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Japan 'stole' our islands, Chinese foreign minister tells U.N.

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Stole, Annexed, Tomato, Tamoto

-6 ( +5 / -11 )

Sounds more like to me that yang has admitted the islands are Japanese as china signed off on it!

Lets see if this guy still has a job when he gets home!

27 ( +29 / -2 )

This is like blending a shake of poo.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

So why did the US give the islands back to Japan in 1971 along with Okinawa? Because they are Chinese? The world does not agree with China, and nobody at the UN gives a crap about the rocks in the ocean.

13 ( +18 / -5 )

Useless... I say a janken tournament or that Jenga game to settle. Or better yet, AKB48 naked in a shallow pool of jelly versus a Chinese team of models. They would have to eat the jelly off... ok I'm just glad it's Friday.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

Business is tricky, you signed the paper no one else, China just admitted they no longer own it and signed them over to Japan.

24 ( +23 / -1 )

This is not your island, this is OUR island!

Chinese stole that quote from the TV series Lost!

8 ( +9 / -1 )

Okay. All I have to say is china has like 75% of the entires world land mass. Japan has what? 1% It's like big fat kid threatening the starving kid for a single skittle dropped on the ground. The only value of these islands is fishing territory right? China has a land mass of nearly 1 million square km with of a population density of about 35 per km. Japan? 335 per km! 70% of Japan's land is useless. Can't grow any crops on 70% of the land. So Japan relies on fishing much much much more than china! But here is china the fat obese kid that just has to have it all and won't share any of it. Ohhhhhh my bad they are citing history from 1000 years ago when "the republic of china" didn't even exist. They are citing a war which has been over for 7o years that every in the entire world has put behind them BUT china.

5 ( +15 / -10 )

So why did the US give the islands back to Japan in 1971 along with Okinawa?

China and Taiwan were not contacted when they gave back the islands to Japan.

-26 ( +5 / -30 )

nobody at the UN gives a crap about the rocks in the ocean.

Nobody gave a c**p until the U.N. (United Nations Economic Commission for Asia and the Far East, ECAFE) did a survey and found potential oil and gas reserves near the islands in 1969. So in a way the U.N. is responsible for this mess.

7 ( +12 / -5 )

didn't steal them, actually kicked your butt and took them. but if you signed the treaty a deal is a deal. take 'em to ICJ if you don't like instead of trying to bully everyone.

7 ( +9 / -3 )

China and Taiwan were not contacted when they gave back the islands to Japan.

But it is proof the US recognizes the islands as Japanese, and the US is under treaty to protect the islands for Japan's sake. Why do you think China has not gone there?

12 ( +13 / -1 )

"Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895."

So... 117 years later, you claim that this was an unfair treaty... too late...

13 ( +15 / -2 )

Let them scream and be laughed at internationally.

8 ( +10 / -2 )

The PRC stole the ROC's seat at the UN, and the ROC is a founding member. Give it back, I say.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

So for over a 100 years, China hasn't been able to claim it back. So tricked or not, maybe the islands belong to Japan! And how does he know that Japan tricked his country anyway?

12 ( +14 / -2 )

Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

Spilled milk mate! If your foolish ancestors signed the islands over then blame them. Live with it!

10 ( +13 / -3 )

They stole our islands, so everybody all together now -- one, two, three RIOT!!!

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Again, if China really thought that Japan stole those islands from them, why didn't they claimed the islands when Japan surrendered? Why didn't China claimed those islands when USA started to administered them. Why did their state-owned media published an article where these islands were described as Japanese in 60's. China only started to claim these islands in early 70's when the area was found to be rich in gas. The fact that China ignored these islands till 70's proves that they did not considered these islands to be theirs, and they want to gain them for the natural resources that are burried in the waters. China should stop acting like a bully and claim every island and land that they see as valuable territories.

13 ( +16 / -3 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

really, since 1895 huh? I'll repeat the idea read here and elsewhere that the People's Republic wasn't even a country at the time. My question is to whom is it to be restored to? The old China? Wasn't Taiwan from those who fled the "People's Republic". Therefore it's Taiwan's then right? Haha. Oh China this is such a waste of time if you want to be logical

8 ( +10 / -2 )

He's probably right.

"All I have to say is china has like 75% of the entires world land mass. Japan has what? 1% "

But Japan has quite a bit of sea there too..

0 ( +2 / -2 )

So the cat's out of the bag now. I am sure his statement said it all.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

So why did the US give the islands back to Japan in 1971 along with Okinawa?

Official diplomatic relations were not begun until after that. Nixon's first visit was in 72 and even that does mean diplomatic relations were actually official and started.

You might also say the US was more interested in keeping their old friend than making a new one. And giving the Senkakus to China at the time would have angered the Japanese government greatly.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Okay. All I have to say is china has like 75% of the entires world land mass

Robert Dykes - either 75% is a typo or I grew up next to China somehow without realizing it

5 ( +10 / -5 )

If you deny the Chinese owned the Senkakus/Diaoyu islands, you could also say Manchuria was not Chinese or Hong Kong or wherever.

The easy answer is to return the islands to Taiwan. Failure to do so pushes Taiwan a step closer to China. Keeping Taiwan in the fold while averting a further escalation would be a smart move.

0 ( +4 / -5 )

Forgot to add one thing. When these islands were under US administration, the US used these islands as a training field for their marines. If China really thought that those islands were Chinese, why didn't they asked the US military to stop landing in these islands? Imagine if a foreign military land in your territory without your consent, it is invasion. Yet China didn't bother. Why?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Japan stole our lunch money too.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

And China stole the future of thousands of people during other dynasties. It is this kind of attitude that keeps the 1000 year, maybe longer, war going on. It is time to look to the future and stop trying to conquer nations even if it just a small nation.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

Its surprising to see some of these responces, China has been plundered and looted by the rest of the world for so long and people had taken that for granted. But now the New China is much stronger and more influential in a good sense since if not the China, America and Europe will be bankrupt. People need to acknowledge that we share a distant heritage with China and their civilisation is built on harmony and respect at least to a certain degree up to 50 years ago when the cultural revolution changed sentiments to a certain degree. This mind you was all because of foriegn invasion into China. Much like the Meiji Restoration in Japan when we kicked out foriegners as they were polluting our culture.

-16 ( +3 / -19 )

...Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

Hmm...they were baby then?? Sign here and get a free candy?

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

Japan 'stole' our islands, Chinese foreign minister tells U.N.

China is in no position to tell anyone that Japan 'stole' their islands when they continue to illegally occupy Tibet, East Turkestan and Inner Mongolia.

11 ( +14 / -3 )

The Chinese FM can't have it both ways. Either China says Japan took these islands into Japan's possession or else China says the islands have remained in China's possession from 1895. Which is it? Did Yang really use words like "demand the return" of these islands? Why does China let Japanese patol boats saiil all around these islands all the time and China send boats only intemittently?

6 ( +6 / -0 )

And how does he know that Japan tricked his country anyway?

Quite right. When the treaty was signed, if any thought was given (at all) to the islands, it was along the lines of "They're just a bunch of worthless rocks. Who gives a damn? Fish them, bomb them, whatever." Scroll forward 7 decades later, the possibility of resources is discovered, and suddenly "We were tricked into signing that treaty!"

You sign over your land, you take a chance and roll the dice. Maybe it's worthless. Maybe it's another Seward's Folly. Either way, you signed the paper, and you don't get to complain that you where tricked a century later.

Its surprising to see some of these responces,

It's surprising that you have been posting with such diligence in these threads and are surprised at these responses.

China has been plundered and looted by the rest of the world for so long and people had taken that for granted.

Just like they take for granted that China did its own share of looting and plundering (and, apparently, wants another go at it). We also take for granted that China is still learning how to behave like an actual first-world civilization, so it is given a bit more leeway when it takes about nuking other countries.

But now the New China is much stronger and more influential in a good sense since if not the China, America and Europe will be bankrupt.

New China holds a pretty high opinion of itself, and forgets that the reason it is a New China to begin with is because America and Europe (and many other countries) chose to do trade with it. However, other countries did just fine before China came along, and if China had never existed, or if China was foolish enough to chase away investors with their foolish actions, the rest of the world would simply adapt to the new environment as it has always done.

People need to acknowledge that we share a distant heritage with China and their civilisation is built on harmony and respect at least to a certain degree up to 50 years ago when the cultural revolution changed sentiments to a certain degree.

If China were able to say this without sounding like some shady organized crime boss in a gangster movie, it might actually get some more respect. What China refers to as harmony and respect, much of the rest of the world sees as plundering and looting.

This mind you was all because of foriegn invasion into China. Much like the Meiji Restoration in Japan when we kicked out foriegners as they were polluting our culture.

Similarly, the calls for Japan to quit denying its history tend to sound flat when the accuser glosses over the same actions in its own history.

10 ( +11 / -1 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked his country into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

Awww.. poor China. Kawaii so!! What's missing in this context is what was traded back them for the islands? When any treaty is signed normally there's some sort of exchange, e.g. "We give you the Senkakus, you give us xyz".

China's reaped whatever benefit it got from the 1895 contract and wants to back out now that they've got what they wanted, leaving Japan with nothing. ... I have no sympathy for this line of logic. A deal is a deal. End of story.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

China is in no position to tell anyone that Japan 'stole' their islands when they continue to illegally occupy Tibet, East Turkestan and Inner Mongolia.

Also Han peoples did not originally own Manchuria, Taiwan or islands in the South China Sea.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Sad to see now absurdity prevails in japna.

-13 ( +1 / -14 )

China is totally lying! Senkaku islands were already incorporated into Japan as terra nulius, a few months before the treaty of Shimonoseki in which China ceded Taiwan. So the Senkakus has nothing to do with this treaty, nor with the first Sino-Japanese war.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

you do all know that this is just a game to distract peoples attention away from other important issues

2 ( +3 / -1 )

funny isn't it? the bullying country (China) is now being bullied. Karma strikes on China.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Japanese has always been the pride and deny the history, is one of the most disgust, rooted in the Chinese gene, since ancient times about neighbor, but don't treat rogue.

-12 ( +1 / -13 )

Again here I see a stark contrast in how the matter is being addressed by Japan and China. The Japanese PM formally calls at the UN for the matter to be peacefully settled in international court despite having maintained control over the islands for years. China, following all the violence and damages caused, is having their highest ranking diplomats ignore the suggestion while using terms such as "stealing" or "robbing" as an effort to further threaten Japan into giving in. Wonder how productive and sustainable such bahavior can actually be beyond keeping the C-people happy and loyal only for the time being. Also wonder how different such behavior can actually be from the tactics most often used by DPRK.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

look who's talking...robbers!

6 ( +8 / -2 )

if china's claim is historical then as china now holds mongolia and the mongol empire covered china and most of russia and central asia, why aren't they making claims to russia as historically being part of china? because they are bullies and russia would kick their butts!

7 ( +8 / -1 )

Japanese has always been the pride and deny the history, is one of the most disgust, rooted in the Chinese gene, since ancient times about neighbor, but don't treat rogue.

Using Google translate?

Back to the topic, and for China to admit to the world that they were 'tricked' into signing the islands away shows that they don't have a leg to stand on. All of that blustering, the riots, the hateful rhetoric.... who looks stupid now? Let's see how long Yang stays in his job, lol

9 ( +9 / -0 )

“The Japanese government still clings to its obsolete colonial mindset,” Li added. “China is capable of safeguarding the integrity of its territory,”

More Chinese lies, the only people that buy this are the brainwashed.

China is doing the same things that Hitler and his fanatics did, steal what is not theirs.

WOnder what other fantasies they will come up with.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

@DebuchoSep. 28, 2012 - 11:57AM JST

So why did the US give the islands back to Japan in 1971 along with Okinawa? Because they are Chinese? The world does not agree with China, and nobody at the UN gives a crap about the rocks in the ocean."

Because... if you have paid any attention to the political reality of the time, you might have noticed there were something called Cold War. China was not a big player compared to US and USSR but it should be obvious to everyone who has heard the term where US and China stood. And maybe you do know why there have been only 40 years of formal diplomatic relationship between PRC and Japan.

Even so, US has stayed neutral on the sovereignty issue. Go figure why. You don't need to touch any Chinese documents if you want to, since both Japan and US are pretty good at keeping records.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Whole world will teach the Mad China a lesson....One day will come for sure for Stupid China, that Japan will attack from one side where India will attack from other side. China is a bug for this peaceful world.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

So China admits Senkaku is currently a Japanese island? lol

7 ( +8 / -1 )

@alliswellinjapanSep. 28, 2012 - 03:20PM JST

Again here I see a stark contrast in how the matter is being addressed by Japan and China. The Japanese PM formally calls at the UN for the matter to be peacefully settled in international court despite having maintained control over the islands for years. China, following all the violence and damages caused, is having their highest ranking diplomats ignore the suggestion while using terms such as "stealing" or "robbing" as an effort to further threaten Japan into giving in. Wonder how productive and sustainable such bahavior can actually be beyond keeping the C-people happy and loyal only for the time being. Also wonder how different such behavior can actually be from the tactics most often used by DPRK."

Form and substance.

When Japan said these were no man's land before their discovery in 1894, China has provided evidence to show why Japan is wrong. That is a direct response.

It is Japan's turn now, to show these documents, be it from China or Japan, only strenghthen their case.

BTW, I have never heard anyone consider Japanese have a pro-mafia mentality just because Yakuza is so open and active here. If you are truly interested in the aftermath of the looting and burning during those days, I suppose you should know by now what they are facing with at the moment in China.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

China was so weak that their a++ was kick by Japan long long ago and let the tricky trick Japan keep kicking their a++ up to the present that Diaoyutais belong to a private Japanese citizen not Japan..

Korea was so weak long long ago that the tricky trick Japan wanted to trick the South Korean that Dokdo belong to Japan even in the 21st century.

The tricky trick Japan still wanted to try to trick the Russian that Kuril's island belong to Japan. Will Japan dare to try tricking kicking the Russian a++? I bet Japan have no GUTS.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

" Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked China into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895. "

That is a pretty hilarious argument. If that gained traction, we would see a lot of fascinating geographical re-arrangements. For example, weren´t the local Indians tricket into trading New York for a bag of funky marbles?

And how about the Tsar.... wasn´t he tricked into selling Alaska for 5000 Dollars or so?

Oh man, that could get interesting.

Afaic, Yang is admitting here that he has no case. They got tricked.... they`ll have to live with it.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

@Thunderbird2Sep. 28, 2012 - 03:56PM JST

Japanese has always been the pride and deny the history, is one of the most disgust, rooted in the Chinese gene, since ancient times about neighbor, but don't treat rogue.

Using Google translate?

Back to the topic, and for China to admit to the world that they were 'tricked' into signing the islands away shows that they don't have a leg to stand on. All of that blustering, the riots, the hateful rhetoric.... who looks stupid now? Let's see how long Yang stays in his job, lol"

I doubt anyone would say it was a fair treaty for China. I think what Yan referred to is that China had to give up Taiwan and the surrounding islands, one of which is Diaoyu/Senkaku.

As I said before somewhere else, if Diaoyu/Senkaku was really NOT discovered until 1884, tell Guinness World Record, see if they will bother to take it as the last found in the East China Sea. Years ago someone wrote a book speculating Chinese, instead of Columbus, discovered the new world. He tried to stretch Zhen He's voyage much further than what is commonly known. Now we know Zhen He might be a modern invention after all. A set of islands just within 200km (140km?) from Taiwan, and nobody had ever seen it unitl almost 19th century, conveniently when Japan became stronger? Yeah, RIGHT.:-)

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

Sorry, not 19th but 20th century.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Just wonderling and curious if DIAOYUTAIS actually belong to Japan.

Why Japan say that DIAOYUTAIS(SENKAKU) belong to a PRIVATE Japanese citizen?????

Why not say DIRECTLY that it is Japan territory instead spending 26M$ to purchase those island????

-10 ( +0 / -10 )

Confusing will keep people wonderling WHY Japan declare that DIAOYUTAIS(SENKAKU) belong to Japan.

But Japan confusion confuse themselves is that Japan just purchased the island from their own PRIVATE Japanese citizen this September 2012.

Now before the purchase, Dioyutais is Diaoyutais(CHINA) NOT Senkaku(JAPAN).

Japan confuse themselves and keep us wonderling and become confusing ourselves.

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

Oh just shut up already with your constant whinging China. You're like a child throwing a tantrum because you didn't get your way. ''Mummy, big bad Japan stole my islands,waahhhhhh'''

7 ( +9 / -2 )

There are many countries around China are shouting that China has stolen lands and lands of them..... Can`t they hear?

6 ( +7 / -1 )

@realmind... I don't think China is listening. They have their fingers poked in their ears and are shouting "lalalalalalalala... I can't hear you!"

5 ( +6 / -1 )

you do all know that this is just a game to distract peoples attention away from other important issues

Yeah, it's called politics. Not really anything new about it.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Hosafella. It is called exaggeration. Becuse population density of Japan is LITTERLY 100 times that of china. So in many ways it does seem china is taken up 75% of the world and won't let Japan have these soccer field sized islands so they can fish.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Hi, I think that they are drunk or sick. Japan never denied history but like any other country it can't allow the Chinese government to stole territories those always belonged to Japan. It is like a robber trying to get your door first and then the robber will stole your entire house.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Even so, US has stayed neutral on the sovereignty issue.

What a curious thing to say. Silence does not equal neutrality.

When Japan said these were no man's land before their discovery in 1894, China has provided evidence to show why Japan is wrong. That is a direct response.

It's also three-quarter's of a century too late.

I doubt anyone would say it was a fair treaty for China. I think what Yan referred to is that China had to give up Taiwan and the surrounding islands, one of which is Diaoyu/Senkaku.

That's the thing about war; loosing sucks. At least it's getting better; used to be that the looser got wiped off the face of the earth and victor got to keep all the land. Nowadays, we actually give money to the looser to fix everything.

As I said before somewhere else, if Diaoyu/Senkaku was really NOT discovered until 1884, tell Guinness World Record, see if they will bother to take it as the last found in the East China Sea.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

As I said before somewhere else, if Diaoyu/Senkaku was really NOT discovered until 1884, tell Guinness World Record, see if they will bother to take it as the last found in the East China Sea.

Discovery only counts for the first owner. After that, ownership depends on the law of the times. Discovery does not convey perpetual rights to ownership. Very few explorers actually get to keep what they discover.

Years ago someone wrote a book speculating Chinese, instead of Columbus, discovered the new world.

Case in point. No one cares who discovered it first beyond academic curiosity. Politically, discovery is all but meaningless.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked China into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

Well, if he wants his country getting back its initial borders before Japan went to to trick them, that will make many happy people. For instance, Tibetans, Uyghurs, Manchus and Mongolians will each get back a huge country.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Just wonderling and curious if DIAOYUTAIS actually belong to Japan. Why Japan say that DIAOYUTAIS(SENKAKU) belong to a PRIVATE Japanese citizen????? Why not say DIRECTLY that it is Japan territory instead spending 26M$ to purchase those island????

Legally, in the eyes of the world, the islands are Japanese territory. This Japanese territory was privately owned by a Japanese citizen. A politician in Tokyo by the name of Ishihara wanted to buy this territory. The central government of Japan, knowing Ishihara would cause political mayhem by rubbing the purchase in the face of the Chinese, attempted to avoid provoking China by buying the land in the name of the government, thus keeping the dancing monkey from causing trouble. Unfortunately, China still took the bait Ishihara was dangling, and now we have the current situation.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Legally, in the eyes of the world, the islands are Japanese territory.

I guess, you are living in your own world?

-12 ( +1 / -13 )

How does one "steal" an island?

Do you pick one up, put it in your pocket, take it home and put it on your mantlepiece and hope the fuzz don't find it?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Japan should stick to their gun or it will send the wrong message! China has not got long to go in its current form. It will self destruct sooner or later with the dangerous line of political action they are following. Before you know it the demonstrations will turn anti authority. The only thing keeping the place united is the armed forces.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked China into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895.

I think that is a translation error. His speech was made in Chinese and obviously the translator has done a crappy job.

He just said Japan's claim of sovereignty over these Chinese islands is a serious violation of the Japanese Instrument of Surrender, Cairo Declaration, Potsdam Agreement and also the UN Charter. His speech can even be found in youtube.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

didn't steal them, actually kicked your butt and took them. but if you signed the treaty a deal is a deal. take 'em to ICJ if you don't like instead of trying to bully everyone.

Yes, you are right that the islands were taken by force. However, the Shimonoseki treaty became null and void after the war and was superceded by the Cairo Proclaimation which says:

"Japan shall be stripped of all the islands in the Pacific which she has seized or occupied since the beginning of the First World War in 1914, and that all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese shall be restored to the Republic of China."

and also the Potsdam Agreement which says:

"The terms of the Cairo Declaration shall be carried out and Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku and such minor islands as we ( US, UK, China and Russia) determine."

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Whilst I feel China and Taiwan have better histrical and geographic claims to the islands, Japan has legal ownership, which is what matters the most. The Chinese are working themselves into a frenzy over a position no-one else will support, so all the posturing and dummy spitting in the world is going to result in diddly squat at the end of the day and they will only further alienate their neighbors and make other countries more defensive.

Diplomatic amateur hour.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Japan has legal ownership, which is what matters the most.

Legal only within Japan but illegal in terms of international law.

-12 ( +1 / -13 )

A fine example of ひんがないChinese diplomacy in view of the whole world.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

"The terms of the Cairo Declaration shall be carried out and Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku and such minor islands as we ( US, UK, China and Russia) determine."

Which obviously included Senkaku.

"Japan shall be stripped of all the islands in the Pacific which she has seized or occupied since the beginning of the First World War in 1914, and that all the territories Japan has stolen from the Chinese shall be restored to the Republic of China."

Wasn't Senkaku Japanese from the late 19th century? That predates 1914, when Japan was an ally of the UK and other allied and Commonwealth countries during WW1.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

I guess, you are living in your own world?

Well, I share it with many other first-world citizens, but yes, I do feel a certain pride of ownership.

Legal only within Japan but illegal in terms of international law.

The international law is what makes it legal in Japan. They aren't the ones that created the process they followed to take ownership of the islands.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

At thisUN assembly, China's Foreign Minister also said "As a defeated country, Japan should follow the international establishment". Moreover, the spokesperson of China's Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that "it's outrageous that a defeated country takes over the victor's territory". This logic sounds as if America should follow whatever Vietnam says. It seems like its rooted from a superiority complex while using their historical misery as a diplomatic card.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Sorry: China never had the Senkaku islands. Thus, Japan could not have stolen them from China.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

"'China has demanded the return of the uninhabited islands, known as the Diaoyu in Chinese and the Senkaku in Japanese, for decades. Taiwan also claims the islands"

Proof that neither "Gov. Ishihara" nor the Japanes governent purchase caused this row. China has wanted to take these islands for decades,

"Yang reaffirmed his country’s historical claim that Japan tricked China into signing a treaty ceding the islands in 1895. Japan states that the islands were legally incorporated into its territory."

The Treaty of Shimonoseki which ended the Sino-Japanese war was signed in April 1885. In it, the Qing Dynasty ceded to Japan the islands of Taiwan and the Pescadores. The Senkakus were never brought up because both China and Japan believed it was Japanese at the time.

"The moves taken by Japan are totally illegal and invalid. They can in no way change the historical fact that Japan stole Diaoyu and its affiliated islands from China and the fact that China has territorial sovereignty over them,” said the Chinese minister."

Nope, Japan stole the Senkakus from NOBODY. They were incorporated in accordance with proper international protocol as Terra Nullius, uninhabited and unclaimed.

"Japan’s move was in “outright denial” of its defeat in World War II, he added, reaffirming China’s repeated references to the 1939-45 war."

It is the Cairo and the Potsdam Declarations that provide the basis of Japan being allowd to keep the Senkakus because they wre never taken from anyone in a war. Not to mention that the PRC is not a signatory or participant to eityher of these WWII accords, it was the ROC.

"Insisting that Japan legally incorporated the islands into its territory in 1895, Japan’s deputy U.N. ambassador Kazuo Kodama said that “an assertion that Japan took the islands from China cannot logically stand.”

That is correct. Otherwise why is China unwilling to take this issue to thge ICJ as a claimant?

"China’s U.N. envoy Li Baodong responded that “the Japanese delegate once again brazenly distorted history, resorting to spurious fallacious arguments that defy all reason and logic to justify their aggression of Chinese territory.”

That;'s funny comming from a facist one party dictatorship that's distorting history right now to achieve their aims.

“The Japanese government still clings to its obsolete colonial mindset,” Li added. “China is capable of safeguarding the integrity of its territory,” the ambassador warned." When Kodama responded that the islands “are clearly an inherent territory of Japan,” Li returned to the attack. He said his Japanese counterpart “feels no guilt for Japan’s history of aggression and colonialism.”

Japans 67 year old history of aggression does not justify China's aggression today towards all of it;s neighbors including Japan.

"The Japanese government’s purchase of the islands is based purely on “the logic of robbers,” he stormed.

No, the Japanese government bought the islands to pre-empt Ishihara from buiolding on them as he declared he would. The only goal was to avoid aggravating the debate further by not giving the rabid mobs reason to attack the Chinese government for "not doing enough".Instead the Chinese government has used this to escalate the issue. The only "robbers" in the scenario are China and the Chines who actually believe this nonsense that "Chinese islands were taken by Japan".

4 ( +6 / -2 )

cabadaje says "The international law is what makes it legal in Japan."

As I said, Japan's claim of ownership based on the international law of terra nullius is just a joke as we know these islands were never terra nullius in the first place.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

May the Almighty God bless Japan for standing firm against thug. Talking about" stealing" form China FM's mouth ,it sounds so funny....Tibet , Paracel islands ,Xinjiang, spratly islands , lands from India,lands from Vietnam..etc do not exist in his mind? , at all?

7 ( +8 / -1 )

at the end china wants to do like any other country with military power, get what they want whenever they want it with force if necessary over the rights of anyone and everyone. hopefully they are not colonialist or imperialist at all lol yeh right. well this king of arguments been use a lot and are over rated I mean Chinese arguments to show off their strength and control.

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Until the focus is changed to mutual exploitation of the hugh underwater reserves, both Chinese and Japanese must seriously reflect on their actions and the unintended global consequences of their behavior.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

China has turned out to be a place to avoid having contact with - even Hong Kong wishes they could return to British rule, after teaching English was stopped to be replaced by Chinese "patriotism" classes. Do they really think they can brainwash intelligent people by endlessly repeating their BS claims.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

And the proof is in the pudding China, hate to tell you this but if the old Chinese empire signed over the islands in 1895 and signed a treaty they were not "tricked" but made the decision on their own behest. The islands belong to Japan end of story and do take it to the ICJ if you want but it depends on the validity of the treaty, if its been legally signed over by China to Japan then you can't have them back.

Good news, because China is hell bent on "claiming" a lot of territory.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Seriously, who the heck would believe evidence from China's side when they shamelessly counterfeit historical photographs like they do with commercial products?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

if and even if the islands is china 's , and japan does not return .. , that shows japan is correct , correct with the same way china does to vietnam and phillipines . does idiot china remember an american slang < it goes around and it comes around > . china is deserved to taste japan 's stool . LOL . it must be self ashamed that its is not even equivalent to the other yet , but it thinks like it is able to swallow .. LOL

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Nobody in UN care about this islets issue except CN & JP! Most of pro-Japen posters have been quite happy here because they feel supportive from their tunnel vision in this website, LOL, don't forget it's JAPAN today, a Japen website! Do you guys really think most of world support JP? They support only your money if any! It's true many countries don't like China, don't forget they neither like Japen! Between CN and JP, who get more friends to support? Real figures talk! Just check UN voting records for many irrelative issues. JP is far behind CN. Nevertheless, both of CN & JP already lost direction, like sky is falling for focus in this issue. Actually neither CN/ TW/ JP can use whatever resource there before compromise achieved but conflict is much easier to happen for any tiny mistake. Although Taiwan's Ma is also woman-like spinless but I however support his 3-parties cooperation plan.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

CHESS MOVES

0 ( +0 / -0 )

As I said, Japan's claim of ownership based on the international law of terra nullius is just a joke as we know these islands were never terra nullius in the first place.

And yet all concerned parties at the time had no problem with it. China didn't make a peep. If the land was ever China's, then China abandoned it when it failed to tell anyone about its claim.

It has nothing to do with communication skills. There are just too many supporters of Imperial Japan's plundering of its neighbors just like what it was in Japan a century ago. You being one of them.

No, really, it's communication skills. There are plenty of people here not supporting Japan who don't have an all but perfect record of negative responses.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

The fact is that China is greedy and it has too much lands for itself. Japan has almost nothing. Why? Because Japan lost so many lands, included those lands previously achieved from Sino-Japanese war. And at the end of WWII and the fallen of its imperialism, they lost them all.

Of course, 70% of Japanese mainland are useless, so they can't expanding so much...i think that is legit to take Senkaku Islands, but i'm disappointed about government's sudden move to buy them..but it was necessary..they really need them.

So guys....don't you think that China has too much power in its hands?

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

The international community knows that the fictional history of the world written by the Chinese government as well as the misinterpretations of international territorial laws are China's methodology of land grabbing.

China is also using Senkaku debate with Japan to take the media focus away from China's other land grabbing.

from the Philippines, Vietnam, Malaysia, Brunei http://onlyinphilippines.blogspot.com/2012/07/china-steals-another-philippine-island.html

http://globalnation.inquirer.net/51012/big-gaps-remain-in-philippine-china-relations-over-territorial-disputes-palace-official

http://www.scmp.com/article/1008308/shaky-ground-disputed-waters

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2009-03-07/china/28004601_1_island-dispute-diaoyu-islands-beijing-and-tokyo

2 ( +3 / -1 )

peanut is right as are other posters who have pointed up China's other land grabs in India, Inner Mongolia, and the biggest of all, Tibet. Now China comes up with the "nine dashed line" that has no standing in international law. They are trying to grab everything they can while crying "poor poor pitiful me" at the same time. But it's not working this time. No more appeasement.

BTW, the other thing the Chinese government wants to shift focus away from is their own corruption. Why are these "communist" leaders and their families rich while the peasants scratch for a living? Rather than answer that it's easier to provoke some riots against the Japanese.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Well, China ROBBED Tibetans of their homeland. As an overseas Chinese who had lived in China for 10 years, I'm embarrassed by all the childish nonsense spouted by the CCP and mainland Chinese. China, please stop making Chinese everywhere look bad.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

So, for the FIRST TIME, China is admitting that the Senkakku Islands belong to Japan. LOL..Nice Try China. The Phony Historic Map trick didn't work, kicking and screaming like a bunch of hooligans didn't work, The 1,000 Boat Armada of Dirty Smelly Fishermen never got underway, the Taiwan Water Wars was very cute yet ineffective, and making frowny faces at the U.N. just prompted the world to click to the next news link. What's next China? I kust can't wait for the next antics of "Commie Clowns" - The Continuing Saga...

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Well, China ROBBED Tibetans of their homeland. As an overseas Chinese who had lived in China for 10 years, I'm embarrassed by all the childish nonsense spouted by the CCP and mainland Chinese. China, please stop making Chinese everywhere look bad.

@Don T. Try not to take it to heart. Many people around the world don't have a bad view of the chinese people, just a very bad view of China's government. Its fine to criticise the actions of the ruling party, but not to the citizens especially if the citizens have nothing to do with those choices.

Many people like to claim that the US is imperialistic, yet there are no new colonies of Americans living in Afghanistan, nor Iraq and neither does the US government control the peoples of those nations, but stands aside to allow the people to make their own choices in the end.

China on Tibet, and Taiwan, and Hong Kong etc.... Well we've seen how the CCP tries to work.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

“feels no guilt for Japan’s history of aggression and colonialism.”

...and there's the rub.

Imagine how much more legitimacy Japan would have in these sort of disputes if it had properly dealt with its WWII legacy.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Still though, you can't equate the treaty made in 1895 to the actual invasion of China by Japan in 1937 and the lack of claims to those islands after Japan surrendered in 1945 which was more than enough time for China to try to legitimately cancel the treaty on those grounds during that time. You snooze you lose.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Hahahaha.... Stole the islands from China? How about the islands china stole. And not only that. How about the products and patents they have copied and imitated. Well I guess , as the saying goes, it takes a thief to catch a thief. China is so powerful now and thanks to the foreign investors greed for cheap labor for more profit. China can buy USA now.... check this up... http://news.yahoo.com/obama-blocks-chinese-purchase-us-wind-farms-181230948.html

1 ( +2 / -1 )

As others have repeated constantly on related threads and articles, the Senkaku's were NEVER part of the Treaty of Shimonoseki of 1895. I guess China is playing the "repeat it a million times, it becomes a fact" routine.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

As others have repeated constantly on related threads and articles, the Senkaku's were NEVER part of the Treaty of Shimonoseki of 1895. I guess China is playing the "repeat it a million times, it becomes a fact" routine.

It's clear that, whatever the legal history, China would be claiming the islands anyway. I just happen to think that Japan's overall position would be stronger if it had better dealt with the aforementioned legacy. (Law and politics overlap, but are not synonymous.)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

If in fact the Senkaku's were taken as a result of Shimonoseki Treaty, the islands would of been under the jurisdiction and administration of Taiwan after Japan took over.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

The Taiwanese claim the islands as well, it should be pointed out.

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Guru29Sep. 28, 2012 - 10:06PM JST cabadaje says "The international law is what makes it legal in Japan." As I said, Japan's claim of ownership based on the international law of terra nullius is just a joke as we know these >islands were never terra nullius in the first place.

Nope. The only remnants of human habitation are from a Japanese fish factory. No evidence whatsoever of any Chinese living there. Ahnd why would they? Take a look at the photos of these tiny islands. China's claim is a joke as is all of their attempts at dipolmacy based on the a priori rule that whatever China says is right, Even if they lie through their teeth to the entire world ast the UN.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Can Taiwan really claim it considering it was founded in 1911?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Honestdictator:Can Taiwan really claim it considering it was founded in 1911?

A child cry and admit he's bad and say sorry to another one is called surrender in adult world. Japan surrender to ROC in 1945. It's actually JP proclaim it belong to Taiwan(ROC).

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@cabadajeSep. 28, 2012 - 06:17PM JST

[Legally, in the eyes of the world, the islands are Japanese territory. This Japanese territory was privately owned by a Japanese citizen. A politician in Tokyo by the name of Ishihara wanted to buy this territory. The central government of Japan, knowing Ishihara...........and now we have the current situation.]"

Japan now have no legal mean to say and declare that the DIOAYUTAIS( senkaku) are Japan territory. The central government pf JAPAN legally say to the people of the world that those island JUST belong to a Private Japanese citizen NOT UNDER JAPAN central government..

That Japanese private citizen also have violated the ANTI SQUATTING LAW by occupying CHINA TERRITORY without authorization from the Chinese government.

JAPAN have violated CHINA sovereignty right of her territory in both count. _JAPAN own citizen have violated ANTI SQUATTING LAW. _JAPAN central government have inspired and encouraged her private citizen to violate the ANTI SQUATTING LAW to occupy CHINA territory and purchased the TERRITORY of CHINA from the violator with 26M$.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Japan now have no legal mean to say and declare that the DIOAYUTAIS( senkaku) are Japan territory.

They don't need to. They already did it back in 1895, in 1941, and in 1970. None of the global players are questioning Japan's ownership of the islands. Heck, barely a handful of UN ambassadors could even be bothered to attend the talks.

The central government pf JAPAN legally say to the people of the world that those island JUST belong to a Private Japanese citizen NOT UNDER JAPAN central government..

They used to belong to a private citizen, prior to the central government purchasing them. Now, it belongs to the central government. Who owns the title to the land, however, does not affect which country the land is a part of.

That Japanese private citizen also have violated the ANTI SQUATTING LAW by occupying CHINA TERRITORY without authorization from the Chinese government.

What anti-squatting law? And why didn't China mention it over a century ago when the owners built a factory on the island, or when they housed over 250 workers there, or when the land was used as a bombing range by the US?

If the property was ever Chinese, it was abandoned, plain and simple.

JAPAN have violated CHINA sovereignty right of her territory in both count. _JAPAN own citizen have violated ANTI SQUATTING LAW. _JAPAN central government have inspired and encouraged her private citizen to violate the ANTI SQUATTING LAW to occupy CHINA territory and purchased the TERRITORY of CHINA from the violator with 26M$.

Repetition does not make something more correct. If it is wrong, it remains wrong, no matter how many times it is repeated. China made absolutely no claim to the islands for over 70 years. Japan followed every rule the international countries agreed upon when claiming uncontested land. China did not contest the Japanese annexation of the islands. China is too late to pretend they have any rights to the island anymore, even if they ever did in the first place.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

@cabadajeSep. 29, 2012 - 11:15AM JST

Thank u cabadaje. I'm very appreciate for your response of those confusion created by your Tokyo governor Shintaro Ishihara since April 2012 up to the present September 2012 by your PM Nado that confuses the world epecially in the eyes of Japanese people. Let's education to diffuse the confusion with original history without confusing the mind of the Japanese youth.

Glad's to make arguments with you.....thanks.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

For the record, he's not my governor; I'm an expat. And yeah, the Japanese government hasn't really done as much as it can to clarify the issue. That said, the Chinese government has gone out of its way to make any discussion rather unpleasant. I can't say I would feel too obliged to speak to a neighbor who kept threatening to burn down my house because my fence was too high.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

China is not too smart. What they have said in UN is a legal document. It will backfire at them at the end.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@cabadaje Sep. 29, 2012 - 12:23AM JST

As I said, Japan's claim of ownership based on the international law of terra nullius is just a joke as we know these islands were never terra nullius in the first place.

And yet all concerned parties at the time had no problem with it. China didn't make a peep. If the land was ever China's, then China abandoned it when it failed to tell anyone about its claim."

China did not say a thing at the time because if you read the content of that treaty, it is not just Taiwan but all the surrounding islands. Are you say China has no case because it didn't ask for a second insult at the time?

@cabadaje Sep. 29, 2012 - 11:15AM JST

Japan now have no legal mean to say and declare that the DIOAYUTAIS( senkaku) are Japan territory.

They don't need to. They already did it back in 1895, in 1941, and in 1970. None of the global players are questioning Japan's ownership of the islands. Heck, barely a handful of UN ambassadors could even be bothered to attend the talks. "

Whether what they did in 1941 and 1970 are of any value depends on how they got it in 1895. Many people have written about it, here is Nicholas Kristof's blog.

http://kristof.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/19/the-inconvenient-truth-behind-the-diaoyusenkaku-islands/

He said very clearly in the blog:

"....That said, when I look at the underlying question of who has the best claim, I’m sympathetic to China’s position. I don’t think it is 100 percent clear, partly because China seemed to acquiesce to Japanese sovereignty between 1945 and 1970, but on balance I find the evidence for Chinese sovereignty quite compelling. The most interesting evidence is emerging from old Japanese government documents and suggests that Japan in effect stole the islands from China in 1895 as booty of war. This article by Han-Yi Shaw, a scholar from Taiwan, explores those documents. I invite any Japanese scholars to make the contrary legal case. "

Have anyone shown anything contrary?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Japan not only lost the Pacific War, it also lost the propaganda wars with Chiang Kai-shek and his Nationalists and Mao Tse Tung and his Communists. The Chinese made much use of false reports and fake photographs of alleged Japanese atrocities, many of them actually pictures of Chinese victims killed by other Chinese in their internecine warfares. The Chinese carried out their anti-Japanese propaganda in the US and other Western countries and succeeded in turning them against Japan and gaining their financial support, much of which ended up in the pockets of Chiang and his henchmen. Chinese today are taught a false, anti-Japanese version of history, which is why they easily erupt into anti-Japanese demonstrations and rioting for whatever reason. And they continue to use these false accusations about Japanese "aggression" in their attempt to take the Senkakus or whatever concession they want to gain from Japan. It's about time the world saw the Chinese Communists for what they are, and it's about time Japan more actively promoted a more accurate view of the history of Sino-Japanese relations based on historical evidence...

1 ( +3 / -2 )

"That's All Folks!"

0 ( +0 / -0 )

In other news, Mexico demands the return of California, China demands the return of Vladivostok, the Vikings demand the return of Normandy and so on.

Joking aside, if we go by the treaties at the end of WWII, it seems that Japan's claim on Senkaku is dodgy, as they specifically recounted the 1895 treaty that gave Taiwan to Japan. So it's not too clear that Japan has a leg to stand on, going by actual legality. OTOH, using the same ruler (going by the legal framework of WWI as executed by the Allies at the end of WWII), Dokdo definitely belongs to Japan, as China didn't know about the islands, didn't map them or name them in antiquity and had filed no official claim. So Korea basically stole Japan's land because they hate Japan, and Japan stole some islands that were terra nullius but which China considered part of its territory, but didn't have quite the claim they needed.

I do hate this "Japan did bad things, therefore they must lost every argument with an Asian neighbour for all eternity" attitude. Japan did nothing that the European powers weren't doing, except that they did them during the age of Photography, so their enemies could make an eternal record and curse them forever, unlike most of the history of the British Empire. This is why the Brits are jolly good chaps enduring the White Man's Burden, while Japanese are the worst devils ever.

Yeah, whatever, show me a Japanese who killed as many as China killed of their own citizens. Put that in the textbooks, please. I mean it, really.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

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