politics

Biden tells Suga U.S. committed to defending Japan

75 Comments
By Ben Sheppard

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The question is, would Japan help defend the US? I doubt it. I don't believe the Japanese are really our allies in anything.

-9 ( +27 / -36 )

Yo, big brother! Now, watch Japan really start to antagonize China with their rhetoric.

-20 ( +17 / -37 )

The U.S. backing "includes the Senkaku Islands" -- an area claimed both by Japan and China, which calls the islands the Diaoyus, the statement said.

Who cares what China calls them. The term is only used in China.

17 ( +39 / -22 )

It’s the US that has consistently prevented Japan from having full military capabilities to defend itself. A nuclear-armed Japan would be a much better ally and even come to the aid of the US in the event of war.

-13 ( +13 / -26 )

Suga, after his predecessor Abe, is again asking the U.S. if USFJ would defend Japan in time of war. Doesn't it mean that the Japan-U.S. Security Treaty is nothing but a facade to camouflage the fact that the U.S. military is here not necessarily to defend the security of Japan but keep its own interest and hegemony intact?

In other words, U.S. forces Japan are occupation forces by nature, maintaining so many bases and so much land/space as ever before.

-15 ( +9 / -24 )

Yo, big brother! Now, watch Japan really start to antagonize China with their rhetoric.

Japan has, over the last 50 years, has perfected the art of antagoizing a conflict, and then playing the victim and accusing the other side of starting it. I hope that the USA is wise to this kind of tat-tic, before coming to Japans defence.

-9 ( +20 / -29 )

Nothing like a warm cup o’ Joe to get the hands and feet tingling in the morning!

-19 ( +7 / -26 )

It’s the US that has consistently prevented Japan from having full military capabilities to defend itself. A nuclear-armed Japan would be a much better ally and even come to the aid of the US in the event of war.

It has absolutely NOTHING to do with having Nuclear arms, and everything to do with Japans outdated Constitution. The Constitution needs to be changed urgently so Japan can come to the aid of the US militarily in theatres of war. The US is certainly NOT standing in the way of changing the Constitution.

Get that Constitution changed, and it will be a genuine mutual military alliance where both Japan and USA can freely engage in foreign wars to defend each other.

Good to see Biden has taken a hard line against Communist China, and guaranteed the Defense of Senkakus. Back at you, Commies.

5 ( +26 / -21 )

it will be a genuine mutual military alliance where both Japan and USA can freely engage in foreign wars

Gee... can't wait for more foreign wars..!

-12 ( +9 / -21 )

The question is, would Japan help defend the US? I doubt it. I don't believe the Japanese are really our allies in anything.

How is this a question? We know that Article 9 of the Japanese Constitution states that, armed forces with war potential will not be maintained. The Constitution was imposed by the United States in the post-World War II period.

-8 ( +11 / -19 )

How is this a question? We know that Article 9 of the Japanese Constitution states that, armed forces with war potential will not be maintained.

Japan does get the best end of the deal. Protection from attack but without the reciprocal obligation.

0 ( +19 / -19 )

Wolfpack

Japan does get the best end of the deal. Protection from attack but without the reciprocal obligation.

Someone appears unaware of how constitutions work... /shrug

3 ( +20 / -17 )

How many headlines are needed for the constant "assuring and reassuring that US will stand by Japan , by the president, defense secretary,ambassador, head of the US forces etc etc....how many times does Japan need to be reassured?

5 ( +22 / -17 )

zatoizugoodoToday  07:01 am JST

The question is, would Japan help defend the US? I doubt it. I don't believe the Japanese are really our allies in anything.

The constitution has already been interpreted to allow Collective Defense with Allies. The Japanese are our allies. The Chinese are our (and everyone elses') adversaries. And "our" only makes sense if you're American. Ethnic Chinese who support the CCP dictatorship are not.

0 ( +18 / -18 )

Japan has, over the last 50 years, has perfected the art of antagoizing a conflict, and then playing the victim and accusing the other side of starting it. I hope that the USA is wise to this kind of tat-tic, before coming to Japans defence.

Agreed, no country has perfected playing the victim more than Japan. If this continues the US should not be coming to Japan's defence.

2 ( +15 / -13 )

ossan:

The term is only used in China.

True. So true. In Taiwan, they call them Diaoyutai, not Diaoyu.

-1 ( +15 / -16 )

OK OK, my bad. Taiwanese call them Tiaoyutai. Thumbs up now?

1 ( +17 / -16 )

business and politicians talk as usual.

let me be honest-does anyone expected a different kind of answer?

this why us basements will stay in Japan and foreign boots on ground as well.

and will cost us a lot of money from our taxes wasted for an "idea"

0 ( +13 / -13 )

@Matej: A waste of money to host US forces in Japan is it? If the US withdrew and Japan had to fund its own defense, do you think that would be a cheaper and more effective solution? I can't see how you would get to that conclusion.

3 ( +16 / -13 )

Thumbs up now?

Yikes! That's embarrassing

7 ( +12 / -5 )

Good to see Biden has taken a hard line against Communist China, and guaranteed the Defense of Senkakus.

Just more empty words from Biden. Biden will never do anything to upset China.

-20 ( +9 / -29 )

True. So true. In Taiwan, they call them Diaoyutai, not Diaoyu.

Irrelevant what Taiwan thinks about Senkakus or calls them. No one else accepts that name. They are Japanese, and with the US promising to defend them, will be forever.

-3 ( +12 / -15 )

@Matej: A waste of money to host US forces in Japan is it? If the US withdrew and Japan had to fund its own defense, do you think that would be a cheaper and more effective solution? I can't see how you would get to that conclusion.

@Merryanne: The message is not the focus in the comment you are replying to, the implication is more important. If the US withdrew from Japan and left Japan on its own, it would fall into China's sphere overnight (Russia would try but they are a Chinese puppet state now). If there was conflict between China and Japan, China would win and who knows what they would do to the now defenseless Japanese people. Considering the dehumansing crimes they commit against their own people, the likely outcome of what they would do to a people they historically hate from the bottom of their hearts would be something the world hasn't seen probably since WW2.

The implication of the comment you replied to is that Japan should do this and suffer the consequences later. There are some here who genuinely wish violence and abuse on normal Japanese people, don't forget that.

-10 ( +4 / -14 )

Deception is a major tool in Japanese arsenal. Japan manufactures and sells arms. In every opportunity they get they want to portray themselves as being weak and vulnerable, a country in need of protection.

China being Not only its major trading partner, but also a formidable adversary in every other way, Japan would not want to antagonize or let the US drag it in a direct confrontation. Japan, I believe will avoid a military confrontation with China at all costs unless totally unavoidable. This Senkaku/ Diaoyu/ Diaoyu tai, is one such but mostly out of saving face. The incessant assurance-seeking from the US for protection by Japan alludes to the importance Japan places on the Islands, like, it's the one ONLY thing that can precipitate a kinetic confrontation between the two.

These appeals to the US for protection must be read by the world as painful signals to China to desist from claiming the Diaoyu/ Senkaku islands because for Japan, that would be a causus belli.

13 ( +16 / -3 )

Japan does get the best end of the deal. Protection from attack but without the reciprocal obligation.

Which is what Trump tried to reverse, but he's orange man cheetoh Hitler so whatever he wanted is wrong, right?

8 ( +13 / -5 )

The Biden and Suga Duets calls China the bad and evil enemy .

Their song is so loud that people wonder why they insists on having robust diplomatic ties with the communist Peoples Republic ... BUT... BUT... BUT... adamantly refuses to establish diplomatic relations with 'friend' , 'ally' and 'like minded' democratic Taiwan!

What a bunch of chameleons !

Such an attitude makes Tokyojing and Washingjing da-kine fervent fans and accomplices of Beijing!

-18 ( +1 / -19 )

If there was conflict between China and Japan, China would win

I wouldnt bet on it. Modern warfare is no longer based on sheer numbers of boots on the ground. Japan has superior technology, a far stronger and more advanced Navy than the PRCs rusty hulks, and can rely on her allies in the QUAD. China has no allies, except NK, and the PRC would do well to remember how their last conflict with Japan turned out...

-5 ( +10 / -15 )

Japan has, over the last 50 years, has perfected the art of antagoizing a conflict, and then playing the victim and accusing the other side of starting it.

You just described China's Asia policy to a T.

-6 ( +10 / -16 )

Unlike his predecessor, President Biden will not try to make a profit from the US - Japan mutual defense treaty. IMO, that idea was particularly immoral.

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

Who cares what China calls them. The term is only used in China.

The 1.8 billion people that populate China.

7 ( +15 / -8 )

If you think Japan plays the victim you should look at South Koreas actions to understand the meaning of that word.

If you want to see what a Bad Ally looks like Don't go farther then South Korea. Japan is part of Quad alliance to balance China. While South Korea is Not!

S. KOREA, a country saved from North Korea invasion, China helping North. Yet unwilling to be part of bigger Quad Alliance in East Asia.

South Korea, unwilling to pay more for USA bases and troops while Japan has been paying 3x more then South Korea for 4x longer period of time.

-11 ( +7 / -18 )

Do some research on who has helped USA more is it:

1.Japan

or

2.South Korea

Which country pays more for troops/bases.

Which country is willing to stand with America against China. (Not Korea).

Which country has helped more with jobs.

Supported more USA by buying bonds over 1 Trillion Japan.

If you look at facts and numbers, history speaks for itself.

A lot of misinformation on here and Korea supporters bashing Japan as always while your Korea is not even part of Quad. While Pacifist Japan under Article 9 IS!

-12 ( +8 / -20 )

The U.S. backing "includes the Senkaku Islands" -- an area claimed both by Japan and China, which calls the islands the Diaoyus, the statement said.

Who cares what China calls them. The term is only used in China.

The term is also used in Taiwan and in Hong Kong. When you say it is only used in China, do you mean to say that Taiwan is a part of China? Taiwan has a conflict with Japan over the Senkakus, and Hong Kong, about a decade ago if I remember correctly, also condemns the Ishihara's nationalization of the Senkakus.

(a) Hong Kong, Taiwan, China, and Japan all claim the islands.

(b) China (including Hong Kong and Taiwan) and Japan both claim the islands.

Your statement points to (b).

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

Hiro S NobumasaToday  10:51 am JST

The Biden and Suga Duets calls China the bad and evil enemy .

Their song is so loud that people wonder why they insists on having robust diplomatic ties with the communist Peoples Republic ... BUT... BUT... BUT... adamantly refuses to establish diplomatic relations with 'friend' , 'ally' and 'like minded' democratic Taiwan!

Trump accepted a call from Pres Tsai Ing-Wen. Made more arms sales to Taiwan under the Taiwan Relations Act. Two US government officials visted Taiwan tself. A Representative from Taiwan was invited to Pres Biden's inauguration. The direction where this is heading, in the face of increasing military threats by China towards Taiwan is obvious.

Instead of whining to other countries, why don't you push Taiwan to amend it's constitution and become the Republic of Taiwan instead of Republic of China? Then Taiwan could declare sovereignty, joing the United Nations and enter defense agreements with the QUAD nations.

Unless Taiwan itself stands up for itself first, other nations can not open full diplomatic relations. And unless the United States does so first, other allied nations can not on their own.

-8 ( +8 / -16 )

P. SmithToday  11:34 am JST

Who cares what China calls them. The term is only used in China.

The 1.8 billion people that populate China.

Try to read befioe posting. The term is used only in China.

-7 ( +7 / -14 )

Historically, the US troops are not here to defend Japan. They were placed here at the end of WWII to ensure the rest of Asia that Japan would never repeat what it did during colonization of Asia and WWII. And the bases here allows the forward deployment of US troops in Asia. That is all.

14 ( +19 / -5 )

China’s being a bully, so it’s good that there’s somebody who’ll stand up to them. Would the United States go to war with China over the Senkaku islands? That’s rather doubtful, but it would be very damaging for relations and probably not worth it for China.

9 ( +13 / -4 )

And they're still here because Japan remains a willing outpost of the US global military hegemony, and a host to its nuclear weapons-armed ships and subs. The last time I can remember the US withdrawing from real estate it occupied overseas was when it was forced to abandon facilities at Subic Bay.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

"...without thanking the US for bringing democracy to Japan." You apparently don't understand the word "democracy"; it isn't really practiced in the US, either, where special interest money determines the political agenda and there is a corporatist olgarchy that's in charge of vetting candidates for most government positions at the federal level.

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

The US can't even defend itself: This is How You Recover From Fascism — and America’s Not Doing Any of It

https://eand.co/this-is-how-you-recover-from-fascism-and-americas-not-doing-any-of-it-73ce0b79bd4c

-14 ( +4 / -18 )

I don't believe the Japanese are really our allies in anything.

Maybe don't live here, in that case?

Anyway, I wouldn't blame our hosts for being wary of the US, given what they did here and continue to do with their military and cultural occupation.

Not that the US has many allies who would give it their all for Uncle Sam. We all saw what the previous regime did to its allies, the Kurds.

And what the previous regimes did to allies like Saddam.

-10 ( +3 / -13 )

They discussed Washington's "unwavering commitment to the defence of Japan under Article 5 of our security treaty," the White House said, and Biden reaffirmed "his commitment to provide extended deterrence to Japan."

The U.S. backing "includes the Senkaku Islands" -- an area claimed both by Japan and China, which calls the islands the Diaoyus, the statement said.

Vague and non-descript.

The Government of Japan, hosts US most critical forward command bases globally.

Guidance from the Commander, U.S. Forces Japan.

https://www.usfj.mil/About-USFJ/

Pay particular attention……

*USFJ enables USINDOPACOM's efforts to ensure a free and open Indo-Pacific. U.S. force posture in Japan provides a ready and lethal capability that deters adversary aggression, protects the Homeland, aids in Japan's defence, and enhances regional peace and security. *

That word aids and the tone and connotations.

The U.S. – Japan Alliance serves as a beacon to those who value transparency in government, transparency in economic dealings, access to markets, access to domains, as well as respect for and protection of sovereignty.

There are no promises or guarantees here.

And to cap it all the Japan people pay for the privilege.

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

gokai_wo_manekuToday  12:34 pm JST

Historically, the US troops are not here to defend Japan. They were placed here at the end of WWII to ensure the rest of Asia that Japan would never repeat what it did during colonization of Asia and WWII. And the bases here allows the forward deployment of US troops in Asia. That is all.

Wrong. That's the story that was given to nations so that they would accept US troops being in Japan. They have been in Japan since WWII to ensure that Japan would not "go red". Japan had been so destroyed by WWII that it would have taken a decade to become any kind of threat to anyone else. Patton was ready to go straight to Moscow after Berlin even before Japan surrendered. That's why the US kept Emperor Hirohito on the throne. The US created the LDP as well as the JSDF.

-8 ( +6 / -14 )

Editors: Spelling error in the headline: 'committed' has two t's (not 'commited')

Moderator: Thank you. It has been fixed.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@expat

Fair points about the flaws in US democracy and Japan isn’t yet a mature democracy, but it’s a hell of a lot better than the appalling regime in Japan before its defeat in WW2. Listen to the elderly here talk about what life was like in those times. I have, and the stories were harrowing.

-6 ( +6 / -12 )

The US can't even defend itself: This is How You Recover From Fascism — and America’s Not Doing Any of It

Stop trivialising actual fascism by portraying a democratic elected President as a dictator just because you didn’t like him.

It’s offensive, it’s pathetic, it’s juvenile, it’s dishonest and it’s demeaning to people who actually did/do live under fascist regimes.

-6 ( +7 / -13 )

This was also what Richard Nixon told the South Vietnamese leaders before the NVA captured Saigon.

Don't trust completely in Americans! Trust in yourself! Foster your own independence from the US!

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

Oh Yes,, let's believe Joe' Just watch how cozy old Joe will become to China' Slow and easy'

-9 ( +3 / -12 )

If even Abe could not find new alliances better stick with the ones that made you wealthy.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

OssanAmericaToday  12:20 pm JST

Instead of whining to other countries, why don't you push Taiwan to amend it's constitution and become the Republic of Taiwan instead of Republic of China? Then Taiwan could declare sovereignty, joing the United Nations and enter defense agreements with the QUAD nations.

Hello OA!

President LTH indeed was on the process of declaring a ROT but guess who stopped him? Lol!

"A senior American official in Taiwan has said that Washington will not intervene to resolve the mounting tensions between Beijing and Taipei and expects Taiwanese officials to avoid further provocations.

Richard Bush, who heads Washington's semi-official presence in the Taiwanese capital, was speaking after talks with President Lee Teng-hui and other senior officials.

Correspondents say his comments are being seen as an implicit criticism of remarks made by President Lee earlier this month that relations between China and Taiwan should be conducted on a state-to-state basis."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/403668.stm

BTW, why is President English Tsai still barred from visiting the WH?

Stating solid facts is not whining.

Only a spokesman for da-kine China can say such words!

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

The 1.8 billion people that populate China.

So? No one outside of China cares what they think. Millions of them eat dogs, they even threw their pet dogs and cats out of apartment windows in early 2020 when they heard a dog caught COVID. And they want to rule the world. They turn every discussion into a political argument, and want everyone to concede and admit things without conceding or admitting anything themselves. They constantly whine and play the victim but turn around and bully people whenever they can. They're notorious for scams, fraud, and counterfeits.

They're seriously unlikable.

-11 ( +5 / -16 )

Try to read befioe posting. The term is used only in China.

Which means it matters to the 1.8 billion people in China. This shouldn’t be this difficult.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

So? No one outside of China cares what they think. 

And then you go on to list things that happen in China that you care about.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

Considering China's aggressive policy on Senkaku Island, this US assurance is very important to Japan's security. Japan today faces a common threat from China and 'North Korea' and both of these countries are full of nuclear power. In such a situation, Japan will have to be very serious about its security and will have to move forward with America in terms of security. China is increasing its tension with Japan over the Senkaku Islands. China wants to annex Senkaku Island on the strength of its military capability. That is why it is very important to rein in China. It is hoped that Japan will be able to rein in China through cooperation with America.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

So fixated on one ally? The number of countries and the size of the globe are the constants. But politics is supposed to be human spirits.

Any way forward other than conservative?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

And he didn’t even attempt to extort Japan. Amazing.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Job Biden talks like a centrist but governs from the far left. -Marco Rubio. Fact!

While Biden is making a clean break from many of Trump's policies,

This really made me laugh. Clean break is putting it mildly. More like annihilation of Trumps policies.

Biden signed an executive order ending the Keystone pipeline, destroying 11,000 jobs, Great job Joe! This man is an axe. Nothing more. Biden has sighed more executive fiats than anyone in such a short period of time, ever. More than Obama, more than Trump, more than anyone. Secondly, these aren’t just normal executive fiats, this is literally going down the wish list of the far left and checking all of them off.”

I think I have counted him signing more than 40 of them in his first week in office. All this success all this winning by the Democrats. But are the American people winning? Hard times are coming and just on the horizon. China declared economic war on the world.

Biden is a yes man to far the left. Nothing more and you can measure it but nothing but a fresh coat a paint on house eaten up by termites. Keep sighing Joe. With every stroke the American people will see through your Ball Scrap. Get ready America. Two years in let's see where we go.

The far left are in drivers seat in American government, while revolution grows stronger and stronger.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Biden will defend Japan, from what? A war instigated by the USA with China? The Chinese have no truck with Japan. Japan poses absolutely no danger to China. BUT. Certainly, the USA military bases in Japan pose a danger. Bases on sovereign soil for 75 years. Yanqui Go Home! As long as Japan remains a client-state under the U.S., the danger remains.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

P. SmithToday  11:34 am JST

Who cares what China calls them. The term is only used in China.

The 1.8 billion people that populate China.

And live under an unelected authoritarian government where expressing a view contrary to the government is a prosecutable offense. Includes some 2000000 in red-education/forced labor camps.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Japan has, over the last 50 years, has perfected the art of antagoizing a conflict, and then playing the victim and accusing the other side of starting it. I hope that the USA is wise to this kind of tat-tic, before coming to Japans defence.

So typical, with zero knowledge about Asian map and its history before WW2

4 ( +5 / -1 )

The pic Reminds me of a Kappa in Japan

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

The Biden and Suga Duets calls China the bad and evil enemy .

Their song is so loud that people wonder why they insists on having robust diplomatic ties with the communist Peoples Republic ... BUT... BUT... BUT... adamantly refuses to establish diplomatic relations with 'friend' , 'ally' and 'like minded' democratic Taiwan!

What a bunch of chameleons !

Sigh. The instant the US or any other nation formally recognizes Taiwan as an independent nation the PRC will attack. It is an instant declaration of war. The outcome, even if the US and Taiwan prevailed, would be horrible destruction and loss of human life. Such a conflict would almost assuredly become a nuclear war very quickly as China would use every weapon it has to win such a war. This isn't speculation. Everyone who matters knows this to be true. Therefore nations accept the current ambiguous situation including the not so veiled threat on the part of the US to defend Taiwan were the PRC to attack it. China has many internal problems not the least of which are its horrible demographic cliff in the coming decades and what happens to her major cities as oceans rise. Shanghai will be submerged under most credible scenarios and Taihu Lake becomes a bay on a new Chinese coast line. The US and NATO managed its relations with the old USSR short of war and won that conflict without the tragedy of a nuclear war. With patience the west can similarly prevail against China without losing cities and millions of innocent lives. Armed patience is not being a chameleon. It is being wise.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

The Chinese have no truck with Japan. 

Don't kid yourself. China hates Japan and wants revenge for WWII. The CCP nourishes this hatred as part of how it maintains its credibility with the Chinese people. My wife is originally from Shanghai and is constantly telling me to never trust any Japanese, "they will attack you when your back is turned". She thinks they will attack America again and is dead serious. She likes Japanese products but not the Japanese, even those 2nd generation Japanese Americans born in the US from US born parents. The islands south of Japan are coveted by China. In the possession of Japan in alliance with the US they represent a barrier to their navy getting into the open ocean. The bases on Okinawa represent a threat to their ships and aircraft and their ability to project power beyond that first island chain. The many smaller islands could be used in a war to place anti-ship and anti-aircraft missiles to threaten Chinese forces trying to pass between these islands and head to blue water. Moreover the seas around those islands are rich in fish and probably oil and gas, all of which China desperately needs as China is unable to feed its people or satisfy its energy needs from within. About the only thing keeping China from taking these by force and attacking Japanese cities to extract a measure of revenge are the US military and that mutual defense treaty.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

nothing but a fresh coat a paint on house eaten up by termites. 

The house eaten by termites are the 19th century smoke stack industries and dirty energy sources like coal and oil. They are not going to be part of the future. Nations that want to succeed and prosper in the future are going to leave these old fashioned unprofitable industries and heavily polluting energy sources behind. They belong in history. They are not the future. If you have ever seen the Diffusion of Innovation model you would know a nation wants to be among the innovators and early adopters. You do not want to be among the 15% who are laggards (I've heard the laggards described as those who own a touch tone phone only because rotary dial phones are no longer made). The laggards who cling to outdated technologies are going to be passed by and left in poverty while the innovators and early adopters succeed and prosper. You want to be on the pointy end of tech, not left in the exhaust plume.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Richard Bush, who heads Washington's semi-official presence in the Taiwanese capital, was speaking after talks with President Lee Teng-hui and other senior officials.

That was more than 20 years ago. LTH was President of Taiwan from 1988 - 2000. Jiang Zhemin, Elaine Chao's old high school friend, would have been the General Secretary of the CCP and President of PRC at the time and US Chinese relations were warm. Relations remained warm through the ten year term of Jiang's successor, Hu Jintao. Nobody wanted to provoke a war when it appeared China was reforming internally. It was not until Xi Jinping came to power that China's relations with the US and much of the rest of the world soured. Today is not twenty years ago so dredging up old quotes from a completely different era is misleading and perhaps deliberately so.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Boss: "Of course, we will protect you if your interests are threatened. But, first, you must provide us with as many land lots and houses as we want."

Turf representative: "As you say. You have as many land lots and houses as you want." "Well, now is the time you must protect us as you promised. Will you protect us?"

Boss: "What are you talking about?"

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

The instant the US or any other nation formally recognizes Taiwan as an independent nation the PRC will attack. It is an instant declaration of war. 

China wouldn't do jack and you know it.

They would simply ramp up their cold war with the US and go full-on cyberwarfare.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Desert TortoiseToday  04:16 am JST

That was more than 20 years ago. LTH was President of Taiwan from 1988 - 2000. Jiang Zhemin, Elaine Chao's old high school friend, would have been the General Secretary of the CCP and President of PRC at the time and US Chinese relations were warm. Relations remained warm through the ten year term of Jiang's successor, Hu Jintao. Nobody wanted to provoke a war when it appeared China was reforming internally. It was not until Xi Jinping came to power that China's relations with the US and much of the rest of the world soured. Today is not twenty years ago so dredging up old quotes from a completely different era is misleading and perhaps deliberately so.

This is not dredging up old coconuts my friend!

I'm just stating a mere fact that a democratic Taiwan Republic could have been celebrating 20 years of being independent from China if not for Washingjing's dire intervention which made Beijington happy.

This was just to remind OA that President LTH was way ahead of his post regarding TI but alas and alack was da-kine brutally extinguished by a supposedly 'friend' and 'ally' and 'like minded' democratic USA.

A very sad tale of a fellow democratic 'ally' being a Judas to a fellow democracy .

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Desert TortoiseToday  03:50 am JST

Sigh. The instant the US or any other nation formally recognizes Taiwan as an independent nation the PRC will attack. It is an instant declaration of war. The outcome, even if the US and Taiwan prevailed, would be horrible destruction and loss of human life. Such a conflict would almost assuredly become a nuclear war very quickly as China would use every weapon it has to win such a war. This isn't speculation. Everyone who matters knows this to be true. Therefore nations accept the current ambiguous situation including the not so veiled threat on the part of the US to defend Taiwan were the PRC to attack it. China has many internal problems not the least of which are its horrible demographic cliff in the coming decades and what happens to her major cities as oceans rise. Shanghai will be submerged under most credible scenarios and Taihu Lake becomes a bay on a new Chinese coast line. The US and NATO managed its relations with the old USSR short of war and won that conflict without the tragedy of a nuclear war. With patience the west can similarly prevail against China without losing cities and millions of innocent lives. Armed patience is not being a chameleon. It is being wise.

Double Sigh.

The US doesn't have to formally recognize a ROT.

Washingjing should just stop fooling around playing a name game and just re-establish ties with 'ally' ROC.

No official name change means the PROC will have a space and a reason for not goin to war.

The re-establishments of ties would give TW parity with China and pave the way for a more balanced political dialogue .

At present Washingjing is only giving Beijington a licensed gun to da-kine subvert a diplomatically empty handed Taipei!

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

China wouldn't do jack and you know it.

I do not believe that is true. Not for a minute and sure as heck don't want to test it. Too many in the CCP and Chinese military especially think Americans do not have the stomach for a major war and are of the opinion the US would fold its cards and leave if the PRC nuked a few important US cities. You and I know that isn't likely true, the US would torch China in retaliation, but the Chinese do not have access to our press and really do not understand how the west and western oriented Asian democracies see the world. It's frustrating because I travel there and have a wife from Shanghai and their worldview often seems upside down from the west. Two people look at the same thing but see it completely differently. Just the other day my wife surprised me expressing bitter resentment at the people of Inner Mongolia for protesting a recent change from Mongolian to Chinese language instruction in the schools of Inner Mongolia. Why? The Xing Dynasty was Mongolian. She thinks Mongolia should not have a country and should be part of China in retribution for the Xing! I looked at her in stunned disbelief. The CCP leadership has no concept of how western style representative government with its division of powers, jury trials and guaranteed individual rights works. The whole of how we govern ourselves is beyond their grasp. It's as alien as Mars. As a result the west and China often talk past each other without really understanding what the other side is saying. If Taiwan declared independence and the PRC did not immediately declare war, it would be the end of the CCP. The anger in China would be such that the CCP would be unable to control it. The CCP is in a box of their own construction. I think an armed standoff for now is the best we can hope for.

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No official name change means the PROC will have a space and a reason for not goin to war.

The re-establishments of ties would give TW parity with China and pave the way for a more balanced political dialogue .

That isn't going to work with Xi Jinping. He is unlike any Chinese leader since Mao. Xi is a hard line Communist true believer. He is also a sociopath and Taiwan is a fixation of his. I don't think you realize Xi is more like Mao than any of his immediate predecessors. In a way this is a good thing because he is going to crash and burn China on his own without the West having to do much other than produce enough armed might to deter him from attacking. Look how he has almost single handedly angered nearly all of Chinas neighbors and trade partners. We don't read about it because China doesn't have a free press and political competition is not allowed, but Xi has enemies inside the CCP who want him gone. Xi is acutely aware of this and resorts to ever increasing repression to keep his enemies at bay. Look what he did to Jack Ma. That will deter a lot of business and innovation in China. Xi is his own and China's worst enemy. But I honestly believe that unlike Hu Jintao or Jiang Zemin, Xi would go to war over Taiwan if he ever thinks he has any chance of winning, or if Taiwan ever declares independence. Let the CCP implode on its own. It will. Demographics and th emassive disruptions of rising sea levels will be the end of the CCP.

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Desert TortoiseToday  12:01 pm JST

That isn't going to work with Xi Jinping. He is unlike any Chinese leader since Mao. Xi is a hard line Communist true believer. He is also a sociopath and Taiwan is a fixation of his. I don't think you realize Xi is more like Mao than any of his immediate predecessors. In a way this is a good thing because he is going to crash and burn China on his own without the West having to do much other than produce enough armed might to deter him from attacking. Look how he has almost single handedly angered nearly all of Chinas neighbors and trade partners. We don't read about it because China doesn't have a free press and political competition is not allowed, but Xi has enemies inside the CCP who want him gone. Xi is acutely aware of this and resorts to ever increasing repression to keep his enemies at bay. Look what he did to Jack Ma. That will deter a lot of business and innovation in China. Xi is his own and China's worst enemy. But I honestly believe that unlike Hu Jintao or Jiang Zemin, Xi would go to war over Taiwan if he ever thinks he has any chance of winning, or if Taiwan ever declares independence. Let the CCP implode on its own. It will. Demographics and th emassive disruptions of rising sea levels will be the end of the CCP.

If Xi is like Mao then he will not go to war with Henry Kissinger's America.

He will tolerate the 'Status Quo' of ROC in TW and his PROC in China.

For all we know he might give diplomatic recognition to the ROC to prevent war with those forces egging for a ROT.

If this happens he knows that he'll become the greatest leader in the annals of Chinese history by embracing peace instead of war .

He also knows that the whole world will then give him a standing ovation and recognize him as the greatest Statesman of the Century .

Xi will then win the Nobel Peace Prize and be Time Magazine Man of the Year!

After all, Xi is also a human being.

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For all we know he might give diplomatic recognition to the ROC to prevent war with those forces egging for a ROT.

As I said earlier, no CCP leader can do that. If they tried the popular anger would end the rule of the CCP or at the very least lead to an internal coup. The CCP have built a box around themselves on this matter, a box from which there is no way out. Xi does not yet have the kind of control over the Chinese that Mao had either. He has a lot of internal party enemies just looking for an excuse to depose him.

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Interesting read on the subject.

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/content-series/atlantic-council-strategy-paper-series/the-longer-telegram/?utm_source=politico&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=strategy_paper_series

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Trump during his time in power rattled Asian allies by picking trade fights with China, embracing North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un and openly floating the possibility of withdrawing troops from the region.

Another way to write this sentence would be: "Trump during his time in power stood up to China, brilliantly got the North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un to stop his nuclear testing and change the NK propaganda wawy from nuclear war, and sensibly floated the possibility of open-ended expensive and unnecessary military presence oin the region."

But do not expect that from our "unbiased" mainstream media.

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