Abe arrives in Moscow for first top-level Russia visit in a decade

Soviets stole those islands and committed ethic cleansing a war crime LOLWUT. Who's talking about ethnic cleansing after Korean "comfort women" which was killed after "using" and Nanking massacre? Who's talking about ethnic cleansing to those who lost more than 20 million people in WWII? Sometimes it's sad that such shit born among Japanese people, great pity. Japan is not threat to Russia I believe so, but right thing to say is "Russia is not threat to Japan", because we still have over 1000 ready to be deployed warheads. We really don't want to use them.

You go to war and lose...you don't get to decide who keeps what territory. Even if it's a violaltion of the intent of the Allies agreement, you don't see U.S. or anybody else challenging the Russians in the last 60 years. So what does it matter?

Arthur DumbolovApr. 29, 2013 - 10:29PM JST We didn't stole any land from Japan, for purpose or accidentally. It was settled during Yalta treaty that we have "kuril >islands". It was not specified, did it was 4islands included in this definition or not.

The reason that the US, UK and EU consider that the USSR "stole" the 4 islands is because the agreements made between the allied powers was to take away territories that the Empire of Japan had taken through war, force or greed. This is why Japan lost Taiwan, the Pescadores, etc which it had won from China in the Sino-Japanese war of 1894/85, and Korea which it had annexed in 1910. In the case of the USSR, the Northern Kuriles were taken by Japan after Russia's defeat in the Russo-Japanese War of 1904/05. BUT- the four islands which form the Southern Kuriles were always Japanese and they were never taken from Russia on the first place. This is in complete violation of the intent of the Allies agreements, and exemplifies the global land-grabbing agenda of the USSR in process even before WWII was actually over. Another reason that many people and nations feel that Russia "stole" the southern Kuriles is that they were taken AFTER Japan announced their surrender, just before the actual Surrender Ceremony onboard the USS Missouri in Tokyo Bay. Russians have attempted to justify their action on the grounds that the official ceremony had not yet taken place, but is given little respect by the world because that is the equivalent of shooting a criminal who has surrendered and dropped his weapon, on the grounds that he has not yet been taken to the police station yet and officially "arrested". The USSR forcefully evicted the Japanese residents of these islands in e years following the end of WWII. Anyone who looks at a map can see that these islands are not in some "disputable" location but are actually visible from Japan. So you really do not have any valid defense when others say that Russia "stole" these islands.

Actually, there might be a repeat of Russian proposal to make the four islands and surrounding area a joint economic development zone that has been around ever since Gorbachev’s time. There is one thing that the Japanese side must never forget when the Russians propose such a joint economic development, namely that sovereignty over the four islands would clearly remain with Russia. That is the major underlying premise for them. Based on this, Russia will propose that the two countries jointly conduct economic activities in the Northern Territories and the adjoining areas. They appeal to Japan to shelve the sovereignty issue and at least cooperate economically. That would create an atmosphere conducive to resolving territorial issues. But shelving the sovereignty issue” means, at the very least, that Japan acknowledges that the status quo will remain unchanged for the time being. The return of the two smaller islands as a first step argument is equivalent to the return of only those two islands, nothing more and nothing less. The logic in both cases is roughly the same. The Japanese government may claim that the four Northern islands are inherently Japanese territory, but unfortunately must recognize the sad fact that Russia retains effective control over them.

A shrewd move from Abe and one I was calling for on this board two months ago. Of course the usual Abe-sceptics scoffed and said Abe would never take any action.

@Nippon Nation

Mr. Putin is a clever guy. I think he's interested in developing the islands, and this may be why he's in negotiations with Mr. Abe. It's a way to redirect revenue so that Russia doesn't have to pay to make the place more profitable. If Mr. Putin makes concessions by allowing Japanese venture capitalist to come in and develop the place then this could become a huge draw for both countries. So it's not about the energy per se. Mr. Putin keeps his enemies close for a good reason.

I agree completely. And with the communists in China actively pursuing closer economic/energy cooperation with Russia, Mr Abe should be highly motivated to compromise and see a deal with the Russians concluded once and for all . Not only is a deal important to establish an official peace treaty and to resolve the island issue in a mutually beneficial way like NN suggests above, but it would also be a massive blow to the communist's agenda and further evidence that the Japanese government is perfectly capable of negotiating in good faith with those of her neighbors capable of doing so.

I believe both Putin and Abe are pragmatists and can see how important this issue is for the stability and economic development of the region. Putin has the advantage here for sure, it will be interesting to see what he does. Should he offer to split the territory and pursue regional economic development together, I really think that's a deal Abe has to take.

One of the best moves Japan could make right now is to establish eminently friendly relations with Russia.

Arthur Dumbolov, the Soviets stole those islands and committed ethic cleansing a war crime. I am waiting to see what President Putin will put on the table. Japan is not a threat to Russia. I am in favor of a true meaningful lasting peace between our two nations.

BTW, I researched a bit. One time people of Japan agreed to have 2 islands, but then, AS ALWAYS, USA intervened and said "We'll get Okinawa if you'll take only 2 islands, not all 4", that's why treaty still not signed after 67 years.

The recent Sankei article quoted Abe's inner circle in that he doesn't care if "there is no dialague between high officials for 5-10 years" referring to Korea and China. This is a welcoming change in foreign diplomacy for Japan.

We didn't stole any land from Japan, for purpose or accidentally. It was settled during Yalta treaty that we have "kuril islands". It was not specified, did it was 4islands included in this definition or not.

This is a interesting turn of events. While we tend to think of Russia and China as being in the same camp, especially when they want to veto the US, UK and France in the PUNSC, the fact is that both Russia and China are true masters at watching out for themselves. No collective defense treaty exists between them, and they even fought border skirmishes in the late1960s. Recently Russia cancelled the sale of 50 SU-35s to China, amid "security" concerns, although Chinese theft and copying of technology is probably the bigger issue. Chinese sincerity also took a nose dive when they assured the Ukrainians that the used Aircraft Carrier was being purchased for conversion into a floating casino. The minute the carrier was delivered it was fitted for deployment with the Chinese PLA Navy. Russia is keen on developing it's Fareast and Siberian territories, and Japan is a far safer country to partner with in this regard than China, whose territorial expansion plan limits are as of yet completely known. The vast border with China poses it's own security concern for Russia. There is no doubt that Japan is aware of this and will seek the resolution of the Southern Kurile issue with a view to concluding a formal Peace Treaty. The Russians undoubtedly are prepared to negotiate two of the islands as they were before, when the United States stopped Japan from settling with the USSR by threatening to drop the return of Okinawa. It may be wise for Japan to accept them. As for whether Russia would entertain the other remaining two islands at a later time depends entirely on how the Russo-Japanese relationship develops afterwards, with China's behavior and actions playing a major role in both countries policies.

"finding a solution to the territorial dispute"

How about the Russians giving back what they stole in 1945? That would settle it.

I'm not entirely sure how 'strong' it makes a leader look to have someone carry a parasol over you after landing is, but I wish the best for these negotiations. I have no doubt that if not now Russia at SOME point will offer two of the islands back, and I think Japan should take it and not expect the others later. If they do not, the four islands remain the property of Russia, so what is there to lose?

Just try to get half of the lands and it still be a good deal.

Mr. Putin is a clever guy. I think he's interested in developing the islands, and this may be why he's in negotiations with Mr. Abe. It's a way to redirect revenue so that Russia doesn't have to pay to make the place more profitable. If Mr. Putin makes concessions by allowing Japanese venture capitalist to come in and develop the place then this could become a huge draw for both countries. So it's not about the energy per se. Mr. Putin keeps his enemies close for a good reason.

OssanAmerica, absolutely correct!

umbrellaApr. 29, 2013 - 09:07AM JST Waste of time. The Kuriles are Russian forever. But we have to go through this farce of course.

Well yes, the Kuriles are as their return to the USSR was agreed in the Cairo and Potsdam declarations. But not the Southern Kuriles which is why the US objected to them being taken after Japan surrendered. For that reason the US, UK and the EU consider them Japanese Territory under Russian Administration. Japan has every right to continue to dispute Russian occupation.

Honest Abe, you may have to take a compromise. Two in the hand is better than 4 in the bush. Also it will liberate Yuri To, do try and make a deal that lets the former residents return to the other 2 islands.

Waste of time. The Kuriles are Russian forever. But we have to go through this farce of course.

Abe please remind the ruskies they stole Japanese territory and check what your signing.

“I would like to build a trusted personal relationship with President Putin,” Abe told reporters in Tokyo ahead of his departure for the three-day trip.

"trusted personal relationship" can not be built in few months, don't know how many PMs japan will have till Putin is in power.

"Medvedev’s first visit to the island, which juts out past the northeastern tip of Japan’s Hokkaido island, in November 2010—when he still held the post of president—was condemned by Tokyo as an “unforgivable outrage"

Japan should be as calm as robots with any island disputes with her neighbors. This only make sense as she expect others to be calm.

Anyway remind Abe not to sell out Japan for two small Kuriles just to rebalance the power play against China in that region. It must hurt Japan bad to be under the thumb of Russia. I actually believe all the Kuriles belong to Japan but we see Japan is too weak to force Russia to give them back!

Gambare Abe-San !