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LDP policy chief to keep visiting Yasukuni Shrine

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some want to go there and pray, some dont. its honoring the dead, its insensitive and provoking our neighbors. we get it. can we stop calling this news now?

6 ( +8 / -2 )

People should respect fallen soldiers to remind us what war is.

3 ( +6 / -4 )

All this Nationalistic chest thumping by the right-wing Japanese politicians are only hurting Japanese firms' profit margins and more importantly Japanese global soft power.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

People should respect fallen soldiers to remind us what war is.

I totally agree. But there is no need or place to show respect for dead criminals! You can not separate one from the other when going to Yasukuni. Yasukuni by it's very existence is a symbol itself of a lot of what was wrong or misguided in Japanese history.

There is a dire need in this country of a secular shrine dedicated to all who died, from ALL sides. Much like the Okinawa Peace Memorial Park where all the names of everyone who died, enemy and friend alike, from ALL countries involved, are engraved in walls of granite for eternity.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

“There is no doubt that (Japan) hurt the ethnic pride of people in colonized countries and caused them tremendous sufferings,” Takaichi said.

That's putting it mildly!

Treating women as sex slaves, extracting fetuses from pregnant women while alive, subjecting people to diseases and operating on them without anesthesia, bayoneting civilians, beheadings and whatnot was all just made-up, right? Ethnic pride was only a small part of it, dearie. Yes, Japan helped to 'liberate' Asia and they should be grateful - that's what I see in their statements and excuses. But then again, I understand - what with Korea and China doing economically well and in the international spotlight, praying and dreaming (and lamenting) is the only thing Takaichi can do.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

If she wants go to shrine, she can go to any shrine in Japan privately.

Even if she went alone, in disguise, on her day off, in the middle of a typhoon, the media would find out about it and blast it all over their front pages.

There is no such thing in reality of an elected politician doing something in public, privately.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Just Ms. Takaichi goofed.

In her position "just goofed" is not an excuse. But then Japanese politicians have a habit of "just goofing" and expect people to forgive and forget.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The priests who run Yaskuni say that all the spirts there coalesce into one entity... which to me being the unreligious type sounds like a huge load of BS, but that's me being insensitive. On the other hand, it almost sounds too convenient that they can't seperate the criminals from the common soldiers..

and even on the third other hand, its about time China and Korea stopped throwing their toys out of the pram every time a politician goes there. Germany doesn't make a stink to the US when an official visits Arlington or any of the war cemetaries around Europe and vice versa when a German official does the same. We're talking about events that happened almost 70 years ago!!

2 ( +3 / -1 )

"Stubborn and idiotic to say the least!" China? yeah I tottaly agree. They are so stubron and idiotic. Germany, Italy, Russia, Poland, USA, UK, France they have all shaken hands put the great war behind them. There were monsters and heros on EVERY front of the war. The western world has put WW2 behind them, about 50 years ago and is focused on actully getting things done that matter TODAY. China (and Japan in a form of denial) refuse to grow up and just let it rest. You would two countries as old as Japan and China could act like grownups, but instead bicker about stupid pointless stuff like children.

1 ( +7 / -6 )

If she wants go to shrine, she can go to any shrine in Japan privately. Maybeswhe tries to irritate Korea and China? Doesn;t she know So, Korea is more close to USA than Japan now? Or maybe she does not know USA owes to China too much money. Some day, USA and China get more closer than with Japan? Someone has to tutor her diplomacy 101, I think. /A big mouth woman.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

"Then, would it have been best for Japan not to fight (major Western powers) at all and to take the path of becoming a colony amid embargoes?” she asked.

I would really love to debate this lady. Is this woman not aware that Japan was only embargoed because they invaded China and Vietnam?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Yasukuni is not Government owned, She will visit whether she is criticized on headline or not. is there any Japanese who can replace her? she was Minister of Okinawa and Northern Territory Affair, Minister of State for Science for Technology. Policy Minister of State for Innovation, Minister of State for Youth Affairs and General Equality. Minister of /state for Food Safety. etc. She is surviving male oriented Japanese culture. Yasukuni? A majority of enshrined souls were from Abe's ancestoral area when Boshin Snesou they had to fight. Not just few A class people's names.

Her

1 ( +1 / -0 )

A class executed were Gen, Genji Doihara, Baron Kouki Hirota, Gen. Seishirou Itagaki, Gen, Heitarou Kimura, Gen, Iwane Matsui, Gen, Akira Mutou, Gen. Hideki Tojo. the name of 7 people were in Yasukuni among millions of people who died in the result of wars. . She can explain China and Korea that she visit Shrine to ensure Japan will not engage any war in future? She can communicate with Chinese and Korean politicians who studied in USA universities.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Not just few A class people's names.

But it's THOSE names that cause the problem. Get rid of them and there would be no problem really.

There are a lot of Okinawan's that are VERY angry at Yasukuni too for them interning their dead relatives there without their permission, and Yasukuni's refusal to remove them from the lists.

Did you know that JIETAI can not be interred there?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

There were Shinshym Shingonshu, Nichiren shum Nichiren Shoushum and othere Buddhism sects in Japan prewar time. People wnt o-tera and also jin-ja. Was there Ministry of Health in Japan?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Like I've said in so many post before, get ride of the criminals from these shrines, put them in some grave some where and no one will care if these politicians visit the shrine or not. I do wonder if they will continue to visit the shrine if the criminals had been "evicted from it. If you see a drop in attendance, you know what's up.

China can't whine when there is no criminal to be whined about. If they continue to whine about it, that's just nonsense. At least for now, they have a reason or excuse to whine. Get rid of these criminal elements and don't give them an excuse to whine then. If you see a problem, solve it. If you don't want to solve it, then it MUST NOT BE A PROBLEM TO YOU.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Yubaru-sanL What is JETAI? . Did they brought the names to Yasukuni?

JIETAI, the current Japanese Self-Defense forces. Because they are not a "military" in service to Japan any member who dies on duty can not be enshrined at Yasukuni.

But many civilians who died during WWII are enshrined there too, and many have relatives who HATE Yasukuni for doing it as well!

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Nigel,

Then why are these criminals being honored in a shrine that politicians visit in mass? Honor their spirits? THAT would be a million times worst. If there are ashes or bodies there, at least there's something. IF there is nothing there, then something ain't kosher here.

If there are no ashes, then why is it so difficult to move whatever that represent them out to somewhere else? It SHOULD be easier if there are not physical substance to be moved.

I just don't get it. Why would anyone want to be associated with them? The notion that they are being honored is just disgusting.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Kobuta,

So is it a tradition for Japan to harbor Class A criminals in a shrine and honor them regularly by concerned politicians?

If that is a Japanese tradition, then you have a crappy tradition. You should fix it. Its unbecoming for a civilized nation.

And it does concerns me. Two of my uncles were killed by Japanese ambush on Pearl Harbor in the war. The man in charge of your gov't and military should not be honored as Gods or Kami. They have no place to be honored in history.

If you don't understand this, then you have a serious problem. You are not only ignorant to the victims of the war and you are a disrespectful person.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Original people enshrined these names have to approve removal,

Toshiko, the only way to be enshrined is to die! Yasukuni officials COULD remove their names from the rolls but refuse to do so.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Her comment will disrupt relationship with China and So. Korea, Big mouth lady? Not a diplomat at all. l

0 ( +4 / -4 )

I think Japan should move war criminal names to a newly build shrine (name it Beijing). The politicians decide which one (or both) of the shrines to visit.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

“It’s an internal affair (of a nation) how to commemorate the people who sacrificed their lives for the national policy,”

Agreed. Though maybe they shouldn't be so public about it. How do the Chinese and Koreans even know when these guys visit? Stop posting it in the news and do it in private.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Yubaru-san: I agree with you. She should always keep in her mind she is a public figure getting paid by government. IIt looks like she is purposely irritating So, Korea and China. My suspicious mind, maybe but when So, Korean President was welcomed by USA congress and USA is mellowing toward China, I wonder what this woman is thinking.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

takaichi you are a poster child for those that are utterlu clueless about their own history!

To all those who say Japan has apologized etc ................. news flash its people like this who send Japan backwards again & again.

I mean if she cant even come to the conclusion that it was a mistake to invade the far east & SE Asia & kill 20-30million etc than clearly she is beyond helping.

And so many wonder why Japan has problems with its neighbours.........well the above is a perfect reason why & there are far far too many like her sadly.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Japanese families iused to have Shiindou Kamidana and buddhism butsudan togetherr in their house. both Shindiu (not shinto) and buddhism came from China. There are a variety of Buddhism in Japan. Shin-shu, shingonshu, nichiren shoushu (Koumei tou peopke worship). for example. However iit became Japanese religeon, You don't have to teach these religeon to Korea and China. They know, Just Ms. Takaichi goofed. .

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Yubaru-san: I think she wanted to please men politicians in Japan to talk like that. I

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Yubaru-sanL What is JETAI? . Did they brought the names to Yasukuni?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

By the way, who hves authority to remove these names? Original people enshrined these names have to approve removal, Are they still arrive?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

By the way, who hves authority to remove these names? Original people enshrined these names have to approve removal, Are they still arrive?

I believe the name lists must be approved by the ministry of health before enshrinement. Not surprising to me since Yasukuni shrine was also called State Shinto, the only religion allowed in prewar Japan.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

some want to go there and pray, some dont. its honoring the dead

No, Yasukuni shrine is not about honoring the war dead since the soldiers aren't even buried there. It is actually about religious belief since the Yasukuni shrine or so called State Shinto claims to have capture the souls of some two over million WWII soldiers and promoted them to deities in the name of its living god, Emperor Hirohito.

These soldiers were promoted to deities for giving up their lives in the holy war to conquer the world for the living god of Yasukuni shrine (State Shinto). In fact, the Yasukuni cult (State Shinto) was the only religion that was permitted to exist in Japan before the end of WWII. It was also the main instrument that the fascist Japanese government used to spread fascism and militarism.

After the end of WWII, the Yasukuni shrine became the symbol/ fortress of Japanese fascism and a common place for gathering of the Japanese fascists.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

When Meiji Emperor created Yasukuni Jinja, Meiji Govet, had following :Civil Affairs (Home Ministry from 1873) Foreign Affairs Finance Army Navy Imperial Household Justice Public Works Education There was no Ministry of Health at all.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Was there Ministry of Health in Japan when these names were enshrined?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

What is the State Shinrto in Japan>

0 ( +0 / -0 )

China would whine no matter if they visited Yasukuni or not. Then theyd whine that it should be torn down or this or that.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Guru,

I have seen that youtube vid before & everytime I see it it sends shivers down my spine!

Its clear the keystones have the rightists back BIGTIME, makes you wonder if the kempeitei is really gone just lurking below the surface in the J-police, scary stuff!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

It was not a citizens choice to go to war it was the Japanese governments ,A lot of time has past , the whole thing is bad news so is the word ,annexation. Lest We Forget.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

@guru

some want to go there and pray, some dont. its honoring the dead

No, Yasukuni shrine is not about honoring the war dead since the soldiers aren't even buried there.

my post was 3 sentences and you stop half way through the first one? obviously i was giving a very brief view of both sides of the argument, one we have all heard a million times. and burying a persons body is not necessary to honor them. besides, bodies are cremated in shinto.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

How come Yasukuni is so out-of-dated? It is not Meiji time or not even 1990's. It can use several data entry clerks to enter each names to a database and can burn all records to enshrine each year. Japanese electronic manufacturers sell data storage units cheap everywhere, Even 1TB flush drive can store all and are many spare spaces for future. US $20 flush drive or other device? Inexpensive several laptops will handle these. The copy of this can be stored in a different place. I'd bet current way might cause fire hazard soon. After all, Japan has 'Kasou" customs for dead people.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Maybe older Japanese hated to hear name of Tojo and these A class war criminals' names, too. Give ' Ka sou' ceremony to these name papers to comfort old Japanese who suffered during WW II. Ka sou is cremation by burning bodies or remains. Many Japanese families have their male families killed in WW II.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Nigel,

Just like what zichi said, the church can excommunicate you. I don't know what planet you live in but guys like Tojo and those even class C criminals would've been excommunicated by any church.

And it seems to me it was the shrine that actually accepted these criminals in the first place. So your point is moot. There are those soldiers that probably just followed orders and did not commit heinous crimes against humanity. Nobody is having a problem with those folks. We are all having a problem with the criminals that were convicted of crimes against humanity. We don't care about 2.5 million soldiers. We cared about the few that just don't belong.

When you honor the innocent, there is no way you would honor the sick and depraved that lie next to them. Why can't you just get rid of those scums? Like I've said before, if you see a problem and don't solve it. That's on you.

The question is not whether I agree with the Chinese gov't, actually just about every gov't on earth would agree to the fact that these elements do not belong in a place of worship.

The question is why are people like you who are so sympathetic about elements like them? What good does it do for you other than shame and unadulterated and indecent pride about that shameful past?

What negative outcome can there be if you people just get ride of these elements? I just don't see any other than the fact that SOMEONE want them there on display to the world. And a flock of money sucking scums of the world would appease those particular SOMEONE for their personal greed.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I agree Half of LDP lawmakers are facist But this matter focus to election and "FAKE Patriotism" for getting vote LDP's platform Rich Guys=Free rider guys are annoying to pay tax for National defence. So LDP continuouslly cut JSDF's budget. So LDP need to "Pretend Patriot" for election. So every election season LDP guys visit this shurine "for Pretend Patriots" and "Hyde thire bribe politics that cut SDF budget & helicopter money spray to rich guys by reducing corprate tax rate" so rotten Japanese politics

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Nigelboy: People are talking about name papers of A class people. It is not Japanese custom to destroy anyone;s tomb. That is not people are asking. Just name papers in Yasukuni. Maybe it might be your custom to destroy tombs, but not Japanese custom, Also, they were not Christians. ou are talking your custom like 'honoring'. "Honor dead in Japan?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Nibelboy: Not everybofy get cremation in Japan. Do Sou is to bury the body in a box. Depending on which place in Japan funeral is performed/ Then 2 i-hais are made. One for Shundo Kamidana. One is for Butsudan for Bjddhism family worship big miniature house. Japan is not moothesis country, People worship Kami-sama and hotoke-sama. There is no state religeon in Japan. they just pray.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

People should respect fallen soldiers to remind us what war is.

Fallen soldiers, not Class-A war criminals!

Wanna make Yasukuni Shrine respectable, conservos? Dis-enshrine those monsters!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Nigel, remember what President Bush said when Japanese media asked him about the shrine. He said he wouldn't visit it and said he understood the honoring of the dead but he had "personal feelings" against it. He said he father Senior Bush was shot down as a fighter pilot by the Japanese. Friendship with Japan asides, personal feelings still lingers.

It was a television interview, when he said it, he pointed his fingers harshly and emotionally about the Shrine.

Back in 06, he repeatedly ask Koizumi on whether he would stop visiting the shrine but K refused.

We don't like the shrine. U.S. "tourists" would visit it and most of the guides are Japanese English speaking guides don't talk about the Class A Criminals. They just talked about the shrine. Most tourists are ignorant but some wanted to see the evil of it as well. I've been there. All my vet buddies had been there. We visited it not to honor it but to see the evil contained in it.

Intent of the visit is more important than the visit itself. We don't care if the uninformed who visit it. We care WHY you are visiting it.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

it should be noted that during the Tokyo Tribunal over 100 ethnic Koreans were found guilty of being Class B or C war criminals. it should also be noted that at least one of the Class A war criminals executed was convicted because he knew of some of the military atrocities commited even though he had know power over them. The Tribunal was far from impartial, being mainly funded by the United States.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

If she wants go to shrine, she can go to any shrine in Japan privately.

Ah, but then all those war veterans and their elderly relatives in her (probably underpopulated and rural) constituency might not vote for her or channel money to her election campaign funds.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

"Then, would it have been best for Japan not to fight (major Western powers) at all and to take the path of becoming a colony amid embargoes?” she asked.

It is hard to say whether refusing to fight would have made Japan a colony of anywhere. Probably not. But it is clear that the decision to fight made Japan a colony (of the US primarily) in the end anyway and a rather vilified figure too. Even in that respect, Murayama's statement has some truth.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

By the way, I will advise the leftists and people who are anti-fascist to refrain from visiting the shrine for their own safety. It is a dangerous place for you. This westerner in youtube is lucky to have escaped from the shrine without injury.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D25FwqRxIDY

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Do as what you please in your country. Don't not interfere other country's custom and traditional.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Like I've said in so many post before, get ride of the criminals from these shrines, put them in some grave some where and no one will care if these politicians visit the shrine or not. I do wonder if they will continue to visit the shrine if the criminals had been "evicted from it. If you see a drop in attendance, you know what's up.

There are no ashes at Yasukuni.

The co-mingled ashes of the executed so-called A criminals are located here.

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%AE%89%E5%9B%BD%E4%B8%83%E5%A3%AB%E5%BB%9F

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Toshiko: I understand your concern with Korea and China. But in order to have a better relationship in the future, Japan must let them know Japan's position frankly without any euphonious saying. The world seems do not understand the concept of Shito. Japan does not have to convert them as Shinto or asking agreement. But at least japan need to let them know the difference between Shinto idea and other religions. We do not go there to accept and agree what they did, (some'' war criminal'' ) Once they die, life energy of those people called Mitama. Pure life condition like one drop of water going back to a big ocean. It is hard to distinguish the former drop and ocean. The bottom line's problem is the religious concept is not being understood. Not every people go there is embracing what they did. I am a Buddhist and believe an individual Karma, so my personal point of view is very different from Shinto. So I do not go there Yasukuni but I since Japan has a religious freedom in our constitutions, we must protect it especially from out side of Japan.

The second point is that based on the international laws, technically there is no more war criminals in Japan since San Francisco peace treaty only technically speaking.

The amnesty provision for international law is the 2nd article of the Westphalia peace treaty in 1648 which made the 30 year war end. There, since war started, it has been specified "There shall be permanent oblivion, a pardon, or acquittal between hostilities countries" about all the things performed in the form of language, description, tyranny, violence, hostile activities, defamation, and expenditure. Thus, the amnesty provision based on the soul of "complete oblivion" which passes all in water, It is needed in order to calm hatred between the states agitated by war and to restore peace, It is incorporated in many peace treaties concluded during the 19th century from the 17th century, and 23~27 articles of the German Soviet Union treaty on March 3, 1918 and 31~33 articles of the German Romania treaty on May 7, 1918 constitute the general amnesty provision.

Based on the custom of the above, before World War II, Even if an amnesty provision is not installed into a peace treaty, that effectuation itself of a peace treaty has the amnesty effect an international treaty. In fact the world did not say anything when Mr. Kishi became a prime minister of Japan who was a former A class criminal. Because of this amnesty concept. If A class criminal was the issue, Korea or China shuld have said something then. The fact is that the president of S. Korea who is the father of today's Korean president made an agreement in 1965 as known as Japan Korea basic treaty and resolved the all issues between 2 nations.

The 3rd point is that China and Korea started to say about Yasukuni issue in 80s, because A class war criminal is there, this is a problem. But then do not say B and C class. This has no logic. Anther bottom line is that the law which determines A.B.C. category and its laws them self was made after the WW2. This is not my opinion but just my wondering that how any one could judge lawfully them based on the laws which did not exist when they were in a war.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

Based on the custom of the above, before World War II, Even if an amnesty provision is not installed into a peace treaty, that effectuation itself of a peace treaty has the amnesty effect an international treaty. In fact the world did not say anything when Mr. Kishi became a prime minister of Japan who was a former A class criminal. Because of this amnesty concept. If A class criminal was the issue, Korea or China shuld have said something then. The fact is that the president of S. Korea who is the father of today's Korean president made an agreement in 1965 as known as Japan Korea basic treaty and resolved the all issues between 2 nations.

Chamkun

A better example, I feel, is Mamoru Shigemitsu who is a convicted Class A criminal who was appointed as a Foreign Minister under Hatoyama Cabinet. Upon his appointment, his job was to convince other Asian nations during the 1955 Bandung Conference for Japan's entry to the U.N.

The view of war criminals and the criminality as a political tool by the Allieds are covered in the paper linked below.

http://www.info.sophia.ac.jp/amecana/Journal/17-4.htm

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

By the way, I will advise the leftists and people who are anti-fascist to refrain from visiting the shrine for their own safety. It is a dangerous place for you. This westerner in youtube is lucky to have escaped from the shrine without injury.

Very disrepectful considering that people from all over Japan came to visit on August 15th.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Maybe older Japanese hated to hear name of Tojo and these A class war criminals' names, too. Give ' Ka sou' ceremony to these name papers to comfort old Japanese who suffered during WW II. Ka sou is cremation by burning bodies or remains. Many Japanese families have their male families killed in WW II.

They were cremated. But the GHQ was intent on disposing them in the ocean but some comingled ashes were kept where it is housed in the link above. Tojo as well as other executed criminals have also separate gravesites (Aoyama reien).

But the logic here seems like if those graves are not vandalized, the Japanese population in general, are honoring them.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Stubborn and idiotic to say the least!

-3 ( +7 / -10 )

She is fluent in American English, She used to work for Dem. US Rep. Schroder as Congressional Fellow. It seems that she is pushed for difficult different jobs in Abe cabinet. BTW, Congressional Fellow is not for everybody in USA. they have to have tight lips and help constituents. Maybe she is enjoying Japanese freedom of speech? .

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

But it's THOSE names that cause the problem. Get rid of them and there would be no problem really.

I doubt it considering the fact that three Prime Ministers have visited 21 times after the enshrinement of so-called Class A without a peep from China. It's a "problem" that they decided to create as a political tool so I'm quite certain they'll always come up with something.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

After the end of WWII, the Yasukuni shrine became the symbol/ fortress of Japanese fascism and a common place for gathering of the Japanese fascists.

In essence, I guess from 1945-85, 12 Prime Ministers combined 60 visits during which time Japan was runned by fascists. (sigh)

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Why in heavens name do you just copy and paste shallow articles cranked out by the Armed Forces Press service like this? Using trigger words like "brutal' to describe the occupation of Korea, and other key phrases show that this is a slanted and attack article from the start. As such it is not worthy of our time and space on your forum and service. Japan was a nation with national goals and policies identical to every other nation of the 1940s and did what it felt was best at the time, war is war no matter who fights it or when it happens....and all sides of that war committed attrocities and i would say that the US attacks on civilians in Japan and elsewhere equal any thing done by the Japanese yet no one complains when US presidents or politicians visit Arlington National Cemetery where the men who commited those acts and flew those bombers that firebombed or nukes Japanese cities are buried. China and Korea need to get on with their own lives and challenges and not be so unbalanced in their view pointing the finger at others when there are plenty of fingers that can point at them for their own modern policies or mistakes. No one supports bad acts or sad events of history but it is sacred to honour the memory of fallen people who gave their lives to their nation in trust and duty. Westerners who have no respect for such Shrines should indeed mind their own business and be respectful or not intrude.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Just like what zichi said, the church can excommunicate you. I don't know what planet you live in but guys like Tojo and those even class C criminals would've been excommunicated by any church.

I don't quite relate excommunication from church to that of baptising for in essence we're talking about two different issues in religious membership and religious rite. There are many Shinto jinjya's that enshrine some of the worst people in history to basically calm their souls. If you detest it, it's simply a difference of a belief and move on.

And it seems to me it was the shrine that actually accepted these criminals in the first place. So your point is moot. There are those soldiers that probably just followed orders and did not commit heinous crimes against humanity. Nobody is having a problem with those folks. We are all having a problem with the criminals that were convicted of crimes against humanity. We don't care about 2.5 million soldiers. We cared about the few that just don't belong.

Class A is defined as "crimes against peace". Class C are "crimes against humanity" in which none of the accused at the Tokyo trials were charged with.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

The question is not whether I agree with the Chinese gov't, actually just about every gov't on earth would agree to the fact that these elements do not belong in a place of worship

And yet the most visit by foreign entity are the U.S. forces.

The question is why are people like you who are so sympathetic about elements like them? What good does it do for you other than shame and unadulterated and indecent pride about that shameful past?

I've said it on many occasions that honoring your own fallen soldiers is a natural thing to do in any country and it's strictly an internal matter. A hero in your own country is considered a war criminal in another but rarely do you see such whining coming from China and Korea.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Nigel, remember what President Bush said when Japanese media asked him about the shrine. He said he wouldn't visit it and said he understood the honoring of the dead but he had "personal feelings" against it. He said he father Senior Bush was shot down as a fighter pilot by the Japanese. Friendship with Japan asides, personal feelings still lingers.

Perhaps you could enlighten me on the exact quote of the this media coverage. But in any case, your comment reminded me of this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvzTfdceOiQ

Back in 06, he repeatedly ask Koizumi on whether he would stop visiting the shrine but K refused.

He did?

We don't like the shrine. U.S. "tourists" would visit it and most of the guides are Japanese English speaking guides don't talk about the Class A Criminals. They just talked about the shrine. Most tourists are ignorant but some wanted to see the evil of it as well. I've been there. All my vet buddies had been there. We visited it not to honor it but to see the evil contained in it.

Considering that you were also "ignorant" of what Class A meant, this is not surprising.

Intent of the visit is more important than the visit itself. We don't care if the uninformed who visit it. We care WHY you are visiting it.

To honor the war dead. If these lawmkers say something else to the contrary, let me know.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

"Then why are these criminals being honored in a shrine that politicians visit in mass? Honor their spirits? THAT would be a million times worst. If there are ashes or bodies there, at least there's something. IF there is nothing there, then something ain't kosher here."

It seems as though you, much like the Chinese government, are searching ways to find it objectionable. The flip side is this. If you don't believe in it, why get all bent out of shape about it?

If there are no ashes, then why is it so difficult to move whatever that represent them out to somewhere else? It SHOULD be easier if there are not physical substance to be moved.

Once they are "enshrined", they can't be moved for the whole purpose is to calm the souls. Your question is analogous to a church un baptising an individual.

I just don't get it. Why would anyone want to be associated with them? The notion that they are being honored is just disgusting.

They are honored along with the 2.5 million soldiers. Like I said in a previous article, if the lawmakers are SPECIFICALLY honoring the class A war criminals, they would go to

http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%AE%89%E5%9B%BD%E4%B8%83%E5%A3%AB%E5%BB%9F

where they SPECIFICALLY house the co-mingled ashes of the executed class A war criminals.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

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