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Rally-go-round

69 Comments

Members of the nationalist movement "Ganbare Nippon" shout slogans during a rally near the South Korean embassy in Tokyo on Thursday.

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Ironic the little old man on the left is talking about Korea and their history, given he probably forgets what he doled out on them.

7 ( +14 / -7 )

Wow, what is with all the anger and hatred lately in Japan, South Korea and China. Instead of all the aggressive words and posturing, why can't the leaders of the countries sit down and talk about it like adults. I know, I know, it's because they all act like children and have half a brain between them, but it would be nice for a change.

13 ( +16 / -3 )

C'mon Japan, let's stay classy and not dip down a notch like the other folks.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

The more the South Koreans act the way they have been lately, the more you'll see stuff like this in Japan. Better than lobbing missiles at each other I suppose.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

It was noisy around the Korean Embassy here in Tokyo today (Thursday), but not as loud as it was from Saturday through yesterday (Wednesday) ... the Obon holiday period. Guess some of those people in the vehicles equipped with loudspeakers had to return to work today, so this took them out of the protest movement. Anyway, as the photo shows, there's still action going on around the Embassy. And my home is well protected as we now have a policeman stationed at the end of our narrow street. As a matter of fact, police are stationed at the lead-ins to most of the streets around the Embassy.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Flag makers certainly do good business during patriotic surges like this.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

Don't know how many people were actually there (wouldn't think (or hope) there to have been too many),but rallies of this nature in Japan is the last thing that needs to happen at this time. Sincerely hope things settle down soon somehow, although it does seem difficult to slow down the provocative remarks on the part of the Korean presidency.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

I haven't heard a whisper or seen anything at all of the anti-nuclear power protesting which gets so much attention here, but I've seen and heard loads from both right-wing / ultra-nationalists since last week and seen another loud protest march by an anti-war / anti-yasukuni group. Are the anti-nulear power protests all stationary and quiet or something?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

B/C when times are tough and your government doesn’t have your back, they have to focus on external (i.e. imaginary) bogeymen to distract you. Anything to help you forget about austerity and nuclear wankery. Anything to prevent you from holding them accountable. Blaming the furriners is always the wise course for aspiring fascists. It’s ironically universal—what unites us is our penchant for divisiveness.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

B/C when times are tough and your government doesn’t have your back, they have to focus on external (i.e. imaginary) bogeymen to distract you. Anything to help you forget about austerity and nuclear wankery. Anything to prevent you from holding them accountable. Blaming the furriners is always the wise course for aspiring fascists. It’s ironically universal—what unites us is our penchant for divisiveness.

Whooo... deep.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Thunderbird: "The more the South Koreans act the way they have been lately, the more you'll see stuff like this in Japan. Better than lobbing missiles at each other I suppose."

Takes to two tango. The SKoreans stepped up their rhetoric when Japan stepped up its rhetoric on this and other island issues. That, and the fact that despite Japan marking the end of the war yesterday it forgets why they war happened, even blaming the West for it instead of doing a bit of soul searching.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

Diappointed not to see any of the military Rising sun versions of the flag. That would REALLY remind the Koreans why they are unhappy.

-1 ( +5 / -7 )

Point I was trying to make, Smithy, is that both sides should just shut up. The war ended 67 years ago. Who cares why it started, it's over. You don't see Poland demanding apologies from Germany, and what the Germans did to the Jews, Gypsies, gays and what have you was far, far worse than what the Japanese ever did to the Koreans.

East Asia needs to move on and stop banging on about the bloody war.

-3 ( +10 / -13 )

This takes away from more important things . They should use this energy to protest at the home of Shimizu and the other crooked TEPCO execs, who harmed Japan far more than these islands could.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

If its anything like the protests for nuclear power, it'll fade out.

Police put the number at 600; organizers claim 60,000.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

If only we could get rid of all the radical fringe elements from every country, the world would be a better place

4 ( +6 / -2 )

In Tokyo too. Yawn. Can't we build some kind of thema park on the rocks ? It would be decorated like 1930. Let's ask the Robot production that did the SanChome movies. From next year, we could send there all the Dainipponese and Chosenians that live in that pre-war in their heads... Obviously, that's a suffering for them to live in 2012, so they'd be happier there. Lee and Ishihara could be mayors of 2 cities inside the park. They'd have soccer games.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Thunderbird2: "Who cares why it started, it's over. You don't see Poland demanding apologies from Germany, and what the Germans did to the Jews, Gypsies, gays and what have you was far, far worse than what the Japanese ever did to the Koreans."

They don't demand Germany apologize because they always do, with some Chancellors -- who obviously had nothing to do with the acts of his ancestors -- prostrating themselves in apology at Auscwitz and other memorials. They have apologized and atoned for their atrocities, Japan has never truly apologized, and denies the past (in fact, changes it in the textbooks). Where are the apologies for the more than 10 million (more than the holocaust, let me point out) that Japan killed until it's reign was ended?

I agree both sides should shut up, but it'll never happen while Japan denies the past. All these idiots in the picture are brainwashed fools who have no idea but are just angry about Dokdo because they have been made to look the fools they are internationally. SK is not innocent on the brainwashing either, obviously, the difference is they WERE the victims back then, not Japan, as much as some Japanese claim they were.

5 ( +13 / -8 )

Where are the barricades and huge police presence? Oh right! This protest does not affect the rich boys' pocketbooks.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Making me sick

2 ( +4 / -2 )

what is happening? we should understand that bullying gets to conflicts, conflicts get to wars and wars have no winners. If the politicians of each country exploiting the situation for their own end then at least the public should realize the importance of peace and the masses should compelled their respective governments to be responsible and seek for peace and dialogue, even after hundred years of wars the nations ultimately come to the table.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

A trip to the disputed islands is one thing.

A personal attack on the most respected citizen in the country and cultural representative of the nation is quite another.

The emperor has been a potent force for easing tensions between Japan and North Korea, particularly during the heat of the abductee crisis.

Island disputes are one thing, but this statement by Lee is nothing but inflammatory, adding insult to injury.

Even if the Japanese government did something to compensate comfort women victims of the war, this statement by Lee, conversely, will persist in the collective memory of the Japanese as somewhat barbaric, utterly uncouth, and basically hostile.

I don't know when he is up for election, but if the Koreans don't have a way to rein him in, the mutually antagonistic nationalism will escalate, certainly not optimal for the situation in East Asia.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

Smithinjapan: very well explained. I just would like to add that every German kids learn deeply what their country did. They all go visiting concentration camps and memorials about these atrocities. This is now an assimilated history fact and there is absolutely no more hanger between Germany and the allies or the Jewish people. Last but not least Europe was created pretty quickly to prevent this to happen again. They truly have learnt from the past. It shows it is possible when people want to move forward for a better future.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

ubikwit: "Island disputes are one thing, but this statement by Lee is nothing but inflammatory, adding insult to injury."

You're absolutely right on that, and I think Lee knows he went overboard with the Emperor comments and demand for an apology. As I have stated time and again, the Emperor is one of the biggest supporters of peace in the region, despite what his ancestors have done, and he has even gone so far as to admin there were Koreans in the past who married emperors and Korean blood is in their veins (blew away the black-truckers). His philanthropic activities put him above question on this.

All the same, while Lee's comments might not be forgivable, they came as a reaction to Japanese sentiment about sexual slavery and the islands. It's not a one-way street, and these guys better work hard now to patch things up.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

I'm willing to wager that more than 50% of the people attending these rallies have absolutely no idea what they are rallying against/for. Ask people about the points at issue and you very rarely get anything but the most simplistic answer - mostly answers consist of the regularly used 'hidoi', 'ganbare', 'muzukashi' etc.

I'm not saying they are wrong to take this stand, but it's just astounding how little people know about the issue. Sure, a lot of it comes down to education as well as a blind nationalism, but it reinforces the reasons to me why Japan is a nation in decline.

From the point of view of those looking in from South Korea and China etc. these 'mini uprisings' look like trouble. They look like the Japanese people are genuinely anti-something. They aren't. It can't be genuine because, as I said before, most people don't understand what they are rallying for.

That's not to say it isn't dangerous, because it certainly is. People need to educate themselves and start thinking for themselves more. Easier said than done though.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Yeah, Lee did go too far. Attacking the Emperor is a good way to get the Nationalists in a frenzy, particularly if the Emperor had been open to being amicable. It's going to take quite a bit of work on Lee's part to fix this. I would not blame His Majesty if he left the Koreans waiting in the diplomatic icebox fora bit to make them rethink things a bit,. After an very public apology

1 ( +2 / -1 )

With all this hate, sometimes it feels we are just an assassination away from another WW, just like the first one.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

It's all distraction. Keep your eyes on the other hand!!

1 ( +1 / -0 )

In Japan it's illegal to burn a foreign flag under Article 92 of the Foreign national flag destruction law. The law does not apply to a Japanese flag.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Saul: "Yeah, Lee did go too far. Attacking the Emperor is a good way to get the Nationalists in a frenzy..."

The irony is that the Emperor gets them all upset when he performs his good deeds, many being apologizing to other nations.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

issa1 - Where did I suggest I was wasting my time here?

All I was trying to point out was that (in my opinion) in Japan things aren't quite what they seem compared with what people see from the outside. That related directly to my point about the people at the rally probably not understanding completely what they were rallying about. If you don't understand the issues, then you can't be genuinely protesting against/for something.

I have no problem living in Japan thank you.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

This is what happens when you DONT teach history to people.............it aint pretty.

And to all those on the other threads who say Japan has apologized upteen times.............well take a good look & perhaps you will learn why there is no sincerity there.

The people in this picture CAN NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY BECAUSE THEY WERE NEVER TOUGHT IT!

Again Japan is going to reap what it has sewn, WHAT AN UTTER WASTE

2 ( +4 / -2 )

"The irony is that the Emperor gets them all upset when he performs his good deeds, many being apologizing to other nations."

No argument on that, but while he might get them upset on occasion, verbally attacking him is a was to REALLY get them going. Korea owns this mess

1 ( +1 / -0 )

What are they protesting about? I don't get it.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

more of a combination of a Protest of the insult to His Majesty and a "Rah-Rah, Nippon against the Boorish Koreans, Chinese, and Russians" Rally, I would think.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Police put the number at 600; organizers claim 60,000.

Link?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

what is with all the anger and hatred lately in Japan,

I blame the Olympics. North Asians seem to use it as a platform for their nationalism more than other countries. Nihon becomes "Nippon," and Western judoists become "animals," according to the Tokyo governor.

The IOC should ban north Asian countries from the Games. They just don't appreciate the Olympics spirit, which is rooted in Western culture anyway.

-11 ( +2 / -13 )

I doubt that it's the Olympics...

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Police put the number at 600; organizers claim 60,000.

It's always interesting how the police under-reports ANY forms of protests.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

JeffLee: "Nihon becomes "Nippon," and Western judoists become "animals," according to the Tokyo governor."

blink blink animals? where was this?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

These guys act like clowns, true clowns!

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Oh the irony.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Saul, spoken last week during a press briefing. Don't worry, the Japanese mainstream media didnt carry it much, as usual.

http://hochi.yomiuri.co.jp/topics/news/20120803-OHT1T00324.htm

http://www.expat-cafe.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=447

http://www.debito.org/?p=10511

Anyhoo, if the authorities of a country -- I don't care what country -- take that kind of attitude, then ban them from the Games. Cuz, they just don't appreciate it.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

And all that for a bunch of worthless rocks jutting out of the ocean. People need to know about how insignificant these islands are. The Liancourt Rocks for instance have a combined area of less than 0,19 square kilometer. Two people live on them, an octopus fisherman and his wife... but 3 dozens South Korean policemen are stationed on those rocks to "protect" them. And South Korea issued stamps with those rocks on them, organizes school visits to this "powerful" "symbol" of Korean "sovereignty and pride".

Stop caring about them! They're worthless, they're small, they don't matter!

South Korean and Japanese nationalists who keep bringing them up are completely absurd. I mean you had a South Korean protester who lit himself on fire for these rocks!

1 ( +2 / -1 )

@kchoze

Stop caring about them! They're worthless, they're small, they don't matter!

It's not about the islands; it's about the oil and the fishing rights to be claimed by the winner.

I say give them to Mexico. Just to annoy all those involved at present.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Eautaceux JanaisAUG. 16, 2012 - 04:02PM JST C'mon Japan, let's stay classy and not dip down a notch like the other folks.

And who are these unspoken "others" exactly?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

smithinjapanAug. 16, 2012 - 03:48PM JST Ironic the little old man on the left is talking about Korea and their history, given he probably forgets what he doled out >on them.

He personally probably didn't "dole out" anything. He's talkiing speciically about Takeshima, you know the place that South Korea unilaterally occupied and is evading taking befoire the ICJ.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

smithinjapanAug. 16, 2012 - 04:33PM JST "Thunderbird: "The more the South Koreans act the way they have been lately, the more you'll see stuff like this in Japan. Better than lobbing missiles at each other I suppose." Takes to two tango. The SKoreans stepped up their rhetoric when Japan stepped up its rhetoric on this and other >island issues. That, and the fact that despite Japan marking the end of the war yesterday it forgets why they war >happened, even blaming the West for it instead of doing a bit of soul searching.

No, the South Koreans have been far more belligerent and aggressive about this issue, occupying the place and themn refiusing tro go to the ICJ. Japan is being totally rational and diplomatic about it, they too stand a chance of loosing at the ICJ. You yourself have gone on abd on about hjow popular Korean TV shows, Kpop stars are loved in Japan. Som Koreans hate Japanese and the Japanese love them. No, it doesn;t sound like both are doing the tango. If nationalkism and a strong anti-Korea sentiment arises well the Koreans brought it upon themselves.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

OssanAmericaAUG. 16, 2012 - 11:41PM JST

No, the South Koreans have been far more belligerent and aggressive about this issue, occupying the place and themn refiusing tro go to the ICJ. Japan is being totally rational and diplomatic about it, they too stand a chance of loosing at the ICJ. You yourself have gone on abd on about hjow popular Korean TV shows, Kpop stars are loved in Japan. Som Koreans hate Japanese and the Japanese love them. No, it doesn;t sound like both are doing the tango. If nationalkism and a strong anti-Korea sentiment arises well the Koreans brought it upon themselves.

There is a problem I see people missing with this argument, sure the Koreans and Chinese are more aggressive and belligerent towards Japan, but can you blame them at all?? The atrocities Japan committed upon their men, women and children on a par with those of the Germany Nazis, but Japan has not got anywhere near the level of open and sincere (and repeated) apology, guilt, and shame the Germans have expressed publicly and individually towards Europeans and Jews in particular since the war and even now

Many Japanese continue to deny (even leading politics), that most of the atrocities never happened (comfort woman, Najing), which is strictly illegal in Germany.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

looks peaceful enough in Korea they burn Japanese and American flags.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

I think you'll find that most countries are rather ignorant when it comes to the details of WWII any more. And I'm not surprised that this group is using "Nippon" instead of "Nihon" - that is typical for some of the conservative groups. In some ways I have to agree with them. But they do have a habit of glossing over the nastier bits of history. Then again, everybody does.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

gelendestrasseAUG. 17, 2012 - 01:31AM JST I think you'll find that most countries are rather ignorant when it comes to the details of WWII any more. And I'm not surprised that this group is using "Nippon" instead of "Nihon" - that is typical for some of the conservative groups. In some ways I have to agree with them. But they do have a habit of glossing over the nastier bits of history. Then again, everybody does.

You're right, certainly, some people are ignorant of the details of the war in any country, but I believe, in my experience though, not on the same level as in Japan. At least in most other WWII nations there is coverage of the details of the war in the media and text-books INCLUDING open discussion of the more shameful and shocking acts committed by those countries - sadly, in Japan, this is not the case.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

letsberealistic

I'll make it simple. Since we both agree that Korea was part of the IJA, then your response to Ossan will look as follows.

"There is a problem I see people missing with this argument, sure the Koreans are more aggressive and belligerent towards Japan, but can you blame them at all?? The atrocities IJA/ Korea committed upon their men, women and children on a par ..."

So again, please explain to me the excuses why Korea should be more aggressive and belligerant towards Japan when they themselves were part of this campaign?

Perhaps, like most posters I've discussed here, that you were under the impression that Japan had a military campaign against Korea during the Pacific war.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

nigelboyAUG. 17, 2012 - 02:20AM JST letsberealistic

I'll make it simple. Since we both agree that Korea was part of the IJA, then your response to Ossan will look as follows.

"There is a problem I see people missing with this argument, sure the Koreans are more aggressive and belligerent towards Japan, but can you blame them at all?? The atrocities IJA/ Korea committed upon their men, women and children on a par ..."

So again, please explain to me the excuses why Korea should be more aggressive and belligerant towards Japan when they themselves were part of this campaign?

Perhaps, like most posters I've discussed here, that you were under the impression that Japan had a military campaign against Korea during the Pacific war.

No, Nigel, I wasn't. The point is not whether or not there were Koreans in the Japanese army, but of the cruel and unjust treatment of the Koreans by the Japanese during the period before and during WW2.

If your nation was forcibly/c cunningly occupied, forced into labor, to speak a foreign language, change your name to one of your occupiers, have your peoples women and children tortured, raped and killed, wouldn't you be at least a little enraged with that country and expect some sincere, heartfelt apology and compensation?

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

If your nation was forcibly/c cunningly occupied, forced into labor, to speak a foreign language, change your name to one of your occupiers, have your peoples women and children tortured, raped and killed, wouldn't you be at least a little enraged with that country and expect some sincere, heartfelt apology and compensation?

I would be enraged if in fact those things happened like the European former colonies but in case of Korea, your description are wrong IMO based on the basic premise that it was an annexation where Koreans at that time became part of Japan.

Of course, we could get into details about those incidents you mentioned but let me just say that for one, conscription work order for Koreans (forced labor) came into effect August of 1944 which is significantly later than that of Japan or Taiwan which were during 1939. Of the 610K Koreans that remained in Japan, only 245 were subjected to this order.

Secondly, speaking Korean was not forbidden as evidenced by Kyunghyang and 毎日新報 newspaper which was circulated during the era. There were also textbook issued by the government where Hangul was taught as a curriculum.

Thirdly, changing your name (so-shi kai mei) was established for it was not the custom of Korean wives to take the husband's surname. Hence, if husband Pak married the wife Kim, they were forced to change the wife's last name to Pak. Japan gave the option to also change your what we know as "first name" to the Japanese style but this was strictly an option that required a payment of fees to do so. But what usually happened was those who wanted change their first names to Japanese style also changed their last name to Japanese style as well for they believe they were treated better in Manchuria. Just to show that this policy was not forced, there are many well known Koreans at that time who kept their names during the occupation. (洪思翊,崔承喜 ,朴春琴 etc.)

Just so that I'm clear, the annexation period was not rosy all the time. There were brutal independence movement and human rights violations during the initial stages. The economic growth period placed a heavy burden on the population. And the war efforts took a heavy toll on both the mainland and the Korean peninsula.

Now, should the Korean people expect an apology? Reading up on other Western former colonies and what they went through, the answer is NO since they haven't apologized either. Should they expect compensation? No. Same reason I stated with apology since most of these former colonies have no received a dime. But Korea received both an apology and compensation.

Hence, I have to agree with Ossan that Korea is far more beligerant and aggressive towards this type of issue.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

The ownership of those islands have already been resolved decades ago, with China, S.Korea, the U.S. and with international agreement.

What Japan needs to do is to send out their navy and protect their islands using military force. When N.Korea starts launching missiles over S.Korea, Japan should step back and tell the S.Koreans, they can take care of those issues themselves. Don't bend to the ridiculous claims and historical lies of China and S.Korea.

If Japan does it the proper way that I aforementioned, then the responsibility is on them. If China wants those islands, it will have to start a war with Japan and forsake international agreements. This will make China look like an aggressor with little care to the international community. If S.Korea has to take care of their own defense, they won't push the sex slave or island disputes.

History shows that Japan has already made reparations to the S.Korean people for the sex slave issue and island issues as well as territorial issues with China. The Treaty of San Francisco signed by 48 nations on September 8, 1951, at the War Memorial Opera House in San Francisco, California came into enforcement on April 28, 1952.. Japan gave Korea $468 million dollars for the S.Korean government, to distribute funds to all war victims caused by Japanese occupation. China receive over $14 billion dollars.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

nigelboy Aug. 17, 2012 - 03:54AM JSTI would be enraged if in fact those things happened like the European former colonies but in case of Korea, your description are wrong IMO based on the basic premise that it was an annexation where Koreans at that time became part of Japan.

nigelJapan...In 1910, Japan mastered, and misused a western terms for international law. Those who are a little bit familiar with modern Korean history in 1910 treaty, along with many other treaties imposed by Japan on helpless, defenseless Koreans in early 20th century, was just a sly cover for what Japan actully did to Koreans in its pursuit of kind of imperialist ambitions with threat and violence in many parts of Asia. There is some convincing argument that the 1910 treaty was still legally null and void for some rules in effect even at that time, including a rule invalidiating a treaty the consent to which was procured by the coercion of representatives. The 1910 treaty was the product of threat and manipulation against the officials of the then Korean government. So, we should look at this and other related aspects as well to fully debate the validity of this treaty and the annexaction.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

letsberealisticAug. 16, 2012 - 11:58PM JST "OssanAmericaAUG. 16, 2012 - 11:41PM JST No, the South Koreans have been far more belligerent and aggressive about this issue, occupying the place and themn refiusing tro go to the ICJ. Japan is being totally rational and diplomatic about it, they too stand a chance of loosing at the ICJ. You yourself have gone on abd on about hjow popular Korean TV shows, Kpop stars are loved in Japan. Som Koreans hate Japanese and the Japanese love them. No, it doesn;t sound like both are doing the tango. If nationalkism and a strong anti-Korea sentiment arises well the Koreans brought it upon themselves."

There is a problem I see people missing with this argument, sure the Koreans and Chinese are more aggressive and >belligerent towards Japan, but can you blame them at all??

Sure I can. The US, UK, Australia Canada and all the allies fought and defeated the Japanese Empire, tried their military leaders and instutitued a democratic system. One which has been an undeniable success for 70 years and still going. Our nations got over it. When people not old enough to have experienced WWII first hand spout racist hatred based on 70 year old histiry we comnsider them retarded.

The atrocities Japan committed upon their men, women and children on a par with those of the Germany Nazis, but >Japan has not got anywhere near the level of open and sincere (and repeated) apology, guilt, and shame the >Germans have expressed publicly and individually towards Europeans and Jews in particular since the war and even >now

I'm half Jewish so lease don't give me this crap. Th Japanes military never had a program of systematically killing civilianms, even in locations where there was no military action being engaged. You people attempting to vilify Japan by compar8ing it to trhe real Holocaust are offensive.

any Japanese continue to deny (even leading politics), that most of the atrocities never happened (comfort woman, >ajing), which is strictly illegal in Germany.

How do you know? You took a poll of every Japanese citizen? As far as Germany isconcerned it's a fallacy to compare it to Japan. differeent circumstances durting and post WWII. Sure Nazism is illegal in Germany but do you realize how many neo-Nazi groups exist today? Do you realize how much anmti-semitism exists?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

politics gonna be the death of us all one day..

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Way to use the Tsunami Relief slogan in a way that makes it offensive. Really classy "Ganbare Nippon" Next thing you know they will be burning K-POP CDs in the streets and denouncing them as total evils.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

letsberealisticAug. 16, 2012 - 11:58PM JST There is a problem I see people missing with this argument, sure the Koreans and Chinese are more aggressive and > belligerent towards Japan, but can you blame them at all??

Yes I can. Hate only breeds hate. The rest of he wrld has gotten over it. So should they.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

There is some convincing argument that the 1910 treaty was still legally null and void for some rules in effect even at that time, including a rule invalidiating a treaty the consent to which was procured by the coercion of representatives.

There are none. The legality of Japan Korea annexation was discussed at Harvard University in 2001 in which Prof. James Crawford of Cambridge and Prof. Anthony Caty indicated the validation. Face it, at that time, major Western powers (U.S., Britain) as well as Russia had indicated that Korea at that time could not govern themselves. Japan, unfortunately, was a reluctant party but decided it was the only option.

http://www.lib.kobe-u.ac.jp/repository/90000398.pdf

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

nigelboyAUG. 17, 2012 - 09:20AM JST

There are none. The legality of Japan Korea annexation was discussed at Harvard University in 2001 in which Prof. James Crawford of Cambridge and Prof. Anthony Caty indicated the validation. Face it, at that time, major Western powers (U.S., Britain) as well as Russia had indicated that Korea at that time could not govern themselves. Japan, unfortunately, was a reluctant party but decided it was the only option.

Now, take off those rose-tinted glasses you see Japan's history through and the selective evidence, and recognise the majority and accepted view on this issue.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Ask yourself this question; why don't Israelis demonstrate and act belligerently towards Germany?

Because there's no territorial dispute between them. Israelis certainly did act belligerently towards the two Germanies in the 1950s, although they were mostly demanding that reparations not be paid, as it would be an insult to the Holocaust victims. And the Israeli government is still demanding hundreds of millions of Euros to help elderly concentration camp survivors.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Now, take off those rose-tinted glasses you see Japan's history through and the selective evidence, and recognise the majority and accepted view on this issue.

There is no such thing as "majority" accepted view for no one around the world really cares about the validity of Japan-Korea annexation. The "accepted" view is quite obviously the one answered by a third party international law scholars which I indicated above.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Ossan: "No, the South Koreans have been far more belligerent and aggressive about this issue, occupying the place and themn refiusing tro go to the ICJ."

Is this going to be another thing you refuse to back up with proof? They've occupied the islands for more than 50 years -- the didn't just set up on them yesterday or anything. They refuse to go to the ICJ for obvious reasons -- the islands belong to them and they don't need to contest and/or be told that. If someone lays claim to my bicycle because they said someone else told them it's theirs, I'm not going to go to the police to confirm whose it is -- it's mine.

The Japanese started this all a few months back with the Senkaku issue and ministers trying to get over and visit the islands a while before that. Seems Japan doesn't like to reap what it sows.

YuriOtani: They have defaced Korean flags before, and there's still footage here and there of them stomping on a Russian flag in front of the embassy before dragging it through the mud.

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@nigelboy: It seem that you prescribe to the colonialist belief that certain people cannot govern themselves.

This just cannot apply to Korea (or any other country, IMHO).

Did you know that by the late 19th century Seoul became the first city in East Asia to have electricity, trolley cars, water, telephone, and telegraph systems all at the same time?

If Japan had not occupied Korea, the Koreans would have soon caught up to the Japanese. It's just that Japan's modernization started at least 30 years before Korea's.

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Ganbare Nippon!

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I'm a little surprised to see a woman in the forefront waving a flag and shouting slogans. What would a ultra-nationalist Japan have to offer her? The death of her husband and sons in war? Even fewer meaningful job opportunities and less social mobility than she already has? Just curious.

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