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Another cabinet minister, 100 cross-party lawmakers visit Yasukuni shrine

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Repugnant. Go to the national cemetery to pay your respects.

0 ( +12 / -12 )

Their right to honor their war dead.

0 ( +15 / -15 )

Selfish and foolish is very dangerous mix.

-4 ( +10 / -14 )

Koreans were part of WW2 and fought with the Japanese imperialist army. There were Korean war criminals who were executed.

6 ( +12 / -6 )

zichi, we all know that, but they were forgiven because they were forced.

-5 ( +9 / -14 )

zichi, we all know that, but they were forgiven because they were forced.

Tens of thousands of Koreans volunteered to join the army.

7 ( +14 / -7 )

oldman_13Today  06:32 am JST

Their right to honor their war dead.

This is just a political stunt to get votes and cash from right-wing nationalist dupes.

1 ( +12 / -11 )

Theoretically speaking, Japan was forgiven by the neighbours for the past crimes, and there is no need to constantly provoke neighbours using the unfortunate past.

It is your right to smoke pork ribs at your neighbours front doors, but at the same time it is really annoying and uncivil, and considered to be a bad manner.

-4 ( +9 / -13 )

"I came here as one Japanese citizen," Takaichi told reporters.

Imagine her surprise when the reporter just happened to be there.

0 ( +11 / -11 )

Yasukuni is a symbol of far-right revisionism, whether pro-Japanese posters like it or not.

And no, it's not just Koreans who share this view:

https://abcnews.go.com/International/british-rugby-team-apologizes-visiting-controversial-military-shrine/story?id=65748197

The posts in question have now been taken down, but not before the British ambassador to Japan intervened, according to the Times, which first reported the story.

“It was very, very naive,” Commander Arty Shaw, who organized the visit, told the Times. “The ambassador had a word or two, so we’ve been told not to visit any more shrines, just in case.”

-3 ( +10 / -13 )

zichi, OMG, another "volunteered" ?

-5 ( +8 / -13 )

Reckless politician are fools. The barriers between japan and neighbours are almost none, people get along very well, millions visit each other every year, there is no need to show your guts. What is it good if you have a lot of guts but no hearts ?

-6 ( +8 / -14 )

It is your right to smoke pork ribs at your neighbours front doors, but at the same time it is really annoying and uncivil, and considered to be a bad manner.

No it isn't your right; you'd be trespassing on your neighbors property.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

Their right to honor their war dead.

It's our right to criticize it, but that won't stop you from whining about us so doing.

0 ( +10 / -10 )

Every nation has the right to pay respects to all her war victims. No one has the right to criticize.

"It's natural to pay respects and express appreciation to those who devoted their lives to a national policy in any country." 

Brilliantly argued by Takaichi-san. Good for her.

-3 ( +14 / -17 )

Every nation has the right to pay respects to all her war victims.

Nobody is arguing this. We are arguing about how it is done. Go to the national cemetery to pay your respects.

No one has the right to criticize.

You clearly don't understand the right to free speech.

8 ( +18 / -10 )

I often wonder why hasn't the US media picked on this yet. A lot of Americans would be upset to know that the Japanese worship the war criminals that started the war and attacked America. For the Japanese, including the Japanese government, knowing that their image in America is being tarnished matters more than antagonizing the Koreans and the Chinese.

3 ( +14 / -11 )

"We are arguing about how it is done. Go to the national cemetery to pay your respects."

Why should we? Japan has the right to pay its respects to its war dead; anyway, anywhere, anytime, the Japanese people want. If foreigners don't like it. Too bad.

0 ( +13 / -13 )

Not all Japanese believe in or support the Shinto religion I think only about 70% of the population actually supports it.

The National Cemetery is for the 350,000 unidentified war dead. Different situation than the Yasukuni Shrine. The emperor and the prime minister do visit the National Cemetery and I think the new emperor, like his father, will not be visiting the shrine.

7 ( +10 / -3 )

Why should we?

Because it's the correct thing to do as it won't be controversial so the focus will be on the war dead and night right wing nutcases

Japan has the right to pay its respects to its war dead; anyway, anywhere, anytime, the Japanese people want. If foreigners don't like it. Too bad.

Too bad for you that is foreigners have the right to criticize these acts. It's enshrined in the constitution the US bestowed upon you after we bombed you into a democratic, peace loving country.

1 ( +10 / -9 )

Yasukuni shrine if you can call it that is a perverse place that makes historical facts twisted. Japan lost, due mostly to its inability to supply or arm it's youth in any meaniful way. It was hardly a beacon of freedom. The Korean girl sitting on the chair has more relevance although she should be bound in rope to be historically accurate. And yet politicians seem to glow in their shuffling through their stunts for constituents.

2 ( +11 / -9 )

Free speech yes, but that does not make it correct speech. The revisionism of the Yasukuni War Museum is what it is, revisionism which is not illegal here, but in some European countries it is.

The Yasukuni Shrine has to be judged has a whole and not by part.

8 ( +13 / -5 )

Lots of people in Japan wonder, why China and Korea have advanced economically,and Japan had been, living in Zombie economy for decades

1 ( +10 / -9 )

Tens of thousands of Koreans volunteered to join the army.

@zichi - source? Or is this simply your opinion?

Germany does not honor its war criminals and they have many. Other countries like Germany and Britain, for instance don't enshrine the names of their war criminals on memorials to the war fallen. We just don't honor them. German war criminals were cremated or placed in secret graves to avoid any form of worship.

True.

-4 ( +6 / -10 )

Tens of thousands of Koreans volunteered to join the army.

well there are things called books of a historical nature and the use of volunteers bit of a streach.

I'd volunteer too with a gun at the back of my head.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

Japan did not draft ethnic Koreans into its military until 1944 when the tide of WW II turned against it. Until 1944, enlistment in the Imperial Japanese Army by ethnic Koreans was voluntary, and highly competitive. From a 14% acceptance rate in 1938, it dropped to a 2% acceptance rate in 1943 while the raw number of applicants increased from 3000 per annum to 300,000 in just five years during World War II.

8 ( +11 / -3 )

I'd volunteer too with a gun at the back of my head.

@Cricky - if you believe Japanese revisionists including the mayor of Nagoya, all 'comfort women' were willing volunteers too.

-6 ( +6 / -12 )

Japan did not draft ethnic Koreans into its military until 1944 when the tide of WW II turned against it.

That is interesting, I didn't know. Thank you.

Until 1944, enlistment in the Imperial Japanese Army by ethnic Koreans was voluntary

So around 1944 it became involuntary.

-6 ( +5 / -11 )

The term voluntary be it "comfort" women (aka sex slaves) or given a uniform and encouraged to act out depraved behavior against people's who never asked for Japan's version of freedom. To have leaders honouring these press gang flotsam is not just offecive on every level but so out of place at any time.

-4 ( +6 / -10 )

Every year time it seems many get confused about what is going on at yasukuni, here, let me clarify for all once again!

Politicians going to yasukuni are NOT repeat NOT going there to worship Japan's war dead!!

Politicians GO to yaskuni to WORSHIP, WAR CRIMINALS, PERIOD!!

If war criminals were removed the politicians would dry up pretty fast at yasukuni.

It really IS that SIMPLE! What it also sadly illustrates is just how little many were supposed to have learned from WWII!!!

-2 ( +8 / -10 )

If war criminals were removed the politicians would dry up pretty fast at yasukuni.

@GW - Absolutely true.

It's the reason why these same attention seeking RWNJ pollies don't visit Chidorigafuchi to pay their respects.

-5 ( +6 / -11 )

Japanese extremists or extreme right wing revisionists of America or my own country Britain should always be challenged. Sometimes I have to experience walking pass their black vans with speakers on top, sometimes with military uniform and I always stop and stare because it bothers the hell out of them.

Revisionism is not acceptable whether its Japanese, Korean or American.

My family and community were required to fight against the Imperial Japanese in Burma and Indian and we paid a heavy price for it.

Again, in the Korean War, my family and community fought to defend Korea against the Chinese/Russians from the north and again we paid a heavy price for it.

The majority of Japanese were no longer born when WW2 happened.

The problem with the Yasukuni is where do we draw the line between free speech and revisionism.

I think PM Abe went to Yasukuni only once but to the National Cemetery every year. But I wish all the politicians would stop but they are not breaking any laws.

None of the Japanese war criminals with "Kami" at Yasukuni Shrine were found guilty of any war crimes against any Koreans. What of the Korean war criminals?

There are no actual war criminals at the Yasukuni Shrine. Names are written onto paper which turns to dust. The whole show is a fake based on the beliefs of the Shinto religion which is only followed by 70% of the Japanese.

There's nothing to remove because there's nothing there.

7 ( +10 / -3 )

The problem with the Yasukuni is where do we draw the line between free speech and revisionism.

It's never easy, but free speech should be a right. So should the right to speak out against those who use free speech in an attempt at revisionism. So far both parties are exercising their rights.

But I wish all the politicians would stop but they are not breaking any laws.

Neither is denying any of the war crimes took place. In Germany it is illegal but in Japan it seems to win you a seat in government. To me Japan missed an opportunity here. It is 2019 and Japan is still seen by many as a country that has not come to terms with its past. The undertones of revisionism, a desire to view Japan's past in a new, more positive light, is prevalent in Japanese politics.

None of the Japanese war criminals with "Kami" at Yasukuni Shrine were found guilty of any war crimes against any Koreans.

I doubt they were even looking to see what crimes were committed against Koreans.

What of the Korean war criminals?

If you follow the reasoning of some of the pro-Japan posters on JT, the 'Korean war criminals' were actually Japanese. That's not my position however.

There are no actual war criminals at the Yasukuni Shrine. Names are written onto paper which turns to dust. The whole show is a fake based on the beliefs of the Shinto religion which is only followed by 70% of the Japanese.

Agreed. You could say it's really just a superstition. But it is also a symbol, just as a mausoleum is nothing more than a pile of bricks, but its symbolism makes it much greater.

-5 ( +5 / -10 )

The late Emperor Hirohito stopped visiting after 1978, and the Akihito Emperor has maintained the boycott. Ask yourself why.

6 ( +10 / -4 )

mausoleums usually contain a tomb as in the tomb of the unknown soldier.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

alwaysspeakingwisdomToday  08:40 am JST

Japan has the right to pay its respects to its war dead...

Anyone who thinks that's what these politicians are doing is either naive or deluded. Their brazen vote-gathering activities insult the war dead.

0 ( +10 / -10 )

Abe will be having Bedbugs and Breakfast at the G7 Google Doral Bedbugs

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

There's nothing to remove because there's nothing there.

Ive never understood why the politicians even visit the shrine. I guess it was there before WW2, but its not even a state property. is it an old tradition?

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Only a few prime ministers have visited Yasukuni.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Ive never understood why the politicians even visit the shrine. I guess it was there before WW2, but its not even a state property. is it an old tradition?

> If war criminals were removed the politicians would dry up pretty fast at yasukuni.

@GW - Absolutely true.

Yes. And you guys don't even know those young kids believed their souls at least could safely return home at YASUKUNI and promised meeting each other at YASUKUNI not Chidorigafuji, at dawn when they took off

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

Until 1944, enlistment in the Imperial Japanese Army by ethnic Koreans was voluntary

So around 1944 it became involuntary.

Except almost all of them did not go to the actual battlefields as the war got over before those last-group officially conscripted finished their military training programs. You might want to know more of the truths.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

Yes. And you guys don't even know those young kids believed their souls at least could safely return home at YASUKUNI and promised meeting each other at YASUKUNI not Chidorigafuji, at dawn when they took off

I have known this for over 20 years. Nobody is saying destroy Yasukuni, so this argument is moot.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Yes. And you guys don't even know those young kids believed their souls at least could safely return home at YASUKUNI and promised meeting each other at YASUKUNI not Chidorigafuji, at dawn when they took off

Just like all religions, the Shinto practiced at Yasukuni is based on a system of make belief!

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Just like all religions, the Shinto practiced at Yasukuni is based on a system of make belief!

As if their last notes were counterfeited by such system

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I have known this for over 20 years. Nobody is saying destroy Yasukuni, so this argument is moot.

Yasukuni had been there already and they all knew and thought it as the very home to meet their families and comrades. Those who like focusing on it as if the world war history had just started from WW2 better just shut their mouth up and reconsider how entire Asia were like those days.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Those who affirm the visit to Yasukuni probably have the same opinion as Judge  Radhabinod Pal regarding the Tokyo trial. Is that bad?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year. How was the war dead honored before that?

0 ( +1 / -1 )

The Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year. How was the war dead honored before that?

Lmao! Zichi in again with more cold, hard facts and logic. It's always a pleasure to watch you work, Zichi.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

The Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year. How was the war dead honored before that?

So? What did I write? Yasukuni had been there before WW2. I know you know those 2466 thousands spirits

enshrined are not just from WW2. not just the soldiers dead on the battlefields, Yasukuni is deeper than just that or than what the western winners unilaterally created as war criminals in ex-post fact law.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

zichiOct. 20  11:57 pm JST

The Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year. How was the war dead honored before that?

"Modern Japan" is only 150 years old. The first dead honored at Yasukuni goes back to the Boshin War which ended in 1869. "War dead" prior to that were those who died fighting for their respective clans or for the shogunate, rather than"for the nation of Japan" and are honored in their respective regions. Those honored at Yasukuni died in war for the modern post 1860s Japan. The vast majority of those enshrined there have nothing to do with WWII.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

showchinmono and ossanAmerica

my question was if the Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year, how were the war dead honored prior to Yasukuni and not since Yasukuni was built which includes the names of the death are from the Boshin War.

 "War dead" prior to that were those who died fighting for their respective clans or for the shogunate, rather than"for the nation of Japan" and are honored in their respective regions. 

I have never discovered anywhere like that. Sometimes a statue to honor a clan or a memorial in a park. But no place with "kami" like claimed at the Yasukuni who's believe that unless the war dead are named they won't become "kami".

The honor of the war death at Yasukuni is a modern event. The death at the National Cemetery are buried there but not honored like those named at the Yasukuni since Yasukuni can not name the unnamed. According to the belief system of the Yasukuni those death at the National Cemetery can not be "kami".

The actions of the Yasukuni is to make the death into "kami", the honor aspect is secondary to that.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

The names of the people at the Yasukuni Shrine are those who died fighting for their country. Not fighting each other like clans but wars and battles against other nations. The names are added by the Yasukuni without obtaining any consent from their families first. Not all Japanese people support the Shinto religion, only about 70% do.

Some families have voiced opposition to having their family names added. Korean families have objected to their added names.

The shrine secretly added the names of the war criminals without first obtaining consent from the government. They also bent their own rules because none of the war criminals, of all classes actually died fighting for their country. The class A were executed. Others survived the war and died later.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Get ready for the defenders to ask, tomorrow, why other countries are upset over this, while the morons who visit white-wash history, deny atrocities, and generally spit on their Asian neighbours.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Actually, Japanese politicos should continue visiting Yasukuni if they so wish; it's part of honoring their history.

I, as, an African , Kenyan born, have absolutely no problem with a British politician, say, visiting Westminter Abbey or such like place that honor British explorers, adventurers and colonialists, and war dead of yore. It's part of their history. So what?!

Why don't you ask the Chinese to stop visiting Tiananmen and Mao's mausoleum? After all, Mao not only caused the deaths of 20,000,000+ innocent Chinese!

The megalomaniac Mao, like a rabid hyena, then crossed over the Yalu River and slaughtered 3,500,000 more Koreans!

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

my question was if the Yasukuni Shrine is only 150 years old this year, how were the war dead honored prior to Yasukuni and not since Yasukuni was built which includes the names of the death are from the Boshin War.

So what kind of message does your personal interest in how or if the war dead were honored before 1869 possibly have? NOTHING.

Not all Japanese people support the Shinto religion, only about 70% do.

Some families have voiced opposition to having their family names added. Korean families have objected to their added names.

The shrine secretly added the names of the war criminals without first obtaining consent from the government. 

The death at the National Cemetery are buried there but not honored like those named at the Yasukuni since Yasukuni can not name the unnamed.

So? I say, Let the Japanese or the ones who actually visit there decide what and how to do it. Aren't you the one who have stressed on the freedom of [ insert as you like] in the other thread?

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

smithinjapanToday  01:40 pm JST

Get ready for the defenders to ask, tomorrow, why other countries are upset over this, while the morons who visit white-wash history, deny atrocities, and generally spit on their Asian neighbours.

Here we go again. a Korean obsessed with ATROCITIES. I wish this Korean could explain how visiting Yasukuni could be equalized to spitting on their Asian neighbors

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Today  06:40 pm JSTPosted in: Another cabinet minister, 100 cross-party lawmakers visit Yasukuni shrine  See in context

smithinjapanToday  01:40 pm JST

Get ready for the defenders to ask, tomorrow, why other countries are upset over this, while the morons who visit white-wash history, deny atrocities, and generally spit on their Asian neighbours.

Here we go again. a Korean obsessed with ATROCITIES. I wish this Korean could explain how visiting Yasukuni could be equalized to spitting on their Asian neighbors

Modern days. Too many sick people. But if they are the ones of your own, deal with them but if they are not, send them back and let them deal with them

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

showchinmono

serious issues remain with the Yasukuni Shrine which need to be readdressed.

Revisionism exhibited in the Yasukuni War Museum.

Adding names of the war dead without seeking consent from the families.

The secret adding of the War Criminals names without seeking consent from the government. Even opposed by the emperor who has refused to visit following that.

Government ministers and politicians visiting the shrine while the above three points remain unresolved. Since according to the rules of the shrine the "kami" names cannot be removed so the only alternative is for the politicians to stop their visits following the example set by the emperor.
1 ( +2 / -1 )

zichiToday  07:34 pm JST

showchinmono

serious issues remain with the Yasukuni Shrine which need to be readdressed.

Revisionism exhibited in the Yasukuni War Museum.

Adding names of the war dead without seeking consent from the families.

The secret adding of the War Criminals names without seeking consent from the government. Even opposed by the emperor who has refused to visit following that.

Government ministers and politicians visiting the shrine while the above three points remain unresolved. Since according to the rules of the shrine the "kami" names cannot be removed so the only alternative is for the politicians to stop their visits following the example set by the emperor.

Those families ( if they really do exist unless they are brainwashed communists or Koreans or Taiwanese) would not visit there. As you know, Yasukuni is private and has got nothing to do with government orders. Either you visit and mourn or not, it is your choice. Their sons left the notes coming back home to Yasukuni to meet their families visiting there. There's no room for those cheep claimers obsessed with ATROCITIES or with war-criminal-labeling to step-in with their shoes on.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Poor Koreans, your economy is in shambles; your youth are in penury for lack of jobs; Chinese companies are taking over market share from you low-tech Korean companies!

And all you can do is perennially whine and moan about Yasukuni?!

Sorry, Hanguk folks, don't you have l'affaire Cho Kuk to take care of?

And also resuscitating your tanking economy? Why not use your energy more productively?

Actually, I, as a foreigner, am planning on visiting Yasukuni next year!

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

MkoreaMwafrikaOct. 21  02:34 pm JST

Actually, Japanese politicos should continue visiting Yasukuni if they so wish; it's part of honoring their history.

Fine, if they go as private citizens and not to get votes and cash from geriatric fascists.

I, as, an African , Kenyan born, have absolutely no problem with a British politician, say, visiting Westminter Abbey or such like place that honor British explorers, adventurers and colonialists, and war dead of yore. It's part of their history. So what?!

Westminster Abbey is a very different sort of establishment from Yasukuni Shrine. The Christianity practiced by the Church of England is an established as a state religion, Shinto is not. Westminster Abbey is therefore property of the nation, Yasukuni is a private establishment so Japanese politicians cannot claim that going there is one of their official duties.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Why don't you ask the Chinese to stop visiting Tiananmen and Mao's mausoleum?

Even though that would certainly be appropriate there are two reasons why they don't 1) they don't actually respect China enough to expect them to listen and 2) they are not trying to build a close friendly relationship with China. They are with Japan but Japan keeps acting like the big brother who, every time guests come, tell them the story of the time they put dog poop in your mouth while you were sleeping.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

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