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Okinawa rejects central gov't demand over U.S. base landfill

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Try relocating a US base near Tokyo and see what happens!

They're only pushing for the new base to be built in Okinawa because they want it as far from Tokyo as they can get it.

-9 ( +7 / -16 )

Try relocating a US base near Tokyo and see what happens!

You would make a fine reporter for Mainstream news outlets. Cherry picking facts and spinning those to support your hatred for the US military. There are three military bases within a stones throw of Tokyo: Yokosuka, Yokota and Atsugi. The the Okinawa Governor and the party block/machine that ensures he gets reelected is funded by outside interests further south that have a lot to gain if the American presence on Okinawa is reduced. When and if, Taiwan falls, Okinawa is next to be assimilated. As the Borg would say, resistance is futile!

7 ( +12 / -5 )

They're only pushing for the new base to be built in Okinawa because they want it as far from Tokyo as they can get it.

The US Navy operates its largest air base in the Pacific, NAS Atsugi, just outside Tokyo. The USAF has an equally large air base in the area at Yokota AB.

Please look at a map. Understand the strategic importance of the western allies maintaining control of the First Island Chain and the centrality of Okinawa to doing so.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

If Chinese forces were to gain control of the First Island Chain US, Japanese and allied western navies would be very hard pressed to prevent China from taking Taiwan, Okinawa and attacking Japan from the east. Defending the First Island Chain depends not only on being able to operate from Okinawa, but preventing the Chinese from dominating it. Basically if the Chinese can break out of the First Island Chain a war with them is lost.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

Relocate the base to the Senkakus...who's gonna object?...China?...fill in atolls China on atolls that are not yours...have a nice day...sorted...I'll expect my Nobel prize in the morning...

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Residents of Okinawa?

You must be joking. Majority do not live in Okinawa and some are not even Japanese!!

0 ( +5 / -5 )

A legal "claim" is right to recoupment for damages done. Japan agreed with the U.S. to wave all claims to damages, overt and covert, that had incurred during Okinawa's occupation. Does this agreement also rescind the irregularities that were committed by U.S. forces, whereby the U.S. has become completely innocent now? In other words, can the illegal confiscation of private lands by the U.S. occupation forces be condoned simply because of this bilateral agreement?

The 1971 Okinawa Reversion Agreement goes:

*Japan waives all claims of Japan and its nationals against the United States of America and its nationals and against the local authorities of the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands, arising from the presence, operations or actions of forces or authorities of the United States of America in these islands, or from the presence, operations or actions of forces or authorities of the United States of America having had any effect upon these islands, prior to the date of entry into force of this Agreement.

In my view, the illegal nature of USMC Air Station Futenma remains the same despite this agreement. Therefore, the USMC air wing, being squatters illegally occupying the land, so to speak, cannot demand its replacement be provided in exchange of its return. Futenma must be returned right then and there with no strings attached.

 Nobody knows what kind of a role will Ospreys based in Henoko will play in a future war in which AI-controlled drones at sea and in the air, together with cruise missiles, will dominate a battle scene. Aren't the U.S. Marines transforming themselves now to deal with such warfare?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

The US Navy operates its largest air base in the Pacific, NAS Atsugi, just outside Tokyo. The USAF has an equally large air base in the area at Yokota AB.

The largest USAF base in the Pacific is on Kadena AB on Okinawa.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

They should seek for independence, the central government in Tokyo just doesn't cares anyone in Okinawa. They just don't want to get involved in world war III, they don't want to know what is your do called "First island chain", just leave me alone!

-9 ( +3 / -12 )

The mayor of Okinawa Denny Tamaki went to China in July and paid his respect at the cemetery of the Ryukyu Kingdom in Beijing's Tongzhou. He knows the root and his ancestors were from China although they were being assimilation to be Japanese. The people of Okinawa has awaken from the myth of being Japanese, the govt. of Japan just don't see them as equal, like second class citizens, the Okinawand have had enough the lies spoken from all the Japanese prime ministers. Okinawa has no business in US-Japan military pact , they want China, they want a liberation and back to the hugging by Chinese !

-11 ( +2 / -13 )

@elephant

Denny Tamaki is not the mayor but the governor of Okinawa Prefecture.

So you are saying the Okinawans want China and won't be treated like second class citizens by the CCP.

Yeah, . . . right!!! What a joke!!!

Maybe, you should ask the Tibetans, the Uyghurs. the ethnic Mongols and the Hong Kongers on how they are treated by the CCP!!

8 ( +11 / -3 )

The mayor of Okinawa Denny Tamaki went to China in July and paid his respect at the cemetery of the Ryukyu Kingdom in Beijing's Tongzhou. He knows the root and his ancestors were from China although they were being assimilation to be Japanese. The people of Okinawa has awaken from the myth of being Japanese, the govt. of Japan just don't see them as equal, like second class citizens, the Okinawand have had enough the lies spoken from all the Japanese prime ministers. Okinawa has no business in US-Japan military pact , they want China, they want a liberation and back to the hugging by Chinese !

Man I hope your handlers pay you well. Just kidding. No I don’t.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

@WiseOneIn Yeah, right!!! What a joke!

You think this is a joke? NO!

Have you heard of these two names?

Rina Shimanukuro, an Okinawa lady's name. She deceased.

Kenneth Franklin Gadson, a murderer's name. He is a convict imprisoned now.

What Kenneth has done to Rina? Search for it. That's why the locals hate US armed forces parasiting on their island.

-5 ( +4 / -9 )

@ elephant

You are completely going off topic!!

Denny Tamaki is only playing with politics. Actually, a lot of Okinawan landowners and farmers prefer the Japanese government to continue to lease their land for the US military. In return the landowners receive long-term income and subsidies from the government.

If the land is returned, the landowners and farmers face a loss of income, increase in land taxes and even worse their land has no commercial value for future development.

Do you know who these people are:

Professor Rahile Dawut.

Rinchen Tsultrim.

Adiyaa, who uses the Chinese name Wu Guoxing.

https://www.rfa.org/english/news/china/china-mongolian-11032022160156.html

These people will tell you how China treats them!!

0 ( +4 / -4 )

BertieWoosterToday 08:42 am JST

Try relocating a US base near Tokyo and see what happens!

> They're only pushing for the new base to be built in Okinawa because they want it as far from Tokyo as they can get it.

There are bases in and near Tokyo, along with places like Iwakuni and Miyagi.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

They're only pushing for the new base to be built in Okinawa because they want it as far from Tokyo as they can get it.

Maybe proximity-wise Okinawa is closer to China and South Korea, so it would make more sense to keep them in Okinawa.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

LDP regime intend to waste trillions yens taxes for unreal project that nobody knows complete or not and even US will use it or not.

Concentrating military facility to Okinawa increase military risk of Okinawa citizen when the war, it just victimize Okinawa again as same as WW2, not defend Okinawa.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

'Some' residents of Okinawa oppose USMC Camp Schwab's expansion to accommodate MCAS Futenma's relocation. No one opposes the closure of MCAS Futenma.

The number of Okinawa residents who oppose, support, or are neutral over the project is unknown. That's because the question has never been voted on. The only votes that have taken place are those for normal elected officials. Voter turnout has never been very high and doesn't represent the whole population. Elected officials impose their own opinions as they were elected to do by a small minority of voters.

The Japanese national government has spent a tremendous amount of money on the Futenma relocation project, which has been delayed by the Okinawa government many times over the past 25 (some say 40) years. It is not likely that the national government is going to stop construction because the governor refuses to sign a permission slip.

This issue should be put to a vote so all the citizens of Okinawa can state their preferences. Then all the government entities should follow the result.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

No, independent Ryukyu Kingdom sent scholars and officials to Beijing for educational purposes. Of course traders came along as well. The cemetery in Beijing is for those Ryukyuans who died there.

The mayor of Okinawa Denny Tamaki went to China in July and paid his respect at the cemetery of the Ryukyu Kingdom in Beijing's Tongzhou. He knows the root and his ancestors were from China

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Maybe proximity-wise Okinawa is closer to China and South Korea, so it would make more sense to keep them in Okinawa.

Google Map Okinawa. See where it is relative to Japan, Taiwan, South Korea and its position in the First Island Chain. I don't think one needs to be Sun Tzu to see Okinawa's military value to Japan, to South Korea, to Taiwan and to the US. It anchors the defense of all of those nations.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Is Denny spouting CCP talking points again?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

No, independent Ryukyu Kingdom sent scholars and officials to Beijing for educational purposes. Of course traders came along as well. The cemetery in Beijing is for those Ryukyuans who died there.

The Ryukyu Kingdom was not as independent as you assert. China strictly controlled what nations the Ryukyuans could trade with, namely the other tributary states of China. They could not trade freely, which is why the Ryukyu Kingdom had to hide their growing trade with Japan. The Chinese put the equivalent of a viceroy at the Ryukyu capital to monitor the government, a viceroy who controlled who held power in the kingdom.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Why is the governor even bothering to protest, the Japanese government can just override anything he says.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The new base, the so-called replacement for USMC Air Station Futenma, now under construction in Henoko, is nothing but a white elephant. The M-22 Osprey base will have no role to play in a future war in which missile exchanging dominates the battle scene. AI-controlled drones at sea and in the air will take the place of man-operated war machine. 

Besides, Japan and the U.S. signed an agreement to the effect that JSDF has primary responsibility to defend Japan's outlying islands.

In spite of these facts, why does the U.S. want to maintain Futenma's function the same as ever before with new state of the art facilities added? One thinkable reason is that the U.S. wants to put Japan under occupation forever, making its armed forces in Japan function as a cap not to let the genie out of the bottle.

When Okinawa was decided to be returned to Japan, a leader of a Southeast Asian country conveyed his concern to a visiting U.S. diplomat about the revival of pre-war Japanese militarism the diplomat replied: "No worry. We have already taken the measure.”

0 ( +1 / -1 )

You would make a fine reporter for Mainstream news outlets. Cherry picking facts and spinning those to support your hatred for the US military.

In fact, its you that would be welcome as a corporate legacy media reporter.

There are three military bases within a stones throw of Tokyo: Yokosuka, Yokota and Atsugi.

Yeah, and they have been occupied by Imperial American troops since 1945.

BertieWooster didn't stutter when he said "new base" and "relocate" a base. He wasn't talking about ancient bases from the SCAP era. He was talking about now....the early part of the 21st century. But your dropping that vital caveat of "new" is some classic propaganda technique the lying press loves. Its almost like it was an honest mistake.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The M-22 Osprey base will have no role to play in a future war in which missile exchanging dominates the battle scene. AI-controlled drones at sea and in the air will take the place of man-operated war machine.

Laughable. The prototype for a modern amphibious assault is the the 25 November 2001 Marine air assault that took Camp Rhino in Afghanistan. Instead of putting an amphibious force ashore using traditional landing craft loaded with vehicles, artillery and armor, the assault was conducted entirely by air from ships in the North Arabian Sea 400 nautical miles north to the objective in southern Afghanistan. General Mattis made a decision to leave all of his armor and field artillery on his ships (he was Commander TF58 at the time, outranking the senior Naval officer in the task force) and relying entirely on airlift to move his force from his ships to the combat theater. For close air support, absent artillery, he relied on the AV-8B Harriers from USS Peleliu, his flagship using precision guided munitions. His experience in Desert Storm convinced him that modern PGMs offered a much precision and timeliness as fixed tube artillery. In flight refueling was conducted using USMC KC-130s. The Marines only had one helicopter able to make such a lift and refuel in flight, the CH-53E so the entire assault relied on that helicopter. The CH-46s were not used.

Because the abundance and ubiquity of cruise and ballistic missiles make a traditional beach assault a suicide mission, that November 2001 raid is the prototype for future Marine Corps amphibious operations. The V-22 with its higher speeds, much greater range and in flight refueling is fundamental to how the Marines will operate in the future. In the past two years the Marines have eliminated all of their heavy armor, turning most of their M-1 Abrams over to the US Army and they have also decommissioned most of their tube artillery. Future amphibious assaults will rely heavily on air lift and air cushion landing craft allowing the assault force ships to stay far from the assault, and also allowing forces to be landed away from enemy concentrations before attacking instead of trying to brute force their way onto a contested beach like WWII.

It is also worth noting that the US Army earlier this month chose to replace their entire UH-60 Blackhawk helicopter fleet with a newly designed tilt rotor aircraft from Bell called the V-280 Valor.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

This is the prototype for modern amphibious warfare

https://www.mca-marines.org/wp-content/uploads/The-15th-Marine-Expeditionary-Units-Seizure-of-Camp-Rhino.pdf

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Besides, Japan and the U.S. signed an agreement to the effect that JSDF has primary responsibility to defend Japan's outlying islands.

Which in no way precludes the US from coming to the assistance of Japanese forces were they threatened with being overwhelmed.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Jun Kitamura, a military analyst, says in an essay contributed to JB Press(9/15/2022) that Futenma's replacement now under construction in Henoko, Okinawa, may be a white elephant, after all, strategically and financially. 

The U.S. Marine Corps is under structural transformation currently, restructuring its ground force and air wing from MAGTF (Marine Air-Ground Task Force) to Anti-Access, in which ground-based Marines will prevent enemy naval and air forces from approaching the shore by firing cutting-edge projectiles such as HIMARS rockets.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

The U.S. Marine Corps is under structural transformation currently, restructuring its ground force and air wing from MAGTF (Marine Air-Ground Task Force) to Anti-Access, in which ground-based Marines will prevent enemy naval and air forces from approaching the shore by firing cutting-edge projectiles such as HIMARS rockets.

They are converting three battalion sized units to this concept, not the entire Marine Corps.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Am sick of hearing about the Chinese threat. It is an excuse for the Americans to do anything to the people of Okinawa. About the new airbase, it is in the wrong area. The bottom of the sea is too soft to build an airfield.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Desert Tortoise,

They are converting three battalion sized units to this concept, not the entire Marine Corps.

You mean all the rest will remain as conventional combat troops for invading enemy territory and occupying it?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

You mean all the rest will remain as conventional combat troops for invading enemy territory and occupying it?

Did you read my post describing how the Marines are changing to a more air mobile force based on their November 2001 assault on Camp Rhino?

In general the Marine Corps are too small to hold and occupy any significant territory. They basically kick the door down for the US Army to follow with a much larger and heavier equipped force.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Desert Tortoise,

A contingent of the U.S. Marine Corps on Okinawa euphemistically call themselves an "expeditionary force", but, in fact, they are a forward strike force, that is, the invaders of enemy land. I don't care if the land they take from the enemy is given to a following Army contingent for it to occupy and administer it.

That's what Okinawa experienced during and after the Second World War.

Now, my question: Will the same thing happen in a future war in which missile exchanging will dominate the warfare, whereby the Osprey-based Henoko base is superfluous and unnecessary? Note that it's been bilaterally agreed that primary responsibility to defend outlying islands rests with JSDF and not with USFJ.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

That's what Okinawa experienced during and after the Second World War

Please refresh your memory of the war crimes committed by Japan upon its neighbors. Please review what Japan did to the US on 7 December 1941. Japan and your dear Okinawa got what they richly deserved. The Marines are there forward deployed so some other nation like Russia and China don't get any ideas they do to the US and its allies what Japan did to the US and its allies in WWII.

You Japanese really have nobody to blame for that but yourselves. I am tired of your incessant whining on the subject. If Japan hadn't attacked China and the US, Mao would have been defeated by Chiang Kai-shek's forces in 1937, there would not be a PRC menacing us now, Japan would still have the Kurile Islands and there would be no US military in Japan. But Japan left Asia a wreck and unfortunately for all the US has to keep forces in the region to prevent a resumption of the kinds of barbarities the IJA wreaked on the region.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Desert Tortoise,

Please refresh your memory of the war crimes committed by Japan upon its neighbors. Please review what Japan did to the US on 7 December 1941. Japan and your dear Okinawa got what they richly deserved. The Marines are there forward deployed so some other nation like Russia and China don't get any ideas they do to the US and its allies what Japan did to the US and its allies in WWII.

Compared with what Imperial Japan did to its neighbors and the atrocitis its troops committed, what the U.S. has done to Okinawa is negligible and minuscule. Is that what you want to say? Besides, you say the U.S. military presence in Japan and, in Okinawa in particular, is the end result of IP's attack on Pearl Harbor.

Well, IJ was duly retaliated against on the nail, almost annihilated with two atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 

If you say the U.S. military presence in Japan is the end result of IJ's misdemeanors during the war, then, what's the meaning of the Japan-U.S. Security Treaty, according to which USFJ is supposed to be stationed in Japan. Is that bilateral treaty nothing but nonsense paperwork and shenanigans?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

If you say the U.S. military presence in Japan is the end result of IJ's misdemeanors during the war, then, what's the meaning of the Japan-U.S. Security Treaty, according to which USFJ is supposed to be stationed in Japan. Is that bilateral treaty nothing but nonsense paperwork and shenanigans?

Japan left Asia a wreck. Fact. Now much of Asia is controlled by enemies of elected representative government and who burn to extract revenge on Japan for the barbarities committed by the IJA in their lands. It didn't have to be that way had Japan not gone on an imperialist rampage but that is how history worked out.

Japan is responsible for this situation and the US is stuck with it. The US knows from the experience of the interwar years between WWI and WWII that if the US walks away war will soon resume and soon enough the US will be dragged back in. Much better to keep US forces forward deployed so nobody gets any ideas that the US is weak and the US allies can be pushed around. It is not an occupation. You elect whom you choose. Japan is free to legislate their own laws. Their courts are independent. The US isn't dictating any aspect of Japanese life. Japan could tell the US to remove its forces and just as with the Philippines in 1992 the US would leave. But Japan's leaders are wise enough to know what happens when US forces leave and all one has to do is see what happened to Hong Kong to understand this. China will come hunting and then your dear Okinawa will experience a real invasion and occupation, and the Chinese won't tolerate your governor's whining when they set up bases wherever they wish.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Desert Tortoise,

Japan left Asia a wreck. Fact. Now much of Asia is controlled by enemies of elected representative government and who burn to extract revenge on Japan for the barbarities committed by the IJA in their lands. It didn't have to be that way had Japan not gone on an imperialist rampage but that is how history worked out.

When his majesty Akishino, Emperor Naruhito's younger brother, visited Vietnam recently, he and his wife visited the tombs of IJ solders who chose to remain in Vietnam after all defeated IJ troops' repatriation to Japan to join and help fight with independence-seeking insurgents.

So, it's safe to say that, contrary to what you assert, not all Southeast Asian people burn to revenge on Japan for the atrocious war that you say Japan was mostly responsible for.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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