politics

G7 warns Russia of massive consequences if Ukraine invaded

56 Comments
By JILL LAWLESS

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56 Comments

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From a historical perspective, I'm not sure Russia cares what other countries do and think about Putins antics. From the economy to world order, Russia has always been the instigator of world wars to attacking Democracy in any form.

-17 ( +9 / -26 )

I wish they'd come out with a similar official declaration against China but they seem more reticent and fearful even though they've unilaterally claimed and taken over most of the South China Sea and instigate constant military flight incursions into Japan's and Taiwan's airspace.

Good on them for taking a stand against Russia even though, like the poster above mentioned, Putin will probably ignore it.

3 ( +16 / -13 )

Russia has always been the instigator of world wars 

This wonderful piece of historical fantasy get a thumbs up?

Even if you did mean the Soviet Union, it’d still be false.

25 ( +30 / -5 )

Tell that to anyone from Eastern Europe.

Good point. Many Eastern Europeans are well educated, but I think they know the difference between world wars and military occupation.

16 ( +23 / -7 )

Putin is not worried about the G7 and the USA or UK.

Threatening him is just stupid.

18 ( +22 / -4 )

The US and NATO need to deploy significant air power on the Ukraine's borders with Poland, Romania and Moldava. In addition the US needs to make a show of naval force including significant amphibious assault forces near Russia's far east. Let Ivan worry that the US and NATO might provide overwhelming air support for Ukrainian troops along the lines of how US air power crushed an attack by 500 Wagner mercs on a Conoco refinery in Syria guarded by 40 US soldiers back in February 2018 while the US just might do some damage in their far east, maybe even take a few Kurile Islands as collateral to force Ivan to get out of the Crimea. Just how I think. Not sure most western leaders are that aggressive.

One thing is certain, if the Russians did move on Ukraine and NATO airpower smashed the assault it would be the end of Vladimir Putin.

-7 ( +9 / -16 )

Sanctions are no good. Most people in Russia still live like peasants outside Moscow and the power circles. If you want to hit Russia hard, you have to hit them militarily. But only if they strike first.

-16 ( +4 / -20 )

After Afghanistan the military industrial complex is looking for new markets.

17 ( +21 / -4 )

In addition the US needs to make a show of naval force including significant amphibious assault forces near Russia's far east.

More Hollywood fantasies.... Yeah, pull that Zumwalt from San Diego and send it there. Just clean all the rust off, so that it's not embarrassing.

10 ( +15 / -5 )

I wish they'd come out with a similar official declaration against China but they seem more reticent and fearful even though they've unilaterally claimed and taken over most of the South China Sea and instigate constant military flight incursions into Japan's and Taiwan's airspace.

Two comments. Number one, an ADIZ is not a nation's sovereign airspace. Sovereign airspace extends only 12 nautical miles from shore. Beyond that anybody can fly. An ADIZ is an Air Defense Identification Zone. An ADIZ is designed to allow coastal nations to have some warning of airplanes approaching their shores. Airplanes flying through an ADIZ on a formal flight plan, like pretty much all commercial aviation, checks in with the controlling agency, declares their flight ID, position, altitude (to double check against what the transponder is squawking) and destination. Satisfied it is a commercial fight nothing else needs to be done. But suppose a foreign military aircraft enters an ADIZ and it is not on a formal flight plan? The controlling agency is going to call them probably on UHF243 and VHF 121.5, the two International Guard frequencies all aircraft are supposed to monitor at all times, and ask their intentions. If there is no response or a response the nation controlling the ADIZ doesn't like they have time to launch fighters to investigate the contact(s). It is a means to prevent surprise attacks. But it is not territorial airspace and anybody from any nation can freely fly through an ADIZ. Unless those Russian or Chinese aircraft violate Japan's 12nm limit and enter their territorial airspace, Japan has no legal authority to do anything but watch the Chinese and/or Russians fly by. Japan can send fighters to keep an eye on them, the US does this all the time when Russian bombers enter the US ADIZ off Alaska, but as long as those airplanes stay outside of territorial airspace they have done nothing wrong. They can refuse to talk on the radio and flip your fighter pilots a nice birdie and it's all quite legal as long as they stay outside 12 nm from shore.

As for international opposition to China, I think you just saw an example where the US told China that if China used force to prevent Philippine forces from resupply their little garrison on Second Thomas Shoal it would force the US to respond under the terms of the US-Philippine mutual defense treaty. China had to back down. You also see a lot of nations deploying forces to the South China Sea to challenge China's illegal claimes. Even the Germans are talking about permanently stationing airpower in the region. I suspect if it became apparent China was massing troops and ships in ports near Taiwan there would be a response from the world's democracies similar to what we are seeing wrt the Ukraine.

-3 ( +9 / -12 )

That area was important to Hitler in WWII as well and people would do good to remember how fierce the fighting was on the Eastern front, don't escalate. Geo-politically, Putin wants to protect the oil in the Caucasus, and with his friend Lukashenko if he secures Ukraine he'll have his western flank protected, plus control the Black Sea. Turkey can be a counter to that, but as of late, Erdogan has had troubled relations with the EU and western countries and has been cozying up to Putin. it will be interesting to see how the U.S. and EU court him now.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Number one, an ADIZ is not a nation's sovereign airspace.

Now C’mon! How’s the MSM supposed to strike fear in the minds of the weak if they know what an ADIZ is.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Hasn't the Ukraine already been invaded...by NATO and Nazis?

For sure the Nazis did hideous things in the Ukraine, too.

but the great Russian hero Stalin (though he was a Georgian leading the USSR at that time) might have been even worse:

How Joseph Stalin Starved Millions in the Ukrainian Famine

Cruel efforts under Stalin to impose collectivism and tamp down Ukrainian nationalism left an estimated 3.9 million dead

https://www.history.com/news/ukrainian-famine-stalin

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

Sanctions regarding SWIFT, the international banking system will hurt his oligarchs, an important target.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

Putin wants a promise from the US (Biden) that the Ukraine won't join NATO, but Biden insists that its up to the Ukraine if they want to join NATO. Thats interesting because Russia has requested to join NATO but was denied by its members, but mainly the United States. The former USSR set up the Warsaw Pact following the creation of NATO.

Since the end of the Cold War, 13 countries have joined NATO; the Czech Republic, Hungary and Poland (1999), Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia (2004), Albania and Croatia (2009), and Montenegro (2017)

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Japan better stay put on this.

The West and China fear a Japan-Russia normalization.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

Number one, an ADIZ is not a nation's sovereign airspace.

Now C’mon! How’s the MSM supposed to strike fear in the minds of the weak if they know what an ADIZ is."

Indeed.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Russia has always been the instigator of world wars to attacking Democracy in any form.

For example?

7 ( +10 / -3 )

History repeats itself. 1962 Cuban missile crisis is the mirror case. Back then Soviet rockets were placed in the uncle Sam's backyard. These days NATO came all the way to Russian borders with all its mighty modern armament. Russia is naturally concerned just like JFK was back in the days, speaking of whom, he completely ignored Cuba being an independent country which had concluded bilateral agreement with USSR. So why so angry about Putin being concerned and acting to contain NATO's subscriber growth. Any other state which has a privilege on independent foreign policy would have reacted the same way. Problem is there are very few left however...

10 ( +10 / -0 )

Hasn't the Ukraine already been invaded...by NATO and Nazis?

Not exactly 'invaded'. A coup instigated by Germany and USA and a coup regime that relies on neo-Nazis terrorizing the population in order to prevent uprisings.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

I would say that crashing the Russian Economy via SWIFT and oil cutoffs (This is kind of a last resort thing) is hardly an empty threat. And make no mistake, that is exactly what will happen to the economy of this Gasoline Stand impersonating a country.

We like to hear that "Oh, the Russians lived through Stalingrad. They can handle this" Um, Stalingrad was thrust upon them during an invasion, and this is not the mid 20th Century. Modern Russians - to the extent that they exist - expect continual increases in the standard of living, not renewed suffering for the greater glory of a modern day Napoleon (By which I mean a midget thug with delusions of grandeur).

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

Sanctions regarding SWIFT, the international banking system will hurt his oligarchs, an important target.

I've wondered about this. If Russia were excluded from SWIFT, wouldn't Germany and etc have to deliver truck loads of cash to the Russian central bank?

6 ( +7 / -1 )

if Russia wanted to attack and occupy Ukraine could do that a long time ago.

as Russia have no reason/yet/to do so there is nothing like need to worry that attack may happen overnight.

talk of facts.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

If and when Russia decides to make the move, NOT A SINGLE sole will or can stop it! It's no different than when NATO invaded Iraq and Afghanistan, Or Israel with Palestine, Or Russia with Crimea. This is the new world order set by Mr. Bush.

10 ( +11 / -1 )

Tell that to anyone from Eastern Europe.

ask anybody in europe who started WW1 WW2, certainly wasnt USSR

and then ask them again who saved their butts from the Nazis.

12 ( +14 / -2 )

I think “massive consequences” will equal a stern scolding.

Putin is like a honey badger. He doesn’t care.

Russian supplies 80% of Europe’s gas, 90% of Germany’s gas.

Imagine winter in Europe without gas. Ha!

8 ( +9 / -1 )

Just stand back and sale them weapons. That is the original plan since it was the days when it was called Novarussia

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

I would say that crashing the Russian Economy via SWIFT and oil cutoffs (This is kind of a last resort thing) is hardly an empty threat.

And how then do you suggest the US will pay Russia for oil and other petroleum products it buys? Or you don't mind living through another oil crisis like in the 70s?

4 ( +7 / -3 )

I like how brave they are towards Russian and how timid they are towards China!

4 ( +6 / -2 )

zichiToday  10:26 am JST

From the photo 11 ministers, six male and five female

Yes, it should be 5-1/2 and 5-1/2. :)

4 ( +4 / -0 )

To all so called "ukraine experts" here.

Ukraine and Russian federation did not have single serious issue since split of USSR till maidan protests organized with help of US embassy and US funds.

Everything started with overthrowing of legally elected and worldwide recognized president Yanukovich when power in country was stolen by various nationalists or if you want get better word-fascists.

Do you remember attack i Odessa when they have burned alive many people in Culture house?

Sure people of Crimea did not want see same things going to happen on their soil,This is why majority of citizens have decided to join Russian federation and worry for violence,civil war and economy bakrupt were three main motives for them to decide as they have decided in referendum.

Sure people in Donbass and Lugansk regions did not want fascists from Kiev will take over their places and they have started to fight against them.

This is talk of facts.

Its sad to see that recent government in Kiev did not make any effort to discuss with citizens of Donbass and Lugansk regions about their status and future.Its sad to see that recent government in Kiev lives in own parallel world and dreaming that americans will come overnight and will defeat "russian agressors".Its sad to see that recent government in Kiev did not make any single step to ease tensions and to solve own country internal problems by their own.Instead of this supporting Azov and other violent terrorist groups.Instead of this supporting antirussian hate.

Very sad and pathetic.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

I know this is outside the issue, but why can't Liz Truss stand up properly: Hardly exudes power or authority. She looks to have the posture of a five year old.

All the other ladies seem to have excellent bearing, but Boris's little protege...dear oh dear, Putin must be laughing at yet another powerless and pointless international gathering, hosted by a nation where the news is dominated by rogue Christmas parties.

If Putin wants to invade the Ukraine, He will. No-one at that meeting will be willing or able to lift a finger against him effectively, sadly. But I'm sure it would call for another round of extraneous meetings to decide upon sternly worded rebukes- That'll sort him out, no doubt...

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Ukraine and Russian federation did not have single serious issue since split of USSR till maidan protests organized with help of US embassy and US funds.

Um, no and they were sure as hell not attended by "paid" marchers. But the USSR, Oh I'm sorry, "Russians" absolutely sent snipers to fire on the crowd to support their hack who absolutely lost the election.

So, sorry to all the pro-kremlin "commenters", but The Ukraine is a sovereign nation, It's not part of Russia no matter what The midget thug says.

The vast, super-majority of Ukranians do not want to be under the little Vlad's thumb and it is his authoritarian bent that is driving Ukraine into the West's arms.

These are the facts and they are not in doubt no matter how much they want to whine and moan.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Germany needs an action plan to get off Russian gas, any word on that?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

btw it's not "The Ukraine" just Ukraine. If you grew up in the past century it may be out of habit. Note that the term "The Ukraine" comes from when it was under USSR rule. Call it just Ukraine respects its independence.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

Tell that to anyone from Eastern Europe.

Russia has a huge amount of support in Eastern Europe largely as a result of the events that led the Red Army to being there. Much to the chagrin of ruling classes all over the world, probably including the Russian ruling class. They are just like American, German and etc ruling classes. Their Swiss bank accounts are far more important than German and American backed neo-Nazis running wild and terrorizing the population of the Ukraine.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

It is so sad that rich, powerful countries leaders insist in creating, agravating problems that demand time, money, resources that could be wisely used to make the whole world a better place to live, not to die for so small ambitions.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Russia has a huge amount of support in Eastern Europe largely as a result of the events that led the Red Army to being there.

So much so that all the former Warsaw pact nations with the exception of Ukraine (apologies for adding the "the". I should know better.) and Belarus rushed to join NATO. And I bet Ukraine wishes that it had either: A) joined NATO or B) kept its nukes.

Huge amount of support. I snorted my drink reading that.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

What Russian “leaders” care less about is Russia itself. The best action against Russian hostility will be to block all the foreign assets of Russian “elite” and their families.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

So much so that all the former Warsaw pact nations with the exception of Ukraine (apologies for adding the "the". I should know better.) and Belarus rushed to join NATO.

Yep and the ruling classes absolutely forbade any referendum on the issue and then except in Germany, made it illegal to carry about opinion polls on the question.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Um, no and they were sure as hell not attended by "paid" marchers.

Obviously a surprise to you, but yes, it was all orchestrated. Just google Nuland and her classic "F... the EU" in 2014 Kiev.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

But of course anything in the Middle East is fine with the G7.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Ukraine will likely be part of the Russian coalition that will invade Israel in the last days for a spoil as prophesied in Ezekiel 38 and 39. This confederacy includes Iran, Turkey, Sudan, Libya and all the central Asian countries including Afghanistan. God will sanctify himself before the eyes of the world when he supernaturally defends his land and his people.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Obviously a surprise to you, but yes, it was all orchestrated. Just google Nuland and her classic "F... the EU" in 2014 Kiev.

And that is why 70%+ think that Russia is the greatest threat they face, why 60+% of the population wants to join the EU and 55%+ want to join NATO? Because it was all "orchestrated" comrade?

I swear, you guys make it easy.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

And then Russia cuts off gas and fuel production to the world and the world goes in to energy crisis like no other...

1 ( +4 / -3 )

And then Russia cuts off gas and fuel production to the world and the world goes in to energy crisis like no other...

Actually what happens is that OPEC and the US ramp up production and wave to the Russians with only one finger.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

PaulToday  02:44 pm JST

And then Russia cuts off gas and fuel production to the world and the world goes in to energy crisis like no other...

And MasterBlaster say, 'Bartertown finished!'

GdTokyoToday  02:46 pm JST

And then Russia cuts off gas and fuel production to the world and the world goes in to energy crisis like no other...

Actually what happens is that OPEC and the US ramp up production and wave to the Russians with only one finger.

Russians don't know or recognize what that gesture means, and the 'F-word' doesn't even exist in the Russian language.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Actually what happens is that OPEC and the US ramp up production and wave to the Russians with only one finger.

Right. Just like OPEC and Russia waved to Biden a few weeks back when sleepy Joe was begging them to increase oil production. What's the price per gallon these days in the States, btw?

2 ( +5 / -3 )

"Russians" absolutely sent snipers to fire on the crowd to support their hack who absolutely lost the election.possibly you have some good info so may i ask for source?

So, sorry to all the pro-kremlin "commenters", but The Ukraine is a sovereign nation, It's not part of Russia no matter what The midget thug says.no doubt theya were sovereign nation till maidan coup d etat.ask ukrainians now how they enjoy their "freedom" especially ones from eastern part of their country.

The vast, super-majority of Ukranians do not want to be under the little Vlad's thumb and it is his authoritarian bent that is driving Ukraine into the West's arms.once again no source.kind of trolling?

These are the facts and they are not in doubt no matter how much they want to whine and moan.i am sure you have never been in Ukraine before so sure dont get it right.but yes maybe wikipedia or cnn may be your "sources"?

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

cnn may be your "sources"?

Just how many reporters did vaunted Faux "news" have on the Ground because CNN had quite a few. You keep saying CNN like it is a bad thing and yet the one remaining News side reporter at Faux just jumped ship for CNN.

And yes, that is exactly what happened. Ukrainians told Russia to perform an impossible act upon itself and overthrew its puppet nobody.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Right. Just like OPEC and Russia waved to Biden a few weeks back when sleepy Joe was begging them to increase oil production. What's the price per gallon these days in the States, btw?

$72.9 down from $83+ in late October, thank you very much. Showing that price kinks are working themselves out nicely. Gasoline, LNG, home heating oil prices all falling.

You could take the time to figure this all out before asking, BTW.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

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