politics

Asia arms up to counter growing Chinese might

44 Comments
By JACK CHANG

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China's belligerence toward its neighbors is causing them to build closer military/economic ties with one another to counter the threat, and to increasingly give up on hope of productive relations with China. China is even turning the screws on Hong Kong, smothering the goose that laid the golden egg.

This certainly reflects exceedingly poor political/diplomatic judgment from China, in that its actions are causing its neighbors and the rest of the international community to see it as untrustworthy and unpredictable, thereby foregoing ventures involving China that would otherwise help its citizens and economy. China needs a change in government.

9 ( +15 / -6 )

The problem for the rest of the world is that the CCP dictatorship would rather start WWIII than lose it's power over China.

9 ( +16 / -7 )

"Japan, however, appears to be preparing itself for possible escalation."

Really? Looking beyond the surface, the viability and feasibility for Japan to participate an arms race and armed conflict are highly questionable.

Why ? Let's examine the hard data sheet: Yesterday, Japanese Ministry of Internal Affairs and Communications reported that the number of people aged 65 or older in Japan reached a record of 32.96 million. The ministry believes 25.9 % of Japanese population is 65 and elders. The fact of matter is that Japan’s accelerating demographics would further reduce Japanese economic mobility drastically in upcoming decade. Some experts in Japan also suggest that 30 years from now, 40 percent of Japanese population could be 65 years or older.

Rhetoric aside, peace or war for Japan seems obvious.

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

****China is being China, the 800 pound gorilla.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

And no doubt China will come out with some BS statement soon accusing its neighbours of militarism.

13 ( +16 / -3 )

BEIJING —

Vietnam has nearly doubled its military spending, Japan is requesting its biggest-ever defense budget and the Philippines is rushing to piece together a viable navy.

Several Asian nations are arming up, their wary eyes fixed squarely on one country: a resurgent China that’s boldly asserting its territorial claims all along the East Asian coast.

The scramble to spend more defense dollars comes amid spats with China over contested reefs and waters. Other Asian countries such as India and South Korea are quickly modernizing their forces,

So how come there are many on here who still cannot see it , when china's neighbours can also see it. They are not arming up because they see japan as the threat are they?

It is not because of Abe either, it is more obvious than the sun.

And EthanWlber, of course "Rhetoric aside, peace or war for Japan seems obvious." there is either going to be war or peace, its alittle like saying it is either going to be night time or day time, it has to be something doesn't it.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

I don't think that tank is a Type 90, but the new one, the Type 10...

4 ( +5 / -1 )

No matter who you blame (for the new arms race), no one stands to make more money than the Military Industrial complex. They couldn't be more pleased with everyone's reactions!

9 ( +10 / -1 )

So Japan's staying ahead of the curve by preparing for escalation as well as increasing patrol capabilities and military presence. A wise choice. The others in the region should do the same. Either the CCP will act, aiming to keep their power than cede it, or else North Korea will take advantage of the diverted attention. I wouldn't put it past those unstable despots. Hearing that India has become the world's biggest arms importer isn't actually all that surprising. Their population is about the same as China's, and China has been antagonizing them as well. I guess it's inevitable for India to say "enough is enough" and start pushing back, like the establishment of this mountain corps. As long as these Asian nations present a united front against China, and as long as they work with the US as well, then China won't become the greatest power in the Pacific. It can try. It will surely try, but sooner or later all this increasing of defence budgets is going to collapse China's economy. They might be the second largest economy now, but investors are surely getting spooked by China's actions. No-one likes a power hungry tyrant. They'll start pulling out soon enough, and then the dominoes will start to fall, one by one.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Japan is replacing its entire fleet with more modern submarines.

Which is not because of China's recent belicosity. The Soryu Class subs have been in the pipeline since the late 90s. What has happened because of China's new agressive attitude is that we are buying more of them.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

IMHO, even if it's a different regime, the objective to be the regional power and strive to be a world power wouldn't change.

Beijing hasn’t yet caught up to the U.S., which at $665 billion a year, spends more on its military than the next eight countries combined and triple that of China, according to the Stockholm International Peace Institute, a think tank. Still, China’s spending nearly equals the total defense budgets of all 24 other countries in East and South Asia.

I'd rather the US work on health insurance and oil refinement, but unfortunately its presence is needed by Japan and in the Middle East.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I don't think that tank is a Type 90, but the new one, the Type 10...

Those are indeed Type 10s not Type 90s. According to statistics Japan has about 50 million available for military service at present the problem is a lack of equipment to arm them all. Japan has no stockpiles of ammo or rifles like other countries do. For instance the American armed forces has something like a trillion rounds of 5.56mm stashed away for war and apparently something like a dozen M16 rifles for every active and reservist member. Japan has like a hundred thousand Type 89s to it's quarter million sized self-defense force. But industrially speaking Japan is above China and most other nations in terms of efficiency and about the same for heavy industrial and electronic output. Both have virtually identical material and resource shortages they need to make up with imports. Hypothetically Japan could bridge the gap in a few years with a higher budget and a few human resources reforms. Technologically it's also vastly superior across the board.

And Japan has this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVsuv-dbV0I

and this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFO-twUguOQ

and this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iZ0WuNvHr8

:)

OK realistically speaking China will probably fire off half it's nukes watch them get shot down by Japan's ballistic missile defense screen then go home and call it an accidentally launch.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

songwillem2011 : China will probably fire off half it's nukes watch them get shot down by Japan's ballistic missile defense screen

Fixed:

China will probably fire off half it's nukes watch SOME OF THEM get shot down by Japan's ballistic missile defense screen

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

Since China is one fifth of the world's population, its military strength on a per capita basis is actually very minuscule compared to USA and Russia. So this thing about China arming up is a big fuss over nothing. USA and Russia are more than happy to sell arms to any country including Japan and China. They are the ones laughing all the way to the bank.

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

Ossan: "The problem for the rest of the world is that the CCP dictatorship would rather start WWIII than lose it's power over China."

Says a guy who defends Japan revising its constitution of peace to help escalate things! Goes both ways, friend.

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

The following statement by the author shows his ignorance."Other Asian countries such as India and South Korea are quickly modernizing their forces, although their disputes with China have stayed largely at the diplomatic level." India is the only country which fought a land war with China after it became a communist country.It defeated India and grabbed plenty of land area which it claimed and continue to nibble. China also is constructing the highest rail/road connecting China with a port in Pakistan through the Indian disputed Karakoram pass. To me this Chinese sabre rattling is with wink from USA which is the main gainer through its Arms export lobby. But this is also slowly forcing Russia to export high tech weapons to China which had a minor land skirmish at Amur river.Obama just cannot see this embrace which is much more bad for USA in the long run.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Says a guy who defends Japan revising its constitution of peace to help escalate things! Goes both ways, friend.

Read the article. In fact, read the FIRST WORD in the article.

Secondly, there hasn't been a revision in the constitution in Japan EVER though many nations such as U.S. and Germany has done so on many occasions.

-2 ( +9 / -11 )

@quercetum Yes, a democratic Chinese regime would probably be quite belligerent (takes a while to reeducate generations of hate), BUT they probably would have a healthy sense of what is/is not worth going to war over. There would be no CCP to keep in power through disinformation. Hence it would be possible to negotiate with them for a change.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

i will choose not to boost my military forces if i were them. It's like taunting and preparing for war. Waste of tax money and effort to maintain all of them. If you want peace then drop all your weapons and use pen and voice to resolve conflicts! If China wont back down and becomes offensive, let the world do its job to defend the poor countries then. Phil and Viet doesnt stand a chance to ever equal the strength and money of China. IRL if you're physically weak, then use your brain and look for allies instead of building up muscles which will never be greater than your opponent.

Just saying that fire power isnt the solution for all these conflicts, humans just have to learn how to respect each other's territories

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Even with Mariana, Iwo jima, Okinawa and others all gone, Japanese military authorities still vowed to fight till the last man, not because they loved their Emperor --whose continued nobility and dignity were readily guaranteed by the Allied---, but because they forsaw their own excecution, in the hands of the enemy. They deliriously hope that swarms and swarms of women and small kids with sharp pointed broom-sticks in hands marching towad the GIs would force American parents to force their government to give up landing on Japan mainland, has peace treaty, thus save their necks.

Let's say there is a system which constantly bombards into the ears of Hsi jinping, his genserals, politburos etc with the messages that goes like Sir, we can see you just alighted from your car--you're entering the building--Oh, Oh what a gorgeous party, have a good time--Night, night, sleep tight--etc, etc, then peace will be guaranteed. Mainly because China knows there are scores of US Verginia-class submarines quetly sleeping, or rather pretending to be asleep, at the bottom of the ocean just outside its east coast, whose tomahawak warhead each packs with a power greater than the combined explosives used in WWI and WWII, and whose proximity let it reach whatever targets in China in minutes, when Chinese inter-continentals are still trying to climb into the skys of the Pacific Ocean, where multi layers of anti missle missles are waiting.

And China also knows, regrettably, that they do not have any such subs sleeping outside US coasts, yet.

When industrial, commercial, political centers of China are thus gone, what's left of China? So why claim this and claim that and claim verything to offend everybody around yourself, to risk accidentally awaking up those sleeping subs?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

While the concern of these countries in the region are pretty understandable, increasing defence expenditure will mean decreasing investments to boost economic growth! And, the defence spending involves mostly procuring defence equipment from the West, notably the US, and that will only benefit the economies of those countries meeting the thirst for better defence preparedness in the region! At the end of the day, it all takes the world to square one where one finds an eventual re-emergence of arms race in the entire world!

4 ( +5 / -1 )

@EthanWilberSEP. 15, 2014 - 08:33AM JST "Japan, however, appears to be preparing itself for possible escalation." Really? Looking beyond the surface, the viability and feasibility for Japan to participate an arms race and armed conflict are highly questionable. Why ? Let's examine the hard data sheet: Yesterday, Japanese Ministry of Internal Affairs and Communications reported that the number of people aged 65 or older in Japan reached a record of 32.96 million. The ministry believes 25.9 % of Japanese population is 65 and elders. The fact of matter is that Japan’s accelerating demographics would further reduce Japanese economic mobility drastically in upcoming decade. Some experts in Japan also suggest that 30 years from now, 40 percent of Japanese population could be 65 years or older.

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

I hate to see Japan militarize by using youngsters. Even if there are plenty of people in Japan and birth rate goes up.

I hope some of Japan inc will look around AI and Robotic development companies in USA to create robots that runs and carry heavy stuffs I warch in Science channels in USA. There are other kind of robots used in factories but people look like ribots will work as soldiers. Until those running robots are mass produced, Japan should stay away from war activities. Japan had horrible experience to start WW II in Asia. Whichever countries create WW III, Japan will be criticized anyway.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

''Japan had horrible experience to start WW II in Asia. Whichever countries create WW III, Japan will be criticized anyway.'' --- toshiko Sep. 15, 2014 - 09:34PM JST

Check and surprise yourself to find where SOME of modern Japanese are from.

''During Yayoi and Tumulus periods, Japanese population all of a sudden swelled, earthenware changed, bronze and iron appeared, rice plantation technique established, temples and huge tombs built---the results of a great influx of immigrants from China and Korea. For it was Waring States and Spring-Autumn period in China, the defeated Hu-Han hybrids escaped to Japan, as many as a million according to some, bringing with them those goodies, plus their acumen in politics, in palace intrigue, in Suntzu Art of War, in how to live off the Hyakushyos, thus very soon they and their descendants gained power and became Shoguns, Daimyos, Daihoneis, kanryous, politicians, all those you hate, all are powerless now because of a new Abe era.''

0 ( +2 / -2 )

The money Chinese are buying their weapons with are ultimately coming from our pockets purchasing Chinese made products... If this foolishness continues China should face a trade sanctions from Japan and rest of the World that's against Chinese military buildup. Also Japanese companies must bring manufacturing back to Japan and stop depending on China for cheap labor, this is the only way to make Japan strong...

1 ( +3 / -2 )

@tmtmsnbSEP. 16, 2014 - 01:12AM JST ''Japan had horrible experience to start WW II in Asia. Whichever countries create WW III, Japan will be criticized anyway.'' --- toshiko Sep. 15, 2014 - 09:34PM JST Check and surprise yourself to find where SOME of modern Japanese are from.

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

jJapanese written history began from Johmon Era, not Yayoi, Yokoana Kofun and Tateans kofgun indicates that. In my time jin Japan, students had to study ko-fun in history classes in Japan, We used to look at old old poteries with Chinese letters or Korean letters. Again, Kojiki and nihon shoki stated Jo mon eras. Yayoi eras came way later. Before War began, in history books and reference books beside hyakka-jiten, it was common sense that Japanese were mixture og Chinese and Koreans in out school. Read Kojiki and Nihon shoki as it seems you are more knowlegeable in Japanese history than youngsters. We used to tell that Amatersu came to Takachiho in Kyushu from China before Pearl Harbor we heard. '

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I don't see why the Asian Countries don't just put sanctions on trade and economic deals with China ! Look at what Obama and the EU Masters are doing with Russia. I smell a rat in the wood pile......... What country claims a fear about another and does nothing but talk ? Where is the action against China if they are such a minister of Trouble. Someone explain to me the logic of these countries ? Is China just testing the Waters, surely oil and minerals is the issue, but the response to the overt movements of China and claims by the Asian neighbors has me lost.... Help somebody ?

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

turbotsat:

Fixed: China will probably fire off half it's nukes watch SOME OF THEM get shot down by Japan's ballistic missile defense screen

Four downvotes net? Someone really thinks if China starts shooting nukes at Japan, Japan'll shoot down ALL of them with their "ballistic missile defense"?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missile_defense_systems_by_country#Japan

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Turbotsat: Yes, I noticed that to, lol. The best missile defence systems in the world can't stop everything. The truth is, no one will be a winner in a modern nuclear war! With maybe the exception of those who sold the weapons.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Anyone who thinks that China can fire ANY of it's nukes and expect to still exist when the world erases it from the face of this Earth isn't playing with a full deck. Even China doesn't dare contemplate doing such a thing,

1 ( +3 / -2 )

@tmtmsnbSEP. 16, 2014 - 01:12AM JST ''Japan had horrible experience to start WW II in Asia. Whichever countries create WW III, Japan will be criticized anyway.'' --- toshiko Sep. 15, 2014 - 09:34PM JST Check and surprise yourself to find where SOME of modern Japanese are from. ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

When N Korea began missile testing, there were report that Japan has anti missile system that crushes N Korean missile. I don;t care we Japanese were mixture of Chinese and Koreans in ancient eras. That is no excuse to be attacked by China and doing nothing.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

China could be trying to instigage Japan begins WW III. There are people like tmtmsr with half baked knowledge of Japanese history to tell us we Japanese should obey Chinese attack .

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Japan lost the last chance to be forgiven by China.

Japanese are just keep lying to push away the responsibility.

This is a English website of Japan but is dominated by the right wing readers that never have a neutral thought.

consider following points:

isn't there really no evidence shows that the dispute islet with China had no owner at that time? I think Japanese are too much like to say "NO Evidence" these days. No evidence of this, no evidence of that.

isn't there really no any reason for China to claim the south china sea? If there is one tiny reason, we can't say Invasion easily.

Seriously, was India really invaded by China? If this true, why India is keeping to forget that part history? why don't they just try to memory it just like China does to memory the invasion of Japan? who is lying here on earth?

I believe no one can answer these question totally here, because you Japanese are keep lying all days.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

toshikoSep. 16, 2014 - 08:49PM JST

''@tmtmsnbSEP. 16, 2014 - 01:12AM JST ''Japan had horrible experience to start WW II in Asia. Whichever countries create WW III, Japan will be criticized anyway.'' --- toshiko Sep. 15, 2014 - 09:34PM JST Check and surprise yourself to find where SOME of modern Japanese are from. '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' When N Korea began missile testing, there were report that Japan has anti missile system that crushes N Korean missile. I don;t care we Japanese were mixture of Chinese and Koreans in ancient eras. That is no excuse to be attacked by China and doing nothing. China could be trying to instigage Japan begins WW III. There are people like tmtmsr with half baked knowledge of Japanese history to tell us we Japanese should obey Chinese attack .''

Historically, there were rather few 'Chinese-Japanese mixture' in Japan. Most Toraijin were of Chinese origin, of Hu-Han mixture--胡-漢混血. 胡, barbaric tribes of north and northeast China, whose characteristics, according to Britannica: -- 'Riaiding other tribes to capture cattle, women, and prisoners was a recognized method of property accumulation'. In short, a certified predator. When these barbarians mixed with the blood of civilized, intelligent 漢民族, they became a very skillful, efficient predator. When hundreds of thousands of these arrived in Japan, they immediately victimized Japanese Jomonjin--a peaceful, hardworking, intelligent people--, turned them into farm slaves, grabed military powers, rendered Japanese ruler powerless. They intermarriaged among themselves to keep their predatory capacity intact. They have ruled Japan for hundreds of years, till Meiji Ishin, before military took over; till Shinzo Abe, a Japan ruled by Japanese. If ever there will be WWIII, it won't be instigated by this government.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

toshiko: When N Korea began missile testing, there were report that Japan has anti missile system that crushes N Korean missile.

If Standard Missile 3 which Japan is planning to use for ABM still has only the 80 pct success rate reported in Wikipedia, that's still 4 of 5 ballistic missiles shot down, 1 of every 5 makes it through. If one that makes it through happens to hit the anti-ballistic-missile defenses, after that point 0 of 5 will be shot down.

China, less crazy, more missiles, better tech. DPRK, more crazy, less missiles / worse tech, but building more and getting better, one supposes.

When US shot the satellite down with a SM-3, they knew exactly where the satellite was and where it was going. It was a known, single target, in a planned test.

And don't know how that will work out if a bunch of BM's get shot off at once. Defenders will have limits on how many incoming they can handle at once.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIM-161_Standard_Missile_3#Operation_and_performance

http://mainichi.jp/english/english/newsselect/news/20140809p2a00m0na013000c.html

Defense ministry mulls introducing ground-based SM-3 interceptor missiles

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/06/21/national/defense-ministry-to-study-new-missile-defense-systems

Defense Ministry to study new missile defense systems, Jun 21, 2014

1 ( +1 / -0 )

I find it incredible how some folks here actually believe that Communist China would launch a nuke at anyone. Yes, Communist China's leadership is a bag full of nuts, but they aren't completely nuts.

Let me introduce you to my old friend M.A.D.. No lads, I am not talking about MAD magazine, I am talking about Mutual Assured Destruction. It's a cold war policy that is still in effect and it covers anyone and protects all allies, even Japan. In short it says, "fire one and we fire all". M.A.D. is the reason no one wants to start a nuclear exchange and why no one will.

Is M.A.D. still in effect? Why yes it is.

Folks that don't know will never understand.

mgglifeSep. 16, 2014 - 10:14PM JST Japan lost the last chance to be forgiven by China.

You Communist fanatics are forever stuck in the past and will always stay there, that is the reason your nation will never be a real world leader. After the Communist Party falls China might achieve greatness again, but until that day comes your nation and it's fanatics will continue their Merry-Go-Round ride of madness.

BTW, on more than one occasion questions 1, 2 and 3 have been answered here, the problem is that the answers you got weren't the answers you wanted to read. Your side continues to deny historical facts because facts go against what you have been taught and what you want to believe.

Sad but true.......

0 ( +1 / -1 )

JoeBigs,

ok, ok , I got it. So Japan will give up the dispute islands with Russia and Korea, because they are history. we should move forward, correct?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

mgglifeSep. 17, 2014 - 03:20PM JST JoeBigs, ok, ok , I got it. So Japan will give up the dispute islands with Russia and Korea, because they are history. we should move forward, correct?

Hm, tell me something, before 1971 did Communist China claim the Senkaku Islands? Before you even try and make something up like, "we have ancient maps" ancient maps are as reliable as an ancient maps of Atlantis. So, let's keep this in the realm of reality. Did Communist china at anytime prior to 1971 ever claim the Senkaku Islands? Answer is no...

Before 1971 Communist China considered those islands as just barren wastes not worth the time or effort of thinking about them. But, for some unknown reason, right after the discovery of vast reserves of oil and other natural resources Communist China wrapped a flag around them and claimed someone's great, great, great, great uncle's sister's cousin's maid lived there once. Then they claimed them as an ancient Chinese holding and cried crocodile tears hoping to get them from Japan.

If you want pre 1971 Communist China statements about Japan's ownership of the islands I can easily provide them.

Next, as to Japan's dispute with South Korea and Russia.

Please by all means show me/us here when was the last time Japan sent it's naval forces into those disputed waters in an aggressive nature?

Or better yet, when was the last time Japan paid it's people to riot and pretend to send an armada of 1000 fishing vessels to invade any of those islands?

Or by all means show us any time that Japan painted any naval ships belonging to South Korea or Russia with it's targeting radar?

The dispute with Russia and South Korea have been disputes kept at a diplomatic level and never escalated from there.

Can you say the same for your Communist China?

Communist China is a bully, but as with most bullies they are all bark and zero bite!

I won't hold my breath and expect anything to counter my points other than typical Communist China propaganda.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

JoeBigs,

I no need to say too much , just one question:

Which name came the first for the dispute islet with China? Senkaku or Diaoyu?

if it is Senkaku , why China named Diaoyu again ? Just to rob it from Japan?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

I LOL at the comment that China's PLAN can dislodge USN in SCS. Its not even a remotely fair comparison.

I also LOL at the comments that says China is a bully or aggressor. That's like saying the sky is blue. China is the biggest nation in Asia. That almost mandate them to be the bully or aggressor similar to what US is to our foes. Its simple Darwinism. There is absolutely nothing wrong with what the Chinese do in their own perspective. Its what Americans do in our own perspective and what Japanese did in its own perspective years ago.

Additionally, its not Japan that holds the legitimate position on those islands. Its Taiwan that really holds the most legitimate claim since they are the rightful gov't and administration that were not included in the relining of territories. And its the ROC that protested at the earliest points in history on the legitimacy and sovereign rights of those islands. Japan is merely an administrator or a property that belongs to Taiwan. China is pushing into the claim based on the One-China Policy. Technically speaking, Japan has been the bully against Taiwan on this matter along with the fishing rights in the area. The only reality is Taiwan is too weak and dependent on US-Japan alliance to stay secure. That's why Japan can still hold on to these islands. If and by some unforeseen circumstance that Taiwan reunites with China, then there is no more dispute on the sovereign rights on those islands.

But let's not exaggerate the military reality here.

Unless China has at least 3 carrier groups with reasonable air and sub support, its no match for USN in SCS. First of all, there will always be 1 carrier group in maintenance or refit. China has a vast coastline and oversea needs for support. So 1 CG will be needed most likely in the middle east or eastern Africa. If not oversea, then in the ECS. Then that leaves 1 CG in the SCS against the 3rd or 7th fleet.

That would be the best scenario for China on what they can build by 2030. However, as I speak, they don't even have 1 CG available, no air wing, and limited long range support. Just what kind of a threat is that? It takes about 10 years to build, test, train, and ready 1 carrier. And that is on the fast track. Let's just say China goes all in with this and build 2 at a time which is highly unlikely per their principle, that will still take 10-15 years to ready 2 groups.

We're talking about 2030 at best. And mind you, these are untested CG without any battle experience. Against a ready to go and battle tested USN. That's not including the naval capability of Japan and South Korea.

Philippines is our ally, Japan is our ally, Australia is our ally, South Korea is our ally. Vietnam is a communist state which we don't care much for. And there are on-going disputes on the same islands between Vietnam and Philippines as well as them against China and Taiwan. So the disputes in the region are never going to go away even if you take China out of the equation.

Again, what military threat? China doesn't have the capability to take on USN in the SCS. ECS maybe with all the short range missiles available to them. But SCS is another thousand miles away. This is not happening.

The main concern is in the ECS against Japan and Taiwan. These 2 nations are the ones that need to double their military spending to form a ring encircling the Chinese. Japan is on the right path on purchasing more advances weaponry from us. Philippines is too poor to do anything. Vietnam is too close to China, the Chinese can simply march over to Vietnam and its all over. Japan is one that needs to man the station and its doing the right thing.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

And its the ROC that protested at the earliest points in history on the legitimacy and sovereign rights of those islands.

No they didn't. The archives at FRUS indicated that they had no interest in Senkaku.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

nigeboy,

"The archives at FRUS indicated that they had no interest in Senkaku."

So at least at that time the US thought this islet belong to China, but China had no interesting on that at that time, can we conclude this from your statement? and further more, at least at that time this islet was not belong to Japan, correct?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

at least at that time this islet was not belong to Japan, correct?

Wrong. Japan has had claims over the Senkaku Islands that date back to 1895, claims that as I understand it, they can substantiate. There was never any dispute with China on that matter to begin with. When Japan surrendered in 1945, administration of the islands was ceded to America, until (I think) 1954, when the US, along with the UK, Russia, and CHINA, decided to return administration of the Senkaku Islands to Japan. China had no qualms with this. Nor did they have any issues with it during the two joint communiques that they signed with Japan, in which sovereignty of the Senkaku Islands was mentioned. Only in 1971, when vast reserves of oil where discovered by the islands, did China suddenly start announcing that the Senkaku Islands were really the Diaoyu Islands and claiming that Japan stole them. Japan merely rolled its eyes at this, and did so for a long time. It was only when China began increasing its defence budget by double digits on a yearly basis that Japan started to get nervous, but they avoided a dispute. Then in 2012, in response to a private Japanese citizen selling some of the islands, the Japanese government decided to purchase the islands. Boy did China get mad at that. How dare they buy their own sovereign territory from one of their citizens? Since then, China has snowballed this dispute, getting more and more aggressive about the claims that date back to 1971. This time however, Japan's decided it's not going to simply roll its eyes and sigh. Japan made the decision to defend itself from China's rapidly growing aggression. It has told China that if they want to, they can take the claim up with ICJ. China doesn't recognise the authority of ICJ and won't become a signatory, and so we have this cat and mouse game that has only built up over the past two years. Now we've come to this stage, where there are several Asian nations who recognise that China is the bully, and is taking steps to defend against them. So, how exactly is China NOT the one's instigating hostility here? How is China's claims to the Senkaku Islands valid, when they denied having sovereignty until the early 70's?

Also, I noticed earlier that you don't seem to be aware of conflict between China and India. Perhaps you should read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Indian_War - It's an article on the Sino-Indian War, fought in 1962. Perhaps that'll help you understand why India is forming a Mountain Regiment to defend against China. It details how China invaded India, capturing Indian territory in this admittedly short war.

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Fox Sora Winters

So why this sentence : "The archives at FRUS indicated that they had no interest in Senkak" exists. I mean if these islets always belong to Japan, why the USA said that? why they will check whether China was interested or not?

You did get my meaning upper.

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The archives at FRUS indicated that they had no interest in Senkak

What that means is that the US has no position on the sovereignty of the Islands. They see it as a discussion that is purely between Japan and China, so they're not showing any support to one side or the other on the sovereignty issue. They acknowledge that Japan ADMINISTERS the Islands, that's something they can't deny since they were among the four countries that returned administration to Japan, but as for the actual sovereignty of the Islands, the US has no position on that issue. That said, if China takes the Senkaku Islands by force, then the US is obligated by its Defence Cooperation pact to join Japan in retaking the Islands and punishing China for what would amount to an act of war. That's all it is. US has no opinion about who holds the sovereign rights over the Senkaku Islands, they're leaving that up to China and Japan to settle between themselves.

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