Sea Shepherd finds Japanese whaler 'hiding behind iceberg'

The Japanese fleet set sail on November 18 in defiance of a worldwide moratorium on commercial whaling and international opposition.

And as in the past, the Sea Shepherd is ready to break every rule in the maritime law-book to hold the Japanese to account. Neither is in any position to claim the morale high ground when it comes to the law....

Give em hell SS!

I wonder if all of the sailors/terrorists on the Sea Shepard all vegetarians? The better not be catching fish or eating meat...

Hilarious. Good for SS! I love the stink bomb idea. The whales will have a great Christmas now.

The whalers should up the stakes and mount a M2 for and aft of their ships. SS wants to act like pirates then treat them like pirates.

God's speed SS.

Ha ha! Lets the games begin!

The more they can harass them, the less whales get killed, and until the whaling moratorium is lifted based on real science, that's a very good thing.

Fair Winds, Sea Shepherd!

While I support the efforts to stop whaling, CrucialS's suggestion for use weapons could prove to be a problem - for the anti-whalers.

When are the "humans" throughout the World going to stop this "masacure" of innocent life and go after the two legged ones that are creating all the problems?

While I support the efforts to stop whaling, CrucialS's suggestion for use weapons could prove to be a problem - for the anti-whalers.

It should be a last resort though and always in an attempt to disable the SS when they're attacking the whaling ship.

When the "researchers" become the "researched", or more honestly, when the hunters become the hunted makes for pure schadenfreude. I hope our fellow creatures can escape the bloody harpoon and continue to swim and live free.

The never ending story continues. Clash of cultures on the high seas. Neither side willing to give an inch. As an Australian on my way down to Wakayama ( historical whaling town) for a karate tournament as we speak, the inevitable lecture to come about the rule of law and terrorism on the high seas is becoming a regular event, especially with the old geezas who have trouble processing different points of view. Its unusual for the non confrontational locals to bring up touchy subjects , but the way the Japanese narrative goes in the media here , they feel they are truely on the side of good, fighting to preserver their precious culture. So many more pressing issues to tackle , you wonder if it is all really worth it? Basically its a conversation that goes no where fast.

SS,the terrorist at sea.

You have to wonder just how much support for whaling there would still be locally if footage of the hunts was televised...

This isa show. Neither side uses weapons

It's a wrong way to convince somebody who does believe in the same religion. It is most likely counterproductive as is shown in many religious wars.

mike jangDEC. 24, 2016 - 10:49AM JST

SS,the terrorist at sea.

Wrong characterisation, let's get this straight and not contribute to the fake news phenomenon. Like em or love em Sea Shepherds main goal is to stop hunting of whales in the wild and not to use violence for the soul purpose of causing fear and intimidation among the public for political aims (definition of terrorism)

The whalers should up the stakes and mount a M2 for and aft of their ships. SS wants to act like pirates then treat them like pirates. so you want Japan to make an internation incident out of whaling by threatening to kill SS crew!? who by the way havent killed any whalers, unlike the whalers themselves. Whats next SS will buy a submarine and start torpedo whaling vessels! When your prepared to use lethal force on humans to hunt whales, then its gone well beyond whaling and everything to do with recalcitrant pride.

SS,the terrorist at sea. so SS has killed no humans or whales, but the whalers have killed two humans, and thousands of whales.....and people call SS terrorists LMFAO

F++ck the Sea Shepherd. White people love animals so much. comon mod though you were supposed to keep these right wing racist nutters off this site, but I do admit I love reading their butthurt comments, Go SS give them hell LOL

socrateous, the purpose is to save whales lives. and SS will achieve that this outing. What would you have them do, sit at a table talking with arrogant people who have no intention of changing their thinking?

We are on the top of the food chain. Whales are food. Live with it. SS is like the Gestapo of the Sea. Sink their ships.

If this was my government my country I would be totally embarrass to go anywhere international. The whole world have told Japan to put your whale ship away. That whales are international protected. Other counrtries have made profitable industries from protecting and saving the whale. Yet Japan goes and kills them and stock pile the harvest in coolrooms which only a very low percentage of Japanese consume. I see these Idiots, these fools of Japan leader. Here is Abe appealing to the UN to utilise Japan peace keepers for more humanitary work and on the other side Abe is arming Japan fishing man with harpones to kill protected spicies. Like my Partner is Japanese and non way we will be raising a family in Japan.

Change comes from education. In JLand, education is, basically, in general, controlled by the state. Those in control are a product of their education, which said 'whaling is good'.

As all know, their mindset cannot be altered. Therefor, it will take time for those with the opposite mindset come to be in control.

Unfortunately, by that time all the researching will be over as no more subjects of study will be found.

anotherexpat: "You have to wonder just how much support for whaling there would still be locally if footage of the hunts was televised..."

Actually, it would increase. The blinders would go on, and the embarrassment from the videos would not prompt a logical reply -- just a knee-jerk reaction and claims that you are attacking their whaling culture... errr... science... and then they'd turn red-faced and not listen. Most of the most vehement people against the movie The Cove, for example, have never seen it.

Anyway, good on Sea Shepherd, and I LOVE that they found the Japanese ship cowering behind an iceberg! Hope they keep it locked in there and cameras on at all times. Give 'em hell, SS!

Japanese whales are in violation of international law. Yes, they say they have a real scientific purpose "this time" but that is rubbish of course. There are enough frozen and unwanted whale corpses in Japan for any scientific research Japan might want. The real reason for this piracy is politics, endowments to win votes for the LDP. The sad joke is that whale meat is full of dioxins. Not good to eat.

The point seems to be missed by Nostromo. If Austrian Antarctic waters have been declared a whale sanctuary, then the Japanese have no business whaling there. Anything the SS does to them short of physical harm to the Japanese crew gets my vote.

Great News for the Whales. Bad news for Japans Taxpayers. The Money is Wasted on Whaling and not spent on Food every one eats not just a stubborn few and pet food.Think of those in need this Christmas even if only a Bowel of rice

Good luck Sea Shepherd.

People are getting tired of hearing the Japanese going on and on about their very precious "food culture".

How the hell does Japan's culture include the Antarctic?!

If my country pushed a "culture" that involved grabbing resources from 1000s and 1000s of kilometers away, in fact, from the other side of the world.... well, I for one would want nothing to do with such a claimed culture.... because it's not culture... it's just greed and arrogance.

Japan is arrogantly imposing its culture on the Antarctic.

There is no other way to describe it. According to the Japanese government's data there are an abundance of whales in the seas around Japan... more than enough for this tiny tiny niche market.

These greedy and arrogant expeditions... sending a massive Victorian era style fleet to the furthest reaches of the globe to grab resources from a pristine wilderness environment... It makes Japan look ridiculous on the world stage.

How the hell does Japan's culture include the Antarctic?!

I'm sure your country imports fish or sea food from Antarctic too.

tinawatanabe: "I'm sure your country imports fish or sea food from Antarctic too."

First, Japan claims it's for science, not food. So your argument is only arguing that it's for food, not science, and the whaling is therefore forbidden. Second, whales are not fish. Third, please point out which nations go thousands of kilometers outside their waters to fish under the guise of science, then bring it home to rot in freezers and cry about other nations picking on them. You can't, because they don't. No other nation goes to the Southern Ocean, Arctic, or off their own waters claiming it's for science and then bringing the 'food' back home and saying others are attacking their culture. None. And certainly none of them then force the food on school children to try and lower the rotting stockpiles.

Japan are being babies, and hiding behind icebergs because they KNOW they are in the wrong.

The Whale Sanctuary thingie was an arbitrary thingie proclaimed by someone who had no ownership or right to do so.

Send the SS to the bottom if they attack.

You Japan-bashing crocodile tears anti-whalers should stop eating fish, lobsters, crabs, clams and scallops, beef, chicken and pork. How in the world can you justify your own consumption of only the animals you like.

Hypocrites, all of you.

Combining scientific research and gathering food at the same time seems smart to me. I hope the whalers return safely and not over-fish the area... which I'm sure they won't. Btw SmithinJapan, tinawatanabe never said whales were fish.

roosterman77: "Btw SmithinJapan, tinawatanabe never said whales were fish."

Then it was even more of an irrelevant comment, wasn't it?

smithin

First, Japan claims it's for science, not food.

That's what Japan was told to do. It is OK to eat them after science research. It is the greedy westerners that demanding Japan eternal science research as harrasment.

Second, whales are not fish.

Who said whales are fish? irrelevant.

Third, please point out which nations go thousands of kilometers outside their waters to fish under the guise of science

The westerners justify their actions and only try to control Japan. They don't bind their own fishing as for science.

The point seems to be missed by Nostromo. If Austrian Antarctic waters have been declared a whale sanctuary, then the Japanese have no business whaling there. Anything the SS does to them short of physical harm to the Japanese crew gets my vote.

the law of the seas is quite explicit.... the SS has broken the international maritime law on many occasions....this is well known.... i do not support Japanese whaling however the SS is in no position to point to the law as its measure of Japanese actions when it repeatedly breaks the law itself....

If my country pushed a "culture" that involved grabbing resources from 1000s and 1000s of kilometers away, in fact, from the other side of the world.... well, I for one would want nothing to do with such a claimed culture.... because it's not culture... it's just greed and arrogance

Are you perhaps American? If so, please stop using gasoline produced from resources taken from the Middle East.

smithinjapan DEC. 24, 2016 - 02:04PM JST No other nation goes to the Southern Ocean, Arctic, or off their own waters claiming it's for science and then bringing the 'food' back home and saying others are attacking their culture.

The waters in question are protected sanctuary waters, they do fall under Law of The Sea. They can be territori ally defended by the owning nations. It never fails. The Japanese take a whale and their bad. The Norwegians take a whale and nobody cares. Both countries have cultural claim to whaling. Hey Sea Shepard, how about the Chinese that keeps killing turtles and coral reefs around the sea?? Ow, selective protesting?

Tinawatanabe: "who said the whales are fish? Irrelevant"

Darn right your comment was irrelevant -- that's the point! You guys asking or bringing up unrelated food culture (actual food culture... not one that is science one minute and ancient tradition thousands of kilometers away the next) and other nations fishing for fish is completely irrelevant and a red herring to boot. Keep that in mind the next time you bring it up.

Everyone should know the true intention of sea shepherd. All you have to do is google sea shepherd southpark

Hide and Seek. BOO.

The loop hole in the law talks about scientific research, well thats fine so far,but has ANY one seen this research data? what does it consist of? do the scientists actually have a set agenda of what data/research is to collated? may be we, the courts and other whaling experts, should be asking to see this data/research so that they can determine wether its just a shared or not, if its a wishy washy pile of useless data, the experts could say we already know this its irrelevant this whale has been killed for no reason and then that ship owner should then be prosecuted? I think that this loop hole can be closed quickly, but I am sure the Japanese won't be in a rush to undertake this task, as we all know what going on. Another regulation could be introduced and that it once the what has been killed and the so called data has been gathered, that the whale can not enter the human food chain, so it has to be released back the deep see from where it come from, this will support the food chain for other fish and micro organisms, once the whaler realise that there is no finical reward for them they will automatically stop the hunt and try there hand at something else.

live by the sword die by the sword

if japan is willing to engage it what is basically piracy of marine life in international waters, it must be ready to accept the fact that its ships may also be subject to piracy

if japan really is conducting scientific research it should send government escort vessels to protect the commercial whaling ships from piracy.

you won't catch JP government vessels anywhere near those whaling ships because the politicians know japan is breaking the law.

Thick fog means it's harder to find the whales.

Good.

you won't catch JP government vessels anywhere near those whaling ships

Actually they have been known to send the Coastguard down to 'protect' the whaling fleet.

Because everyone knows the Japanese coastline extends all the way down to the Antarctic.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/whale-watch/japans-coast-guard-protecting-whalers-from-activists/2008/01/31/1201714116182.html

@ Nostromo

The point seems to be missed by Nostromo. If Austrian Antarctic waters have been declared a whale sanctuary, then the Japanese have no business whaling there. Anything the SS does to them short of physical harm to the Japanese crew gets my vote.

the law of the seas is quite explicit.... the SS has broken the international maritime law on many occasions....this is well known.... i do not support Japanese whaling however the SS is in no position to point to the law as its measure of Japanese actions when it repeatedly breaks the law itself....

Some of us hold the MORAL law as being SUPREME to all other laws.

Go Japan!

Down with SS

What right do humans have to slaughter other animals using high explosive tipped harpoons?

Is that really an action that any Japanese can condone?

It certainly isn't a Japanese cultural tradition is it?

until the whaling moratorium is lifted based on real science

There already is real science supporting the lifting for some species. But the IWC has refused to even review the status of a single species since the moratorium went into effect. Despite the fact that the moratorium required reviews to be done by 1990 and then every 10 years thereafter. And that's a bad thing.

to use violence for the soul purpose of causing fear and intimidation among the public for political aims (definition of terrorism)

Yes, cherry pick a definition. But the definition in UNCLOS is the one that matters and it says nothing about political aims. Also I could argue that SSCS IS following political aims, they want to influence governments (political bodies) to back up and support their views.

There are enough frozen and unwanted whale corpses in Japan for any scientific research Japan might want.

Sorry but monitoring a population over time requires obtaining new samples every year.

If Austrian Antarctic waters have been declared a whale sanctuary, then the Japanese have no business whaling there.

So then all Japan has to do is declare the waters a Japanese Antarctic waters and call it a whale hunting ground right? I mean Australia's claim is just a bogus as if Japan made the same claim.

whales caught in Antartica spend half their lives feeding in northern waters also

No the Antarctic Minkes do no such thing. Virtually ALL seafood has mercury and seafood from Antarctica has been shown to have lower levels than seafood from other areas and that includes whales.

but has ANY one seen this research data

Yes, anybody who actually looks will see it. Even the IWC admits that Japan gives them usable scientific data from every one of their trips to the Antarctic and until recently the IWC even had scientists going with some of the Japanese ships (SOWER cruises).

I think that this loop hole can be closed quickly

I know that is wrong. The loophole and the REQUIREMENT to process the meat are both parts of the IWC's original charter and thus can only be changed with a unanimous vote of all members. Also any new regulation passed (without a unanimous vote) will not supersede the original charter.

What right do humans have to slaughter other animals using high explosive tipped harpoons?

The right of survival of the fittest, natures ultimate right.

So the SS probably gets on the megaphone and says, "whalers, come out and playyyayyy!"

Revintokyo: "With a name like smith you come from a western nation."

You never hear of someone not wanting their real name known saying, "uhhh... it's Smith, John Smith"? You have no idea where I'm from, bud, and even if it is a Western nation, that has zero bearing on the fact that your argument is about whaling for food and blubber when Japan claims it's for science.

Voiceofokinawa: "Yubaru: you say out are Japanese..."

As if the irrelevance of your posts needs highlighting, on top of remarks like the one you just made being borderline racist, you post about Yubaru "not being Japanese" because he doesn't agree with you about the base issue on a thread about whaling?

The Whalers are lucky that Australia does not arrest them and seize their ships for violation of an Australian sanctuary.

Japan doesnt seem to get it. Do commercial whaling where the "product" ends up on dinner tables and try calling it just scientific fools nobody. Japan would be much better of doing actual scientific research that is non lethal for 5 years to get information to support their claims the numbers are sustainable for small scale commercial whaling.

If you do the right thing you have more chance for success. Not that many would support a return to commercial Whaling, but if they have the scientific evidence to back them up that was carried out non lethally, it would be harder to ignore the facts.

Mike O -

Re your comment "...So then all Japan has to do is declare the waters a Japanese Antarctic waters and call it a whale hunting ground right? I mean Australia's claim is just a bogus as if Japan made the same claim."

Could you elaborate a little more. Is the bogus part connected to Australia being closer to Antartica by 10,000+ kms than Japan, or the bogus part being Australia's connection with Antartica for over 100+years, or the bogus part that sees Australia wanting to protect Antartica from commercial exploitation as the largest remaining true marine wilderness, or the bogus part that Australia sees the hunting of whales as part of a bygone era?

Or the bogus of Japan pleading food sustainabilty (one of the most food wasteful nations on the planet - fact), or the bogus of traditional cultural practice in waters far from traditional happy hunting grounds, or the bogus of this is only in the name of science to establish the possibility of securing resources for a resource poor country?

Please clarify a little on the bogus bits.

And Mike O - I must say I was a little disappointed with your argument slant. I have always thought you answered precisely, although I often didn't agree with you, but your last line -

" The right of survival of the fittest, natures ultimate right." just demolished your carefully crafted construct over all these years.

Might is Right. Got it.

the REQUIREMENT to process the meat

The REQUIREMENT (why are we shouting?) is to process any whales taken under these special permits. That's WHALES, not just the MEAT. Most of the whale is chucked overboard in the Antarctic. In this respect, Japan is not adhering to the provisions of Article 8.

seafood from Antarctica has been shown to have lower levels than seafood from other areas and that includes whales.

anybody who actually looks will see it (the research data)

Interesting that the data on the ICR website shows they killed 3,264 whales during JARPAII of which they only bothered to measure the heavy metals in 212 whales and the organochlorine in 5 whales. (Nelson holding his telescope up to his eyepatch and stating that he sees no ships?) (The annotations claims that 'the 2011 earthquake and tsunami affected heavily the samples collected for pollutant studies. this explains the particular smaller samples size for this item.' Strange how other data, including the 'We need to gouge their ears out to determine their age' data remains intact. A case of the tsunami ate my homework? Why wasn't this data presented to the IWC?)

Even the IWC admits that Japan gives them usable scientific data from every one of their trips to the Antarctic

Members of the IWC Scientific Committee are on record as saying that the 'lethal sampling' carried out in Japan's so-called research had not been justified. The IWC's review process, they say, is flawed because it gives equal weight to both sides and is not a genuine peer review.

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2016/01/whaling-reviews

As for claims that Japan gives the IWC usable data... after WWII, Unit 731 provided the US with 'usable data' on biological warfare and data obtained from human experimentation including vivisection, for which the US showed its gratitude by granting the butchers immunity from prosecution post-war. Doesn't mean the actions of Unit 731 were in any way justified.

The right of survival of the fittest, natures ultimate right.

browny1 has already chewed you out for this, rightly so. Can we assume that, in the event SS proves to be fitter and mightier than the whale killers and brings the 'research' to an end, you'd be OK with that?

The Whalers are lucky that Australia does not arrest them and seize their ships for violation of an Australian sanctuary.

Australia is lucky they don't arrest them and seize their ships as doing so would be a gross violation of quite a number of international laws.

doing actual scientific research that is non lethal for 5 years to get information to support their claims the numbers are sustainable for small scale commercial whaling

They have collected over 30 years of non-lethal data that supports their claim, much of it in concert with the IWC. And even the IWC's own Scientific Committee has said that some of the data can ONLY be collected through lethal means.

browny1 -

The bogus part would be that their claim to the waters is in violation of international law. And even their land claim is only recognized by 4 other countries, who all have their own claims.

Might is Right. Got it.

Never said that. Fittest does not mean mightiest. I suggest a few basic courses in biology and evolution.

Some of us hold the MORAL law as being SUPREME to all other laws.

Intelligence out the door!

The culture argument is rubbish.

As I've said before, countries like the United States and Australia also had a very long 'culture' of whaling before they decided to stop in the interests of conservation and international mindedness.

Japan obviously aren't quite up to the same levels of 'harmony'.

before they decided to stop in the interests of conservation and international mindedness

They decided to stop because of cheaper alternatives to whale oil, which was their primary reason for hunting whales.

They decided to stop because of cheaper alternatives to whale oil, which was their primary reason for hunting whales. No they decided to stop becuase they found it increasingly difficult to even catch whales due to the small numbers theyd dwindled to due to over hunting. Realized conservation was the only option before it was too late.

Australia is lucky they don't arrest them and seize their ships as doing so would be a gross violation of quite a number of international laws.

Really? Australia so far does not have any ships involved. The "private" vessels involved are not Australian Flagged. And If Australia did arrest the Whalers for violating Australian law, even against international law, they wouldn't be the first country to do that, or the last.

They have collected over 30 years of non-lethal data that supports their claim, much of it in concert with the IWC. And even the IWC's own Scientific Committee has said that some of the data can ONLY be collected through lethal means.

I am sure that the IWC stating that "some data" can only be collected via lethal means, does not mean the brutal slaughter of thousands or even hundreds of specimens per year to obtain. In addition there is Scientific opinion that there is NO DATA that can not be obtained lethally that can not also be obtain via non lethal means.

Mike O - thank you. & Merry Xmas (or is that Happy Hols?)

re the bogus bits - you didn't mention about my comments re Australia's proximity, historical connection, stewardship etc re Antartica.

And the reason only the neighbouring countries have recognized territorial rights, is simply because all other countries are afraid of "missing out on their piece of the golden pie" if future resources exploitation is realized (a very high possibility). US, a country as far away as Japan, esp doesn't want to miss the cut likewise Japan. Greedy Eyes.

And I appreciate your Xmas humour re taking bio / evo classes. I like that. And re the relationship of fitness & might. Well that'd just be finger picking the etymological basket wouldn't it?

The essence of your statement - " ..The right of survival of the fittest, natures ultimate right..."..can only mean that you believe that as humans are the fittest (in biological / evolutionary terms) creatures on the planet, they have the ultimate right to decide what lives and dies. Sounds a bit like "all-mightiness" to me - but then???

Anyway the point is that you're are correct, and for millennia Sapiens have exacted dominion over all life (incl their own stock). And if they couldn't they still believed it was their right. Fortunately in the late 19th century a different wisdom began to dawn and over the ensuing century +, some people began to view nature / life in ways unimaginable a few decades before. And some even postulated concepts such as wilderness conservation and animal / plant life preservation. Some people stepped down from the pedestal of "The Right of Dominion duly granted by our Fitness in the scheme of things" and actually began to view life on the planet or for that matter, the whole planet in a vastly different way. Some of these people believe you don't have to hunt animals such as whales like bygone era humans, because now we know we are not the necessarily the #1 species after all - virus and bacteria certainly attest to that.

So just because we can, doesn't mean it's the best - or fittest thing to do.

Oldman_13: "Go Japan!"

Yes! Keep hiding in fear behind those bergs! Go Japan! Haha

No they decided to stop becuase they found it increasingly difficult to even catch whales due to the small numbers theyd dwindled to due to over hunting. Realized conservation was the only option before it was too late.

If that was true then it means they plan on returning to whaling when the numbers have increased enough.

In addition there is Scientific opinion that there is NO DATA that can not be obtained lethally that can not also be obtain via non lethal means.

Not from the experts of the IWC, the preeminent whale organization on the planet.

you didn't mention about my comments re Australia's proximity, historical connection, stewardship etc re Antartica

Because none of them are relevant. Especially when international treaties and laws are against their claim.

Well that'd just be finger picking the etymological basket wouldn't it?

No it wouldn't, but thanks for the humor.

can only mean

More humor. Or do you believe you are psychic and can know what I mean? But please continue with the straw men building, it is useless but fun to watch.

With all of the new technology we have today to do research on animals you do not have to kill them. Research is taking measurements, a small amount of blood to check DNA type matching and profile to store in a catalog database along with pictures for reference. There are so many things that can be learned from a small amount of blood in todays scientific research and animals do not need to be killed to do any of it. So the main thing that can be asked is where is the scientific data explaining everything about the animals they killed in the name of research? We all know the answer to this question is they do not have any. Once again you do not have to kill an animal for research purposes with all of the advances in technology these days. If you need to do research on a dead animal its done after their death and that is called a necropsy an animal autopsy to find cause of death after you FIND THEM DEAD. So please stop killing these majestic animals for the sake of our future gegenerations. The whales were hunted to near extinction generations ago for commercial gain and not necessarily food back then. So now the argument is if they have recovered enough to be hunted for food again? The answer to that question is no. And you still do not need to kill the animals to find out thats bacwards because you are still lessening their numbers. Please stop killing these majestic animals for the sake of a lie research is fact finding information for the sake of understanding different things and learning purposes. So please stop hunting them because just like tuna they will be extinct before you can blink and then the only way future generations will learn about these animals will be the same way we learned about the dinosaurs from archeological digs to find out about the ancient past and books after they are extinct.

Peter14 - The Whalers are lucky that Australia does not arrest them and seize their ships for violation of an Australian sanctuary.

"Australian sanctuary"? Only 4 nations accept the attempted Australia territory grab (water grab?) of international water. 189 nations do not recognize their claim. Australia has no more authority to seize international water as it's own than you do.

The eco-terrorist SS will continue to attack fishermen, and whalers, with glass bottles of acid, nylon/steel lines, ramming, and the sinking of ships. All of which the eco-terrorist SS repeatedly admit and brag about.

Where is the pirate captain Watson? Didn't he suffer a stroke?

Mike O - thanks.

Sorry I'm a little confused. Something about straw men - Hay!

Could you explain for me more clearly then what exactly you meant by your statement,

"The right of survival of the fittest, natures ultimate right.."

and in particular how it relates to whaling in Antartica.

I'm "all fingers" with this at the mo.

you do not have to kill them

The experts on whales say otherwise.

There are so many things that can be learned from a small amount of blood in todays scientific research and animals do not need to be killed to do any of it.

Yes, many things can be learned from a blood sample, but not everything. It can't tell you the whales age or the whales sexual maturity or the amount and types of chemicals in various organs. If a blood sample could tell everything then doctors would never order any tests other than blood tests.

We all know the answer to this question is they do not have any.

Actually anyone that has taken off their blinders would find numerous papers.

Once again you do not have to kill an animal for research purposes with all of the advances in technology these days.

Once again for some data you do have to kill an animal.

The whales were hunted to near extinction generations

No some species were. Other species were hardly hunted at all. And currently some species can be sustainably hunted. Generations ago the American Bison was hunted much closer to extinction than any whale species, yet currently they are safe from extinction and support a sustainable level of hunting.

Could you explain for me more clearly then what exactly you meant by your statement,

Yes, I could explain what I meant.

Mike O - thanks.

"... Could you explain for me more clearly then what exactly you meant by your statement,

Yes, I could explain what I meant...."

Well - broken fingers? Or are you claiming the right to be silent for fear of incriminating yourself?

Remember - you brought up the right of the fittest and on this, a discussion forum, I'm just seeking a little clarity because as you hinted I'm not well schooled in the intricacies of current deliberations on biology / evolution.

a discussion forum

It is a news discussion forum. Not a satisfy someone's curiosity discussion forum, which would be off topic in this discussion. If you want to discus this article and whaling great.

Research whaling is explicitly allowed by the IWC charter. The majority of IWC members refuse to follow their review obligations under the moratorium. Japan could quit the IWC at any time and be free to resume commercial whaling. If commercial whaling isn't profitable then lift the moratorium for Antarctic Minke whales and no one will hunt them because of the lack of profit. The ICR followed the ICJ ruling. Australia has no claim to the high seas around Antarctica. The actions of the SSCS meet the UNCLOS definition of pirate.

That about covers the legal issues. The remaining arguments are moral and since every person has their own unique take on morals arguing from morals is generally a waste of time.

Mike O - thanks.

Good to see you back on topic.

And I certainly agree with you re some of the technicalities of the legalities of research whaling. I haver never said otherwise.

Some posters have never read the charter - I have. And it does say research whaling is allowed and it does say that as far as is possible the carcasses should be thoroughly utilized - ie not wasted, so processing the flesh for human consumption is legal and mandated.

And I have said on a number of occasions on this forum that Japan should just leave IWC - like some others - and just do what it feels right and let the market decide. Remove the considerable tax-funded subsidies and go for it I say.

If a govt can decide on hard topics like the death penalty or soldiers on active service, then this is small by comparison, so don't be bullied by a few pirates and protesters and instead embrace The Whaling. Japan should exercise it's right as a sovereign nation operating within it's rights and just do it.

browny1 - And I have said on a number of occasions on this forum that Japan should just leave IWC - like some others - and just do what it feels right and let the market decide. Remove the considerable tax-funded subsidies and go for it I say.

Since the Netherlands, British, and Sweden, thru their lotteries, have chosen to fund the latest eco-terrorist SS pirates garbage scow, it's obvious that they are one who should quit the IWC. It's not as if the Dutch, British and Swedish intend for the eco-terrorist SS to obey international law, or abide by IWC decisions.

It has been almost a week since this SSCS press release was posted and nothing new has been reported. Makes me think that they either lost the harpoon ship and/or they haven't found any of the other whalers, most especially the factory ship. Following and stopping one harpoon ship won't accomplish much.

The only way the SSCS has ever had any significant impact is when they have been able to hold position behind the factory ship and prevent any whales from being transferred from the harpoon ships.

If they can't find the factory ship they may have just prevented it from processing whales for a day or two while it moved away to another area with the other harpoon ships. And it is now back to processing while the SSCS is either following the lone harpoon ship they spotted or the SSCS isn't even in contact with the original ship and is again blindly roaming the vast Southern Ocean hoping to randomly bump into the whalers again.

Having dominion just means we may eat them.

F*&^% off Japan these whales are OUR whales. We been looking after them since whaling was ban. Australia has invested billions in protecting OUR whales. Just because your whale gets out it back yard into international waters means you a kill it.Like you don,t go killing the blokes dog from down the road because it got out.This is a good enough reason to refuse and service to these ship if they ever get into trouble. I know it a international law to help ship in distress but placing such a sanction on these ship is valid legal response to destroying a Countries economic industry which is whale watching.

Australia have been under going extensive research into quril for decades. ( This is on the internet) This is the only food source of whales in the south hemisphere. They eat nothing else. Australia has genetically change this food source to carry a protein that will not effect the whale reproduction but if those who eat the the whale. It is targeted at controlling the Great white Shark population which feed extensively on dead whales, seals and lately Ausssie and tourist, Shark attack have a big effect on tourism so the need for the program. I just feel sorry for the Japanese who eat this meat. The Japanese Government know of this and are feeding it to its populations. Whale meat from the northern hemisphere is not effected only Whales in the Southern Hemisphere.

It is sad that japan can not reach the common world understanding and agreement not to kill whales. It show poor honor to lie so obviously to the world or show a poor scientific skill to need so many kills every year.

It is rare the world is universal about protection. Whales have a soul in them that is beautiful. Killing them so openly show poor soul japaneese spirit.

Japan need to become adult in his dealing with the world. I know american and their bad ways tend to push people and their bad side for pride, but in the end this a matter of right and wrong, and not pride.

Whose whales are a sign of modernity in the soul of an advance country. It will be a urge step for japan to stop those hunting a become more reasonnable about their dealing with the world.

@arrestpaul sorry that your so salty but it just shows more countries support SS than those against them. They can get their funding even without the US. Japan is more than welcome to sue SS in UK , Australian , Swedish, Neterlands courts. good luck with that. LOL What Japan fails to realize is their continued recalcitrant pride on the useless cause which is whaling is just feeding the SS beast that continues to grow. There will come a day when SS boats outnumber the whalers, they can already outrun them with their new ship, imagine one SS boat harassing every whaling boat they send, cant wait. time to donate some more cash LOL

This is the only food source of whales in the south hemisphere. They eat nothing else.

That is not true. Krill do make up much of their diet but it is not the only thing they eat.

Australia has genetically change this food source to carry a protein that will not effect the whale reproduction but if those who eat the the whale.

Any source for this claim? And since krill around Antarctica are collected by humans to be eaten by humans (ever heard of Krill Oil pills?) then you are claiming that Australia is intentionally and knowingly poisoning humans around the world. And that the governments of the world know this and let it happen.

Whale meat from the northern hemisphere is not effected only Whales in the Southern Hemisphere.

And how does Australia magically keep these genetically modified krill from spreading out of the Southern Hemisphere?

It is sad that japan can not reach the common world understanding and agreement not to kill whales.

The IWC moratorium on whaling was approved by significantly less than half the world's countries.

show a poor scientific skill to need so many kills every year.

Actually they provide the statistical science behind their annual sample size and it is rooted in well known and understood principles.

Dom Palmer: It the Northern krill that are use for oil. Ok krill eating mammals in the North leave a red stain of the ice in the south the mammals leave a greens stain from eating southern Krill. There're different spices all together. I am just stating what I know is fact. Yes Japan Government have been told because they are the only people feeding on Southern whale. GO for it. Try it out. Then see if you have the ability to get excited and they don,t know how long the effect lasts.

It the Northern krill that are use for oil.

Antarctic Krill are extensively collected for krill oil.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2008/mar/23/fishing.food

<http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/science/tracking-antarctic-krill-as-more-is-harvested-for-omega-3-pills.html

So it appears Antarctic krill ARE used for oil. Also still waiting for anything even hinting at this Australia genetic manipulation.

Like they are going to tell the public. Look under Australian krill research Tasmania. It will tell you about how excited they are at the advencement they have made.

Look under Australian krill research Tasmania. It will tell you about how excited they are at the advencement they have made.

I did as suggested. Found nothing about any genetic modification, but did find plenty about how Antarctic krill ARE collected for use in making krill oil supplements for human consumption.

So we are back to the claim that despite knowing that Australia is doing some mad scientists genetic manipulation of krill, the rest of the world governments (and Australia) are perfectly happy letting their populations eat this intentionally poisoned product. And yet no one can provide a single source for the claim.

Mike

Don't expect to find any source other than random claims by anonymous commenters. Krill have been and continue to be harvested in large quantities from around Antarctica for human consumption. And no one or country has genetically manipulated them in a way that won't harm the whales but will harm anything eating the whale meat.

Did see a quick bit from radio NZ that SSCS has spotted another harpoon ship but still no Nisshin Maru. My guess would be the harpoon ships are taking turns leading the SSCS on wild goose chases while the Nisshin Maru and the other harpoon ships continue to kill whales. With only two ships, only one of which can keep up with the harpoon ships, SSCS's only hope is just pure luck to find the Nisshin Maru. And as long as one of the harpoon ships keeps the Ocean Warrior in radar range they can relay the location to the Nisshin Maru making it almost impossible for SSCS to ever find it.