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COVID vaccine for elderly to be distributed based on population proportion

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So, Tokyo and Osaka will be first because they have the largest populations of elderly in Japan.

Outside of some doctors and nurses at one local hospital here, I highly doubt we down here are going to see any vaccinations being done for a long time!

11 ( +15 / -4 )

Together with doctors from the local medical association, officials practiced going through the entire inoculation process from reception to monitoring for side effects and responding to foreigners in the city with a population of some 70,000.

> With just under 2,000 foreigners living in the city as of late January, staff ran through providing individual interpretation in six languages including English, Vietnamese and Spanish.

So, are there a lot of elderly foreigners living there too? What's the point of this in this article? It's REALLY annoying to see multiple topics stuck together like this, not to mention poor journalism!

20 ( +23 / -3 )

@yubaru

It is proportion to the total population of each prefecture so everywhere in the country receives at the same rate.

In places with relatively young populations like Tokyo and Osaka the older people will get vaccinated faster automatically. As it should be since these are the most dangerous places.

Kono seems to have missed this obviously.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

today's plan anyway.... tune in at the same time tomorrow for the latest "adjustment".....

13 ( +14 / -1 )

It is proportion to the total population of each prefecture so everywhere in the country receives at the same rate.

That is not how it will end up, believe me, anything the government says is one thing, what it does is another.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

Britain plans to use its presidency of the Group of Seven economic powers to push for an internationally recognized system of vaccine passports that could allow world travel to resume,

From another JT article today. Taro Kono yesterday:

"I don't think the international community will introduce a system preventing people from doing something unless they get shots," the former foreign minister said.

As a foreign resident of Japan, I say we are .

10 ( +13 / -3 )

Hmm, JT does not like HTML.

I say we are in a spot of bother.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Do not rush to draw conclusions from this article. We do not know until it begins.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

Thank God I didn’t have to wait for Japan to vaccinate me. I received my first vaccination on a military installation on mainland Japan, and had an appointment for my second dose. I later received notification that they had run out of vaccines and didn’t know when they would be getting more. Fortunately for me, I was able to fly down to Okinawa and get my second dose Within the recommended time frame at military installation there. FYI, I had no adverse reaction to either vaccination other than pain at the injection site.

10 ( +15 / -5 )

Japan won’t accept vaccine passports until enough people have been vaccinated or the shots are available to be bought privately for air travel as the PCR or Lamp test currently is.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

@sensei- just out of curiosity, when did you have each shot? I’m totally envious!

1 ( +4 / -3 )

They need Portuguese translations as well.

I bet the form is the exact same one as the flu shot form.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Japan might get the whole population vaccinated in time for Tokyo 2032!

6 ( +10 / -4 )

April, May, June .... and it continues like this!

The "normal population" will wait until "St. Never's Day" if the plan doesn't change.

Agree, Tokyo 2032 (or some time after that) looks more and more promising.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

The explanation is not very clear but at least they have decided on a way to distribute the vaccines already, judging from what is being seen in other countries this will not go smoothly at first so I really hope they left room in the plans for some flexibility.

8 ( +12 / -4 )

If you live in Inaka then be prepared to wait it out...

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Missing in this long winded tripe is WHEN it will be introduced.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

These Pfizer vaccines are still experimental skipping long term studies and going straight to injections using the Emergency Use Authorization to get approval. Outside of EUA it would take years to get approved. Whatever happens to seniors (and everyone else) there will be no recourse. You just have to accept the result of any negative adverse events...unfortunately even death.

This is only one article but there are so many more not in the mainstream media news. Seniors with weak immune systems simply can't handle the vax and the 2nd shot will be worse.

https://thecovidblog.com/2021/02/23/netherlands-22-nursing-home-residents-dead-within-14-days-of-first-mrna-shots/

Original article:

https://www.rtvutrecht.nl/nieuws/2139404/de-eerste-coronaprik-was-gezet-en-toen-kwam-toch-nog-de-uitbraak-we-zijn-er-erg-ontdaan-over.html

-8 ( +6 / -14 )

"At present, I don't give much consideration" to the infection situation. Pretty much says it all. Nobody else in the government seems to either, except as it potentially impacts the Olympics.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

"I really hope they left room in the plans for some flexibility..." How long have you lived here?

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Cities are putting an effort to provide proper language support for foreigners who receive vaccinations. I see duplication of effort here. Why not provide well-written information and consent forms in each language distributed from one national source? Just mail the forms to each foreigner a few days ahead of the scheduled vaccination day and ask that they be filled out ahead of time. Any questions could be handled by a phone call to a central expert. When I get my annual flu vaccination I request the consent forms ahead of time so I can translate and clearly understand and just take them with me on vaccination day. This seems to be a completely nonconformist idea. Some things in the Japanese medical system are archaic. For example, when one Dr writes a letter to another Dr and then asks me to deliver it. Why not just email or post the letter? Or, paying bills each day for procedures that require multiple visits over several days. Or, not being able to prepay?

6 ( +7 / -1 )

These Pfizer vaccines are still experimental skipping long term studies and going straight to injections using the Emergency Use Authorization to get approval. Outside of EUA it would take years to get approved. 

You skipped the reason for this, and it is because the cost of delaying the use of vaccines means unnecessary loss of lives directly and indirectly because of the pandemic. This is something that is evaluated carefully but for you is easy to consider these lost lives as completely disposable, healthcare professionals do not share that attitude. This is specially true because the natural infection already has been corroborated to produce long-term and even permanent health problems, so the vaccine is on an advantage as long as no relationship is found between vaccination and those problems, something that continues until today.

This is only one article but there are so many more not in the mainstream media news.

The problem with that article is that for it to have any importance it assume that vaccinated people are no longer normal people and stop having all unrelated health problems, which is obviously not true. Vaccinated people will keep having all other health problems and even die, which is not something that can be attributed to the vaccine unless you can find it at higher rates than in the non-vaccinated population. This requirement has not been fulfilled with the examples presented, which means they are still part of what is expected from people being alive and getting health problems as usual.

Why the death rate of non-vaccinated nursing home residents is not presented as a comparison? precisely to hide that the deaths are not out of the ordinary for this population.

9 ( +12 / -3 )

I receive my influenza vaccine every year.

It is very easy.

Just call my doctor, make an appointment, go there, take the shot, finish.

I don't have to fill out any form or document.

My arm always hurts after the shot for 1-2 days, and that's all.

To be honest, I don't care much about possible side effects, also not for the COVID vaccine.

I will take the shots and wait what will happen.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

"We had to explain difficult medical terms at times, but it all went smoothly,"

Are you not paid to do so? Almost sounds like a complaint. When in the world and why in the world would this be published or said. Oh boo hoo you had maybe speak a little English.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

If the death rate is what you need then here it is...31.7% for residents vaccinated at the nursing home.

46 dead out of 145 residents at the nursing home in Los Barrios, Spain

Thank you, it is not often that commenters bring themselves evidence that proves them wrong.

This is a huge example why vaccination have to be done as soon as possible instead of trying to find excuses to scare the population out of it. 46 people died because they got COVID-19 before being fully vaccinated, according to the report they did not even received the second dose, much less had time to increase their immune response against it.

These people did not die because of vaccination, they died because it was not done opportunely to protect them before they got involved in a confirmed outbreak of COVID-19.

6 ( +12 / -6 )

difficult medical terms

Like what?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

This is a huge example why vaccination have to be done as soon as possible instead of trying to find excuses to scare the population out of it. 46 people died because they got COVID-19 before being fully vaccinated, according to the report they did not even received the second dose, much less had time to increase their immune response against it.

Spain: second Pfizer shots halted after 46 nursing home residents die after the first shot

"All residents and workers at the facility received the first dose of Pfizer mRNA in early January, according to Spain mainstream media outlet ABC de Sevilla. Most residents became extremely ill shortly after the shots. It is believed many came down with COVID-19, despite being “vaccinated against it."

Unfortunately you didn't understand the article. All 145 residents were vaccinated and still got covid which led to that 31.7% death rate. I know you want to say "They got COVID already! The vaccine couldn't have saved them!"

No. They were injected and then got COVID. But aren't they "protected" with the vaccine? NO. Unfortunately not. Next you will say it takes time - 3 weeks for it to work AND you need your 2nd shot so 6 weeks in total.

I thought it was supposed to stop transmission and infection? And now you will say it takes time for the vaccine to work. Clearly you are in denial due to your love of vaccines and that the belief that vaccine related deaths are normal or dismiss them by saying it could be anything but probably old age even though it happened within days at such a high rate. Again....31.7% for nursing home residents.

-8 ( +4 / -12 )

I'm amazed by the mental gymnastics demonstrated to get to "46 people died because they got COVID-19 before being fully vaccinated". Impressive!

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

BTW, wasn't there an article here on JT recently about recommending only one shot, saying it was still effective enough and this would allow more people to get vaccinated. But I don't remember which vaccine it was and in which country this recommendation was made...

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

All 145 residents were vaccinated and still got covid which led to that 31.7% death rate.

It is in fact, worse. The facility has capacity for 145 residents whereas actual occupation was 94. That is almost a 50% death rate!

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Assuming the vaccines are effective, which I do not, it would make more sense to vaccinate the workforce because they are the ones who go out every day. workers in the house or the ones who would bring it home to the elderly. Workers who are younger the ones who would suffer for a long time from the effects of an infection. Workers are the ones who would put strain on the medical system in the future to pay for open damage. How is it more effective use to give the old people the vaccines who can stay at home because they don't have to work?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Difficult medical terms for translation for a COVID vaccine? Huh?

I had four major eye operations and learned the medical terms. Not much work, just some memorization.

The common flu vaccine form and other vaccine forms all have the same questions. Not rocket science. Just tell them your allergies, tell them if your last shot gave you chills, or pain or a fever, and correctly pronounce your name when they ask you to say who you are.

Simple. The hard part is getting someone to put that in a data base at your tiny local clinic so they do not have to ask you for 37 years in a row. And yes, I know they only had files and no computers 37 years ago, but my file looks really tattered when they pull it out of the thousands of files stored behind the clerks dressed as nurses.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Unfortunately you didn't understand the article. All 145 residents were vaccinated and still got covid which led to that 31.7% death rate. I know you want to say "They got COVID already! The vaccine couldn't have saved them!"

It is not me who said it, the article is the one, just check the heading, that is exactly what they are reporting. "Un brote en una residencia de Los Barrios provoca 46 muertes por coronavirus" "An outbreak in a nursing home of Los barrios produces 46 deaths by coronavirus"

Protection from the vaccine is not instantaneous that is why it is still recommended to follow social distancing measures as if not immunized for weeks. This is an example of what happens when this is not enough and infection occurs on people not yet protected.

I'm amazed by the mental gymnastics demonstrated to get to "46 people died because they got COVID-19 before being fully vaccinated". Impressive!

There is no need for any mental gymnastics, the article is reported exactly like that, "Most residents became extremely ill shortly after the shots" taking in account the incubation time (people don't get sick the day they get infected) it is not unreasonable to understand they were infected even before they were immunized, it should be obvious.

BTW, wasn't there an article here on JT recently about recommending only one shot, saying it was still effective enough and this would allow more people to get vaccinated.

After enough time is given to develop the defenses, being infected before the first dose is still way too soon no matter how you want to consider the vaccine.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

Thank God I didn’t have to wait for Japan to vaccinate me. I received my first vaccination on a military installation on mainland Japan, and had an appointment for my second dose. I later received notification that they had run out of vaccines and didn’t know when they would be getting more. Fortunately for me, I was able to fly down to Okinawa and get my second dose Within the recommended time frame at military installation there. FYI, I had no adverse reaction to either vaccination other than pain at the injection site.

So this means you are active duty military. They are the only one's getting vaccinated here now.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@ haaa nemui

Jan 13th / Feb 10th

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

I am retired military.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

@ Yubari - You are a statement the only active duty military are being vaccinated is incorrect

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Your

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Assuming the vaccines are effective

They are not assuming anything. There are peer-reviewed tests and results.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

at snail speed as expected...as usual in Japan...

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Just asking, you've gotta catch up with the times, there are new mutations every time I check the news. I had trouble with the mic, but my point is, by vaccinating the young who should do the chores, working, riding trains, etc, they could cover the most vulnerable to catching the disease thus increasing the effective USE of said vaccine. The article is about effective USE, but I'm trying to understand why elderly should have first priority.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Just asking, you've gotta catch up with the times, there are new mutations every time I check the news. I had trouble with the mic, but my point is, by vaccinating the young who should do the chores, working, riding trains, etc, they could cover the most vulnerable to catching the disease thus increasing the effective USE of said vaccine. The article is about effective USE, but I'm trying to understand why elderly should have first priority.

For two reasons, the first is that there is still need for evidence that the vaccine stops the transmission, that has not yet been proved so it is not valid to just assume it is the case, in the small chance the vaccine do not reduces transmission then the young population would be protected but still would be able to spread the diseases to the vulnerable population.

The second reason is that vaccinating the young would mean slowly begin to protect the old with comorbidities, even if you vaccinated half of the young people that would still mean the vulnerable population would still be at risk and would continue like that until herd immunity levels are reached. If you begin with the vulnerable population then those vaccinated are already protected no matter what happens with the spreading, and you can in theory protect every vulnerable person long before herd immunity is reached, leaving the risk of infection for those for whom the consequences are less important.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

I understand elderly are more vulnerable in the short term, but considering the article and how places in the countryside with few infections would be given priority because people are old doesn't seem to prioritize actual vulnerability. Obviously, people in Tokyo who are old are the actual most vulnerable. It could be based on other factors that are not disclosed. For example, people in the countryside have lots of land assets and their sudden death could be problematic for a lot of reasons. Some of what virus rex said made sense, but I'm not sure if one were to compare virus distribution with old age distribution.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@sensei - thanks for that. Can't pull any strings? Nah jokes, I'll wait but good stuff!!

2 ( +3 / -1 )

But Kono said Sunday the vaccine will only be available in limited areas and among limited age groups during that month due to a supply shortage.

Poor organisation i wounder?

city officials participated in a dry run for the COVID-19 vaccine rollout at a public health center in the western Japan city

For goodness sake just get on with it, doctors and nurses who have been giving injections dont need dummy runs, they just need the vaccine, materials and people.

I am supprised that Japan has not developed a vaccine of its own there is some very bright scientists in Japan.

Here in the UK even bumberling Boris has managed to organise vacine centres around the Uk and we have already dished out 17.2 million jabs.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

With the Japanese government selecting a few places who will get the vacine first, this meens other area wont be seing any for of injections soon, this begs the question will these people in that area ( the ones that have been left out) will the vote differently next time around there is a election?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

That’s because unlike the flu shot, the COVID vaccine is currently limited in supply and they want to make sure it is distributed to the most vulnerable first. This is why they require you to fill out paperwork. It is the exact same way it is distributed in my hometown

I receive my influenza vaccine every year.

It is very easy.

Just call my doctor, make an appointment, go there, take the shot, finish.

I don't have to fill out any form or document.

I got my shot. No side effects other than a stiff shoulder

To be honest, I don't care much about possible side effects, also not for the COVID vaccine.

I will take the shots and wait what will happen.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

I have had my Pfizer vaccine. I also know people 80 years ok’d and above who have gotten the vaccine and are currently fine. Shots are scheduled 2-3 weeks apart for the 2nd shot. You cannot get COVID from the shot said the nurse that gave it to me because the shot does not have live COVID.

If a person gets COVID after it’s because the vaccine has NOT taken effect until at least 2 weeks after. Vaccines are nit instantaneous.

And in the future after the vaccine they say you MIGHT get COVID but you won’t die of it. The vaccine prevents you from death from it or very serious version.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Shini sei 258 You are a statement the only active duty military are being vaccinated is incorrect

My bad, Japan started too.

For some reason, your "jumping ahead" because of your military status, is annoying. Sounds like you are bragging, particularly when you wrote about jumping on a plane to Okinawa to get the 2nd one.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

My trip To Okinawa was scheduled a long time ago. I was fortunate enough that it enabled me to get my second shot. Not bragging just telling you what I had to go through

0 ( +2 / -2 )

It is unfortunate that this experimental COVID vaccines are being pushed so hard as the "cure" but it does not even stop infection or transmission. Much of the elderly (especially those with comorbidities) will have a very difficult time handling these injections (2nd one being the worst reactions and now they are proposing a 3rd shot for the "variants")

COVID19 vaccine effectiveness (they are always mentioning on mainstream news outlets) is for possibly reducing cough and headache + risk of negative adverse events (yes even death or permanent disability)

Doctor on CNN: Don’t be ‘alarmed’ if elderly die after receiving COVID vaccine

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/doctor-on-cnn-dont-be-alarmed-if-elderly-die-after-receiving-covid-vaccine

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

It is unfortunate that this experimental COVID vaccines are being pushed so hard as the "cure" but it does not even stop infection or transmission.

That is the thing, they do, very efficiently and safely. Up until now there has been not even a single report where elderly people have any increase in the incidence of death compared with unvaccinated people. On the other hand you yourself brought here unequivocal proof that vaccination should be performed as soon as possible on elderly patients. Even one example of patients being infected before being vaccinated (as your own source said it happened) would be enough to push for faster inoculations, but you yourself brought 2 of those examples.

I think nobody here has done a better job in demonstrating why fast vaccination on elderly people is so important as you have, congratulations.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

On the contrary...this is happening to people in general:

https://thecovidblog.com/2021/02/16/united-kingdom-12-deaf-five-blind-after-pfizer-mrna-shots/

United Kingdom: 12 people deaf, five blind after Pfizer BioNTech mRNA shots

As always, compared with what incidence on the non-vaccinated population.

Let me see, If I find 15 people becoming deaf, and 8 blind on non-vaccinated people, this means the vaccine would protect not only against COVID, it would also protect against blindness and deafness, because less people had the problem than not vaccinated people!

This is why is so important to present also non-vaccinated people data, unfortunately the source you choose for the information actively tries to hide this to misrepresent the information as if nobody in the normal population became deaf or blind.

One sure way to choose a better source is to ask directly for the information on unvaccinated population to do the comparison, if it is an antivaxxer source trying to mislead you they will never answer your question and instead will try to swamp you with other unrelated information (also without the normal population data). If you see this it is better to ignore that source.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Let me see, If I find 15 people becoming deaf, and 8 blind on non-vaccinated people, this means the vaccine would protect not only against COVID, it would also protect against blindness and deafness, because less people had the problem than not vaccinated people!

You must also consider the timing. I don't know the details of the mentioned adverse effects but if five people suddenly turned blind within one week of receiving the vaccination, then you would have to look at what proportion of the unvaccinated population suddenly turn blind every week.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

What virusrex is saying, for those who aren't so scientific, is that without a control group to know how many would have caught these things WITHOUT the vaccine, the number of people who did is meaningless, as there is no way to know if the vaccine increased, decreased, or had no difference as compared to a group that didn't take the vaccine.

The thing is, valid science and news reports will explain the control group. Anything that doesn't give that is not giving the full picture, and as often as not is someone cherry picking facts that meet their agenda.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

If a person gets COVID after it’s because the vaccine has NOT taken effect until at least 2 weeks after. Vaccines are nit instantaneous.

Indeed, it does take some time, and vaccines are less effective in older people.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

You must also consider the timing. I don't know the details of the mentioned adverse effects but if five people suddenly turned blind within one week of receiving the vaccination, then you would have to look at what proportion of the unvaccinated population suddenly turn blind every week.

Yes, that is exactly the point. Without that information it may very well be even lower than in the non-vaccinated population.

Taking in account the ages of the people that are being vaccinated this is not something impossible, or even very unlikely. So both halves of the information are definitely necessary. If a source is deeply anti vaccination it would be natural for them to offer this number if that could prove their point, but since it is purposefully hidden that would make it more likely the opposite is true.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

I would like to see such statistical analyses, but all we hear is that experts looked at it and there is nothing to see here. That is why I often check out Children's Health Defense, they have done a number of detailed analyses that Big Pharma would rather keep quiet (that is why pharma lobbyists attack them constantly). 

And I guess some medical agencies have also done these analyses and ended up changing their recommendations to vaccinate their elders.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

I would like to see such statistical analyses, but all we hear is that experts looked at it and there is nothing to see here. 

It takes about no-time flat to find the information and even the data used so you can run your own comparisons, any scientifically valid analysis would make it clear vaccines are safe, much more so in comparison with the natural infection. Reports are released with some frequency but with an understandable lag on the analysis.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2021-01/06-COVID-Shimabukuro.pdf

That is why I often check out Children's Health Defense, they have done a number of detailed analyses that Big Pharma would rather keep quiet (that is why pharma lobbyists attack them constantly). 

That is a terrible source since it is well recognized as an antivaxxer organization that uses unsupported, misleading and incomplete information, in cases even openly lying all in order to smear vaccines for political gains, It's activity has been related to a resurgence of preventable diseases.

If you think the CDC is not trust-worthy that would mean you should consider CHD as deeply deceiving.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

That is a terrible source since it is well recognized as an antivaxxer organization that uses unsupported, misleading and incomplete information, in cases even openly lying all in order to smear vaccines for political gains,

[edited]: That would be your opinion. From my understanding Robert F. Kennedy Jr. would never have gotten into vaccine research if the mothers of vaccine injured children had not brought vaccines to his attention.

His main focus was trying to litigate the removal of chemical run-off that are contaminating rivers / oceans (mercury / aluminum / heavy metals). Of course he is addressing vaccines now: childrenshealthdefense.org

Here is an interview excerpt of his why - he's not antivaxx but a vaccine skeptic for safety:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEPsq6A04rk

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Without a comprehensive vaccination program across all prefectures then all can fumble and debate the science and epidemiology until they're blue in the face.

There has, and must be a clear transparent vaccination policy roll out. 

At this moment in time it is vague and abstruse.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@neowave

[edited]: That would be your opinion. From my understanding Robert F. Kennedy Jr. would never have gotten into vaccine research if the mothers of vaccine injured children had not brought vaccines to his attention.

This is no personal opinion, in nursing and medical school is taken as the textbook example for an organization working against science and public health. I have not yet met an American pediatrician that doesn't talk horribly about it.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

The only thing that bothers me is that they stopped animal testing of the vaccines because none of the animals survived after later re-infection. Here in America you sign a document before receiving the vaccine aknowledging that it is an "Experimental treatment" you need to read the fine print and people just sign not paying attention to the very real risks from th injection.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

The only thing that bothers me is that they stopped animal testing of the vaccines because none of the animals survived after later re-infection.

I'm skeptical of the accuracy of this claim.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

The only thing that bothers me is that they stopped animal testing of the vaccines because none of the animals survived after later re-infection.

That is false, the testing was conducted and finished without problems. The animals are later euthanized to search for hidden signs of problems (not found) but saying that is why they don't survive is misleading.

If you know how animal testing is done you would have known that is much shorter than the phase III trials, if what you said was true then every human subject that was reinfected would have died, not even one did.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

That’s a strange calculation. It means, that 90-years olds in a low populated prefecture are served last while much younger seniors in Kanto get their vaccinations early. In other words, it should be considered the higher percentage of vulnerable people in those far away and lower populated prefectures.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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