politics

N Korea unveils first nuclear-armed submarine to patrol waters between Korean peninsula and Japan

49 Comments
By Josh Smith and Soo-hyang Choi

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49 Comments
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At least they able to make something working, while in Japan just to make plan already being tainted with scandal and another bowing.

https://manila-stv.ph/japan_news/japan-defense-chief-apologizes-for-flawed-aegis-data.html

-18 ( +6 / -24 )

What is with all the sightseeing windows?

-8 ( +4 / -12 )

They will still need to pull into the gas stand to fill it up.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

Analysts said the vessel appears to be a modified Soviet-era Romeo-class submarine, which North Korea acquired from China in the 1970s and began producing domestically

Also known as : The Sinking Rusty Coffin.

4 ( +13 / -9 )

USA forgot to speak to you about mafia, black ops, nazi../ submarine. They tend to infiltrate north korea by submarine. Producing such submarine means, NK know all the technology under. And those terrorist they don’t have access to nuclear submarine or the technology that come with it to detect lesser submarine.

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As a problem for Japan, following those submarine are hard. They are use outside warfare and anti-submarine technology outside warfare is pretty unusefull. Those submarine can transport nuclear Materials too for dirty bombs. This is about transporting nuclear weapon underwater in a steals manner.

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Today, open war is are. The problem is the spying war. And Korea got a serious weapon here.

-20 ( +4 / -24 )

Simply bizarre. I guess it works for the domestic audience. Good luck young North Korean submariners, you'll need it.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

But why?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Don't laugh or look down on others. If you can build a submarine, why others can't?

-4 ( +5 / -9 )

It kept some carpenters busy, I suppose.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

CuteUsagi

What is with all the sightseeing windows?

Those aren't windows. They're vents.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

I’m just worried. Will the sub be able to resurface after diving?

6 ( +10 / -4 )

Fighto!

Today 05:07 pm JST

Analysts said the vessel appears to be a modified Soviet-era Romeo-class submarine, which North Korea acquired from China in the 1970s and began producing domestically

> Also known as : The Sinking Rusty Coffin

You should have kept reading.

It is a "design" from the 1970s not made in the 1970s it has been modified and this one is newly built!

It has been modified and as the article states it seems to now have vertical launch capability which means possible tactical Nukes missiles.

Old or not if it is able to fire even one nuke at a flotilla of ships that would sink quite a few!

Nothing to laugh about at this point.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

North Korea has about 20 Romeo-class submarines, which are powered by diesel-electric engines and are obsolete by modern standards, with most other countries operating them only as training vessels.

Not sure where the writer gets his information from but diesel electric are still the standard for most countries.

Only 6 countries have nuclear submarines once Australia and Brazil gets the ones they ordered that number will be 8.

A total of 42 countries and Taiwan have military submarines with nuclear 37 with diesel electric including Japan and South Korea, Taiwan, Canada (used bought from the UK), the Netherlands, Germany Poland, Norway, Sweden, Spain, Portugal, etc...

Only the USA, China, Russia, India, France and the UK have nuclear ones.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

"When this thing is field deployed, it's going to be quite vulnerable to allied anti-submarine warfare," he said. "So I think from a sort of hard-headed military standpoint this doesn't make a lot of sense."

I would agree if they are not equipped with nuclear missiles and torpedoes.

You need to get fairly close to drop depth charges either from a ship or plane and a nuke doesn't have to make a direct hit to do damage.

I am not saying these are anything great, the technology is probably old but again anything that fires a nuclear weapon is not to be taken lightly.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

This is it from day 1 lol

https://en.yna.co.kr/view/PYH20230908025200315?section=image/nk

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The US will simply deploy more Hunter-Killers in the Sea of Japan. This NKo fish will never see combat.

7 ( +11 / -4 )

The race for the most nuclear continues

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Ossan,you do not know what the US will do,,the US has not done anything too protect it basis children safety

-13 ( +2 / -15 )

Looks like the Titan with more windows for people to rent and site see

1 ( +5 / -4 )

OssanAmerica

Today 07:03 pm JST

The US will simply deploy more Hunter-Killers in the Sea of Japan. This NKo fish will never see combat

Let me point out.

The USA no longer has a large fleet of Nuclear submarines.

It now has only 4 the rest have been decommissioned.

So a total of 68 sunbs 64 are diesel.

Now China and Allie of NK has 78 subs 4 of which are nuclear.

Russia has 70 subs 12 of which are nuclear.

NK has 35 subs.

So in the Pacific region

China, NK and Russia have the potential of 183 subs 16 of which are nuclear.

While the USA, Japan, South Korea and Taiwan have a combined number maximum of 115 with 4 being nuclear.

All this silly talk of the USA being the great power still is just that, talk.

The USA has neglected maintaining its power, shifted to going after easy targets like in Iraq and Afghanistan.

While China increased its ability everywhere and China, Russia, and NK have kept the need for outside tech and parts to a minimum, so they can increase rapidly production of anything they need.

-12 ( +3 / -15 )

Our SKo allies view:

" South Korea’s Joint Chiefs of Staffs (JCS) poured scorn on those claims in a statement on Friday, saying the new sub appears “not capable of normal operation,” and warned there were signs North Korea was trying to exaggerate its capabilities."

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/09/07/asia/north-korea-submarine-intl/index.html

2 ( +6 / -4 )

@ossan

Hahaha

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

OssanAmerica

Today 07:43 pm JST

I don't believe anything NK says but using SK as a source isn't much better.

The USA and SK will down play everything NK says.

I remember the first time NK said they successfully detonated a nuclear bomb.

Both the USA and SK claimed it was fake and a large conventional type explosion.

Well it wasn't as we now know!

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

It is ironic that Canadian owned UK Reuters is trying to downplay this when Canada's subs are used British subs that caught fire in on the way to Canada and had to be towed to Canada!

Even if it is an old design at least they can build their own subs !

-5 ( +4 / -9 )

@OssanJapan

The US will simply deploy more Hunter-Killers

Actually the US doesn't have enough Virginia class submarines to spare, with increasing demands at South China Sea.

The only realistic solution is to finally consent to ROK nuclear submarine program that Koreans have long been demanding and provide the 20% enriched uranium fuel. The US too could consent to Japanese nuclear submarine program but Kishida from Hiroshima is against nuclear submarines.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

North Korea has about 20 Romeo-class submarines, which are powered by diesel-electric engines and are obsolete by modern standards, with most other countries operating them only as training vessels.

Not sure where the writer gets his information from but diesel electric are still the standard for most countries.

The writer was referring to Romeo-class submarines, which are indeed obsolete, not diesel-electric powered submarines in general.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

The thing can probably be heard underwater from 100 miles away. But good job, or something

4 ( +6 / -2 )

This is bad news.

More than I fear some country will be stupid enough or crazy enough to launch a nuclear attack, I worry that an accident or miscommunication will start a nuclear war, and we won't survive many nuclear exchanges, not even if we lived on Tristan da Cunha. And the odds of a goof just went up by quite a lot.

It was not known at the time, but America was dropping depth charges on a nuclear armed Soviet sub during the Cuban Missile Crisis. Their standing orders were to launch in such an event and they had no communication with Moscow. It came down to a vote, and the captain and political commissar voted to launch. The Flotilla commander voted against, and it caused a great and furious argument, but since it had to be unanimous it was not launched. His name was Vasili Arkhipov and even the Soviets did not properly recognize that this man likely saved the entire human race.

Later came Stanislov Petrov who second guessed a computer system glitch that said America had launched a single nuke toward the Soviet Union. He decided not to report to higher ups because he knew they would be stupid about it. He too likely saved us all by simply doing nothing.

Well I don't think the North Koreans have many sane or well-educated people in its military, and I certainly don't think they have many independent thinkers with the cojones to say "To hell with all of you! NO!" Its scary enough here with so many of you kowtowing to whatever the narrative of the day is. Seriously. I have no hope for this planet.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

"The U.S. military has 68 nuclear submarines, including 14 SSBNs and 50 SSNs, according to a document compiled by the Congressional Budget Office in April last year. China still trails far behind, with 15 nuclear submarines in 2021, the U.S. Congressional Research Service said."

6 ( +8 / -2 )

The USA no longer has a large fleet of Nuclear submarines.

Of course they do.

It now has only 4 the rest have been decommissioned.

All US military submarines are nuclear powered.

So a total of 68 sunbs 64 are diesel.

The US has no military diesel/electric submarines. They stopped using them decades ago.

Someone needs to update their information. I suggest checking Janes.com.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

40 years old Soviet junk pretending to be dangerous………Sea of Japan pollution…….nuclear

0 ( +4 / -4 )

I think my bath toys look more suited to the task than this haha

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Antiquesaving

Let me point out.

The USA no longer has a large fleet of Nuclear submarines.

It now has only 4 the rest have been decommissioned.

So a total of 68 sunbs 64 are diesel.

Let me point out...you are incorrect. You appear to be conflating the power source with the armament.

The entire fleet of 68 submarines are nuclear-powered. However, only 4 are equipped with guided missiles. Perhaps that is where you got confused. Also, 14 are equipped with ballistic missiles, making 18 armed with medium-to-long-range nuclear weapons.

The other 50 are fast-attack submarines, all nuclear-powered.

All this silly talk of the USA being the great power still is just that, talk.

Yet, it's still the most-powerful navy in the world, for better or worse. The 11 aircraft carriers and the 100's of aircraft they bring to the table are still unmatched. (Yes, the PRC is the largest navy with almost twice as many vessels. But, the sheer number of vessels does not equate to most powerful.)

The USA is still one of the great powers. I'm not sure why you don't see that. And, if you add NATO and the IP4, they've got a pretty powerful coalition going on.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

wallace

"The U.S. military has 68 nuclear submarines, including 14 SSBNs and 50 SSNs, according to a document compiled by the Congressional Budget Office in April last year. "

Yup. That's what the "N" stands for. (BTW, you left out the 4 SSGNs.)

Not sure where antiquesaving got his numbers from. Seems like those numbers are a bit antique.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Wow. That must have taken a lot of Lego. Neat ventilation holes for really hot days.

Wouldn't want to be on it when they try to launch one of their fireworks.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

The United States aims to denuclearize the Korean peninsula, so it will not approve of this move by North Korea.

South Korea has long aspired to develop nuclear weapons. South Korea used to do this secretly and was scolded by America.

Depending on the administration, the United States may approve of Japan's nuclear weapons, but not South Korea. This is because the denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, which is the front line, is the ultimate goal of the United States. And unlike Japan, South Korea is not trusted by America.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

What is with all the sightseeing windows?

Not windows. Those are ballast tank vents and free flood vents. The pressure hull is inside an outer hull. The ballast tanks are in between these. There are openings on the bottom of the hull to allow water to enter the ballast tanks and displace air so the sub can submerge. To surface compressed air is used to blow ballast water out of those same vent holes. Some of the holes allow water to flow freely between the outer hull and pressure hull. It that were not so the thin skin of the outer hull would be crushed by water pressure at depth. The inner pressure hull is much thicker. All those vent holes create a huge amount of "flow noise". Each hole creates a "Helmholz resonance" as water passes over, the same way blowing over the top of an open bottle makes noise.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

You need to get fairly close to drop depth charges either from a ship or plane and a nuke doesn't have to make a direct hit to do damage.

No half way modern navy uses depth charges any more for anti submarine warfare. Pretty much every navy uses acoustic homing torpedoes, some of which like Mk-48 ADCAP have very long ranges and run times. A few navies use mortars or rockets for ASW, but these are not effective against deep diving subs or most modern nuclear subs who's thick hulls of high strength steel wound not be damaged by a rocket or mortar hit.

During the Cold War the US and some allies had nuclear depth charges for use against enemy SSBNs. Almost guaranteed kill but boy does a nuclear explosion mess up the acoustics under water for a few hours, making further ASW more or less impossible.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

I feel pretty for the engineers who are not capable of redesigning the entire hull but still had to add a new item to the boss's toy box

Hope that backpacker submarine won't sink and produce true radioactive water.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

I feel pretty for the engineers who are not capable of redesigning the entire hull but still had to add a new item to the boss's toy box

Hope that backpacker submarine won't sink and produce true radioactive water.

The sub appears to be based on the old Soviet Projekt 629 (NATO code name Golf ) class ballistic missile subs. They were diesel electric boats. Ten of these were sold to the North Koreans for scrap.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Those 'Holes' in the side are where the oars go, but I hear they are building a newer one that is pedal powered.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Koreans complain about Japan's treated water, but never about China or Russia.

A sunken Russian nuclear submarine is also being disposed of in the Sea of Japan, but there seems to be no particular opinion on this either.

If North Korea's nuclear submarines are not brought to the surface, there will be more trash loaded with nuclear fuel in the ocean, but I'm sure South Koreans won't complain about this either.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

If North Korea's nuclear submarines are not brought to the surface, there will be more trash loaded with nuclear fuel in the ocean

This NK sub is not nuclear-powered, it's diesel-electric.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Reginald Bok Sep. 8  07:48 pm JST

@ossan

Hahaha

"Laughter out of context to a situation or exaggerated is called paradoxical laughter. It’s related to schizophrenia and other neurological disorders, but there are treatment options."

https://psychcentral.com/schizophrenia/paradoxical-laughter

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Fighto!Sep. 8  05:07 pm JST

Analysts said the vessel appears to be a modified Soviet-era Romeo-class submarine, which North Korea acquired from China in the 1970s and began producing domestically

Also known as : The Sinking Rusty Coffin.

What? No Beatles looking outside at you?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

AntiqueSaving=

The USA no longer has a large fleet of Nuclear submarines.

It now has only 4 the rest have been decommissioned.

So a total of 68 sunbs 64 are diesel.

Now China and Allie of NK has 78 subs 4 of which are nuclear.

Russia has 70 subs 12 of which are nuclear.

NK has 35 subs.

So in the Pacific region

China, NK and Russia have the potential of 183 subs 16 of which are nuclear.

While the USA, Japan, South Korea and Taiwan have a combined number maximum of 115 with 4 being nuclear.

Everything you said there, everything, is patently and verifiably false with only the most cursory of internet searches.

The US has SEVENTY TWO nuclear submarines. Not 4. Not 14. Not 44. 72.

Thats more than the rest of the world. Combined. Russia is next with 33. China has 6.

I’m at a loss…your “information” isn’t even close to accurate. It’s laughably and provably false.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The USA no longer has a large fleet of Nuclear submarines.

It now has only 4 the rest have been decommissioned.

This is trivial to prove false. The USN only has nuclear subs. No diesel at all. Of those,

Los Angeles class (29 in commission, 2 in reserve)

Ohio class (18 in commission)

Seawolf class (3 in commission)

Virginia class (19 in commission, 1 delivered, 1 fitting out, 7 under construction, 2 on order)

Let's do some 3rd grade math. That's 69 commissioned. That's without making any special claims about "reserve" or other status for un-ready submarines.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Talk about a country that has their priorities screwed up. They can't feed their people, but they have an active nuclear weapons program for ICBMs and submarines? Nobody is planning to attack the country. Eventually, China will just take over ... China will get NK before they get Taiwan. And the NK people will still have miserable lives under a dictator more interested in appearances than helping anyone.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

While you are busy counting submarines don't ignore the 23 very high quality attack subs in the JMSDF. When I was active duty we always considered a Japanese attack sub to be the next best thing to a US or UK nuclear attack sub. They might not be nuclear powered but considering that any action would be close to Japan, there is much less need for nuclear power to meet Japan's defense needs. The Japanese subs were always tough adversaries with skilled professional crews and great equipment.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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