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Most human embryos naturally die after conception – restrictive abortion laws fail to take this embryo loss into account

29 Comments
By Kathryn Kavanagh

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29 Comments
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Nature gives life and it can take it away.

Humans can't and shouldn't.

A person should never take another human's life away.

I couldn’t agree more.

-14 ( +5 / -19 )

A genuinely interesting piece, but recognition will not lead to 'rational decisions' by Republicans.

But there may well be benefits from further defederalisation of rights under a Republican supreme court. Regardless of the make-up of the federal government, Republican states would be more Republican (banning abortion, contraception, the teaching of evolution, supernatural books/TV for kids and Obamacare) and Democrat states more Democrat. It may reduce the rancour and division in federal politics, with neither side feeling as if they are living under an occupying force. Having voted with their feet, they will have moved to live under a state government that permanently matches their political allegiance, no matter who is in the White House. Two Americas living side by side in one nation.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

A genuinely interesting piece, but recognition will not lead to 'rational decisions' by Republicans.

Saving a life is irrational? What?

But there may well be benefits from further defederalisation of rights under a Republican supreme court. Regardless of the make-up of the federal government, Republican states would be more Republican (banning abortion, contraception, the teaching of evolution, supernatural books/TV for kids and Obamacare)

Not quite right, to address the usual misunderstood GOP statements and stances, contraceptions overwhelmingly are not banned, neither is evolution, you can teach it and still have religious convictions. As far as Obamacare is concerned, if the people that want and think this system is good, no worries, the problem comes from the people almost 80% that have private healthcare insurance and do not want the Federal government to take it away from them.

and Democrat states more Democrat. It may reduce the rancour and division in federal politics, with neither side feeling as if they are living under an occupying force.

The main difference is, Democrats are unwilling to compromise on anything, it’s our way or no way. California and New York are great examples, that’s why so many people are leaving, the one party state ruled is not appealing to a growing segment of the society.

-12 ( +6 / -18 )

A person should never take another human's life away.

I couldn’t agree more.

But you’ve called for capital punishment in the past.

11 ( +15 / -4 )

When does an embryo become a human life? When does a foetus become a baby? The answers cannot be answered by religion.

When does a foetus get the right to life? 

A woman must have the right to decide to have a termination within a 15-20 week time scale.

9 ( +13 / -4 )

Total abortion bans that define personhood at conception mean that full legal rights exist for a 5-day-old blastocyst, a hollow ball of cells roughly 0.008 inches (0.2 millimeters) across with a high likelihood of disintegrating within a few days.

The US is moving in the right direction.

-17 ( +2 / -19 )

Many state legislatures are seriously considering human embryos at the earliest stages of development for legal personhood.

Great progress by the US recognizing the sanctity of human life.

-15 ( +1 / -16 )

But you’ve called for capital punishment in the past.

Yes, that’s correct, for people that engage in Henneous crimes, they knew the difference between right or wrong, a fetus doesn’t.

-14 ( +4 / -18 )

But you’ve called for capital punishment in the past.

Yes, that’s correct, for people that engage in Henneous crimes, they knew the difference between right or wrong, a fetus doesn’t.

So, you don’t actually agree that “A person should never take another human's life away.”

Thanks for the clarification on what is clearly not such a black and white issue.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

Bob FosseToday  12:00 pm JST

So, you don’t actually agree that “A person should never take another human's life away.” 

Thanks for the clarification on what is clearly not such a black and white issue.

Thankfully it's getting there in the US.

-13 ( +2 / -15 )

Thankfully it's getting there in the US.

No, it isn’t. Individual states will hold ballots on the issue.

Kansas overwhelmingly voted pro-abortion. Other states are already preparing and are likely to follow suit.

8 ( +11 / -3 )

Bob FosseToday  12:10 pm JST

Thankfully it's getting there in the US.

No, it isn’t. Individual states will hold ballots on the issue. 

Kansas overwhelmingly voted pro-abortion. Other states are already preparing and are likely to follow suit.

Yes it is. As an American especially, I know this. This is a matter only US voters can understand thoroughly.

-14 ( +2 / -16 )

Yes it is. As an American especially, I know this. This is a matter only US voters can understand thoroughly.

Thst is an argument you seem to be keen on recently. But it’s a lose lose stance.

Either US news is only of consequence to Americans because US is globally insignificant and/or you support censoring outside opinions.

Or US news is of consequence to everybody and you shouldn’t be so thin skinned when foreigners criticise the US.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Bob FosseToday  12:35 pm JST

Thst is an argument you seem to be keen on recently. But it’s a lose lose stance. 

Either US news is only of consequence to Americans because US is globally insignificant and/or you support censoring outside opinions. 

Or US news is of consequence to everybody and you shouldn’t be so thin skinned when foreigners criticise the US.

No one can understand the nuances of the American voters just by watching FOX, or CNN, MSNBC or whatever.

So, much of the criticism here has a starting point that does not take into consideration a multitude of factors that are not expressed in a number of a sound byte, And much of the criticism amounts to schoolyard banter, because there is limited depth to the scope of it.

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

The majority of Americans support abortions.

Today, a 61% majority of U.S. adults say abortion should be legal in all or most cases, while 37% think abortion should be illegal in all or most cases.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

wallaceToday  12:56 pm JST

The majority of Americans support abortions.

Today, a 61% majority of U.S. adults say abortion should be legal in all or most cases, while 37% think abortion should be illegal in all or most cases.

Was that information garnered from the US media or by some poll done in the US?

Because obvious to Americans, that figure does not represent the reality.

-14 ( +1 / -15 )

Total abortion bans that define personhood at conception mean that full legal rights exist for a 5-day-old blastocyst, a hollow ball of cells roughly 0.008 inches (0.2 millimeters) across with a high likelihood of disintegrating within a few days.

The US is moving in the right direction.

Jewish and Muslim religious law teaches that a fetus is not a human until it breathes on its own. Abortion is not a sin under their religious laws. There are I believe two lawsuits already on this matter, filed by Jewish groups claiming laws like this violate their religion and are thus illegal. No trials have been set yet.

11 ( +12 / -1 )

Yes it is. As an American especially, I know this. This is a matter only US voters can understand thoroughly

I think you misunderstand the opinion of most Americans on this matter. When it comes to statewide initiatives to either legalize abortion or guarantee it as a right in their state constitutions I strongly suspect such ballot initiatives will pass. State legislatures will resist but the voters will vote in favor of legalizing abortion or even guaranteeing it as a right. For women especially this is a visceral assault on their autonomy, their right to make decisions about their own bodies.

10 ( +12 / -2 )

Desert TortoiseToday  01:17 pm JST

I think you misunderstand the opinion of most Americans on this matter. When it comes to statewide initiatives to either legalize abortion or guarantee it as a right in their state constitutions I strongly suspect such ballot initiatives will pass. State legislatures will resist but the voters will vote in favor of legalizing abortion or even guaranteeing it as a right. For women especially this is a visceral assault on their autonomy, their right to make decisions about their own bodies.

No, you have the misunderstanding. You are discussing a different issue.

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

And much of the criticism amounts to schoolyard banter, because there is limited depth to the scope of it.

Depth?

Several posters, myself included have presented factual information about the current and probable future legal state of abortion in the US.

I must have missed the nuances of your in depth certainly not schoolyard banter responses /s.

The US is not moving towards a ban on abortion, quite the opposite. As I’m sure you’re aware several states have upcoming ballots and many more will follow.

Kansas leading the way, what a turnup.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

All human beings eventually die – restrictive murder laws fail to take this loss into account...

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

As a woman, I DO NOT want others to make decisions concerning my body.

If I don't want it and you make me have it, please be prepared to raise it too!!

I can't stand the idea that old men that never have to be in that position get to make

these decisions.

What if I were raped?

What if there was a genetic problem?

What if my life was on the line?

Its my life and my decision!

3 ( +5 / -2 )

JudyinJapanSep. 11  10:31 pm JST

As a woman, I DO NOT want others to make decisions concerning my body.

If I don't want it and you make me have it, please be prepared to raise it too!!

I can't stand the idea that old men that never have to be in that position get to make 

these decisions.

What if I were raped?

What if there was a genetic problem?

What if my life was on the line?

Its my life and my decision!

Then, as an American you know that like it or not, others do make decisions concerning your body.

As for decisions, make responsible ones and the likelihood of thinking you need an abortion will decrease dramatically.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

make responsible ones and the likelihood of thinking you need an abortion will decrease dramatically.

It will not disappear. There will still be 10-year olds unable to make those ‘responsible decisions’, there will still be rapes, there will still be ectopic pregnancies, there will still be responsibly created and much-wanted foetuses that for whatever reason, turn out to be not viable and that need to be removed before they kill the mother.

Responsible decisions are those made by the mother and her doctor, not by irresponsible old men (and women) sitting in judgment.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

"Also, in the deeper evolutionary history of a species, having a huge pool of genetic variants could occasionally provide a beneficial new adaptation that could aid in human survival in changing environments."

Understand that a 'genepool' is a self-reproducing 'database'. A 'gene' is a unit of 'genetic information' and almost every gene except 'highly conserved' genes that relate to the very basic roots of the genesis of Life have 'variations' that confer modified behaviors to those genes in vivo and that widens the informational base of the genepool and the more 'information' that a genepool can transfer through time in its distributed 'carriers' the more likely that it will have latent informational resources and be able to adapt to changes in its ever changing environmental context. But some of this 'information' when combined with other information, while highly 'operationally' beneficial in some combinations, can be 'contradictory' or completely dysfunctional in other combinations yet, for the genepool as a whole, there is benefit to maintaining as much variant information as practicable among its distributed carriers. This is one of the reasons that, if a genepool drops below a certain minimum number of 'carriers' and much variant information is lost, its ability to adapt to change is severely limited and extinction is its next step. So, there is advantage in a very early 'filtering' process that ensures the progression of compatible combinations while eliminating unfavorable combinations EARLY in the consumption of genepool resources.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Yes it is. As an American especially, I know this. This is a matter only US voters can understand thoroughly.

No one can understand the nuances of the American voters just by watching FOX, or CNN, MSNBC or whatever.

Because obvious to Americans, that figure does not represent the reality.

Then, as an American you know that like it or not, others do make decisions concerning your body.

painkiller what's up with your "American" rant??

I'm American as well but I do not agree with what you say.

Don't try to represent your opinions as those of all Americans.

Maybe try Republican? or Trump supporter?

4 ( +6 / -2 )

I think he's beyond Republican or a Trump supporter. Just from a different time where everybody was led by the Bible and he has failed to adapt to modern life on so many issues.

If Kansas voted to uphold abortion I think it's fair to say that most, if not all States will, even if the wording on the ballot was such that it misled on an initial glance.

Elements of the Supreme Court have bitten off more they can chew this time, and let's not forget that it was the appointments recommended by Donald Duck himself that tipped the balance into something that doesn't belong in the modern world, But in a religious cult.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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