A Chinese coast guard vessel sails near the Senkaku Islands in the East China Sea in February. Photo: KYODO
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China says it is exercising self-restraint against Japanese ships near Senkakus

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China the world's new bully !

49 ( +56 / -7 )

Boycott China and sink their vessels when they ignore international law and intrude into other sovereign territory making threats!

42 ( +53 / -11 )

China really wants to start some wars, I guess it's time to boycott its products.

54 ( +62 / -8 )

Being a bully again.

China does not want to fight everyone for real.

Its good that the US, Japan, India, and Australia are forming a new alliance.

43 ( +50 / -7 )

It is easy to solve the problem. Let a U.S. nuclear aircraft carrier patrol the area regularly. Japan and other related countries will pay expenses. Not just the sea near Senkaku but also the territorial seas of the South Eastern nations including Taiwan.

45 ( +50 / -5 )

How to deal with a bully. Punch them in the nose. Show that their way isn't without costs. If they really want control over the Senkaku Islands, they should sue in world court. Otherwise, go away.

35 ( +42 / -7 )

The discussion from all the countries pushed by China is that the land was theirs since ancient times. Since ancient times a lot has happened, so this is not a good argument.

33 ( +38 / -5 )

Since nation-wide demonstrations and riots against Japan took place in China in 2012 over the Senkaku/Diaoyudao territorial issue, vandalizing Japanese firms and shops operating in Chinese cities, I've urged both sides to come to a discussion table (a forum) to review the history of the islands once again with cool heads.

-30 ( +6 / -36 )

China has territorial disputes with at least 16 countries: India, Taiwan, the Philippines, Indonesia, Vietnam, South Korea, North Korea, Singapore, Brunei, Nepal, Bhutan, Laos, Mongolia, Myanmar, Tibet and Japan.

Definitive that evidence the Chinese government has a problem with imperialist expansionism.

39 ( +43 / -4 )

Japan should send out their far right wing cuckoos on a ship straight after china coast guard vessels. Kill two birds with one stone.

0 ( +18 / -18 )

More lies from the Commies. Fortunately the QUAD Military force is ready to deal with them if they make just one aggressive move.

China the world's new bully !

New? Have you been watching the news the past two decades? Their bullying is certainly not new.

28 ( +34 / -6 )

They are unihabited Islands, No? If they are just give them to China. Who cares...they are Islands that are not even being used.

-50 ( +4 / -54 )

I guess it's time to boycott its products.

You realized this just now?

28 ( +37 / -9 )

Ricky,

The fishing and mineral exploration rights are hugely important.

37 ( +41 / -4 )

They are unihabited Islands

With potential reserves of natural resources.

36 ( +40 / -4 )

We were expecting this.. and more to come from China.

Where is our Biden?

Yes he is sleeping

When Trump was president the China was afraid of enacting such laws

Now Trump is no more the President so China is going to encroach the Island

I am sure JT will remove this post.

-20 ( +23 / -43 )

I guess it's time to boycott its products

Good luck with that! Just have a look around you and count how many Chinese made products you are using. Say goodbye to your keyboard and monitor too. Oh, and your phone.

-7 ( +16 / -23 )

It's funny. I believe it was last week when a Chinese fishing vessel capsized near Senkaku and the JCG ended up pulling some of the crew from the drink. Where was the Chinese coast guard then? Now, these crewmen will be treated, housed, and fed with our taxes. This is the second time the Chinsed coast guard has failed to rescue their citizens.

41 ( +41 / -0 )

Trump was no good for Japan. When the rubber hits the pavement Japan can only rely on itself. A pity I am too old to be in the Maritime SDF.

-5 ( +13 / -18 )

Cancel the China Olympics

41 ( +44 / -3 )

No money had to be paid to any politicians.

The people to blame are the people who built China as it is now - the executives of companies.

Companies around the world willingly bought from China and deserted their domestic factories and workers so they could make more money.

And societies allow it to happen because people willingly give up the future of their children to buy cheap plastic stuff today.

34 ( +36 / -2 )

We were expecting this.. and more to come from China.

Where is our Biden? 

Yes he is sleeping

When Trump was president the China was afraid of enacting such laws 

Now Trump is no more the President so China is going to encroach the Island 

I am sure JT will remove this post.

Why would such a shining example of eloquent fantasy be removed?

23 ( +31 / -8 )

Just a matter of time before something happens. Just hope that something will be a blip rather than the start of something far worse.

27 ( +27 / -0 )

Admirable restraint, I too am restraining my self from breaking down the fence on my neighbor's "property". I have a diary that says my great, great grand Pappy used to walk around that place, so clearly it is mine to do what I whish. (Regardless of what has transpired since then)

29 ( +31 / -2 )

Here we have two powerful nations arguing and could possibly miscalculate and end up fighting over an island, risking losing Human Lives and billions of $ , Failure to Communicate is the cause of all conflicts, so BOYS sit down and TALK for the sake of your nations future.

-15 ( +9 / -24 )

Napan must sent troops to stay on the senkakus with navy and air force patrolles as backup.

otherwise , one day soon, the dragon will do this. China must be stopped NOW

28 ( +31 / -3 )

We have definitely moved into the next phase. China will keep pushing and gaging reactions to plot its next moves. What the international community does in response will determine our entire future.

The big research question is, can there be dialog, cooperation and understanding with an ever flexing collectivist entity set on revenge for what it sees as a hundred years of humiliation? Within the ranks of the Chinese hawks the hatred of the west has become vitriol. They simply refuse to listen to a single thing that we say.

How does one align basic principles with such a determined, ambitious and calculated mindset? Problem is that by giving an inch, they will inevitably take a mile! This is what we have learnt over the past thirty or so years. We were duped big time.

How do you negotiate with this groupthink borg like entity, that cannot by nation even be seen to flinch? As things stand at the moment, you can’t.

Japan will be in the thick of it, they will either play the role of middle man or first line of defense! I hope they are up for the challenge.

29 ( +30 / -1 )

 I've urged both sides to come to a discussion table (a forum) to review the history of the islands once again with cool heads.

"I've?" "urged?" is your name Abe? We all know the results of his "urges". Find it extraordinarily difficult to believe that anyone here on JT has any ability to influence China. And if they did, they sure as hell wouldnt be posting about it here!

26 ( +26 / -0 )

China has become the wild dog that needs to be put on a leash and trained. They have caused so many problems on ALL fronts.

o Coronavirus Origins and lack of cooperation, promoting secrecy to the international community

o Continue introduction of fake goods including vaccines containing water, and fake PPE medical masks

o Fighting over territories not belonging to them in the seas of Japan, Philippines, and Taiwan

o Controlling Hong Kong

o Threatening to take over Taiwan

The only thing that I can recall China doing for the world is offering vaccines to some countries. But come on, would anyone that had any other option of taking a vaccine from any other country choose a vaccine from China? I'll bet even people in China would prefer taking vaccine from other countries. Feel very sorry for the people there that are controlled and censored by the CCP. Many of them do not know any difference or blind to it.

32 ( +35 / -3 )

Japan could start 'exercising restraint' by announcing it will not fire on Chinese ships if they stay out of Japanese territorial waters. Fishing vessels that enter territorial waters should be confiscated and sunk and crews should be returned after payment of fines. (This works effectively in Indonesia and Malaysia). Japan is not helping itself by inaction. China will simply keep creeping forward mm by mm until Japan discovers it has lost the Senkakus.

27 ( +28 / -1 )

Definitely the regional countries need to get together to stand up against the Chinese who are intent on bullying to get their own way in defiance of internationally acknowledged maritime rules. They simply cannot be allowed to make their own rules to suit their own.purposes or even bend them for the same ends.

23 ( +24 / -1 )

Do the hustleToday  07:48 am JST

I guess it's time to boycott its products

Good luck with that! Just have a look around you and count how many Chinese made products you are using. Say goodbye to your keyboard and monitor too. Oh, and your phone.

All that ended in 2020. Watch what happens in the next decade.

24 ( +24 / -0 )

They are unihabited Islands, No? If they are just give them to China. Who cares...they are Islands that are not even being used.

Potential of natural resources, under the ocean, fishing zones, territorial boundaries, and lets not forget, "just giving them back", is ludicrous beyond belief!

Also I would recommend studying the history too, they weren't always uninhabited, they were used as a coal refueling station in the past. Plus these "problems" with China didnt start up again like this, until the national government decided to purchase the islands from the original "owners". While they were in private hands, the Chinese government pretty much left them alone.

Ishihara Shintaro is largely to blame, nationalistic arse he was, and he facilitated the purchase of 3 of 5 of the islands, partially using donated funds, back in 2011 or 2012, if memory serves me right.

It's not about "using" the islands, it's about owning them.

22 ( +24 / -2 )

Ricky SanchezToday  07:39 am JST

They are unihabited Islands, No? If they are just give them to China. Who cares...they are Islands that are not even being used.

The argument that China wants the resources is a cover. Taiwan started the claim because it wanted fishing rights. This was settled between Japan and Taiwan. But China usurped the claim on their belief that Taiwan is part of China.

China's claim on the Senkakus is military, to break the First Island Chain and expand the Chinese PLA Navy's abilty to conftont the US Navy. Japan will not allow this, the United States will not allow this.

25 ( +25 / -0 )

Chinese "self restraint" is about as convincing as "democracy with Chinese characteristics"; like everything else that emanates from China, the definition is whatever the Party wants it to mean.

25 ( +25 / -0 )

Keep talking, boys. straight to the bottom, that’s where they go if the fail to “exercise @self-restraint.”

19 ( +19 / -0 )

Japan can respond by exercising self-restraints and peaceful programmes. Most effective is to let civilians as well as local fishers to land the islands just for fun or non-combatant activities. The government should sponsor a private picnicking with "GoTo" travelling subsidy....ups, bad timing yet.

More seriously, geologists or biologists are willing to conduct field inquires on Senkaku islands. It's a relevant reason the government can hardly reject. Regular visits and land use for peaceful purposes are significant to demonstrate the sovereignty.

20 ( +20 / -0 )

Leave the US out of this nonsense. Japan can deal with its own problems.

-26 ( +7 / -33 )

Fighto!Today  07:37 am JST

More lies from the Commies. Fortunately the QUAD Military force is ready to deal with them if they make just one aggressive move.

Ah yes we have the almighty QUAD worldwide famous and ready to protect us anytime.

Let’s be frank here,Australia can’t compete with the military combined forces of China and even Russia.

India is only following it’s interest and though they have a large army it’s far behind China.

Japan can’t even shoot an arrow if it’s an attack,so this basically leaves only the US.

A strong military coalition against China should be of course lead by the US,but with more credible and powerful allies like the UK,France,Germany,Italy.

And yes I agree with all of you that China is going to far and needs a stop.

But I don’t think the QUAD is going to make it happen.

-18 ( +4 / -22 )

China should excercise self-restraint over a lot of things. Not just disputed islands, but places like Hong Kong, Taiwan and Tibet. And of course, it should release the Uighur peoples from their camps.

More lies from the Commies.

I am sceptical of a lot of statements released from Beijing. Especially as they are about as communist as the GOP is.

27 ( +28 / -1 )

I think Tokyo's official stance as regards the Senkaku issue is that there's no dispute about the territoriality of the Senkakus. So they won't come to a "negotiation table" to discuss the sovereignty of the islands.

 What I'm proposing here, however, is a “civic-level forum” to discuss and review the whole issue from historical and international-law perspectives.

-19 ( +2 / -21 )

What is there to discuss with China? Japan hopes the US seventh fleet will join us in the hunt but it can not be depended upon. It might just take China attacking the US bases on Okinawa. This will determine if the USA is a friend or occupying power.

12 ( +14 / -2 )

Ishihara Shintaro is largely to blame, nationalistic arse he was, and he facilitated the purchase of 3 of 5 of the islands, partially using donated funds, back in 2011 or 2012, if memory serves me right.

Yes, with the intention that they be used to provoke war between the US and China. When he finally retired he claimed his greatest regret was that he hadn't been able to start another war with China. Japan's far right loves the US military because they want them to fight the war they can't fight themselves.

-10 ( +7 / -17 )

@YuriOtani

Stay out of the territorial waters of Japan or we will be forced to harpoon the offenders.

I have said it over and over; Japan can try to push out Chinese ships by ramming, but under no circumstance can Japan open fire first, because that leads to a full scale Chinese invasion. Think why Indian and Chinese troops are beating each other with clubs and stones, but never shoot, because first to shoot side takes all the blame for subsequent war.

Think of Japanese firing as the present day Mukden incident, but this time being used by China against Japan instead.

Remember, no one in East Asia recognize Japan's claims on Diaoyu Islands.

-26 ( +6 / -32 )

Sure thing @YuriOtani 11:55a JST “Stay out of the territorial waters of Japan or we will be forced to harpoon the offend...ing whales.

-15 ( +0 / -15 )

When he finally retired he claimed his greatest regret was that he hadn't been able to start another war with China. Japan's far right loves the US military because they want them to fight the war they can't fight themselves.

The war the can’t fight or win themselves.

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

Do as India did and strike back. Sink their ships. Again and again. This is Japan territory and by rights has imminent domain and defensive measures are on its side. The UK needs to take HK back since the CCP has already stated publicly the agreement is null and void and not following a guarantee of the agreement signed. Taiwan needs to declare itself INDEPENDENT before it is too late.

16 ( +17 / -1 )

Does it matter you forced Japan to sign Article 9? ?

We could have a military much stronger if America didn't get in the way. Now you complain? Typical.

Japan tried to get the Nuclear weapon after China got it.... Who told Japan No don't get the Nuke?

America told Japan No, we'll protect you with Nuclear Umbrella. You don't need it.

Now the Hypocrite wants to cry Japan is Not stronger, they might have to help protect Japan after 80+ years of promises to do so. After your country is directly responsible for Japan being in it's current position. Nice!

6 ( +9 / -3 )

@P.Smith 12:32p So then, + them so we can offset all the ‘flag waiving’, ‘Yankee Go Home’, ‘nationalistic’ Isolationists that can’t see what could be ‘on the Horizon’.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

What I'm proposing here, however, is a “civic-level forum” to discuss and review the whole issue from historical and international-law perspectives.

And your half-baked idea gives legitimacy to the claims that China is making regarding the islands.

Not to mention it would be a waste of time and money, as NOTHING would ever come from it. Neither Japan nor China pay anything other than lip service to any international laws.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

Does it matter you forced Japan to sign Article 9? ? 

We could have a military much stronger if America didn't get in the way. Now you complain? Typical.

Yeah! It’s not like you’ve had over 70 years to change the constitution. Instead of whining, take action.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

China will claim Japan fired the first shot even if China fires first. Their propaganda machine is already with the evidence Japan fired first. It is not a question of if China will fight but when? Second question will the seventh fleet help fight the Chinse aggressor?

15 ( +15 / -0 )

If you believe from the bottom of your heart that the Senkakus are your own sovereign territory, it's natural that Chinese citizens would loot and vandalize Japanese firms and shops operating in China and that its coast guard ships would patrol the Senkaku waters. 

The outcome of this would be an arms conflict and eventually a war. To prevent this from happening, a civic forum must be held to convince the Chinese public that their territorial claim on the basis of history and international law is not well-founded.

A teeth-to-teeth approach or resorting to arms would be no solution at all. What lessons have we learned from the Battle of Okinawa?

-11 ( +2 / -13 )

Never let the small island be the contentious issue that could become the fuse to a military conflict between China and Japan. Beijing is trying to restrain itself, so should Tokyo. No war, never..

Japan must not think that now it can fall back on QUAD for protection, it can start talking louder.

-14 ( +1 / -15 )

China just seems to be defending itself against Japanese/USA arrogance and aggression. I don't see the issue.

I don't agree with their attitude either, but it was started by America and Japan.

-19 ( +4 / -23 )

In fairness, *that *@12:46p comment* applies to ‘both sides’ of the sea*: “...all the ‘flag waiving’, ‘Yankee Go Home’, ‘nationalistic’ Isolationists that can’t see what could be ‘on the Horizon’. - ‘Peace’ all. -

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

china please stop being such an a-hole!!

As I have been saying for decades now, the LONGER we wait to DEAL with chinese aggression the higher the cost is going to BE!

15 ( +17 / -2 )

*You don’t say anything about IF ‘the neighbors’ are invited to Your ‘picnic’ *? *@noriahojanen 10:55 am JST - ‘Japan exercising self-restraint & peaceful programmes ..let civilians and local fishers land on the islands ‘just for fun or non-combatant *activities”.

- Sounds nice but we must always consider international protocols: “*Backyard parties are great opportunities to gather a crowd, with everyone pitching in. Usually, the hosts provide the main event- the steak, burgers, ribs, vegetables for grilling and the beverages, while guests bring sides dishes and desserts.” - It's up to you to ensure that the menu is balanced.”*

So, ‘before you start making phone calls or sending invites”, etiquette dictates we should first inform ‘in advance’, and/or extend ‘invitations to the neighbors’. Otherwise, it’s just rude.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

They should just go directly to the boxing ring and get the fight over with.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Remember, no one in East Asia recognize Japan's claims on Diaoyu Islands.

Apart from China, not one country on this planet considers the Senkakus to be Chinese.

All nations consider them either Japanese territory or under Japanese administration, they do not consider Japan as "having a claim" on them.

15 ( +17 / -2 )

@OssanAmerica

Apart from China, not one country on this planet considers the Senkakus to be Chinese.

Taiwan : Taiwan

ROK : Taiwan

North Korea : China

Russia : China

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

South Korea supports China on the Senkakus? Prove it.

Thats the same as China supporting Japan over the Liancourt Rocks.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

I only see two countries there on your list considering the Senkaku Islands to be Chinese.

China used the islands as markers on their trade routes to Okinawa. Does that mean that they then owned everything in the world that they once might have sighted?

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Sorry, @noriahojanen - @LK demanded we always cite the source: https://emilypost.com/advice/outdoor-entertaining-tips-and-ideas - “*the backyard barbecue is a quintessentially all-American way to entertain.”, “Have lots of coolers to keep foods cool, especially those with mayonnaise“* - Thanks, everyone. See you there!

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@OssanJapan

South Korea supports China on the Senkakus?

Taiwan, not China

Prove it.

The islands are known in Korea as Joedo(钓鱼岛, Diaoyu Islands pronounced in Korean), and the conflict as Joedo Conflicts, and is regarded as the territory of Republic of China that was supposed to have return to ROC per the terms of Japan's surrender.

-14 ( +1 / -15 )

@nandakandamanda

China used the islands as markers on their trade routes to Okinawa. 

No, the very name Diaoyu Islands(fishing Islands) shows the islands' usage to Taiwanese fishermen; it was a fertile fishing ground for Taiwanese fishermen for 500 years.

It was unknown to Okinawans due to Kuroshio current dividing Okinawa and Diaoyu Islands making the crossing very difficult with sailboats, but a smooth sailing from Taiwan.

Japanese didn't even know about its existence until they discovered it on British Navigation chart listed as Pinnacle Islands, and translated as Senkaku(Pinnacle) Islands.

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

It’s been pointed out by @SamitBasu 12:03p “Indian & Chinese troops beat each other with clubs & stones, but never shoot,...”

Interesting idea @oxycodin 2:44p “They should just go directly to the boxing ring and get the fight over with.”

but, this may lead to even more controversy and further disputes as to “Which is best: ‘Gung Fu, Tae Kwon do or Karate’?

There, you have it!  Maybe there should be ‘some type of international sporting event’ where many countries could gather ...  - Uh,... maybe not.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

@Samit Basu So, Senkakus are the issue among Japan and Taiwan and China's got nothing to do with it. right?

9 ( +10 / -1 )

If you believe from the bottom of your heart that the Senkakus are your own sovereign territory, it's natural that Chinese citizens would loot and vandalize Japanese firms and shops operating in China and that its coast guard ships would patrol the Senkaku waters. 

no, those riots were organized and operated by the china propaganda machine. most chinese wouldnt give a hoot about some random island and just want to go about their daily lives, but the ccp machine is well-oiled and makes sure everyone is behind the official party line.

The UK needs to take HK back since the CCP has already stated publicly the agreement is null and void and not following a guarantee of the agreement signed. Taiwan needs to declare itself INDEPENDENT before it is too late.

HK is lost, and even if china had fully honored its agreement, what you see happening now wouldve happened in 50 years anyway. UK doesnt have the power to take back HK anymore.

Taiwan might as well just maintain the status quo; they are for all intents and purpose independent already. They would easily be crushed if they over-provoke China, however a military invasion by China would indeed be the international flashpoint of the century--the world wont let it go like Russia did with Ukraine, especially given increasing negative perceptions of China in recent years and COVID.

China must realize that it is hated by all its immediate neighbours--you have to wonder what their end game is. they are going to get a bloody nose soon.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

So they haven't granted the coast guard authorization to use weapons. A bluff. Just as I thought.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Its good that the US, Japan, India, and Australia are forming a new alliance.

Except that it is not forming a new alliance. It is a group of like minded nations having meetings and some military exercises. All have an interest in maintaining a free and open Indo-Pacific and all resist an aggressive China making unilateral moves to alter the status quo. But it is not a formal alliance where if one nation is attacked the other three come to it's immediate aid militarily. Many wish it would form such an alliance like NATO but that is not yet on the cards. It should be but it is not. Please do not miss state the situation it leads to assumptions and that leads to more incorrect statement.

China needs to be contained if we are to keep a free and open world. China's idea of freedom is, do what the CCP says, when it says it, every time it says it or be severely punished one way or another. A cadre of old Chinese cronies want to make decisions for the way the whole world works, always with themselves at the top.

They believe it is their destiny. That can only end badly for everyone everywhere.

13 ( +13 / -0 )

The law explicitly allows the Chinese coast guard to use weapons against foreign ships it sees as illegally entering China's waters and raised concerns that the legislation would target Japanese vessels navigating around the uninhabited islets called Diaoyu in China.

It certainly will. I hope Japan has the stamina to establish a land presence on the Senkakus, in spite of screaming from Beijing. But the way things are going, the CCP is on a winning streak.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Taiwan is not an issue. They are not sending CG vessels into the Senkaku area every day and they have not passed any law authorizing the Taiwan CG to fire under the circumstances that China has. Taiwan which initially had the claim raised it for fishing rights and that has been resolved bilaterally between Taiwan and Japan.

The Senkakus were incorporated as Terra Nullius in 1895 by Japan in accordance with International law, and were never taken from anyone by war or otherwise. While territories to be handed over from Qing China to Japan in accordance with the Treaty of Shimonoseki are specified, the Senkakus were never included because no party considered them to be belonging to Qing China.

Chinese (PRC) maps right into the 1950s/60s showed the Senkakus to be part of Okinawa, a Prefecture of Japan. It is only after 1971 when China usurped Taiwan's claim that China began making concocted claims about previous ownership.

Because they were never taken by war, they were excluded from territories taken from other nations and returned to them after WWII. They were to be returned to Japan but Taiwan complained and the US established the islands as under Japanese adminstration.

Being that the Senkakus are part of Okinawa, which houses the largest US Military presence in Asia, the probabilty of China taking them through force without a direct conflict with the United States is zero. Especial;;y since China's goal is to break the First Island chain to challenge the U,S,

13 ( +15 / -2 )

As China has stated it’s self restraint, Japan should thank them nicely and reciprocate by publicly stating they will continue their self restraint in not sinking them.

Adopting a policy similar to Indonesia and Malaysia in response would be an effective push back.

Agreed the Genocide Olympics should be cancelled or at least taken away from them.

Japan needs to be firmer in its response but no not opening fire or sinking their vessels, agree with the post above referencing the Mukden incident.

12 ( +13 / -1 )

Taiwan is not an issue.

Not true.

I had to fact check because I was told by a Japanese in the foreign ministry that China is not only one who claims the Senkaku’s. Taiwan President Asserts Sovereignty Over Disputed Islands Claimed by Japan and China. This was the title of an article dated June 2020. Apparent it’s not merely fishing rights

Taiwan which initially had the claim raised it for fishing rights and that has been resolved bilaterally between Taiwan and Japan.

Perhaps to head off a possible China-Taiwan collusion and with US nudging, Japan signed a fishery agreement with Taiwan in April 2013— the first concession over the island quarrel after seventeen futile previous rounds of negotiation. Taiwanese boats can now operate freely in a 7,400-square-kilometer area around these islands.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

President Xi, the world's newest megalomaniac.

14 ( +14 / -0 )

Peter14

China needs to be contained if we are to keep a free and open world.

True, but it is not happening. With the pro-Beijing swamp in power in Western Europe and the US, nobody is standing up to them. Moscow is forced into an uneasy alliance with the CCP because the anti-Russian warmongering by the Western establishment, and the 3rd world is systematically enslaved by the CCP with their "aid" i.e. extortion programs.

Things do not look good for the free world, long term.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

quercetumToday  07:46 pm JST

Taiwan is not an issue.

Not true.

I had to fact check because I was told by a Japanese in the foreign ministry that China is not only one who claims the Senkaku’s. Taiwan President Asserts Sovereignty Over Disputed Islands Claimed by Japan and China. This was the title of an article dated June 2020. Apparent it’s not merely fishing rights

It's very true. Unless Taiwan is sending it's CG ships to the Senkakus, Taiwanese fishung boats are ramming JCG ships, and Taiwan has authorized firing on ships in areas it claims. Taiwan's claim has nothing to do with territorial expansion or an agenda seeking regional dominance.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

President Xi, the world's newest megalomaniac.

that term brings to mind fist shaking, cold-sweating, cursing ala hitler or stalin style, but big boss Xi looks so entirely bored in every tv appearance, you wonder who is really pulling the strings behind the scenes...

7 ( +7 / -0 )

With out ‘Mr. T’ to have Japans back the CCP will make moves with impunity.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

Margaret Thatcher wanted to hang on to Hong Kong. Xiaoping told her that China could take the territory back today if it wanted to and no one could stop them. Thatcher replied that yes, China could do that but the whole world would see what China was all about, and that gave the little man pause. I suspect that same sentiment still gives pause to China's leadership.

11 ( +11 / -0 )

@OssanJapan

they have not passed any law authorizing the Taiwan CG to fire under the circumstances that China has.

Why would they? Diaoyu Islands are Taiwanese territory under Taiwan's law already.

The Senkakus were incorporated as Terra Nullius in 1895 by Japan in accordance with International law,

Stop making this "Terra Nullius" false claims already, as none of these disputed islands were "Terra Nullius" by the time Japan declared them. They were nothing more than an instrument by which the Empire of Japan used to lay claim on somebody else's islands.

Being that the Senkakus are part of Okinawa, which houses the largest US Military presence in Asia, the probability of China taking them through force without a direct conflict with the United States is zero.

Well, ask Ukraine how the US honored the territorial integrity guarantee that the US signed as a part of Ukraine giving up its nukes.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

For all "JT military experts" thinking China will simply take a stroll in the Senkakus:

"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZZ1prD60MU"

-12 ( +8 / -20 )

With the pro-Beijing swamp in power in Western Europe and the US, nobody is standing up to them

Nobody in Western Europe or the US is "pro Beijing". Speaking such nonsense only emboldens Chinese trolls to keep up the propaganda.

7 ( +11 / -4 )

Can Japan and China innovate and change this bad old behavior of fighting and make a historical act by making an agreement to share these islands? Grown up minds, great leaders build peace, learn to leave the past in the past and write a new history of cooperation, aiming the future of mankind.

-7 ( +5 / -12 )

If you believe from the bottom of your heart that the Senkakus are your own sovereign territory, it's natural that Chinese citizens would loot and vandalize Japanese firms and shops operating in China and that its coast guard ships would patrol the Senkaku waters. 

Fortunately the world is not run by "feelings" and the naivety of the comment here just shows to me the lack of understanding of the situation.

People do not suddenly up and riot, without a reason, particularly Chinese, you REALLY have your head in the sand if you dont think the government orchestrated the protests.

The outcome of this would be an arms conflict and eventually a war. To prevent this from happening, a civic forum must be held to convince the Chinese public that their territorial claim on the basis of history and international law is not well-founded.

Again, ludicrous, naïve, and childish to believe or even think that any "civil" forum is going to solve anything here. This is another sign of weakness and lack of understanding of the issues.

You want proof that China would care or listen? Talk to the people of Vietnam and Philippines about that little island China suddenly built in their territorial waters.

The ONLY reason China doesnt play that crap here, is thanks to "Big Brother" having Japan's back!

Oh and your ideas would have us all singing Kumbaya in Chinese, at some reeducation camp!

10 ( +11 / -1 )

The Japanese believe the Senkakus are Japan's inherent territory and hence it was natural the Japanese government bought three islands in the chain from a private owner and nationalized them. The Chinese, on the other hand, believe these islands are an integral part of China and hence it thinks the Japanese government's actions are illegal, whereby it regularly sends its Coast Guard ships to the Senkaku waters to demonstrate its claim to the islands.

Whose belief or claim is correct? Should the conflict of claims be solved only by force as you suggest?

-11 ( +0 / -11 )

It's very true. Unless Taiwan is sending it's CG ships to the Senkakus, Taiwanese fishung boats are ramming JCG ships, and Taiwan has authorized firing on ships in areas it claims. Taiwan's claim has nothing to do with territorial expansion or an agenda seeking regional dominance.

It’s misleading for your post to suggest Japan and Taiwan have resolved the island dispute because of a fishing agreement signed in 2013. If that were true the President of Taiwan would not have asserted sovereignty over the islands last year 2020.

You write “it’s not an issue” but you don’t explain why Taiwan still claim the islands. The fact is the island dispute has not been resolved and is still an issue between Taiwan and Japan.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Then again try looking at it from China's point of view. They are being pushed into a corner. It may be that their only option is to surrender to the US hegemony or fight! Is it the bible that teaches on death ground fight! No it is  Sun Tzu's The Art of War. In any event Japan needs to resist Chinese invasion. The only option is to go against the desires of the American government and somehow make peace with China. I just do not see such a path.

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

The Japanese believe the Senkakus are Japan's inherent territory and hence it was natural the Japanese government bought three islands in the chain from a private owner and nationalized them.

What are you talking about? There was no "need" to purchase them from the owner, and was done ONLY to inflame China.

There is nothing natural about it! They could have been nationalized without purchasing them as well.

It is Japanese territory, nothing "inherent" or otherwise!

Should the conflict of claims be solved only by force as you suggest?

Never suggested anything, and life is "white and black" as you obviously think. There is no way in hell a "civic" discussion is going to change anything as you keep repeating!

As I noted, if there was no US Military alliance here, those islands and Taiwan would have been invaded by China years ago.

You know it too, just can't admit it, because then everything else you preach about would be meaningless and lies!

10 ( +11 / -1 )

If you claim a find is yours and want to retrieve it at a police station, you have to show the evidence of why it's yours. Simply claiming the find is yours won't help return the find to you. It's in this sense that I am saying dialog is needed between the two sides to solve this territorial issue.

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

How terribly inconvenient it is for China having other countries in this world. Unfortunately I think they will do their utmost to resolve that issue at some point.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

Surprising there're four negative valuations on my post! Are they jingoists who favor the use of force over dialog to solve international disputes?

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

For all "JT military experts" thinking China will simply take a stroll in the Senkakus:

Yes, China can.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/07/28/asia/japan-china-fighter-jet-scrambles-intl-hnk-dst/index.html

4 ( +8 / -4 )

Then again try looking at it from China's point of view. They are being pushed into a corner. 

are they? no one is trying to steal territory from china, or shift borders by constructing outposts on their doorsteps (India might be an exception).

it seems that China is just repeating the actions of imperial Japan in the early 20th century...trying to secure enough resources to satisfy its bulging population by stepping over smaller players.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

@tokyo-star

it seems that China is just repeating the actions of imperial Japan in the early 20th century...trying to secure enough resources to satisfy its bulging population by stepping over smaller players.

Diaoyu Islands are different because they are covered by the Cairo declaration which Japan has accepted as the term of surrender. Hence the Republic of China is legal owner of Diaoyu Islands.

The only dispute to resolve is who this "Republic of China" is. Taiwan claims to be the Republic of China, still kicking and alive, while China claims itself to be the successor state of the Republic of China which China claims has disappeared in 1948 and PROC has inherited all the rights of the Republic of China.

-12 ( +2 / -14 )

If you claim a find is yours and want to retrieve it at a police station, you have to show the evidence of why it's yours.

How naïve, to even state this. One thing, which you conveniently side-stepped here, is the fact that neither side accepts the right of the "police" to adjudicate it in the first place.

It's in this sense that I am saying dialog is needed between the two sides to solve this territorial issue.

No, plain and simple, it's nonsense.

11 ( +11 / -0 )

Surprising there're four negative valuations on my post! Are they jingoists who favor the use of force over dialog to solve international disputes?

Typically an adult here does not care about "thumbs up" or "thumbs down". They write their opinions, and like the real world, not everyone is going to agree with your opinion. That's life.

It's also shows immaturity to assume that because people dont agree, they are automatically stating they are talking about using force to settle the dispute.

They just dont like what you have to write here, plain and simple. Never safe to assume why, when no comments are made in reply.

As I have stated numerous times on numerous posts, be happy that people are a least acknowledging that they have read your post.

13 ( +13 / -0 )

The Cairo Declaration states:

"Japan shall be stripped of all the islands in the Pacific which she has seized or occupied since the beginning of the first World War in 1914, and that all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese, such as Manchuria, Formosa, and The Pescadores, shall be restored to the Republic of China."

The First WW started in 1914. The Senkakus were incorporated as Japanese territory in January 1895 after a thorough search to see if any nation owned them in accordance with proper international protocol which included whether they were registered anywhere as part of Taiwan or China. As no nation claimed them the islands were incorporated as Terra Nullius. No nation raised a claim to the Senkakus unti 1971.

The Senkakus were never "stolen" from anybody, and were not listed in the Chinese territories to be handed over to Japan in accordance with the Treaty of Shimonoseki signed in April of 1895.

For these reasons, the WWII Allied Powers saw fit to exclude them from territories to be taken away from Japan at the end of WWII.
12 ( +14 / -2 )

Rest assured, JP is not the only power concerned over recent strong tobac in the southern waters.

Declaring borders to ones liking is not doable in the 21st. Already the old powers of Europe consider naval presence globally again.

10 ( +10 / -0 )

No more Chinese Communist Party fascism please. Thank you. It’s bad enough what they are doing in their own territory

11 ( +12 / -1 )

"Yes, China can."

Yes, they can, especially with you in charge of strategy.

There is something called a map. Check it out in order to see China's predicament and Japan's advantage in any maritime scuffle with Japan.

You may learn something.

Geography is everything is this tussle and Japan is in charge.

China's 2 million-man army will not be nowhere near the battlefield.

-9 ( +9 / -18 )

@OssanJapan

The First WW started in 1914.

And you missed the second part.

all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese, such as Manchuria, Formosa, and The Pescadores, shall be restored to the Republic of China."

Territories of the Republic of China is separate from the 1914 clause.

The Diaoyu Islands, as periphery islands of Formosa(Taiwan) is covered by the Cairo Declaration, and Japan has a legal obligation to return them to the Republic of China.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Yubaru,

Sorry, you're simply misunderstanding me here. We are discussing the Senkaku issue, not the Futenma relocation issue.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Samit Basu Mar. 15 11:07 pm JST

The Diaoyu Islands, as periphery islands of Formosa(Taiwan) is covered by the Cairo Declaration, and Japan has a legal obligation to return them to the Republic of China.

You say so yourself. Cairo "Declaration". And I emphasize that word.

A declaration is not a treaty. And it has no legal coverage, nor jurisprudence. It is only a statement of intent. In fact, The Cairo Declaration. It is actually a basic draft of the future San Francisco Treaty of 1951.

It is precisely this treaty. The one that confers legal personality. And it is the one that determines that the Senkaku Islands belong to Japan. And not to Taiwan. As you desperately try to claim.

And what's more. It is the Treaty of San Francisco that legally incorporates the Senkaku Islands into Okinawa Prefecture.

If we speak in legal terms. A declaration. It is basically a political statement or intentions. And it has no jurisdictional rank, unlike international treaties. 

Any discussion of more. These are terms that enter into the morality of each person. I only stick to the current legality in force.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

@doughehead13

Cairo "Declaration". And I emphasize that word.

https://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/hirohito.htm

Emperor Hirohito, Accepting the Potsdam Declaration, Radio Broadcast. 

We have ordered our Government to communicate to the Governments of the United States, Great Britain, China and the Soviet Union that our empire accepts the provisions of their joint declaration.

Potsdam Declaration includes all the provisions of Cairo Declaration, and Emperor Hirohito has accepted Cairo Declaration on August 15th, 1945.

 It is the Treaty of San Francisco that legally incorporates the Senkaku Islands into Okinawa Prefecture

Actual text of the San Francisco Treaty says the opposite.

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Treaty_of_San_Francisco

Article 2

(b) Japan renounces all right, title and claim to Formosa and the Pescadores.

Article 3

Japan will concur in any proposal of the United States to the United Nations to place under its trusteeship system, with the United States as the sole administering authority, Nansei Shoto south of 29° north latitude (including the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands), Nanpo Shoto south of Sofu Gan (including the Bonin Islands, Rosario Island and the Volcano Islands) and Parece Vela and Marcus Island. Pending the making of such a proposal and affirmative action thereon, the United States will have the right to exercise all and any powers of administration, legislation and jurisdiction over the territory and inhabitants of these islands, including their territorial waters.

Interpretation

1) Japan has officially given up all claims to Formosa and its periphery islands, aka Diaoyu Islands.

2) List of retained Japanese territories under US administration doesn't list Diaoyu Islands, as they have been reverted back to the Republic of China.

This is why Taiwan wants to take Japan to ICJ and Japan refuses, because Japan is guaranteed to lose 100%.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

@dougthehead13

"https://treaties.un.org/doc/publication/unts/volume%20136/volume-136-i-1832-english.pdf"

Check CH II

Art. 2(b)

Art. 3

That's all you need.

Please let me know if you find any mention of Senkakus in there.

-9 ( +7 / -16 )

thepersoniamnowMar. 14  07:24 am JST

Being a bully again.

China does not want to fight everyone for real.

Its good that the US, Japan, India, and Australia are forming a new alliance.

Maybe with SK too? And the Phillipines by their location always has been benefical strategally as well.

> vanityofvanitiesMar. 14  07:27 am JST

It is easy to solve the problem. Let a U.S. nuclear aircraft carrier patrol the area regularly. Japan and other related countries will pay expenses. Not just the sea near Senkaku but also the territorial seas of the South Eastern nations including Taiwan.

One or two US nuclear aircraft carrier carry a lot of jets and can refuel/restock jets for several runs. Two or three carriers in the Mediterrean were used in such a manner for the Libya War of 1985- 1986, again in 2011, Bosnia in the 90s, and so forth. And their sheer presence has also prevented wars as well.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

The Three Great Allies are fighting this war to restrain and punish the aggression of Japan. They covet no gain for themselves and have no thought of territorial expansion. It is their purpose that Japan shall be stripped of all the islands in the Pacific which she has seized or occupied since the beginning of the first World War in 1914, and that all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese, such as Manchuria, Formosa, and The Pescadores, shall be restored to the Republic of China. Japan will also be expelled from all other territories which she has taken by violence and greed. The aforesaid three great powers, mindful of the enslavement of the people of Korea, are determined that in due course Korea shall become free and independent."

Samit Basu

That is the declaration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_Cairo_Declaration (What 1914 "clause" are you referencing here)

Here is your comment: Provide some link or research to support this:

Territories of the Republic of China is separate from the 1914 clause.

The Diaoyu Islands, as periphery islands of Formosa(Taiwan) is covered by the Cairo Declaration, and Japan has a legal obligation to return them to the Republic of China.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Samit BasuToday  03:07 am JST

This is why Taiwan wants to take Japan to ICJ and Japan refuses, because Japan is guaranteed to lose 100%.

Japan, by being a signatory to the Agreement that recognizes ICJ jurisdiction and ICJ rulings can not refuse to answer any claim brought against it at the ICJ.

Japan is not playing the game that South Korea has been playing since 1952 with the Liancourt Rocks.

10 ( +11 / -1 )

1) Japan has officially given up all claims to Formosa and its periphery islands, aka Diaoyu Islands.

Read the treaty, The islands were not included in the treaty, as they were always considered Japanese territory, hence never being mentioned in any treaties.

Periphery islands were not the Senkakus!

2) List of retained Japanese territories under US administration doesn't list Diaoyu Islands, as they have been reverted back to the Republic of China.

No, because they are called and referred to as being the Senkaku Islands. You are pulling at straws and are wrong. You have no factual evidence to back up your claims here. If they had been "returned" as you claim, then there would have been no justification or reason for the US to have administered the islands.

Your claims make no sense,

 The United States administered the islands as part of the United States Civil Administration of the Ryukyu Islands from 1945 until 1972, when the islands returned to Japanese control under the Okinawa Reversion Agreement between the United States and Japan

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senkaku_Islands

This is why Taiwan wants to take Japan to ICJ and Japan refuses, because Japan is guaranteed to lose 100%.

This makes no sense whatsoever. No one is stopping Taiwan from taking Japan to the ICJ. Taiwan can take them to the ICJ as much a they want, Japan is not stopping them. I have no idea what logic you are using here to even state this. Using your logic, Japan would have to agree to be "taken to the ICJ" for a ruling.

That's like stating a thief has to "agree" to be taken to court, even though they stole your car! If they dont agree, then no need to go to court.

Taiwan KNOWS they will lose, otherwise it would have already done so.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

Still a peaceful ending is much preferred to a military conflict. I do not think the People's Republic will do very well. Japan has ships and weapons systems that are identical to the Americans, Then the 7th fleet will join the SDF. Really are these islands worth a war?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Then the 7th fleet will join the SDF. Really are these islands worth a war?

Actually the SDF will follow the lead of the US Navy. Japan has no current experience in a shooting war!

4 ( +4 / -0 )

China's claim on the Senkakus is military, to break the First Island Chain and expand the Chinese PLA Navy's abilty to conftont the US Navy. Japan will not allow this, the United States will not allow this

Alas, with the swamp back in power in the US, Japan (or anyone else, most worryingly Taiwan) can not count on the US to stand up to Beijing for the next 4 years. Japan better grow some backbone, otherwise will wake up and and find Chinese presence on the Senkakus one morning.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

China says it is exercising self-restraint against Japanese ships near Senkakus

OMG! That a favorite standard Japanese phrase!

0 ( +1 / -1 )

One thing that is abundantly clear: The US will come to the aid of Japan if the Senkaku's were to be taken by force:

In 2021, aweek after his inauguration, President Joe Biden and Prime Minister Yoshihide Suga ina telephone call discussed “the United States’ unwavering commitment to the defense of Japan under Article 5 of our security treaty, which includes the Senkaku Islands.” In his first conversation with his Japanese counterpart as Secretary of Defense, Lloyd Austin also reaffirmed the application of Article 5 to the Senkakus. Austin added, “[T]he United States opposes unilateral moves to change the status quo.”

Source: https://fas.org/sgp/crs/row/R42761.pdf

The above is from the Congressional Research Service. Not the distorted news media.

I do applaud the gentleman Makoto Shimizu, for trying to explain that the proper and best way through this is peace. It always will be. But China does not honor agreements nor treaties.

And#VoiceofOkinawa - Please change your user name. You are not the voice for the people, just a foreigner that wishes they were of Ryukyu heritage. Your answers to issues like this are not helpful nor factual. That is why you are downvited. Especially with an agressive foe that has already bullied the Philippines and Vietnam in the Paracels and Spratleys. There will be no sit down and agreements with China. The only thing they understand is brute force. I don't advocate war, but unfortunately that is all they respond to.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

It's more like exercising aggression.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Japan should have friendly talks with Taiwan, ROC on how to properly resolve the island territorial dispute.

Nippon knows too well that those isles were teeming with tombstones of Ilan fisherfolks, especially of the Chang and Hsieh clans when Imperial Japan 'surveyed' the area back then.

There were also thirteen stone markers delineating the land boundaries of the Ilan folks there all of which were destroyed by the Japanese together with the desecration and total destruction of the graves obviously to delete any form of evidence.

In fact there were hush-hush ramblings amongst the families of the Japanese team that built a lighthouse over a grave that many got sick and suffered from various mental and psychiatric ailments .

Fortunately, Ilan and Keelung fishermen association records shows there are still extant graves inside caves and besides cliffs and at least four land markers that escaped Japanese destruction.

Obviously these documents are now top state assets and a viable secret weapon!

The statement by China sayin they are 'exercising self-restraint' in the area is already a game changer of sorts.

It means their ships will remain but will not fire first. So if Japan will not make the first salvo then Beijington will already achieved victory via a tactical draw.

Nippon should do the right thing and re-establish diplomatic ties with friendly Taiwan, ROC. Never mind if the USA will still cling to her exclusive 'only diplomatic love ' with China and 'forget' Taipei dogma!

That's what secret partners with China does anyways!

Tokyo therefore must return to her ways of the Bushido Spirit and do the morally righteous act of being a loyal friend of the very Japanese- friendly Taiwanese people.

Re-establish ties with Taipei and quickly solve the island issue together before the PROC makes its next move.

I'm da-kine pretty sure that PM Suga would prefer shaking hands with Lady President English Tsai rather than 'you- know- who' so why not go for it asap!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

China may soon realize that the USA is exercising GREAT restraint by not turning Beijing into a flat glass city and sending their country back into the stone age similar to Afghanistan and Iran.

The USA can be a Big Bully too if need be.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

When China first tested the territorial boundaries by sending fishing boats back in late 90's and early 2000's. Japan should have been so timid and should have sunk those ships. Just kept escalating after that incident. Even now, with China's bad behavior, Japan is too timid and situation keeps escalating. I think war with China is inevitable, just a matter of time.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"China may soon realize that the USA is exercising GREAT restraint by not turning Beijing into a flat glass city and sending their country back into the stone age"

Though my military and country have the agility to so. And I am assuming you are hinting towards a nuclear war?

@ Carl N Jpn Gcjp. This is an just a moronic course with China as they are nuclear as well.

@Nobumasa san, that is an outcome that should be explored with China greatly and your strategy makes sense to me. As a former military strategist. I would be looking at sanctions like never seen before. and total economic full on war. I would starve them out.

There is only one way to win a Chinese war. Strength in numbers.

Full destruction from with in. That's it. Cut them off and starve them to death. The Chinese people will rise and over throw the the current regime. The real power of China is its normal everyday oppressed worker.

If history teaches us anything. People will rise against the government if government has gone to far.

The islands are already lost. ((((New Flash))))

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Slickdrifter Do you understand the "M.A.D." Strategy with regard to nuclear weapons?? If not, you might want to do some reading. It has worked very well over many years. The choice might be for China to decide: is it really worth it to them (China) to risk a nuclear confrontation over the Islands??

When they know we (US & Japan) have advanced anti-missile defenses (AGIES), SM-3, and strike capabilities that they cannot defend against.

Of course the US will explore applying more sanctions etc... etc..,, but if China should pursue capturing Islands they will have a very serious choice to make.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

If Japan returned them back to China and both sign a non-aggression pact, perhsps Japan could escale back in buying overpriced military hardware. This is the easiest way to fleece a country’s wealth from within.

According to scholar Martin Lohmeyer, these islands basically belong to China. In his these published on line, he presents certain documents to prove his point.

https://ir.canterbury.ac.nz/handle/10092/4085

In my opinion, by holding on to them while Okinawa was occupied, and later allowing Japan to administer them, the US kept a cash cow. This by way of the continued tensions and the need to resolve all issues through arms sales. I am not favoring any side. But it is natural for expats married to Chinese to side with China and for those married to Japanese to side with Japan. It is about affinity. Even some Japanese scholars side with China on the issue. But because they are members of the Communist party, their opinions will have little credibility.

They are Tadayoshi Murata and Kiyoshi Inoue. http://www.skycitygallery.com/japan/diaohist.html

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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