Defense experts back Japan acquiring enemy base strike capability

a slippery slope.

Do not let Japan have any strike capabilities.

Japan will repeat all the atrocities they did on WW2 is you let them the chance.

Debate,debate and more debate. Is been going on for years now. Just scrap the whole constitution already and buy the damn missiles. Clearly US and EU aren't against it and neither is our government. There is not much to discuss about.

There must be full open public debate.

The people/public must be fully involved

All minutes published.

Lives of our families could ultimately be at risk from retaliatory strikes

This ultimately is a first strike capability being acquired here.

Article 9 could well have to be amended.

because look how well it turned out for Japan last time.....

I don’t trust the LDP with this capacity, it’s too easy for them to fire first, then claim self defence in their delusional state of mind.

Only thing you need is the GPS location of a target,and the missile,it can do the rest by itself

If you couldn't trust the LDP during the pandemic, the Tohoku recovery, the Olympics or numerous other issues that occurred during "peace time" what makes anyone think giving these clowns weapons is going to fare any better than a total cluster. Think twice or thrice before handing destructive capabilities to someone that has a proven track record of gross incompetence.

Ishihara has gone, Abe has been pushed into the background, but their followers are still with us, their ideas are still with us, the LDP is still in control.

Ask Japanese why they love Japan, and one of the reasons will be Japan is a safe country. Ask them why they think it is safe, and one of the reasons will be that Japan has a peace constitution, Article 9 does not allow Japan to start wars.

I believe the vast majority Japanese people do not want Article 9 to continue controlling their policiticians, especially the extreme right.

I know that if Japan is given the right to munitions again, they will do exactly what they did in WW2. Remember the old boys club is still in charge. Different faces but same ideology.

Japan absolutely should choose to have the capability to strike at enemy neighbors with missiles - short-range and intercontinental - and long range bombers - just as her neighbors have the capacity to strike at Japan.

In this, the most dangerous time to be in Japan for the past 80 years, it's a no brainer.

Just as Germany's military is normalised, so should Japan's Military.

bokudaToday  07:17 am JST

Do not let Japan have any strike capabilities.

Japan will repeat all the atrocities they did on WW2 is you let them the chance.

Ridiculus nonsense. Japan does not have the government structure that Imperial Japan did that allowed for it's WWII aggression. Unless you can tell me who the current Cabinet Ministers of the Army and Navy are. Today's JSDF are in lockstep with the US and it's allies. The threats are from China and Russia.

Michael MachidaToday  08:17 am JST

I know that if Japan is given the right to munitions again, they will do exactly what they did in WW2.

The United States who fought Japan in WWII doesn't think so. In fact hasn't thought so since 1950. Japan has the "rights" to any weapons they want, they don't need anyone to allow it. Any reservations come from the Japanese people. Something the people of countries like China could learn from.

"Americans are pleased with the current state of U.S.-Japan relations: More than eight-in-ten prefer that ties between the two nations remain as close as they have been in recent years or get closer. But Americans are divided over whether Japan should play a more active military role."

Some critics say allowing Japan to acquire such capabilities would herald a major postwar shift from its exclusively defense-oriented policy while also marking a change in the nature of the Japan-U.S. security alliance.

The critics are ignorant or fully misunderstanding this point; Japan has already acquired such capabilities through a series of legal arrangements and amendments since 1999; the latest revision in 2015

武力攻撃事態等及び存立危機事態における我が国の平和と独立並びに国及び国民の安全の確保に関する法律

https://elaws.e-gov.go.jp/document?lawid=415AC0000000079

According to it, a preemptive move is even valid and possible in response to eminent threats. The law is also in line with the US consent and grand strategy.

A remaining debate is about its constitutionality with regard to Article 9. The critics might want to argue it is unconstitutional, thus the law should be abolished. But again it's inaccurate to say that Japan shouldn't seek the capabilities which have already been in place.

Only thing you need is the GPS location of a target,and the missile,it can do the rest by itself

Not true. Not even close to true. GPS jammers exist and work. Expect not to have GPS in a major war. There are alternatives. Find out what TERCOM is for example. It is how Tomahawks find their targets.

Any movement committed to preventing war and building transnational solidarity must consider the threat of Japan’s remilitarization. Empowering and arming Japan’s far right would be the worst mistake in the region.

The uncomfortable truth is that in order to prevent war, one must be prepared to fight war.

Events in Ukraine should inform Japanese policy makers and the public. Russia would not be able to flatten Ukrainian cities if the Ukrainians had he means to attack Russian supply lines and support bases inside Russia, or to concentrate a large scale air and missile attack on Russian forces surrounding any of their cities. Japan needs the ability to sink Chinese ships at long range, attack and destroy their naval bases to prevent their use to resupply the Chinese navy and the ability to attack Chinese airfields that are supporting the aircraft mounting attacks on Japan. Japan needs to be able to find and destroy Chinese ballistic missiles before the Chinese can launch them. China will be deterred from attacking if they know Japan can make the price of any attack more than it is worth to the Chinese. China does not respect kindness, restraint or democratic principals. The CCP sees all of those as signs of weakness, and weakness is an invitation to the Chinese to attack.

gintonicToday  09:17 am JST

 know that if Japan is given the right to munitions again, they will do exactly what they did in WW2.

The United States who fought Japan in WWII doesn't think so. In fact hasn't thought so since 1950. "

There are other countries who "think " differently. 

Well let's see...The US., UK, Canada, Germany, France, Australia, Philippines, Taiwan all think so. So, China, Russia, North Korea think differently. Basically any country that is against the US and it's allies don't think so. Of course not, it's to their benefit to keep Japan as unarmed as possible by whining about WWII.

Everyone is wondering if Japan is responsible enough to obtain strike capabilities that would end their false pacifist constitution.

Yes Japan holds a grudge from ww2 that's obvious .

And no the Japanese people don't have as much say in government decisions as some presume.

Yes Japan should be able to defend itself but however iam sceptical that is truly the reason for the justification of these capabilities .

Japan really wants nuclear weapons .

Better for Japan to be a strong neutral country and not try to be a leader.

Michael MachidaToday  09:15 am JST

"Americans are pleased with the current state of U.S.-Japan relations: More than eight-in-ten prefer that ties between the two nations remain as close as they have been in recent years or get closer. But Americans are divided over whether Japan should play a more active military role."

More nonsense. Nearly all Americans belive Japan should play a more active role and this view is bipartisan. The only ones who object are working for, or influenced by China and they are an insignificant minority.

Of course the so called experts would want Japan to rearm itself. There's a lot of money to be made in this business. A vague threat from China which doesn't even make any claims to Japanese territory beside the senkaku isles does not justify spending trillions of yen especially in the dire economic situation that Japan is in right now.

Tortoise,lots of these weapon have anti jamming counter measures ,Google Anti Jamming Proof Munitions

Former PM Abe, (whose brother is the defense minister, grandfather a war criminal), has advocated going to war under orders of a certain country to restore japan to a regional power that once invaded all our neighbours. Can’t see Article 9 lasting much longer.

gintonic

@OssanAmerica:

"More nonsense. Nearly all Americans belive Japan should play a more active role and this view is bipartisan. The only ones who object are working for, or influenced by China and they are an insignificant minority."

The only people objecting are China stooges? Wow, thats a pretty big call, you know this as a proven fact, do you?

Ossa America seems a bit confused about that:

OssanAmericaToday 09:05 am JST

Any reservations come from the Japanese people.

QED Japanese people who don't agree with the government's defense policies are CCP shills. Or possibly spies and traitors who should be rounded up and dealt with appropriately.

Bungle

Today 11:05 am JST

Kōmeitō are Socialists - chummy with the Chicoms and Vlad the Invader.

That makes the LDP Socialist collaborators.

Michael MachidaToday  09:28 am JST

Any movement committed to preventing war and building transnational solidarity must consider the threat of Japan’s remilitarization. Empowering and arming Japan’s far right would be the worst mistake in the region.

Japan's "far right" is nothing compared to the threat that the CCP poses to the world, in interms of capability and and size. You're anti-Jp rhetoric is at least 10 years outdated. BTW, guess who has and continues to suppoprt Japasn's right wing? China and Russia's main adversary.

The probability of Japan "going back" to miltarism is zero. China amd North Korea are already Militant nations.

Tortoise,lots of these weapon have anti jamming counter measures ,Google Anti Jamming Proof Munitions.

I am aware of this. It is my day job. In a war with a peer enemy assume GPS will not be available. If you haven't noticed the US Navy is getting away from reliance on GPS and going back to celestial nav. They are also reviving Aviation Navigators. Aircraft like P-3Cs and C-130s used to be able to use celestial nav to get around. That capability will be restored. The US is also building a new form of LORAN called LORAN-E to use in the event GPS is denied. Incidentally ICBMs use celestial nav for mid course guidance while in space.

Why would China ever want to enter into an incredibly high cost & destructive conflict with Japan ( with the Japan-US alliance guaranteeing US involvement )?

The fear is Japan being drawn into a war with China through a third party, say a war in Korea or with Taiwan. In either situation Japan would almost inevitably be drawn in on the US and allied side. To defend either Korea or Taiwan US, Australian and other allied forces would almost certainly use bases on Japanes soil, giving China a reason to attack. Do not assume such a war would necessarily escalate to a nuclear confrontation.

RodneyToday  10:32 am JST

Former PM Abe, (whose brother is the defense minister, grandfather a war criminal)

Let's cut this big lie shall we? Nobusuke Kishi was never charged, tried or convicted as a "War Criminal" by the Allied powers. For this reason he was never considered a War Criminal by the International Tribunal for ther Far East. Only J-bashers keep repeating this false label.

Yes, obviously war is rather very dirty as we regrettably even have to watch again on a daily basis now, so you have to take such dirty measures too. But in this specific case you most of all need to outnumber the potential enemy, who relies on a strategy with many missiles, so taking out a few launch pads by preemptive strikes doesn’t improve the situation significantly. Right from the start you have to send an outnumbering answer on their fist few attempts, just to ‘help’ them considering to stop the whole thing. If they ever feel they have a chance of some first missiles coming through into the targets here, they are becoming wild and send the whole package which is not possible to intercept by the concepts or strategic considerations we are discussing here.

The best defense is a good offense.

The bureaucracy of Japan is keep making a controversial discussion in an endless talks to keep those officials in their post until retirement ! Keep talking.....when dogs keep barking, you know they won't bite!

If these closed-door hearings were open to former high ranking official experts only and the details of the private hearings remain undisclosed then how is this constitutional anyway?

This decision affects everyone in Japan and not only for the government to decide.

What kind of democracy is Japan thinking ?

gintonicToday  11:59 am JST

Thats true - he was never tried as the Truman administration preferred to have a number of Class A War criminals pardoned ...Many of these suspected war criminals were able to move smoothly into politics, the bureaucracy, and big business

https://www.pacificwar.org.au/JapWarCrimes/USWarCrime_Coverup.html

I'm surprised that you haven't got more downvotes from the resident pro-LDP nettuyoku shills. There only seem to be two or three of them yet anyone who has anything to say that they don't like always gets about a dozen downvotes. Curious, that.

Kōmeitō are Socialists - chummy with the Chicoms and Vlad the Invader.

actually they are a Japanese religious cult. Japan only.

The government/people pay out a exorbitant sum for the protection from US forward bases, a huge military, air, sea, under a nuclear umbrella. This protection is defined in a joint US/JPN security pact treaty.

Japan-U.S. Security Treaty

https://www.mofa.go.jp/region/n-america/us/q&a/ref/1.html

There is also a substantial annual defence budget.

Humbly, is there any need to spend or commit the j tax payer to contribute to any policy that would provide a government, present or future to unilaterally strike a perceived threat?

I suggest suspect, there is a yearning within the government to change Japan defense posture, and particularly article 9

Good point, dbsaiya. Stay out of war and let the SDF chop up fallen trees. No war since 1945! Everyone one living in Japan should thank their lucky stars

Because of the Komeito, we received ¥300,000 during the Covid and from the LDP a useless facemask.

Dont forget the face masks were a present by Mr. Abe. The were not useless but showed how much Abe cared for the general public.

Japanese people who like peace do not want such horrible weaponry

Indeed, we all want peace. Ukraine too wanted peace and gave up its Soviet weapons stockpile including Nuclear weapons. Now Putin takes advantage of its weak neighbor that does not have the ability to strike back with its own conventional armed ballistic missiles. They all wish now they had not given up that defense ability.

Japan wants peace, so needs to arm itself for peace. As long as a number of Japans neighbors have such ability themselves and Japan does not, it is vulnerable and weak in comparison. Just look at Ukraine cities to see what others are willing to do when they want your lands. Thousands of civilians killed and millions displaced because Ukraine had no allies and no ability to strike back over long distance when invaded. Japan has one ally right now and all its eggs in one basket. Best to have your own options at hand and hope you never need to use it.

Upper house election coming up soon. Let's see how the people would judge the realities. Hope those bunch of non-realistic peace dotage and useless cultic bloody-tax eaters all lose their seats.

I know that if Japan is given the right to munitions again, they will do exactly what they did in WW2

That is called 'scaremongering" and has no basis for being true. Just because Russia is doing what it did to Finland in 1939 under Stalin, to Ukraine under Putin in 2022 does not mean Japan has returned to nationalistic ways and desiring to build an empire in Asia. That mantle is being handled by China and Xi these days.

In addition, Japan has the right to arm in any way it chooses to. It is a sovereign choice, not someone else's to make.

Understandable response to ever growing threats to national security. I would suggest strategic and tactical nuclear weapons.

I know that if Japan is given the right to munitions again, they will do exactly what they did in WW2

That’s like assuring Germany will do exactly what it did, and all ex-Western-powers will do what they have done over all-over the world.

bokudaToday  07:17 am JST

Do not let Japan have any strike capabilities.

Japan will repeat all the atrocities they did on WW2 is you let them the chance.

More you read this kind of disgusting post, the more certain you would be that this kind of disgusting post from such disgusting posters is nothing but racism/hate speech. The very first task Japan must do is to kick out these residents out of the country

Give us guns, guns, and more guns, so we can protect our families. What would happen if they gave us guns?

Unfortunately, is necessary to be prepared for war, for self-defense as it is absurd that a member of the UN Security Council can cowardly attack a neighbor country and neighbor countries cannot individually help as they are members of NATO (Poland wanted to allow their MIG planes to be sent to Ukraine but the US did not agree). What happened to Ukraine can happen to Taiwan, can happen to the disputed islands. It is regrettable that instead of giving steps to build a better world still under the negative effects of the pandemia that Russia chooses to make large steps, towards the past, using brute force instead of dialogue, diplomacy. It is a pity, billions of money could be used to turn the world in a better place to all mankind but it is a real threat these lunatic despotic leaders with nuclear power at the reach of their fingers and evil minds...

For better chance of survival Japan needs to live with head in the sand forever....

Yes Japan knows all to well how necessary it is to protect itself from foreign aggressors because Japan itself was a a lethal aggressor that sneak attacked many countries.

Thankfully it seems as though times have changed and apparently Japan is trying very hard to be a team player.

Hard to believe tho how sincere Japan really is and not vengeful.

The proof is in the pudding.

so taking out a few launch pads by preemptive strikes doesn’t improve the situation significantly

This is why the US developed the F-117 and later the F-35. All aspect stealth allows the aircraft and long range stealthy UASs like the RQ-180 (and before that the TR-3A) to roam enemy territory more or less freely since they are not detectable on radar, looking for enemy mobile missile launchers and air defense systems to destroy. Back at the end of the Cold War the discussion was to use the B-2s to take down the USSRs ICBM force using precision guided hard target penetrator bombs with conventional high explosive warheads while the F-117s would roam eastern Europe looking for the Soviets SS-24s on their mobile launchers. Basically whittle down the USSRs nuclear arsenal without resorting to nuclear weapons. The US Navy had every Soviet boomer tracked at all times and those weren't going to last long either. Today the F-35 fulfills the old F-117s mission and then some as the F-117 had zero air to air capability and limited sensors and networking compared to the F-35. This is the whole reason the US and the other F-35 partner nations went though the agony and expense of developing that airplane. And with precision guided munitions one airplane can destroy as many targets as it has bombs in a single sortie. That F-35 can fly into an enemy's airspace and take out four or six enemy mobile missile systems in one flight depending on what it is carrying.

obladi

a slippery slope.

Another small step to become a normal nation, having rights to protect themselves.

bokuda

Japan will repeat all the atrocities they did on WW2 is you let them the chance.

China is "Japan" today. Japan is not.

Surely defense experts should not be extolling ‘offensive capabilities’ ?

China is "Japan" today. Japan is not.

The Japanese raised the bar very high with Unit 371 and Tiananmen massacre.

China will have to try very hard to top out Japan there.

bokudaToday  04:03 am JST

China is "Japan" today. Japan is not.

The Japanese raised the bar very high with Unit 371 and Tiananmen massacre.

China will have to try very hard to top out Japan there.

Tiananmen massacre？ Another trial to pass the buck to the devil Japanese?

A pointless exercise. Except to waste money. Be like Switzerland or Ireland. Neutral.

China would flatten Japan. Nor will Japan ever be a military power, let alone Empire.

The USA keeps its client-state as the first line of defense in Asia.

Diplomacy, trade and economic power will persevere. China is an economic power, with no need to encroach on Japan.

The last war ended with two nuclear bombs but the next war will begin with hundreds of nuclear bombs. Do the Japanese people really have confidence that their corrupt and inept leaders will keep them out of the next war?

It is a no-brainer for today's world with the three mad men Kim, Xi and Putin, and all three are within a stone's throw from Japan's territories. Peace does not mean waiting till those guys have started raining missiles on your major cities. Japan has to get serious about its own defense.

The only problem is that North Korea is technically a territory of ROK, hence any preemptive Japanese strikes on North Korea means a preemptive strike on the ROK, hence an automatic counterstrike from the ROK on the point of Japanese attack origin.

gintonicApr. 4  10:35 am JST

The only people objecting are China stooges? Wow, thats a pretty big call, you know this as a proven fact, do you?

You already lost the argument when you parroted Russian propaganda about NATO expansion and took the side of autocratic China and North Korea.

Satoshi Morimoto, Shotaro Yachi, Shigeru Kitamura and Ryoichi Oriki are special advisors to the NSS and advising the government to possess capabilities to pre-emptively attack enemy missile sites? They are conservative, rightist-minded bunch of people, looking at security matters only from jingoistic perspectives.

For these people, Article 9 of the pacifist constitution is virtually non-existent, that states: "(1) Aspiring sincerely to an international peace based on justice and order, the Japanese people forever renounce war as a sovereign right of the nation and the threat or use of force as means of settling international disputes; (2) In order to accomplish the aim of the preceding paragraph, land, sea, and air forces, as well as other war potential, will never be maintained. The right of belligerency of the state will not be recognized.

Have they forgotten militarism, colonialism and jingoism did destroy Japan to the nail in the last war, culminating in two atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Haven’t the Japanese people learnt the essence of Article 9 of the Constitution because of that war, which powers that be touted as a sacred war? Was the pacifist constitution really forced upon Japan by the U.S. via GHQ, as right wingers say?

Is it the war-renouncing constitution or the bilateral Security Treaty, that has helped Japan maintain peace for the last 77 years?  Remember that the promulgation of the pacifist constitution on May 3, 1947 after long wars of attrition ended was celebrated with pomp and circumstances by the whole nation. In this sense, the new constitution was Japan’s own making, not something forced upon by the GHQ.

Hasn't the U.S. been encouraging Japan to revise the constitution and fight foreign wars along with it?  Take the Gulf War, for example. Washington urged Japan to enter the war and contribute to it physically and militarily in spite of the nation’s wish to the contrary.

A war-renouncing spirit was permeating almost everywhere in post-war Japan. The Hiroshima cenotaph, for example, has assured atomic bomb victims by saying: "Please rest in peace, for the error shall not be repeated."

The Okinawa peace declaration proclaimed every year by sitting governors at the Mabuni Peace Memorial Park on June 23 is replete with the same antiwar spirit.