politics

Japan revises law to make more part-timers join pension program

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So, let me see how this will benefit me (us).

Receiving the pension when you're 75 .... well, if you live that long. If not your payments more or less go down the "government drain"!

I personally prefer to retire when I turn 65, gives me 10 years more to re-collect my contributions.

19 ( +19 / -0 )

All this is about is increasing funding for the pension funds. WIth the aging society here, there are fewer and fewer people paying into the scheme.

This is going to be a killer for some businesses as their overheads are going to go through the roof!

11 ( +15 / -4 )

Receiving the pension when you're 75 .... well, if you live that long. If not your payments more or less go down the "government drain"!

Read the article again! "Eligible recipients" Meaning those who make a ton of cash already and dont need the retirement money.

What the government SHOULD do is drop the amount of money they can claim in a pension, based upon their yearly income. If they make above a certain amount, they shouldnt receive full benefits at all

4 ( +7 / -3 )

This is only about scalping more funds for their failed pension scam.

My Mrs paid over 60 grand into this scam over 20 odd years. Her benefit entitlement is only 13 grand. I got conned into laying just over ten grand into this scam and, now that I’m no longer living in Japan I want a refund. I have to wait at least a year before I can apply and my refund entitlement is only ¥140,000.

A pension fund is a fund that grows as an investment. The Japanese scam is more like another mandatory tax with a 15% rebate. It’s not a pension at all!

18 ( +19 / -1 )

So part time workers, that's about 60% of the work force now their ¥1.000 an hour needs to pay for cup noodles and a pension scam. Are politicians, bueacatics that disconnected from reality? It's a very said state of affairs

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Are they talking about the Social Pension Plan (社会保険) or the National Pension Plan (国民年金)?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

So more people can pay into this scheme which will more than likely be gone or very little by the time they get it, if they are still sucking air by that time, 70 was it to get your full wake? Lots better options available.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

You don't need advanced level math to discover this is just another "pension" scam to fleece the gullible, not to mention the joker in the deck: death!

10 ( +10 / -0 )

You don't need advanced level math to discover this is just another "pension" scam to fleece the gullible

What? Until now, employers weren't required to put their part-time employees on insurance. Now they will be required to. It will cost these companies more money, and will result in more employees with a pension.

How is that fleecing them?

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

Two mistakes:

If people postpone the starting age for five years, from 65 to 70, the monthly amount will increase by 42%, not 84%. 

“Under the current system, People aged 60 to 64 whose monthly wage is more than 280,000 yen”

Correction: whose combined amount of monthly wage and monthly pension benefits exceeds 280,000.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Part timers who get around 1000 per hr.and contract workers have no bonus.

Most companies in Japan pay around JPY200,000 starting salaries,English teachers get around 250,000

Subtract shakai hoken around 40,000

and your take home is around 160,000 to 200,000

Do the math from there.House rent,utilities,food,phone and internet bills,households, miscellaneous and other unseen bills and for foreigners sometimes you fly back to your countries to visit.

What you remain with after 31 days before the pay is peanuts or -ve

Go figure.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

I thought ponzi was illegal , unless of course youre the govt.

Worked here for quarter of a century and never ever paid i yen into their scam , never will. they can go suck the lemons.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

Stop forcing people for that scam already. I am out.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

Currently, the government asks people to begin receiving their pensions at 65 in principle, but allow them to do so at 70 in a bid to encourage people to work longer.

I don't have much of a pension, but if I had enough, the government encouraging me to work longer would get the middle finger.

All the government should be doing is not discouraging or penalizing people who continue to work. The decision to continue working should be the individual's alone.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Are politicians, bueacatics that disconnected from reality? It's a very said state of affairs

Yes, they are and sadly, yes, it is.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Ken - Do the math from there.House rent,utilities,food,phone and internet bills,households, miscellaneous and other unseen bills and for foreigners sometimes you fly back to your countries to visit

I did the math and that is why I left Japan. With pension, city tax, income tax and health insurance (all mandatory) it’s 35-40% of your measly salary gone before you even consider rent, utilities and living costs. For a foreigner, Japan is a great place for an adventure. However, forget being a long-term resident or you’ll become a financial prisoner stuck on the Nippon Kaigi hamster wheel.

9 ( +12 / -3 )

i think even 50 employees establishments be covered. then it is sensible idea .

1 ( +1 / -0 )

A tax by any other name.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

It’s such a monumental scam, luckily more and more people are realizing it and not throwing their money away to it. This new law is just another scam, as if they care about people.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

And as a result, companies will hire less part-time workers which will add to number of unemployed. another example of The Law of Unintended Consequences brought to you by those who are truly disconnected from reality.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Lets hope this law puts an end to the scam used by companies in Japan where they employ workers from noon until 9 everyday but class their employees as part time to avoid making any pension contributions.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Maybe start making companies hire full time on contract rather than purposely capping people so they are considered part timers, and thus limiting their exposure on benefits. And stop demanding foreigners pay into pension system when they aren't going to be able to collect what they pay into it.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

@yubaru, those who were making tons of money before and deficient of their taxes are those who are in dire need of retirement pension most of the time. Most of them had their own flourishing business which eventually went bankrupt and are in need of retirement pension in which their contribution are almost always incomplete for them to receive such.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Why not cut corporate welfare and military spending, and reduce the size of the bureaucracy, and use the funds to provide pensions, which should be means-tested based on your assets?

9 ( +9 / -0 )

This could also curb the rampant violation on work visas. This will make it easier to track and trace students or illegal workers who work and do overtime 4x than they are allowed to do.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Its a strategic approach in how to save the pension system from going bank rupt. The younger generation and including myself will be lucky to live pass 70 years old and be able walk without any complications. Japan has adopted the SAD diet called Standard American Diet and its purely a sad diet because our foods are 90% processed unhealthy foods we are consuming and causing cancer and heart attacks. So, yeah we give you your pension if you make it pass 75 and good luck.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

As a freelancer I'm expected to pay 16,000 a month in pension. I have no idea what I'll recieve for that.

I also have to pay about 25,000 a month in local tax, and 64,000 a month in health insurance for my family.

(Despite taking kids to the doctor regularly, we never get even close to using 25% of that cost!, and still have to pay a fortune for vaccinations and even pay for flu jabs!)

So that's basically 100,000 a month in taxes out of my monthly pay packet, before eevn thinking about things like rent, bills, food.

It's ridiculous.

PS/ Does anyone have any way of reducing these ridiculously high payments?

9 ( +9 / -0 )

|| PS/ Does anyone have any way of reducing these ridiculously high payments?

Yeah if we are luckily enough to find a job that pays more than 20 million yen a year.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

If you are a politician you get in three months the average wage it takes 12 months to earn. So to receive tax money in abundance whack a few posters around your house and hey presto you too can send yourself tiny masks.....still waiting for mine. Ok don't have to urge promise not getting them anyway.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Article is badly written and gives a very negative impression of the proposed change. I'm glad they are improving coverage of shakai hoken of part time workers. I think they should introduce it faster, so that people can build up enough contributions to have a reasonable pension. The payouts need revising upwards, as they are not enough to live on. Increasing the allowance so that you can earn a living wage is also right.

That said, the idea of incentivising people to keep working with the payback that your eventually payout will climb noticeably and makes it worth your while to do so is not a bad one. If you go into the pension office or use the online tracker, you can see how you are getting on. And once you get past 61, there is a lot of flexibility built in, so you can decide month by month. If you start to get hacked off with your job or the commute, you can just decide that month to start claiming pension. If your final pension is based on a mix of your contributions and the meter ticking, it is an incentive. Noone is being forced to work to 75, but if you feel healthy and want to keep working and contributing to the pot for another 3 or 4 years, surely that's a good idea for everyone.

This is completely different to raising the pension age, which is like moving the goalposts.

And once you have got 120 months of contributions, you qualify for pension, even if you are no longer in Japan.

It's certainly not perfect, but get the facts before you bash it out of hand.

What they should be doing and soon, is making more bilateral agreements, so more of us migrants can get pension based on contributions in our home or other countries.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Do the hustle,

I did the math and that is why I left Japan. With pension, city tax, income tax and health insurance (all mandatory) it’s 35-40% of your measly salary gone before you even consider rent, utilities and living costs. For a foreigner, Japan is a great place for an adventure. However, forget being a long-term resident or you’ll become a financial prisoner stuck on the Nippon Kaigi hamster wheel.

Smart move.You saw the writing on the wall.

Many foreigners come here at a young age and are mostly clueless as to what lies in wait.By the time they figure out what's happening,it's too late,they're already old and especially if you have family and bought a house, the situation gets murkier and you're already in the viscous cycle.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

I see several effect from this decision.

Part-timers:

1) Stop working

2) Stop paying taxes

3) Go into more debt

4) Increase crime

5) Work for themselves where they get cash in hand

People will have very little in savings each month. It makes it hard for folks to improve their lives.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Nator “Does anyone have any way of reducing these (health insurance) ridiculously high payments?”

A common ploy is for the breadwinner (you) to bail out altogether. The wife then enrols herself and the kids separately. Premiums are based on income; assuming her income is negligible, so too will be the amount she pays for health insurance for her and the kids. Out of the 3万円+ that stays in your pocket each month, set aside 1万円 as an accumulating health care fund to pay for your own medical needs.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

As a freelancer I'm expected to pay 16,000 a month in pension. I have no idea what I'll recieve for that.

I also have to pay about 25,000 a month in local tax, and 64,000 a month in health insurance for my family.

Ask an accountant or your local chamber of commerce if you'd be better off on shakai hoken with your spouse as a dependent. You and your business would both pay in, but you'd get health cover for your family, kosei nenkin for yourself, and kokumin nenkin for your spouse. It may work out less than the 80,000 total you pay now, you'd get a better pension, an extra pension for your spouse, and it may have tax benefits for your business.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

PS/ Does anyone have any way of reducing these ridiculously high payments?

Self employ. Write off everything as expense because the tax office does not audit individuals. No taxable income means 1500 yen per month in insurance. No income tax.

Write offs. Write offs. Write offs.

I ignore payment requests from the national pension office. They haven’t seized any money or property. Just keep your head low.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

My Mrs paid over 60 grand into this scam over 20 odd years. Her benefit entitlement is only 13 grand.

If it was as bad as that, your Disillusionment would be understandable. That it’s not, is easily ascertainable from the numbers you proffer. If you’re talking about 国民年金, 60 grand for one person is equivalent to over 35 years of payments, making her close to retirement age. At 65 her pension entitlement wouldn’t be much shy of 10 grand a year, payable for life. That 13 grand in total figure you adduce makes zero sense.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I am required pay almost 15 grands a year in this garbage of a pension program. I wish I could use that money to buy bonds/etfs and manage my pension money instead of having a low skilled komuin do that for me.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

@Nator - PS/ Does anyone have any way of reducing these ridiculously high payments?

Get off the Nippon Kaigi hamster wheel and get out of Japan!

All government agencies (city tax, health insurance and pension) have been ordered to clear all debts. They have no qualms about taking your whole salary without notice if you have arrears in any of these scams until the debt is cleared. The Japanese economy has been in a recession for the last two decades and it’s only getting worse. When I first cane to Japan in 2001 (nearly 20 years ago) salaries for public high school ALTs were around ¥250,00 paid for the full 12 months. Private high schools and universities we’re paying ¥300-400,000 per month fir the full 12 months. Now, 20 years later, the salaries are 20-30% less. Universities do not hire full time foreign teachers and only pay per class. Public high school ALTs are also on a per class contract, which amounts to around ¥200,000 per month with no salary during the vacation periods.

Get out of Japan while you still have sone dignity and integrity.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

I just wish they would put a real agreement in place between US social security - Japanese pension systems The one they have now is limited to short term expats which is only a small minority.

Also old age pensions are pretty important - it is forced savings for those who cannot get that organized due to low pay/high costs. But instead of adopt the US model, I wish Japan would look to Singapore's.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

“Universities were paying for the full 12 months........do not hire full time foreign teachers and only pay per class”

Even part time university instructors are paid all year round. Loaded to the gills with 20 or more 25-35K per month koma, there’s nothing to stop them pulling in 600K or more per month. As long as they keep their noses clean and do the bare minimum, universities even though they know full well that quantity and quality are usually inversely correlated, are loathe to call these modern day Stakhanovites out on spreading themselves so thin.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

I wish they'd do something like the UK where freelancers and self-employed people can pay lowered premiums, but receive reduced benefits.

If you're on the Employed Person pension scheme here, at least the company is paying half your rather expensive pension, and some (all?) of your horribly expensive health insurance. But if you're not an employee you're expected to pay the entire amount yourself.

I could have built up some pretty good retirement savings over the years if I hadn't needed to pay so much of my income over to them.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

When I first cane to Japan in 2001 (nearly 20 years ago) salaries for public high school ALTs were around ¥250,00 paid for the full 12 months. Private high schools and universities we’re paying ¥300-400,000 per month fir the full 12 months. Now, 20 years later, the salaries are 20-30% less. Universities do not hire full time foreign teachers and only pay per class. Public high school ALTs are also on a per class contract, which amounts to around ¥200,000 per month with no salary during the vacation periods.

When I graduated college, I also did eikaiwa but in Korea. Had a blast and it was a good experience living outside of my country. But, I also knew that I would go nowhere if I continued down that path so I went back to school 2 years later. I saw it as a life experience more than anything else.

If you realized that you're in a dead end job after 20 years of eikaiwa, you only have yourself to blame. Obviously, it's not a career choice to be in if you expect any type of financial rewards going up the social hierarchy. Most stay and do it because they love teaching or love to be living in their new adoptive home. There are some that are stuck because they had no ambitions and just lived day to day because the pay is excellent considering the skill set that is required to become one. Usually, they were the ones always in bars catered to foreigners complaining about what everything is wrong with the country and blaming all their woes on the country while not taking any initiative to learn the language and adopt to their surroundings.

Living in a different country is going to be difficult regardless of wherever you are. Becoming financially well-off is even harder. Owning a business or having a specialized skill set are ways to have a leg up in society, not just in Japan. But that also takes a tremendous amount of work and having a business always carries significant risks of failure. Finally, there are options where you can apply for foreign companies located in Japan as I'm sure there are many located in Tokyo and elsewhere (Morgan Stanley, Barclays, etc).

Get out of Japan while you still have sone dignity and integrity.

Hahahahaha, oh the irony.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

@Yubaru

If they make above a certain amount, they shouldnt receive full benefits at all

The nenkin pension system is not a government handout: it's a contribution-based plan like insurance. People get it because they pay into it. Denying contributors the payments is basically theft.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Considering family history, I am not sure I will make it to 65. 75 is just out of the question. I never expected to retire because I have never been in such an income bracket. I have always expected to die working. And now I have these bozos telling me to pay into a collapsing pension system when I am already having trouble making ends meet? And I am not the only one either and I know loads of Japanese just don't pay despite being in the system automatically. The amazing thing is that there has been no violence...yet. But I suspect its going to happen. You can only turn the thumbscrews so tight....

1 ( +2 / -1 )

The reason there is no violence is because the authorities are careful to ensure that people always have a fall back position. Can’t pay? Then simply don’t. They’ll go on sending overdue notices for years, threatening all sorts of dire consequences, most of which can be safely ignored. If they ever did get serious about balancing the books, that would be a game changer.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I don't think that a lot of gaijin realise is that Japanese companies are doubling what they pay into their nenkin. Gaijin don't usually get this because most gaijin spend a year and go home, not paying into nenkin.

If you actually get a real job in Japan, you get a proper bonus, benefits and many jobs offer free accommodation.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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