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Japan opposition pledges to tax the rich in election platform

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The CDPJ will call for a temporary lowering of the consumption tax from the current 10 percent to 5 percent

How about the 0% consumption tax we had in 1989?

16 ( +18 / -2 )

I totally agree that the rich should be taxed more as they really are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. Dropping the cosumption tax is a good idea but unless the government stops wasting money then the country will only get into more debt.

20 ( +21 / -1 )

effectively exempt people who earn less than around 10 million yen annually from paying income tax, 

Wow, that's a bold idea, who will pick up the slack. Companies? Who then in turn further slash bonusses to pay for this.

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

Make it 4mil, see what happens go from there.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

More shoe boxes full of cash in wardrobes. Way to go!

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

The CDPJ will call for a temporary lowering of the consumption tax from the current 10 percent to 5 percent and will effectively exempt people who earn less than around 10 million yen annually from paying income tax, according to the sources.

How could they lose with a platform like this? But this is an oligopoly, it will end up being a nominal rise in taxes for the rich that will probably not be paid ( see the Pandora and Panama Papers et al) and higher sales and residence taxes hitting workers.

I have yet to see coverage of Yamamoto's Reiwa Shinsengumi Party here. With a UBI and progressive environmental agenda I think the time would be right for them.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

The Democrats in the U.S. have a similar plan to tax the 0.1% rich and Corporation but cannot get Republicans to go along. It will be interesting to see if Japan can pull this off.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

The opposition's platform is so much more refreshing than the rot the LDP and Kishida are offering.

The CDPJ will call for a temporary lowering of the consumption tax from the current 10 percent to 5 percent

There shouldn't be a blanket consumption tax. Tax cigarettes and Alcohol at a much higher level than other goods. As for essentials like food, milk and especially baby and toddler items like diapers and clothes those should not be taxed at all. Personally I think its absurd to tax cigarettes the same as diapers. Shouldn't be in the same category.

6 ( +10 / -4 )

First, start with the consumption tax and get rid of those pesky 1 yen coins. Then open Pandora's box, empty the piggy banks of all the hidden loot from around the world and lock them up. Trim the pork and waste from government programs not forgetting to cut the budget for the military. Finally, revise tax laws to introduce some "Robin Hood" taxes on the "undeserving" rich.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

ou know how the rich buy those ridiculous price fruits well that is the only time they actually pay tax.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

The CDPJ's campaign platform will claim that "Abenomics," the policy mix implemented by the former Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and his successor Yoshihide Suga, has caused the gap between the rich and the rest of the population to widen.

No need just to make a claim. It's fact. See the link below for some good graphs detailing the degree to which Abenomics increased precarity and inequality.

https://apjjf.org/2018/6/INOUE.html

6 ( +6 / -0 )

The CDPJ will call for a temporary lowering of the consumption tax from the current 10 percent to 5 percent

The rich will bring forward their big ticket purchases and get them for a 5% discount at everyone’s expense, when the CDPJ said they were gonna tax them….

and will effectively exempt people who earn less than around 10 million yen annually from paying income tax, according to the sources.

This is a better idea - taxing income is a stupid idea in the first place, especially when the government just churns the money around and gives it back.

Anyway, I don’t see CDPJ as having any chance of taking power so it’s all a bit moot isn’t it.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

The Japanese Communist Party, which the same day unveiled its own campaign platform, vowed to give cash handouts of 100,000 yen to middle-income households and raise the minimum wage, currently averaging at 930 yen, to 1,500 yen per hour. Like the CDPJ, the JCP looks to lower the consumption tax to 5 percent.

The Communist Party needs to work on its PR campaign or maybe merge with the Reiwa Shinsengumi? And be more focused in its policy proposals? The old revolutionary slogans are not enough.

As has been reported , having many people earning around 200,000 a month (or less) in this gig economy are paying 30,000-50,000 yen at the end of the month after income taxes on the associated residence taxes, insurance etc. There would be riots if this were this case elsewhere. It is a regressive crime of taxation policy and should be a pillar of a reform agenda.

Especially with the Pandora Paper revelations about how little the wealthy contribute in taxes to the cpuntries where they were founded.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Well that means they just about sealed their loss at the next election.

Income tax is relatively low, residence tax, health insurance and pension however take a massive chunk out of a lower scale salary.,but is never mentioned.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

The CDPJ will call for a temporary lowering of the consumption tax from the current 10 percent to 5 percent

as a temporary measure

> and will effectively exempt people who earn less than around 10 million yen annually from paying income tax, according to the sources.

for only one year.

Should be reported exactly

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Seriously, does anyone actually think they have a chance in hell of winning? There’s a great tony Blair doc on the bbc at the mo showing how he made labour more than a socialist club. this party need to rebrand, find a focal point and a purpose-for example lowering taxes and actually helping people. Just entering on the chance people finally get fed up of abe taro aso et al is not a strategy..

5 ( +5 / -0 )

There shouldn't be a blanket consumption tax.

The more complicated you make it, the more burden that is on people who need to administer it. And the more exemptions you make, the higher the rate needs to be to collect sufficient tax revenues from it.

Singapore and New Zealand at least, and I’m sure other countries with smart tax systems, keep it simple with a single rate too.

Making food exempt, for example, means that the vast majority of people then pay no tax revenues for their food, etc, and that’s lost tax revenues that could have been redistributed to assist the needy.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Just give change a chance, clear out the bureaucrats. Try just try a different way without the ingrained self serving players, they are/were superfluous 20 years ago. Just stifling movement forward in 2021. They say they care about Japan but their actions tell a completely different story.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

You do not want to do that. America, Australia, Indonesia, and Singapore will be seeing alot of new rich Japanese residents if passed.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

MoskolloToday  09:07 am JST

Seriously, does anyone actually think they have a chance in hell of winning?

No, because it's a bit more complicated than how good their policies are or how well they campaign. They just don't have the kind of money that LDP dynastic politicians have been able to hoard up and pass down to their offspring or finance other candidates, so the CDPJ is probably going to have about a hundred fewer candidates than the LDP.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Erik MoralesToday  10:05 am JST

You do not want to do that. America, Australia, Indonesia, and Singapore will be seeing alot of new rich Japanese residents if passed.

Quite possibly but I don't think being intimidated by rich people should ever be a factor in determining government policy.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

That’s not a matter of intimidation, it’s just simple consequences. Policy decisions induce various behavior changes, and good policy making would take that into account.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Removing income tax for under 10 mil is actually not a bad idea. I think this is will result in stronger middle class and increase consumption.

However taxing the rich is a bad idea because rich companies will then start spending money on solutions outside Japan.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

If only politicians had the best interests of the population at their forefront. Sorry they the politicians probably they don’t understand the word “forefront” or “population” so there really is no hope. The Emperor should start handing out pilot googles, this is not going to end well for the population.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Removing income tax for under 10 mil is actually not a bad idea.

Yeah, I like it too.

But if someone making 10 million pays no tax, then I think they can certainly afford to pay for a lot of things out of their own pocket too.

They can afford to save for their own health care and personal retirement fund, for instance.

If people were to start spending their own money on themselves, in return for paying no income tax, then the out of control public spending could be reined in.

For the needy (the income level is debatable but certainly well below 10 million), let’s pay taxes for them to help.

However, I suspect having the middle class people pay their own way is not what the opposition has in mind. More public debt is.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

The entire reason for Abenomics aka Reaganomics is to fatten the coffers of the rich. That its only purpose. And dubbed a fraudulent policy by its author, David Stockman, a Reaganaut ideologue & budget director in the Reagan regime. A policy that was shown to be a failure almost 40 years ago, invoked by Abe, followed by Suga and now Kishida.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Speaking of this one-upping the LDP, there is a big story now about how a top Finance Ministry guy wrote a piece raising the alarm bells over all the crazy spending proposals by both sides at this election:

https://www.asahi.com/amp/articles/ASPBC6GZVPBCULFA00H.html

He is getting bashed by the politicians for it now, ironically he said the situation is like Japan as the Titanic heading towards the you know what.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Hi Richard, according to your source, he says they didn’t actually do Reaganomics:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mkD_5vGpfS8

Hmmm

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The more complicated you make it, the more burden that is on people who need to administer it.

economics is complicated.

And the more exemptions you make, the higher the rate needs to be to collect sufficient tax revenues from it.

no problem. you can raise the taxes on things like tobacco and alcohol and other things like that

Singapore and New Zealand at least, and I’m sure other countries with smart tax systems, keep it simple with a single rate too.

Yes, but that's because those countries are smaller and have a smaller wealth gap than Japan. So it makes sense.

Making food exempt, for example, means that the vast majority of people then pay no tax revenues for their food, etc, and that’s lost tax revenues that could have been redistributed to assist the needy.

Money here is not spent on the needy. It goes to pork barrel spending. If there is less money for that while the vast majority of people can save on the income tax, I'm all for it

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Good.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

That’s not working, because the rich will decrease jobs and wages or raise prices, invest less in other companies or product research etc., therefore following less global sales and incoming money as well as taxes for the country. And of course, the then even more poorer people will immediately spend those nice handouts, that are of course very attractive at first look only, and again make the rich richer and stay themselves poorer again after all is spent. Taxing and / or spending for all is by far not economically substantial, ecological green or lowering the gaps in wealth, in contrary, that is all very expensive and has to be paid and repaired afterwards again.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Taxes here are already exorbitant. And spent on wasteful nonsense. This is just dumb. Guess the silver lining is thatnthese clowns will never get elected

0 ( +2 / -2 )

 the vast majority of people then pay no tax revenues for their food

This is how things should be and should be a basic moral decision. No one should have to pay the government a spiff for something as basic as food.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Taxes here are already exorbitant. And spent on wasteful nonsense.  This is just dumb. Guess the silver lining is thatn these clowns will never get elected"

Thank the LDP for that...they have been in power continuously for around 70 years, ( apart from a handful of years Opposition managed to get in ). This screwed system was created by LDP and for LDP.

The opposition " clowns" as you call them need to win for precisely that reason...alas the electoral system here was made to ensure near perpetual Jiminto victory.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

No one should have to pay the government a spiff for something as basic as food.

One has to look at the tax regime and spending regime as the one system that they constitute, rather than bits of the system in isolation.

If everyone is contributing their fair share, and the money is spent appropriately, then I see nothing immoral about it.

If the rich and well off want to enjoy lots of fine steaks and pay lots of tax in the process, contributing funds that could be redistributed to the needy, what is immoral about that.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

no problem. you can raise the taxes on things like tobacco and alcohol and other things like that

Ok, run the numbers.

And how much it’s gonna cost to have the retailers all abide by your complicated rules.

Get back to me.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

The majority of working people are paying 20% or less in taxes, earning up to ¥6.5 million. 23% for up to ¥9 million. Less than American taxes.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Less than American taxes, but potential and reality to earn a higher wage less than Americans also.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

And how much it’s gonna cost to have the retailers all abide by your complicated rules.

Get back to me.

simple

Its called 源泉徴収

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

No, because it's a bit more complicated than how good their policies are or how well they campaign.

its a good bit more complicated than that.

In the last election, the LDP got a mere 33.28% of the popular vote, but 61% of the seats.

The opposition parties between them, not including the Komeito Party, got 52.9% of the popular vote, but only 27.95% of the seats.

Japanese national elections are rigged so that the LDP has to try really, really hard to lose.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

There shouldn't be a blanket consumption tax. Tax cigarettes and Alcohol at a much higher level than other goods. As for essentials like food, milk and especially baby and toddler items like diapers and clothes those should not be taxed at all. Personally I think its absurd to tax cigarettes the same as diapers. Shouldn't be in the same category.

Alcohol and tobacco is taxed much higher than 10% already though...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Alcohol and tobacco is taxed much higher than 10% already though

Keep the tobacco tax, increase the 10% consumption tax.

Maybe add in an air pollution tax, public nuisance tax and sheer stupid tax for good measure.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Vote for the CDPJ!! (God, I hope the Japanese voters are reading my posts here on JT.....)

2 ( +2 / -0 )

They could probably get a lot of votes if they say they will remove consumption tax completely on non-pre-made foods.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Alcohol and tobacco is taxed much higher than 10% already though...

But It’s still lower than the west.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Vote for the CDPJ!! (God, I hope the Japanese voters are reading my posts here on JT.....)

Agree

0 ( +1 / -1 )

The best measure is to drop the consumption tax for essential products, like food. It will benefit the poor while rich will observe no difference.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Best measure, dropping of the consumption tax? lol If I only have 200yen and something costs 550yen and another one 1100yen including 10% tax, then it’s irrelevant, if the tax is completely dropped or the price halved or even both measures together. It’s simply all still far out of reach.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Tax on the Rich? This is why CDPJ cannot mature, CDPJ should refer, at least, to the so-called ex-pats and multinational powerful foreign enterprises as the taxable source to finance for transforming this country back to the most successful socialistic country CCP China even respects, with all middle-classed 120 million citizen, none are the rich, nor the poor, no room for the Ghosn to manipulate to evade Japan tax.

Just say it

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

CDPJ. If you are the one, do not let the former convict with the criminal record of embezzlement of public money, or the suspect who could have kept lying about her nationality against the law..... to arrogantly speak and criticize your opponent in the diet. Don't just warn each of those, but you should kick those out, including the one who has just insulted the efforts of the families of abductees. Try to be perfectly clean if you can. Let's

see how you really are realistic and true

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

cleoToday  01:59 pm JST

"No, because it's a bit more complicated than how good their policies are or how well they campaign."

its a good bit more complicated than that.

In the last election, the LDP got a mere 33.28% of the popular vote, but 61% of the seats.

The opposition parties between them, not including the Komeito Party, got 52.9% of the popular vote, but only 27.95% of the seats.

Japanese national elections are rigged so that the LDP has to try really, really hard to lose.

Thank you for the clarification. I think supporters of the LDP would do well to reflect on those figures but I don't suppose they will as long as this deeply messed-up system continues to favour their "side." I suppose they will try to close their eyes to the blindlingly obvious fact that Japanese people don't actually want to be lorded over by these loathsome oligarchic old s**s with delusions of being daimyo* any more.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

The best measure is to drop the consumption tax for essential products, like food. It will benefit the poor while rich will observe no difference.

“Like food”, and everything else that a lobby group seems essential.

So MacDonalds is tax free? Mister Donuts? Whale meat products? Caviar?

After food, then what?

Health care? If so, then plastic surgery? LASIK eye surgery?

Books? Educational books?

DVDs for kids?

This is a big slippery slope that gets complicated fast, and I hesitate to point out that it’s just a matter of time before the Komeito crowd or someone else starts campaigning for some new consumption tax carve out.

The result, is to erode the low-rate, broad-based nature of the consumption tax, its very efficiency relative to taxing income etc is the reason it was introduced in the first place.

Why? To get tax revenues to support the needy. But then woodpeckers want to go and hollow it out…

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Ah, yep, all of the previous Kishida fans should be proud of their judgement that he was "The One" who would turn Japan around and improve the lot of the average Japanese person because, as always, 'pride goest before the fall' and a lower opinion of one's owns judgement might be the 'fall' called for in what we see now: Empty promises right out of the gate. And now will come all of the obfuscation, endless discussion, tedious debate about 'how', and. in the end, essentially no change at all. I suppose it's understandable given the choice between a strong woman and the most wishiest washiest of the males, that the male would be selected, and the demonstrable and unreasoning fear of females we see both in many Japanese males and many voices here seem to agree: Choosing 'Nothing' is a better choice than risking having a woman prove the men totally inadequate to their tasks and, perhaps, taking the country in a direction favoring its People rather than its parasites using a poisonous presumption that a woman as strong as Takaichi-san would be completely beholden to her mentors however much she may have found it necessary to sound like them to achieve leadership. Just another Shou ga nai ne...

0 ( +1 / -1 )

“Like food”, and everything else that a lobby group seems essential.

So MacDonalds is tax free? Mister Donuts? Whale meat products? Caviar?

Sure. Food products should be tax free.

After food, then what?

Then other things that should be tax free.

Health care? If so, then plastic surgery? LASIK eye surgery?

Health care - definitely. Plastic surgery - only if it's deemed essential (ie horrible disfigurement). LASIK - sure, that seems like a good thing to make tax free.

Books? Educational books? DVDs for kids?

Those seem like good candidates.

This is a big slippery slope

Ahh, the old "slippery slope" logical fallacy, that people throw out to say "we need to stay at this extreme, because any move to fix it can only result in the opposite extreme.

Americans are particularly prone using to the "slippery slope" fallacy, due to the binary thinking that country's legal and educational system have produced. Americans aren't so good at nuance, it's only A or B, black or white, right or wrong, with us or against us, democrat or republican and so on.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

You do not want to do that. America, Australia, Indonesia, and Singapore will be seeing alot of new rich Japanese residents if passed.

Unlikely. Rich people tend to stay around where they are most comfortable. But if rich people did leave, it would be no big loss, as once rich, rich people don't contribute to society

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Japan opposition pledges to tax the rich in election platform

Socialists are always looking to maximize poverty by bringing down successful people so they too can enjoy poverty with everyone else.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

So Strangerland, who is going to be in charge is deciding what products shouldn’t be taxed?

It’s simply not worth the trouble it all causes.

The smart, grown ups way is to take the money from taxation on whale meat and what have you and give it to the needy.

And in doing so the tax rate can be kept low and no army of bureaucrats need be employed to determine the taxation status of every single product under the sun.

once rich, rich people don't contribute to society

Lol :)

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

WolfpackToday  09:07 am JST

Socialists are always looking to maximize poverty by bringing down successful people so they too can enjoy poverty with everyone else.

Right, because everyone's desperately poor in Denmark, Norway, Sweden and Finland.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Sweden and Norway are socialists?

Then how come they abolished inheritance / wealth taxes?

Maybe they did an inverse Kishida maneuver and created a “new socialism”, which is not socialism?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Excuse me, Finland and Denmark abolished their socialist wealth taxes too.

https://www.cato.org/commentary/why-europe-axed-its-wealth-taxes

Because ”They raised little money and were a beast to administer.”

Same mistake as proposed by sales tax fiddlers here at JT.

Interesting I learn that New Zealand, with a flat 15% sales tax gets more in revenues than any other OECD nation (more than 30%). That is, more from that tax source means taxes on income can be lower, helping all those who go to the effort of earning income.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

fxgaiToday  12:52 pm JST

Excuse me, Finland and Denmark abolished their socialist wealth taxes too.

By that logic the USA is a socialist country because it hasn't.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

So Strangerland, who is going to be in charge is deciding what products shouldn’t be taxed?

The legistlators of course. The same way all laws work. It's the reason they are elected - to make such decisions.

Sweden and Norway are socialists?

Yes. You didn't know? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model:

The Nordic model comprises the economic and social policies as well as typical cultural practices common to the Nordic countries (Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Sweden).[1] This includes a comprehensive welfare state and multi-level collective bargaining[2] based on the economic foundations of social corporatism,[3][4] with a high percentage of the workforce unionized and a sizable percentage of the population employed by the public sector (roughly 30% of the work force in areas such as healthcare, education, and government).[5]

2 ( +3 / -1 )

By that logic the USA is a socialist country because it hasn't.

Funny you mention the USA. It’s not the only area where the US is more socialist than Sweden these days:

https://www.cato.org/policy-report/january/february-2020/swedens-lessons-america

The legistlators of course.

Wow. They’ll have their work cut out for them. And what do we have bureaucrats for?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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