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Abe calls for summit with China

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I don't think China will agree to the offer and will meet Abe. However, recent troubles with China and Korea are all ignited by politicians and businesses on both sides are vey much bothered and suffered losses by it. Global businesses are removing borders while the minds of politicians are old fashioned.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Japan's true intention is to become a strong country and eventually kick the US out. It may take 20 years, 50 years or longer. But this is the ultimate ambition of any nationalist politician. But this is only possible if China does not pose a threat to Japan, not just presently but in the long term. The Philippines kicked the US 20 years ago, but now they got them back because of dispute over islands with China. So it didn't work out too well.

This "true intention" is immediately understandable by China. But it's one that the Americans will not appreciate. Japan will be asking the Chinese to produce a credible proof of why China is not and CANNOT be a threat to Japan. Promises won't worth anything. The two countries must engage in such a way so that their long term national strategic interest will ensure peace between them. To put it cynically, it can be said that the US and USSR accomplished this goal by permitting each other the "mutually assured destruction" by nuclear weapons. Japan and China does not need to do that, but you see it is possible to ensure peace, even in the worst case.

The real problem however is this: will the Chinese trust Abe will tell them his true intentions? Until they are convinced this, they would not be interested in talking. Because doing so would only make Abe look good to the Japanese poeple. That's something the Chinese are trying to avoid.

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

Abe poops around massively at his neighbors' yards, and he begs them to invite him, wagging his head.

-4 ( +10 / -14 )

Japan should eventually recognize that the Senkakus are disputed territory, that would be more consistent with their stance towards the disputed territories in Russia and South Korea, but not while tensions are running as high as they are. Ideally the threat of military action and other forms of coercion shouldn't be a factor in these talks.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Japan and China are inseparable?

Didnt they were seperated since the 1895 Shimonoseki treaty! They were no more friends no more neighbours anymore! Oh sorry Japan does not need any asian countries anyway! I do believe the echoes of world war1 does exist today between the peoples republic of China and Japan. Because that was a debt has to pay A fact that shall no more to be 'ignored'!

-7 ( +3 / -10 )

A first step towards the future is dealing with the issues of the past, including Japan's invasion and occupation of much of China in the 1930s and '40s. On the other hand the Japanese have been reacting to years of kowtowing to the Chinese.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

stalingrad2014Jan. 25, 2014 - 08:11AM JST Japan and China are inseparable? Didnt they were seperated since the 1895 Shimonoseki treaty! They were no more friends no more neighbours >anymore!

The Treaty of Shimonoseki was signed by the Qing Dynasty, The same one that was defeated in the Opium War with Britain and was over run with foreign troops in 1900, and the Empire of Japan which has not existed since 1945. The Treaty below was signed by Post WWII Japan and the Peoples Republic of China, the current "China". You should read it and you will see that your comment is really absurd.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Communiqu%C3%A9_of_the_Government_of_Japan_and_the_Government_of_the_People's_Republic_of_China

1 ( +9 / -8 )

Is this guy bi-polar? You have him DIRECTLY lashing out on the world stage at China one day, then asking China for talks the next. One day visiting Yasukuni with the complete knowledge (and partly out of spite, since he said he would do it if China didn't come to the table) it would exacerbate ties, then suggesting they forget history and engage in talks of the future. You have him one day saying there was no Nanjing or sex slaves (later having to change his stance and just say they were hookers), then the next suggesting China grow up and engage in dialogue. You have him one day seeking to renounce an apology made in the '90s and say Japan did not engage in the aggression some people think, then wondering why China is angry and suggest 'talks'. You have Abe suggest they engage in talks, but there is no 'discussion' regarding the island issue (non-issue in his mind). You have him say to the world they must all act on China now or face the consequences, then asking China to understand and engage in talks.

Aside from the right-wing nutters here, I wonder if the actually thinks people buys into what he says.

3 ( +18 / -15 )

So why have we come to a situation where Japan needs to implore their two closest neighbours for dialogue? It was not that long ago Japanese PMs were regularly meeting with their Chinese and Korean counterparts, so what has changed?

It should be obvious to all but the most ardent supporters of Abe that while he loves to go on record and call for dialogue and discussion, he has been largely disingenuous in his actions, and has done nothing to foster peace that he alleges to strive for.

His recent statement comparing Japan-China to pre-WWI England-Germany was a worrying provocation. Nobody will win a war between China and Japan. It's a question of which side will lose less but neither will benefit from it.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

I disagree the Japan X China dispute is causing headache to the US. To me the americans are very happy with the latest disagreements between the asian powers.

The US have interests in both countries. Also, the US knows that if Asian powers become united there will be a shift of power from the West to the Orient.

So I would say the situation is very convenient to the US.

My opinion: Japan and China should shake hands and stay together. The Middle East is a very good example to what can happen to a region that have countries that dont understand each other.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Again Abe calls to for talks, and yet again the Chinese will ignore him, If you really had issues with your neighbour you would sit down and talk , atleast try to resolve the differences, But the Chinese just want to continue to be belligerent.

Abe isn't perfect but atleast he makes the offer.

1 ( +7 / -6 )

Suga insisted that the remarks had been wrongly interpreted. “We will explain to those media so that what he truly meant to say will be conveyed,”

Maybe Japanese politicians should try having their speeches vetted first, so they don't have to keep 'explaining' them after each speech. No one ever cares about the explanation, they just care about what was originally said.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

In 2012:

US GPD = $16 Trillion European Union GPD = $16 Trillion Japan, China and South Korea GPD = $15 Trillion

To me it is very clear why the US wants China and Japan to keep fighting. The three asian countries united represents a world power balance.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Mitch CohenJan. 25, 2014 - 09:18AM JST So why have we come to a situation where Japan needs to implore their two closest neighbours for dialogue? It was >not that long ago Japanese PMs were regularly meeting with their Chinese and Korean counterparts, so what has >changed?

China and South Korea are behaving like children. They are the ones refusing meetings. Although, to be fair, there is some light at the end of the tunnel for South Korea.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

"Chilling and inflammatory"

Dude, that's an oxymoron.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

This man, having made a fool of himself again, but this time at Davos is getting really desperate. The way to handle him is to let the force of economics reveal him as a fraud and his economic policies nothing but shams to hoodwink the people of Japan while he goes on his crazy phantasy of re-militarising Japan.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Yes, just a few days after telling the world leaders they must stand up to China at Davos, comparing Japan China ties to pre war Germany England situation, visiting Yasukuni, signing off on military spending increase and declaring there is nothing to talk about with Senkaku islands , Abe calls on China to come to a summit. With his uncompromising stance he knows perfectly well China will refuse any summit talks so this call for a summit is nothing but empty posturing for an international audience. That's all.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

China and South Korea are behaving like children. They are the ones refusing meetings. Although, to be fair, there is some light at the end of the tunnel for South Korea.

@Ossan - And Japan has been acting maturely? Just days ago, Japan complained about China erecting a memorial to Ahn Jeung Gun in China, weeks after they dismissed China's protest about Yasukuni saying it was a domestic issue and other countries should not interfere in domestic affairs. Japan clearly showed through their recent protest that it wants China and SK to see things from a Japanese perspective. Not very mature in my mind.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

"To me it is very clear why the US wants China and Japan to keep fighting."

Believe it or not, the U.S. does not want Japan, China and Korea to become embroiled in another war. It's bad for business.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

It is slightly ridiculous that Abe is criticized for making the comparison with pre-WW1.

The Economist had a leading article recently stating the same, and many historians and observers have been talking about this before. (In the comparison, obviously pre-WW1 is Germany).

4 ( +5 / -1 )

@FernandoUchiyama ... My opinion: Japan and China should shake hands and stay together. The Middle East is a very good example to what can happen to a region that have countries that dont understand each other.

Your wish for an Asia united in cooperation and free from Western interference has a long history, from Okakura Tenshin (author of "The Book of Tea", 1906, http://www.sacred-texts.com/bud/tea.htm) up to and including Kishore Mahbubani (author of "New Asian Hemisphere: The Irresistible Shift of Global Power to the East", 2008) this vision has inspired many to action.

I don't think you need to look as far the Middle East for a good example to what can happen to a region that have countries that dont understand each other.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Ishiwara,

Its fine for economists & us arm chair types to make these comparisons BUT when a leader of a country does knowing full well the situation with its neighbours.......... THAT is gross & utter STUPIDITY!!

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Mitch CohenJan. 25, 2014 - 10:55AM JST "China and South Korea are behaving like children. They are the ones refusing meetings. Although, to be fair, there is some light at the end of the tunnel for South Korea."

@Ossan - And Japan has been acting maturely? Just days ago, Japan complained about China erecting a memorial >to Ahn Jeung Gun in China, weeks after they dismissed China's protest about Yasukuni saying it was a domestic >issue and other countries should not interfere in domestic affairs. Japan clearly showed through their recent protest >that it wants China and SK to see things from a Japanese perspective. Not very mature in my mind.

Yes Japan is not doing anything that could trigger a conflict even by accident, In fact Japan is doing what it can to improve communications which China is denying on both a diplomatic and military level. In contrast for those who are unaware South Korea denies diplomatically but their military communicates with Japan's. Complaints about history which do not affect anything today do not have any bearing on peace and stability in the region. China and South Korea can whine, and Japanese PMs can go visit some dead peoples names in a shrine forever and that isn't going to cause an accidental conflict.

-1 ( +7 / -7 )

I don't see any reason for Chinese leader to meet with this Japanese PM. Let him crying and whining, and ignore him. He is a lap dog of Washington anyway.

China, doing what you are doing - build the economy, strengthen ties with other countries, solve the pollution problems.

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

So what does Abe want to talk about? Can anyone explain this? He says Yasukuni is internal issue, but statue in China of Ahn Jung Geun isn't. He says Japan's territorial claims are off the discussion table because there is no dispute. He says the world needs to stand up to China, and talk of war with China. Yet he wants a peace meeting with China. He says this is all just a "misunderstanding". Oh christ sakes, what is the 'misunderstanding" here? His big mouth?

-9 ( +5 / -14 )

Complaints about history which do not affect anything today do not have any bearing on peace and stability in the region.

The very fact that it is an issue at the level at which it has escalated to, means that it most definitely does have a bearing on peace and stability in the region. You can dislike that the Chinese and Koreans feel the way they do, but the fact is that they do, whether you like it or not. If it turns into a war, then your protests that 'it has no bearing' aren't going to stop that war, as they'll to be lost in the sound of gunfire.

Japan doesn't have to feel that these complaints about wars past should matter either. But that's not going to stop a war either.

The only real question that has any bearing is whether or not the Chinese would do the same things they are doing even without provocation by Japan. And they might, but we'll never know, because Japan keeps provoking them. It would be nice if Japan would take the higher ground on the matter, because we sure as hell know that the Chinese aren't going to.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Japanese PMs can go visit some dead peoples names in a shrine forever and that isn't going to cause an accidental conflict.

@ Ossan - but if you say it's okay for Japanese PMs to go visit some dead peoples names, surely it's also okay for Chinese and Koreans to commemorate the executed Ahn Jeung Gun? Why the double standard?

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Have the summit in Hiroshima..

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Regional tensions are proving a headache for the United States, which is wary of being drawn into any conflict that might erupt between treaty ally Japan and China, one of its biggest trading partners.

No, this is definately a wrong expression! The one who instigated the tension in east Asia is the United States, the policy of 'Returning Asia' is a plot intended to wage hostilities at PRC! America's defeats in Iraq and Afghanistan needs a scapegoat to blame or justification! Obama was pissed off when his first trip to China in 2009 when he was demanding money from Chinese leader! He is coming back with a gun just like a bank robbery ! No wonder China has stepped up efforts to test advance stragetic weapons capable to reach the western hemisphere. When you dont know who is 'kicking your door at midnight', will you ignore those bangings or goto grab a gun to protect your families?

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Abe just making himself a fool for his dosmetic audiences and just riducule himself in front of international community knowing that both Korean and China will not meet him.....with his uncompromising attitude, and pouring oil into fire. he gets what he sow period. don't waste time, Mr Abe, I know you're desperate and being left alone, and that your neighbours are cosying up relationship.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

@ Ossan - but if you say it's okay for Japanese PMs to go visit some dead peoples names, surely it's also okay for Chinese and Koreans to commemorate the executed Ahn Jeung Gun? Why the double standard?

Double standard? If you're going to make comparisons, at least come up with something that's equal in action and reaction for as the headline states, "Abe calls for summit with China"

Can't imagine both Korea and China doing the same right after Abe's visit to Yasukuni.

The times have changed folks. Up until the last decade, Japan would simply oblige to both China and Korea's whining thanks to the sympathizers within the Foreign Ministry and the Cabinet. With the advent of the internet, those old bureaucrats have long retired and the new blood within the ministry simply aren't going for the "guilty" card. Why should they? It's the 21st century where treaties have been signed to settle all matters generations ago.

-3 ( +10 / -11 )

I am certain everyone notices, China is always setting some sort of conditions before any talks takes place. Just ask Taiwan! Anyone China thinks it can control or wants to control with out success, always sets conditions because it can not have its way, like a spoiled brat!

7 ( +8 / -1 )

Abe takes two cards, raises by $1000.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

All this China-containment and provocation is spearheaded by the Washington that is still stuck in the cold-war, anti-Communism era. The Washington is just using all the recent right-wing noise that is being generated by the right-wing buffoons like Abe for their own China-containment agenda.

Abe wants to suck up to the US and be subservient to them. The Internet right-wingers that Abe is using for his support are completely and utterly clueless. They have no idea what they're doing.

It certainly is not in neither US's or Japan's or anyone else's interest to worsen the relations with China and South Korea. Who is benefiting from all of this? Nobody. Everybody loses and everybody suffers thanks to mostly right-wing idiocy that is being lead by the Washington.

Japan has more or less always been trying to improve relations with China since the end of WW2. DPJ which has initially tried to vastly improve the relations with China but of course that plan was shot down by the Washington.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

PM Abe is very good ; despite all of complaints for nothing from China , he still wants to talk. Leader of a civilised ,democratic country is different, indeed.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Abe calls for summit with China

The only true diplomat and master strategist in this chess match has moved his rook into position and is threatening his opponents Queen, what do they do? Cry and whine. Chess masters they are not!

Reality is mired when you deal with servants of propaganda, but if you counter them with logic and facts they will disappear.

But they regrow somewhere else like mushrooms. So, one's battles never end till they can't grow again.

stalingrad2014Jan. 25, 2014 - 01:28PM JST Regional tensions are proving a headache for the United States, which is wary of being drawn into any conflict that might erupt between treaty ally Japan and China, one of its biggest trading partners.

I can tell you never served in the US military in any capacity, if you had you would have realized that the full potential of it's capacities have yet to be seem.

If you think that the reservations that the War Chiefs are showing is a sign of weakness then you need ask Saddam Hussein what he thinks. Oh wait, you can't....

Saddam Hussein took the US's silence as a sign of weakness and complacency, but what he got for his lack of understanding and stratagem was a noose.

The war chiefs have been dying for a chance at Communist China. But, they have to wait for a Casus belli and if Communist China and it's tributaries keep pushing the Chiefs will have it.

Yes, Communist China shall make a mistake and when it does their debt after will dwarf anything you could have ever imagined.

In other words, the War Chiefs have been champing at the bit for a chance at deflating Communist China for a long long while. And if Communist China and it's tributary states keep jumping, the War Chiefs will have their dreams fulfilled.

Last time I asked you a question, but for some reason you never replied. So, I shall ask it again, whatever happened to Communist Russia/the Soviet Union?

Eiji TakanoJan. 25, 2014 - 03:51PM JST All this China-containment and provocation is spearheaded by the Washington that is still stuck in the cold-war, anti-Communism era. The Washington is just using all the recent right-wing noise that is being generated by the right-wing buffoons like Abe for their own China-containment agenda.

Eiji, reality keeps calling, but sadly you keep missing the calls.

This row with Communist China and their tributary states is a product of Communist China and their tributary state's creation.

The Islands weren't an issue until vast amounts of natural resources were discovered around 1971. After they were uncovered Communist China draped a flag over the islands and cried out loud.

So, the issue isn't with Japan, the issue is Communist China's need for more resources, aka greed.

evian1Jan. 25, 2014 - 01:31PM JST Abe just making himself a fool for his dosmetic audiences and just riducule himself in front of international community knowing that both Korean and China will not meet him

He isn't making a fool of himself, he is exposing is the silliness of Communist China and it's tributary states of Korea. The more they whine the wiser he seems.

Right now Prime Minister Abe seems like a prophet, if they keep whining and making childish claims Prime Minister Abe might achieve godly status.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

@fernando uchiyama In 2012:

US GPD = $16 Trillion European Union GPD = $16 Trillion Japan, China and South Korea GPD = $15 Trillion

To me it is very clear why the US wants China and Japan to keep fighting. The three asian countries united represents a world power balance.

Your analogy is as if to say you want your mom and dad to keep fighting so that you can continue to get your way. Sounds childish to me

0 ( +0 / -0 )

StrangerlandJan. 25, 2014 - 12:48PM JST "Complaints about history which do not affect anything today do not have any bearing on peace and stability in the region."

The very fact that it is an issue at the level at which it has escalated to, means that it most definitely does have a >bearing on peace and stability in the region.

OK, let's say China starts a war with Japan resulting in many people dying because their PMs keep "visiting a shrine". How many countries on this planet are going to agree that China's actions were justified? Then consider how many countries on this planet care at all whether any J-PMs visit a shrine or not. And many of those countries are former victims of Japan's WWII aggression and/or were enemies who fought the Japanese Empire. the Yasukuni visits do not "destabilize peace in the region", certain countries are using it as an excuse to destabilize peace in the region. No one is getting hurt or injured or property damaged by the visits.

Mitch CohenJan. 25, 2014 - 12:55PM JST "Japanese PMs can go visit some dead peoples names in a shrine forever and that isn't going to cause an accidental conflict." @ Ossan - but if you say it's okay for Japanese PMs to go visit some dead peoples names, surely it's also okay for >Chinese and Koreans to commemorate the executed Ahn Jeung Gun? Why the double standard?

There is no double standard. Abe visits Yasukuni and China and South Korea refuse to talk to him. South Korea and China put up a monument to an assassin and Abe asks China for a summit meeting. Where is the double standard?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

JoeBigs

Eiji, reality keeps calling, but sadly you keep missing the calls. This row with Communist China and their tributary states is a product of Communist China and their tributary state's creation.

Sorry, but what the hell are you talking about? I can't understand your English at all.

The Islands weren't an issue until vast amounts of natural resources were discovered around 1971. After they were uncovered Communist China draped a flag over the islands and cried out loud. So, the issue isn't with Japan, the issue is Communist China's need for more resources, aka greed.

You're just repeating whatever the Internet right-wingers at 2chan are saying? Be more original, please... Either way what you're saying has no basis in fact.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

In the 1970s, Jimmy Carter sent a union boss to secretly negotiate with China, and that led quickly to important deals and understandings with China on the status of Taiwan, Vietnam and Deng's drastic reforms.

Abe could do the same. China cannot talk with Abe's government directly. Perhaps Abe can send an unofficial personal envoy, even an ethic Chinese if possible, to tell China what he wants to say to them. The "explanations" he had in mind.

There are definitely ways. Unless of course Abe is in fact not interested in talking, but just doing the calling for PR purpose.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

There's been far too much rhetorical posturing in the media by both sides. And some of it's the media's fault. It's time the leaders of both nations sat down alone, came to grips with differences and stopped griping at each other through the press.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

DPJ was very much interested in talking and vastly improving the ties with China. But of course they were shot down by the Washington because they can't have Japan getting close with their hypothetical Communist enemy that is China.

So ever since the DPJ was gone, now that vacuum is being filled by the right-wing buffoons like Ishihara, Abe and their crazy right-wing loony supporters with anti-China rhetoric. The right-wingers are trying to label China as "evil and aggressive", just like how the US labeled the "terrorists" as "evil and freedom-hating" (therefore it justifies going to war). Of course China is doing more or less same to Japan.

But the fact is that both China and Japan used to have semi-secret deals with each other to improve their relations and get on with their political lives.

The Senkaku island dispute was POSTPONED by both the Chinese and Japanese governments in the 70's. They've decided that the later generations would be wise enough to settle the dispute later. They've made a semi-secret deal: that they both never mention about the islands and not talk about them ever again. There have always been some idiot nationalists who would claim that the Senkaku islands were "theirs", but they would always be quickly silenced by their governments.

Japan had an undisputed claim to the Senkaku islands. China was fine with that, as long as Japan had kept that fact quiet as to not upset their citizens and make their government seem weak. But then things started to get worse when the post-DPJ government started to make a lot of noise. They arrested the Chinese sailors instead of quietly returning them to China like usual. Then things got REALLY worse when Ishihara the idiot announced that he would nationalize the islands. China was furious. I'm sure, that China was saying, "Japan, what the hell are you doing? I thought we had a deal!"

So understandably, China doesn't think that it can trust Japan. Japan says one thing and does another. China is skeptical that Japan is only being a puppet of the US. And you know, they're right. All this anti-China crap is basically manufactured in Washington. I'm not saying, that it's all the US's fault, but they do play part in it and they WERE the ones that completely destroyed DJP which initially attempted to normalize relations with China.

So all this nationalist, right-wing anti-China rhetoric is just nonsense, pure noise created by the fact that a huge gaping void has been left when the DJP was destroyed by Washington. And that void is being filled by senseless nationalism and right-wing rhetoric.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

@joebigs "Right now Prime Minister Abe seems like a prophet, if they keep whining and making childish claims Prime Minister Abe might achieve godly status." yeah Abe the prophet of doom, take along the banzai tenno......it'll be disaster!! I see there're no shortage of uyouku people like you and onsanamerica still live in the past glory of Imperial Japan.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 06:16AM JST So all this nationalist, right-wing anti-China rhetoric is just nonsense, pure noise created by the fact that a huge gaping void has been left when the DJP was destroyed by Washington.

So it's the US that has invaded territories of many nations in the South China sea?! Wow, so all those ships with Communist China's flags on them are actually the US Naval ships!

Your logic and reasoning functions are not of this world.

Propaganda 101, say it enough times and some folks will start believing you. Sadly for you there are those of us who will call you out on that propaganda every time.

evian1Jan. 26, 2014 - 06:41AM JST I see there're no shortage of uyouku people like you and onsanamerica still live in the past glory of Imperial Japan.

Your post holds little to no weight. You are posting "what ifs" and "what might bes" rather than facts.

Last time I checked Japan's economy is picking up and each and every time PM Abe has spoken he has been spot on.

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 06:16AM JST DPJ was very much interested in talking and vastly improving the ties with China. But of course they were shot down by the Washington because they can't have Japan getting close with their hypothetical Communist enemy that is China.

The only reason that the DPJ's plans to kiss Communist China's hind were ruined was because the Japanese people removed them from power. The Japanese people were sick and tired of the Communist loving DPJ.

Once more your illogical Communist opinion has gotten the better part of you. I await further insults since you can't make a valid point.

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 02:41AM JST Sorry, but what the hell are you talking about? I can't understand your English at all.

By the sheer fact that you reverted to silly attempts at insults clearly shows that I am right. You can't defend your position and can't counter my argument, so insults are your only option.

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 02:41AM JST You're just repeating whatever the Internet right-wingers at 2chan are saying? Be more original, please... Either way what you're saying has no basis in fact.

2chan? No, my dear Communist antagonist these opinions of mine are based on facts and history. My facts can be found in many, yes many books and not just the internet. I love it when you Communist revert to silly illogical nonsense.

Again you can't argue with facts so you shall revert to silly childish insults.

Try to answer some questions, was Communist China a nation at the end of WWII? BTW, WWII ended in 1945.

Then this one, during the San Francisco treaty meetings how many times did Communist China utter a complaint about the islands?

If you had a leg to stand on you would, but you haven't and revert to silly childish gibberish.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

The only reason that the DPJ's plans to kiss Communist China's hind were ruined was because the Japanese people removed them from power. The Japanese people were sick and tired of the Communist loving DPJ.

That's not at all why the people voted out the DPJ. You're projecting. The DPJ wasn't really all that different from the LDP, and I believe more than half of their members were former LDP.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

JoeBigs

So it's the US that has invaded territories of many nations in the South China sea?! Wow, so all those ships with Communist China's flags on them are actually the US Naval ships!

Again, I have no idea what the hell you're talking about. It is true that the US, or the military-industrial complex compels the US to conflict with China as the hypothetical enemy, just as the military-industrial complex compelled the US to start "war on terror", which is an impossibility since you can not sit down and talk with the terrorists and force a peace treaty on them.

You see "JoeBigs", your entire premise starts with "China is evil and aggressive", when clearly it's not that simple and black and white. I'm afraid that your worldview is childishly black and white not unlike George Bush's "good guys (US) against bad guys (terrorists)" world view.

The best policy is diplomacy, NOT using force and aggression. We've learned that lesson in WW 1 & 2. Let's NOT repeat the same mistake again by simplistically paining China as "evil and aggressive".

If the best you can do is to call me a "Communist"... then I'm afraid that there's not much point in arguing with you. Never mind the fact that China is hardly a "communist" country anymore... thanks you proving to me that you are indeed stuck in the cold-war era, just like Washington and the Japanese right-wingers are.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 07:45PM JST Again, I have no idea what the hell you're talking about

Well let me enlighten you, look up Communist China's aggressions against it's neighbors.

Let me even help further Google;

Malaysia Philippines Vietnam

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 07:45PM JST The best policy is diplomacy, NOT using force and aggression. We've learned that lesson in WW 1 & 2. Let's NOT repeat the same mistake again by simplistically paining China as "evil and aggressive".

Great argument, but tell me did diplomacy work for Neville Chamberlain when he dealt with Nazis Germany? It didn't Nazis Germany continued to take territories it deemed as it's.

Now, we are dealing with Communist china, japan has been trying to talk about their problems but the Communist won't come to the table unless they get what they want.

Tell me, how is diplomacy working for the Philippines when it comes to Communist China's invasion of it's territories?

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 07:45PM JST your entire premise starts with "China is evil and aggressive

Not an opinion, it's a fact.

2000, Communist China's Military Budget $20 Billion 2012, Communist china's Military Budget $166 Billion.

If you don't think they are building up their military to be aggressive then you are blinded by your own ideology and not by reason.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

There's no proof that China has any expansionist or militarist ambitions like the Fascist Japan, Germany and Italy did. Besides, expansionism, fascism and militarism don't work. China is too big, there's no way that they could lead an entire group of whole billion people to go on the path of fascism and militarism.

2000, Communist China's Military Budget $20 Billion 2012, Communist china's Military Budget $166 Billion.

That's your "proof"? China only spends about ~2% of the GDP on military, which is far below the world average (4.4% for US and Russia, 2.5% UK, 2.3% France, etc). Maybe you should be going after the US which spends 6x the amount of what China spends on military ($682 billion).

To be sure, China have always wanted respect, but historically, they've never really been very aggressive.

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There's no proof that China has any expansionist or militarist ambitions like the Fascist Japan... did.

There wasn't any proof last time either. There never is until they do it. What you have to look at are the signs before they start. Signs like being aggressive to your neighbors. Signs like claiming you never did anything wrong last time you started conflict. Signs like creating secrecy laws so you can discuss war without anyone knowing. Signs like changing your constitution to allow for war, rather than only defense.

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Yeah, like spending only 2% of the GDP on military, which is far below the world's average? Why don't you go after the US or Russia which spends 4.4% of their GDP on military? In fact the US has been far more aggressive than China. The US has been ignoring international laws to start wars in the Middle East. It's obvious that the US wants to conflict with China so that their military-industrial complex can benefit. It's just too bad that everybody else will suffer as a result. It is NOT in US's or Japan's or China's or anyone else for that matter's interest to conflict with China.

Signs like changing your constitution to allow for war, rather than only defense.

Actually, pretty much any country has the right to start a war for any reason, that's how you maintain your sovereignty. The question is, is it justified? It's just that the Japanese constitution is a bit "special" due to the US occupation.

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Actually, pretty much any country has the right to start a war for any reason, that's how you maintain your sovereignty. The question is, is it justified? It's just that the Japanese constitution is a bit "special" due to the US occupation.

Yes, special in a good way all countries should be aiming to have a constitution like Japan's. Japan has been a model for 70 years. They should not be trying to shed that, they should be encouraging others to follow their lead.

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Yes, special in a good way all countries should be aiming to have a constitution like Japan's. Japan has been a model for 70 years. They should not be trying to shed that, they should be encouraging others to follow their lead.

LOL, yes, according to some of the "leftists" in Japan. And model my ass, it was forced upon by the US. It has nothing to do with what Japan had made as choice, as it had no choice in the matter. Japan did not "choose" to become a "pacifist" nation. It was forced.

So no, the so-called "pacifist" constitution is simply unrealistic, and Japan doesn't even have its own sovereignty, the US pretty much does. Japan is still a protectorate of the US.

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Maybe Japan didn't choose directly, but they chose to wage a war which they then lost. So they were in no position to complain with the constitution imposed upon them. But 70 years of that constitution has shown that it is workable, and the huge majority of Japanese people are proud of their pacifist state, and have no interest in going back to war.

The very fact that they have done it for 70 years shows that it is realistic.

And every country in the world should be aiming to be peaceful and pacifist in. Going in the opposite direction is a step backwards for humanity.

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But 70 years of that constitution has shown that it is workable, and the huge majority of Japanese people are proud of their pacifist state, and have no interest in going back to war.

How can they be proud of something that they had nothing to do with? lol...

And no, it clearly isn't working since Japan is still subservient to the US. Why do you think that democracy is pretty much non-existent in Japan?

bicultural

"Eiji," let me guess, you're another brainwashed korean American

Let me guess, you're yet another internet right-winger from 2chan...

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How can they be proud of something that they had nothing to do with? lol...

Um, because they are. They can vote out that clause, and yet, haven't. Therefore they have taken ownership of it.

And no, it clearly isn't working since Japan is still subservient to the US.

That's your opinion. But if it assent working, it wouldn't have lasted 70 years, and Japan wouldn't be one of the most powerful economies in the world, with the second strongest navy in the world.

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Um, because they are. They can vote out that clause, and yet, haven't. Therefore they have taken ownership of it.

Ok, so what wars did Japan end or successfully intervene? Is Japan researching on how to diplomatically end wars or not start wars in the first place? What exactly did Japan do to contribute to world peace? Not much, it seems.

Saying that your country is "peaceful" just because you pretend that your country doesn't own any military (it does) is just foolish and deceptive at best.

That's your opinion. But if it assent working, it wouldn't have lasted 70 years, and Japan wouldn't be one of the most powerful economies in the world,

Well first of all, Japan was "allowed" to become prosperous by the US. I'm not saying that Japan had nothing to do with it, but the US had been extraordinary generous in this matter. Basically, Japan could only prosper under the protection of US. Japan is basically a protectorate of the US.

with the second strongest navy in the world.

I thought Japan was "pacifist"? lol...

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Ok, so what wars did Japan end or successfully intervene?

What does that have to do with anything?

Is Japan researching on how to diplomatically end wars or not start wars in the first place?

What does that have to do with anything?

What exactly did Japan do to contribute to world peace?

They lived under a constitution for the past 70 years that states that they as a nation will not wage war upon other countries. This serves as a model for all other countries to aspire to.

Not much, it seems.

See my last point, it's huge.

Saying that your country is "peaceful" just because you pretend that your country doesn't own any military (it does) is just foolish and deceptive at best.

It's not my country, and I didn't say that. So I'm not sure what you are referring to with that statement.

Well first of all, Japan was "allowed" to become prosperous by the US.

So. That doesn't change the fact that it is prosperous. So obviously something is working.

I'm not saying that Japan had nothing to do with it, but the US had been extraordinary generous in this matter.

So?

Basically, Japan could only prosper under the protection of US.

You don't know that, because there is no point of comparison.

Japan is basically a protectorate of the US.

So?

I thought Japan was "pacifist"? lol...

It is. Have they attacked anyone since their pacifist constitution came about? Nope. No one. That's called pacifism. Leaving themselves undefended would just be stupid though. There is an ideal (pacifism), and a reality (needing defense). You live one and aim for the other.

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Article 9 is a bit of a joke and nobody takes it seriously. Not even Japan takes it seriously. It's unrealistic to expect to have no military (which is what article 9 states) and claim sovereignty over your country. For that reason, Japan is still not an independent sovereign nation.

And why are US troops stationed in Okinawa? Because Japan has no choice but to be subservient to the US. So much for peace.

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Article 9 is a bit of a joke and nobody takes it seriously.

If that were true, then there wouldn't be a huge uproar at even the mention of changing it. The very fact that it becomes world news, shows that it is taken very seriously. Even when the Japanese simply wanted to help supply other armies a few years ago, not even participating in combat, it was a huge uproar within Japan and ended up in court battles.

So the facts beg to differ with your statement. Both Japan and the world take Article 9 very seriously.

It's unrealistic to expect to have no military (which is what article 9 states) and claim sovereignty over your country.

Japan has a self-defense force, and an extremely strong one. That's both reasonable, and at this time in our world history, a necessity.

So much for peace.

Japan has been at peace for 70 years. So I think you meant to say "so much peace".

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Japan has a self-defense force, and an extremely strong one.

That it has even that is due to cold war US pressure to re-arm. You certainly dont see much military advertising or promotions on TV in Japan, like you do in western countries. Its almost like recruitment to the SDF is by word of mouth

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Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 09:28PM JST There's no proof that China has any expansionist or militarist ambitions like the Fascist Japan, Germany and Italy did.

One only needs to look at the Communist Chinese naval vessels laying siege in the West Philippine sea, claiming all of the South China sea, east China sea to see the proof. But when one has an agenda, like yourself that person sees nothing wrong.

Your attempt to minimize and distort the facts, but when you do your so called facts are as silly as China claiming that they own Okinawa and all that they see.

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 09:28PM JST Besides, expansionism, fascism and militarism don't work.

You forgotten to add that Communism also doesn't work. Let us not forget that if it wasn't for Communism Fascism would never have been.

Eiji TakanoJan. 26, 2014 - 09:28PM JST China is too big, there's no way that they could lead an entire group of whole billion people to go on the path of fascism and militarism.

You're right, Communist China is too big and that is why it can't fight against Corruption and control all it's people without using repressive Totalitarian tactics against them.

You actually believe that Fascism is the only one that is Militaristic? If that is the case you have never really read unfettered history.

Let me help you out some more, read about how Stalin actually aided Nazis Germany in 1939, then go into their invasion of what came to be called "the Eastern Block". Then when you are done there go into the Communist Chinese invasion of Tibet. Real good reading.

Now, before you jump up and down and your head implodes, let me explain that I never supported the Western manipulation and gerrymandering of Central and South America.

Now, I will surprise you even further, I hold great disdain for Authoritarian and Totalitarian regimes. In my book those are the bane of mankind. I hold that each and every person has the right to freedom of expression and thought. No state in my opinion should have the right to deny a person of these rights.

Now, I also don't believe that a god or any god gives us these rights, these rights are ours because we can reason. If a person agrees that a state can and should restrict the will of the people then that state needs to be ended.

Freedom is our right and if a state tries and take that right we remove that state's power.

Now, in closing, I shall ask you one final simple question, why haven't you answered the simple questions I before you?

Don't worry, I knew from the get go that you weren't going to answer them, We doth know that if you did answer them they would prove that your position is based on propaganda and lies.

Facts and proof hold more weight than silly 3rd grade propaganda, only folks that believe them are 2nd graders.

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