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Are China's 'internal affairs' going more global?

17 Comments
By TED ANTHONY

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HK was under British rule for 100 years, why did they not fight for an independent state during this time?

Because they didn't.

Why should that disqualify them from doing it now? That's just silly. Sounds like the logic of someone trying to jusify a dictatorship.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Well done fella! You're up to page 92. Keep with it, even though it's a painful read. So to answer this question that you asked earlier

HK was under British rule for 100 years, why did they not fight for an independent state during this time? Why did the West not show much concern for HK independence during those years?

We can look at this passage (P190)

"In 1967, the local Chinese had to choose between supporting Communist China and the colonial government, which had provided stability, good order and the general conditions for them to live and work without facing persecution or overt oppression. In the process, they reflected on their sense of identity. It was not an easy decision but they overwhelmingly chose to uphold their own way of life. It was as a result of being forced to choose that for ‘the first time in Hong Kong’s recent history, the inhabitants believed that the British-Hong Kong government was “their” government’, however wanting it might be in other ways. This change in attitude was critical to the forging of an ‘imagined community’ of Hong Kong in the long process entailed in the emergence of a local identity."

And the reason for this might have been;

"The Maoists failed to win general public support for two reasons. To begin with, the violence and chaos of the Cultural Revolution made their appeal to create a similar state of instability and savageness in their alleged struggle against the British colonial oppressor at best hollow and at worse highly repulsive. Their indiscriminate bombing campaign and disruption of economic life were made even more repugnant by the discovery of corpses with their hands tied behind their backs floating into the Hong Kong waters from the Pearl River. This hammered home the senseless brutality of the Maoist regime, from which over half of the local population had chosen to avoid or escape less than two decades earlier"

Not much has changed. HKers still recognise and distrust the savagery of the Chinese govt. 50 years later.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

ClippetyClop: It appears you are not aware of the HK riots while HK was under British rule, apparently you are not aware of the number of non-European citizens killed by the British army  during the riots, apparently you are not aware that the Chinese under British rule in HK did not have the same status as their British rulers. As I said, history is the past and cannot be changed to meet our narrative.

Yes, HK was leased under duress, with Britain (and other European powers) holding cannons to China's head (have you heard of the GUN BOATS?). Forced leasing is no more than annexation by another name. This is history and cannot be changed.

Here are details from the book to which you refer with recommended page numbers.

 Modern History of Hong Kong

Steven Tsang

A 'Colonial Society' 62; Segregation 65

Labour Unrest 87

The Rise of Chinese Nationalism 90;

The Canton-Hong Kong Strike and Boycott 92

Worth reading!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The Chinese were forced to lease HK to Britain under duress, China had no option.

If it was leased, it wasn't annexed was it? Although it was under duress, I'll grant you that.

By the way, when does Tibet's lease expire? China gonna give it back?

Incorrect

You are again incorrect. Britain encouraged the people to feel more patriotic towards HK to dissuade Chinese nationalism Whilst under UK rule there was never a major movement by the Chinese residents of HK to overthrow British rule. Instead, they prospered. China has barely been there for 20 years and is making a huge, embarrasing mess out of it.

As for the rest of your post, it's clear you have only a basic grasp of the history of the colony. I recommend Steven Tsang's book on the history of HK. Availaible in all bookstores not run by the CCP.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

ClippetyClop: "It wasn't annexed, it was ceded by treaty."

Incorrect; HK was essentially annexed after the Opium Wars. The Chinese were forced to lease HK to Britain under duress, China had no option. This is history and the past cant be changed or ignored.

" Britain encouraged HKers to feel more like HKers and less like Chinese."

Incorrect; Britain regarded the citizens of HK as "coolies" and second class citizens, without the right, of British citizens in HK and this was the cause of numerous riots by the Chinese living in HK and resulted in many deaths as the British used it army to quell the rioters. This is history and the past cannot be changed or ignored however untasteful.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

When will HK realise that they ARE and were  part of China before British annexation?

It wasn't annexed, it was ceded by treaty. Unlike Tibet, which was annexed. When will China give it back?

HK was under British rule for 100 years, why did they not fight for an independent state during this time?

Annoying eh? Britain encouraged HKers to feel more like HKers and less like Chinese. It was their parting gift learned from running an empire for a a couple of centuries. China is still a bit new to this imperialism thing, bless em.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

I’m shocked at how little regard people have for self-determination, particularly when the people are rebelling against a regime with an appalling record on human rights, the right to vote, the right of freedom of conscience and speech and a track record of killing its own people by the millions.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

When will HK realise that they ARE and were  part of China before British annexation?

And again, when will China recognize that HK has no interest in being a part of China.

Forcing them to do so is a violation of their right to freedom.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

"When will China accept that HK has no interest in being part of China?"

When will HK realise that they ARE and were  part of China before British annexation? Why did not HK riot when the British/Chinese hand back agreement was being negotiated?  HK was under British rule for 100 years, why did they not fight for an independent state during this time? Why did the West not show much concern for HK independence during those years?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

When will the West accept that HK is part of China?

When will China accept that HK has no interest in being part of China?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

When will the West accept that HK is part of China?

Perhaps when the people of HK are allowed to freely express their opinion on the matter, for example by means of elections or a referendum.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

When will the West accept that HK is part of China?

It is accepted. However, just because you are head of the household and think it's OK to rule with an iron fist doesn't mean the people inside have no rights and that no on should stick up for those people.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Yes.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

"Are China's 'internal affairs' going more global?"

The headline could equally be: Are Spain's internal affaires going more global or are India's  internal affaires going more global. Criticising Spain over Catalonia, or India over Kashmir or Indonesia over Papua will have as much response as criticising China over HK, absolutely none. Commentators can criticise till the cows come home but China will not relinquish HK, which was annexed from China by the British some 200 years ago.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

"When its leader, Donald Trump, holds a press conference."

This has as much to do with Trump as the separatist movement in Catalonia, Kashmir or Papua. This has nothing to do with the US and it should not get involved. So, the US is getting out of Syria and you want them to get into China?

When will the West accept that HK is part of China?

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Totalitarian state lacking fairness, nuance and empathy seeks perpetual rule through violence, oppression and fear.

Details at eleven.

When its leader, Donald Trump, holds a press conference.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

News flash:

Totalitarian state lacking fairness, nuance and empathy seeks perpetual rule through violence, oppression and fear.

Details at eleven.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

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