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Why cartoons depicting Mohammed anger many Muslims

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Muslim rules dont apply to non-muslims. Simple as.

18 ( +21 / -3 )

The purpose of religion is control. Tenents and the power of faith specify all the details of control in the name of reverence.

“We should not open the door to people to draw the prophet in different forms that could affect his status in the hearts of his people,” said Kubaisi, the Iraqi preacher who is based in Dubai. -article

While many can list all sorts of benefits of the religious mind and practice, at the central focus of power is the need for absolute control of the mind and will. Such control is forgiven because the all knowing power of creation should be pleased with us and may well not be when variations or alterations in doctrine are entertained.

Religion then is an effective control as its purpose is to reach into the creative human mind and punish any thought "that could affect his (insert Deity here) status in the hearts of his people". So, the practices stemming from any teaching cannot be questioned as this also affects the status of the subject deity.

A pretty neat trick, there have been a parade of humans who claimed similar power, their names are legion.

If nothing can be questioned then the schools should be closed, the deviants punished as an example and all this to please the disembodied power that controls our lives from afar. The reader can find such places throughout the world even now. The complaint then is there are not yet enough of these thought prisons and how can anyone pursue happiness if the great unknowable almighty sprit has so much to find disappointing in his creations?

13 ( +12 / -0 )

Mahathir Mohamad: 'We respect their religion and they must respect our religion.'

Having lived and worked in a muslim country (one considered rather liberal), I didn't notice much respect for Christianity. Although brought up in a Christian culture I don't profess any religion. Nevertheless I was constantly harassed by a substantial number of people (not the majority I should say, but a large proportion) for being, as I was called on more than one occasion, 'no more than as I was a non-muslim. At least for me it was only verbal insults. A Jewish colleague was subjected to stone throwing and spitting every time he went out. He wisely decided to leave before things got worse. This was thirty years ago. I guess now it's much worse.

17 ( +17 / -0 )

How about articles about why Muslims think the can assault, torture, murder and rape for every little complaint and grievance they have?

Or maybe an article about why everyone else cares at all What violent Muslims think?

10 ( +10 / -0 )

Because they are muslim, basically. This kind of fanaticism started with Moses and Islam is just the latest example.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

That should read:'Nothing more than a dog.'

2 ( +2 / -0 )

“We respect their religion and they must respect our religion,” he added.'

As already pointed out, it's pretty difficult to argue that Islamic societies provide the same level of tolerance towards all religions as western secular democracies. The hate-filled, murderous propaganda coming out of some of them against Jews, Christians and Hindus is far more dangerous than a satirical cartoon about Mohammed.

I can't be sure of the translation if there is one but I don't like the word 'must' in the above quotation. If that's what he said, I'd recommend a little research into France's history and ideals. He may learn something of use.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Yes, they may disagree with pictures of prohets etc, but not reason to kill someone.

and i don't see much respect for other religions in Muslim countries.....

10 ( +11 / -1 )

Many Muslims might be angered, but its only a few doing any killing over it...and even Muslims have questioned whether those doing the killings are really Muslims.

While I don't see anybody standing up to say that anybody has the right to kill, I find it fascinating that many seem to be questioning the right of Muslims to even be angry. Some of those cartoons were above and beyond the call of duty to be offensive (if there is any such duty). The goal was to anger obviously. Mission accomplished!

-12 ( +0 / -13 )

Caricatures seem to have been tooooo much for Musims. That is why some extremists did it after all. I knew such thing would happen sooner or later. Charlie Hebdo should have downplayed caricatures about Islams less than exaggeration. It seems that terror just happened just like It would happen someday.

-11 ( +0 / -12 )

Kwatt.

Exactly you can be satirical without being offensive, they had been warned before but just had to push it.

As they say if there is a red button marked 'End of the World. DON'T push', you can be guaranteed someone will just to see what happens.

-10 ( +1 / -12 )

I think it's really about insecurity. The more confident you are about your beliefs, the less likely you are to be offended when someone demeans them.

Take Mormons on the complete opposite end of the spectrum. They often face ridicule from the public but just respond with a genuinely sympathetic and sorry smile, since they have no doubt about where your soul is headed.

10 ( +11 / -1 )

and i don't see much respect for other religions in Muslim countries.....

An interesting statement. Of course Muslims revere Jesus as well, so not sexually degrading pictures of him in Muslim countries.

So, any sexually degrading pics of Christian priests and pastors? Or something really out there like depictions of them eating babies or something? I cannot think of a single equivalent cartoon from the Muslim world.

It would be an extra degree of separation to tie Christianity with say, the hunt for WMD in Iraq, or the greed for oil, or terror drones blowing up madrassa and such, complete with lots of Christian crosses marked on things and devious depictions of the Pope. I have not seen anything like that either. I might have just missed them.

Yes, I know that Islam is put first in many of these countries and I am against putting any religion first. But that does mean there is no respect for Christianity, at least not in general. I am sure you can find EXTREME examples, but doesn't putting so much stock in extreme examples make you an EXTREMIST?

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

Fight back with pencils. Do some drawings and go after them that way, not with guns.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

first the artict writr generalizing like if he makes all muslims are gulity . the attackers are terrorists following elqaida and isis the police men who die is muslims trying to protect the victims of that journal another victim i mean who works in the journal is muslim ... and there a muslim guy saved 15 peson from the other jihadi terrorist by hiding them in that jewish shop . it's sad to see a stereotype of persons like this who generaliez all . even thought i'm not muslim but i did grow up in a muslim country morocco and most of my friends is muslisms .. islam have nothing to do with terrorist . that terrorists have another religion called " salfi jihadi " there more than 2 billion muslim around the world .. and islam have more than 100 groups ... same like budisht there some group called "jihadist" wich is banned in all the muslim countries ... and only about 0.0001 percent of muslims bleive that thinking .. also believe it or not a normal muslim also can be kiled by that jihadist if he not agree with they thinking ... same as we se in iraq ad syria isis and elqaead are jihadist terrorist ...and most of they victims is normal muslims and who fights them is muslims ...

2 ( +2 / -0 )

“This is a prophet that is revered by some two billion people… Is it moral to mock him?”

Is it moral to kill people because your "prophet" is made fun of? Hmmm.

Having lived and worked in a muslim country (one considered rather liberal), I didn't notice much respect for Christianity. Although brought up in a Christian culture I don't profess any religion. Nevertheless I was constantly harassed by a substantial number of people (not the majority I should say, but a large proportion) for being, as I was called on more than one occasion, 'no more than as I was a non-muslim. At least for me it was only verbal insults. A Jewish colleague was subjected to stone throwing and spitting every time he went out. He wisely decided to leave before things got worse. This was thirty years ago. I guess now it's much worse.

Not suprising. If that was three decades ago I can't imagine how much worse muslims treat non-muslims these days.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Malaysia just passed a law banning Christians from using the word Allah to describe the Almighty, even though they have used this word in their publications for as long as anyone can remember, and beyond.

Now, what was it that Mr Mahathir said?

8 ( +8 / -0 )

killing of innocent people is unacceptable and it should be condemn, at the same time bullying, making fun of others, disrespecting and insulting other cultures is extremism and it should also be condemned.

You have the freedom to speech, but you do not the have the freedom to make fun of others or to hurt the feelings of others. the same newspaper fire their employ when he wrote against the Jews.

-6 ( +1 / -8 )

The second anyone puts a "but" after condemning killing people for free speech you are making that condemnation totally meaningless.

Everything must be open to question, comment, enquiry and satire, the only appropriate response is in-kind, in the same manner.

People have freedom to speech, people have the freedom to be offended... thats all...

It is the religious that should be the most careful about restrictions of free speech as for example I find some statements from various religious perspectives to be some of the most offence, disgusting anti-human speech to ever leave a humans lips.. however they have a right to do so, as I have a right to say "I think you are incorrect, and here is why..."

Do not give in to tyranny, the most freedoms for the most people should be the ultimate goal for humanity not the watering down of our interactions to suit the easily offended.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Netminder:

" An interesting statement. Of course Muslims revere Jesus as well, so not sexually degrading pictures of him in Muslim countries. "

Islam "reveres" Jesus as an islamic prophet, which is a completely different description than Christians use, so that is a false argument. About the "respect" for other religions, maybe you want to take a closer look at the Bahmian Buddhas (or what is left of them).... or at how Hindus and Christians are faring under Pakistans islamic blasphemy laws. Or at how Jews are routinely cartooned in Arab countries: http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ArabCartoons.htm

However, I do not see Jews reacting with death threats and murders of cartoonists. Which is the difference some of us are trying to point out to you.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Hate speech is speech that offends, threatens, or insults groups, based on race, color, religion, national origin, sexual orientation, disability, or other traits.

But I guess France doesn't have Hate Speech laws.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Charlie Hebdo's caricatures were surely offensive to Muslims and at times Christians and others as well. That is no justification for retaliating with a Fatwa or an AK-47.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

I tolerate, but I do not respect, religion. For me it's clear that they are all made up; believe in them if you want, but don't try to tell me what I can and cannot do based on whatever nonsense you believe.

If you argue that we must respect all religions, then I can make up a new religion right now that states, e.g. "the kicking of a ball (or depiction thereof) is absolutely forbidden". So no more football on TV please, as it is an insult to my religion.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

When I were a lad, we had a TV series in British TV called Spitting Image. It used puppets to depict the people in the news of the day.... including depicting Maggie Thatcher as a mad woman with glowing red eyes, other members of the cabinet as oily or insane, and other politicians as either nasty or stupid. Royalty were lampooned, as were foreign leaders and celebs. It was cruel, the puppets were ugly... but you know what? Most people took it on the chin. Some even wanted a puppet as a souvenir.

The ayatollah was depicted as a scary, mad, insane cleric espousing mass murder, etc... and yet I don't remember the series having a fatwa placed on it.

Islam needs a sense of humour. Stop being so precious about your religion's founder.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Thunderbidd2.

I agree with you, enjoyed Spitting Image. Said that I don't recall Muslim Terrorism from way back when I was a kid. Israel/Palestine and PLO yes but nothing on the scale as we saw recently.

IRA, ETA and others yes.

When did it all start?

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

@it"S ME... yeah, I don't remember the IRA attacking the TV studios when Gerry Adams was depicted as a maniac, or the UDA when Ian Paisley was depicted as an insane raving madman.

I think the current spate of Middle East terror can go all the way back to when the Ayatollah ousted the Sha in Iran in 1979, and the west armed the Jihadists to fight the Russians in Afghanistan the same year.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I think the current spate of Middle East terror can go all the way back to when the Ayatollah ousted the Sha in Iran in 1979, and the west armed the Jihadists to fight the Russians in Afghanistan the same year.

Agree, don't recall radical Islam in the 60's,70's and early 80's, seems to have originated with the Taliban during the Russia/Afghanistan conflict, IMO.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Its Me:

" Agree, don't recall radical Islam in the 60's,70's and early 80's, seems to have originated with the Taliban during the Russia/Afghanistan conflict, IMO. "

There was always radical islam, but it was suppressed and unambitious for a long time. You correct that Jihadism got a gigantic boost when Ronald Reagan sent Stinger missiles to the Mujaheddin, and suddenly they were able to defeat a superpower. We have been suffering from the result ever since.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

WilliB.

Rare but we agree. Talking about Reagan and Spitting Image.

Genesis - Land Of Confusion: http://youtu.be/TlBIa8z_Mts

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Thunderbird;

" The ayatollah was depicted as a scary, mad, insane cleric espousing mass murder, etc... and yet I don't remember the series having a fatwa placed on it. "

Maybe he did not notice, or had other priorities at the time? The Ayatollha was very quick to issue a death Fatwah on Salman Rushdie for the crime of writing a book, and how many millions did the UK spend to protect a citizen from a death sentence given by a cleric in a country half across the world?

Talking about cartoons, I remember that in the US "South Park" did get death threats for depicting Mohammed in a bear costume (thinking: who recognizes anybody in bear costume, anyway??), and weren´t they very quick to withdraw that installment and bury it?

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Religion in general is very dangerous be it Judaism,Christaintity or Islam. I have seen the evils of all of them. With that being said, what is the logic of killing 12 people over a comic strip? It only shows when religions say Tolerant, they only mean you and not them or their followers.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

I still think Muslim extremists need to develop a sense of humour... if they could see how stupid they are the world would be a safer place.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

However, I do not see Jews reacting with death threats and murders of cartoonists. Which is the difference some of us are trying to point out to you.

@WilliB At least those reacting with murders are NOT Muslims either. And that is the difference some of us are trying to point out to YOU. Once someone has reached a murderous point of insanity, they are too insane to be adherents of any religion.

Islam "reveres" Jesus as an islamic prophet, which is a completely different description than Christians use, so that is a false argument.

And the price of tea in China now is 2000 yuan per kilogram!

maybe you want to take a closer look at the Bahmian Buddhas

The Taliban does not represent Islam.

or at how Hindus and Christians are faring under Pakistans islamic blasphemy laws.

Pakistan does not represent Islam.

Or at how Jews are routinely cartooned in Arab countries:

Jews are not nearly as concerned about their image as Muslims are of the image of Mohammad. If you want to rile up Jews, you hit them with the Holocaust! That could get you firebombed by the Jewish Defense League. Or you might get a nice Jewish mail bomb. Ask Alex Odeh. No wait. You can't. He was killed by a mail bomb for speaking on a TV show. And it might also interest you to know that July 15 last year, armed Jewish vigilantes went on a rampage in Paris.

That said, if the western world recognized that Mohammad was as sensitive a topic to Muslims as the Holocaust is to Jews, would Charlie Hebdo be tolerated? Or, for that matter, has Charlie Hebdo portrayed the Holocaust on the level it did Mohammad?

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Netminder:

" At least those reacting with murders are NOT Muslims either. ..... The Taliban does not represent Islam. .... The Taliban does not represent Islam. "

How do you come up with this stuff?? When DID the Kouavhi brothers leave islam? What IS the religion of Afghanistan and Pakistan? Buddhism perhaps?

I am talking about real existing world, you seem to be talking about an imaginary one. The point is: You are not some kind of Grand Pan-Islamic authoritiy who can declare who is muslim and who is not. Good grief.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

WilliB, a Nazi attending church and reading the Bible and claiming to be Christian (they did) does not make him a Christian any more than men searching for excuses to murder and rampage are Muslims by the virtue of going to mosques, reading the Koran, claiming to be Muslims and yelling "Allahu Akbar!" Or is that the way it works in your world?

These guys were radicalized by a man thrown out of his mosque, and the minute they did that, they ceased being true Muslims in my book and a whole lot of other people's books too.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Netminder:

" These guys were radicalized by a man thrown out of his mosque, and the minute they did that, they ceased being true Muslims in my book "

That is in your book, not in theirs, and not in that of anyone who follows Shariah. Again, in countries with Shariah law (I used Pakistan as an example), the government would have done the killing. It is quite mind-boggling to see that you take it upon yourself to declare that Shariah law is somehow un-islamic. Wow!

" Jews are not nearly as concerned about their image as Muslims are of the image of Mohammad. If you want to rile up Jews, you hit them with the Holocaust!

Check out the International Holocaust Compedition: "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Holocaust_Cartoon_Competition

The Jewish response? An Israeli Anti-Semitic Cartoons Contest.I quote Illustrator Amitai Sandy: "We'll show the world we can do the best, sharpest, most offensive Jew hating cartoons ever published! No Iranian will beat us on our home turf!"

How do you manage to compare that with mass murder?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Netminder... the whole point is that the world should not be afraid to take the mick out of religious figures (for satirical reasons of course), be that figure God, Buddha, Ganesh or Mohammed. Why should the world be afraid of reprisals? Why should we be afraid to take the mick out of one religion but not the others? God appeared in the Simpsons. Buddha was in a manga as a schoolboy... I think the Simpsons took the mick out of Ganesh too... Big Bang theory frequently makes Jewish and Hindu jokes.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

How about the cartoon depicting a Muslim woman pushing a baby stroller with a baby boy wearing a turban and holding a knife?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Muslims regard their prophet as the greatest man to have walked this planet. If they are right, I'm sure such a man would have been able to rise above being satirized in a crude cartoon in his great wisdom, maturity and tolerance. A Guardian cartoonist wanted to depict Mohammed in a t-shirt with the slogan 'not in my name' but decided against it for fear of having his head cut off by the followers of this supposed paragon of wisdom and tolerance.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

"Some people 'do not understand the Western context of free speech, where you can easily make a movie that is critical of Jesus.'"

What is it that they don't understand? Somebody ought to explain it to them.

"We respect their religion and they must respect our religion,' he (Mahathir Mohamad) added."

It's just a little hard for some people worldwide to really believe this kind of line. Do Muslims in Mahathir's native Malaysia really respect the Hinduism practiced there by Indians and the Daoist/Buddhist/Confucian religious beliefs of ethnic Chinese? The number of Hindu and Buddhist temples that were declared idolatrous and destroyed by Islamic invaders throughout the Indian subcontinent over the centuries is so big that it cannot be counted. To this day, I strongly suspect that many Muslims feel intense hatred towards the non-Abrahamic religious faiths of South Asia and East Asia and wish to see them eradicated. This type of feeling on their part is unacceptable to people who have never subscribed to the monotheistic "desert dogmas" that first took root in the Middle East.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Fighting cartoons with Kalashnikov's is cowardly and wrong.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Jimizo:

" A Guardian cartoonist wanted to depict Mohammed in a t-shirt with the slogan 'not in my name' but decided against it for fear of having his head cut off "

That is the point. Respect has to be earned, not forced by threats of violence. It is this islamic demand that non-believers submit under their rules, enforced with death threats, that makes this an issue.

I remember a parody song by "Crazy Al Jankovich" about the "Amish paradise". I don´t remember any Amish riots in response. Now, I´d think a song about islamic paradise with all its well-known features would be quite rich material. But don´t expect Crazy Al to go there...

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Many have questioned whether religion has some special status which limits criticism. Others have pointed out 'hate speech' isn't criticism, it's hate. Still more have asked for a 'sense of humor' or the acceptance that satire, is by its nature, demands deeper thought and questioning of even the most feared gods and authorities. All of these perspectives are beyond the capability of the insane.

The insane have no need for your ideas based on centuries of rational analysis and democratic disciplines. The certainty of the insane has but one result, and religion isn't necessary for this; the insane will find any source to justify their anger and nothing will ever change that.

The sources of insanity are certainty, ignorance and the capacity to harm without remorse or conscience. So far, there is no antidote to this, it is as oddly human as any other confounding illness.

The only answer? Those who are yet uninfected had best act to disarm these violent insane few and that can only be done within the infected bodies. The test then isn't of the West, the test of humanity is within the communities where insanity has become a daily cocktail to deaden all feeling and reason. The infected communities know where and how this disease is fed and sheltered and its deadly affect is within their control until the insane outnumber all humanity.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

There will be caricatures as long as there are death threats.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

For those asking for a sense of humor from Islam, this is from Iraqi TV:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx0Gu0PlNjI

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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