate in some organs.

COVID is an Adenovirus. If, for some children, a COVID vaccine or its adjuvant creates antibodies that weakly cross react with Adenovirus 41, even while providing a strong immune response against COVID, a condition called antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE) which can have seriously destructive effects on the Liver MIGHT result.

I have come across papers over the past 2 years showing coinfection of SARSCoV2 (a coronavirus) with other viruses (e.g. adenovirus) being associated with severe outcomes.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

Yes, I would like to know their vaccination status

In a study of 13 such cases in Scotland, none had received the vaccine. Four had tested positive for Covid in weeks or months before hospital admission. Five tested positive for the adenovirus upon admission to hospital.

https://www.livescience.com/unexplained-hepatitis-uk-children

One thing that puzzles me is the focus on the adenovirus. If that was related, wouldn't you expect it to be detected in all cases? I'm no expert, so my thinking is likely over-simplistic. But I'd be interested to know how the adenovirus might be involved.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Possibly they are coming into contact with spike protein exuded from others

You linked a wrong source, people infected with SARS-CoV-2 exude much more spike protein than the indetectable amounts coming from vaccines, that is the whole point of viruses being infective.

Someone may need to examine the possibility that persons unknown are deliberately spreading rare, novel or tweaked viruses around the world.

That would be as necessary as examining the possibility of people secretly making puddles of water after every rain. This is how viruses survive and the appearance of novel diseases is the rule, not the exception, human expansion and climate change have been predicted to produce more and more zoonoses from decades ago.

This may seem a little farfetched but no mention of the COVID vaccine status of the children is mentioned.

Well, the vast majority are from an age where they can't be vaccinated, so that may be the reason, a little of attention lets anybody notice this since the first reports.

COVID is an Adenovirus

COVID is a coronavirus and completely different, beginning with being single stranded RNA viruses while Adenoviruses genomes are of double stranded DNA. ADE is always a possibility but obviously not because of the vaccine because it is not given to infants (ADE is also not common in infants either) so other reasons are much more likely, like directly an effect of infection.

Yes, I would like to know their vaccination status, considering that the vaccine components have been shown to accumulate in some organs.

Only on animal experiments conducted completely differently from human vaccination on massive doses, if you think those results can be extrapolated to humans it would also be valid to say that unvaccinated individuals died 100% of the time so that must be also true for humans.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

That would be as necessary as examining the possibility of people secretly making puddles of water after every rain.

Bizarre attempt at an analogy as rain is not spread through or by humans.

Well, the vast majority are from an age where they can't be vaccinated, so that may be the reason, a little of attention lets anybody notice this since the first reports.

Children 5 years of age are eligible to be vaccinated in most of the countries in which this liver damage is being found. In fact, the ages of those children range from one month to 16 years old.

ADE is always a possibility but obviously not because of the vaccine because it is not given to infants (ADE is also not common in infants either) so other reasons are much more likely, like directly an effect of infection.

If wouldn't matter whether or not the vaccine was given to infants because neither COVID-19 disease nor the new COVID-19 vaccines have shown evidence of causing ADE.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Ah, yeah, a late night neuronal wire-cross somehow blends Adenovirus 'vaccine' into Coronavirus albeit my original thought was not to the antigens themselves but to 'adjuvants' which have been linked to various physical side effects but also Big Pharma hostility side effects which have obscured the case. Both the 'alleged' increased incidence of autism secondary to the MMR vaccine injection and Gulf War Syndrome have circumstances that hint at adjuvant involvement but...? Anyway some good information and further detail has been offered although some empty assertions such as:

"If wouldn't matter whether or not the vaccine was given to infants because neither COVID-19 disease nor the new COVID-19 vaccines have shown evidence of causing ADE."

do not help by the rule "an absence of evidence is not evidence of absence". That's Big Pharma's favorite trick...

0 ( +1 / -1 )

William BjornsonToday  02:39 am JST

Ah, yeah, a late night neuronal wire-cross somehow blends Adenovirus 'vaccine' into Coronavirus 

Caught ya!

Gee, the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia must be having a neuronal wire-cross; and maybe they are following Big Pharma's favorite trick by putting out this propaganda!

Anyway some good information and further detail has been offered although some empty assertions such as:

Well, seems like not such an empty assertion; how does crow taste?

 Evidence of ADE has not emerged for COVID-19 vaccines even though concerns have been raised.

Today’s routinely recommended vaccines do not cause ADE. If they did, like those described above, they would be removed from use. Phase III clinical trials are designed to uncover frequent or severe side effects before a vaccine is approved for use.

https://www.chop.edu/centers-programs/vaccine-education-center/vaccine-safety/antibody-dependent-enhancement-and-vaccines

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Bizarre attempt at an analogy as rain is not spread through or by humans.

Analogies do not share every aspect with the situation they illustrate, the point is that both things happen naturally with high frequency.

Children 5 years of age are eligible to be vaccinated in most of the countries in which this liver damage is being found. In fact, the ages of those children range from one month to 16 years old.

And still the vast majority of the patients are not eligible for vaccination, exactly as I wrote. As other posters have also contributed vaccination is absent from the studied cases much more often than not.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

As proved the vast majority of the patients were not of an age that could be vaccinated, and that is confirmed with the lack of vaccination reported on them, that means it is not wrong, nothing in your own comment disproves this so to say this is wrong you need references that say most of the cases were in vaccinated people. At this point lack of vaccination would be more validly related to the liver illnesses.

And no, a partial comparison is a perfectly valid way to make an analogy, you have not refuted the explanation that make thinking about purposeful spreading of viruses unnecessary and illogical when compared with frequent natural occurrences.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

painkillerToday 03:04 am JST

"Phase III clinical trials are designed to uncover frequent or severe side effects before a vaccine is approved for use."

Many medications is use today went through Phase III clinical trials only to discover rarer side effects after entering the armamentarium. But, apparently, according to what has been said here, the victims have generally not been vaccinated so...

Regarding crow sushi, having begun my suggestion with "This may seem a little farfetched...", I will leave 'caught ya' to virusrex who pointed out the Adenovirus versus Corona mix up virus that you seemed to have missed...

2 ( +2 / -0 )

“If we start testing everybody for the adenovirus, they will find so many kids” that have it, said Dr Heli Bhatt, a pediatric gastroenterologist who treated two Minnesota children with the liver problems.

The age of the kids is not stated.

William BjornsonToday  10:43 am JST

Regarding crow sushi, having begun my suggestion with "This may seem a little farfetched...", I will leave 'caught ya' to virusrex who pointed out the Adenovirus versus Corona mix up virus that you seemed to have missed...

So it turns out my comment did not consist of some empty assertions after all.

As proved the vast majority of the patients were not of an age that could be vaccinated, and that is confirmed with the lack of vaccination reported on them,

Noooo, according to the statistical data it means they were of an age that could be vaccinated but were not vaccinated; very simple concept. There are many elderly people who could be vaccinated but are not.

At this point lack of vaccination would be more validly related to the liver illnesses.

This is not a medical opinion of course. Because to think that not being vaccinated leads to liver illnesses is just...well, oh geesh.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

The age of the kids is not stated.

this is not the only report about the problem, in many others (including some in the comments) the children are in most of the case too young to be vaccinated.

Noooo, according to the statistical data it means they were of an age that could be vaccinated but were not vaccinated; very simple concept. 

That is false, most of them are too young to be included in the age for them to be vaccinated

This is not a medical opinion of course. Because to think that not being vaccinated leads to liver illnesses is just...well, oh geesh.

How would you know? you have no basis to qualify any opinion as medical or not without knowing the occupation of who says it. Do you have any evidence of that?

Also, lack of vaccination against hepatitis viruses do lead to liver illness, that is the whole concept of vaccinating against them.

In the case of COVID the cases are more related to not being vaccinated, that means if anybody has to force a conclusion about it it would be easier to justify the relationship with not being vaccinated, that should be easy to understand.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

this is not the only report about the problem, in many others (including some in the comments) the children are in most of the case too young to be vaccinated.

A report of which the source you do not provide. So all we have is your opinion.

That is false, most of them are too young to be included in the age for them to be vaccinated

Wrong. There is no statistical data proving that.

How would you know? you have no basis to qualify any opinion as medical or not without knowing the occupation of who says it. Do you have any evidence of that?

Yes, because you are not a medical professional.

Also, lack of vaccination against hepatitis viruses do lead to liver illness, that is the whole concept of vaccinating against them.

This is grossly inaccurate. Millions of people are not vaccinated against hepatitis yet they do not all end up with liver illness.

In the case of COVID the cases are more related to not being vaccinated, that means if anybody has to force a conclusion about it it would be easier to justify the relationship with not being vaccinated, that should be easy to understand.

The forced conclusion is the wrong conclusion, which is unsubstantiated, with no verifiable source.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Sources that clearly list the ages of most of the victims are readily available, it takes no special preparation to be able to find them. What it may be a tad more difficult is to understand that not being vaccinated against infections that hurt the liver is correlated with more liver problems for the unvaccinated, it does not take everybody to get the disease to prove this is the case. A forced conclusion is the contents of the original comment, which is the whole point of the criticism.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Those sources show the victims are mainly age-eligible for vaccination.

What is the point on making up things that are easily disproved? it only make it clear you have no argument.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7118e1.htm

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1073704/acute-hepatitis-technical-briefing-2.pdf

COVID-19 vaccinations are not recommended by the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation for children aged under 5. They are available for children aged 5 and over. There were no COVID-19 vaccinations recorded in cases aged under 5, the age group which makes up over 75% of hepatitis cases

and so on

This is not what the statistics show.

What statistics? you have presented none.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

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