Singapore singalong

Oooooops.

faces that look like they might have just gone finished

. Should be "faces that look like they might have just finished "puberty". That is what I wanted to say.

The reason that these girls are where they are has nothing to do with their talent. First of all, they don't have any talent. I have been here since the mid 80's when Akina, Kiyon Kiyon and Norippi ruled the sad talentless world of music on TV in Japan. It was the same then as it is now. Nothing has changed except the names and the faces. Vocally talentless singers with semi to cute faces rule from one side of the country to the other. The good voices are quickly swept under the rug. The problem then was exactly the same as it is now. They have always wanted the youngest looking faces that look like they might have just gone finished. Once again if you look at the manga it screams the same thing. They want girls who are innocent but have matured just enough. Akb48 is just the same thing. And why are they popular? It is the same thing as always. A country that doesn't have that many foreign acts on its primetime TV is force fed what they are told is talent. TV shows are the same here. It is the same thing rehashed over and over again. Being creative is not wanted. A lot of the people who think that AKB48 has talent really lacks any type of idea about what is actually going on here or have just been duped into believing so. AKB48, talentless. Nothing is new. It is the same thing.

This is an excellent photo.

ok ye all, just be thankful someone hasn't come up with the all pretty boy AKB48 YET

wtfjapanJan. 29, 2012 - 08:22PM JST

OK then dress them in normal clothes make them look like women instead of girls

Now THAT is pretty damned funny! They were dressed as women in Heavy Rotation! And we never hear the end of it!

And if they are ever dressed as little girls, its only Victorian era little rich girls fashion which one would have to be pretty incredibly old to make the association anymore. Little girls do not wear this stuff, and have not for a long long time. Its only older high school teens, college girls, and adults who wear anything resembling it today. Just another fine example of how the moral panic makes people not think.

Exploit scantily clad young girls on TV like AKB48 and wonder why junior and high school girls are now victims of men touching them on the train or trying to have sex with them. In the US we call them "Jailbait".

Groping on the trains is way, way older than AKB48. Its not unique to Japan. And men have been trying to have sex with girls this age since the dawn of man! Enjo kosai had its peak long before AKB48 was just a dream its creators mind.

Moral panic is a form of limited insanity. A person might seem perfectly reasonable until a subject like AKB48 comes along. Insane people tend not to do research. And those of limited insanity tend not research their pet moral panic. And if they bother, they focus on aspects that reinforce their preconceived notions at the expense of all else. And one thing that is really really hard to do is to convince the insane and obsessed that they are in fact, insane and obsessed, even if the insanity is just limited form of moral panic. I am not insulting anyone. This kind of thing is not limited to those of low intellect. It can strike anyone. There have been many in history. Some of you need to realize this and stop giving in to moral panic. Nothing has changed because of AKB48.

Save that Kara are adults, not children.

Not true, Smith. Ji-Young is 18 now and all members were under 20 when they debuted, including Nicole who was 16 years old.

"PLEASE STOP POSTING ARTICLES ABOUT AKB48"

THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, ha ha!

"They sing like chipmunks"

They do not.

They are not smoking, drinking, voting, going to war, driving, being held fully responsible for crime or doing XXX. So why are we talking about legal age again? Oh, yeah. Some people need to change the subject in order to gain some traction. How sad!

In less than two years, the youngest member will be legally allowed to do XXX, so what is the hub bub about just showing some skin now? Would it be better to say "Okay young lady, you are 18 now! So you can do anything from dance in lingerie to be an anal porn star! Happy Birthday sweetie!"

The "sense of perspective" comment vanished. But yeah, its badly needed.

Actual age, legality or illegality, it doesn't matter. AKB is a product deliberately made to look underage and sexy. Simple as that. So to have such a product continually thrust in everybody's face offends me.

AKB48 is the best thing to happen to Japan in a long, long time! They are very nice young girls, working very, very hard and many people love them, no matter what some negative sourpusses here always writing completely negative comments, most likely pessimistic Brits?? Always complaining about this, about that, shouganai ne!

They sing like chipmunks, for goodness sake. ......................................... That's very funny.

Jonnydesu: "Now in the states, where you may be from, 18 is considered an adult, so that makes one udnerage girl."

Not from the US, sorry. Nor does adult age in the US make an adult in Japan, unless you think a kid saying 'b-b-b-but it's legal at this age in ??? nation!" is a valid justification for what is tantamount to crime.

"As to what I thought of the video, well, obviously in my western eyes it was all about sex. But then I read an interesting little tidbit from the director of the video (a Japanese woman) who said that the video shows a somewhat typical side of Japanese girls. According to her, many young Japanese girls display such actions towards each other."

So you were duped by someone whose argument is completely transparent and ludicrous. Do you think that makes it okay because the director knew she was taking advantage of a society that exploits children sexually?

Leave these cute young innocent girls alone, we Singaporeans love them as entertainers and eye candy. We've too much of K-pop that's why.

Okay smith, did my research. Apparently two girls are underage, one was 17 and one was 18. Now in the states, where you may be from, 18 is considered an adult, so that makes one udnerage girl. Not so easy to find. As to what I thought of the video, well, obviously in my western eyes it was all about sex. But then I read an interesting little tidbit from the director of the video (a Japanese woman) who said that the video shows a somewhat typical side of Japanese girls. According to her, many young Japanese girls display such actions towards each other. Of course she exaggerated the idea. So, if I try to use eyes from the perspective of a Japanese person, they may see this as cute and innocent.

So why do these girls do what they are told, again, it is not out of fear for their life, it is because they want fame and fortune. They can choose not to do this if they want.

When I say women in this position, I don't mean girls enslaved to be used sexually, I mean girls who try to compete for fame and fortune.

There is nothing illegal about what they are doing. There are no laws that state a girl in sexy lingerie must be a legal adult. There are no laws saying the young girls cannot emulate a sexual image in order to sell records. There is only your own moral law that finds this criminal. You have every right to feel that way.

jonnydesu: "Smith, just curious, what artists would you prefer most people listen to?"

Whatever they choose to, so long as it's legal. It doesn't mean I have to support little girls in lingerie.

"I suppose they are the leaders of the group and well above the 20 year mark."

Suppose what you like. When you know for a fact come on back and tell us. So how did you feel about the 'heavy rotation' video? I mean, aside from the extreme lack of talent.

"Bottom line is that these girls do what they want."

No, they do what they are told, by a company that preys on little girls for the sake of sales.

Smith, just curious, what artists would you prefer most people listen to?

I did a bit of research and saw the "Heavy rotation video, yes the girls were wearing lingerie. But those girls seemed much older than your 14-18 range. I suppose they are the leaders of the group and well above the 20 year mark.

Bottom line is that these girls do what they want. Nobody is threatening their lives to make them do this. The most ham that could come to them if they refused the work is that they would no longer be in the limelight and would have to try and make it on their own. Most women in these positions do realize that sex sells, and if they want to dominate the competition, they must resort to it at some point.

PLEASE STOP POSTING ARTICLES ABOUT AKB48, for the love of real news (and real music, for that matter, not these factory made bubblegum schoolgirls). Mega-popular? That doesn't mean they are talented, or relevant to the news at all. They sing like chipmunks, for goodness sake.

These guys are bat shit crazy. I am being as nice as I can, under the circumstances.

"Mega-popular all-girl group AKB48"

I can understand why they're mega-popular! They're beautiful and talented!

What it says to me is that a lot of people are satisfied with drivel and lack of content, not to mention lack of ability. They'd probably be content with watching their wallpaper -- so long as it was less than 18 years old and had frilly panties on.

First choice is avoid them.

Never turn on the TV, enter a convenience store, or ride a train. Do not read magazines or newspapers. Avoid looking at billboards. By no means step foot in shops that sell or rent music. Or any other establishments that sell products of any sort.

"Mega-popular all-girl group AKB48"

Mega-popular! Heh, this must really irk plasticmonkey, smithinjapan and wftjapan.

KingBasil: "Why do you insist on dragging this down unrelated avenues. First you cannot get their ages right, now this. Everything they are doing is perfectly legal except perhaps in Saudi Arabia."

So in other words you aren't willing to answer my question about the age of adulthood in Japan. Nice try on shirking the blame, though.

"And I mean real and actual harm and not "I gotta personal problem"."

You mean like prostitution houses advertising their women dressed in junior highschool outfits is no clue for you there is a problem or harm being done in society? How many underage sexual assault cases would you like me to link you to, for future reference, you know, to prove I don't just have a problem with kids being paraded as sex toys. You want me to buy you a subscription to weekly jump as a teaser, then an AKB48 album as a chaser?

" They are in fact prevented from having what even you would probably consider a normal healthy teen dating relationship"

Absolutely agree! How could a child being posed in lingerie and pursued by old men ever have a normal relationship? Hell, even when they say they want to leave to pursue a relationship their management says it's gossip!

"The exploitation is psychological, and that is what is ugly about them. Its certainly not their legs, try as you might to make that blind accusation."

Well, I don't disagree with you their, save that I've never mentioned their legs at all (I think). But given that you are misdirecting anger from somewhere else I'm not surprised you missed that in relation to the thread. And nowhere did I say their legs were ugly at all, did I? I just said it's society that's ugly when they push children as sexual beings.

smithinjapan wrote : "Quick question(s), though... what's the age of adulthood in Japan?"

Why do you insist on dragging this down unrelated avenues. First you cannot get their ages right, now this. Everything they are doing is perfectly legal except perhaps in Saudi Arabia.

If you got a problem with them, I will give you two choices. First choice is avoid them. Don't buy their stuff, change the channel if they are on TV and don't read or comment on articles about them. Second choice is put together some research proving that they are doing some harm. And I mean real and actual harm and not "I gotta personal problem".

I suggest persuing the exploitation angle, and I am not talking about "minors being sexually exploited" because they are aren't and that is ridiculous. They are in fact prevented from having what even you would probably consider a normal healthy teen dating relationship. Its not that they are being used as sexual objects, near as much as they are being used as beasts of burden, and promplty disgarded like trash if they balk even slightly. The exploitation is psychological, and that is what is ugly about them. Its certainly not their legs, try as you might to make that blind accusation.

AKB is a mostly legal age female group made to look like younger girls to please there younger fan base, there also dressed in skimpy clothing to please there older male fans. great marketing to sell albums make profits, but morally bankrupt.

oberst: "nice sexy posture the way they seem to sway their hips, very Kara-ish."

Save that Kara are adults, not children.

calm down: "smith your arguments got more holes in it than a sponge."

So long as it's not a little girl wearing it, fine. Might disappoint you, though.

".the leaders are all 20 or older...and they have never ever worn lingerie.."

There was a member as young as 14 until recently, and now the youngest is 16? Might be wrong. But my point was not only about AKB48 but also directed towards the tendency in Japan towards making little girls into sexual objects, since another poster brought it up, so it's not limited to underage AKB48 members. They've never worn lingerie, eh? What about the 'heavy rotation' video? Mind you, when someone suggested I watch it as an example of how disgusting things here can get I could only hack it for twenty seconds, so I can't tell you if the girls in lingerie were gussied up children or the 'leaders' you speak of who are older than twenty.

Quick question(s), though... what's the age of adulthood in Japan? What's the average age of the total members in AKB48? If it's less than 20 years old, is it incorrect to say that more than half the band are children?

smith your arguments got more holes in it than a sponge.As crazyjoe and a miniscule of understanding would would show that there are no members around the age of 10 or 12 or 14 ..the leaders are all 20 or older...and they have never ever worn lingerie..pfft as in zilch knowledge of what youre talking about.

Readers, we have already ruled that pedophilia is not relevant to this discussion.

@crazyjoe if the average age is 19.4, then why are they made to look like girls in there early teens & sexually exploited at the same time. sexually exploited & underage should never be allowed in and culture. and anything that encourages PEDOS should be criminal & be banned period

Moderator: Sorry, but we already ruled that pedophilia is not relevant to this discussion.

nice sexy posture the way they seem to sway their hips, very Kara-ish.

They're average age is 19.4. Has nothing to do with pedophilia.

Johnnydesu: "Often it isn't a sexual thing, but yes sometimes it can be."

Then why allow it if it involves children? Suggesting that some sort of ambiguity makes it less perverse is simply bizarre.

"My point about the Paris fashion article was to show that exploitation of young girls is not just limited to Japan. Never said that it was considered allowable."

And hence my 'sadly' at the beginning of my response. Nonetheless, if they were selling that kind of thing ONLY in Japan it would not have even made the news. It made the news because it's sick to have little girls around the age of 10 in lingerie, and serves ZERO purpose but to further the consumption of media that pose little girls as sex objets, then furthering the zeal to clothe kids in such rubbish. The fact the Paris show is news shows that it is controversial and a good deal of people are against it. Here it would simply be cherished, called 'kawaiiiiii', then people (foreign people, at least) would wonder why 援助交際 or sex salons that have women dressing in children's outfits are so prevalent.

calm down: "they're having fun and making a lot of money."

Having fun, no doubt. And when they are fired by 18 after their independent album attempts fail they'll be like Macaulay Culkin and impossible to work with and unwanted. As for 'making money', how do you figure? They've got to divide anything they make by however many hundred are in their ranks.

"..only by you.the local village vicar and the Harper Valley PTA..."

Ummm...no, you may not be adverse to seeing "tweens" in garters, g-string underwear, and a skimpy bra, but fortunately most of the world is against that kind of image. I find it sad you think it's positive that children pose in scanty lingerie (since you took me up on my comment on the "tween lingerie" thread).

OK then dress them in normal clothes make them look like women instead of girls then see if they sell as many albums. my point is while they have a majority young female fan base, they are also marketed indirectly to men who like young girls.

Perhaps the title should read "SINGAPORE SLINGALONG"..

wonder if the moderator has a life or just like to patrol discussion boards, should change name to MORAL POLICE. delete this if you agree. LOL

Plastic, if you assume (falsely) that all male fans of AKB are pedos

My reasoning is this.

1) AKB members are designed to look like like HS girls (i.e. underage).

2) AKB members are dressed to look sexy.

3) AKB is not musically talented by any stretch of the imagination, at least not in proportion to their massive success. The girls' voices are amalgamated and digitally brushed up by a computer, which more than likely writes their music as well.

4) ergo, the predominant reason any male would be an AKB fan is because he is turned on by the image of sexy HS girls. Otherwise it would have to be attributable to an utterly infantile taste in music.

Take your pick.

A few years ago they won some award for their "innovative and aggressive" dance routine from one of their music videos. At the time I paid little attention, looked up the video on You Tube and was unimpressed. Then one day I saw them perform a medley of their songs with SMAP on TV. SMAP did aforementioned dance routine while the ladies stood in the back waiting for their turn and wiped the floor with them. SMAP. Not a SMAP fan either, but they took that choreography and did it the way it was supposed to be. You know you're doing something wrong when some men pushing 40 who are supposed to be paying tribute to you, end up doing what you do ten times better than you. Sad.

Then one day I saw an AKB show on cable. Watched a bit of it to try and give them a second chance. There were, as expected, lots of mini skirts and boots and hand movements, typical idol stuff. Then the camera panned out to get a full shot of the entire troop. Every single girl had a wireless microphone, every single one of them was "singing" into their microphones. Yet there were only four floor monitors on stage. None of them had ear monitors in their ears. Really now. 48 of them all singing at the same time, dancing and singing at the same time, and they can all hear themselves? They can all dance and sing and stay in key, even the ones in the back?

bicultural, you are absolutely right. Akimoto has used this formula time and time again to make a whole lotta money! I just can't understand why people have been falling for it for so many years. I really don't get it. Yeah the pop world is full of girls and guys with marginal talent, and some of them I actually like. I've just never been able to get into AKB. I do appreciate Akimoto Sensei's skills as a J-Pop songwriter and producer but the material would sound so much better if given to someone else.

I don't really have a problem with people who like them either. I just feel that the media and record agencies end up with tunnel vision, because they see how much money these girls are making and then the people with true hard earned talent, innovation, and ambition end up getting pushed to the wayside because they can't look, act, or sell like these girls do.

"pedophilia is not relevant to this discussion" !!? funny thats what every second reader is thinking when they see photos of AKB48 in skimpy clothing. AKB48 male fans = pe**es oops nearly said the P word. LOL

Moderator: Every second reader, including yourself, is wrong because they do not understand what AKB48 is all about.

Readers, pedophilia is not relevant to this discussion.

the fact that between 30-70% of AKB48's fans are girls.

So their fans mirror the gender demographic of Japan?

Meaning that half of their fans are girls (a large number prepubescent) who want to be them, and the other half are guys (a large number over 30) who want them.

Nothing wrong there. Old guys wanting young girls, young girls wanting to be famous, and marketers making money from both sides.

Plastic, if you assume (falsely) that all male fans of AKB are pedos, then yes, your math would work. But this is clearly not the case so your argument is meaningless.

Who cares? Hot! Hot! and Hot! Where is Tomomi Itano? She rocks!

the fact that between 30-70% of AKB48's fans are girls

So that means only the other 30-70% are pedophiles? That's comforting. Fun for the whole family.

Sure, the sexualization of young girls is a global phenomenon. Japan's media machine just does it more aggressively and with less shame. And it's defended with the 'it's-Japanese-culture-don't-knock-it' card.

Curious to know what all the pedophile-behind-every-corner believers think of the fact that between 30-70% of AKB48's fans are girls.

I agree that AKB 48 lacks talent, but according to an interview with their producer (Akimoto) that's exactly what they're going for. They are not "complete" idols but have many imperfections. This makes them seem more real to their fans. Another factor is that they will get better at dancing and singing (hopefully) and prettier (with plastic surgery) and fans will be able to see their transformation as they get closer to being true idols. I'm not making this stuff up, nor am I in any way a fan of AKB. Just sayin. Anyway, Akimoto sure knows how to make the big bucks.

When these gals do a concert, do they actually sing live, or do they lip-sync?

Smith -

My point about the Paris fashion article was to show that exploitation of young girls is not just limited to Japan. Never said that it was considered allowable.

Hmmmm, well I won't take things personally as I did throw out a bit a rip at the end of my last comment. But I think a lot you take this too far on the pedo tip. Look at from the the psyche of the Japanese. They love and adore "cute". Often it isn't a sexual thing, but yes sometimes it can be. I don't think 100% of their PR is based in attracting dirty old men.

GW - are you saying that when Brittney first broke into the scene, she was considered a woman? She was barely 18 when her two smash hits "oops I did it again" and "baby one more time", both heavy with sexual undertones, gained her fame and popularity. While I understand 18 is a legal age, she still looked like a young girl. And yes I admit, the 13 and 14 year old girls parading out in bathing suits in the mags and dvds is pushing it too far, but the songs they sing about love and romance and possibly even sex are harmless. As always, it is not the product, it's what the users do with it.

Maybe I am just confident with myself that I can handle looking at young girls trying to emulate an adult image and not get aroused by it.

@smith ..'whereas in other nations it is going to meet with a lot of resistance'...only by you.the local village vicar and the Harper Valley PTA...

jonnydesu,

nice try at justifying pedo-pop, totally unconvincing. And you clearly need to learn to know the difference between young girls & women, perhaps thats why you have so much trouble determining right & wrong

they're having fun and making a lot of money

They may be having fun, but they are certainly not making a lot of money. The guy who is their producer is making the cash. Japanese entertainers like AKB don't make all that much money in reality, it's the "fame" they get and maybe if they are lucky when they go out on their own they will make some money, but not as long as they are in the group.

johnnydesu: "And for those of you thinking that the exploitation of young girls is dominate in Japan, please take a look around the world, all countries do this. America has a ton a history with this. Brittney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Lindsy Lohan (probably spelled their names wrong)."

And how old are these 'young girls' you mention? Are they 12? 13? 14? Are they with other underage girls in lingerie pillow fighting and singing 'I need you. I want you' to old men?

"And didn't we just see an article about Paris fashion pushing lingerie on the pre-teen market?"

Sadly, yes. But you know why it was an article at all? because many people are troubled by it. Most of the posters admitted it would not be considered abnormal in Japan, whereas in other nations it is going to meet with a lot of resistance.

Good stuff jonnydesu ! ..I'm by no means a fan-just sick of all the same old fart comments ...they're having fun and making a lot of money.

Serrano: "That's like saying "I don't know anybody who likes beautiful, talented young women.""

No, it's more like saying these young women are talentless hacks and I don't know anyone who likes them. Surely you're not suggesting someone must like a band of musicians simply because they might or might not be attractive? And no, they cannot sing. What's more, they cannot play any instruments or write their own music. I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of the audience weren't middle-aged, Japanese businessmen in Singapore.

Look, obviously they have some kind of talent, whether it be singing and dancing, looking cute, whatever, they are out to entertain. They aren't activists trying to change social norms, they are looking to break new ground and create new musical genres, they aren't about the sex, drugs, and rock-n-roll (my personal favorite). They simply sing easily written songs that are meant to bring some joy to some people. And that is exactly what pop music is. They must do a good job at it, look at their fan base, it's huge. Talent is subjective, always has been. Maybe you prefer a Monet painting to a Warhol, does make Warhol less talented, certainly not. Rather than just bash on someone or some group, how about learning to express your own tastes instead and just say you are not interested in them.

And for those of you thinking that the exploitation of young girls is dominate in Japan, please take a look around the world, all countries do this. America has a ton a history with this. Brittney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Lindsy Lohan (probably spelled their names wrong). And didn't we just see an article about Paris fashion pushing lingerie on the pre-teen market?

Just because you don't care for a certain style doesn't give you the right to call people talentless. Unless of course you are performing on stage in front of thousands on a weekly basis. Nah, probably just karaoke cowboys wishing they had half the talent these girls do.

Mega-popular. That is a new one.

Even when they're abroad we get a daily dose. Unbelievable.

Japan's music industry is just prostituting these girls. Can't really sing. Can't really dance. It takes 48 of them to get your attention. Of course, you are abound to like at least one of them. Look at the manga that is read here? It is the same thing. Exploit scantily clad young girls on TV like AKB48 and wonder why junior and high school girls are now victims of men touching them on the train or trying to have sex with them. In the US we call them "Jailbait". But here they are target as "The Main Course". And this is one of the big reasons. The media promotes them as sex symbols. Disgusting. People who do that seriously need to have their heads examined. Makes me sick how they prostitutes these girls as sex symbols. They just got out of their diapers as far as I am concerned.

That's like saying "I don't know anybody who likes beautiful, talented young women."

If they were beautiful and/or talented I might agree. Average at best, talented......NO.

Excellent!

"Oh, they can sing too?"

"Ummm, no!"

Ummm, yes!

OK Serrano, I'm gonna finish off this conversation.

MeanRingo: "Very childish Serrano."

Serrano: "No, you are!"

MeanRingo: "NO, YOU are."

yep typical of the Japanese entertainment industry using the image of underage girls to make a profit, then again in country where having child pornography in your possession is not a crime!! what do expect. suppose moderator will remove this comment because it offends somebody !?? paedofiles!!?? "nobody has the moral high ground" if you think exploiting scantily clad young girls is OK then you have no MORALS period.

JT, singalong or lip synchalong?

You see, I don't mind them when they dress up properly like this. It is when they constantly represent the Japanese paedo fetish of underage school girls that it turns my stomach.

And yes, some excellent legs on display here! Just look at that muscle tone...

plasticmonkey has just come up with a BRILLIANT idea! Make an AKB48 news section! I second that!

"I don't know anybody who likes them"

That's like saying "I don't know anybody who likes beautiful, talented young women."

JT should just make 'AKB48' a news section in itself. Interesting how it must be stated each time that AKB is popular, as if that weren't already apparent from the daily bombardment that we apostates are subjected to. My observation is that AKB is more popular among advertisers, the media, and production companies than among the general population. I don't know anybody who likes them. Softcore porn propaganda in service of the entertainment complex.

Audience number also coincidentally was 48.

Excellent!

"Oh, they can sing too?"

"Ummm, no!"

Ummm, yes!

"All those legs!.. Wow!... Oh, they sing too?"

Ummm, no!

I really like this picture. And I mean A LOT!

How long can they be popular for? Some are already posing in men's magazines

All those legs!.. Wow!... Oh, they sing too?