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U.S. women stocking up on abortion pills, especially when there is news about restrictions

27 Comments
By LAURA UNGAR

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27 Comments
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How sad that women in the ‘land of the free’ have to resort to stocking up on these drugs, when they should be available freely in 2024 without worrying about availability. What a basket case of a country.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

rainman1, let me rephrase that:

How sad that women in the ‘land of the free’ have to be responsible when engaging in sex, when they should be able to get pregnant and freely shirk their responsibility in 2024 by aborting the child without thinking about the life they ended. What a basket case of a country. . .

Now if only there were societal pressure on men to be responsible when engaging in sex and take care of the children they fathered, oh wait! The best equality is when it is one-sided. But perhaps women lack the personal agency men do.

-6 ( +4 / -10 )

So - in other words you are pro-life. Whatever buddy. There are a host of reasons why this should be freely available and more importantly administered under the instructions of a Doctor .

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Some communities could benefit greatly from this.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

rainman1 Today 04:10 pm JST

So - in other words you are pro-life.

Well the alternative is pro-death, so I think it is the most humane position. But above all what I am about is equitable standards. And since I have been taught that women are just as capable as men, then I would have expected that this capability extends to the area of personal agency and the responsible exercise thereof. Therefore, I would also expect women to be held to the same standards as men and engage in sexual activities in a responsible manner and, should conception take place, to take care of the children that result just as men are expected to. Do you not believe in the equality of the sexes?

-7 ( +3 / -10 )

jeffyToday 04:35 pm JST

Men don't have to carry an alien lifeform inside of them putting their health at risk for nine months. Have you see what happens to the internal organs in late pregnancy?

4 ( +7 / -3 )

TaiwanIsNotChina Today 05:05 pm JST

Men don't have to carry an alien lifeform inside of them putting their health at risk for nine months.

Is this an argument that women have more reason to be responsible when engaging in sexual activities because they may end up carrying a human child? Well I would hope so.

Have you see what happens to the internal organs in late pregnancy?

Have you ever seen a man's life completely destroyed because a woman spermjacked him to get pregnant thereby making him responsible for child support which the government enforces under the threat of incarceration?

The prevalence of sperm theft is difficult to measure. Research for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in 2011 found that approximately 10.4% (or an estimated 11.7 million) of men in the United States reported ever having an intimate partner who tried to get pregnant when they did not want to or tried to stop them from using birth control. In a survey of 5000 women for the British magazine That's Life, 42% stated that they would lie about using birth control in order to get pregnant, in spite of the wishes of their partner.

— https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sperm_theft

https://youtu.be/BeS_Y8q9kcY

Seems to me like everyone has incentive to be responsible when engaging in sexual activities.

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

And do broken condoms, contraceptive failure, rape and domestic violence count in your perfect world of responsibility?

I can't wait to read your answer.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

These abortion pills are unsafe…for the mother let alone the child. Women have more physical complications with these drugs and usually have to see a practitioner in many cases to have their dead child removed fully.

Those pushing these “medications” are not interested in informed consent of their clients due to failing to provide information on life-threatening side-effects.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

jeffyJan. 6 06:08 pm JST

Have you ever seen a man's life completely destroyed because a woman spermjacked him to get pregnant thereby making him responsible for child support which the government enforces under the threat of incarceration?

Is this really a concern for you? If so, I suggest working to change the laws on that particular scenario.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

JeremiahToday 01:49 am JST

These abortion pills are unsafe…for the mother let alone the child. Women have more physical complications with these drugs and usually have to see a practitioner in many cases to have their dead child removed fully.

Those pushing these “medications” are not interested in informed consent of their clients due to failing to provide information on life-threatening side-effects.

As unsafe as the actual pregnancy itself and all of the complications that entails? A few women taking it outside of the recommended usage period is not a reason to ban the drug needed by others. And its not a child until it stops being a parasite.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The woman is the only one who must decide over her own body.

Not a fanatical conservative medieval dinosaur from Washington...

And seriously, is this the "land of the free"????...

Looks more like the "home of the scared"..

1 ( +2 / -1 )

TaiwanIsNotChina Today 02:58 am JST

Is this really a concern for you? If so, I suggest working to change the laws on that particular scenario.

Of course it is a concern for me since I am about equitable standards. And if you had actually read the URL I posted along with the citation, you would have read the statement “Sperm theft (namely a woman becoming pregnant against a man's will or without his consent) is not illegal anywhere” and read a long list of legal cases in which courts around the world have consistently sided with women on the issue, one of which, in Australia, was a case where the magistrate frankly admitted, “I can't let you win in this case because it would set a precedent that would change Federal law.” The point to take away is that men are legally disadvantaged the world over when it comes to their choice to not have children. Men must always take responsibility, but women may or may not.

The same may be said with genital integrity as well were many countries have properly enacted legislation against female genital mutilation while not a single country has enacted a law against male genital mutilation. Women have issues yes, but so do men. To acknowledge them equally and work on them both together is what real equality is. It is simply disingenuous to solely concentrate one women’s issues and completely ignore men’s issues and give lip service to equality. Such is not real equality and the disingenuousness proves that equality is not really the goal. The proof is in the pudding as they say.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

jeffyToday 04:08 am JST

Being upset about circumcision is no reason to ban abortion. They are completely separate issues. And yes, women will have greater "outs" because they are stuck with the parasite for nine months and the health impacts they cause.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

jeffyToday 04:08 am JST

Also trying to ban abortion makes no sense if you are concerned about child support as you aren't even letting women provide their man an out if there is a screw up.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

These abortion pills are unsafe…

Data proves they are safe. Read and learn.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5774715/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9223776/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/abortion-pills-are-very-safe-and-effective-yet-government-rules-still-hinder-access/

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The same may be said with genital integrity as well were many countries have properly enacted legislation against female genital mutilation while not a single country has enacted a law against male genital mutilation. 

Probably because where female circumcision does permanent damage to the woman and causes lifelong pain, male circumcision produces absolutely no ill effects for the man and in fact helps reduce the incidence of STDs, as there is no foreskin to trap the germs that cause STDs. I have some direct knowledge of this.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

@Jeremiah. Every termination carries a risk, drug induced abortion causes far less trauma to a woman physically than a surgical termination. Fact. The drugs are proven and safe. Fact.

If access to hormonal contraception was equal around the world then there would be less need for abortions full stop.

Many states in the USA make it difficult and sex education is very poor. You can't have it both ways.

People are going to have sex (for fun and for love) whether this who live by the Bible like it or not.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

TaiwanIsNotChina Today 04:41 am JST

Being upset about circumcision is no reason to ban abortion. They are completely separate issues.

Of course they are separate issues. Yet at the same time both issues evidence inequitability. But you understood my point even with your attempt to obfuscate it.

And yes, women will have greater "outs" because they are stuck with the parasite for nine months and the health impacts they cause.

So you concede my point that there is inequitability on the issue, even if you only concern yourself with detriments to women and ignore the detriments to men. Thank you. To be fair this is the expected position. Society as a whole does not care about issues that affect men all while maintaining the pretense that equality is important.

TaiwanIsNotChina Today 05:10 am JST

Also trying to ban abortion makes no sense if you are concerned about child support as you aren't even letting women provide their man an out if there is a screw up.

If you read carefully I have not said “Abortion should be banned.” What I have said is that abortion entails 1. a lack of taking responsibility and 2. inequitability. Nobody thus far has addressed either of these points, but instead have only attempted to assail my character.

My concern is not about paying child support. But you already understood this. My concern is about the two points made above. Your phraseology evidences these points: “you aren't even letting women provide their man an out.” Why does a man need a woman to let him off the hook? Why can’t he just let himself off the hook? Does she need him to let her off the hook? Can she just let herself off the hook? If you answer those four questions honestly you will see inequitability of the situation.

I gave you the example of women intentionally stealing sperm to get pregnant which forces the man to be responsible for the child for years while destroying his own life. Please watch the video https://youtu.be/BeS_Y8q9kcY and see how it is socially normalized for women to do this. Yes, men’s issues are a concern to nobody as I said. The societal message is clear: only women are to be valued.

Desert Tortoise Today 05:21 am JST

Probably because where female circumcision does permanent damage to the woman and causes lifelong pain, male circumcision produces absolutely no ill effects for the man and in fact helps reduce the incidence of STDs, as there is no foreskin to trap the germs that cause STDs. I have some direct knowledge of this.

In regards to the claim “absolutely no ill effects for the man,” I note the paper “Circumcision of Infants and Children: Short-Term Trauma and Long-Term Psychosexual Harm” from Advances in Sexual Medicine by Gregory J. Boyle ( https://www.scirp.org/html/3-1990071_55727.htm ). The ill effects are known, it is just that they are ignored because it is men that are effected and the archaic religious practice has not gone out of favor.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

I'm sorry @jeffy. Too much emphasis is placed in abortion solely being down to being irresponsible, this is simply not true in many, many cases. If your views are such then so be it, but I think you're understanding of why the VAST majority of sex takes place is very misguided.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

rainman1 Today 12:09 pm JST

Too much emphasis is placed in abortion solely being down to being irresponsible, this is simply not true in many, many cases.

From the Guttmacher Institute:

Forty-six percent of women had not used a contraceptive method in the month they conceived, mainly because of perceived low risk of pregnancy and concerns about contraception.

Contraceptive Use Among U.S. Women Having Abortions in 2000-2001 ( https://www.guttmacher.org/journals/psrh/2002/11/contraceptive-use-among-us-women-having-abortions-2000-2001 )

So almost half (46.3%) of those getting abortions were not users of contraception. This evidences an incredible amount of irresponsibility when engaging in sex. What about the 53.7% of contraceptive users?

Table 1 indicates that 27.6% of all those getting abortions used condoms as a contraceptive. Table 6 shows that of this group, 49.3% were inconsistent users who did not always avail themselves to using a condom. Thus these individuals, representing 13.6% of those getting abortions, also acted irresponsibility when engaging in sex.

Table 1 indicates that 13.6% of all those getting abortions had relied on the pill as a contraceptive. Table 6 shows that of this group, 75.9% were inconsistent users who did not regularly use the pill. Thus these individuals as well, representing 10.3% of those getting abortions, also acted irresponsibly when engaging in sex.

So without going all the way through the remaining figures which would add still more, from these alone one can see that 70.2% of the abortions are directly attributable to irresponsibility. So while there are indeed other reasons for unintended pregnancies, the main one is clearly irresponsibility. And in the face of this irresponsibility, the proposed solution is to actually incentivize abortions by making them more freely available rather than raising men and women to act in a responsible manner when engaging in sex. No I’m sorry, that is a basket case of a country.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

And in the USA, sex education is so poor, added to that contraceptive education, especially when it comes to hormonal contraceptive education, where would you like to start? Many American woman still continue to use period tracking apps without realising that they no longer ovulate. All your tables/data is of no interest to your average person on the street. When the basket case of the country that is the USA educates properly then things might change.

Social media in the USA is so full of bad information about hormonal contraception that the only way to counter that is for EVERY state to fund education properly. Unfortunately in the Bible Belt any funding gets blocked.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

jeffyToday 11:05 am JST

Why does a man need a woman to let him off the hook?

Why can’t he just let himself off the hook?

Basic biology. You need a uterus to get pregnant.

Does she need him to let her off the hook?

I suppose there could be things she needs from him but probably not involving whether they will be having children by accident.

Can she just let herself off the hook?

Not as long as you keep implying abortion is immoral and presumably should be banned. I'd like to hear how you have "taken responsibility" by raising a child.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

rainman1Today 04:55 pm JST

And in the USA, sex education is so poor, added to that contraceptive education, especially when it comes to hormonal contraceptive education, where would you like to start? Many American woman still continue to use period tracking apps without realising that they no longer ovulate. All your tables/data is of no interest to your average person on the street. When the basket case of the country that is the USA educates properly then things might change.

Social media in the USA is so full of bad information about hormonal contraception that the only way to counter that is for EVERY state to fund education properly. Unfortunately in the Bible Belt any funding gets blocked.

I suppose you come from a country that has this all figured out but it certainly isn't Japan where the birth control pill was approved way late and has very little usage.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

TaiwanIsNotChinaToday 05:56 pm JST

Basic biology. You need a uterus to get pregnant.

Once again you attempt to obfuscate things. “Why does a man need a woman to let him off the hook?” I asked. This is because your statement was “you aren't even letting women provide their man an out.” Thus the point is not about who gestates or carries the child. The point is about taking on responsibilities when a child is born. And with that in mind let me walk you though the questions again to see with whom the equitable position lay:

Why does a man need a woman to let him off the hook?

Can she just let herself off the hook?

Your answer would be yes and the reason is simple to you. It is her body and therefore her choice whether to have a child and become responsible for it. But her choice need not necessitate that the man must also be compelled to pay child support for the decision she made on her own as you assume. She could still have the child with the man legally able to opt out his responsibilities and go on with his life. So your view engenders an inequality against a man’s right to choose to take responsibility or not.

Does she need him to let her off the hook?

Why can’t he just let himself off the hook?

Your answer would be no and again the reason is simple to you. It is her body and therefore her choice not to have a child and therefore not to take on the responsibility. Yet this position conflicts with the previous one which maintains that a man must necessarily take on the responsibility should the woman decide to have a child. So here too your view engenders an inequality against a man’s right to choose.

Thus your position is inherently inequitable in its formulation. Only women have the right to choose in your view, men do not. But I think you already understand this.

On the other hand, the pro-life position, which requires both parents to take responsibility for the child is the most equitable one. Yes, it may cause undesired problems for the woman and the man, but such things should have been thought about beforehand. It is called being an adult.

Apart from this the only other truly equitable solution to the problem will come with the creation of artificial wombs. On that day all the misogynists will break away from society to the cheers of all the misandrists. And the misandrists too will break away from society with all the donated deposits from the sperm banks disgusted by those women who have any interest in men. And the people who actually care about family will continue to have children naturally as they have always done since before recorded history and create a truly sociable world. Fin.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Well - 'Fin' it might be from @jeffy. Scary. Sounds like something out of some dystopian novel. Crackers.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

rainman1 Today 12:55 pm JST

Scary. Sounds like something out of some dystopian novel. Crackers.

Let us employ the “logic” of your position in another situation.

Let us suppose that there is a man who is HIV positive and he desires to engage in sex with some woman. Now let us also suppose that he is not a person so far mentally gone as to keep the fact that he is HIV positive from her and he clearly informs her of the fact that he is HIV positive. However, the woman, now so informed, still agrees to have sex with him on the condition that he use a condom so that she does not contract HIV from him. And yet, even while having protected sex, the woman ends up contracting HIV from the man due to a failure of the condom.

In your world the woman would be completely justified to receive legal damages from the man for a situation that she went into with full knowledge and agreed to. That is scary stuff. In your world although she knew the risks, she should be excused for her poor decision making. That is scary stuff. Yet this is exactly analogous to the situation in the vast majority of abortion cases (70.2% minimum).

So unless you assume women are stupid or lack any personal agency, you should agree that women should be accountable for their actions just as men are. But you, like so many others, do not accept the fact that women are the equals of men and should be held accountable for the decisions they make. And then from such a stance, you, again, like so many, would actually lecture men that they need to “man up” in the case of having fathered an unplanned child all while never thinking women need to “woman up” to their responsibilities. In summary, your position assumes matriarchal supremacy on this issue and is far removed from equality. From those who hold such a position I never want to hear complaints about equality or rants about “the patriarchy” because I can clearly see that such people are simply being disingenuous.

So while the view I advocate for may appear strict, i.e., responsible, it is in no way crazy as you suggest. The child who does not want to do their homework also thinks that when an adult expects them to do their homework before play, that adult is being unreasonable and strict. I understand. But it is in fact you and others with the same view who actually hold the irrational position with your assumption that women are to be deemed less accountable for their actions than men. I, for my part, accept the equality of men and women, while you and many others clearly disagree.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

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