Watered-down LGBTQ bill shows how far Japan's Diet is out of step with its society – and history

The article is far more inflammatory than Japanese politics. Maybe that’s what the editors want.

Thought I'd comment before the thread is blocked. LGBT rights and same-sex marriage are relatively new issues but but societies and people are changing all the time. Slavery was common throughout most of human history and considered by some societies as necessary to increase wealth or keep society functioning. Today you cannot name a country that allows de jure slavery in law.

Until 1967 interracial marriage in some parts of the USA was illegal. A black man who wanted to marry a white woman would just have to cry and and claim unfair discrimination before the Supreme Court abolished the laws.

Homosexuals have existed throughout history but LGBT as an identity is more recent, only being recognized from the 20th century. When the gay rights movement started in earnest in the 1970s there was backlash from some people who claimed gays wanted to "groom" kids with parades and in schools to increase their number since they couldn't do so naturally (the same arguments are being used today). I remember singer Anita Bryant's campaign to ban gay teachers in California through a referendum. It failed. We don't need parades or schools to make gay people, we have plenty of straights who give birth to them. Ancient Sparta and Mesopotamia managed to produce plenty of homosexuals without parades, as far as I know from my history books.

Some claim the Bible says marriage is a union between one man and one woman. It also acknowledges incest and polygamy. I, like millions of others, am not Christian and do not believe in the Bible and do want laws based soley on its precepts.

In Japan homosexuality has also been around for centuries (just read "Comrade Loves of the Samurai" written by Saikaku Ihara in the mid 17th century)

The subject of same-same marriage comes up every year in my university classes and ALWAYS gets about 95% support, sometimes 100. Unfortunately for now, most of them don't vote and we are stuck with a group of very old men with very insular views running the country. That will eventually change.

I don't want special rights. I just want my partner to be at my side if I'm in hospital near death, to have access to my finances when I'm gone, etc.

One important note to the writer of this piece (Frühstück). California is a disaster, in large part because of these extreme silly social policies. People are leaving in droves. Why do you continue to push this failed agenda on others? Does it get you bonus points in the American academic community? Please stay in your lane. Cheers.

The thing about the whole pronoun thing, is that people generally only use the third person forms to talk about you when you’re not around. When you’re with the same people, they’ll generally refer to you as ‘you’. So, the whole ‘they’, ‘zum’, ‘zee’ etc, only really seems to be significant if you’re famous and constantly being talked about. The other thing about this whole debate is that there seems to be zero room for nuance or debate. You’re either on one side or the other.

Actually, looking at the issues going on around the world within this hysterical community. It looks to me like Japan have got it absolutely right. Perhaps Japan will be one of the few places where the rights of women are protected. It will make a nice change to what see sadly see happening to women's spaces and sports in the West.

Governments are equipped to deal with numerous problems and projects simultaneously.

Just goes to show there is hope for Japan. The Japanese government is doing the right thing for once.

I seriously doubt the the Japanese want this most know where it will go once they accept same sex marriage

Maybe you can..what is it the kids say…’influence’ them?

Was it on Louder with Crowder of Matt Walsh?

They seem to be the thought leaders for the less intellectually able and the hysterical.

The Japanese are a generally well educated and practical lot.

I’d go for something with a little more substance.

Luckily there is not much of a pronoun issue in Japanese. "-san" and "-sama" are very useful and take the place of Mr, Mrs, Ms. Names. Genderless 3rd person pronouns such as "ano hito" exist and it's certainly much easier to speak about someone in a way that doesn't refer to their gender. But the point of the article, that the Japanese diet is completely out of touch with reality is spot on, I feel.

The subject of same-same marriage comes up every year in my university classes and ALWAYS gets about 95% support, sometimes 100. Unfortunately for now, most of them don't vote and we are stuck with a group of very old men with very insular views running the country. That will eventually change

The opposition to this will shrink even further in the coming years.

The point where inaction or opposition becomes a clear liability is close.

Just a matter of time. Probably within 5 years.

The Tokyo law ... outlawed the expression of hateful anti-LGBTQ rhetoric in public.

I wonder what kind of jurisdiction this has. Would it, say - just supposing it happened - cover public comments on certain posting fora.

Nothing will ever change until the old geezers who are running the show leave willingly or unwillingly nothing will change in the government and that means their kids, too, who usually automatically inherit their dad's or mom's seat in the house.

I notice that the article singles out Japan amongst G7 countries, whilst abjectly ignoring the fact that Japan is completely in step with Asia as a whole in its collective attitude towards LGBTQ issues.

I know that the West virtue signalers are desperate to bully and shame Asian cultures on this approach, which strikes me as particularly noninclusive of diverse attitudes and cultural perspectives.

So the Japanese would essentially fornicate with anyone and not have labels for anything like the ancient Romans and Greeks until Christianity ruined everyone’s good time. Japan never had any Christian religious animosity towards homosexuality like Europe and America. So thanks japan, in your rush to modernize and look “developed” you borrowed the puritanical nonsense of the west without the Christianity aspect so really the ban on same sex marriage makes even less sense.

@apeman

A very thoughtful comment.

Whether it's immigration or LGBT, there's no way that things that aren't doing well in Europe or the United States will work well in Japan.

It is necessary if the Japanese people want it, but the majority thinks that it is fine as it is. It's just arrogance that doesn't care about Japanese people to force it on Japan.

From a global perspective, Japan falls into the category of being fairly tolerant of religion and personal preferences.

If you want to change the world, I would like you to change the Islamic world and the Hindu world where the human rights of women and LGBT are suppressed more than Japan.

In addition, the excessive consideration of Disney and others is rather harmful.

Moreover, although they give preferential treatment to blacks, they do not give much consideration to Asians. not fair

Well what did they really expect when the Japanese government is run by a bunch of out-of-touch, "traditional" (misogynistic, homophobic, xenophobic etc.), dinosaur geezers? Real change will probably only come about if they boot out the current people running the country and install individuals who actually know which end of a USB to use.

Everyone's favourite establishment news agency:

https://english.kyodonews.net/news/2023/02/d95968c3f7d5-urgent-64-favor-recognizing-same-sex-marriage-in-japan-kyodo-poll.html

Perhaps those who continually insist, every time this issue arises, that "Japan is completely in step with Asia as a whole in its collective attitude towards LGBTQ issues," might want to think again.

This is an interesting topic. First off, I do not support gay rights or LGBT rights. I support human rights. I don't think people should be discriminated against in any realm of society based on sexual orientation or gender identity. In a civil society, all one must do is tolerate other peoples ways. That's it. People do not have to agree with how one lives...they just have to tolerate it. I have no problem with same sex marriage. It's the gender identity part. If you're an adult, do what you want. Live and let live. But there are limits.

I draw the line at a few things. First off, leave kids out of it. Most gender dysphoric kids grow out of it to become gay adults. It's almost like a war on gay people. The fact that parents will greenlight their kids to take puberty blockers, (from what I understand, what is used to chemically castrate sex offenders) , cross sex hormones. and even surgery is absolute lunacy. They become lifelong customers to the pharmaceutical industry. We criticize countries that practice forced female circumcision, (it's mutilation), but in the west it is accepted and often celebrated. This is done to kids, who cannot, drink, smoke, vote, drive, etc, yet it's become normal. Actual transgenderism is quite rare and the literature backs it up.

Secondly, no trans-women in female sports. That just seems like common sense, yet people still push for it. Google Fallon Fox. This does not happen with trans-men....I wonder why.

Third, stop sending men who identify as women to women's jails. Again, common sense. Again, this does not happen with trans-men. I wonder why.

I honestly don't know why the LGB part is connected to the TQ part. They are two very different things. My best friend, who is a married gay man, does not like the fact that he is always associated with the TQ part.

I think Japan should allow gay marriage. I think Japan should not discriminate based on preference or identity. I think everyone should have the same rights. I just don't want Japan to become a lunatic country like my home country. And that's where the transgender aspect of it has reached too far. When a cause is not just happy with equal rights but constant affirmation, then you've overplayed your hand.

Out of step? That is not the case at all. They are just afraid of change. Japan is still living in the 1960’s in many ways.

@Falseflagsteve

oh yeah, without this law, how would Japan be, oh just the same, as must people like it to be

Read my comment again. It can be interpreted both ways ;)

The government pussyfooting about is doing the right thing for once.

Just 3 points for people in the comments.

There are no pronouns in the Japanese language, so talking about pronouns in the context of Japan makes absolutely no sense.

Polls show that most Japanese people have been in favor of same sex marriage for a decade now, just like most are also in favor of separate last name marriage, but because of the LDP, these 2 things that, and I repeat, MOST people arr in favor of, they are not even discussed in the diet.

People in Japan can already legally change their gender, though it requires sterilization, basically saying that transexuals shouldn't be allowed to breed.

Does any society really want that?

No, they don’t overwhelmingly.

a watered-down bill

It's easier to write as weakened bill, as if Japan has law about it but it's weakened version.

Polling in February 2023 found that 64.3% of Japanese respondents backed laws that promoted a better understanding of sexual minorities.

64% backed better understanding NOT pandering to their every wish

That still leaves 36% who don't even want this. Quite a sizable minority.

The LGBXYZ community would get more success if they campaigned on specific issues.

The T part is problematic for many logical thinkers.

Watered-down LGBTQ bill shows how far Japan's Diet is out of step with its society – and history

Hope they published this article in Japanese

This year, the Tokyo Rainbow Pride event – Asia’s largest Pride event – returned to full capacity for the first time in four years, after pandemic disruptions.

 

About 10,000 out of city of 30 miilion.

tora

oh yeah, without this law, how would Japan be, oh just the same, as must people like it to be

Watered-down LGBTQ bill

Good. Spend more time on serious issues please.

shows how far Japan's Diet is out of step with its society

Says* *Sabine Frühstück. Not really a balanced opinion from this sex and Japan obsessed "educator".

Thuban

Today 06:29 am JST

highlight how national politicians are out of step with Japanese society at large.

> Does "Japanese society at large" really want to remove women only spaces and have men competing against girls in sports and start every greeting with an announcement of pronouns.

> I wonder

That is a good question?

They keep point out this

Polling in February 2023 found that 64.3% of Japanese respondents backed laws that promoted a better understanding of sexual minorities. A similar percentage of the population also support the legal recognition of same-sex marriage.

But the poll as all of them don't or more likely leave out, "do you want non transgender women (biological men) in women's spaces like baths, onsen changing rooms? or transgender men (biological women) in men's spaces like baths, onsen changing rooms?

I suspect the answer would be NO.

I support LGB rights even marriage if they want to.

Both LGB know what sex they are they are not pretending to be something they are not biologically.

It is like the debate on transitioning children in The West the pro transitioning keep saying people support it when push they cannot point to a single study on safety of long term effects and then when the public is asked the direct question

Do you accept or think transitioning of young teens or acceptable? 70% said no!

Just because people support same sex marriage does not mean they accept all the rest like biological men in women's private spaces where they are in various states of undress.

The reaction by women to the unisex public toilets in Shinjuku and the building owners reversal and decision to make separate toilets says it all.

Women were uncomfortable felt not safe and that was just a public toilet.

Now ask the question do women in Japan want biological Men in changing rooms, onsen, sento, etc...?

The answer will most likely be NO!

The country is held to ransom by the stubborn, loveless dinosaurs of the LDP preaching a "traditional culture" that merely reflects their prejudices rather than reality. In truth, they could choose public opinion on any other occasion to back them up, except that is against them here.

Polling in February 2023 found that 64.3% of Japanese respondents

Name the poll. You wont because you know it wasd conducted by interest group