'Comfort woman' statue at Sydney church upsets Japanese-Australian community

“We consider this is a huge intimidation to the Japanese nationals,” Yamaoka said in a statement from Tokyo.

He also said in a TV interview that Japanese just want to forget what happened in the war and move on... what he forgot to say is that the Japanese tend to remember the parts that suit them and prefer to forget the rest...

That section makes it unlawful for someone to do an act that is reasonably likely to “offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate” someone because of his or her race or ethnicity.

Ironic that the Japanese would use THAT seeing how their denial is exactly an act that is reasonably likely to “offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate” someone because of his or her race or ethnicity.

We consider this is a huge intimidation to the Japanese nationals,” Yamaoka said in a statement from Tokyo

Really. Well, we consider the Uyoku Dantai a huge intimidation to foreign nationals here in Tokyo. Any chance you are going to take steps to force them to disband?

the Japanese tend to remember the parts that suit them and prefer to forget the rest... Alas, don't we all!

But we don't deny them.

As you can see, the Japanese expats living in Australia (of which there are far more than Australians living in Japan) have a voice when they feel that they are being discriminated against - unlike Australians living in Japan.

Of course. Australia is a democratic country with human rights. Japan isn't. At all.

As you can see, the Japanese expats living in Australia (of which there are far more than Australians living in Japan) have a voice when they feel that they are being discriminated against - unlike Australians living in Japan. Their complaint will be taken seriously by the Aust. Human Rights Commission. Alas, I would doubt the findings will change anything. It is a fact of history as alluded to here:

Tokyo has promised a 1 billion yen ($1 million) fund as a way to atone for its wartime sexual abuse of South Korean comfort women.

Denying and revising your history defies the spirit of atonement.

Sorry no dice - the statue is located at a church, not the Intl. Arrivals lobby and in addition it is a statue of an innocent girl not a North Korean propaganda poster of someone bayoneting a baby.

The comfort women are a fact not a myth, and if that's discomforting for some Japanese tourists then, well - rough life, imagine what is was like for those forced into sexual slavery

Reality is becoming more and more distorted around the world by professional spin. Japan will be more successful at revising it's past so personally I think it's good that there are reminders. AND this does not blame Japanese individuals for actions the country took in a war 70+ years ago.

I hope they rule to allow the statue to stay.

(And I care very much for Japan - just not it's revisionist history right-wingers)

the Japanese tend to remember the parts that suit them and prefer to forget the rest...

Alas, don't we all!

'Comfort woman' statue at Sydney church upsets Japanese-Australian community

correction:

'Comfort woman' statue at Sydney church upsets revisionist Australia-Japan Community Network

Here's an ABC report on the issue, where one AJCN member refutes the comfort women narrative, and Yamaoka complains about the wider global sexual slavery awareness campaign:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-14/japanese-group-launches-18c-case-against-uniting-church/8117234

Here's AJCN's website, complete with links to Texas Daddy and other revisionist material:

http://jcnsydney-en.blogspot.jp/p/about-jcn.html

The truth hurts ay.

The Australia-Japan Community Network website contains a link to the "Texas Daddy" website hosted by Tony Marano who is an active supporter of Japan's nationalists. The AJCN's link to that website alone suggests that the AJCN is a fairly repulsive organization.

That's a shame. Before now, I thought the AJCN played a positive role in Australia-Japan relations. I'm disappointed.

Never forget your past, no matter how offensive it is. It should serve as a guide for your future.

Imagine for a moment you are a British citizen... and you are on holiday in India. How would you feel if people everywhere kept reminding you of how bad your ancestors were during the Raj?

I am British, I have been to India; Britain isn't in the habit of denying what it did in India, so India isn't in the habit of reminding them. Fairly simple really.

Mr. Yamaoka is nothing more than a rightwing hack.

http://jcnsydney-en.blogspot.jp/?m=1

So no, Mr. Yamaoka likely has 0 problem with A bomb memorials.

CH3 - thank you.

I'm aware of all you presentes, esp Professor Park.

Simply I'm saying that the denial of any wrongdoings by parties here, gives access to those who wish to challenge that.

War is War. Horror happens. There can be no denying that "some" atrocities were committed by the IJA (as were some committed by others). No one is squeaky clean.

So coming to terms with that - rather than engaging in incessant nit-picking about correct figures to the nth - and accepting that and moving on without falling back onto questioning again and again and again resulting in refutation, would yield over time a better result for all concerned.

If you think the denialist strategy is the way to go - then I'm afraid seated chair statues et al will proliferate for a long time to come.

Wiping away the sincere apologies of remorseful politicians with blanket denials is oil on a fire. If you think I'm wrong, print this out and re-read it again in 10 years and see what progress has been made.

Ch3CHO: "So, they promised to take care of the statute in Seoul."

Nowhere did they PROMISE to do anything of the sort. You can"t even correctly comment on that which you quote, can you? It said, in what you directly quoted, that they will "strive to resolve the issue". STRIVE to resolve, not even an Abe vow to do so. The statue has been placed there by a civic group and they are unwilling to remove it for good reason, so strive as the government might, legally they cannot force them. So, you fail, again.

People are called deniers because they deny what happened. You are called that because you have in the past denied it. But, if you like, here's a chance to clear your name: please go ahead and admit that Japan coerced women into sexual slavery. It is a well-known fact, so if you can't admit it, you are in denial. It's not a "strategy" or a "way to go" it is simply fact.

And if you don't think trees can be memorials, better head up north and chop down the husk that is called the "miracle tree" for surviving the 3/11 disasters, my friend.

The question is if you admit that you are responsible for the atrocities your nation did.

No.

The FIRST question is... do you accept that your country committed terrible deeds in the past.

(I accept that my country has committed many).

The SECOND question is... what exactly, in your opinion, are those terrible deeds?

(I can list many such atrocities committed by own country)

The THIRD question is... are you willing to talk about your country's atrocities with people from other countries?

(I am more than willing to do so... particularly with those countries that were victims of my country's awful actions)

Basically, I think many Japanese are not willing to talk about their country's atrocities.

Instead, I think they are happy with the current situation.

They can spend all their time denying the comfort women, Nanking, etc... spend all their time nitpicking details about this... spend all their time complaining about how unfair the Tokyo War Crime Trials were... spend all their time promoting victimhood about Hiroshima and Nagasaki...

It's a wonderful situation for this type of Japanese person.

Because they can spend all their time doing these things, they don't have to spend any time considering what atrocities their country may have committed.

We can see that they enjoy this comfortable existence of denying and nitpicking.

It means they never have to face the uncomfortable dark side of what Japan may have done.

Japanese people sometimes say to me... oh Japan did many bad things during the war.

When I ask, "Exactly what "very bad things" did Japan do?" they will never tell me exactly what.

It's ridiculous and childish... and we can see the same behavior here with CH3CHO and tinawatanabe.

We can observe them enjoying their existence of denying and nitpicking and never having to think about any atrocities that Japan may have committed... (I mean atrocities that have been researched and confirmed by Japanese historians).

Well, just as an example, how about the way the lepers on Nauru Island were treated by the Japanese military?

Here is an account:

http://apjjf.org/-Yuki-Tanaka/3441/article.html

It's funny but there is no mention of this at all on the Japanese language entry for Nauru on Wikipedia.

Why is that?

Yamaoka doesn't seem to deny that many comfort women were victims of sexual slavery, unlike many others with a revisionist agenda these days. However, he does make some abhorrent remarks such as, "The Japanese government was forced to establish comfort stations for occupying soldiers as thousands of rape incidents were reported in the first month or two of the occupation after the WWII."

In his press release, Yamaoka writes, "the group called Chon Dae Hyup based in Seoul [is] erecting such statues all over the world." The irony of course is that Japanese interests have been actively encouraging the setting up of Hiroshima/Nagasaki monuments worldwide for decades now. A quick Google search turned up no fewer than 50 such monuments worldwide outside of Japan for Hiroshima, and there are hundreds of Holocaust memorials worldwide.

I wonder if Yamaoka would be against setting up Hiroshima monuments outside Japan on the same grounds of divisiveness/discrimination, or setting up Holocaust memorials outside of Germany on those grounds. Something tells me he would be OK with those monuments. Hypocrisy.

Here is Yamaoka's press release: http://jcnsydney-en.blogspot.jp/ Here is an ABC Australia segment on this, with an interviews of Yamaoka and Crews (8'07"): http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-14/japanese-group-launches-18c-case-against-uniting-church/8117234

What should upset the Japanese community, and all of Japan, is the white-washing of history it's government not only pushes on its people, but tries to fob off on the world and then play victim. There are posters on here who LITERALLY say it's Korea's fault their people were raped and murdered, and China's fault this and other massacres occurred; that Japan was DEFENDING those nations. THat's if they ever acknowledge anything happened.

If Japan acknowledged history (I'm not saying current people need feel sorry about it save the deniers) statues recognizing it in defiance of Japan's denial would not be going up EVERYWHERE.

Like I have been saying for ages here, Japan reaps what it sews with its 7+decades of denial & counting, its overall insincerity when it comes to the many atrocities Japan committed is WHY these statues are going up!

Japan should have LONG ago admitted its history then neither China or the Korea(s) or other countries that have beefs could complain>

BUT NO Japan harps about Hiroshima & Nagasaki constantly but prefers to deny pretty much everything else WWII related.

IF Japan had owned its history, it could simply say that THAT Japan was then, it is no longer who/what we are & PROUDLY carry on

But alas Japan has taken the low road & watching all the denials it pains me to see Japan & Japanese getting it horribly STILL in 2016!!

This is entirely on Japan, its their decision & these are some of the consequences simple as that, DEAL with it, or not, choice is yours.

The problem is that the Japanese do not have a non biased view of their own history! The colonization of Korea and the subsequent authoritarian regime's action is the reason why there is a statue-maybe the Japanese in Australia are ignorant of that fact? And the Japanese there are initiating an action under Race Laws?

How ironic when Japan has none of its own.......

CH3CHO:

Belfast. It is the other way around.

from that same link:

During the ceremony, representatives from Belfast, Coventry, Hiroshima and Berlin threw pebbles from their respective countries into the statue's surrounding water garden, where stone boulders bear the names of those cities.

Is Belfast commemorating Okinomiyaki, then?

the link does not work

Check your settings. All the links are fine on my machine.

London, It is just a tree.

A tree can't be a memorial? Really?

Staffordshire It looks more like a war trophy than a memorial

Once again, from the BBC link:

It forms the centrepiece of a memorial to the victims of the two atomic bombings on Japan during World War II.

The original question:

Hiroshima/Nagasaki memorials all over the world? Where can we find one outside the two cities?

Five examples have been provided, from locations familiar to this poster. I'm sure others exist, and that their existence will be denied too.

I hope you find peace.

So, is Yamaoka Japanese or Australian? It is not clear to me.

@jon_guy

Good comments. A point in response; you note that you found the plaques about the British at the Summer Palace to be informative and appropriate, but that you wouldn't be comfortable seeing the same plaques around the world. Fair enough; but then the UK doesn't have a government dedicated to denying or obfuscating the events in question or undermining the credibility of the accusations. That is exactly what Nippon Kaigi does, and a large chunk of the LDP are members, hence we get the denialist tone being set from the top for decades; if that hadn't been the case, the statues wouldn't have happened. The reason yamaoka doesn't like this isn't that it's intimidating for him, it's that he's trying to spread his revisionist position and this is the pushback.

CH3CHO yes using women as sex slaves whether it is forced or vountarily (due to poverty or hunger created by these men at war) is EVIL, INHUMANE and WRONG whether Japanese Imperial, Lord Resistance Army, or ISIS. You can put any terms for it (comfort woman is the most beautiful term I've ever heard so far), as we South East Asian people know better....

What a bunch scumbag these Japanese Aussies are. They should take a collection and pay for these memorials along with the Japanese government. There are memorials in honor of war victims and tragedies all over the world. Do you hear Germany complaining about Jewish, Polish or Greek memorials over Nazi massacres? ONLY Japan whines everytime inconvenient history receives any sort of recognition. Japan whines about Unbroken and wants to ban it. Japan whines everytime anyone recognizes these poor surviving WWII sex slaves. It's so pathetic and inexcusable.

LOL. The absurd stupidity of neo-fascist types claiming that Japan already apologized while denying Japan coerced these women into sex slavery is a hoot. Really? Japan already apologized for something that didn't happen?

Funny isn't it, any foreigner here expresses an opinion and usually within 3 or 4 posts we get a... "its Japan if you don't like it perhaps you shouldn't be here"... yet overseas where human rights and at least the attempt for equal rights gives them a voice.

Free Speech, and private property means you could do just about anything you want.. only exception being that its a church which, though its likely, tax free status should have some recognition of the community around them.

As for the subject matter at hand, Japan... young Japanese people, older Japanese people, no one is accusing you individually of anything, unfortunately unlike Germany, for example, rather than pretending bad things didn't happen(except for the sadly increasing revisionist nutters) have firmly and clearly separated themselves from that period in time and will apologise anytime, anywhere.

Awwww... somebody got their feelings hurt. They should take the statue down because those poor Japanese are suffering so much!

Memorials to events are not generally placed in locations unrelated to the events being memorialized.

Should Japanese people enjoying a day in the park with their family have to be confronted by their nation's past at every turn?

@jpn_guy

Good comment, and I tend to agree with you overall.

However, given that you are put off by "unrelated memorialization," how do you feel about memorials to the Holocaust or Hiroshima/Nagasaki which are prevalent all over the world? If the Australian government opts to remove this comfort women memorial, should the government also remove Hiroshima and Holocaust memorials on Australian soil?

The thing that gets me is the hypocrisy — many Japanese people overseas actively spread the gospel worldwide of Japan's wartime suffering through memorials and commemorative events, but then those same people paint themselves as victims of mean-spirited foreigners when people of another country draw attention to their suffering at the hands of Japan. Personally I'm fine with Japanese people engaging in "unrelated memorialization" in other countries about the suffering many people of Japan endured, but I think it should also come with a willingness on their part to also recognize the suffering many Japanese people caused others.

There is a strong tendency these days among many Japanese people to see the IJA as virtuous and well-intentioned liberators who have since unfairly been given a bad rap by foreigners trying to take advantage of the kind-hearted people of Japan. I hear this sort of sentiment often, and it really bothers me.

The title is so misleading, it is not ALL Japanese Australian community, but one Japanese leader for one community network complaning about the statue, calm down...Japanese in Australia alreay open minded about varous issue and willing to talk about it. One OLD GUY and you guys deduce all the communty which obviously in thousands and don't share the same view as this man....

Imagine for a moment you are a British citizen... and you are on holiday in India. How would you feel if people everywhere kept reminding you of how bad your ancestors were during the Raj?

I've been to countries and seen memorials to atrocities done by my country in past years.

All it made me do was resolve that I'd do my best to ensure my country would never do that again. I didn't feel even remotely guilty, as I didn't do it, nor did I feel bad, as I didn't do it.

If the Japanese Government (on behalf of the peoples of Japan) had have accepted responsibility many years ago for these events during WW2,things like this would probably not be happening now.

How so? Click my name and search from my old posts and prove yourself how those contradicts each others, if you can.

here are 2 of your quotes contradiciting each other

There should be nothing wrong with attacking first. Without it, there would not be any war or any fight on the street.

and

No. Just spoils of aggression, unilaterally broken non-aggression pact and invaded after seeing weakened Japan with 1st atomic bomb. Coward Sneak attack. No need diegn to think IF in history

On one quote you say that the pearl harbor attack was fine but on the other hand the soviet attack was a sneaky and cowardly thing to do. There.

. I am a Japanese who has any right to state what I believe correct.

But you do not have the right to change history.

The Japanese community should get the church to put up a sister memorial dedicated to the Lai Đại Hàn right next to this one.

They should, someone should, as that is also a part of history that should be discussed more and shouldn't be forgotten. Maybe it'll pressure South Korea to finally acknowledge it. You see, that's kind of the problem with people who make the "but they did this and that too!" argument. No one is actually excusing what Country A did, and it also doesn't mean we can forget, or not discuss, what Country B did. In other words, Japan still forced women into sexual slavery, and what South Korean troops did in Vietnam won't change that and is a different topic all together. Both countries are hypocritical if they only acknowledge one fact that suits them.

'Comfort woman' statue at Sydney church upsets Japanese-Australian community

Well, that community has access to free information about the "comfort women" in Australia. A simple Google search would even do. It's disturbing that even overseas populations don't believe in it, because if they did, then they'd be sympathetic or even empathetic to what the statue represents.

jpn-guy - you made sensible pertinent points. I agree with your sentiments.

But as yoshitsune stated -

"....but then the UK doesn't have a government dedicated to denying or obfuscating the events in question or undermining the credibility of the accusations. That is exactly what Nippon Kaigi does, and a large chunk of the LDP are members, hence we get the denialist tone being set from the top for decades; if that hadn't been the case, the statues wouldn't have happened. The reason yamaoka doesn't like this isn't that it's intimidating for him, it's that he's trying to spread his revisionist position and this is the pushback....."

much of the fuel for the assailing of Japan is provided by the constant denials and refutations by leading Japanese politicians and citizens of prominence (we can to an extent ignore the rantings of the black-truck brigand) over many years. The Aust. Japan Community spokesperson(s) form part of that broader network by it's connection / sympathy with such "measured" groups as the society for textbook reform and nippon-kaigi. They are politicizing their own stance - willingly or not - by association.

For the flailing to halt and the besmirching of innocents to stop, would require a paradigm shift from the current espousements of denialist leaders. But I'm not holding my breath, as I doubt any change will come in the foreseeable future. It (revisionism) is so entrenched the assailants have fodder for decades.

I hope I'm wrong.

“We consider this is a huge intimidation to the Japanese nationals,” Yamaoka said in a statement from Tokyo.

Or this is a statement from the ruling L.D.P.?

Huge intimidation? Luckily my grandmother wasnt abused, I would feel that a huge intimidation.

marcelito: "In a letter sent to Mr Crews in June, network president Tesshu Yamaoka said the statue was being pushed by political activists "connected to north Korea". "These Korean anti-Japan activities are being utilized as a part of the Chinese Communist Party's information operation attempting to cut the ties of the alliance between Japan, the US and Australia," he wrote. Vivian Pak from the Peace Statue Establishing Committee in Sydney said the statue was about peace, not racial hatred."

Thanks for posting that. I find it incredibly funny, because I can just picture that lout Yamaoka and other wingers, that because of their denial, hatred, and white-wash of history and subsequent letters and statements that the support for such statues grows stronger, calls for Japan's HONEST apologies grow, support for the victims grows, and the outright lunacy of people in Japan's right-wing is shown for what it is. I mean the guy literally says it's part of North-Korean political activists and China's Communist Government at the same time! hahahaha... Japan looks even stupider on this issue thanks to the right-wing getting all riled up. Yamaoka doesn't have to worry much, though... he can cry with his ultra-right buddies on 2-channel and the an say "We're being bashed!" and "they hurt Japan's feelings and attack us!" and other such nonsense while the world continues to support Japan's former victims and the facts come more and more to light and to a broader group of people world-wide. I believe another statue just went up in the US as well, San Fransisco, I think.

Yet another one of Japan's atrocities from their attempted imperial rule of Asia that they chose to downplay and deny. Stop trying to hide from your past Japan.

No-one gives us the evil eye if we don't apologise or are made to feel guilty all the time, so why should Japanese people constantly be subjected to it?

I've been overseas to at least 20 countries with my Japanese wife, and not once has anyone subjected her to making her feel bad, or asking for an apology. So I have no idea where you get 'constantly' from. The only thing we are talking about is a statue, and as I've said, there are memorials dedicated to atrocities my country has done, which is no different from this statue regarding the comfort women.

Yes but my point is that we (British) don't deny what was done (by Britain), so we don't get pushback from people trying to stop us denying it. And by extension, my point is that that is exactly why Japan gets confronted with these statues; if they weren't trying to deny and revise, it wouldn't be happening. So that's why I responded to your example of the Raj.

Do people really need wollaped about the head to remind them?

If it isn't in their school curriculum, there's nothing to be reminded of.

Imagine that.

Ianfu or comfort women is a system of prostitution lisenced by the military. If you call it an atrocity, so is prostitution in London lisenced by the UK government. Japanese government apologized to the former prostitutes. Why doesn't London apologize to the prostitutes for the on-going atrocity?

Since when has the UK government been kidnapping women and forcing them into prostitution?

Japan was the only country that had not been taken over

Except Thailand, and Korea (which had been taken over by Japan), and Taiwan (which had been taken over by Japan), and Mongolia (which was then part of China), and of course most of China itself - except a few ports taken over by Europeans, and the massive chunk annexed by Japan.

This Japan the 'liberator' and Japan the 'victim' narrative doesn't really stack up against Japan's brazenly aggressive expansionist moves against its neighbours in 1895, 1910, 1932, and 1937.

it's their church and their country (Australia) if you don't want it, the door is open and get the hell out! (How does it feel now huh?)

Yamaoka writes:

The current AJCN members consists of 20 % male member and 80 % female member

Him and four women then, whose core values include:

A desire for their children and grandchildren to have a safe living in Australia

Older ladies, perhaps, who harbour

A desire for Japanese peoples, Japanese descendants and their siblings (sic) to live with a proud for carrying a Japanese soul and discipline.

Nice! And finally

A desire for the Federation of Australia where is a multicultural and multinational country which they have well mixed into and lived on, with the people from the other countries including Korean and Chinese to retain their friendships and lives peacefully

Sounds like the old immigrant pecking order at work. Nothing new to see here, folks.

Hiroshima/Nagasaki memorials all over the world? Where can we find one outside the two cities?

Here's a few:

Belfast, Ireland: http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/visit-and-learning/stormont-estate/sculptures/

Cork, Ireland: https://www.flickr.com/photos/workerspartyireland/3797868288/

Dublin, Ireland: https://www.flickr.com/photos/infomatique/5562040997

London, UK: http://www.londonremembers.com/memorials/hiroshima-victims

Staffordshire, UK: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-19262404

CH3 - thank you.

re your "..To parallel your comment, if you think "call them deniers" strategy is the way to go - then I'm afraid demagogues will proliferate for a long time to come."

Yes - but no-one is erecting statues all over in "the proliferation of demagogues". Please start a statue campaign.

tinawatanabe - I haven't accused anyone of anything. I've just written about a situation that exists - that the comfort women statues are spreading, perhaps in part fuelled by denialist, revisionist retort from prominent people in Japan. and that is a matter of fact.

And you conveniently didn't quote what I said next - "...rather than engaging in incessant nit-picking about correct figures to the nth - and accepting that and moving on without falling back onto questioning again and again and again resulting in refutation, would yield over time a better result for all concerned."

Try it.

Ch3CHO: "I do not know where you are from, but if you are from US, Canada, Australia or New Zealand, occupying the land of native people is an on-going atrocity."

So are the Japanese people to the Ainu. You guys going to go back to China and Korea where your come from, or do you realize what a ridiculous straw man argument you're throwing out there in your absolute desperation to deny Japan's atrocities? You still never admitted the sex slaves existed, by the way, which means you deny it. Thanks for proving my previous point about denial.

A Japanese living in Australia complaining about the truth. If he doesnt like to see the truth every time he passes the church then I suggest he goes back home to his own xenophobic and insular country. The level of arrogance is hard to comprehend.

sfjp330DEC. 18, 2016 - 12:51AM JST gloobuyer DEC. 17, 2016 - 10:17PM JST Just because you didn't know something doesn't mean it isn't true. The information

you seek is easily available - if you really wanted to know the answers to these questions you would start searching and reading. Maybe your confused. Your talking about Dutch women. This case was settled in the 50's. Where is the Australian women? Where did it happen and how many? Send me a link.

Sigh. Did you even bother to search yourself? Jan Ruff-O'Herne was an Australian woman so called 'comfort woman' and she is well known in Australia. http://tinyurl.com/zf8fuzd

Australian nurses were captured along with Dutch women during the war and tortured, raped and killed. Ever seen the Tenko https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3143890/ http://www.qaranc.co.uk/damemargotturner.php https://oneluckysoul.blogspot.co.nz/2015/01/the-comfort-women-of-imperial-japanese.html

Anyway, whether there were Australians at the time raped by the Japanese military or not is besides the point here - Koreans were comfort women and some of their decedents are now Australian - that's why they want their ancestors plight to be remembered.

When a nation commits evil, it is important that the incident be memorialized, for history repeats itself otherwise. Here in the USA, there are TONS of historical markers memorializing the massacres of Native Americans because it's history. It happened and it must be remembered. In Germany, the sites of the Concentration Camps are preserved as memorials because they are history. They happened and they must be remembered. Japan needs to suck it up and accept that the "comfort women" incident happened. It's history that must be remembered.

What were public-statements made by Murayama, Kono

DRCheck,

I was here in the 90s for those, were you?? If you were you MIGHT recall the reason Murayama san was the one to give the speech on the 50TH anniversary of WWII, hint the LDP were too chicken to do what was right!!

You might also recall abe & his fellow LDPer's were LIVID with Murayama san's speech & there were INSTANT howls & denials, it was disgusting to witness.

I have OFTEN given credit to BOTH Murayama san & Kono san here on JT! They are very RARE breaths of fresh air in a sea of insincerity & denials & trips to yasukuni.

And to this date in case you don't know there has NOT been a single OFFICIAL apology by Japan ratified in the Diet.

The man on the photo is an idiot as he smiles posing besides the statue. Show some respect man, wake up, it's not a joke.

“I find it very sad,” Crews said of the complaint. “To me, it’s about the suffering of the women. I’ve got no antipathy toward the Japanese people.”

Rich coming from the church that should be placing 'comfort boy' statues instead for all the suffering of young alter boys at the hands of the Christian clergy and covered up for so many years. I find it the irony of this story is lost on a great deal of the public but as the old saying goes "those who live in glass houses should not throw stones".

Blame who ? Australia or S.Korea ?

Tu quoque (/tjuːˈkwoʊkwiː/; Latin for, "you also") or the appeal to hypocrisy is an informal logical fallacy that intends to discredit the validity of the opponent's logical argument by asserting the opponent's failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s).

Without even a hint of denying the atrocities committed by the Japanese Army (NOT Japan) or the existence of sexual slaves, I admit I fail to understand how exactly women forced into prostitution and their sufferings are exactly equal to the mass extermination of a whole ethnic group based on their race and religion or the attacks with atomic weapons on largely civilian populations. I don't understand the logic behind the constant claim of Korean nationalists and some comments here that the statues of sex-slave women are exactly equal to holocaust memorials and if the latter exist then the former should exist too. Or that somehow (in random order) Auschwitz=Nanking=Hiroshima=Ianfu and a memorial of one of these horrible events justifies the erection of memorials for the others. Wouldn't it help some wounds to heal more easily if these events were treated individually even though they happened during the same time period?

Contrary to the Japanese revisionist POV that sex slaves were volunteers or contractors and any cases of forced sexual activity was due to rogue individuals ( how often would that happen in a top down structure like a Japanese military?) western women were also "volunteers" in Singapore, Indonesia and the Philipines among others. This statue is erected to remember Australian women who were systematically forced (raped) into sex by the Japanese forces. It's odd that the same system was so coincidentally implemented by a few "rogue individuals across all of Asia at the same time with no co-ordinating from Tokyo? this bloke should feck off home if he doesn't like looking at the facts of war.

It doesn't matter if Australians want the statue. Maybe the native Aborigines want the statue too of the treatment. Last year, South Korea and Japan reached a agreement to resolve their dispute over Korean women who were forced to serve as sex slaves for Japan’s Imperial Army. The agreement, in which Japan made an apology and promised millions payment that would provide care for the women. The Japanese and South Korean foreign ministers said each side considered it a “final and irreversible resolution” of the issue.

Hjnice: "But are there also statues everywhere in the world to remember the nazis, the crimes of the USA in Vietnam, Cambodia "

You defeat your own argument with yet another straw man. The statues aren't remember Japan or the IJA, they are to remember the victims and to promote peace by remembering history. Where are the statues of "the nazis"? Well, plenty to commemorate those who died as a result of their reign of terror. Never hear of Auscwitz? Germans Chancellors even go there to beg forgiveness, since you bring Germany into it. On top of that, there are PLENTY of cenotaphs, memorials, and heaps of events to commemorate those lost to the nazis. Cambodia? Never hear of the Genocide Museum? You really ought to better inform yourself before posting nonsense in defense of the aggressors and against the victims.

I can see why such a statue was needed. Reality has a habit of destroying religious or political bias

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 06:42AM JST

What has Korean comfort women got to do with this church? A large Korean congregation?

It's a symbol of remembrance for a crime committed against humanity to show we never forget their suffering - I'd say that's a good thing to have in front a church.

The church should place a statue that represents women who were persecuted by the Taliban... can't think of many better places to have one than Ashfield. Why don't they have a statue of a child who was abused by the Catholic church? Lets all stand up and show our support for the injustices of history...

Great idea! But you didn't care enough before to suggest to the church to put a statue up, unlike Koreans in Australia.

Realitycheck,

you don't deny or you can't deny? then did you make sincere apologies? when and how?

The UK doesn't deny. It doesn't deny e.g. Amritsar or Bloody Sunday, etc; while it hasn't formally apologised for everything, it acknowledges the events and doesn't deny them. My point is that Japan's revisionist denials and obfuscations are what brings about the pushback we see with statues etc

CH3,

The question is if you admit that you are responsible for the atrocities your nation did

That isn't the question at all. The question is if my nation acknowledges what it did.

DieRealityCheckDEC. 17, 2016 - 08:56PM JST ＠igloobuyerDec. 17, 2016 - 07:22PM JST

Not doing much research are you. Search Google it's common knowledge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women I am shocked that I didn't have common knowledge after this much of my posts wrt comfort women. Other than O'herne who was not Australian at that time, how many Australian comfort women existed? As long as I know there was no comfort women stations in Australia. Were they kidnapped or abducted suddenly or decieved and taken away to somewhere else to work as sex slaves? I appreciate a little more information because your wiki-link does not say anything asserting. Were they comfrto women or the victims of war-time sex crimes like O'herne. Why didn't they raise their voices for sincere apologies, were they all dead by now? where were they when being abused as sex slaves? why didn't Asian women fund didn't even recognize Austarilan victims? What's going on?

Just because you didn't know something doesn't mean it isn't true. The information you seek is easily available - if you really wanted to know the answers to these questions you would start searching and reading.

and You just don't deny them but never made official apologies as much as Japan did, or as formally as Japan did

except you deny you did anything wrong which contradicts EVERYTHING you said. Your posts are incoherent.

A statue or Monument of this nature is for one to take the time to reflect. These monuments usually have only a few objectors. If This Monument was place in the Australia War Monaural (which there is already section dedicate ) I doubt weather there would be any protest. Surry Hills has a greater population of Koreans then Ashfieild, so the placement has is my question. It has no other purpose then to created division, so move it to a more appropriate place.

I heard a radio documentary on ABC Radio National a couple of years ago glorifying the Australians who occupied Japan after the war. Funny, they didn't mention the rapes committed by their soldiers and the well deserved "barbarian" nickname. MacArthur sent the Aussies packing because of the crimes they were committing.

DieRealityCheck: "THEY DENY WHAT DIDNOT HAPPEN"

Shame on you, and shame on deniers like you. You're the reason why statues should go up in every single nation on the planet, across from every Japanese embassy.

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 03:54PM JST Can Germans complain about any such monuments?

Why don't you ask about the Russians? Germans are silent? Why?

sfjp330. Sorry, I'm not sure what you're alluding to.

@sfjp3030. Are you saying Russians were raped by Germans? And Austrians? Did you mean Australians and that Australians were raped by the Imperial Japanese Army? You said "Many victim of Japanese-American were guilty without due process?" I'm sorry but you've lost me. Who are the victims?: The Korean comfort women, or all who were raped by the IJA, or the Japanese-Americans who were falsely accused of rape? Sorry, but I'm a bit slow today. When I said "unbelievable" I meant that it was unbelievable that the priest or the Korean community expected that such a monument would have been allowed in a public place.

I think they shouldn't say anything about the statue. Then people will just think it is a nice statue of a girl sitting on a bench, and move on. Don't attract attention.

sfjp330DEC. 17, 2016 - 05:54PM JST igloobuye rDEC. 17, 2016 - 05:37PM JST Australians can put up statues of humanitarian symbols as much as they want. With

our without pressure and approval from certain shameless people. This is a joke. Since you know, how many Australian comfort women were a victim? Maybe zero?

First, yes, there were indeed Australian women who were used as sex slaves - plenty of eyewitness accounts of that. Secondly, the statue was put up by Korean-Australians with Korean heritage - they are as much Australian as any other Australian. Finally, the rape camps set up by Japanese (yes, some Koreans were complicit) is a human atrocity not just a Korean, Japanese, Australian atrocity. Cruelty to humans has no borders.

sfjp330DEC. 17, 2016 - 06:16PM JST

igloobuyer DEC. 17, 2016 - 06:11PM JST First, yes, there were indeed Australian women who were used as sex slaves - plenty of eyewitness accounts of that. Where and how many?

Not doing much research are you. Search Google it's common knowledge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women

Don't forget, there were many women tortured, raped, starved and killed by Japanese military in POW camps. Again, very well known and hundreds of eye-witness accounts. And know I'm not going to go get you links when you can easily do it yourself if you really wanted to know the truth instead of what you want to believe.

Forget what happened in the "past", just don't let it happen again! These people that continue to harp on past problems are the ones that want to start new Problems!

That's all fine and well IF you actually LEARN what happened, sadly in Japan for 7+ decades its been not about learning & moving on, its been about DENYING & pretending nothing happened, understand the difference???

You just don’t get yourselves exposed at all to your own crimes endlessly like this.

What are you talking about?? Learn English then post please..

LOL. The absurd stupidity of neo-fascist types claiming that Japan already apologized while denying Japan coerced these women into sex slavery is a hoot. Really? Japan already apologized for something that didn't happen?

excellent post. excellent point. but that is exactly what my point was. their posts are anything but coherent.

Clearly, y'all are taking this a lot more seriously than the guy that signed off on it all, Bill Crews, who is seen showing his support for women's rights by sitting casually with his arm around the statue representing the victims, and a big grin on his face.

F-Zero..He is a minister of a church.. he is at least confused, specifically about mental capacity I won't comment ;-)

Hi to those Japanese living in Australia . If you Truly dont Like it Go back to japan . Stop bludging on our Social services and everybody in Australia why are you here if you love your home country so much. Japan needs workers and increased population .

What has Korean comfort women got to do with this church? A large Korean congregation? The church should place a statue that represents women who were persecuted by the Taliban... can't think of many better places to have one than Ashfield. Why don't they have a statue of a child who was abused by the Catholic church? Lets all stand up and show our support for the injustices of history... unless retaliation is possible ... Japan is fair game: you won't see any violent protests by the Japanese in Sydney.

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 04:11PM JST0 sfjp330. Sorry, I'm not sure what you're alluding to.

Your quote: "So, it's from the Australian Korean community and the priest allowed it to be displayed on the grounds of his church... I don't know why I'm surprised; and to think they wanted to display it in a public park and he's upset the council rejected the initial proposal ... unbelievable".

So how many Austrian victim were actually from rape of IJA? Many victim of Japanese-American were guilty without due process? 120,000? Most were born in U.S.

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 03:54PM JST

@igloo buyer. I didn't say Muslims believe that the Taliban are real Muslims; but then again I wouldn't say "no Muslim". I was saying that some Muslims would see it as an attack on their religion because there is a perception that all non-Muslims think they are all the same. I don't think Taliban supporters would see a statue as a good idea.

You are confusing a statue that is symbolic of a human atrocity with attacking a people (i.e. Japanese). Because you remember an atrocity does not automatically mean you are attacking the nation that perpetrated the atrocity. Do we blame Germany for the holocaust? No. Do we blame Japan today for the comfort women atrocity? No. We DO however blame Japan and Japanese people like yourself who deny it ever happened and try to hide it by not having statues in its memory. Germans don't do that.

The statue CAN be seen as provocative because it represents something that is of a controversial and political nature; whether or not it is provocative is neither here nor there. It also has nothing to do with Australia.

Again, it's a humanitarian issue, and only a political issue in the eyes of Japan because Japan refuses to honestly and openly atone for its past.

Are statues of the holocaust provocative? Not for me... but then again I'm not German. Can Germans complain about any such monuments? They'd probably be in a lot of trouble if they did.

Then why is this not also true for Japanese!? Why are you and others against this statue 'not in trouble as you should be!?

Where do we draw the line? History isn't black and white. Therefore, if Koreans and German want monuments in their country then great but Australia has its own issues.

There is almost no disagreement over the comfort women atrocity (except in Japan of course, but there is a clear agenda there). So in this case, it is indeed 'black and white'. Australians can put up statues of humanitarian symbols as much as they want. With our without pressure and approval from certain shameless people.

The hypercritical thing here its a Japanese guy living outside of Japan offended about a statute about the bad behaviour of Japanese troops operating outside of Japan. I was once given a revisionist speech by a Japanese woman who had grown up outside of Japan now living back in Japan about the Hiroshima/Nagasaki bombings it fascinates me how a percentage of Japanese people still deny the fact the Pacific war was started by Japan.

No need for a statue like this to be erected in Australia. Australians may occasionally need to be reminded of atrocities done by those who originally founded the country to right wrongs that are yet to be atoned for (with regard to indigenous Australians), but a constant reminder of atrocities involving two foreign nations is unwelcome and will beget nothing but prejudice towards new Australians and their innocent children. Welcome to Australia, embrace your heritage, but leave your anger and possible subsequent racist views behind you!

@sensenotsocommon thank-you for the link. So, it's from the Australian Korean community and the priest allowed it to be displayed on the grounds of his church... I don't know why I'm surprised; and to think they wanted to display it in a public park and he's upset the council rejected the initial proposal ... unbelievable.

One thing I am different from other posters is Allied force raped Japanese Women during their landing and occupation. Poor Japanese women should be included as comfort women too. It has been rarely mention in many nations history books.

Flyfalcon,

In case you didn't know there WERE JAPANESE SEX SLAVES!! yes, Japanese women who were forced to have sex with their own military, doesnt get much notice in Japan as you would expect, as most in the govt actively deny sex slaves exist & a whole more as well related to WWII.

No just IMAGINE if any of these JAPANESE women are still alive NOW, how they must feel.

The whole statue thing is because JAPAN wont ADMIT its HISTORY plain & really simple!

I beggars belief how so many cant grasp this simple concept

@igloo buyer. I didn't say Muslims believe that the Taliban are real Muslims; but then again I wouldn't say "no Muslim". I was saying that some Muslims would see it as an attack on their religion because there is a perception that all non-Muslims think they are all the same. I don't think Taliban supporters would see a statue as a good idea.

The statue CAN be seen as provocative because it represents something that is of a controversial and political nature; whether or not it is provocative is neither here nor there. It also has nothing to do with Australia.

Are statues of the holocaust provocative? Not for me... but then again I'm not German. Can Germans complain about any such monuments? They'd probably be in a lot of trouble if they did.

Where do we draw the line? History isn't black and white. Therefore, if Koreans and German want monuments in their country then great but Australia has its own issues.

igloobuye rDEC. 17, 2016 - 05:37PM JST Australians can put up statues of humanitarian symbols as much as they want. With our without pressure and approval from certain shameless people.

This is a joke. Since you know, how many Australian comfort women were a victim? Maybe zero?

@igloobuyer.

You are confusing a statue that is symbolic of a human atrocity with attacking a people (i.e. Japanese). Because you remember an atrocity does not automatically mean you are attacking the nation that perpetrated the atrocity. Do we blame Germany for the holocaust? No. Do we blame Japan today for the comfort women atrocity? No. We DO however blame Japan and Japanese people like yourself who deny it ever happened and try to hide it by not having statues in its memory. Germans don't do that

. Let's slow down. First of all I'm not Japanese, I'm Australian. Second, I don't deny that it happened. I know the priest is not attacking the Japanese but highlighting an atrocity; I understand that. My point is that if Australia allows a comfort women statue to be displayed then what other monuments for atrocities are allowed to be highlighted in a country that had nothing to do with them. We can't speak for others and say that they won't be offended. Where do we draw the line? Do you believe that the Chinese community wouldn't be offended if we decided to place a statue in a public place in Sydney that remembers the Tibetans killed by the Chinese army, even though it's not intended to offend?

Why are you and others against this statue 'not in trouble as you should be!?

Why do you think I should be in trouble? What have I said? So, I should keep my mouth shut....?

Again, it's a humanitarian issue, and only a political issue in the eyes of Japan because Japan refuses to honestly and openly atone for its past.

Yes, the women who were raped and killed is a humanitarian issue but the broader issues of dealing with the war is political even if Japan is no longer under Imperial rule. Just like Australians facing our own historical humanitarian issues in regards to the killing of Indigenous Australians.... it's always political whether we like it or not.

@sfj330

Do you know anything about the settlement? Japan made an apology and promised millions payment that would provide care for the women. The Japanese and South Korean foreign ministers said each side considered it a “final and irreversible resolution” of the issue. What more do you want?

Your posts have really confused me. I don't want anything. I am against the statue.

@igloobuyer

Comparing notes of denials by Japanese politicians of "comfort women" issues, how do you explain the evidence of the Dutch women whose testimony of sexual enslavement in the then Dutch East Indies? To be sure it had been preceded by a long series of denials in Japan government, but the main allegations had been proved in a Dutch court under Western rules of evidence as far back as 1948. That court, which had been convened in what was then the Dutch East Indies (now Indonesia), had considered allegations that Japanese army officers had forced many Dutch women seized in the Dutch East Indies into sexual slavery. One Japanese military official was executed and many others were sentenced to jail terms. The Dutch went on in 1956 successfully to press the J-government to pay compensation to the women. In 1985 details of the comfort women story were published in an official Dutch government history of the war.

If Korea had agreed back in 1965 for Japan to handle individual compensation, as Japan had first suggested, Japan would have immediately publicized, and given claimants a deadline by which to submit claims with substantiating evidence. Japan would have honored the claim. But based on the treaty, it was up to the South Korean government to set up these measures. the South Korean government did not take sufficient interests in its people such as comfort women who actually suffered from the colonial times, but that was the responsibility of their own government. Japan made reparations in good faith to the Korean government instead of to individuals because that’s the way the Korean government wanted it. The Korean government was supposed to pay the individual reparations. Even if comfort women reparation was included in the 1965 treaty, the Korean government would've kept the money anyway. It was not Japan’s fault that Park Chung-hee used the money for infrastructure instead. Many Koreans for years didn’t even know that Japan paid reparations.

In 1992, Korean Prof. Ahn Byeong-jik of Seoul University talks about Japanese comfort station system. An investigation conducted in South Korea by Professor on 40 survivors resulted in all testimonies not being credible. He also concluded that half of comfort station owners were Korean. The fact that half of comfort stations were run by Koreans maybe surprising to you. The brutality of some segments of the Imperial Japanese military is well known and have been tried at the Tokyo trials. Problem is that surviving Korean comfort women tells different version each time they recount their experiences. The South Koreans started attacking even the good will of former PM Murayama who spent working for the surviving comfort women as a head of AWF. Based on the testimonies that they gave, many are now questioning the stories behind it.

In today climate I assume the church will be made to remove it. This is seen as a pay back buy the Korean nationals. It was finance by the Koreans. It a form of hate speach which is not allow in Australia anti discrimination laws. I see it has a attempt to dig up pass tension. Both groups of people came here because of Australia tolerance and exceptance of all people. I am sure there is a monmoral at the Australian War museum for War11 sex workers. It may be ask to be move to there ?

I've been to countries and seen memorials to atrocities done by my country in past years.

All it made me do was resolve that I'd do my best to ensure my country would never do that again. I didn't feel even remotely guilty, as I didn't do it, nor did I feel bad, as I didn't do it.

Neither do I feel guilty... but that's my point. No-one gives us the evil eye if we don't apologise or are made to feel guilty all the time, so why should Japanese people constantly be subjected to it?

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 08:45AM JST @igloobuyer.

I was being sarcastic and no, I don't think any of those ideas are good . Imagine a statue to female victims of the Taliban in Ashfield which has a huge Muslim population. Some would view it as an attack on Islam and not the Taliban.

That's just silly - no Muslim believes the Taliban are real Muslims. Even if they do, they would agree such statues would be a good idea too.

If Koreans want to have some monument in Korea then good on them. To me this statue can be seen as provocative.

What are you talking about!? How is it provocative? Are statues to the Holocaust provocative? Do we see Germans complaining about that? No, they are more grown up and smarter than that.

roosterman77DEC. 17, 2016 - 05:08PM JST The Korean comfort women, or all who were raped by the IJA, or the Japanese-Americans who were falsely accused of rape? Sorry, but I'm a bit slow today. When I said "unbelievable" I meant that it was unbelievable that the priest or the Korean community expected that such a monument would have been allowed in a public place.

Do you know anything about the settlement? Japan made an apology and promised millions payment that would provide care for the women. The Japanese and South Korean foreign ministers said each side considered it a “final and irreversible resolution” of the issue. What more do you want?

gloobuyer DEC. 17, 2016 - 10:17PM JST Just because you didn't know something doesn't mean it isn't true. The information you seek is easily available - if you really wanted to know the answers to these questions you would start searching and reading.

Maybe your confused. Your talking about Dutch women. This case was settled in the 50's. Where is the Australian women? Where did it happen and how many? Send me a link.

How old is Yamaoka? In USA, Japanese American means half Japanese and females are boxing such organization.

I think the statue very strange, to be honest. There were Australian women used as sex slaves by the Japanese in WW2, so I am confused as to why they have chosen to commemorate Korean women here. The local council clearly thought it inappropriate, and I'm not convinced the Uniting Church are doing it purely to acknowledge the suffering of women.

@igloobuyer. I was being sarcastic and no, I don't think any of those ideas are good . Imagine a statue to female victims of the Taliban in Ashfield which has a huge Muslim population. Some would view it as an attack on Islam and not the Taliban. If Koreans want to have some monument in Korea then good on them. To me this statue can be seen as provocative. I would be certain the authorities would step if the statue represented the Armenian genocide... and quite rightly because it would offend the Turkish community but it's the Japanese community so who cares?

igloobuyer DEC. 17, 2016 - 06:11PM JST First, yes, there were indeed Australian women who were used as sex slaves - plenty of eyewitness accounts of that.

Where and how many?

@igloobuyer

Just because you didn't know something doesn't mean it isn't true. The information you seek is easily available - if you really wanted to know the answers to these questions you would start searching and reading.

When did I say such thing? Are you evading my question?

Forget what happened in the "past", just don't let it happen again! These people that continue to harp on past problems are the ones that want to start new Problems!

@igloobuyer

I mean, if it is such common knowledge with enough evidence, the epigrahs of the statue on the ground of the church must be surely includig AUSTRALIA in the victims list,.. somewhere in "OVER 200,000 WOMEN AND GIRLS FROM KOREA ,CHINA,TAIWAN,THE PHILIPPINS,INDONESIA,MALASIA,VIETNAM,THE NETERLANDS AND EAST TIMORE .....(continue)".

Otherwise, Rev Crews and Korean-Australian activists group would be in trouble.

GW

sadly in Japan for 7+ decades its been not about learning & moving on, its been about DENYING & pretending nothing happened, understand the difference???

7+ decades? first korean comfort women came out early 1990's.

What were public-statements made by Murayama, Kono, Abe ,etc and Asian Women Fund all done for ? Who are those guys like Yoshimi Yoshiaki, Yuki-Tanaka, all other professors and Journalists including activists group in Japan?

Don't you see JAPAN has been split in opinions?

igloobuyerDEC. 18, 2016 - 08:02AM JST Sigh. Did you even bother to search yourself? Jan Ruff-O'Herne was an Australian woman so called 'comfort woman' and she is well known in Australia. http://tinyurl.com/zf8fuzd

Is that the best you can do? She wasn't even born in Australia. Jan O’Herne was a Dutch was born in 1923 at Bandoeng, in central Java. She emigrated to Australia after the war. How many Australians that were born in Australia was taken to comfort station?

@Aly

except you deny you did anything wrong which contradicts EVERYTHING you said.

How so? Click my name and search from my old posts and prove yourself how those contradicts each others, if you can. The driving force to prove Japan's attorocities during WW2 are coming out of inside Japan by Japanese themselves. The opinions of the Japanese are not the same. but split . I deny the narratives inflated, or exggerated. so How am I contradincting? show me the proofs. I am not JAPAN. I am a Japanese who has any right to state what I believe correct.

@melonbarmonster

claiming that Japan already apologized while denying Japan coerced these women into sex slavery is a hoot.

I don't remember I myself or some like CH3 or sfjp330 ever denied some specific War crimes by Japanese soldiers. I don't remember JAPAN as a country officially refered to or denied those specific cases.

When Abe said there was no proofs of abduction, he refered to, in particular, Korean Penninsula. Nowadays major ad-tower korean oldwomen whose narrative were orginally being abducted, kidnapped by IJA soldiers almost all fine-tuned and started excluding the subjects of the story Who did. How come they could possibly change their narratives so easily. some of them started their testimonies in her early 60's for gods sake.

As an individual I deny anything which I believe is not true. so I DENY your too-rough expression of hoot

Sick, let's smile and snap a photo. I can imagine the reaction if it was some other similar memorial statue whether from Germany, Hiroshima or Tiananmen Square. At least show some respect. Actually I'm not quite sure what the statue itself represents. Why the chair?

Did any of the Japanese in Australia have anything to do with the treatment of these "comfort women?"

How about a statue memorializing the rapes, murders and robberies of Japanese during the first days of the occupation? The entire occupation of Japan was halted by MacArthur and ordered commanders to his HQ to try to stop the onslaught on Japanese women, because it would interfere with the occupation.

So, this is just grandstanding.

Australia has a long history of murdering prisoners of war, going back to the Boer War. Where is that statue?

I think the world needs to remember what happened, sure. But at the same time, putting these statues in places that had nothing to do with the issue in question is ridiculous. Somebody mentioned that Japan is doing the same with A-bomb statues around the world. I haven't seen them, but I think it's equally stupid.

Why don't we just take this to the extreme and fill every street, park and front yard with memorials for foreign war victims. I mean, they all need to be remembered by every single person on the face of this planet, right?

I mean, am I right or what?

CH3CHO

In your previous post, you mentioned there were no Australian Women have been raped by JIA. In my knowledge, there were some POWs of Aussies existed during WWII. Some posters said Australian women included. As you are well researched for that issue, are there any credible information?

One thing I am different from other posters is Allied force raped Japanese Women during their landing and occupation. Poor Japanese women should be included as comfort women too. It has been rarely mention in many nations history books.

There were legal prostitution during war time. Even paid Prostitute was not willing to satisfy the multiple clients at once. Japan was waging war with many nations. Even it can not afford to supply enough fighter jets to Air Force. Zero Pilots sacrificed by themselves. Very unlikely one soldier was rationed equally for one prostitute. It was one of the reason, IJA committed war crimes. Even paid prostitue was performing her duty, if she was force to perform beyond her limit, it was a simply gang rapes in my definition.

I also agree with Japanese point of view, Japanese and Okinawa women were victims of Allied force war crimes. There are two sides of stories.

＠igloobuyerDec. 17, 2016 - 07:22PM JST

Not doing much research are you. Search Google it's common knowledge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women

I am shocked that I didn't have common knowledge after this much of my posts wrt comfort women. Other than O'herne who was not Australian at that time, how many Australian comfort women existed? As long as I know there was no comfort women stations in Australia. Were they kidnapped or abducted suddenly or decieved and taken away to somewhere else to work as sex slaves? I appreciate a little more information because your wiki-link does not say anything asserting. Were they comfrto women or the victims of war-time sex crimes like O'herne.

Why didn't they raise their voices for sincere apologies, were they all dead by now? where were they when being abused as sex slaves? why didn't Asian women fund didn't even recognize Austarilan victims? What's going on?

@Andrew Crisp The "Pacific War" was started by Europeans who began taking over Asia, as they did the rest of the world. Japan was the only country that had not been taken over and feared it would be next. So of course, Japan reacted. Whether the reaction was good or not is another question. Japan should have helped Chinese free themselves of the European colonialists rather than invade to try to kick them out. If you research this, you'll find that there were a significant number of Asians who had escaped to Japan and wanted Japan to do something. Including one called Zhou En Lai, who because Mao's right hand man.

＠GW

If you were you MIGHT recall the reason Murayama san was the one to give the speech on the 50TH anniversary of WWII, hint the LDP were too chicken to do what was right!! You might also recall abe & his fellow LDPer's were LIVID with Murayama san's speech & there were INSTANT howls & denials, it was disgusting to witness.

Sorry to ask you but So What?

Did Murayama, Kono were forced to take them back? Do you know the backgrounds of how Kono-statement was prepared? Korean Government reviewed and good bedding was done between 2 governments beforehand. But the reality was that there were absolutely none of back-up investigation but Japan took all the testimonies by some unknown named victims living at some unknown address as if they all **did actually happen.

What happened then afterwards? Some of victims testimony found out to be completely false, there were no comfort stations in the area she claimed having worked!

Seiji Yoshida confessed his testimonies were completely fictious.

Asahi finally admitted it has been leaving falsified news and column for too long only to gtake them back 3oyears after.

And yet, Abe took the statements of those two back? Didn't Japan as a country swallowed all those including dubious parts.. but apologized?

Since when, anybody could possibly assert that you need Diet’s ratification? Is it some international Law or something? I don’t know any country which ratified the apology except when Americans apologized to Americans. Above all else, I don’t know any country which apologized except Germans only to Jews.

Australia and US has been pressured by local Korean communities for erecting Comfort Women Statues. Many Church gores of Uniting Church are not impressed by politically motivated monument. I have a Korean Friend married with African woman and living in.Africa. He is also encouraging local Africans for erecting that staute. In fact Africa is nothing to do with comfort,wormem issue.

Australia, North America, Asia have been already erected statues. If Africa will be included again, almost none continent will be left for erecting that statue. Not only Korean women have been raped by Japanese. Dutch, Australian, Fillipinoes, Okkinawans, Taiwanese and Burmese women too. Those nations and prefecture are more forgiving and move on with no bitterness and hatred. Bygone is bygone and Auld Lang Syne for farewell to 2016. 1943 to 45 was distant memory.

Mr Crews should realize that Son of God suffered thousands time more that those victims. Despite his unbearable suffering,he prayed for forgiveness from Goddor Romans. Uniting Church is not the political play ground. It is a worshiping place.

StrangerlandDec. 16, 2016 - 06:52PM JST

I've been to countries and seen memorials to atrocities done by my country in past years.

All it made me do was resolve that I'd do my best to ensure my country would never do that again. I didn't feel even remotely guilty, as I didn't do it, nor did I feel bad, as I didn't do it.

I was thinking of the falacy of your logic.

1 Is a nation responsible for its wrongdoings of the past?

2 Are the people of a nation responsible for what their nation is responsible for?

The answers to these questions should be both yes. It follows that you as a member of your country are responsible for what your country did in the past.

YoshitsuneDec. 17, 2016 - 12:12AM JST

Yes but my point is that we (British) don't deny what was done (by Britain), so we don't get pushback from people trying to stop us denying it

The question is if you admit that you are responsible for the atrocities your nation did.

I would turn it into a hilarious meme mocking the Koreans for their victim complex. Every day dress the statue as Hatsune Miku or Santa Claus or some other inappropriate thing and spread photos on the Internet.

Azrul HakimDEC. 16, 2016 - 01:46PM JST

OK. Tell us your opinions regarding comfort women.

StrangerlandDEC. 16, 2016 - 06:52PM JST

I've been to countries and seen memorials to atrocities done by my country in past years.

All it made me do was resolve that I'd do my best to ensure my country would never do that again. I didn't feel even remotely guilty, as I didn't do it, nor did I feel bad, as I didn't do it.

I do not know where you are from, but if you are from US, Canada, Australia or New Zealand, occupying the land of native people is an on-going atrocity. If you are from UK, it is responsible for many of the on-going atrocities in the Middle East. How would one deal with the on-going atrocities? Does one feel guilty for the on-going atrocities?

I am British, I have been to India; Britain isn't in the habit of denying what it did in India, so India isn't in the habit of reminding them. Fairly simple really.

I'm also British, but I was just using the unpopularity of the Raj as an example... sometimes I think all I do is defend myself from people who get the wrong end of the stick!

As for the statue... it's a bit like putting up a statue of an African slave in Docklands, to remind people how bad our ancestors were, or a Vietnamese child in Washington to remind Americans of the Mai Lai massacre... Do people really need wollaped about the head to remind them? I don't care about accepting what was done, or apologising for the war... like I said, modern Japanese people have no reason to be made to feel ashamed for what was done two or three generations ago by their grandfathers and great grandfathers.

Damn sure I'm not going to apologise for what the British Empire did as it romped across the globe

Yoshitsune

Yes but my point is that we (British) don't deny what was done (by Britain), so we don't get pushback from people trying to stop us denying it.

Is that so? you don't deny or you can't deny? then did you make sincere apologies? when and how?

Azrul Hakim

Are you saying that from today's point of view or from your religious point of view?

How do you want to deal with the time and place where prostitutions were legal? or with sex workers who march on the street claiming for the freedom of choosing occupation?

SensatoDEC. 16, 2016 - 10:49AM JST

how do you feel about memorials to the Holocaust or Hiroshima/Nagasaki which are prevalent all over the world?

Hiroshima/Nagasaki memorials all over the world? Where can we find one out-side the two cities?

The following is what was agreed between Korea and Japan last year regarding ianfu.

http://www.mofa.go.jp/a_o/na/kr/page4e_000365.html

(2) Foreign Minister Yun (RoK) announced as follows.

(ii) The Government of the ROK acknowledges the fact that the Government of Japan is concerned about the statue built in front of the Embassy of Japan in Seoul from the viewpoint of preventing any disturbance of the peace of the mission or impairment of its dignity, and will strive to solve this issue in an appropriate manner through taking measures such as consulting with related organizations about possible ways of addressing this issue.

(iii) The Government of the ROK, together with the Government of Japan, will refrain from accusing or criticizing each other regarding this issue in the international community, including at the United Nations, on the premise that the Government of Japan will steadily implement the measures it announced.

So, they promised to take care of the statute in Seoul. But they started to build a lot of them in other parts of the world. What about their promise to refrain from accusing or criticizing?

browny1DEC. 16, 2016 - 02:17PM JST

much of the fuel for the assailing of Japan is provided by the constant denials and refutations by leading Japanese politicians and citizens of prominence (we can to an extent ignore the rantings of the black-truck brigand) over many years.

It is not that simple. Read this New York Times article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/19/world/asia/south-korea-comfort-women-park-yu-ha.html?_r=0

When a Korean professor, Ms Park Yu Ha, researched archive documents on comfort women and published her work, she was criminally prosecuted by the Korean government. The problem is what is believed in Korea now does not match what was recorded, and any attempt by academics to reveal what was recorded is oppressed by the Korean government.

It is also widely known that the testimonies by Korean former comfort women changes widely every time they testify. The following transcript contains 2 contradicting versions of testimonies by one comfort woman who testified before US Congress on the same day.

http://archives.republicans.foreignaffairs.house.gov/110/33317.pdf

In addition to all this, any attempt to sort out facts and myths is also called "denial" by Koreans. What you called "denial" also falls in this category, though you may not be aware of it.

Imagine for a moment you are a British citizen... and you are on holiday in India. How would you feel if people everywhere kept reminding you of how bad your ancestors were during the Raj? That's possibly how the Japanese feel. I suspect that more than 80% of Japanese alive had nothing to do with the war, and yet they are constantly receiving pelters because of what their ancestors did... The last thing Japanese Aussies need is something to alienate them from the rest of the population based on what their ancestors got up to more than 70 years ago.

Rich coming from the church that should be placing 'comfort boy' statues instead for all the suffering of young alter boys at the hands of the Christian clergy and covered up for so many years. I find it the irony of this story is lost on a great deal of the public

I was about to refer to this story. Thanks for letting posters here know about the irony.

Crews said of the complaint. “To me, it’s about the suffering of the women. I’ve got no antipathy toward the Japanese people.” the Peace Statue Establishing Committee in Sydney said the statue was about peace, not racial hatred."

And yet, intentionally ignoring about the epigraphs of all around 50 statues in the world ,which refer to nothing but IJA as sole evil. No mention to Koreans, Americans, Russians, Chinese, Germans, French. Some even exclude Japanese comfort women from victim’s nationalities’ list inscribed. So much for hypocritical excuse likewhat these statues universally represent This is nothing but an act of racism against Japanese only.

seeing how their denial is exactly an act that is reasonably likely to “offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate” someone because of his or her race or ethnicity.

How exactly denial becomes such an racism act? I defy you to explain exactly. When Seiji-Yoshida’s crap or Katsuichi Honda’s crap(who admit his fabrication later in his life) was denied and proven falsified by the efforts of Japanese, Japanese offend , insult, humiliate Japanese? To exonerate the wrongfully convicted, or to prove what did not happen as did not happen, of course you deny falsified claim. A lost posters here don’t understand the biggest driving forces criticizing Japan for war-time atrocities coming inside from Japan. Japanese themselves.

You are not making any sense.

But we don't deny them.

You just don’t get yourselves exposed at all to your own crimes endlessly like this.

As you can see, the Japanese expats living in Australia (of which there are far more than Australians living in Japan) have a voice when they feel that they are being discriminated against - unlike Australians living in Japan.

Of course. Australia is a democratic country with human rights. Japan isn't. At all.

it's their church and their country (Australia) if you don't want it, the door is open and get the hell out! (How does it feel now huh?)

AJCN continuously belittle, abuse, disgrace Aussie people and the country Australia or just asking not to erect the statue?

blowny1

No one is queaky clean. So coming to terms with that

You can't accuse someone with that logic.

smith

People are called deniers because they deny what happened

Because deniers never gave up, people started realizing that, as far as Korean peninsula is concerned,** their original narratives were falsified, like abduction or kidnapping, enforce recruitments by Japanese military. On the other hand, majority of Korean comfort women were sold by their korean parents, deceived by korean brokers, korean chief of villages, or willing prostitues.

Without the efforts of those deniers sorting out the facts and fabrications, I am pretty sure, the narrative just like in the recent disgusting fictious korean movie (Kikyou) would 've been the defact standard of history. As a matter of fact, this narrative is the de fact standard for epigraphs of almost all statues in the world.

See? THEY DENY WHAT DIDNOT HAPPEN

so strive as the government might, legally they cannot force them. So, you fail, again.

Yes. K-Government can, or at least it could but it didn't. It's just silly exuse, not to mention Vienna treaty, despite the fact, in case of girls statue run over to death by ameicans, K-Government rejected, and took down the statue twice immediately no matter how strongly a civic groups and families condemened their actions.

SenseNotSoCommonDEC. 16, 2016 - 02:04PM JST

Belfast. It is the other way around.

‘Reconciliation’ is a sculpture by the artist Josefina de Vasconcellos.

Originally created in 1977 and entitled ‘ Reunion’, the sculpture depicts a man and woman embracing each other across barbed wire.

In 1995 (to mark the 50th anniversary of the end of the Second World War) bronze casts of this sculpture (as Reconciliation) were placed in the ruins of Coventry Cathedral and in the Hiroshima Peace Park in Japan.

Cork, the link does not work.

Dublin the link does not work.

London, It is just a tree.

Staffordshire It looks more like a war trophy than a memorial.

randomnatorDEC. 16, 2016 - 04:36PM JST

This statue is erected to remember Australian women who were systematically forced (raped) into sex by the Japanese forces.

Excuse me, but the statue in the photo does not look like an Australian woman.

This statue is erected to remember Australian women who were systematically forced (raped) into sex by the Japanese forces. It's odd that the same system was so coincidentally implemented by a few "rogue individuals across all of Asia at the same time with no co-ordinating from Tokyo?

You cannot put everything into one bag. There were rapes. There were also prostitution. We are talking about a numerous issues that took place over Asian continent and near by islands.

Japanese army licensed prostitution operations in occupied areas. This prostitution was called ianfu which Americans translated as "comfort girls", which is later re-written by Americans as "comfort women". Prostitution per se was legal in Japan as well as in many countries in the world. Japanese government has never denied ianfu. Prostitutes were commonplace. However, from retrospective standpoint, Japanese government apologized for the prostitutes for their suffering as prostitutes. Most of the prostitutes were citizens of Japanese empire, which included Japan, Korea and Taiwan.

There were also random rapes that were committed by Japanese soldiers. The victims were enemy citizens, such as Chinese, Filipinas, Indonesians and so on. They are not ianfu or comfort women. There were pure victims. However, some strange political mechanism works and they are somewhat left behind after ianfu, or prostitutes.

By the way, who do you mean by Australian women? You must be confusing with a Dutch woman who was a colonizer of Indonesia who got Australian citizenship after WW2.

if they weren't trying to deny and revise, it wouldn't be happening.

People deny when it is a wrong accusation. I recommend South Korea go to the international court instead of irrecting statues.

browny1DEC. 16, 2016 - 03:26PM JST

CH3 - thank you.

If you think the denialist strategy is the way to go - then I'm afraid seated chair statues et al will proliferate for a long time to come.

I think I have already answered your question as follows.

In addition to all this, any attempt to sort out facts and myths is also called "denial" by Koreans. What you called "denial" also falls in this category, though you may not be aware of it.

To parallel your comment, if you think "call them deniers" strategy is the way to go - then I'm afraid demagogues will proliferate for a long time to come.