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Genderless high school uniforms spread in Japan to meet needs of LGBT students

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Kinda unfair if boys aren't allowed to wear skirts.

-8 ( +14 / -22 )

Genderless high school uniforms spread in Japan to meet needs of LGBT students

To meet the 0.02%

10 ( +20 / -10 )

How about just getting rid of school uniforms altogether?

-1 ( +17 / -18 )

Burning Bush Today 08:37 am JST

Kinda unfair if boys aren't allowed to wear skirts.

It looks like they can:

The most common step has been to allow trousers for female students but schools are also dropping designations of uniforms as male or female and even allowing students born as males to wear skirts.

I hope all the students feel free to wear the uniform of their choice. There's no need for clothing to be gendered.

It's about time to let go of gender roles, stereotypes, and expectations and let everyone just be who they are.

1 ( +16 / -15 )

I am old fashioned and i like girls to dress as girls, boys as boys. And i don’t see the point in a “uni” “form” if there are several combinations of clothing possible as it will no longer be uniform.

-3 ( +13 / -16 )

Is this a joke?

Guys should wear male uniforms. Girls should wear girl uniforms.

Those who wish to identify otherwise should be able to wear as they wish.

But making ALL uniforms neutral is unfair to ALL.

-1 ( +13 / -14 )

schools are also dropping designations of uniforms as male or female 

Men's trousers and women's trousers are both trousers but they are different shapes. The same goes for blazers. When indicating these different body shapes, the words "mens" and "womens" are handy and still in widespread use all across the fashion industry. No-one is protesting outside Uniqlo for selling men's and women's fleeces, coats, and pants.

It's perfectly fine for girls, non-binaries and the rest to wear trousers. But for them to fit, quite a few girls are going to have to have something that is a different shape. The fashion industry calls clothes of this shape "womens". A different "designation" is possible perhaps, but you are still going to end up with some binary type distinction.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

Does this mean they will all be wearing sailor suits?

8 ( +12 / -4 )

Pupils should be able to chose whatever they wish. Standard uniform, genderless, no uniform etc.

4 ( +13 / -9 )

I am old fashioned and i like girls to dress as girls, boys as boys. And i don’t see the point in a “uni” “form” if there are several combinations of clothing possible as it will no longer be uniform

I completely agree.

-10 ( +8 / -18 )

Remove the dresses and let the girls wear pants/trousers.

2 ( +12 / -10 )

Remove the dresses and let the girls wear pants/trousers

Absolutely not, some girls don’t feel comfortable wearing pants and they should wear a skirt if they feel like a lady, if there are some that like pants, that’s fine as well.

1 ( +11 / -10 )

Absolutely not, some girls don’t feel comfortable wearing pants and they should wear a skirt if they feel like a lady, if there are some that like pants, that’s fine as well.

Firstly school girls are not "ladies" and school boys "laddies". Being female has nothing to do with wearing skirts or pants/trousers. That is just your own male opinion.

So your own girls don't get to wear pants/trousers?

A young female wearing pants/trousers is less of a lady?

A young male wearing a dress is less of a laddie?

4 ( +11 / -7 )

Firstly school girls are not "ladies"

I disagree.

and school boys "laddies". Being female has nothing to do with wearing skirts or pants/trousers. That is just your own male opinion.

What? But yes, that’s my opinion.

So your own girls don't get to wear pants/trousers?

A young female wearing pants/trousers is less of a lady?

No and the second part of your question, I never said or even insinuated that.

A young male wearing a dress is less of a laddie?

A guy/boy wearing a skirt is not a lady

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

*“A young male wearing a dress is less of a laddie?”*

A guy/boy wearing a skirt is not a lady

Whoosh!!!

4 ( +6 / -2 )

A guy/boy wearing a skirt is not a lady

But still a laddie.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Does this mean they will all be wearing sailor suits?

Works pretty well in the Navy.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

But still a laddie

If the boy wears them and identifies sexually as a woman, his choice, no problem, but gender-wise she is still a “he” and that will never change.

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

“But still a laddie

If the boy wears them and identifies sexually as a woman, his choice, no problem, but gender-wise she is still a “he” and that will never change.

Rolling on the floor, laughing my arms off!!!

4 ( +6 / -2 )

It is practical to see the sex of a person through clothes. Then I don't care much of what is dressed.

But I don't want to find out a girl is standing beside me whe' pissing...

You don't identify as what you wish, but as you are.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

It would be interesting to know how many students identifying as trans have taken up this option. The comments quoted in the article are exclusively from students attracted by the practicality of the new uniforms, rather than any statement they might make about the wearer's gender identity.

I can't see how there'd be much of a problem with girls wearing slacks. It's generally accepted in wider society. But boys wearing skirts? Much less accepted, and school can be a hard enough place as it is to be different.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

I think the girls look very cute in their skirts. They are neatly dressed, but the guys are always disheveled.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

So a girl wearing a skirt becomes a lady but a laddie wearing one is never a lady? So transgenders wearing a skirt can not be a lady?

2 ( +4 / -2 )

really hot topic of day.

most important one.

economy is sinking.gov spending over for unecessary shopping and wasting tax hard.

people are loosing savings,haveing hard times to survivev,businesses as well.

and here is "most importnat topic od these times"....give me a break folks...

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

If the boy wears them and identifies sexually as a woman, his choice, no problem, but gender-wise she is still a “he” and that will never change.

That's aggressively rejecting a person's gender identity.

But this is predictably going on another tangent.

To avoid any more confusion, may I suggest you check the etymology of the word "laddie"?

Clue: laddies in Scotland (and Ireland) can wear a type of skirt. And they aren't the only countries/cultures that do so. It doesn't make them any less or more of a laddie. But if they identify as a lady and wear a skirt, that's all good craic as well.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Wear what you like but no Crocs.

Interesting that those who are constantly giving us platitudes about freedom are weighing in here.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

economy is sinking.gov spending over for unecessary shopping and wasting tax hard.

people are loosing savings,haveing hard times to survivev,businesses as well.

and here is "most importnat topic od these times".

This is the final stage of decadence that often precedes a civilization's collapse. When people are starving in the streets, or being killed in a war, they will forget all about these indulgent little "concerns."

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

When one states they are transgender, they are acknowledging what sex they truly are though they may feel differently, i.e. born male but feels female.And with this acknowledgement of knowing that one was born innately male or female comes the explicit self-evident truth that these students know whether they should be wearing a male or a female uniform.

just because someone claims to be gender confused does not mean that we ALL must be gender confused. Pretending a boy is a girl is anti-science and helps no one.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

That's aggressively rejecting a person's gender identity.

No, it’s not and no one is saying they can’t what they want to be, but you still can’t change what you anatomically are and what you were born as.

So a girl wearing a skirt becomes a lady but a laddie wearing one is never a lady? So transgenders wearing a skirt can not be a lady?

If they want, but they can’t change their sex and even if they did, they are still genetically what they were born as or what their gender DNA was assigned to be.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

"Sex" and "Gender" are not the same.

A laddie feels more like a lady while a lady feels more like a laddie.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

A laddie feels more like a lady while a lady feels more like a laddie

Again, No one is disputing the right for someone to feel what they want to feel, people can identify with whatever they wish, it doesn’t change your DNA make up. 3,000 from now scientists won’t be able to analyze a persons skeletal remains and says this person was a Transgender, they will be identified as a male or a female.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Pretending a boy is a girl is anti-science and helps no one.

Actually, ignoring the entire field of psychology is what's anti-science, and refusing to accept the fact of gender dysphoria and its treatment absolutely harms people.

Let me break it down for you all:

Gender dysphoria is real.

Transitioning helps people with gender dysphoria.

Gender identity should be respected.

If you refuse to respect gender identity, you are active causing harm to people with gender dysphoria, and there really is no excuse for behaving in such a hateful, harmful way towards other human beings.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Actually, ignoring the entire field of psychology is what's anti-science

Except that many scientists do not consider psychology to be a science at all:

"The great scholar of the field, Paul Meehl, captured this perfectly when he proclaimed that the sad fact that in psychology:

theories rise and decline, come and go, more as a function of baffled boredom than anything else; and the enterprise shows a disturbing absence of that cumulative character that is so impressive in disciplines like astronomy, molecular biology and genetics.

Another great scholar of the field, Kenneth Gergen, likened acquiring psychological knowledge to building castles in the sand; the information gained from our methods might be impressive, but it is temporary, contextual, and socially dependent, and will be washed away when new cultural tides come in. Even mainstream icons, like Daniel Gilbert, readily acknowledge the cumulative knowledge problem. In this clip, he comments that one of psychology's big problems is that new paradigms simply “throw the babies out with the bathwater” and he wonders whether psychology as we know it will even be around in 10 or 15 years." 

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

If the boy wears them and identifies sexually as a woman, his choice, no problem, but gender-wise she is still a “he” and that will never change.

You are wrong and I will prove it.

Firstly, no one chooses their gender.

In prenatal development, we all start out as female. For boys, first a set of genes needs to activate and turn off the female development system (Müllerian). Then a second set of genes, needs to activate and turn on the male developmental system (Wolffian). Anywhere in the process something could not play out "correctly."

Second, you need to understand that everything in nature is on a 3D spectrum (like a cloud). Some males are fem, some are alpha, and there's everything in between.

Now third and most important, one's gender is a function of the size and shape of the sexual dimorphous nuclei in the hypothalamus. And the size and shape of thus nuclei is a function of exposure to androgens during prenatal development. So even if you have XX genes (which could be due to a failure of the Mullerian system shutting down), you could have a high androgen exposure during prenatal neurodevelopment, and in fact have a male brain. We are our brains, period. All other parts are replaceable.

So as I said, no one chooses your gender, it's how we are born.

This information is presented this textbook used in postgraduate neurophysiology courses:

https://www.pearson.com/us/higher-education/product/Carlson-Physiology-of-Behavior-11th-Edition/9780205239399.html

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Rolf AndersonToday  06:02 pm JST

When one states they are transgender, they are acknowledging what sex they truly are though they may feel differently, i.e. born male but feels female.And with this acknowledgement of knowing that one was born innately male or female comes the explicit self-evident truth that these students know whether they should be wearing a male or a female uniform.

just because someone claims to be gender confused does not mean t

You're wrong as well, see my above post.

Understanding gender is essential in maintaining a just society. Your type of thinking is what leads to discrimination, suffering and suicides.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Bassfunk wrote: If they want, but they can’t change their sex and even if they did, they are still genetically what they were born as or what their gender DNA was assigned to be.

Wrong. Again.

Gender/sex is not determined by genes. See above post.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

ommanteerToday 06:54 pm JST

Except that many scientists do not consider psychology to be a science at all:

This statement is the epitome of science denial.

You handpicked one quote that supports your personal view. I'm not sure why you think that is sufficient to disprove an entire field of inquiry.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

PC gone crazy !

we sacrifice the majority, to satisfy the minority

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Actually, ignoring the entire field of psychology is what's anti-science, and refusing to accept the fact of gender dysphoria and its treatment absolutely harms people.

I disagree. You cannot change your DNA code.

Let me break it down for you all:

Gender dysphoria is real. 

Transitioning helps people with gender dysphoria.

Gender identity should be respected.

Yes, but if you’re born with mill chromosomes and you have male sexual genitalia and you have a complete male body structure internally and muscularly, then you are a man

If you refuse to respect gender identity,

I don’t, please stop deflecting from the actual point.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Gender/sex is not determined by genes. See above post.

I did and I disagree and as I have said before I have a daughter and as a young lady and as most young girls, they would never feel comfortable with a transgender that is in the same change room room with them that has male genitalia. They’re not going to except that the majority of women, no should they.

Your type of thinking is what leads to discrimination, suffering and suicides.

No, just keeping it honest and real, liberals want to inject an emotional component to it. I never called them out, slandered or believe they should be discriminated, but I won’t be lectured into gender politics by people telling me what you are when you aren’t really what you would like them to be anatomically. I never call for discrimination and I never called for them to be shunned or ostracized, please do not speak for me we’re all humans, but I still stand by my original point.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

*You are wrong and I will prove it.*

Firstly, no one chooses their gender.

In prenatal development, we all start out as female. For boys, first a set of genes needs to activate and turn off the female development system (Müllerian). Then a second set of genes, needs to activate and turn on the male developmental system (Wolffian). Anywhere in the process something could not play out "correctly."

I took the same class, I know, but if I feel like a woman right now and I insist on it and take hormonal injections and implants, I am still not a woman, I can feel like one but underneath all of that I am still every much and every bit a man.

Second, you need to understand that everything in nature is on a 3D spectrum (like a cloud). Some males are fem, some are alpha, and there's everything in between.

That is complete and utter nonsense, you do not see transgender mosquitoes, you do not see transgender lions, you do not see transgender koalas, you’re not making any points here.

Now third and most important, one's gender is a function of the size and shape of the sexual dimorphous nuclei in the hypothalamus. And the size and shape of thus nuclei is a function of exposure to androgens during prenatal development. So even if you have XX genes (which could be due to a failure of the Mullerian system shutting down), you could have a high androgen exposure during prenatal neurodevelopment, and in fact have a male brain. We are our brains, period. All other parts are replaceable. 

Ok, I understand, But if you’re a woman or a transgender and you feel like a man, you’re not a man and you do not have the muscle build, or the male appendage, Or even the lung capacity call that your genetic code and make up or still that of a female, regardless of what you believe in what you feel.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

You guys kill me!......I'm so confused now (^O^)//

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

bass4funk

so according to what you believe there are no transgenders or GAYS, non binaries. Everyone is the sex they are born with, male or female. So how about those born male and female? Or even people born without a sex?

How many LGBTQ students are in your daughters' schools?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

so according to what you believe

Not what I believe, what is scientifically proven.

there are no transgenders or GAYS, non binaries.

Not one time did I say or imply that.

Everyone is the sex they are born with, male or female.

Yes.

So how about those born male and female?

hermaphrodites they have both organs, that really seldom happens, but it does happen but I’m not talking about that, I am talking about 99% of people that are born in that are either born man or woman, I was never referring to about what your sexual orientation is, that is something totally different.

How many LGBTQ students are in your daughters' schools?

Not one Transgender.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

PC gone crazy !

we sacrifice the majority, to satisfy the minority

I agree. Change a whole system for 0.02%.

I feel this article is about offering a choice of uniform that could be suitable for any gender, rather than made specially for LGBT students

2 ( +3 / -1 )

These are not gender neutral uniforms, they are traditionally male uniforms which they are now allowing females to wear. This does not make them gender neutral. Truly gender neutral uniforms would allow students of either sex the choice of dresses or trousers.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

@longtimenosee,

.....one's gender is a function of the size and shape of the sexual dimorphous nuclei in the hypothalamus. And the size and shape of thus nuclei is a function of exposure to androgens during prenatal development. So even if you have XX genes (which could be due to a failure of the Mullerian system shutting down), you could have a high androgen exposure during prenatal neurodevelopment, and in fact have a male brain. We are our brains, period. All other parts are replaceable.

So as I said, no one chooses your gender, it's how we are born.

This information is presented this textbook used in postgraduate neurophysiology courses:

https://www.pearson.com/us/higher-education/product/Carlson-Physiology-of-Behavior-11th-Edition/9780205239399.html

Excellent post. Thank you for the informative link.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@girl_in_tokyo,

If you refuse to respect gender identity, you are active causing harm to people with gender dysphoria, and there really is no excuse for behaving in such a hateful, harmful way towards other human beings.

Agreed. Unfortunately, your wisdom seems to be lost on some of the retrograde bigots who contribute to these comment sections.

I guess they see themselves as "frontline soldiers" for Donald Trump's asinine culture wars.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

I guess they see themselves as "frontline soldiers" for Donald Trump's asinine culture wars

Absolutely absurd, this has nothing to do with Donald Trump, it has everything to do with actual and irrefutable Scientifical facts.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Oh well it is what it is! To each its own as long as they enjoy the world they are in with out disrupting the other world they are outside of

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Scientifically proven? Then you can at the same time also replace all standard school textbooks with their individually favorite manga books.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Speed

Genderless high school uniforms spread in Japan to meet needs of LGBT students

So what are these "genderless" uniforms going to look like, or is this just more content=less virtue signalling?

Sure, they could put everybody under some sort of shapess burkha, but if they use normal clothes like trousers and jackets, surely they have to make adjustments for the different body shapes of XX and XY students?

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

asdfgtr

I guess they see themselves as "frontline soldiers" for Donald Trump's asinine culture wars.

LOL, I know it. Somebody just had to bring in Trump in an article about .... school uniforms in Japan. The media-created syndrome is deep indeed.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Sure, they could put everybody under some sort of shapess burkha, but if they use normal clothes like trousers and jackets, surely they have to make adjustments for the different body shapes of XX and XY students?

Good point.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

This statement is the epitome of science denial.

You handpicked one quote that supports your personal view. 

Now you are saying that scientists are denying science? There are several such quotes from many respected scientists, if you care to look. So far as my own personal view, I am on the fence. For various reasons, psychology falls short of delivering the real-world results of, say, physics. For that reason alone, some skepticism of ideas supported only by the latest psychological research is warranted.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Absolutely absurd, this has nothing to do with Donald Trump

To some people, everything has to do with Donald Trump. It's a bizarrely narrow and cult-like view of the world - and rather dangerous when it comes to international affairs.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

This is the final stage of decadence that often precedes a civilization's collapse. 

Comedy gold.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

commanteerToday 09:37 am JST

Now you are saying that scientists are denying science?

Scientists don't cherry pick a quote from a single source and then use it to declare that their personal opinion is correct. That is what you just did.

There is no uniform agreement that psychology is not a science, i.e., that the research done in the field doesn't follow the scientific process. The argument is over the labeling of so-called "soft" and "hard" sciences. This is not to say that "psychology is not a science" and that therefore all psychological research is moot and any person with an opinion can then declare themselves an expert in psychology.

Psychology is a legitimate filed of inquiry, with it's own rigorous processes of validation. AKA, a real science.

The APA, which is one of the most respected organizations of professionals in the field, is made up of hundreds of individual researchers and professional associations, are in agreement that gender dysphoria is real, and that one of the best treatments is transition.

I see this in terms of a choice people make. People can chose to be kind and empathetic to people with gender dysphoria and support them in their treatment, or they can be hateful, malicious, and bigoted towards them. Which course you chose says exactly what kind of person you are.

APA promotes research in psychology, the improvement of research methods, and the application of research findings. One of APA's four directorates, the APA's Science Directorate's mission is to communicate, facilitate, promote and represent psychological science and scientists.

This is science. You quote-mining to support your bigoted opinion is not.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

I THINK CAUTION WITH SEX OPEN COMMUNITY IS BETTER !

°

Genderless everywhere is eradicating women gender. They are forced to wear skirt or pink ? No. This is male clothe code and just male clothing codes.

So, in France, I recommend to avoid getting ride of all gender code. This is desorientating for adolescent who end up not understanding their sexual path and end up manipulated by friends wanted to have sex friends experimentation. Lack of gender end up is a big social mess for kid who are not matured enough to bare this is adult sex matter. We have a polygamie come back, drug and surprise rape increase.

My daughter was harassed on her feminine clothing by gay girls. And she is still reparing her natural look. It was very agressive in the end and very political to go after underage girls. Let's be honest, violent sex male are in the core of the lobby and they are women haters.

I am not a skirt mom, but i created a female gender style for her. So let's be careful because the lobby is violent, popular but really don't care about female rights. They got their limits and we have rape problem in France and surprise rape problem, and grey mariage for kid by the male.

There is a really distressing sec social matter for normal sexual women & girls who are targeted a lot when they are naive or nice. In the end, females want protective law or seek legal advisor and found a political ban for their case. They are social bash, social harassed, social targeted, the kid are given to the gay spouse and they end up in asylum because a corrupt system was organised to protect the lobby angelic commercial.

Dark web is behind all this a lot. This is in the beginning the dark sex web and this is the dark sex in politic who was phoenixed.

So just think. This is was just about "not killing them, not putting them in asylum, not discriminating them" and we ended up to the come back of women sex slaving and a set back on the law protecting us. Now there are dictating school uniform change to feet ? When our sensitivity is taken care ? Old pervert men love the set back. We actually did confirm one origine for sex slavering in history : gay men in religion organisation.

°

NadAge

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Everyone should just wear kaftans and be done with it ffs.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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