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Japan says ties at risk if S Korea tries to revise 2015 'comfort women' deal

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By Hyonhee Shin

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Hasn't Japan done and paid enough already in regard to this matter ? /

37 ( +45 / -8 )

Comfort women issue aside.

If a president can so easily reverse an “irreversible” treaty it speaks volumes for that nation’s credibility.

37 ( +45 / -8 )

Andrew Horvat, a visiting professor at Josai International University in Japan, said that the pact was flawed from the beginning because it failed to produce real reconciliation

What is real reconciliation? When they signed in 2015, didn’t they check whether the other side agreed with the conditions?

Even if a new deal and more compensation is given, there’s no way to stop people from talking about sex slaves.

15 ( +20 / -5 )

Kang apologised for "giving wounds of the heart to the victims, their families, civil society that support them and all other people because the agreement failed to sufficiently reflect a victim-oriented approach, which is the universal standard in resolving human rights issues".

The South Korean government failed the victims in 1965, spending the money Japan paid to go to "individuals who suffered" on infrastructure. Then they blamed Japan. Now they do the same thing again after signing the 2015 agreement. It's about time Japan started playing hardball with South Korea, as well As the United States. South Korea continues to let the China influenced Chong Dae Hyup to influence and control their government to break the US-ROK-JPN alliance.

"The agreement was not reconciliation, but an agreement not to talk about it anymore", Horvat said

South Korea is still breaking that agreement as well.

28 ( +33 / -5 )

It's not whether the've done enough, it's that a deal was made with the Korean government in 2015 that was supposed to put the issue to bed. The new Korean government seems to think that negotiating in bad faith is acceptable international behavior.

Why negotiate at all when it just means you'll have to do it all again in 4 years time?

29 ( +34 / -5 )

Ignore S. Koreans extortion. Notice to US and Trump 'Japan is no. longer US ally with S. Korea. NK hasn't been complaining about comfort women even though S. Korea put all money to their pocket.

18 ( +25 / -7 )

The world is watching. Not because they care about the CW issue, but because they are gauging future foreign and trade policies to SK.

21 ( +24 / -3 )

Here we go again.

Hasn't Japan done and paid enough already in regard to this matter ?

No. Hush money does not negate decades of subjugation and abuse. The disgusting previous government in SK is to blame. Imo the hush funds should be returned in full and a more lasting, far reaching solution explored. For the typical naysayers, best solution is to go the way Germany was treated after the atrocious war. That simple.

-25 ( +9 / -34 )

My father (Meiji born) used to say it is not Japan invaded and colonized Korea onesidedly but they asked for help or needed help from Japan to govern the country since the country is so difficult to rule even by themselves since people there are very argumentative and cannot decide things. He said "Chosen wa rikutsu no ooi kunida." It has not changed.

-1 ( +16 / -17 )

Japan. You can't just start denying the comfort women issue as Abe has done, just after signing a seemingly irreversible treaty with South Korea. Signing a treaty also mean that you historically has to deliver accurate information to the future generations! Japan has on their side, not delivered on this issue. Thinking that only an agreement will please South Korea, and that they can start denying right after signing it!

Double standard is what we call it!

On top of this, the japanese government is saying that they; "signed it in front of the international community and with their consent". That is a complete lie! Even the UN secretary general Antonio Guterres said that Japan is exaggerating the importance of the agreement, and that they should await South Koreas population's consent. Has Japan done this??

Another important aspect is that, Park Geun He who was president at the time (2015) is now imprisoned. This itself should represent South Koreas disapproval of her, but also her actions, including the 2015-agreement. Consider this, Japan, and stop acting like the most superior country in Asia!

-19 ( +14 / -33 )

You can't just start denying the comfort women issue as Abe has done

Yep, Abe is sure a weird guy. Who else would think of "denying the comfort women issue" by signing a very public compensation deal and issuing several high profile apologies.

No wonder the Japanese are thought to be inscrutable.

16 ( +24 / -8 )

Strikebreaker555Today 07:51 am JSTJapan. You can't just start denying the comfort women issue as Abe has done, just after signing a seemingly irreversible treaty with South Korea. Signing a treaty also mean that you historically has to deliver accurate information to the future generations! Japan has on their side, not delivered on this issue.

The U.S. Army, The U.S. Government, Professors Ahn, Soh and Park have delivered accurate information. But South Korea is so biased that they prosecuted Prof. Park.

On top of this, the japanese government is saying that they; "signed it in front of the international community and with their consent". That is a complete lie! Even the UN secretary general Antonio Guterres said that Japan is exaggerating the importance of the agreement, and that they should await South Koreas population's consent. Has Japan done this??

He never said that. Your statement is a lie.

"U.N. Secretary-General Antonio Guterres has told Prime Minister Shinzo Abe that he backs the agreement signed by Tokyo and Seoul on the Korean women who were forced to work in Japan’s wartime military brothels, the Foreign Ministry said."

Another important aspect is that, Park Geun He who was president at the time (2015) is now imprisoned. This itself should represent South Koreas disapproval of her, but also her actions, including the 2015-agreement. Consider this, Japan, and stop acting like the most superior country in Asia!

That Park was charged and indicted for something that has nothing to do with the 2015 Agreement has zero relevance to the fact that she was the President of the ROK at the time of the agreement. Japan does not blatantly backtrack on biliateral agreements with other sovereign nations. South Korea should be ashamed of it's behavior.

22 ( +27 / -5 )

South Korea wants Japan to take legal responsibility and provide due compensation.

How many times do they have to do that? Enough already! How long do they expect to ride this gravy train?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

You can't just start denying the comfort women issue as Abe has done

Abe “denied” the comfort woman issue by declaring a public apology and financial compensation treaty?

Can you provide one statement in which Abe denies the issue?

22 ( +28 / -6 )

Just ignore them completely. There is no point of talking. They will only be happy if Japan is gone from the face of the earth. Asian Palestinines and Israels. There can be no peace.

17 ( +22 / -5 )

 South Korea continues to let the China influenced Chong Dae Hyup to influence and control their government to break the US-ROK-JPN alliance.

Would not surprise me at all. Has to be near the top of the priority list for China to break up that alliance. Although when it comes to Japan & South Korea, its perhaps one based more on military necessity than any sort of friendship. Surely most South Koreans and Japanese have moved on and can see that given their geographic location, it would be far better to pursue friendship than constantly bringing up the past.

20 ( +21 / -1 )

An agreement is supposed to be an agreement, that's why it's called an agreement! SK milking this for all it's worth as usual. Haven't seen them talk about returning the money though.....

22 ( +27 / -5 )

My father (Meiji born) used to say it is not Japan invaded and colonized Korea onesidedly but they asked for help or needed help from Japan to govern the country since the country is so difficult to rule even by themselves since people there are very argumentative and cannot decide things. He said "Chosen wa rikutsu no ooi kunida." It has not changed.

It's replies like these that reinforce the need for the replication of the german model of contrition. No number of down votes is going to change the fact that unlike Germany after the atrocious war, Japan got a slap on the wrist in comparison as far as atonement goes.

-10 ( +13 / -23 )

What the first 2 posters said! ++

11 ( +13 / -2 )

This ongoing nonsense isn't comforting at all.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

the only point i agree about in this article is that "enforced sex slaves" is more accurate than "comfort women." the rest is just the same blathering from sk. the country sure does know how to milk a dead cow.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

This is internal Korean politics. The deal with Japan is done! DONE!

16 ( +18 / -2 )

Seems like the SK is taking negotiation lessons from NK. This issue has been "agreed" to multiple times since 1965 and SK just keeps looking for more ways to get Japan to apologize and pay up. If this is China's way of driving a wedge into the alliance they're doing a good job. And SK must be really gullible.

12 ( +14 / -2 )

I no longer support any further discussion with SK over these prostitutes. This issue is permanently over

9 ( +14 / -5 )

Were the victim groups involved in the 2015 negotiations? Did Japan make sure the money went to the right people? If so, it's pretty ridiculous for Japan to keep paying.

But this story makes it seem like Japan simply made a deal with the then SK government, without any agreement from the victim groups and general public. In that case, Japan should've seen this coming. It's the people they have to make amends with, not some corrupt government's.

And you don't win people's hearts and show genuine remorse by going around the world trying to prevent statues from going up and textbooks from mentioning history and facts. No amount of money buys you the right to erase history.

-12 ( +5 / -17 )

"South Korea wants Japan to take legal responsibility and provide due compensation." Again!

I'm sure everybody is sick of SK beating this same drum over and over again. However, I'm even more sick of Japanese historians and bureaucrats downplaying the severity and straight up denying the use of comfort women. I remember one Japanese politician who recently stated the women all volunteered to be used as sex slaves. These comments must be extremely hurtful to the SK people, especially those who were enslaved, of which there are only a handful left alive. If Japan were to stop trying to change and downplay their historical facts this problem would go away.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

What is worse - what happened 70 years ago or SK playing around with politics to milk the issue? I think the tipping point was passed some time ago... JP has apologized (enough) for the former; SK should STOP with the latter.

11 ( +17 / -6 )

I don't agree with the financial aspects of all this, but SK was stupid in agreeing to the deal in the first place as it was clearly not a good one & certainly not done with any good faith on Japans part, Japan simply wanted to pay hush money & did so & then has the bizarre idea that that part of history can no longer be publically discussed which is absurd....

At this point both side should just shut up when dealing with the other

As for Japan/abe denials, quick search revealed some:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1544471/Japanese-PM-denies-wartime-comfort-women-were-forced.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1544471/Japanese-PM-denies-wartime-comfort-women-were-forced.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1544471/Japanese-PM-denies-wartime-comfort-women-were-forced.html

-15 ( +6 / -21 )

Before taking action, I do think the leaders of South Korea should take a look at how the credibility of their major external benefactor (the United States) has been shredded to pieces by Donald Trump's unilateral abrogation of assorted agreements and deals with other countries. Park Geun-hye was a terrible president in South Korea and undoubtedly Moon & Co. would love to negate her legacy completely in the way that Donald Trump is trying to erase any trace of Barack Obama's 8 years as U.S. president.

But South Korea's credibility as a good-faith partner will be destroyed if it unilaterally abrogates the December 2015 deal with Japan about the Comfort Women issue. It doesn't matter that she got impeached later, Park WAS the democratically elected president of South Korea when she concluded that deal with the Japanese. More than 15.7 million South Korean citizens voted for that totally incompetent and unqualified woman in the December 2012 presidential election. They are at least partly responsible for the assorted disappointments and disasters that followed.

12 ( +14 / -2 )

Weird above pasted same link oops

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/15/opinion/comfort-women-and-japans-war-on-truth.html

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-29736144

-12 ( +3 / -15 )

Abe has NEVER denied the existence of the comfort women system, a military brothel system which existed in other militaries like Germany and France. As others have pointed out, how could Japan possible reach an agreement with South Korea in 2015 if they "denied their existence".

Abe is on record denying that the women were all forced, the allegation hat "200,000women were kidnapped by the IJA". It has been determined that that charge came from a fake story run by the Asahi newspaper in the early 1990s and the newspaper has admitted to it and apologized. In addition, US Army reports, a US government investigation spanning 7 years, the findings by South Korean scholars support the view that the women were not "forced" by the IJA. There's little doubt that some were deceived by Korean agents, some sold off by their parents, some actually volunteered by answering recruitment ads in the newspapers. But the notion of a mass kidnapping by troops when Japan was stretched fighting losing war is preposterous.

13 ( +19 / -6 )

abe denies ANY were forced, they were all willing volunteers in his mind

-18 ( +4 / -22 )

The world is at brink of war with NK and SK wants to focus on destroying bilateral ties with Japan. I forgot, the president is from NK with existing family ties with NK. How could the SK people be blind in not seeing the obvious?

13 ( +17 / -4 )

Perhaps someone can better inform me, but I have read somewhere that both China and NK have influence in SK's domestic politics. Perhaps the US and JP should cease their involvement in the peninsula and let KJ-U and the Chinese do their thing?

8 ( +12 / -4 )

I used to be more supportive of S. Korea on this matter. But Japan negotiated in good faith, and now SK seems to be reneging on that deal.

14 ( +18 / -4 )

SK seems to be reneging on that deal.

Like I've said before followed by a hail of denialists, this so called deal was a mistake executed by now defunct corrupt government.

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

The 2015 Agreement was made between the governments of ROK and JPN. The government of South Korea did not become "defunct", it continues to exist as before with simply a change in administration.

12 ( +15 / -3 )

Study the Korean cultural element called "han" and you will see that no reconciliation is possible. Grievances are eternal and can never be forgotten. The mass suicide of Japan would still not be enough. Don't give another yen.

16 ( +18 / -2 )

The government of South Korea did not become "defunct", it continues to exist as before with simply a change in administration.

My mistake. If you change government to administration, my point still stands. Decisions made by corrupt administrations can not be considered valid in any developed democracy.

-11 ( +1 / -12 )

A couple of interesting links.

https://scholarsinenglish.blogspot.jp/2014/10/summary-of-professor-park-yuhas-book.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Park_Yu-ha

6 ( +8 / -2 )

This is the last time I will comment or ever open an article about this subject. It has truly been discussed and worked out on Japan's part for sure ..... has it not? Enough is enough.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

If you change government to administration, my point still stands. Decisions made by corrupt administrations can not be considered valid in any developed democracy.

This reasoning is not only ridiculous, but factually incorrect. Richard Nixon's administration in the United States (a developed democracy) was corrupt, maybe the most corrupt ever until the present White House occupant. That didn't lead Nixon's successors to just renege on the opening to China and the withdrawal of American soldiers from Vietnam, among other things. Every civilian president South Korea has had since 1993 has been corrupt in one way or another. Perhaps Park was the most corrupt of them all. She was definitely the worst and the most incompetent. But that's not relevant here. She was the democratically elected president of South Korea when she decided to suddenly reverse her anti-Japan stance and conclude a deal with Abe & Co. on the Comfort Women in December 2015. South Korean voters put her in office through a free and fair presidential election. Maybe Park's domestic policy decisions can be more easily reversed, but bilateral agreements reached with foreign countries are another matter. To argue otherwise is to imply that any South Korean president's word is worthless to a foreign government.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

Japan basically gave an apology only to shut SK up, then paid them to make it stick. It wasn't sincere, it didn't express responsibility, and they continue to try to rewrite history by either outright denying the women were sex slaves, or by trying to hide that they were sex slaves by insisting on calling them "comfort women." There has also been much derogatory talk from politicians as well as members of the media.

That is why SK is now renegeing on the agreement. It's also a perfectly legitimate reason to renegene. This is an absolutely intolerable way to behave. And if SK withdraws from the agreement and Japan loss its support in the conflict with NK, that will be well deserved.

It's about time the Japanese people stood up against the government and clearly demand it to stop undermining the agreement before it's too late and SK makes the final decision to tell Japan to GFY.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Japan basically gave an apology only to shut SK up, then paid them to make it stick. It wasn't sincere, it didn't express responsibility, and they continue to try to rewrite history by either outright denying the women were sex slaves, or by trying to hide that they were sex slaves by insisting on calling them "comfort women."

Exactly.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35188135

Everything about the 2015 deal seemed like a business transaction rather than true recognition of the past. A lot of Japanese people even complained about getting the short end back when the deal was made. They complained about not getting enough returns... On their supposed compensation to victims...

This blatant lack of genuine remorse is what makes Japanese politicians just as much to blame as Korean/Chinese politicians in keeping this issue alive.

-10 ( +5 / -15 )

Certainly agree with many posters that this unsavoury topic should have been put to rest ages ago.

Korea has it's own domestic issues to accomodate concerning the case, as does Japan.

Kazuhiko Togo, respected Japanese academic and statesman's words of last year -

"...Despite these key reasons for resolving the issue, it is still difficult to understand how Abe persuaded his nationalist followers of his new position. But the political reality is that Abe is the most powerful political leader who shares sympathy to the nationalists’ thinking. Some nationalists have already begun protesting against the present agreement, but ultimately they are bound to follow their leader’s decisions.

It is more difficult to understand why the South Korean government consented to the agreement. The agreement does not include an acknowledgement by Japan of its criminal and legal responsibility, which had previously been a prerequisite for the South Korean civic movement. Possible reasons for this shift in policy include the US position, better balancing with China and some domestic frustration at the lack of policy flexibility toward Japan.

So is the recent agreement tenable and will both countries remain committed to it? It is certainly possible. But the long-term success of the agreement depends on both sides continuing to act in the spirit that led to this agreement: efforts to understand each other and to find a mutually acceptable solution......"

So - no it's not over, and guarantee it won't be anytime in the near future unless all stones are turned - meaning all.

That will cause frustration & pain on both sides - but it needs to be done. If Korea Inc thinks it's done enough and Abe Inc thinks it's done enough  - then prepare for a much longer conflict.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

OssanAmerica

It was a lie from the Japanese Government; http://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/AJ201705310017.html

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

Even if Japan's apology wasn't "heartfelt" (a condition conveniently only to be judged by the Koreans....after they have signed the nth agreement and the nth pile of money has arrived) it simply doesn't matter. "Han" says that the pain and hurt are forever....it's an endless cycle of "Ok, we accept your apology and your money.....oh wait, no we don't because you're such awful people, please try again." Give it up and let them stew.

12 ( +13 / -1 )

Ossan -

The incorrect Asahi shimbun articles based on the fabrications of Yoshida Seiji, may have impacted the populace at large, but they were not the only basis to the investigations and revelations concerning comfort women.

There exists plenty of material that preceded Seiji's fantasies. Many authorative voices will claim that the Asahi articles were of no importance in their research and announcements.

Continually bringing up the Asahi articles is truly flogging a dead horse.

Following on from my post above, referencing Togo's comments, while there continues  to be voices denying the tragedy - like LDP lawmaker Yoshitaka's comments last year stating the comfort women were prostitutes claiming to be victims - there will be no peace.

The irreversible contract was based on mutual acknowledgement of the issue and any denial or criticsm by either govt would break the trust. Well when you've got the govt of Japan - by proxy through it's members like the aforementioned troglodyte Yoshitaka, spouting denial, then the box is opened for all with opposing views to cut loose. It's a no-brainer.

And btw, I have no side in this, just sadly a bemused observer.

-8 ( +4 / -12 )

I'm beginning to think if the the South Korean Gov are just seeing this as a cash cow to bash Japan over until they have all past away, and point the finger at japan in the future for not doing enough.

From my research they have paid cash.

So this was from wikipedia,

"In 1951, at the start of negotiations, the South Korean government initially demanded $364 million in compensation for Koreans forced into labor and military service during the Japanese occupation: $200 per survivor, $1,650 per death and $2,000 per injured person.[120] In the final agreement reached in the 1965 treaty, Japan provided an $800 million aid and low-interest loan package over 10 years. Japan intended to directly compensate individuals, but the Korean government insisted on receiving the sum itself and "spent most of the money on economic development, focusing on infrastructure and the promotion of heavy industry".[121]"

"On December 28, 2015, Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and South Korean President Park Geun-hye reached a formal agreement to settle the dispute. Japan agreed to pay ¥1 billion (₩9.7 billion; $8.3 million) to a fund supporting surviving victims while South Korea agreed to refrain from criticizing Japan regarding the issue and to work to remove a statue memorializing the victims from in front of the Japanese embassy in Seoul.[140] The announcement came after Japan's Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida met his counterpart Yun Byung-se in Seoul, and later Prime Minister Shinzo Abe phoned President Park Geun-hye to repeat an apology already offered by Kishida. The Korean government will administer the fund for the forty-six remaining elderly comfort women and will consider the matter "finally and irreversibly resolved."[141] Despite the official, final agreement between Japan and South Korea, some Korean comfort women protested the outcome.[142]"

"On February 16, 2016, the United Nations' “Committee on the Elimination of Discrimination against Women”, Seventh and Eighth Periodic Reports, was held, with Shinsuke Sugiyama, Deputy Minister for Ministry of Foreign Affairs (Japan), reiterating the official and final agreement between Japan and South Korea to pay ¥1 billion.[143][144] Sugiyama also restated the Japanese Government apology of that agreement: “The issue of comfort women, with an involvement of the Japanese military authorities at that time, was a grave affront to the honor and dignity of large numbers of women, and the Government of Japan is painfully aware of responsibilities.” [145]

But it seems Korea received it's money, but didn't wish to give the money to the actual victims themselves.

While I'm not happy at the way Japan handled such issues, I think the Korean Gov seem to keep coming back for more money, after spending it all.

Is the money the issue? if not, is it the way Japan teaches history? ( as part of the heart felt apology) Sadly, I seem to be running out of patience myself.

Japan should just honestly deal with the teaching of history and go all out like Germany did in teaching history. Move on in its pacifist future.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

Did Abe or Aso go to Korea to confime the mood of the people? From Yamaguchi there is a clear perception of all sorts of transmission from closest foreign areas and feelings involved in sensitive issues. Albert in a foreign tongue.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

From what I have read the money paid has never reached the actual women themselves, and never will.

Ask the Korean government, and the self-appointed controllers/minders of the remaining women why.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Always the innocent who suffer. Women most of all.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

2015 was not first time negotiation. Japan paid money South Korea demanded many years before 2015 .

8 ( +8 / -0 )

Korea is not near to Yamaguchi. Shimonoseki is near to Korea. Taiyo Gyogyo has been contributing S Korea's food industry long time before WW II. And Abe's wife love Korean soap opera, Sean Korean language.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

demanded many years before 2015 .

Demanded? Its within their right as a subjugated former colony to seek reparations of any kind. That said even after all payouts to individuals that never meant to pay out to victims, the fact that some people still deny the atrocities perpetrated goes to show that there's been truly no real change in the past 70 years. Cosmetic touches coupled with hush money payouts have clearly failed to quiet this. It's truly never been about money only. The admittance of all known atrocities along with massive education of the masses regarding these plus the complete and utter disregard of the war past is only way forward at this time. There's no way around this. And not enough screeching can ever change that.

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

The agreement was not reconciliation, but an agreement not to talk about it anymore

Because nothing to be reconciliated.  It was the last payment for Korea's extortion over fake comfort women story.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

Recommend “Culture and Imperialism”, although thats another part of island.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Basically, Korea is just doing what Japan did - remember the promises Japan made with that UNESCO heritage site and forced labour?

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Japan mde Korea colony. Japan was. not behaving like. Japan today..

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

browny1Dec. 28 07:24 pm JSTOssan -

The incorrect Asahi shimbun articles based on the fabrications of Yoshida Seiji, may have impacted the populace at large, but they were not the only basis to the investigations and revelations concerning comfort women. There exists plenty of material that preceded Seiji's fantasies. Many authorative voices will claim that the Asahi articles were of no importance in their research and announcements. Continually bringing up the Asahi articles is truly flogging a dead horse.

Indeed it is flogging a dead horse but necessitated by the constant repetition of fallacies; 200,000 kidnapped by IJA soldiers. The term "sex slaves" itself is a fallacy, coined by the anti-J crowd to enhance the degree of perceived suffering by the women who were military prostitutes.

This is an interesting article about the views of Seoul National University professor emeritus of economics Lee Young-hoon on the subject.

https://japan-forward.com/estimates-based-on-facts-200000-comfort-women-defies-math/

The other fallacy always repeated is that "Japan" or "Abe" DENIES the existence of the Comfort Women system, an absurd claim when Japan and South Korea reached an agreement in 2015. The article pertains to South Korea reneging on it's agreement, and despite some of the comments, no, there is no excuse for a sovereign nation that values it's credibility in the international community to do so. Perhaps this is indicative of the nature of South Korea as a nation and people, as their on and off position on THAAD sends a similar question of credibility to the United States.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

You can't claim you've apologized for something you deny. Reading the despicable comments here is exhibit A in proving why Japan continues to have niggling disagreements over history with all its neighbors.

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

melonbarmonsterToday 05:18 am JST

You can't claim you've apologized for something you deny.

It never ends. Let's just keep repeating false information. How did Japan and South Korea reach an agreement in 2015 if anyone was "denying" the existence of the Comfort Women?

6 ( +9 / -3 )

By that you're selectively referring to the claims of 'admission' which exists in midst of claims of denial. This is rife even in this insignificant comments sections as well as statements from Abe who has claimed that there is no evidence of coercion. That's an outright denial.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

Abe has denied there was "coercion". He has never denied the existence of the Comfort Women System. These two are NOT the same thing. Especially since US Army Reports from during WWII, a US Government investigation spanning 7 years, views voiced by Prof. Ahn. Soh, Park and Lee all support the view that Japanese troops did "not coerce" the women. What Abe says "that there is no evidence of coercion" is factual and correct.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

Ossan - sorry to be flogging a dead horse - but there is evidence of coercion. Easy to find credible material.

I agree the very questionable 200,000 number still gets thrown about - but to deny any co-ercion out of 10,000s is just way way out of here.

The IJA coerced, bullied, stood on, killed members of it's own forces as a matter-of-fact. The whole military was an exercise in brutality - upon it's own. Why on earth would someone believe then that foreign women (couldn't get much lower on the social scale) wouldn't have been pressured.

Begs disbelief.

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

From what I have read the money paid has never reached the actual women themselves, and never will.

Ask the Korean government, and the self-appointed controllers/minders of the remaining women why.

The same thing happened the last time Japan paid money. Japan should have known better, yet they made another deal with a suspect government anyway. Again, there's a lot wrong with the way the SK and Chinese governments deal with the issue, bit for it's part, Japan seems to think throwing money at the problem gives them the right to play the victim.

Why not actually reach out and have a dialog with the victims to determine where the money should go? Because they don't really care and just want to wash their hands of the issue.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

browny1Today 09:02 am JSTOssan - sorry to be flogging a dead horse - but there is evidence of coercion. Easy to find credible material.

I agree the very questionable 200,000 number still gets thrown about - but to deny any co-ercion out of 10,000s is just way way out of here.

The IJA coerced, bullied, stood on, killed members of it's own forces as a matter-of-fact. The whole military was an exercise in brutality - upon it's own. Why on earth would someone believe then that foreign women (couldn't get much lower on the social scale) wouldn't have been pressured.

Begs disbelief.

Hate to have to educate you on this subject but the only proven and documented "Coercion" carried out by actual IJA troops occurred in Indonesia. There is no evidence whatsoever of a similar "coercion" by Japanese troops in Korea. Such claims by some surviving "comfort women" have been fund to be contradictory and unreliable by South Korean scholars. Bullying among the IJA themselves is not relevant to this issue. As to why a comfort woman would not be pressured, Comfort Women were under the employ of the military brothel system making them subjects of the Emperor, and if you're a Japanese soldier, you don't harm such persons. Note that some made good money, some even married Japanese soldiers. Note also that the Comfort Stations serviced Korean men too who were "Japanese soldiers".

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Both Korea may be unified. Japan will forget them Konoo has been busy visiting ther countries. Beside that Russiaa and Chiina are not treatiiiing Japan as their enemy. S Korea will hate Japan forever.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

I don't think it matters what Japan does or doesn't do. This issue is going to come up again and again until the end of times.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

South Korea doesn't understand the meaning of the treaty.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

kannotomoya: "South Korea doesn't understand the meaning of the treaty."

Evidently it's YOU who does not understand, since this was not at all a treaty but simply a deal made between the leaders of the two nations. SK should definitely pay the money back, but should never let the issue be forgotten since Japan still denies it. If Japan wants to put it back into the textbooks and ban any speech that says the women were just prostitutes and it's all propaganda, then fine. Until then, with even posters on here denying it, they should never let it go and should show the world. Hopefully this gets more media attention and the issue is once again brought to the forefront. Japan is hoping it just goes quietly into the night, like it's kidnap and rape victims, who don't have much longer to live.

-11 ( +1 / -12 )

Well, in the light of modern day women getting revenge upon men's actions in the past, this seems in line with that trend... were the individual "Comfort Women" compensated by any treaty ? If not, then I guess they're due something, and as there's not a lot left, it shouldn't be a big deal for Japan, right ?

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Japanese war time crimes against humanity are despicable beyond the comprehension of moral and normal human beings.

The seasoned investigators of Japanese War crimes were in tears after interviewing the many Korean sexual assault kidnap survivors of Japanese internment gulags.

These same investigators had investigated the Nazi war crimes.

Japan should pay hundreds of billions of dollars to Korea and Korean families for the incomprehensible and gargantuan vile horrors it committed against Korea and many Asian peoples.

-10 ( +2 / -12 )

Before anything can be resolved, the Abe regime ought to be aware who they are trying to intimidate with its bullying and totalitarian language. South Korea is not a poor third world country cringing before a world class superpower. South Korea is a economic powerhouse and, therefore, a major political power. For the first time it has freedom to tell the Japanese government where to get off. Thus, when the South Korea tells Japan there are flaws in the 2015 treaty concerning Japanese sex slavery Japan had better listen. Let Japan negotiate this rather than making empty threats. There are no risks to South Korean - Japanese ties no matter what the Abe regime says. Anyone with half a brain knows that.

-11 ( +1 / -12 )

Schopenheur - Thanks for the education - But no thanks.

You said only one piece of documented evidence exists. Puhleez. How many more times do we need to hear this fable.

Reasearch a little more widely in English and Japanese and Korean and Chinese and .........!

And you said the IJA's methods of "bullying" (reads as brutality) have no bearing on this discussion - what no bearing on a system of bullying & brutalizing women? lol.

And you said that the Japanese soldiers wouldn't have harmed Korean women because they were the  emperor's subjects. Now that takes the cake. The IJA murdered 10,000s of their own soldiers and citizens (especially by coercion to suicide), but they wouldn't harm a hair of the comfort women because they were under the Emperor's protection. Wow!

Sorry - you've lost me now. As I have said on numerous occasions - and if you read my post's carefully - I've no axe to grind either way. But if you have a logical debate - one that you'd expect to stand up on it's own merit - then you need to research more widely and take a step back and look at all points. Focussing on the extreme narratives and hysterics of some on the Korean side, doesn't tar all opinions and evidence with the same brush.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Schopenheur - Apologies - my post was addressing Ossan.

I was just reading your posts on another thread.

Happy New Year.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

OssanAmerica: "As to why a comfort woman would not be pressured, Comfort Women were under the employ of the military brothel system making them subjects of the Emperor, and if you're a Japanese soldier, you don't harm such persons. Note that some made good money, some even married Japanese soldiers. Note also that the Comfort Stations serviced Korean men too who were "Japanese soldiers"."

Told you. Not only could you not address my question directly and point out that I was incorrect and people have admitted Japan engaged in wrong doing, you prove what I said and say Japan is the victim again, and the women were well-paid prostitutes, and no evidence exists to the contrary. Well done. And you claim SK is in the wrong here and should "forget it and move on", when you are the one denying the facts.

browny1: "And you said that the Japanese soldiers wouldn't have harmed Korean women because they were the emperor's subjects. Now that takes the cake. The IJA murdered 10,000s of their own soldiers and citizens (especially by coercion to suicide), but they wouldn't harm a hair of the comfort women because they were under the Emperor's protection. Wow!"

Exactly! But remember, these people also deny that the Japanese forced suicides by shoving grenades in the hands of Okinawans hiding in caves, and pulled the pin, or forced them off the cliffs at Itoman.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

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