Japan hopes to leave agriculture out of U.S. trade talks

I heard that purchases of weapons from America by Japan is not regarded as trade. If it is included, trade deficit of America with Japan may be different.

The US is in the driving seat. It doesn't need Japanese products

I totally agree. Finally we have in America a leader with the strength to decide what America needs and what it does not. He probably has a spreadsheet.

Farmers have 3 times more voting power, the government wants to leave it out to stay in power

The US is in the driving seat. It doesn't need Japanese products.

Laughable.

USA relies on Japanese B2B.

Some examples...

Many broadcast studios in America use Sony and Ikegami cameras. This sector is thoroughly cornered and there is NO suitable non-Japanese replacement because the quality can only go down from there.

Without Panasonic's expertise, Elon Musk's quest for cheap electric cars will still be just a dream.

and there are many more, you just don't see them because B2B.

I would like more reasonably priced meat, butter and vegetables... bit of competition might be nice there.

Red suns at Mar. 12, 2017 - 08:25AM JST Without Panasonic's expertise, Elon Musk's quest for cheap electric cars will still be just a dream.

Hardly relevant to this moment in time.

Li-ion battery technology in 18650 and the upcoming 2170 format Tesla will be using are mature technology. Both LG and Samsung are more than competent to replace Panasonic products.

Also, cutting edge research into safer and higher density energy sources are being carried out by mostly American companies, not Panasonic.

Japan hopes to leave agriculture out of U.S. trade talks, hoping the US negotiating team fails to notice. It's a rock and a hard place, slip agriculture in under the table, and the powerful JA lobby will be hammering down the Prime Minster door pitch forks in hand.

Question is how much price increases can we expect by the goods being shipped halfway around the globe.

Walmart/Seiyu is not all that much cheaper, neither were the ASDA owned stores

itsonlyrocknrollMAR. 12, 2017 - 08:59AM JST Japan hopes to leave agriculture out of U.S. trade talks, hoping the US negotiating team fails to notice.

The hilarious thing is, it could actually work. Trump is obsessed with American cars in Japan. He keeps telling people that Japan has some kind of tariff on American cars with his only evidence being that Japanese people don't tend to buy American cars. Which means it's fairly obvious he's never been on a Japanese street or seen a typical Japanese parking space.

With that kind of fanatical obsession with the last century's industries, yeah, I bet Trump wouldn't even notice if we don't talk about food.

Question is how much price increases can we expect by the goods being shipped halfway around the globe.

Walmart/Seiyu is not all that much cheaper, neither were the ASDA owned stores

It's called tariffs, mate; but what JA doesn't want, is competition.

US wants to sell Lorain rice to Japan. But it does not emphasize beef.. Kosher meat may appeal to "epee who don't want to be fat. There re vegetables that Japanese farms do not plant. Japan can export short grain rice to USA People still love eating sushi and only northern Japanese farmers cultivate sushi rice but their children do not become farmers. There are difference milk products and tomato based sauces that Japanese may enjoy. .

DogdogMAR. 12, 2017 - 09:35AM JST You're going off on the classic Japanese tangent of directing this towards auto parts.

I'm not the one who complains about American cars in Japan every time the topic comes up, that's Trump you're thinking of.

Personally, I'd love for Japan to open up its agriculture markets. I get really sick of the very limited varieties of food that every supermarket in the country has the exact same stock of. I'm just saying it's hilarious that Japan may be able to avoid opening up just because America's current president's view of the world hasn't budged since the economic issues of the 1980s.

Japan would like these negotiations to be just about auto parts,

That's an odd thing to claim given that complaints about auto tariffs always come from the US directed at Japan and never go the opposite direction.

Hi katsu78, I cant make head or tail of President Trump, he is a total enigma to me. Trump certainly has put the wind up the Government of China, not sure that is a good thing.

Food prices in Sunshine are far to high for families, there is no denying that. American beef has a advantage in price when it reaches the shelves. At Coco's there is a deal for two steaks for the price of one, around 990 yen, with chips.I buy meat from a butcher because I a have crazy carnivorous indulgence for wagyu, sometimes middle four figures per one hundred grams.Guy there said he would go out of business if America, Canadian, or Australian beef had unfettered access to the market here. I don't know what will happen, both japan and US will have to find a compromise. I am not sure if one is there.

One overriding fact is Japan has an almost a zen like skill and ability to design and build cars that suits the worldwide market, at every level. It's production methods are a marvel to witness. It is not down to just technical know how, it as if nature looked down as decided where motor vehicles will be made.

There is a catch, J Cars are functional not aesthetic.Park an E Type Jaguar and kids want to sit and make brum brum noises in the drivers seat, families stand around and take picture,all oblivious to the fact it overheats, leaks oil, and regular as clockwork breaks down. The US had deigned some gems too, Mustang, Stingray, GTO....

These talks will probably not end well.

.Park an E Type Jaguar and kids want to sit and make brum brum noises in the drivers seat, families stand around and take picture,all oblivious to the fact it overheats, leaks oil, and regular as clockwork breaks down.

Is that really a surprise? That is a model from 1961-1975. Can you honestly say that back during that time Japanese cars were of that much higher quality or were even equal in quality to american and European car brands back then? Heck what car from that time period didn't over heat, leaked oil and on regular clock broke down? It has really only been in the past 10-20 years at most that car quality, especially durability really improved for all brands. It is very difficult now a days to not get a car that can go 10k miles between oil changes.

"We’ll go with areas where a deal may be easier, such as infrastructure projects,”"

Why easier? US projects are - or at least should be - contracted through open tender. Japan is basically proposing to undermine with this fair and transparent process.

I own stock in a Canadian company that must compete aggressively for infrastructure projects in the US. Why should the Japanese get automatic access thru a political deal? Crazy.

My feeling is that Japan will increase imports of oil from the US. The trade deficit with the US will decrease and Trump will be happy, but little else will have changed.

No country has to bow down to the US on trade. The US is far from being a free trader.

Japan hopes to leave agriculture out of U.S. trade talks

Good luck with that.

Here we go again JA flexing its muscles. The farming population is dwindling due to the aging of the farmers, and the self sufficiency of Japan is less than 40% here is an article from the japan Time,Feb 2008:http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2008/02/26/reference/japan-needs-imports-to-keep-itself-fed/#.WMSlNxhh2Ho. Agriculture should be deregulated first here in Japan, JA has kept the prices ridiculously high for decades. The rhetoric they use is that the Japanese quality is superior to all imported products. Thats a myth that been sold to the Japanese public and they have believed it. At present around 60% of fresh produce is imported, and the prices controlled by JA. Open up the market competition here first, and then the public will see the benefits.

I can't say from experience, before my time, Noliving, I owned a Honda motorcycle from the 70's once got me from a to b in London.

My Mother has a Datsun120y, it suffered from 'rust' worm. The engine was reliable, unfortunately from her recollection that was all that remained after a few years parked in the open.

How much does the average farming household make in Japan ? Does anyone know ?

The Japanese agricultural industry is built on a 'legal' price fixing racket, which they are not going to give up. Farmers of all the staple fruits and vegetables, rice, tomatoes, melons, nashi, lettuce, etc. are paid to not grow them in order to keep the prices high and to stop a glut of produce, which would in turn force prices down. It's quite a daft system. The extra revenue raised from keeping prices high is used to pay the farmers not to grow. Personally, I wouldn't look forward to an increase in US produce if US beef is anything to judge the standard by. The US beef that gets to my local supermarkets is always fatty and cheap cuts like, shoulder and chuck steak. Whereas, the Aussie beef is always nice cuts of rump and sometimes even fillet steak. The Aussie beef is purposely produced for the Japanese market, but it seems the US only send the junk to Japan. Japan needs to import up to 70% of its foodstuffs and this is why they protect the domestic produce with price fixing. It was a good practice some 30 odd years ago when the economy was booming, but now the economy has stalled they really need to open the markets to increase consumer spending, thus making the sales tax increases actually produce revenue. In the three years since the sales tax increase consumer spending has dropped by 10% on average, but it's up to 25% in some sectors like, major department stores, Isetan, Tobu, Takashimaiya, etc. Trump is only interested in getting a slice of the Japanese market for his own personal triumph. Japan does not need a glut of junk US produce.

I am an American living in Japan. I would rather not see U.S. food products enter this country. Not interested in GMO products or growth hormones in my diet. Yesterday was at the store and bought some meat for yakiniku. We bought one U.S. package and one in Japan. The difference in quality and taste was remarkable. The Japanese beef was far superior.

I hope Japan does protect its agricultural industry. Food is a basic in a nation's security.

Guessing Agriculture means "rice" American beef has been locked out of a number Asian countries due to mad cow disease - Australia beef has no problems accessing Japan.

Andrew - Surprisingly there is alot of American beef in Japan. Bought some yesterday and it is generally available at grocers selling bulk or less expensive products.

Personally, I am not in favor of some sort of 'near-total' deregulation as it would place J farmers in an unsustainable position. When we talk about industries, agriculture, products etc ppl tend to forget lives and livelihoods are at stake.

Ask thousands of aussie dairy farmers what deregulation meant to them when supermarket giants coles and wollies started selling a litre of milk at a dollar (jpy85-90). Same for millions of small/medium size farmers all around the western world. Total deregulation may bring prices down it also kill/ruin ppl. I personally do not want to live in a world even more dominated by ultra-capitalism where only the biggest/most powerful live and thrive.

There is no question JA could do more (wine and other goods are already widely available in japan at a very reasonable price) and open some agri markets to foreign competition but total deregulation isn't the answer. I'd rather spend a few extra yens on a kilo of rice/milk etc if I know producers make a decent living out of it rather than save 40jpy and 'contribute' to someone's suffering.

Tokyo-EngrMAR. 12, 2017 - 11:32AM JST Andrew - Surprisingly there is alot of American beef in Japan. Bought some yesterday and it is generally available at grocers selling bulk or less expensive products.

Agreed. It's generally a lot cheaper than Japanese beef as well. I pretty much only buy American or Australian beef here - I pretty much only buy Japanese beef when it's discounted because it's close to expiring and I'm looking for something to cook that day.

You know, while I do want Japanese agri markets to open more, I do wonder how it is that Americans can complain the Japanese market is unfair given the extreme degree to which the American government subsidizes corn and cotton production.

Any poloticial advantage from businesses should be taken away like farmers' in Japan. Sorry to say, but choice for food is indeed limited in Japan and price crazy sometimes (200 yens for 3 medium potatoes lol in konbini sometimes). Of course Japanese food is good quality for that price but you moust leave it to consumer what he wants to eat and what price, not be forced to be on diet. Having a family to feed in Japan is a rip off. Japan win win situation is a lure. I would like Trump to force the change. USA decides, not a one third in population country which has its demography dropping like a stone and going on a forced diet everyday. True that Japanese cars are just better in quality/price, that is a fact.

PS: Red suns remarks about J-girls. So true ! (My wife was so nicer with bumps, lost them while in Japan.. ;( )

Japan hopes to leave agriculture out of U.S. trade talks

Yeah. Good luck with that!

Non gmo pesticide laced food please!

I don't want American agricultural products in Japan. I don't care if the US has a trade deficit.

If Trump can midnight tweet about America first, Japan can put Japan first.

The US has plenty of onerous tariffs and trade restrictions to protect its own industries, so how about we just spin down the false narrative that Japan is somehow unique in protecting its farmers and domestic industries...

USA: global leader in whining because no one wants what it makes (poorly). Sheesh. The US even has trade deficit with India. India!

Are all of you USApologists going to be alright, or do you need some tissues and counseling?

hey while im all for cheaper agricultural goods, presently Japanese consume more per capita of American good (about $500 yearly) than vice versa (about $400) forcing Japan to import more American goods just because Trump wants to balance the deficit is hardly fair trade, and certainly not balanced

American government subsidizes corn and cotton production.

America needs to cut this agro-corp welfare.

“What’s important is to create a win-win situation for both sides. This is not something where one side wins and the other loses,” Shunsuke Takei, parliament vice minister at Japan’s foreign ministry, told Reuters in an interview, but did not comment on specific areas of negotiations.

BS, Japan has been winning for almost 4decades straight LOL!! And now wants win/win, gee that's sounds wonderful.

The problem in Japan is farmers votes are worth too much compared to urban voters that needs to change BUT Japan has done nothing!

The problem is Japans farms are too small & inefficient, Japan has had decades to remedy & has done basically nothing!

Japans farmers are getting older & dying off & Japan has done next to nothing to bring in young people & NEW ideas.

Folks the problem isn't that the US will push Japan to open agriculture sectors(clearly LONG overdue!!), the problem is for the last 50years Japan has done next to nothing to improve agriculture.

And I predict even if foreign rice was much cheaper a LOT of Japanese would still by J-rice anyway.

Bottom line is Japan has had its cake & eaten it for decades at other expense, Japan is NOT what she used to be, changes they are a coming!

Alas instead of doing it on its own it will once again be GAIATSU that moves things along, same as we are seeing with smoking in restaurants & male only golf clubs, Japan just WONT do what's right/needed on its own, when clearly it should be doing so!

most american food are gmo

most american food are gmo

Coming soon...

You heard it here first!

Expansion of mandatory GMO labeling in Japanese groceries on any good coming from USA.

Butter, cheese, anything dairy basically, is way overpriced here--basically double what it costs in the U.S. As a result, anything that requires these ingredients are similarly overpriced. Considering that the average Japanese salary is half of what it is in the U.S., the effective prices are quadruple that of the U.S--for no other reason that bad government policies. Ever wonder why trans-fat-loaded margarine is still popular here in Japan? Partly because the Japanese people are oblivious to the health risks, and partly because it's all that the people can afford.

trump is a joke.I live in America.We have a trade deficit because no one in the world wants the junk we make.The only products the world's 6.7 BILLION consumers really want from America are Apple Iphones,Microsoft operating systems,Boeing Airliners and Heinz ketchup. There isn't ONE PRODUCT Americans make that someone else doesn't make that isn't comparable or better.You can't win a trade war when you don't make anything the world can't do without. Samsung.LG and Huawei sell more cell phones than Apple.We don't make ANY televisons (we just sold Vizio to the Taiwanese), nor do we make computers inside the borders. The Germans,Japanese and South Koreans make superior automobiles. Try buying clothes made in the United States.The Mexicans are already buying grain from other countries,endangering our farmers.You can't sell products to people when they don't like the buffoon in the White House.America's bottom feeders elected an incompetent,and he's going to cause another epic economic collapse just like Hoover,Reagan,and Bush/Cheney did. It's just a matter of time.

Farmers of all the staple fruits and vegetables, rice, tomatoes, melons, nashi, lettuce, etc. are paid to not grow them in order to keep the prices high and to stop a glut of produce, which would in turn force prices down. It's quite a daft system.

I agree that it is daft. (Decided by daft bureaucrats and selfish people). It would be better just to allow imports, but guarantee an income to farmers if their income drops too much. Keep the fields in production except for the fallow every 5-6 years.

As much as I dislike Mr Trump, I am not to sure weather if this, bully boy approach to the rest of the worlds leaders will work in the long term, Its nice to see a president with some sort of conviction to get the job done, rather than presidents who take years to change a few things, but is this aggressive stance going to hold up? he certainly has shaken the whole economy up.

@bones Japan uses 4 x as much active ingredient of pesticides per hector as US and one of the biggest reasons is because Japan has not modernized agriculture by introducing crops with novel traits. Regardless, CRISPR technology is about to leave GMO crops in the dust and Japan will be even further behind.

Go slog your snake oil fear mongering elsewhere.

Japan should reduce the export to US until US deficit with Japan disappears.

While the trade deals are in the making would be a great and big bonus time for Japan to join the rest of the cell phone market and get rid of the bogus, 2 yr. contract system period.

American beef tastes like cardboard, buy Australian beef the taste is the best.

Without food tariffs and farm subsidies, the LDP would lose it's hold on the government.

Back in the post-war years, Japan's voting system was formulated to make the election system "fair" by giving rural voters more than one vote per person (today they get an average of 3 votes per per person). By heavily subsidizing the agriculture sector (which makes up less than 3% of the economy) the LDP has managed to buy almost every election since it first came to power at the end of the occupation.

Even though the vast majority of Japanese are not farmers, and most now live in metro areas, those who live in the countryside are still the most formidable voting block. If the LDP were to lose the power to buy their vote, the LDP would actually have to campaign on their governing merits (of which they have absolutely none).

So, the LDP will certainly not allow free trade in agriculture, even though high food prices in Japan are one of the reasons the population is in decline. Before anyone tries to say that food is reasonable in Japan, on average, Europeans spend about 8% of their income on food. Americans spend less than 5%, whereas Japanese spend almost 13%.

Getting rid of food tariffs would greatly reduce the cost of living of the average Japanese. With wages stagnant, and decreasing demand making wage increases impossible, lowering food costs would be a wonderful boon to the vast majority of us who are not farmers. But, it will not happen, because it would be the end of Aso, Abe, Suga, and the rest of the LDP.

So? The US is the most stubborn society on the planet. They're heads start spinning at the mere mention of the words centimeter or Celsius.

Should we all whine about the olive oil not being the finest quality that the farmer in Spain or Italy gets?

This same moaning and hand wringing has gone on for all of those 25 years. Japan has an obligation to act in the interest of Japan and things Japanese. Shouganai.

Protectionism benefits the industry, but hurts the consumers. It's understandable why the Agriculture industry would want to protect their business, but the average Japanese should be opposed to any protectionism if he wants to enjoy a vast variety of products on a lower price. Self interest trumps nationalism.

Japan. Buy American rice and send to hungry nation. Import avocado and pineapples.

Dogdog

The Japanese government is addicted to these huge current account surpluses,

J govt is not addicted to current account surpluses because it might lead to stronger yen.

without them, because of the national debt, the Yen would become as worthless as the Zimbabwean dollar.

Japan's national debt keeps increasing regardless of current account surpluses. J bond is bought by Japanese so Japan will not become Zimbabwe.

Besides, Japan's current account surpluses are not from trade (Japan is also trade deficit country) but from investment, interest, divident. So why are you against Japan reducing export to US?

@gogogo: Learn how to cook or change your stove. Beer meat raised and cared by American ranch cowboys are tender and delicious. Try to purchase Omaha beef. The beef merchants airmail to your door.

I saw the news article title and I thought to myself the comment section is going to be interesting. And sure enough, a lot of butt hurt, anger and stereotyping going on, on all sides.

One thing that many here are forgetting is that Japan lives and breath on trade, it's a resource poor, food insecure country. It much more trade dependent that many nations around the world, regardless of what your position is.

@ domtoidi, Many countries are stubborn, Japan is just an insular in many ways.

@ NURREDIN actually the US leads in many sectors around the world. If you want to see US global dominance look at the IT sector and Silicon Valley. I don't know about your figures about who sells more phones than Apple but that's irrelevant as it's about profit figures. You ignored the fact that Apple doesn't sell cheap phones in Third World countries while most other companies do. Also Huawei and ZTE both aren't doing well if you knew what you were talking about. High end smartphone market has hit saturation point for several years now. ZTE and Huawei's sales figures for smartphones in $$ are declining.

Also your comment about cars shows your ignorance as there is such thing as a national car manufacturer. Car manufacturers around the world share "platforms" and then rebadge them with a different brand and exterior. Also everyone hires international designers from around the world. South Koreans cars went from being jokes to serious competitors after they hired Japanese engineers as industry consultants and Western design teams to design their cars. Several Japanese manufacturers have car lines that are made in the US and exported back to Japan and the newest NSX was designed in the US.

@Redsuns while I agree with your sentiments however, Japan is a trade and export dependent nation while the US is less so. The US is more independent and secure in more areas than Japan is. The most basic among them is food security and energy security. With the US being more far more energy secure than Japan. So if everyone embargoed each other and trade around the world came to a halt, everyone would hurt but resource poor island nations like Japan would be devastated and struggle to survive.

@katsu78 While I agree with you, however complete free trade between nations doesn't really exist. It's really about reducing trade barriers, tariffs, subsidies, and regulations but not complete abolishment. Every nation will protect certain industries or sectors, America's not unique in that regard. For example US free trade agreement with several nations include guaranteed quotas on H1B visas as to secure US IT sector jobs for their citizens outside of green card lottery. So I don't think anyone in America expects complete and total regulation of the Japanese agriculture sector as no nation's ever done that in a free trade agreement with the US. I do believe Mexico gave up the most in terms of agriculture.

That's the second time in a week you've brought up that fact. and its a fact that many dont know, which is why I brought it again. Just because America runs a deficit with Japan doesn't make the two-way trade unbablanced. If there wasnt a deficit then Japanese would be buying more than twice as much per capita than Americans buy Japanese products. Can you tell me how this is fair or balanced?

For all the high minded talk of the need for trade liberalization and the spectre of American protectionism, we still have countries trying to exempt their sacred cows from these negotiations. Are you still confused as to why Trump got elected???

Japanese corporations have been creating their plants in USA, employ Americans and market in Japan. Ramen products are popular in USA. Instead of exporting from Japan, Nissin created factories in Calif,. employedAmerican people and marketing in USA. o

The Japan government are sitting on $10+ trillion public debt, a trap if rates are not nailed down at zero-ish, taking account global financial distress could is the force up JGB yields. Which explains why J Government is desperate for a U.S/E.U trade deal, not necessarily a FTA, something along the lines of a EPA (Economic Partnership Arrangement), a compromise, that might with a bit of jiggery-pokery, sleight of hand, morph into at least short to medium term economic growth.

The difficulty remains JA won't compromise, and there powerful political lobby could force change to LDP government from top down.. There is no possibility of opposition parties gaining enough ground to make any difference, assuming poll rates are correct at 9.2%.

Can Abe, and Aso,kid the kidder, in effect pull the hair down over Presidents Trumps eyes? That gift of a quality golf club might come in handy to stun him first.

Tina,

Every one of your arguments this month has been soundly defeated but other posters. Bring up some real facts, please.

bruinfan

You can easily check the fact that Japan is trade deficit country.

www.bloomberg.com/.../japan-s-exports-increase-less-t...

Putting them both on an equal price parity and off the top of my head, I would say that in terms of volume, the ratio would be a 3:1 advantage for Japan. total BS give me some actual credible statistics to prove your point. trade deficits arent calculated on the retail prices of said goods in each county, it the wholesale purchase price before export. Then were not even taking into account the 100s thousands of US workers employed by J companies manufacturing within the US, how many Japanese workers are employed making American goods sold in Japan, sweet F all, theyre all made in the US China or Mexico. Then lets get to the biggest currency manipulation of all the "Plaza accord" of the 80s which effectively forced Japan to strengthen its currency to suit American workers which Japan has never really recovered from. There's only so much a Japnese or American can afford to consume.　Forcing Japan to buy more American goods is fine as long as these goods are made in Japan by Japanese workers also, fair trade is fair trade.

Idaho potatoes have different type potatoes. Veggies are healthy old. Dressings in jars.

But the US does have a 50% tariff on pickup truck imports.

Nothing is as cut and dry or accurate as people like to think their posts are.

Farmers have 3 times more voting power, the government wants to leave it out to stay in power

Yes, Japan has this peculiar democracy based on square meters and geo-location and not based on citizen voting.

Nothing is as cut and dry or accurate as people like to think their posts are.

If we believed people's posts, or even so-called economic experts' reports, Japan's economy would have already been dead for about 20 years.

True therougou.

And how about the pundits here who have never posted a single comment in their thousands upon thousands of posts that wasn't sarcasm or bashing of Japan society of the people of Japan? And a few of them actually live in Japan.

Japan will push to leave agriculture out of its first economic talks with the Trump administration next month, sources say, hoping to prevent thorny topics such as its heavily protected farm industry from blocking other negotiations.

Japan will have to make major concessions like significantly increasing imports of U.S. fossil fuels mentioned here to get Team Trump to go along with it. The new president knows how to work a deal.

I predict the new president will do or say something so stupid that he will be impeached before his term is finished. Wait until Americans wake up to Trump's world of minimum wage jobs manufacturing cheap plastic crap in dirty factories. That'll really show the Chinese who's boss, right?