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U.S. conducting late-night Osprey drills despite agreement not to do so

64 Comments

Defense Minister Itsunori Onodera said Friday that the U.S. military has been conducting Osprey training flights after 10 p.m. in Okinawa, despite an agreement with the Japanese government not to do so.

Twelve MV-22 Osprey tilt-rotor aircraft are based at the U.S. Marines air base at Futenma, with another 12 due to be deployed later in the summer.

Onodera said the original agreement with the U.S. government stipulated that Osprey training flights would not be held between 10 p.m. and 6 a.m., TV Asahi reported. The Osprey were observed flying after 10 p.m. on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday this week, Onodera told reporters.

Okinawan government officials have lodged a complaint and Onodera said he will ask the U.S. side for further information on the drills.

Earlier this month, Osaka Mayor Toru Hashimoto and Osaka Gov Ichiro Matsui offered to ease the base-sharing burden on Okinawa by inviting the U.S. military to hold Osprey flight drills at Yao airport in the prefecture.

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64 Comments
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Meh, why do they do whatever they want?

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Because they can. And, in case you haven't noticed, the Chinese are becoming increasingly more brazen in their encroachment of Japanese maritime waters. This is NOT something to be taken lightly. The Marines are here as a deterrence. They must train. Wars do not stop between the hours of 10pm and 6am. If they Okinawans have a problem with this, they need to stop whining and let the Futenma replacement facility be built. The reality is the Marines are in Okinawa for a reason. The Japanese and nearly every other nation in the Asia-Pacific region want them there. Freedom is not free.

-2 ( +10 / -12 )

Freedom is not free.

My concept of freedom is different from yours. If they are not able to respect people who they should defend, I don't see how they are able actually to defend them. I don't believe China is dangerous. I have a different vision about what is happening around the Asia-Pacific region. I believe the USA and China are actually building up a strong partnership, even if everything apparently suggests this is not the case.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

Readers, please keep the discussion focused on the Osprey flights.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

In San Diego, they have time limits and they are followed by the Marines and Navy. It seems as if they're more arrogant when it comes to "others".

6 ( +10 / -4 )

I was at a friend's barbecue yesterday evening. Everybody was having a good time, eating, drinking, chatting.

Then suddenly the peace was shattered by an Osprey overhead. It was deafening.

I didn't look at the time, but it was well after 10PM.

I could understand if there was an actual war on.

There isn't, but the U.S.A. seems determined to create one.

-5 ( +9 / -14 )

The thing with the osprey flight training, or any other flight training for the military is that, it is not only a question of flying the aircraft, it is also a question of making sure you could spring the pilots awake at odd hours and have them flight ready. Perhaps because most disaster training takes place at the convenient hours, we assume that the enemy waits for the convenient hour to attack, or that quakes happen only at our convenient hours. On the other hand, we shouldnt forget that these crafts could equally be called in for civilian rescue missions in times of disaster. That said, I think should Japan be wining at every turn about the troops, the US should pack and leave them the handle their defense issues.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

The thing with the osprey flight training, or any other flight training for the military is that, it is not only a question of flying the aircraft, it is also a question of making sure you could spring the pilots awake at odd hours and have them flight ready.

If night-time flying is so important, the US should never have agreed not to fly the darn things at night in the first place. Did they make the agreement knowing all along that they intended to break it? In what way does that kind of attitude garner trust between allies? How can any agreement made with the US be taken seriously, when they're so ready to go back on their word?

4 ( +9 / -5 )

An agreement is an agreement, even one between the US and Japan.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

Three days out of the week and exactly how long after 10PM? Knowing how Japanese timetables work, it might have been 10:01 to bring about this complaint.

-6 ( +5 / -11 )

The thing with the osprey flight training, or any other flight training for the military is that, it is not only a question of flying the aircraft, it is also a question of making sure you could spring the pilots awake at odd hours and have them flight ready. Perhaps because most disaster training takes place at the convenient hours, we assume that the enemy waits for the convenient hour to attack, or that quakes happen only at our convenient hours.

This is what MOST people don't understand, because a large majority NEVER have served in the military, but as you said, the pilots need to be prepared at ANY given time, many covert assaults happen during the night, because it obscures a lot of the human form and it gives the pilots and crew the element of surprise. Yes, I do think it can be nerve rattling to hear that late at night, but it goes with the territory. People just need to grin and bear it.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

Yes, I do think it can be nerve rattling to hear that late at night, but it goes with the territory. People just need to grin and bear it.

That's all well and fine ! But an AGREEMENT is an AGREEMENT - or am I not understanding the meaning of this word ? If it's so easy to go back on one's word and the answer is to "grin and bear it", what is the world coming to ?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

As long as seeing many American soldiers incidents in Okinawa, it seems that they would never follow such an agreement.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

bass4funk, you make a good point but the US made an agreement not to fly them during certain hours. As I always say agreements between America and Japan/Okinawa are worthless because the Americans always break them. As to protecting Japan these 12 aircraft are not there to defend Okinawa. They are there to train on bases paid for by the Japaneses taxpayers. They said anything to bring these aircraft to Okinawa. Made an agreement they knew would never be kept. This is proof of their unbelievable arrogance and disrespect of the Okinawa people.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

The Osprey were observed flying after 10 p.m. on Monday

how can you see anything clearly after 10pm??

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

Well... the agreement is that there will be no TRAINING flights after 10pm.

Not ever flight is a "training" flight. Could be a simply movement of aircraft, could be a maintenance check, could be any of a number of things that aren't even remotely considered "training".

1 ( +3 / -2 )

@Yuri

I am not a military spokesperson. There must be a reason as to why the agreement was not followed up on. Agreements should be honored, but if NOT, there clearly must be a reason for that. No one has the right to condemn or say anything unless we know the exact details and facts as to why this happened. Let's be rational and NOT prejudge.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

"Okinawan government officials have lodged a complaint"

Because they can. When the Chinese take over, there won't be any more lodging of complaints.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

Three days out of the week and exactly how long after 10PM? Knowing how Japanese timetables work, it might have been 10:01 to bring about this complaint.

It doesn't matter if it was 10:01, or 12:01, the US made an agreement it has not adhered to. I am with the Okinawan's on this one. If they can't keep the agreement ground the planes. (Or make another agreement!)

how can you see anything clearly after 10pm??

Obviously you have never been around Futenma. If you were here you would know, they could be seen, and the planes themselves don't fly dark either.

I am not a military spokesperson. There must be a reason as to why the agreement was not followed up on. Agreements should be honored, but if NOT, there clearly must be a reason for that. No one has the right to condemn or say anything unless we know the exact details and facts as to why this happened. Let's be rational and NOT prejudge.

Common courtesy dictates that if there was a pressing need for the night flights, training or otherwise, the USMC had an obligation to notify the Japanese Defense Ministry of the scheduled (night) flights and let them notify the Okinawan authorities.

By not following the terms of the agreement the US is 100% at fault here.

7 ( +10 / -3 )

calr751,

how can you see anything clearly after 10pm??

I wondered if someone would ask this one.

In my case, the Osprey was over Ginowan and the lights of the city made it visible. Apart from that the noise is hideous.

And, please if the US military really HAS TO practice night flying, do it in Iwojima, the Senkakus or somewhere where people are not inconvenienced by it.

The best would be over US territory.

Okinawa, by the way, is NOT US territory any more.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

I understand and agree it is not really militarily desirable to ban flying at night, for the reasons others have said already.

However, an agreement is an agreement.

Not ever flight is a "training" flight. Could be a simply movement of aircraft, could be a maintenance check, could be any of a number of things that aren't even remotely considered "training".

Oh great, let's just rename all the training flights into something else and keep flying. I guess the Japanese government just underestimated the deviousness of the legalistic Yankees.

I am not a military spokesperson. There must be a reason as to why the agreement was not followed up on. Agreements should be honored, but if NOT, there clearly must be a reason for that. No one has the right to condemn or say anything unless we know the exact details and facts as to why this happened. Let's be rational and NOT prejudge.

When you enter an agreement, you don't just break it because you have a reason. The reason must, at the very least, be unforeseen, the need time-critical and huge, and there must be no other reasonably practical alternative. Even if we grant there is a need to train at night, I don't see how the "unforeseen" condition can be fulfilled.

Common courtesy dictates that if there was a pressing need for the night flights, training or otherwise, the USMC had an obligation to notify the Japanese Defense Ministry of the scheduled (night) flights and let them notify the Okinawan authorities.

Allow me to be a cynic and say the Defense Ministry will say "Yes sir!" and phone the Okinawan authorities on even the slightest justification - do you really see them saying No?

6 ( +7 / -1 )

Allow me to be a cynic and say the Defense Ministry will say "Yes sir!" and phone the Okinawan authorities on even the slightest justification - do you really see them saying No?

And let me return your cynicism and ask if you actually read what I wrote?

Let me repeat myself here: Common courtesy dictates that if there was a pressing need for the night flights, training or otherwise, the USMC had an obligation to NOTIFY the Japanese Defense Ministry.

Never said "ask".

1 ( +2 / -1 )

An agreement was made. Other points are irrelevant. No flights after 10:00pm. Period.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

I understand how painful must be for the residents of Okinawa, to have so many US bases there. But i don't understand why do they keep protesting to the solders themselves ? It's not their decision to be there. If they don't want the bases to be there, then why not go and protest against your stupid government ? Tell your government to remove them, if that's what you want, but its very meaningless to protest and blame the solders for being there, its not their decision. If it's ''shouganai'' again, then just shut up and bare the pain, if you don't want to bare the pain, go and protest and make your government remove the bases.

Also, it is not right to criticize others without proposing a better solution yourself. Many people want to be protected from China and North Korea, but on the same time, they don't want to have bases near them. That's understandable, but they don't propose any solution, they just criticise any attempt and solving the problem. If you hate something, just criticising it using words will not solve your problem, and criticising others without doing anything yourself is not a good thing to do.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

happystory,

Why do the Okinawans complain to the soldiers?

Well, one reason is that the puppet government in Japan has its collective hearing aids turned off when it comes to Okinawa. They believe the hype that "Japan needs protection against the evil and dangerous Chinese and North Koreans," but want their protection as far from Tokyo as possible. They don't care if Okinawa gets attacked, but they wouldn't want anything to happen close to home.

So, what do they care if Osprey training flights buzz Okinawan cities at all times of day and night?

"If it keeps them happy, let them get on with it," they seem to be saying.

The soldiers are not inconvenienced by excruciatingly loud military aircraft flying overhead at any time of day or night. They signed up for it. The people of Okinawa didn't sign up for it and don't want it.

Why don't they do their Osprey training flights over US territory?

The US is a huge country compared to Okinawa.

They have PLENTY of space.

They should use it!

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Under an agreement on noise prevention between Japan and the United States, Osprey flights from 10 PM to 6 AM are supposed to be kept to a minimum.

Here it is from NHK

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/english/news/20130614_29.html

Night time Flights are not ban @ Japan Today Please check your facts

0 ( +3 / -3 )

BertieWooster,

Japan does need protection, especially now, when China is getting increasingly stronger and nationalistic. If the US bases weren't there, who knows what would of happened by now. But that's not the question, the question is, why do people of Okinawa blame the solders for being there ? It's not their choice to be there, and its not their choice whether they will fly at night and make noise.

There are many solutions to this problem, but people don't seem to engage that much. They could build a small offshore land, just like the Kansai international airport, and host the bases there, that's one solution, im sure there are other ways of solving it, but people are not doing anything other than to criticise the bases and any attempt at solving the problem, without proposing anything themselves.

People seems to be more interested in installing pride and nationalism in people, they gather every sunday with those black vans and shout and scream like insane nationalistic lunatics. Why don't they do the same with the bases ? Instead of shouting and spreading ignorance, they could protest and demand their government to do more about the bases.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Ospreys have landed on a Japanese destroyer taking part in the joint Japan-U.S. military exercise.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

This is the same thing as when the Osprey did Night training in Oct 2012, And every time the Newspapers come out and stay that Night flights are ban, and every time the GOJ checks and clear the US military (The Oct 2012 Night Flights did not break the agreement b/c it was required night training) My guess is this was required training again, and the Japanese newspapers will never print that the flights didn't break the agreement after the GOJ checks.......... any takers on that bet?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

There is bit of quid pro quo here as the Japanese self-defence force have been doing "re-taking" islands exercises on American territory, would be presumably not be very quiet. Oddly enough, it was on continental USA, when Hawaii is much closer and has a wonderfully large harbour to practice in.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

10:01pm?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

happystory,

Japan does need protection, especially now, when China is getting increasingly stronger and nationalistic.

Sorry, but I don't buy the hype.

The economics of China, Japan and the U.S.A. are so intermingled that aggression would be impossible.

In addition to which, you have large Chinese populations in the U.S.A. who still keep close contact with mainland China.

The aggressor is the U.S.A.

These Osprey flights are just showing off.

There is no reason for the US military to be here in force.

Osprey training could just as easily be done in the U.S.A. where there is much more space and fewer people to inconvenience.

Late night Osprey flights are doing nothing to improving US-Okinawa relations.

In fact, quite the opposite.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Well we dont want to ruin anyones dinner, especially those after 10 pm (bertiwahwah). Hello Children, wake up and smell the chowmein, the marines can only get good at what they do if they train day and night. if okinawa wanted to be independent then they should of sued for independence in 1972, instead all they did was side with the previous occupiers (satsuma). If you want to know what Okinawans should do now, is to look to the past and see how the Shoei, Ryukyu Kingdom, treated the Chinese and Japanese and Koreans. With indifference. They were independent and loyal to none, only taking what was beneficial to the people of Okinawa. A Japanese yoke is the same as an American one, and lighter then a Chinese one, a Okinawan one has yet to be made. Peace

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Todd the Okinawa people are not here to serve the US military. A yoke of oppression is still a yoke of oppression. Yes the Marines need to train but they can do it where they do not bother people. An agreement was made and broken. Soon it will be like no agreement was made and the US military will do what they want as usual. It is clearly a sign of disrespect to the Okinawa people. As for China oh please! At worse the SDF can hold them off until the US arrives to help.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Bertie, like it or not, you are ignorant. Yes, ignorant. Nothing more, nothing less, your comments are based on "feelings" and not reality.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@bertie

And, please if the US military really HAS TO practice night flying, do it in Iwojima, the Senkakus or somewhere where people are not inconvenienced by it.

From what it looks like the only inconvenience is the noise and that's about it.

The best would be over US territory.

Yeah, but we are NOT in the US, so.....

Okinawa, by the way, is NOT US territory any more.

No, but the military is stationed there and according to the SOFA will be there for the next foreseeable future, get used to it.

Sorry, but I don't buy the hype.

Bertie, you don't have to, no one is forcing you to, even if you are totally wrong.

The economics of China, Japan and the U.S.A. are so intermingled that aggression would be impossible.

Do you know how many countries in the past we thought we real friends and alliances and then it all went South?

In addition to which, you have large Chinese populations in the U.S.A. who still keep close contact with mainland China.

How insulting! That's not saying the Japanese community in the states will keep an eye on Japan. Most American Chinese have nothing to do with the mainland and many of the students are trying to stay in the states after they finish University.

The aggressor is the U.S.A.

Where is your proof? Did you bring it up to the MPs? How about bringing some legitimate document that states that.

These Osprey flights are just showing off.

Are you jealous? I'd be. Love them!

There is no reason for the US military to be here in force.

So instead of whining, how about being a part of the solution! Talk to your local politician or see if you can talk to someone on base and present your wishes, that's the problem.

Osprey training could just as easily be done in the U.S.A. where there is much more space and fewer people to inconvenience.

But they are stationed here, so they can easily fly them just as well. We have THE most skilled pilots in the world, they should be able to maneuver quite well, even in smaller spaces. Besides, takes a lot of skill to fly one of those.

Late night Osprey flights are doing nothing to improving US-Okinawa relations.

Listening to you, I highly doubt it EVER, EVER will, so why bother, damned if you do, damned if you don't.

In fact, quite the opposite.

Then they all need to suck it up.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

bass4funk the government of Okinawa has sent in a complaint. The Americans are breaking the agreement. There is no question about it and the written agreement is being changed to make it possible. The Americans impose themselves on the Okinawa people because the Japanese let them. I wonder what the Americans will do next? The Americans need to make agreement with the government of Okinawa to be on the high moral ground. While they do not have to do this it is the number one reason the Okinawa people want them GONE! These things are noisy! Making the lives of the Okinawa people miserable 24 hours a day. How are people suppose to sleep? This is our island and there is no place to get away from the noise. My friend says we need the Mainland Chinese to liberate us from the Americans. The Americans have caused us nothing but trouble for 68 years!

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

@yuri

Ok, that was the first step, now let the process work its course, and take it from there. Gripin' about won't change ANYTHING, until you hear a response, then just deal with it, that's it. No matter how you or Bertie pout and throw a tantrum, that's how it's going to be for now.

The Americans impose themselves on the Okinawa people because the Japanese let them.

So take it up with the Japanese mainland politicians, that's all you can do. The US can't or won't change anything unless the politicians come and put it in writing and it directly comes from Parliament.

While they do not have to do this

Says who? YOU??? Who are you to say what the US military needs or doesn't need?

it is the number one reason the Okinawa people want them GONE! These things are noisy! Making the lives of the Okinawa people miserable 24 hours a day. How are people suppose to sleep?

Like I said, until some changes come from the top, until then, I'd suggest in buying a box of ear plugs.

My friend says we need the Mainland Chinese to liberate us from the Americans. The Americans have caused us nothing but trouble for 68 years!

Who was the one that put the country in that position to begin with? Also, you live in America, right, so which is it? If you live in the states, then you have nothing to do really with what is going on here, even if it is where you once lived, I am assuming you pay taxes in the US, correct? Or then leave the states and move back here. By the way, knowing you how you feel about China and that last comment, be careful what you wish for.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Readers, please stay on topic. China is not relevant to this discussion.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Bertie Wooster.....the posts you make just show your ignorance, yes ignorance of reality. Thanks for the humor!

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@ Yubaru

Japan does have 'Marines', they're just not called 'Marines.' They are called the 'Special Naval Landing Forces' (SNLF), which is the same damn thing. If you want to call me out on something, come with a little big more intellect and substance.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

As long as seeing many American soldiers incidents in Okinawa, it seems that they would never follow such an agreement.

Americans consider Japan, in general and Okinawa, in particular as defeated nation and plain servants. That's why they behave themselves this way.

You can not break an agreement with a friend, otherwise you will lose a respect. But you can break an agreement with a servant. His opinion has no any weight for you. North Americans show the same attitude to their so-called "allies" everywhere.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

http://www.mofa.go.jp/mofaj/area/usa/sfa/pdfs/jc_mv22_2.pdf

Both flight and ground operations between the hours of 2200 and 0600 are limited to those considered necessary for US operational requirements. Night training flights are limited to the minimum required to fulfill assigned US Forces Japan missions and maintain aircrew proficiency. Unit Commanders will exert every effort to complete night flying operations as early as practical.

Well, here is the truth if any one wants it..........

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Ugh, it sounds like no real restriction at all. Minimum required for operational requirements is no restraint.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@BertieWooster

Night vision goggles are a huge tool for Helo pilots, they need Familiarization Flights of their training and landing area b/c things look very different with NVGs on its more of a safety currency check to make sure that they can fly safely with them on.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Tyler Vandenberg, they can do it someplace else than Okinawa! They can fly to America and fly at night there, no advantage is being made doing it in Okinawa. It is always the Americans, they should be given everything they want. While the Japanese permit it, the Americans are doing the dirty deed! Then again what else do you expect from a government that spies on its own people?

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

@ YuriOtani no b/c with NVGs you don't see the same so Okinawa looks different and they need to be familiar with Okinawa at night with NVGs so they don't crash into the ground when the they stuck in a situation where they have to land in Okinawa at night with NVGs and they have never done it before. Most of the training is done in night Labs and the Simulator, then they have to do the area Familiarization Flight to get the qual so most of the training is being done other ways, They could do it other places, but its safer for the pilot to know what his home airport looks like with NVGs on and land there before he has to do it in an emergency situation.

Here is a NVG video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=-v62cK1oN7Y

It is always the Americans, they should be given everything they want. While the Japanese permit it, the Americans are doing the dirty deed!

Please explain how the Americans are doing the dirty deed.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Japan does have 'Marines', they're just not called 'Marines.' They are called the 'Special Naval Landing Forces' (SNLF), which is the same damn thing. If you want to call me out on something, come with a little big more intellect and substance.

Dude you living in WWII? Sure they HAD Marines back then, but not NOW in 2013, so take your own advice.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

They can do it someplace else than Okinawa! They can fly to America and fly at night there, no advantage is being made doing it in Okinawa. It is always the Americans, they should be given everything they want. While the Japanese permit it, the Americans are doing the dirty deed! Then again what else do you expect from a government that spies on its own people?

Tyler does have a point about having to be familiar with local conditions. Besides, skills are perishable, so it isn't like the pilots can fly to America, punch in the number of annual NVG-flying hours mandated by the regulations in a cram course then come back and not practise the skill the rest of the year. Or do you propose they make weekly trips to America?

We are seeing a confluence of things here, among which is of course the government apparently selling the agreement as worth more than it really is.

But then, perhaps even the Japanese Defense Ministry genuinely thought the Yankees won't push it so far. Japanese feel at least obligated to give words like "minimum" real meaning even if it inconveniences them, and America takes a legalistic stance of maximal exploitation. So if Japan and America's positions were reversed, we might be seeing Osprey flights once per week.

But ultimately, the fundamental problem, and the one peaceniks aren't willing to see, is Japan's inability to mobilize the will to divert sufficient resources for defense. So America does the defending for them. Japan is thus a protectorate in the literal sense of the word and cannot speak loudly in such problems.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

@techno

Americans consider Japan, in general and Okinawa, in particular as defeated nation and plain servants. That's why they behave themselves this way.

So now you speak for ALL Americans? I'm an American and I never thought like that.

You can not break an agreement with a friend, otherwise you will lose a respect.

Agreements get broken all the time, I could give you a mile long list of agreements that were broken that the US had with other countries as well and NO, it doesn't justify anything, but these things happen, just have to live with it. The sun will still rise tomorrow.

But you can break an agreement with a servant. His opinion has no any weight for you. North Americans show the same attitude to their so-called "allies" everywhere.

And the opposite as well.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

There is no reason for the US military to be here in force.

By this then you agree that there is a reason for the US to be here in the first place. Now then whether or not they are here "in force" is open to discussion. Thank you for acknowledging the facts.

Osprey training could just as easily be done in the U.S.A. where there is much more space and fewer people to inconvenience.

In actually, since you are ignorant of the mission or purpose of why the Osprey's are here in the first place it is easy for the uninformed to make blanket statements like this that are off the mark.

The Osprey's and the entire air wing of the USMC for that matter work and train in conjunction with the ground elements of the MC so they need to be here to train with them.

Taking the Osprey units somewhere else too far away from the ground forces as you think in your statement here that they could do their training in the US, defeats their purpose.

You don't play a game of baseball and have the pitcher playing in one ballpark and the catcher playing somewhere else. They have to be together in the same place for them to do their jobs. Same with the Osprey's.

Late night Osprey flights are doing nothing to improving US-Okinawa relations.

No one made this assertion or even suggested it. Unrelated to the topic and just seems like stirring the pot.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

So now you speak for ALL Americans? I'm an American and I never thought like that.

Seems, you are lucky exception.

Agreements get broken all the time, I could give you a mile long list of agreements that were broken that the US had with other countries as well and NO, it doesn't justify anything, but these things happen, just have to live with it. The sun will still rise tomorrow.

If Americans like to break agreements, it does not mean that other nations often do the same. If you deliberately break an agreement, you have no respect to other side. That's why there is nothing strange in night flights of American Ospreys over Okinawa. An agreement? Big deal. WHO cares?

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

China is not relevant...

Then the flights are useless, the US bases have no purpose.

it is also a question of making sure you could spring the pilots awake at odd hours and have them flight ready. they have to do the area Familiarization

SO WHAT ? I grew up in a military town and they had a yearly special training period for nights, long drills and weather conditions, and even enter your garden. That was announced years in advance to residents. The rest of the year, they had rules and they'd limit to their woods (a zone inhabited at 90% by families of military).

Who are you to say what the US military needs or doesn't need?

Unless the law of the jungle applies, only Japanese citizens have that right. US military should obey to them, only to them. Or they should leave the areas under Japanese sovereignty.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Meh... They do what ever want, because they are the Gangsters of the World...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Unless the law of the jungle applies, only Japanese citizens have that right. US military should obey to them, only to them. Or they should leave the areas under Japanese sovereignty.

Do you have any idea how flawed your logic is here?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

@techno

Seems, you are lucky exception.

Oh, I seriously, highly doubt that.

If Americans like to break agreements, it does not mean that other nations often do the same.

Yeah, they do, seriously.

If you deliberately break an agreement, you have no respect to other side.

I agree! That's why I personally have a problem with other countries that criticize the US, but don't look in their own backyard.

That's why there is nothing strange in night flights of American Ospreys over Okinawa. An agreement? Big deal. WHO cares?

Like we do all the time, you just have to suck it up, at least for the time being.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Send them home :P

Let China, Japan, South Korea and Taiwan settle the security of the region between themselves.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/7/china-helps-anti-piracy-effort-it-harries-japans-c/

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I am a little disappointing that the time of the flights was not included. Not because 10:01 makes it less right or wrong, but because providing the time would just be better journalism. Todd thank you for including the text from the agreement, that also could have been included in the article for a sense of context.

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Like we do all the time, you just have to suck it up, at least for the time being.

:-))) You can tell to your puppets. In case of military engagement with India, China or Russia you will suck collectively. Let us be honest, you are crappy warriors. All you can is to bomb a single ME country with a huge bunch of NATO servants, in a proportion 100 : 1. In a 1 : 1 ratio you suck *** of defenders, like it took place in Vietnam.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Wonder what would be happening now if they were flying over Tokyo or Osaka. It does seem that the Okinawans are putting up with the noise for the rest of the country. I am not saying US bases are not needed, but the entire country needs to share the brunt rather than pushing it down south.

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Alex80 (Jun. 15, 2013 - 07:01AM JST) asks why the marines can do whatever they want. To this, Elements (Jun. 15, 2013 - 07:12AM JST) answers "because they can.

Elements is correct in saying the U.S. Marines can do whatever they want in Okinawa because Okinawa is their unmistakable military colony. This state of affairs is sanctioned by Japan, which is a U.S. vassal itself.

Since before Okinawa's reversion to Japan there have been numerous agreements, including gentleman's agreements, signed between local governments and U.S. forces to minimize noise, crimes, or stop training facility construction near civilian residential areas, and what not. But such agreements have never failed to be breached.

This is what the U.S. forces have been to us, insincere and untrustworthy foreign troops doing whatever they want to do as occupiers but touting themselves as "good neighbors."

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@techno

You can tell to your puppets. In case of military engagement with India, China or Russia you will suck collectively.

Now you are sounding the kid down the street that got beat and swears he will come back and bring his older sister to kick your butt. lol

That is a pipe dream, NO way, NO how, never would happen and even if it did. I really don't think you know the intricate details of the full might of the US military, you just have NO idea.

Let us be honest, you are crappy warriors.

Won our Independence from at the time was THE greatest military in the world and we didn't even have a real military, most of them were merchants and farmers

Fought 2 World Wars, the second on 2 sides of the world, the Atlantic and the Pacific.

Liberated Kuwait.

Got Saddam and his thuggish sons.

Got OBL.

I'd say a 9 out of 10 is NOT all that bad to be honest with you,

All you can is to bomb a single ME country with a huge bunch of NATO servants, in a proportion 100 : 1. In a 1 : 1 ratio you suck *** of defenders, like it took place in Vietnam.

What time period are you from???? ROFL

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

@techno

As for your "full military might", you tried to bomb a small Vietnam into Stone Age.

Ever heard of "Rules of engagement?" if we wanted to, we could have vaporized the entire country, but that wasn't the objective, our hands were tied and we were limited as to how far and exactly how much force to apply, also take into consideration that the South Vietnamese didn't put up a strong fight. Had they not done that and fought for their country, the outcome would have been totally different. We trained them to take over and fight the North, but that didn't pan out the way we wanted.

They fought back and finally kicked you out ot their country.

As I just elaborated you are way off but, you are most certainly welcome.

You tried to exterminate Taliban in Afganistan for 12 years (together with your NATO sidekicks) and nowadays Taliban laughs at your faces.

We killed the main larger targets that matter, the soldiers are not as big of a threat, but as far as many of their higher ranking leaders, we pretty much obliterated them, so as far as that is concerned, for the most part our objectives were met.

They even opened their embassy in Quatar, spitting at Karzai, your puppet.

I would do that if a could and a lot of other people for different reasons though. The man is a sneak, a cheat and most importantly an opportunist. Can't wait till he's out of office.

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@techno

As I said before, that is absolutely not true under ANY circumstances.

As for the Osprey, they are truly magnificent flying machines and I do think, there is a perfectly valid reason for them to not honor the contract. We shouldn't rush to judgement just because this promise was broken, we don't know why, yet.

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