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U.S. could face a simmering, chronic domestic terror problem

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By Luis De la Calle

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including the 1993 Waco siege and the Bundy family’s 41-day occupation of an Oregon wildlife refuge in 2016 – ended poorly for the extremists.

Yeah, when military grade battle tanks are used against civilians (including children), the latter tends to lose.

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

Not could be... is. And has for decades.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

The main thing is these domestic terrorists aren't one large and fairly coordinated group operating in many areas like ISIS or the Taliban. They may be the same color and share the same ideology but aren't very organized, tactical, smart or well armed enough to overthrow the government as it sits now. They don't have a groundswell of support around the country, do not control the military and would likely be met with strong resistance at every turn from various civilian opposition groups along with the military. However, they could possibly throw the country into chaos by assassinating top leaders, destabilizing the government, carrying out mass attacks against other groups and such and should be taken a a very serious threat; something that has not been done, really, until the events of January sixth this year.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

Yes, Italy had problems with the Red Brigades and others, and so did Germany (not mentioned in the article) with the Baader-Meinhof gang in the 1970s. I'm sure there have been others across "affluent democracies". Japan too had its Aum Shinrikyo cult, although they were not politically motivated and, Tokyo subway bombing aside, had a far more limited impact than the European terrorist groups.

But no postwar democracy I can think of has ever had as many problems with home-grown terrorists as has the United States. Trump didn't invent them, or bring them into being. But as far as I'm aware, he would have been the first American president to actively encourage them. And as with so many things Trump, someone else now has to clear up the mess he left behind.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

This article fails to mention last years BLM / Antifa riots. Nancy Pelosi and governor Cuomo to name but a few actively encrougaged this disobedience.

To class half of the population (ie Trump supporters) as potential terrorists is reminiscent of tactics deployed by Stalin and Chairman Mao. And by potentially marginalizing such a swath of the country it is most likely to actually create the very situations it claims to be trying to avoid.

People have short memories, the last century was a blood bath of wars based on ideologies that failed to deliver on their promises.

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

I would say this "research" is more a case of perception catching up with reality. Right wing terrorism has been a problem in the US for a very long time. This researcher isn't telling anyone who has been paying attention anything particularly new.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

This article fails to mention last years BLM / Antifa riots

Yes, remember when they invaded the White House because they wanted to oust Trump before his term was legally finished?

Proud Boys stand by

(Trump)

When did Nancy tell the BLM people to stand by?

5 ( +8 / -3 )

This article fails to mention last years BLM / Antifa riots. Nancy Pelosi and governor Cuomo to name but a few actively encrougaged this disobedience.

Civil disobedience is one thing. Trying to hunt down and execute lawmakers or kidnap and murder governors is something entirely different.

To class half of the population (ie Trump supporters) as potential terrorists is reminiscent of tactics deployed by Stalin and Chairman Mao. And by potentially marginalizing such a swath of the country it is most likely to actually create the very situations it claims to be trying to avoid.

We can't just ignore the fact that it is Trump supporters that are trying to murder lawmakers and violently overthrow congress. I'm sorry but Biden supporters aren't posing a threat like that. They aren't arming themselves to the teeth and literally attacking the Capital. Its Trump supporters. You have to wear that. Don't like it, don't support Trump.

People have short memories, the last century was a blood bath of wars based on ideologies that failed to deliver on their promises.

Yeah, exactly.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

It already does. It grew considerably larger and more violent during the Obama administration, but was well documented long before that. Janet Reno, his AG, was pilloried by the GOP for a report that they bottled up identifying members of the armed forces as being either recruiting targets, susceptible to recruitment, or fellow travellers with these white nationalist domestic terrorists. Guess what? A mob of them turned up at the Capitol 2 weeks ago, armed, looking for elected representatives and the vice president.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Burning BushToday  06:52 am JST

including the 1993 Waco siege and the Bundy family’s 41-day occupation of an Oregon wildlife refuge in 2016 – ended poorly for the extremists.

Yeah, when military grade battle tanks are used against civilians (including children), the latter tends to lose.

When you allow citizens easy access to military grade guns what do you expect?

4 ( +5 / -1 )

A failed state.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

People have short memories, the last century was a blood bath of wars based on ideologies that failed to deliver on their promises.

Would a recent promise be the one to accept an election loss like a man and not try to derail democracy based on fake election fraud lies? Too soon?

As other posts clearly point out civil disobedience due to murder in the streets of black people by primarily white cops is one thing, sedition via domestic terrorism in order to over throw the USA government is something else. The last time the Capital was taken down it was the British invading the country. If black people tried to invade the Capital they would be in the ground right now, again showing why BLM is so relevant in the racist USA. White criminals took selfies with the cops and flew back home.

For the sane readers of JT you can see the delusion many labor under regarding politics, especially those in the military it seems.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

"We don't negotiate with terrorists", right? This should apply to domestic actors as well as foreign terrorists. Appeasement won't get us anywhere. The harshest available legal penalties need to be applied at all times.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"We don't negotiate with terrorists", right? This should apply to domestic actors as well as foreign terrorists. Appeasement won't get us anywhere. The harshest available legal penalties need to be applied at all times.

The writing of Thomas Jefferson offers the counter argument:

" I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.1 Unsuccesful rebellions indeed generally establish the incroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions, as not to discourage them too much. It is a medecine necessary for the sound health of government."

The US government needs exercise care in who the mete out justice too and how much.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Sedition is a crime and the rightwing kooks who invaded the Capital to keep Trump as the President based on fake news lies about the election belong in jail. Sacking of the Capital once every 200 years is enough and never should be done by American citizens no matter how deluded they may be.

incredible how the hard right is so unwilling to take responsibility for their crimes, even though many of them who invaded the Capital are members of the military and police forces. They even murdered one of their own, a fellow cop.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The US government needs exercise care in who the mete out justice too and how much.

You're concerned that, in applying the law to people who attempted to overthrow the US government, there might be too much justice?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

You're concerned that, in applying the law to people who attempted to overthrow the US government, there might be too much justice?

While my personal political values place me far to the left of the protesters, I share their demographic profile and grew up immersed in the very same bigotries, hatreds and worldview that motivated that rebellion. And because of my age and race older conservative whites where I live make assumptions about my worldview, very wrong assumptions btw, and say things that they would never say at work or in polite company. I look like them so they think I am a kindred soul and say what's on their mind so I get an unfiltered view into their mindset. Simply punishing all and sundry to the maximum extent possible will not solve the underlying problem and will only harden their views. Their fear and hatred is real, they really think they are fighting for their survival at this point (roll your eyes but I'm telling you how they feel) and in their view time is running out. They also feel like economic outcasts as jobs disappear where they live while some big wealthy coastal cities thrive. In short they feel desperation and desperate people who feel they have little left to lose (not true but it's how they see it) will do dangerous things. There needs to be a national discussion on race and sexual orientation relations in the US. Part of the problem is not enough whites really know black families well enough to be disabused of their ridiculous bigotries. And a lot of poor whites, if they really saw themselves in the mirror, are not a whole lot better off or better educated than the minorities they disparage. Poor Americans in general need help. There needs to be education and infrastructure so all the good paying work isn't concentrated in a few wealthy coastal areas. If there are jobs and opportunities to live well in the so-called flyover states a lot of this anger will die down. Punishment alone doesn't solve the problem.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

You're concerned that, in applying the law to people who attempted to overthrow the US government, there might be too much justice?

I want to ad that the individuals who really need to be punished severely are mostly members of the media and some politicians who in all likelihood will never be indicted much less sent to prison. The crux of the problem was a simple statement made decades ago by Ronald Reagan that government is the problem, compounded by his subsequent push to eliminate the Fairness Doctrine as a condition of holding a broadcast license with the FCC. Ever since there has been a steady drumbeat of anti-government propaganda coming from right wing media outlets who were freed from any requirement to produce balanced and truthful broadcasting. They have been stoking these fires and nourishing racial animosities for decades. Donald Trump gave all of this a bigger megaphone (MAGAphone ?) but all the pieces were out there before 2016. For decades since the 1980s I have had older white males whispering to me about "the coming race war". This has been building for a while but the propagandist will all walk free and they are the ones who really deserve some time in jail. They misled people and caused this insurrection.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I'm not sure that I follow. No-one is suggesting arresting conservative white men who think politically incorrect things. They're suggesting that the people who stormed the Capitol should be arrested and punished to the full extent of the law.

I'm sure that the insurrectionists felt very sore that their candidate lost. But you can't just try to overthrow democracy and get away with it because you were upset. If you let these people off without any consequences, the only lesson they'll learn is: we should try harder next time.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

U.S. could face a simmering, chronic domestic terror problem

What do the writers mean “could face”? We already have a full blown domestic terror problem from Antifa and BLM.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

What do the writers mean “could face”? We already have a full blown domestic terror problem from Antifa and BLM.

This isn't true.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

With how many mass shootings a year it's hardly a simmering problem is it. Such prevalent gun ownership has no place and is not required in a properly functioning society.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I'm not sure that I follow. No-one is suggesting arresting conservative white men who think politically incorrect things. They're suggesting that the people who stormed the Capitol should be arrested and punished to the full extent of the law.

Everyone who was at the demonstration has friends and family and many are going to be sympathetic. When the demonstrators are brought to court and tried there has to be a perception of justice rather than vengeance or you will turn those friends and family into future insurrectionists. One of the reasons the US has open public trials instead of the secret courts is so the people have trust in the courts and in the justice system as a whole. People have to believe the laws are just, and justly enforced to be willing to obey them. If punishments end up looking like partisan vengeance this will further inflame hatreds and lead to even worse violence. How the DOJ and courts handle the protesters will be critical.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

What do the writers mean “could face”? We already have a full blown domestic terror problem from Antifa and BLM.

Over 90% of the protests last summer against police brutality aimed at blacks were peaceful and there is some strong evidence that the small amount of violence that did happen was instigated by people sympathetic to or actively involved with white nationalist groups among the protesters. You claim also deliberately ignores the reason for those protests, which is the incessant institutional racism that seems to be baked into American institutions at all levels. There is a vast difference between protesting injustice and the outright murder of blacks on a daily basis in the US, and a mob intent on overthrowing the duly elected government of the US.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

U.S. could face a simmering, chronic domestic terror problem

No kidding. Antifa and BLM aren’t going anywhere.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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