national

Japan protests after 3 Chinese ships enter waters near disputed islands

109 Comments

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

© (c) Copyright Thomson Reuters 2012.

©2019 GPlusMedia Inc.

109 Comments
Login to comment

Easy response, put a few rounds in front of them and watch them run!

-14 ( +10 / -24 )

Only those 2 made it through the typhoon?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

**** Japan is forbidden from taking military shots. Except if Chinese ships fire on them, then they can return fire as a defense. China is not restricted by that. Another thing should be noted, Japan has not sent ships to confront the Ships of China. If they did, it would be an escalation of both sides. China would love this since it would allow it to deploy its navy against Japan directly. Japan would not be able to respond. The USA would have to instead, but that would potentially start a spiral effect the USA would probably not like to see since it could include North Korea, South Korea, Russia as well.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Good to see we have master diplomats here on this forum... Sinking the ships is obviously the smartest response. Escalation is clearly not a good solution.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Where is James T. Kirk with his photon torpedos?

We come in peace ...

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Good to see we have master diplomats here on this forum... Sinking the ships is obviously the smartest response. Escalation is clearly not a good solution.

lol. And when China parks its navy off the island, and ignores Japans warn offs, Japan does.... Nothing.

Guys, just hand over the islands now, if you don't have the balls to defend the territory.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

It seems that Chinese surveillance ships try to provoke Japanese coat guards and put them in trap.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Easy response, put a few rounds in front of them and watch them run!

Exactly something George Dubya would say... How about a "Bring it On!"

Let's hope the leaders in Tokyo have more brains than balls.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

The coast guard should put some rounds done and see what happens. But I seriously doubt they'd run Yuri

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Chinese playing the entrapment game. They want the Js to make a mistake and get hit or sunk or something so they can go all out. Let's hope Japan continues to play mature here.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Arrest them and bring them to Tokyo to meet Japan's supreme leader Ishihara.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

Obviously sinking them is not the right answer, but doing nothing doesn't exactly seem like the smartest thing to do either. What would China do if Japanese "civilian surveillance vessels" entered Chinese territorial waters? Ignore them? I doubt that.

I agree with Molenir. If Japan isn't going to even try and defend them, what's the point? At the very least they should arrest the people on the boats and bring them back to Tokyo for trial.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Japanese military needs to build up in around Senkaku Islands ASAP whatever Japanese Government has intended to take action on these two Communist Chinese surveillance ships. I believe Communist Chinese Government is first intimidating and later invade on Islands. Communist Chinese Government is like a Mafia and they only know Mafia ways to sorting out problems instead of diplomatic channel and going through the International Court of Justice. Japanese peoples should be moving back if they think their lives are at risk. Otherwise, they stay in Communist China for their free of will and they have to responsible for their own decision. Business peoples must be careful because Communist Chinese Government will use dirty trick and put them in jail. Australian - Chinese Rio Tinto Mining group boss Stern Hu in Shanghai was sent to prison because business disputed with Communist Government control business. The Communist Chinese Government took away his Lap top computer and steal Rio Tinto Group's business information from Stern Hu's Lap top. Japanese Company must take extraordinary security measure for their Company trade secrete and information in China and they should be thinking about sending back their Lap top to Japan until the problem was over. Now time to move Japanese businesses away from Communist China to more friendly other Asia countries.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Apart from what mentioned here, I believe those patrol ships are guarding their fishermen around the area and perhaps also prevent them move deeper into the disputed islands.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

On second thoughts all hell will break loose again if Japan arrests them. shoganai nippon?

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Japan will be the ultimate loser in confrontation with China.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

China wants these islands as a way of surrounding and trapping Taiwan. If Japan gives in (as the Philippines, Malaysia and Vietnam have done in their part of the sea), it will help forward China's agenda over Taiwan.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Mount the loudspeakers and turn on enka. They'll leave.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

The Chinese are waiting for some emotionally charged Captain to do something stupid. Just one slightly move, just one push to scrape the side of any Chinese ship and boom, your southern fleet is gone. I see stupid people everywhere wanting Japan to retaliate, with what? You don't think the Chinese have been preparing for this for decades? China had been preparing for a showdown against us, the US military since the first Gulf War. They saw that they can easily be defeated with their Maoist mentality and they shifted course since 1991. This Chinese PLA you are seeing is one of the most lethal one in its history. One will the will to sacrifice but with modern weapons. Especially against you guys. Our pacific navy and airforce alone might not win over the Chinese and you people want to pump a few hundred rounds at them? Are you insane?

So one wrong move from you, and its going to be a turkey shoot. They will start raining bombs and missiles in your face. Pump a few hundred rounds? Did you get your heads checked out?

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Even though the Japanese govt are squatting Diaoyu Islands at the moment with the backup of the USA, in no way will the China and Chinese people surrender the island sovereignty to Japanese side. It will remain a thorny issue unless a justified settlement can be achieved.

And why China and Chinese people are so persistent about the Diaoyu Islands (or Senkaku Island as Japanese call it)? Diaoyu Islands is the legacy issue of the past Japanese invasion to China, and it just scratches widely opened the deep cuts of the old unhealed wounds. Many posters here just put the blame to the China and Chinese people about being the monsters for keeping hatred of the past 80-year events, arguing that today's generation of Japanese have nothing to do with their predecessors' brutal aggressions while they just accept or keep silent about the revisionist versions of their past imperialist history.... and keep on occupying the Diaoyu Islands!

One is crying out loudly for peace while occupying other's property :D LoL

Some posters here use the Communist label to stigmatize all China's actions... China and Chinese people today are as Communist as the Federal Reserve is an agency of the United States government! LoL

Anyhow the Puppet Masters will be glad to see their works on another proxy war in Asia (after the current ones in ME) achieving some successes.

Wars are good for the Military-industrial complex (MIC) and banking businesses, to plunder the enormous profits, to conceal/delay the current dire economic trouble.

THE HISTORY OF THE DIAOYU ISLANDS

The Diaoyu Islands issue was settled after World War II. The United States has nonetheless managed to turn it into a complicated dispute.

The Diaoyu Islands and surrounding islets have been the inherent territory of China since ancient times, and were first discovered, named and used by the Chinese. The earliest historical record of the Diaoyu Islands can be dated back to China's Ming Dynasty about 650 years ago in a book titled "Voyage With a Tail Wind," published in 1403. The book records the first usage of "Diaoyu Islet" and "Chiwei Islet". The names refer to the current Diaoyu Islands and Chiwei Islet.

Hu Zongxian, the Zhejiang governor of the Ming Dynasty, placed the Diaoyu Islands and surrounding islets within China's maritime defense system. It demonstrates that the islands have been within China's maritime defense sphere since the Ming Dynasty. Japan claimed sovereignty during the Sino-Japanese War of 1895, seizing the islands by illegal means.

Back in 1582, the Diaoyu Islands was officially incorporated into the Chinese territory as a part of Fujian Province. Until the late Qing Dynasty, there was absolutely no ambiguity as to the ownership of the islands. For centuries the Diaoyu Islands were administered as part of Taiwan (or Formosa, as Taiwan was called before 1945).

Japan took the Liu Chiu Islands, which Japan calls Okinawa (formerly known as Ryukyu Islands), by force from China in 1874, when the Qing Dynasty (1644-1911) was invaded by several countries. The Diaoyu Islands, though, remained under the administration of Taiwan.

In 1895, as the Qing government’s defeat in the First Sino-Japanese War was all but certain, Japan illegally occupied the Diaoyu Island and its affiliated islands. After that, Japan forced the Qing government to sign the unequal Treaty of Shimonoseki and cede to Japan "the island of Formosa (Taiwan), together with all islands appertaining or belonging to the said island of Formosa". Since then, Japan incorporated the Diaoyu Islands into its territory as a part of Okinawa Prefecture.

After the end of the Second World War, China recovered the territories invaded and occupied by Japan such as Taiwan and the Penghu Islands in accordance with the Cairo Declaration and the Potsdam Proclamation. According to international law, the Diaoyu Island and its affiliated islands have already been returned to China at the end of World War II. The Japanese government accepted the terms of these documents, including one saying "that all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese, such as Manchuria, Formosa (as Taiwan was called before 1945), the Pescadores (or Penghu Islands), shall be restored to the Republic of China".

Facts are facts, and history is not to be reversed. Japan's position on the issue of the Diaoyu Island is an outright denial of the outcomes of the victory of the World Anti-Fascist War and constitutes a grave challenge to the post-war international order.

Article 2 of the Treaty of Peace with Japan, which was signed in 1951 by Japan and the allied powers, states: "Japan renounced all right, title and claim to Formosa and the Paracels." Article 4 of a separate peace treaty signed in 1952 by Japan and the Republic of China declared that ALL agreements made between Japan and China BEFORE 1941 were NULL AND VOID.

As stated above, it's perfectly logical to conclude that the Diaoyu Islands, being part of the Taiwan territories, have been returned to China.

So where do the claims to the contrary come from?

In part from an ILLEGAL TREATY the United States and Japan signed in San Francisco in 1951 in the ABSENCE of CHINA, one of the victors in the war. Article 3 of the treaty wrongly (intentionally) assigned the Diaoyu Islands and other islets to the Liu Chiu Islands, which was then under the US'* control. [THE US intentionally planted a time-bomb in the East China Sea.]*

On September 18th, 1951, then Chinese Premier and Foreign Minister Zhou Enlai made a solemn statement on behalf of the Chinese government that the Treaty of Peace with Japan signed in San Francisco was illegal and invalid, and would not be recognized without the participation and signing of the People's Republic of China.

In 1953, the United States Civil Administration of the Ryukyu Islands arbitrarily expanded its jurisdiction to include the Diaoyu Island and its affiliated islands, which are in fact Chinese territories.

In June 1971, Japan and the United States signed a pact to hand over Okinawa to Japan. The Diaoyu Islands were mapped into the handover area. China's Foreign Ministry announced on December 30th 1971 that such a move was "totally illegal" and reiterated that the Diaoyu Islands and surrounding islets were "an integral part of the Chinese territory".

After 1972, when the US handed over the Diaoyu Islands, as well as the Liu Chiu Islands, to Japan under the Okinawa Reversion Agreement, Japan once again began to administer the islets. Even so, that agreement did not and could not recognize Japan's control over the islands. The country is now trying to use its "nationalization" plan to pretend it has sovereignty over the Diaoyu Islands.

The principle of "shelving disputes and seeking common development" set forth by former Chinese leader Deng Xiaoping in 1979 has been the basic rule for China and Japan to handle the Diaoyu Islands dispute in the past 30 years. Both countries claimed sovereignty over the islands while waiting for an appropriate time to resolve the dispute, and neither country will make concessions in this regard.

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

@Qomolangma

What your beloved little China has done and continues to do to its own people is far worse than any of the atrocities China has faced from foreign invaders.

If anything, China has a far worse track record for plundering and pillaging.

But I forget, they did away with all the smart and educated when the cultural revolution came around.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Tokiyo, looks your your "smart and educated" society in Japan didn't successfully make your economy stronger independent of China.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

@CVHuan

Don't put words in my mouth I never said anything about Japan's "smart and educated" society.

I was merely pointing out that the argument over the invasion of Japan into China has been played to excess when many worse things are happening domestically.

Plus, what you are mentioning has nothing to do with my argument. So you've got a strong economy, again not the point I was making.

Though, you may have just proven my original argument. Thank you.

1 ( +6 / -5 )

Japan should threaten to deploy AKB48 to the islands, although that could be interpreted as scorched earth....

6 ( +8 / -2 )

Qomolangma, when you write something like this: "Japan took the Liu Chiu Islands, which Japan calls Okinawa (formerly known as Ryukyu Islands), by force from China in 1874, when the Qing Dynasty (1644-1911) was invaded by several countries." ... then you send a clear message that China will be demanding Okinawa next.

The Japanese-speaking people of Okinawa subconsciously see themselves as citizens of an independent Kingdom of Ryukyu (or Liu Chiu), and just having an alternative Chinese-sounding name does not make them want to go back to being part of some ancient Chinese province.

Many Japanese expect that if they give way once, they will have to give way again and again. Some Japanese friends have even told me that many Chinese see Japan itself as historically part of China. A case could probably be made, joking aside.

The question for Japan thus becomes, where and when do they put their foot down; at what point does the old fighting spirit return?

In the meantime they and the the world await the judgment of the international court.

We ask why, after years and years of silence, of nothing, the Chinese have suddenly become so active and interested in this issue, and why they seem too impatient to even wait for the independent arbitration that they have agreed to.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

@nandakandamanda!

Both Japan and China has been very quiet about dispute since 1971. Since 2009, that issue becoming hot. It was not entirely fault from both. One nation has secretly pushed behind from Japan to settle it sooner than later! Reality is later is better than sooner! Sudden outburst from China is consequence of impatience.

China waited HK for 100 years. They may wait that isles for ten thousand years. Without provocation, they will not get angry. It TAKES TWO TO DANCE TANGO!

0 ( +1 / -1 )

China didnt even try to out bid Japan???? hmmmmmm

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Easy response, put a few rounds in front of them and watch them run!

Yes, spoken like a "heiwa" loving Japanese national who lives outside of Japan who expects the US to comer running and protect whenever she demands it. Though wants the US out What a joke.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

I agree with Molenir. If Japan isn't going to even try and defend them, what's the point? At the very least they should arrest the people on the boats and bring them back to Tokyo for trial.

Arrest them for what? Surveying? Foreign ships go into territorial waters on a fairly regular basis (and Chinese fishermen are still fishing these waters). All of this drama plays well in the media room, but on location, it is really just business as usual. China is making many claims, it is talking big, but as far as actual action...lot of barking, but no biting as of yet. Notice how, even with all the reports of damage, looting, and destruction of Japanese businesses, there haven't been any Japanese companies writing off China assets as a loss yet? Again, it looks flashy on TV, and yes, you feel it in the pocketbook, but when all is said and done, these business can be back up to full production in a very small amount of time.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The Chinese are playing a dangerous game.

One wrong move, one scrape, and the fourth largest navy on the planet will make efforts and send the shops of the plundering communist Chinese navy to the bottom.

Maybe the Chinese will whip out the Vorag - their shiny new 30-year-old heap of Falklands-era junk?

Hope they've already pre-designated it as a diving attraction because that's what it'll become soon enough.

Moreover, the JSDF should immediately order “rights defense” patrols around the Senkakus and right off the coast of Beijing. These patrols would comprise JCG vessels blaring what will be the unstoppable force of AKB48, enka, and the right wing nationalist sound trucks dudes all mixed up on an IPhone 5 made at Foxcon.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@ Tokiyo

Chinese people take the internal struggles and external aggressions quite differently. I believe such differentiation treatment is not just limited to Chinese people but quite a normal practice across the many nations. Don't try to blur the Jap past brutal aggression toward China with the failed experiment of the Mao's Great Leap (aka. the Cultural Revolution), the biggest social engineering ever tried by the mankind. Whatever happened with the Mao's Cultural Revolution, or the civil war between the Kuomintang and the CCP does not alleviate the capital sins inflicted by the Japanese Imperialist forces upon Chinese people. Chinese people definitely detest any foreign meddling into their domestic affairs, incl. the cross-strait relationship! Needless to say about the naked aggression and occupation by any external force, they already underwent the very long bitterness and suffering related to those foreign's aggressions and occupations as did happen repeatedly from the 19th Century till around WW2 period.

Chinese people may forgive but they shouldn't forget such atrocities! Today's generation of Japs may claim they've nothing to do with their predecessors' brutalities, but what do they do toward the revisionist versions of the history about their fascist regime? What about their public official's (cabinet ministers or even premier) paying homage to Tokyo's Yasukuni Shrine, which honors Japan's war dead, including some convicted of major war crimes? And of course, occupying one's loot of the past war.

Now they're crying wolf about peace while explicitly or implicitly supporting those acts... What do you expect the Chinese people worldwide, not only in the mainland, to feel and react???

It's quite easy to preach 'forget', 'forgive', 'peace' when you are NOT the victims and instead belong to the invader, and while holding proudly the loot of the past... those people are simply playing with fire !!

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

@ nandakandamanda,

"Japan took the Liu Chiu Islands, which Japan calls Okinawa (formerly known as Ryukyu Islands), by force from China in 1874, when the Qing Dynasty (1644-1911) was invaded by several countries." ... then you send a clear message that China will be demanding Okinawa next.

That's your own interpretation. Did you ever hear that China put forward the claim on Okinawa???

"We ask why, after years and years of silence, of nothing, the Chinese have suddenly become so active"

Some posters intentionally overlooked these obvious facts.... (or possibly they're just too dumb to learn any essential & real history lesson??)

1) After the Japanese unconditional surrender & the 1951 treaty which gave control of the islands to the American, China was soon embroiled in another civil war between the Kuomintang vs CPC until the Communists emerged victorious & in control of the country.

Note: the so-called "San Francisco Treaty" signed solely between the United States and Japan in 1951, was signed in the ABSENCE of China, one of the victors of the World Anti-Fascist War and constitutes a grave challenge to the post-war international order. Article 3 of the treaty wrongly (INTENTIONALLY) assigned the Diaoyu Islands and other islets to the Liu Chiu Islands (at present days known as Okinawa Islands, formerly a.k.a. as Ryukyu Islands), which was then under the US’ control. China has NEVER recognized "the San Francisco Treaty".

2) Not soon after that, came the proxy wars that were fought in Korea & Vietnam where Red China along with the USSR were involved directly in helping their Communist brothers in their fights against Western imperialism.

3) Then came a period of a Cold War between the Liberal Capitalism world & Communism.

4) Until the 1970s, the United States recognized the Republic of China on Taiwan as the legitimate government of mainland China and did not maintain diplomatic relations with the Communist regime of the People's Republic of China. In the midst of the Cold War, the Sino-Soviet split provided an opening for the U.S. to establish ties with mainland China and establish it as a counter to the Soviet Union, at which both the US & China finally established diplomatic relation in Jan 1st 1979.

5) That was after the little great man called Deng Xiaoping first opened out China to the world of capitalism in 1978.

So, it must be noted that the US handed over the islands to Japan, its ally, in 1972, right at that time.....

a) When China was still in a period of Cold War with the Americans.

b) When China was still a backward & impoverished nation, it was simply too weak to defend itself and was in no way a respectable country. Now China is a very strong nation, it decides now is the right time to care about it.

c) At that time the leaders of Taiwan were too weak and too dependent thus in no position to question what the Supercop was doing.

Above reasons partly explained why both China & Taiwan didn't take any action during that period.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

I'm not eating another bite of Gyoza or ramen till this is resolved. Oh, and we're keeping your pandas!!!!!!

6 ( +7 / -1 )

YuriOtani: "Easy response, put a few rounds in front of them and watch them run!"

Yuri's banging on the war drums again. Seriously, Yuri, you want Japan to go down in history as starting (another) war? Firing even warning shots would put things perilously closer, and it would be Japan's fault. Shout at the boats, and then just ignore them. They're not going to do anything unless provoked.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

Japan is forbidden from taking military shots

You Japanophiles are pretty funny. You seem to inhabit a fantasy world.

On December 22, 2001, Japan Coast Guard ships intercepted a Chinese-flagged vessel believed to be North Korean in origin, in the Japanese Exclusive Economic Zone between Kyushu and China. When the vessel failed to respond, she was fired upon by the JCG and an exchange of gunfire resulted. The unidentified vessel sank in the Chinese EEZ with all hands.

The wreck and its contents were put on display at the Japanese Coast Guard Museum at Yokohama. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Coast_Guard)

It should be noted that afterward, the JCG's offices were flooded in faxes from the Japanese public, congratulating them.

-10 ( +3 / -13 )

Japanese Vice Foreign Minister Chikao Kawai visit China on Monday discuss Sino-Japanese relations with Chinese. The maritime pressure exerted by Chinese maritime survillence and fisheries department has made the Japanese government bend down and willing to talk! Noda's time is running out he understood his days in PM office is running out! The JCG shall never shooting at Chinese government ships, China is no North Korea and the consequence is beyond any countries might afford!

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Perhaps Japan whether they sit back and moan about this or move and enforced is screwed either way. They don't move China gains momentum for any other dispute they have with anyone in Asia. They do move China gains the response they want to test their military might.

Japan I believe will escalate things by trying to save face nationally and internationally . China obviously doesn't care what the world thinks ..but may not like where everything goes once USA is forced into another defend another country mode.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Above reasons partly explained why both China & Taiwan didn't take any action during that period.

Not being able to take action is one thing. Utterly and completely ignoring the islands, not mentioning them at all (ever), not correcting your own country's newspaper when it refers to the islands as Taiwanese...that's another level entirely. Call it abandonment, call it squatter's rights, call it Terra Nulus, when all is said and done, if China ever had a claim, it doesn't have one now.

You can give all the reasons you want for how China was such a busy little beaver that it simply couldn't find the time to jot out a quick note to the rest of the world, but the simple fact of the matter is that China's very first official claim (not even action, just a plain old claim) to the islands wasn't till they announced the possible resources there.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The history of China is claiming others always.. the demands goes like this." My is mine and yours also mine" And speak loud that I am the most peaceful person in the world. China claiming Indias Kashmir and took 30% of that land in 1972. China is claiming Arunchal pradesh of India. China is claiming Sikkim of India... They stopped aggression after India became nuclear and tested the missiles. Now China is claiming Islands of all near by countries.. And they are very good at making the history... SOON YOU WILL SEE THAT A RECORD COMING UP THAT MING DYNASTY WAS RULING ALL ASIA AND PART OF CANADA and AUSTRALIA... May be some other dynasty in 10000 BC...

5 ( +5 / -0 )

cabadaje

Arrest them for what? Surveying? Foreign ships go into territorial waters on a fairly regular basis

Yes. First of all surveying by a foreign entitiy without permmision within territorial waters is a large violation of international law and can also be considered as provacation of war since mapping of ocean floor is the first thing needed in navigating within uncharted waters. Second when foreign ships transit within other nation's territorial water they need to request permission to the local authority and given strict instruction the route like a road in the middle of the ocean.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

I can't decide if I dislike the Chinese or the Japanese right now. But if Japan shoots at those ships, you can bet you'll be facing the Chinese armada next. Is Japan ready for that? Japan can do one thing though, without losing too many ships. As for China, it wouldn't look good if they got into a fight with Japan. China's best bet is to just cut diplomatic relations with China, and totally isolate Japan. It won't be no time before Japan comes back crawling with the keys to the island.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

Smith in Japan, what would Canada do if this would happen to one of their islands? They know if they wait too long the island is lost.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

First of all, Canada wouldn't be in that situation, taking territory which is not theirs. Second, Japan should get out of territory which doesn't belong to them. It's been a bad habit for Japan to invade other countries.

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

I see no conflict of interest for China and Japan in the prosperous Asia. The oil resources can't be utilized if the disputes persist, there is no benefit for the people in both countries if a war breaks out. Don't be fooled by the politicians .

0 ( +2 / -2 )

YuriOtani: They would resolve it peacefully with their neighbours. And anyway, there ARE actually some rather low-key island disputes between Canada, the US, and even Denmark. I think even Russia claims certain rights to areas around Canada's northern islands where gas fields may exist deep under the ice. I believe the one between Canada and Denmark is called Hans island -- some rock in the middle of nowhere, and the one with the US (well, one a few actually), is the Machias Seal Island. I forget exactly where the former is, but I think somewhere between Greenland and Nunavut's eastern edge, and the latter is on the Eastern border somewhere where the US ends and Canada begins.

Point is just that when have you ever heard them blow out of control or send ships to defend them? May have happened, but not like things are happening here. Those nations all claim the islands in the various disputes -- we don't go to war over them. Nor do we BEG for war over them, as you seem to be doing here.

As for the 'wait too long' thing, if Japan had only continued waiting as it has been and Ishihara not start this whole increase in tensions with his announcement to buy the islands, time would have been on JAPAN'S side, not China's. Now it's more than ever in question, with China posing a very real military threat Japan could never hope to control. It's the same with Dokdo as well; Japan can keep asking South Korea to go to the ICJ until the cows come home, but as long as SK says there is no dispute and refuses to go, and lives on and administers the islands, they become more and more theres every day.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

That's "theirs" at the end there, sorry.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

It's not just Ishihara who have been guilty of stoking fire.

Noda: 'there is no war criminal in Yasukuni Shrine'

Noda deliberately chose sensitive historic anniversaries to provoke China. The announcement of the island nationalization plan was made on July 7, on the anniversary of Marco Polo Bridge Incident day. Noda then officially nationalized the islands on the 10th September, Manchurian Incident day. Why pick these dates to further inflame the Chinese?

The Chinese president Hu-Jintao warned Noda at the APEC meeting that not to nationalize the island, yet the very next day, Japan ignored the warning(s).

Not to mention the mayor of Osaka who said the WWII comfort women were all prostitutes. The list goes on and on, with Japanese politicans pouring oil over the fire.

I really don't blame China's anger. But they really should stop burning and looting their own cities.

-5 ( +5 / -10 )

Time to remove Article 9 of the Constitution and take action against these thugs!

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

You can't live in peace if the other side is so desperate for a war! Japan should explore all diplomatic options but must prepare for the worst, war. It seems that the writing is already on the wall .It is very sad to see that a country with old civilisation like China just want to fight so much to expand its territory these days.Xinjiang, Tibet, Paracel islands, Spratly islands, Taiwan ,Senkaku.... i

0 ( +1 / -1 )

actually japan always failed in diplomatic activities measurement since world war 2, if u will feed milk to black cobra they will never become your friends but must be bite u when one day u will not feed milk cobra, so japan needs to first correct diplomatic relationship with other countries who is japans enemy, second need to start take first step by solving trade problems with enemy countries and as possible less involvement in business. its better to focus on friend countries than enemy not matter if u earning more from enemy cause one day ur enemy must bite u if they hurt by u. in current situation china is more aggressive and usa is country that always think about own interest, lots of peoples think that usa is friendly country of japan its totally false cause its not possible ur enemy can be ur friend, if they showing some friendly emotions that means they saw profit on u whenever profit finish will bite u, so there is two things usa is not so good economically now as they are shocked with economic slowdown and busy solving that prob its very hard at that when war happens between china and japan us will be involved against china, history always teach u which is ur friend and which is ur enemy but japan failed to understand that, thats the prob, for example if u are going to kill a tiger u must prepare well and sure there is no another tiger to attack so u can kill the tiger and back home safe, but for japan they invaded china in world war 2 and when chiense try to make friendship with them with vision of revenge they didnot understand the china's trap, now when they understand they are facing a elephant in front of them that want to kill them. time is going and its time to understand the situation and take action as time need. finally there is one hope for japan and they can do best if they will wake from now and make good policies keeping future in mind. i love japan but also sad cause of current situation of japan as they didnot learn anything from history.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

The JP coast guard cutter should have put a shot across the bow. If the PRC boats persist, the JP coast guard need to put a round into her bow and take them into custody.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

After Japan created this mess by nationalize these Islands and this is merely China's reaction to it.

This is just the way of China showing that it have the will, resolve and power(although these ships are unarmed) to reaffirming its claim to the islands.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

HikozaemonSEP. 24, 2012 - 04:15PM JST Japan should threaten to deploy AKB48 to the islands, although that could be interpreted as scorched earth....

Yes I think this will actually work. Send AKB48 and Funky Monkey Babies as backup, should do the trick

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Japan & China have been neighbours for thousands of years; during most of those centuries China had been the bigger, stronger nation. It was only during Yuan Dynasty that Kublai Khan attempted an invasion of Japan, so Han Chinese had largely stick to the continent demonstrating little interest in Japanese territory, so why would China want to attack Japan now when it is fast becoming a developed country enjoying the fruits of peace?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Japan will stay cool and make China look like a fool.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

In accordance with international law, Japan has the right to use force to defend its claimed territory.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

SMithinJapan has it right: China and ROK need to take their dispute to the ICJ. Since they will lose there, they don't. In short, China and Korea do not want a resolution to the 'dispute."

But hold on there: Japan is just as guilty in re: the Sakalin and the Kuriles.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

But hold on there: Japan is just as guilty in re: the Sakalin and the Kuriles.

How so?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Now, is the most dangerous time. Both leaders are busy, you have vice's running both countries this very moment. One slight miscalculation and BAM. Let's keep our eyes open, things could get a little dicey on the high seas very soon, and both countries would be none the worse on the account of both leaderships being in transition. Let's work something out here nations, the world is watching. Peace.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

smithinjapan, so what should Japan do just meekly watch as the Red Chinese take control of the islands. Then once that happens Japan would be the "aggressor". As more and more Chinese arrive around those islands soon they will land ground troops and order Japanese ships to leave. If they do not leave then the mighty Chinese fleet will arrive to take them. Then the Self Defense force would have to become involved. Either that or Japan meekly surrenders the islands and the Red Chinese will proclaim total victory.

Now that they have experience success against the evil ones with increased appetite will look to the south east. Look the Ryukyu Island chain. These islands have been Chinese since recorded time. The American transfer to Japan was illegal. Next step is Red China will demand these islands. The people of Okinawa will NEVER accept Chinese rule.

So one more time, the pm needs to drive the Chinese ships from these islands or risk total defeat.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

I see the Pro China lobby is at work again, trying to use propaganda cloaked as "history" in an sad attempt to support China being a bully in the modern Pacific. The past is the past, but the Present is where we live now. Japan bought the islands form their legal owner. China policy of placing claims to anywhere they want to control and then daring anyone to try to stop them is reminiscent of the worst of imperialist tactics. It wont work any more we have the UN and sensible modern governments, including Japan who do not base their nations and their policies on force and threats.

what China is saying now: “In recent days, Japan has constantly provoked incidents concerning the Diaoyu islands issue, gravely violating China’s territorial sovereignty,” China’s Xinhua news agency said.

ha

Well sorry you got the name of the islands wrong. and it is NOT sovereign Chinese territory at all, so what you are saying is wrong also. Japan is defending its legal rights under international law and Law of the Sea.

Posting long and detailed posts trying to justify aggression as historic is just empty. Different opinions are just that, opinions, not fact.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Don't be naive... protest as much as you want but do you think China will listen. Naaahhhh ! They got you by the balls when you surrender that fisherman who intentionally rammed his fishing boat to a Japanese Coast guard vessel and you even paid the damaged to his fishing boat. USA can't do anything about China's bully attitude now. USA owes China billions of dollars. Even Panetta commented the feud can start a war. Oopppsss armamnets are USA number one business. IMO

0 ( +0 / -0 )

How about this postings.....is there any truth in it? You judge...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnlr_OBN2uw&feature=share

0 ( +0 / -0 )

In response to Qomolongma's dissertation about China's hegemony over the seas and territories surrounding the Chinese mainland, I find that position very interesting. China also claimed Vietnam and parts of other South East Asian countries at one or more times in the past. The claim about Okinawa is also of interest. I would like to be enlightened about Tibet. Was it once a Chinese territory? Is that how China intends to administer all of its territorial acquisitions in the future?....Because I'm pretty sure that there will be new additions to China's borders. Is it good or bad from the perspective of China's emerging middle class?

0 ( +1 / -1 )

People, you have to look at the big picture. If China gets these islands, nothing will stop them from taking Taiwan by force, the islands around Vietnam, Malaysia, and Brunei. It is an exercise to see whether the world will do anything to stop them.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

smithinjapan, so what should Japan do just meekly watch as the Red Chinese take control of the islands.

Should have thought about that before Japan mouths off at China and nationalized the island. Now you have no choice but to leave, or face the Chinese navy armada. This is Japan's own choice that they got into this mess.

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Should have thought about that before Japan mouths off at China and nationalized the island. Now you have no choice but to leave, or face the Chinese navy armada. This is Japan's own choice that they got into this mess.

Sorry Chucky. The decision to "nationalize" it came from the current owners of the property. He got the best Yen out of the deal. So I guess we can blame it on the current owner.

In any case, it goes to show you that China will always come up with something to protest about for it's their OWN fault that they deceived their brainwashed citizens into believing that they were the ones administering the islands.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Chinese marine surveillance ship Haijian No. 51 is not a destroyer, it appears their just looking around. Japan stand fast, be on your guard. Chinese surveillance ship Haijian No. 66 is also not a war ship. Belay the gun's for now. Continue to maritime prosecute with verbal commands. Do not leave your post. China posturing for responce. Again stand fast.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

With the China problem, Japan should become increasingly open to expanding economic ties with Russia despite the territorial dispute, removing another incentive for Russia to make major concessions. Russians can challenge Japan aggressively regarding the islands and still secure considerable Japanese investment and commerce. In the long term, one would expect the Japanese to make the most concessions, since China's continuing rise presents a greater threat to Japan's interests. In addition, better ties between Russia and Japan might prove to be important for near future geopolitical realignment that sees Russia adopt a more guarded approach to China. Until such a softening occurs on the Japanese side, Russia has little incentive to change its approach to the island dispute, and many reasons to maintain its tougher stance.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

nigelboySep. 25, 2012 - 03:31AM JST The decision to "nationalize" it came from the current owners of the property. He got the best Yen out of the deal. So I guess we can blame it on the current owner.

No. It takes two to agree. If any of the J-goverment had any common sense, which they don't, they should've stayed out it and leave it alone. These J-goverment reps should be fired and let them go into unemployment line for the mess that they caused. They don't represent the people of Japan.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

peanut666Sep. 25, 2012 - 03:16AM JST People, you have to look at the big picture. If China gets these islands, nothing will stop them from taking Taiwan by force, the islands around Vietnam, Malaysia, and Brunei. It is an exercise to see whether the world will do anything to stop them.

Japan does not need to negotiate with China at all. If any forceful invasion by China occurs in Senkaku, the Article 5 of U.S. Japan agreement is valid. China will lose credibility with the international community. I don't believe China wants to get into direct confrontation with U.S. Let China test the treaty.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

No. It takes two to agree. If any of the J-goverment had any common sense, which they don't, they should've stayed out it and leave it alone. These J-goverment reps should be fired and let them go into unemployment line for the mess that they caused. They don't represent the people of Japan.

That would then be the Metropolitan government of Tokyo purchasing them.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

The claim about Okinawa is also of interest.

China did propose to the US a joint occupation/ administration of the Ryukyus with an eye for future independence from Japan during the Cairo Conference in 1943. And President Roosevelt did not seem to oppose the idea then.

From disclosed US document:

"During a private dinner with the Chiangs on the evening of November 23, President Roosevelt asked Chiang China's intentions regarding the Ryukyu Islands. According to the memorandum written by the Chinese side (Roosevelt's special assistant Harry Hopkins was present but did not apparently take notes), "The President referred to the question of the Ryukyu Islands and enquired more than once whether China would want the Ryukyus." To this, Chiang reportedly replied that "China would be agreeable to joint occupation of the Ryukyus by China and the United States and, eventually, joint administration by the two countries under the trusteeship of an international organization.""

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

China would be agreeable to joint occupation of the Ryukyus by China and the United States and, eventually, joint administration by the two countries under the trusteeship of an international organization.

And that's probably the origin of the UN trusteeship which covers the islands in dispute according to Article 3 of the San Francisco Peace Treaty:

"Japan will concur in any proposal of the United States to the United Nations to place under its trusteeship system, with the United States as the sole administering authority, Nansei Shoto south of 29deg. north latitude (including the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands).... Pending the making of such a proposal and affirmative action thereon, the United States will have the right to exercise all and any powers of administration, legislation and jurisdiction over the territory and inhabitants of these islands, including their territorial waters."

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Japan will concur in any proposal of the United States to the United Nations to place under its trusteeship system, with the United States as the sole administering authority, Nansei Shoto south of 29deg. north latitude (including the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands)....

And Japan did cede the Ryukyu islands and Diaoyu islands according to the San Francisco Peace Treaty. As a result, the Ryukyu islands and Diaoyu islands were regarded as foreign lands to the Japanese between 1945 to 1971. And Japanese who visited these islands during that period must have their Japanese passport stamped at the Ryukyu immigration. Older generations of Japanese who lived through that period such as chamkun can testify to this fact.

And that is the reason why the Diaoyu islands and Ryukyu islands can't even be found in any map of Japan either published in Japan or other nations in the world between 1945 to 1971 such as these:

http://retromaps.tumblr.com/image/30107477891

http://anu.academia.edu/PedroIacobelli/Papers/1167733/Orientalism_Mass_Culture_and_the_US_Administration_in_Okinawa

US map of 1945 showing Ryukyu Islands as not belonging to any country

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

US map of 1945 showing Ryukyu Islands as not belonging to any country

However, things started to change in 1954 when President Eisenhower made it clear in his State of Union Message that the U.S. intended to keep the Ryukyus/ Okinawa for an unlimited period of time:

"We shall maintain indefinitely our bases in Okinawa. I shall ask the Congress to authorize continued material assistance to hasten the successful con-clusion of the struggle in Indo-china. This assistance will also bring closer the day when the Associated States may enjoy the independence already assured by France. We shall also continue military and economic aid to the Nationalist Government of China."

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Guru29

What your point? Agreement between Japan and the United States of America Concerning the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands states "reversion=returning to a former state" on the islands.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Better for Japan in not getting into any agreement with China. If Japan gets into island agreement and offshore drilling agreement with China, they will lose all the leverage. For Chinese goverment, a contract is considered a draft subject to change. Chinese goverment may agree on a deal and then change their minds. A signed contract is not binding for Chinese and does not mean negotiations will end. If you have a contract agreement with Chinese goverment, they will take over the East China Seas and make their own rules. Japan probably has to stay out because of assertive Chinese military presence. Contract with China is worthless.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

"we shall defend our Island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!" Winston Churchill June 1940 speech. Chucky, Red China would of found another excuse.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Agreement between Japan and the United States of America Concerning the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands states "reversion=returning to a former state" on the islands.

According to Article 3 of the San Francisco Peace Treaty, the UN trusteeship is to be solely administered by the US with no sovereignty attached. A change of the administration body (with no sovereignty attached) must therefore be approved by the UN too.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

I still don't understand your point Guru29. What you are basically doing is copy/pasting articles relating to Okinawa but despite your many postings, you have not provided a single convincing argument that Senkaku, in particular, belongs to China.

"Considering further that Japan is willing to assume full responsibility and authority for the exercise of all powers of administration, Legislation and jurisdiction over the territory and inhabitants of the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands;"

Almost exact words used also in Article 3 of the Peace Treaty. Sounds like "soverignty" to me.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

According to Article 3 of the San Francisco Peace Treaty, the UN trusteeship is to be solely administered by the US with no sovereignty attached

Not just administration. "the right to exercise all and any powers of administration, legislation and jurisdiction over the territory and inhabitants "

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Almost exact words used also in Article 3 of the Peace Treaty. Sounds like "soverignty" to me.

As I said, that's called "administration rights (with no sovereignty attached)" under the UN trusteeship as stated in Article 3 of the San Francisco Peace Treaty.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Guru29.

Perhaps you need to look up the definition of sovereignty.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Guru29 Sep. 25, 2012 - 05:21AM JST As I said, that's called "administration rights (with no sovereignty attached)" under the UN trusteeship as stated in Article 3 of the San Francisco Peace Treaty.

Doesn't matter. China did not sign the San Francisco Peace Treaty. China does not recognize this treaty.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

China did not sign the San Francisco Peace Treaty. China does not recognize this treaty.

China does not recognize the San Francisco Peace Treaty since it is not a signatory of the treaty. However, China does recognize the Potsdam Agreement which is the primary peace treaty in east Asia. And regarding this issue, the principles of the San Francisco Peace Treaty aren't very different from the Potsdam Agreement which says "The terms of the Cairo Declaration shall be carried out and Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku and such minor islands as we determine."

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Guru29 Sep. 25, 2012 - 05:37AM JST China does recognize the Potsdam Agreement which is the primary peace treaty in east Asia.

Are you sure? In the Potsdam Agreement, Chiang Kai-shek, Chairman of the Nationalist Government of China issued the Potsdam Declaration which outlined the terms of surrender for Japan during World War II in Asia. However, he fled to Foremosa in 1949. So how does Mao's communist goverment recognize the Potsdam Agreement? They are different goverment.

T

2 ( +2 / -0 )

@qomolangma

The Ryukyu (Lew Chew) Archipelago Kingdom was a flourishing and peaceful INDEPENDENT Naval Empire with at its head Sho-dynasty (1400-1879) Kings located in Shuri (part of Naha in Okinawa Honto, Japan nowadays) with its beautiful Shuri-Jo castle (= UNESCO World Heritage Site), and were trading flourishly between Ming/Qing dynasties, Shogunate Japan (especially Satsuma domain under Shimadzu-clan), Korean dynasties and South-East Asian Dynasties. Ryukyu's Naval Ships were far bigger then those of Columbus/Amerigo Vespucci/Pizarro/Cortez had in their occupation of the Incas, Aztecs, Mayas,... almost comparible with Ming Admiral ZhengHe's fleet.

The Senkaku islands were the southern part of that flourishing Ryukyu Archipelago Kingdom, that became part of the Japanese Meiji Empire in 1879 when the Sho-dynasty Kings were forcifully moved to Tokyo. It is true that before 1879 the Ryukyu Archipelago Kingdom payed tribute or taxes to the Ming/Qing dynasty Emperors (as did many Korean and South-East-Asian Empires, like the Majapahit Kingdom of what is now part of Indonesia), but also to the Satsuma Domain (Shimadzu-clan). During the 19th century the Qing Empire was very weak and lost first to the modernized Satsuma Domain with its Western-style factories, but then also to the scientifically modernized Japanese Meiji Empire, leading to what the Chinese nowadays call the 'unjust' treaty of Shimonoseki (Taiwan, Liaodong Peninsula and Penghu islands also became part of the Meiji Empire). The Meiji Empire of Japan was scientifically and technologically more advanced than the feudal Chinese Qing Dynasty, and many Chinese intellectuels studied in Japan at that time like Dr. Sun Yat-Sen ! No matter in what kind of Law or Treaty you are looking at (this is stuff for international lawyers who try to explain the laws according which country they serve !), the Senkaku islands NATURALLY belong to Ryukyu and Ryukyu now belongs to Post-WWII Japan !

1 ( +1 / -0 )

China can complain. Hahahahaha

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

gregoryharuko Sep. 25, 2012 - 06:19AM JST The Senkaku islands were the southern part of that flourishing Ryukyu Archipelago Kingdom, that became part of the Japanese Meiji Empire in 1879 when the Sho-dynasty Kings were forcifully moved to Tokyo.the Senkaku islands NATURALLY belong to Ryukyu and Ryukyu now belongs to Post-WWII Japan !

Why would Japan embark on a non-viable survey for ten years to determine without any doubt that Diaoyu was terra nullius? If, as Japan claims, the ten years spent surveying the islands would mean they were likely to encounter Chinese fisherman taking shelter there in a storm and not actually terra nullius, would Japan have accepted that the islands were visited by Chinese fishermen? Then why Japan did not lay claim to Diaoyu/Senkaku Islands before 1894 the year Japan vanquished Qing China’s navy? Why wait until 1896 after Japan forced an unequal Treaty of Shimonoseki on China in 1895 to pass an imperial decree to make Diaoyu a Japanese territory? Surely it is obvious that Japan had not surveyed Diaoyu/Senkaku Islands to verify that it is no man’s land or uninhabited, because Japan could not as Japan knew the islands belong to China.

That accounts why Japan could not claim to discover the islands unless by outright war of conquest, which Japan did in 1894, and issued an imperial decree in 1896 to make Diaoyu a part of the Japanese Empire after the 1895 Treaty of Shimonoseki. Thus it would appear to me Japan is disingenuous, as Japan well knew long before her 1894 defeat of China, the Senkaku Islands were named as Diaoyu, a fishing platform for Chinese fishermen to take refuge in storms and route markers. To say Japan surveyed ten years the islands she called Senkaku Islands was a pretence Japan did not hear of the name Diaoyu used by China centuries before Japan called it Senkaku Islands.

The truth is very much lacking from Japan. To claim terra nullius is to say no one ever lived there before, and at the point of time, the discovery was made. Thus, having ‘proved’ terra nullius, Japan purported to land in Diaoyu and claims it as a discovery. That was what precisely Japan trying to legitimise their theft and answerable to no one with what is suspiciously a big lie.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands always belonged to the Ryukyu Kingdom ! The weakend Qing Dynasty was NOT INTERESTED in those Senkaku/Diaoyu islands and the Ryukyu archipelago as a whole (and was even NOT INTERESTED in Taiwan), and did not bother what happened to the Ryukyu's Sho-Dynasty Kings when they were moved to Tokyo in 1879 ! The snobbish Qing-dynasty considered Ryukyu and Taiwan as islands for Pirates and other "inferior" people !

0 ( +0 / -0 )

gregoryharukoSep. 25, 2012 - 06:42AM JST The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands always belonged to the Ryukyu Kingdom !

Where is your proof?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands always belonged to the Ryukyu Kingdom ! Where is your proof?

They weren't.

http://www.japanfocus.org/-Koji-Taira/2119

The China-Japan Clash Over the Diaoyu/Senkaku Islands

"The acknowledged boundary between China and Ryukyu until the demise of the Ryukyu Kingdom was somewhere in the sea east and south of the Diaoyu Islands (west and north of the Ryukyu Islands). This Sino-Ryukyuan boundary became a Sino-Japanese boundary when Japan took over Ryukyu and proclaimed it Okinawa Prefecture in 1879."

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

So how does Mao's communist goverment recognize the Potsdam Agreement?

PRC did replace ROC in the UN. And you don't have to be a signatory to recognize an agreement.

For your info, the 1972 PRC-Japan treaty signed in Beijing even includes a clause for the Potsdam Agreement which says "The Government of Japan fully understands and respects this stand of the Government of the People's Republic of China, and it firmly maintains its stand under Article 8 of the Potsdam Proclamation."

And Article 8 of the Potsdam Proclamation says:

"The terms of the Cairo Declaration shall be carried out and Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku and such minor islands as we determine."

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Why would Japan embark on a non-viable survey for ten years to determine without any doubt that Diaoyu was terra nullius

Nicholas D. Kristof, a New York Times columnist and his friend have unearthed plenty of evidence to prove that the so called terra nullius is just a lie.

http://kristof.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/19/the-inconvenient-truth-behind-the-diaoyusenkaku-islands/

The right to know is the bedrock of every democracy. The Japanese public deserves to know the other side of the story. It is the politicians who flame public sentiments under the name of national interests who pose the greatest risk, not the islands themselves."

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

@sfjp330

The Ryukyu Kingdom was considered by the mighty Ming Dynasty as an intermediate state, as a "bridge to various kingdoms", as can be seen on their famous bell, hung in Shuri-Jo castle. Taiwan had the same status during the mighty Ming Dynasty with the Hokkien/Fujian people also playing an important role in this trade. During the Qing dynasty the snobbish Chinese Court LOST INTEREST in these "Pirates" (they were MORE INTERESTED in building summer palaces instead of funding a Chinese fleet !). It was at this time that the Satsuma Domain and later the Meiji Empire saw the importance of these islands and abducted the Sho-Dynasty Kings in 1879 to Tokyo, and as a result the whole archipelago became part of the Japanese Meiji Empire !

0 ( +0 / -0 )

That accounts why Japan could not claim to discover the islands unless by outright war of conquest, which Japan did in 1894

You are right on this. More evidence can be found in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Republic of China website.

http://www.mofa.gov.tw/official/Home/Detail/4ad52054-ebc7-452c-a6c1-d182b25c8001?arfid=2b7802ba-d5e8-4538-9ec2-4eb818179015&opno=027ffe58-09dd-4b7c-a554-99def06b00a1

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Guru29 Why don't you stop copy/paste and come up with your own words.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Guru29 Why don't you stop copy/paste and come up with your own words.

Didn't you say you want to see evidence?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

No. It takes two to agree. If any of the J-goverment had any common sense, which they don't, they should've stayed out it and leave it alone. These J-goverment reps should be fired and let them go into unemployment line for the mess that they caused. They don't represent the people of Japan.

The purchase of the islands by the Japanese government was an attempt to de-escalate the issue. If the Japanese government had not purchased the islands, Tokyo, meaning Ishitara, would have, and frankly, Ishitara would not have shut up about it. If the Japanese government had not purchased the island, then you would have seen some honest to goodness "provocation". Buying something to shut up the obnoxious guy and staying quiet about it is the exact opposite of provocation.

Why would Japan embark on a non-viable survey for ten years to determine without any doubt that Diaoyu was terra nullius

Because that is what responsible people do prior to purchasing property? Confirm that they are doing so legally. In the business world, we call it "Due Diligence".

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Readers, you are going around in circles.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The purchase of the islands by the Japanese government was an attempt to de-escalate the issue.

Disagree.

To do that, they just need to tell the truth that the ownership is bogus.

There is absolutely no need to buy land from a bogus owner as any private ownership would have been rendered null and void in 1945 when Japan lost the war and gave up its sovereignty over the Ryukyu islands and Diaoyu islands according to the Potsdam Agreement and subsequently, the San Francisco Peace Treaty. That is the reason why Japanese who visited Ryukyu must have their passport stamped at the Ryukyu immigration between 1945 to 1971.

And that is the reason why the Diaoyu islands and Ryukyu islands can't even be found in any map of Japan either published in Japan or other nations in the world between 1945 to 1971 such as this one:

http://retromaps.tumblr.com/image/30107477891

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

eventhought islands were china 's , y did not it react right at the time the US return islands back to japan , but it wait till now to ... , with its attitude it would say it can take whatever it want to from its weaker and smaller neighbors . japan is the real hero at war , and japan should be the best leader of china , if china does not respect japan and want to taste japan ' s stool , so y should not japan let china taste its for china ' dinner . china is never really b at a real war , it is only bulluying and intimidating its smaller neighbors for its victory , lol , therefore if japan teach china what the defeated china in a real war is , then the world can not refuse that japan is the first , best and honor teacher of china . japan must not hesitate b4 to beat china up , recently the world is thinking japan is totally different with japan b4 , so do not b shy Japan , please ! just kick into hu jintao ' face to wait china up , otherwise it is idiot to think thai it is the super ( shit ) power

1 ( +1 / -0 )

China is acting more like Nazis Germany than a civilized nation.

Nazis Germany made territorial demands against it's neighbors and when those demands were not met they invaded.

At the rate China is going they will start and lose a war within the next 3 years.

The PRC and their drones can not be trusted.

Also, would like to send a wave to the PRC's "WATER INTERNET ARMY", I see you guys are hard at work here spreading your lies as usual.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Disagree. To do that, they just need to tell the truth that the ownership is bogus.

That's not de-escalation. That's appeasement. Which, to be fair, is precisely what China wants.

There is absolutely no need to buy land from a bogus owner as any private ownership would have been rendered null and void in 1945 when Japan lost the war and gave up its sovereignty over the Ryukyu islands and Diaoyu islands according to the Potsdam Agreement and subsequently, the San Francisco Peace Treaty.

Can you show us on any of those documents where they refer to private ownership? Sovereignty is about the power of rule over a territory. It does not immediately require, or even imply, that individual private ownership of land is affected, much less forfeited. Sovereignty in middle-ages Europe changed fairly regularly, but most of the farmers continued working their land, occasionally unaware that they had a different ruler.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Japan needs to force these ships from our water by any means possible. You know the Chinese would shoot at any uninvited Japanese ship in their waters. The coast guard needs to pursued them to leave. Noda chan stop being afraid and LEAD! Weakness in the face of the enemy feeds their desires. Worse come worse invoke the Security agreement and ask the Americans to help evict the invading Chinese ship but you have to act!

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Why do you have to act? Give the Chinese enough rope and they'll hang themselves.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@Guru29 - Sorry Guru29 the US and the rest of the international community doesn't recognize any fabricated history that China has made up regarding the Senkaku Islands.

Also neither the Republic of China in Taiwan nor the People's Republic of China in mainland China were invited to the San Francisco treaty negotiations.because neither government was legitimate. ( Commies vs. Nationalists). So anything the current Chinese government has to say about the legitimacy of the treaty is pretty much all crap.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Hi, Taiwan needs to be more smart, if China takes the islands, then it will be easy for them to take Taiwan main island. If it happens, they will feel confidence to take South Korea, Phillipines and all the countries around. If China win, Taiwan will not be allowed to fish there since they will use force and the next territory that they will ask is Okinawa or perhaps Kyushu. They don't care to send militaries there since they are overpopulated. If Japan win, Taiwan probably will be allowed to fish there if they ask for permission and there will be no risk since Japan renounced the right to take piece of islands owned by other countries.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Login to leave a comment

Facebook users

Use your Facebook account to login or register with JapanToday. By doing so, you will also receive an email inviting you to receive our news alerts.

Facebook Connect

Login with your JapanToday account

User registration

Articles, Offers & Useful Resources

A mix of what's trending on our other sites