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COVID-19 wrecked 2020. Will 2021 be different?

25 Comments
By Brigitte CASTELNAU

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I doubt it. It will take a long time to distribute the vaccine so we are not out of the woods yet. There are also certain things I would like to remain and not go back to normal such as working from home and home schooling options improved. Less commuting more working and studying from home when possible and if desirable.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

Many of the underlying causes for the pandemic are still there, From uncooperative countries that hide information to the popularity of science denialism; together with the reduced attention towards the diseases that were already here before, it means that there is still danger for another disease to make things worse, be it one that was only getting under control (like TB or malaria) or a new one making a Jump from animals to humans as the COVID-19 did.

6 ( +10 / -4 )

Many of the underlying causes for the pandemic are still there, From uncooperative countries that hide information to the popularity of science denialism; together with the reduced attention towards the diseases that were already here before, it means that there is still danger for another disease to make things worse, be it one that was only getting under control (like TB or malaria) or a new one making a Jump from animals to humans as the COVID-19 did.

Excellent point! I truly hope that we start to do things a little differently. For me, I'd just like to see more done with technology to assist with working and studying from home. We've had a lot of death and suffering from this disease. It would be nice to have something positive come out of it as well. I truly hope we just don't go back to business as usual.

1 ( +7 / -6 )

Time for a reset on how we all work and live and the rewards we receive for our work and efforts. We can do better making a better society for all.

Covid-19 will remain with us for quite some time.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

No To Mandatory Vaccines - Save Our Children

It was to save the children - from measles, polio, smallpox, rubella, and a host of other life-threatening illnesses - that mandatory vaccination was introduced decades ago, and mainly succeeded. What a perversion of that ideal it is to see a placard like the one being held by the woman in the photo.

Will 2021 be different from 2020? Almost certainly. But like everyone else, personally I've got to be on guard against my optimism getting the better of my realism. I'm hoping for an improvement across the board in 2021, and a return to something very close to normalcy by 2022. Fingers crossed.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

@zichi

"Covid-19 will remain with us for quite some time."

Same as influenza yet we have never shut down the whole world because of it.

Complete hysteria coupled with greed and stupidity on part big pharma and politicians.

@virusrex

How much money do you get from the vaccine companies for your never ending

pandering of their "solution" to a "pandemic" that is on par with the seasonal influenza?

The death count has been officially exaggerated as per Dr. Birx, she said it herself in a news conference:

"We’ve taken a very liberal approach to mortality'.

“The intent is if someone dies with COVID-19, we are counting that as a COVID-19 death,” concluded Birx.

https://www.theblaze.com/conservative-review/horowitz-dr-birx-admits-overcounting-covid-19-deaths-heart-attacks-mysteriously-plummet

Will you take the vaccine?

-6 ( +5 / -11 )

Bring on the vaccine. Get rid of the useless masks.

I got my influenza shot last week, as I have done many years before, and as I will many years hereafter. An additional vaccine for corona would be no big deal. Unless a person has an underlying health reason they can't be vaccinated, they should. Certainly better than having to wear a mask.

I want a return to normal because I want to be able to enjoy visiting my children who have moved away (that is, be able for myself to travel or my children to travel) and to go to restaurants, amusement parks, and other places without those despicable masks.

I will be first in line, last in line, whatever in line to get a vaccine. I will even sign up as a test subject. Anything to get rid of those stupid masks.

There are many places that require masks, even for those that have legitimate reasons for not being able to wear them. Why not have those places require vaccines? Certainly more effective than masks.

In case I haven't made it clear, I HATE MASKS!

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

The Covid-19 has become far worse, more cases and more deaths than with influenza.

Covid deaths three times higher than flu and pneumonia .

So how to stop the spreading?

Will I take the vaccine?

My doctor recommended I don't vaccinate at this time because my immune system is still weak from my cancer recovery. If Covid-19 is still a major problem next year, then I'll probably have the vaccination. During the initial cancer recovery I had some idea what Covid-19 must be like. Physically weak. 88% blood oxygen. Difficult breathing. All scary stuff.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

If these people don't want to accept vaccines, fine - but they should be refused medical care if they fall ill with the coronavirus later and cannot produce a vaccination certificate.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

Same as influenza yet we have never shut down the whole world because of it.

Complete hysteria coupled with greed and stupidity on part big pharma and politicians.

Just compare what is the situation with influenza this year, that will let you understand the huge difference between both diseases, and no, big pharma and politicians are not the ones begging people to do their part, doctors and nurses are the ones that most strongly do it. It does not fit in empty conspiracy theories but that is because they are not true.

How much money do you get from the vaccine companies for your never ending

pandering of their "solution" to a "pandemic" that is on par with the seasonal influenza?

It is sad that people that are only interested in money think that everybody else is the same, in reality the most important interest for people to call attention for the pandemic is the public health, and again see for yourself what is happening with the flu this year, that comparison should be enough to prove you wrong.

Bring on the vaccine. Get rid of the useless masks.

You may hate masks but that does not make them useless, they have proved effect in curtailing the spreading the same as keeping your distance and washing your hands. unfortunately vaccines have proved to be able to protect people from the infection safely, but there is still not enough evidence to prove they help making the vaccinated people not infectious if they are exposed to the virus, so it is very likely masks will still remain necessary until that evidence is found.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

@zichi

Did you bother to read the part where I mentioned that the number of deaths are exaggerated?

It's there in plain black and white, right there from the horses mouth, so to speak, no conspiracy.

The actual numbers are much lower.

The US death rate, even with the inflated numbers is only 0.08%.

@virusrex

I guess you have missed the thousand and thousand of doctors are the world who are petitioning against the lockodowns and the unnecessary vaccinations. But then again it takes a bit of searching as the main stream media and all the social sites censure information to the contrary of the official narrative.

Even Pfizer's ex-vice president came out and said this is just a hype and over reaction.

How is that for a non-antivaxer source?

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

I guess you have missed the thousand and thousand of doctors are the world who are petitioning against the lockodowns and the unnecessary vaccinations.

Doctors that have no names and only you can see? yeah those are difficult to see. As always when confronted with the truth the easy way to escape is a hidden conspiracy that nobody can prove.

How about an official declaration from a professional association of health workers that say that vaccinations are unnecessary? it would not be possible that every single association in the world is against your uninformed opinion, right?

One single person expressing his opinion without any kind of scientific data to back him up is irrelevant. This is not religion, its science, where the only important thing is the scientific basis for a decision, not the name of the person who makes it. Unfortunately for conspiracy zealots this concept of having evidence first to be able to say something is quite alien.

Bring the studies that prove that all the different measures against the pandemic are not justified, or that vaccinations are not necessary. Someone can discuss the heaviest, most consuming measure not cost-effective but still consider the rest of them perfectly justified.

Its the same situation as a doctor criticizing unnecessary use of antibiotics for non-bacterial infections, that does not prove that "doctors do not believe in microbes"

5 ( +9 / -4 )

@virusrex

Here you go:

"An article was published in Lockdown Sceptics where the former Vice President Dr Michael Yeadon said, "There is absolutely no need for vaccines to extinguish the pandemic. I have never heard such nonsense talked about vaccines. You do not vaccinate people who aren't at a risk from a disease. You also don't set about planning to vaccinate millions of fit and healthy people with a vaccine that hasn't even been extensively tested on human subjects."

A study was done by Belgian doctors proving the complete ineffectiveness of wearing masks.

The study was not published by the major medical journals because it goes against the "official narrative".

Fauce said in an interview a few days ago that taking the vaccine will not prevent a person catching the virus, it will only lessen the severity of the illness, if at all.

What a joke this "vaccine" will be.

But as I said, go ahead and take it, then come back and tell us how you feel.

Especially since it is a never before tried mRNA vaccine with possible unforeseen effects on humans.

99% of your posts are about corona related threads, and you are telling us you are not connected to the vaccine industry? I find that highly unlikely.

-7 ( +3 / -10 )

If these people don't want to accept vaccines, fine - but they should be refused medical care if they fall ill with the coronavirus later and cannot produce a vaccination certificate.

So taxes are used to pay for the vaccines, and taxes will be used to pay those who suffer from the side effects of the vaccines, but those who refuse this rushed experimental vaccine should not receive medical care?

How about all those who already recovered from Covid19 and do not need the vaccine. Are you suggesting they should get the vaccine just to get the certificate?

Why would you support such totalitarian measures?

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Here you go:

So, an empty opinion not sustained by any data and without any discussion for the extensive proof of the role a safe and effective vaccine can have in controlling the disease? where are the other thousands and thousands of doctors that can supposedly prove this?

That is exactly what I told you you were going to have, not a scientific study, no epidemiological basis. It is easy to say people are not at risk of a disease that kills even young healthy people, what is difficult is to prove it. Vaccines on the other hand have to prove to decrease the risk for anybody to be be vaccinated (be it healthy people or old people with lots of preexisting conditions) that is the whole purpose of the clinical trials. So if you have trials in tens of thousands of people carefully assesses saying one thing, and one single person saying the contrary based in absolutely no data saying the contrary, it should be easy to see which one has much higher chances of being right.

A study was done by Belgian doctors proving the complete ineffectiveness of wearing masks.

The study was not published by the major medical journals because it goes against the "official narrative".

Yet another world wide conspiracy that has absolutely no proof of being real, how do you know the conclusions of the study if this was not published?

In today's world where anybody can publish a pre-print without any problem this excuse is no longer acceptable, there is no need for any journal to accept anything for the results to be put in the open, it is much more likely that the authors did not get the results they wanted and so they unethically choose not to disprove themselves with their findings.

Fauce said in an interview a few days ago that taking the vaccine will not prevent a person catching the virus, it will only lessen the severity of the illness, if at all.

Err, I do not know how to say this to you, but that is the same for every single vaccine developed in the history of humanity, it is practically impossible to stop viruses to infecting even a single cell, but it is terribly easy to stop this infection from escalating and producing disease, it is like saying that antibiotics do not eliminate bacterial infections but let the immune system do it (yes, that is how they work).

And no, mRNA has been used in literally hundreds of human trials for many years now, without any kind of report of important side effects, that is expected since the human body is chocked full of mRNA from the normal functioning of the cell. In comparison even the asymptomatic infection produces millions of times more mRNA for many proteins including some made specifically to mess up with the immune system. It is quite obvious that replacing that huge amount with a small quantity of short lived mRNA for a single protein would be the much safer option.

99% of your posts are about corona related threads, and you are telling us you are not connected to the vaccine industry? I find that highly unlikely.

People that can only do things for their own economic benefit are like that, unable to imagine that other people can even do things because they benefit from being in a society with high levels of public health, it becomes impossible to think that people may want to express opinions about something they are interested in. For these kind of people there is no value on doing something that they are not paid for. I feel really sorry for those kind of people.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

but those who refuse this rushed experimental vaccine should not receive medical care?

The vaccine cannot be called rushed, it follows a testing protocol followed by vaccines that are being used right now without any problem on efficacy nor safety.

How about all those who already recovered from Covid19 and do not need the vaccine. Are you suggesting they should get the vaccine just to get the certificate?

Once a correlation between antibody levels and protection can be demonstrated that can be a valid option, while those antibodies are detectable. For people without those antibodies it would be necessary to assess specific reactivity of memory cells against COVID-19 antigens (including isolating those cells, cultivate them, expose them to antigens and quantify how strongly and specifically they react against this stimulus). If anybody consider spending the few thousands dollars necessary to get this data instead of getting the vaccine this is also a valid option. They would already had the much more risky natural infection so the vaccine risks would add nothing but they can choose to prove the infection.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

The big wheel keeps on turning

On a simple line, day by day

The earth spins on its axis

One man struggles while another relaxes.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

99% of your posts are about corona related threads, and you are telling us you are not connected to the vaccine industry? I find that highly unlikely.

Yeah, and all vaccines are completely safe and effective, and new vaccines are perfectly fine even before trials are completed. Any long list of publications that consistently show something, well those are all bad studies. Didier Raoult, one the top experts of infectious diseases in the world, well he's bad too...

All statements from Big Pharma and professional associations are gospel and everything that goes against it is ... "bad/false/irrational"...

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Yeah, and all vaccines are completely safe and effective, and new vaccines are perfectly fine even before trials are completed. Any long list of publications that consistently show something, well those are all bad studies. Didier Raoult, one the top experts of infectious diseases in the world, well he's bad too...

Vaccines are safer and more effective than the natural infection, that is the whole point, using strawman arguments only evidence that you have no argument to defend against this fact.

It is not may fault that science advances by the knowledge of the best available evidence, so if you want to believe the opposite you are left with the worst evidence. It does not exist only for you, it is evident and part of the considerations of the experts, found lacking in comparison with the better studies and discarded, that is how science advances.

I am neither responsible for your choices of people to follow, if you actively look to believe only people that have been convicted of fraud, found repeatedly lying in order to manipulate people or being found doing unethical research to hide that his beliefs were wrong as Raoult did, that is something that you choose to do by yourself. I would recommend then to listen to better people, but for that you would need to accept that they may demonstrate as true things you don't want to accept. So at least try not to use people of low moral as examples to follow.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Vaccines are safer and more effective than the natural infection

You keep on saying that, but nobody knows that yet. There is no data on the long term effects of any Covid19 vaccine. That is why many medical professionals will at least delay taking the vaccine.

There is no valid reason for a healthy person to risk taking such a vaccine. You keep on saying that getting the virus is infinitely more dangerous than getting the vaccine for young healthy people, but there is no data to support that. You are only repeating Big Pharma talking points.

I, on the other hand, have nothing to gain to say the things I do.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

Looks like a couple of our long-term anti-vaxxer posters on here are getting tired of being out-argued on logical or factual grounds and are resorting to playing the man and not the argument.

I, on the other hand, have nothing to gain to say the things I do.

How do we know that?

Why would you support such totalitarian measures?

Perhaps you should look up the meaning of the word "totalitarian" and the history of "totalitarian" states. You need a bit more to establish that accusation as a fact than an disagreement about the need for vaccinations in the middle of a pandemic that's killed more than 1.5 million people and is still on the way up.

Oh sorry, forgot, it's nothing to worry about. Or it's Big Pharma. Whatever.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

You keep on saying that, but nobody knows that yet. There is no data on the long term effects of any Covid19 vaccine. That is why many medical professionals will at least delay taking the vaccine.

No, medical professionals want to corroborate by themselves the data, which is perfectly fine. But even as a requirement to advance to phase III it is already necessary.

Long term effects is also a point for the vaccines, because there are changes that indicate those effects will appear in the future, constant inflammation, loss of neurons, autoimmune reactions, the kind of things that have been described even on asymptomatic people infected with COVID-19, but not in any vaccine volunteer. That mean that yes, vaccines are hugely less likely to produce any long term effect compared with the natural infection, even if you don't understand the science behind it.

There is no valid reason for a healthy person to risk taking such a vaccine. 

Yes there is, the healthy person would be at a lower risk of complication after being vaccinated, you don't believing it has no importance, it can be proved scientifically. No people have as a consequence of the vaccine, even for subjects of advanced age and with comorbidities, but on the other hand perfectly healthy people in their prime have died because of the COVID-19 infection. It does not matter how much you want to be in denial of this undeniable fact, it still proves you wrong.

People do not need to gain anything to be mistaken, lots of people like to have religious-like beliefs about things they ignore completely. Repeating mistakes that can be easily proved wrong do not make those mistakes true.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

I had high hopes that Pfizer's Covid-19 vaccine would break the back of the pandemic over here, but it is in today's news that the Trump Administration refused to secure contracts for the vaccine, so other countries have done so, and now Pfizer has said that they won't be able to make enough of the vaccine for the US until the second half of 2021.

Once again, Trump demonstrates his utter and complete incompetence.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

The Danish study did show that the infection rate wasn't much different for people not wearing masks as those wearing masks in the general population.

There are legitimate questions about the study because there was no verification that the mask wearers actually wore them, wore them properly or the circumstances of the location, or if social distancing was included. The total infection rate of Denmark was 2% or less then, so that would have affected the results.

I think the issue that people could still shed the virus even after being vaccinated (as far as we know now) is a serious issue. If people don't understand that, they'll jump to the conclusion that the vaccine doesn't work.

The vaccine will help you not get the virus and the masks and distancing will help you from not transmitting it.

The problem is that there are just too many stupid people who are easily manipulated and manipulators, that's the real pandemic now - stupidity.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The problem is that there are just too many stupid people who are easily manipulated and manipulators, that's the real pandemic now - stupidity.

That means that we need to get these liars, false preachers, AM mayhem radio crackpots like Rubbish Limberger and his ilk, the Rupert Murdock press and other yahoos who spread rumors, lies and misinformation held accountable for the messes caused by their lying. They gossip, stir up hatred and violence, and rip people off. Nobody has the 'liberty' or the right to endanger other people. Nobody has the right to be a 'Typhoid Mary'. And it's also in religion - Love thy neighbor.

And America needs to get tougher about CoVid standards too. Do you really need to get your hair cut so much? Do you need that tattoo so bad? Our government needs to help out the smaller businesses and quit filing these bogus lawsuits, wasting tax dollars. Hopefully Joe ByeDon will get the ball rolling faster, the sooner the better.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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