S Korea summons Japan envoy over Yasukuni visits, Abe remarks

jerseyboyApr. 26, 2013 - 06:10AM JST "The comparison to the German invasion of Poland in 1939 is ridiculous and typical of the absurd over-exaggerated bias of the Korean anti-Japan crowd."

Ossan -- the only thing absurd is you making the distinction between the two about invasion, rather than simply >aggression.

Please read the above article wherein South Korean political scientist Ko Sang-tu specifically equates Hitler's INVASION of Poland and the Japanese annexation of Korea. Nowhere does he mention "aggression".

The fact that Japan's military superiority was such that it was not required to use force against Korea does not make >the pain and suffering inflicted on the people there over the decades of Japanese rule any less real.

There was no Japanese INVASION of Korea in 1910. That's not how the annexation was achieved. This is real.

Do you think the thousands of Korean "comfort women" feel the same way you do? Or how about the hundreds of >thousands of Koreans forced to go to Japan as slave laborers to support the war effort? Including working in Aso's >family's businesses.

Going off on tangents and away from the article.

VIVA JAPAN!****

Yasukuni Shrine is a place to go to see the soul of ancestors who died in the war. For the Japanese of today, it is also the farest place from the war. Visiting to Yasukuni shrine of this time, Abe Prime minister and senetors only try to participate in the festival to pray for peace in this spring. Every time we visit there, we would remember the horror of war. When we only visit the shrine, I can't understand to being called a militarism. You should know that japanese people always are cool and calm. We are thinking how it should be for the sake of peace in the world.This is an overreaction. Because we need to remember the oath of no-war there.

jerseyboy Apr. 26, 2013 - 06:10AM JST The fact that Japan's military superiority was such that it was not required to use force against Korea does not make the pain and suffering inflicted on the people there over the decades of Japanese rule any less real. Do you think the thousands of Korean "comfort women" feel the same way you do?

In 1965 the issue was settled for $500 million that was paid out to Korea. The Japan goverment asked Korea goverment to show the concrete number of conscripted workers and soldiers, dead and injured and how much unpaid wages were. They asked to "show the evidences and they would pay". Korea agreed and investigated them. What I want to clarify here is that Korea didn't claim the compensation for the war time prostitutes. Why didn't they? It's because there was no abducted prostitute. Nobody said at the time in Korea, those prostitutes were abducted. Everyone knew there were many women who were so poor that they sold themselves to live and the Japan army didn't have to abduct Korean women. There were many Korean volunteers for Japan army at the time. Therefore Koreans didn't claim it at that time. It's the Korea goverment's problem if they did not disclose the comfort women issue at the time. What did South Korean goverment do with the $500 million that Japan paid already?

Readers, please stop bickering.

The comparison to the German invasion of Poland in 1939 is ridiculous and typical of the absurd over-exaggerated bias of the Korean anti-Japan crowd.

Ossan -- the only thing absurd is you making the distinction between the two about invasion, rather than simply aggression. The fact that Japan's military superiority was such that it was not required to use force against Korea does not make the pain and suffering inflicted on the people there over the decades of Japanese rule any less real. Do you think the thousands of Korean "comfort women" feel the same way you do? Or how about the hundreds of thousands of Koreans forced to go to Japan as slave laborers to support the war effort? Including working in Aso's family's businesses.

In a twisted way, many Japanese politicans and citizens feel their actions in China, the Philippines and Southeast Asia were no worse than those committed by colonizing European nations such as Britain, France, Portugal, Spain, the U.S. and the Netherlands. Some Japanese feel it is unfair that they have to apologize while other colonizing nations do not.

As much as the Koreans are reluctant to admit it, after the WWII, Japan has over the years helped South Korea in many ways. Japan introduced South Korea to Western culture and provided machinery and expertise to set in progress its economic growth in the 1970s.

iWorld Apr. 26, 2013 - 12:35AM JST

The definition of what constitutes aggression has yet to be established in academia or in the international community, Mr. Abe said on Tuesday, according to Japans Asahi Shimbun newspaper. Things that happened between nations will look differently depending on which side you view them from.

In some translations, the hawkish Mr. Abe was quoted wondering about what constitutes invasion. Japanese language experts said invasion and aggression were both valid translations of what Mr. Abe said.

Its like saying Hitlers invasion of Poland wasnt really an invasion. If a German chancellor had said the same thing, he or she would have had to resign, South Korean political scientist Ko Sang-tu told the Chosun Ilbo newspaper.

I just don't see how anyone here can defend Abe and these politician.

IMO:

If he meant "invasion" I suggest that there certainly is room for technical argument over what happened in Korea. Less so in China proper after the establishment of Manchukuo, etc.

If he meant "aggression" there is less room for discussion. Expansionism for example, is a form of aggression in so far as that expansionism exerts one nation's power over other countries and territories to possess or control them.

How many Class A war criminals are interred at Arlington? How many people who dont want to be interred at Arlington are there? There is an even longer list of questions that I would like to pose but you should get the hint, you are talking apples and oranges here.

None. The simple explanation for this is that "Class A, crimes against peace" (ex post facto law, btw) were one of three categories established at London Charters for the International Military Tribunal at that time where the Allieds (winners) sat as both jury, judge, and executioner. In other words, U.S. and their leaders, commanders, and soldiers, being the part of the Allieds were completely EXEMPT from not only these charges but other charges like Class B (wonton bombing of civilians), Class C (ill treatment of POW and citizens.)

I can't believe the lengths that China and SK will go to over the Yasukuni issue. There are real issues to be dealt with, but they can't even have a conversation as long as they are going ape over what is not really the issue at all.

iWorldApr. 26, 2013 - 12:35AM JST In some translations, the hawkish Mr. Abe was quoted wondering about “what constitutes invasion.” Japanese >language experts said “invasion” and “aggression” were both valid translations of what Mr. Abe said. “It’s like saying Hitler’s invasion of Poland wasn’t really an invasion. If a German chancellor had said the same thing, >he or she would have had to resign,” South Korean political scientist Ko Sang-tu told the Chosun Ilbo newspaper.

I just don't see how anyone here can defend Abe and these politician.

Would anyone like to cite what Battle (s) occurred between Korean and Japanese troops leading to the annexation in 1910? How about the day when Korea Surrendered to Japan? The comparison to the German invasion of Poland in 1939 is ridiculous and typical of the absurd over-exaggerated bias of the Korean anti-Japan crowd.

"On September 1, 1939, Germany invaded Poland. The Polish army was defeated within weeks of the invasion. From East Prussia and Germany in the north and Silesia and Slovakia in the south, German units, with more than 2,000 tanks and over 1,000 planes, broke through Polish defenses along the border and advanced on Warsaw in a massive encirclement attack. After heavy shelling and bombing, Warsaw surrendered to the Germans on September 27, 1939"

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005070

“The definition of what constitutes aggression has yet to be established in academia or in the international community,” Mr. Abe said on Tuesday, according to Japan’s Asahi Shimbun newspaper. “Things that happened between nations will look differently depending on which side you view them from.”

In some translations, the hawkish Mr. Abe was quoted wondering about “what constitutes invasion.” Japanese language experts said “invasion” and “aggression” were both valid translations of what Mr. Abe said.

“It’s like saying Hitler’s invasion of Poland wasn’t really an invasion. If a German chancellor had said the same thing, he or she would have had to resign,” South Korean political scientist Ko Sang-tu told the Chosun Ilbo newspaper.

I just don't see how anyone here can defend Abe and these politician.

HokoOnchi

I haven't read the exact comment either but one thing for sure, Japan had not "INVADED" Korea. One thing that Koreans will never admit nor accept.

Does anyone know what, exactly, Abe said? I see reports from Korea that say that Abe also denied that Japan's military actually invaded Korea or China, etc. I assume there may be some short-handing to promote a bias that the Korean papers can exploit from their editorial bully pulpits but what did Abe say about how Japan's armies ended up in Korea, Manchuria and China during the War?

I can't find mention of it.

YubaruApr. 25, 2013 - 11:53AM JST

....

How many Class A war criminals are interred at Arlington? How many people who dont want to be interred at Arlington are there? There is an even longer list of questions that I would like to pose but you should get the hint, you are talking apples and oranges here.

There are no convicted Class A war criminals interred at Arlington. There might be, depending upon the partisan side involved, someone interred at Arlington who might be accused of committing acts that might be considered a war crime.

In point of fact there are no Class A war criminals interred at Yasukuni. No ashes, no remains.

I visited the Yushukan war museum next to the Yasukuni Shrine, and found it a bit strange that while almost all the display panels in the museum were accompanied by quite complete and accurate English translations, the small section close to the exit which commemorates Gen. Tojo, Admiral Onishi (founder of the kamikazi corps) and several others is left in japanese only. It seems to me that if the shrine were so proud of the accomplishments of these men, they would want to let the rest of the world know it and provide a translation of what the Japanese says about their exploits. In Korean as well as English, for that matter.

I think what the Koreans are especially upset about here is Abe's "The definition of what constitutes aggression has yet to be established by academia or in the international community" - in other words, Japan committed no real aggression in Korea from 1910 to 1945, lol.

Well, that sounds about right. They were already part of Japan, due to let's face it, gross mismanagement of the situation by their own government and yanban.

Very broadly speaking, in the 19th century Korea and China were given the similar opportunities to take advantage of Western technology as Japan. One did, they didn't, and they paid for it. And they don't like to be reminded about that. And that's IMO why they squawk louder than most other nations.

How would the Japanese people feel if S Korea built a memorial to President Truman and the pilots who dropped the Atomic bombs? And every year the korean politicians would pray for their souls. I would image the Japanese people will demand S Korea to stop and rightly so.

Your analogy is flawed in so many ways but anyway ...... I don't imagine the Japanese people would like it very much but I do believe the vast majority of the citizens would just think it was Koreans being Koreans. I seriously doubt that they would bleat on about it year after year for the next hundred years. Its called having some pride.

South Korea has been and continues to be a tributary state of China. This despite having an alliance with the U.S. to defend them. South Korea has successfully merged their WWII denial and "victim" position with China's anti-Japan "patriotic education" in order to have value to China and stay in it's good graces. China ignores the reality that Korea was part of the Japanese Empire and Korean soldiers probably killed Chinese civilians.

Oh,Ii know of state-shinto which is a minor group that existed from the Meiji era till the end of WWII in 1945. Lots of Shinto groups.

The founder of my Buddhist faith was arrested as he refused accept Shintoism and Died shortly before the end of the war in prison.

I think what the Koreans are especially upset about here is Abe's "The definition of what constitutes aggression has yet to be established by academia or in the international community" - in other words, Japan committed no real aggression in Korea from 1910 to 1945, lol.

South Korea needs to get over itself. it's been 68 years since wars end. As Long as the Japanese don't do the same thing again, then they can put a sock in it.

But then I'm thinking that it's a giant distraction from Kim Jung Loon to the North and his nonsense

If what the PM means by "pride" is positive self-esteem, then Japan's post-war reconstruction and modern culture seem more appropriate in acknowledging and preserving Japan's present well-being than the aspects of history and tradition that have seemed to be leaned towards in the LDP of late.

if you read history, the protest coming from China and SK is just recent. They had not protested over the issue for few decades after the war. And yes, kindly tell SK and China to stop telling that the whole Asia is against it. For all i know only China and SK are protesting

MikiH,

1940s,50s,60s etc was a LOT different than 1990s onwards, for example back in the 40s most didnt have TVs, in China Korea probably didnt get newspapers often, and CNN NHK nor the internet nor mobile phones were invented yet

Hint you cant compare 40s-60s to 1990 onwards just sayin!

@ Shinjuku No Yaju

" Poppycock( is that a real world). Yes the reasons for war were wrong...... that doesn't taint the soldiers who fought and died in it".

Correct but no one is against ordinary Japanese or even the PM and his Minister visiting the Shrine and paid their respect and honour those who died in the war. They are against those War criminals buried in the same Shrine who received the same honour.

receiving visits from government members in a way that effectively makes it part of a religious organization, state Shinto, that is no longer supposed to exist.

I don't know how you reached to this conclusion but I am not pressured to pray Yasukuni one bit even though I am a full blooded Japanese. Please leave me out of your fantasies.

Virtuoso.

What you are suggesting would be against the Japanese constitution which separates religion and state. Shinto is just as well alive in Japan as Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, etc.

The shrine is another beautiful example of Japanese ambiguity, receiving visits from government members in a way that effectively makes it part of a religious organization, state Shinto, that is no longer supposed to exist. Emperor Hirohito, to his credit, ceased his visits there immediately after the souls of the Class A war criminals were secretly enshrined as kami in 1978. Let the shrine be divested of its religious status and made national property. Then voters will decide how much money it receives from the state and also be forced to take responsibility for how they want their country portrayed to the world. They might make the wrong choice, but at least it will have been their choice to make.

How would the Japanese people feel if S Korea built a memorial to President Truman and the pilots who dropped the Atomic bombs? And every year the korean politicians would pray for their souls. I would image the Japanese people will demand S Korea to stop and rightly so. This is exactly how the Koreans and the Chinese feel everytime the Japanese right wingers visit this shrine. It's not about the visit its about visiting a shrine that honors war criminals who were responsible for millions and millions of innocent lives.

“It is only natural to honor the spirits of the war dead who gave their lives for the country. Our ministers will not cave in to any threats,” Abe told a parliamentary panel on Wednesday.

Beautiful. Well said Mr Abe. Finally I have lived to see a Japanese PM with the stones to stand up to the ridiculous demands of the Koreans and the communists. Bravo.

Except that Japan at the time was the brutal aggressor toward other countries, slaughtering those who truly sacrificed their lives for THEIR countries.

Poppycock. (is that a real word). Yes the reasons for the war were wrong, and many of the actions taken were wrong, but that doesn't mean that at the time of enlistment the individual soldiers didn't fight for love of country. 50 years from now, while the actions of Bush/Cheney and the lead up to war in Iraq will be despised, that doesn't taint the soldiers who fought and died in it.

“It is only natural to honor the spirits of the war dead who gave their lives for the country. "

Except that Japan at the time was the brutal aggressor toward other countries, slaughtering those who truly sacrificed their lives for THEIR countries.

Other Asian countries have moved on and so should China and Korea!

f you read history, the protest coming from China and SK is just recent. They had not protested over the issue for few decades after the war. So then this justifies the actions?

No it doesn't. But it comes to show that, as many have realized in the past several years, both countries' politicians have their own agendas and do not hesitate to use such events for achieving their own political goals.

if you read history, the protest coming from China and SK is just recent. They had not protested over the issue for few decades after the war.

So then this justifies the actions?

if you read history, the protest coming from China and SK is just recent. They had not protested over the issue for few decades after the war. And yes, kindly tell SK and China to stop telling that the whole Asia is against it. For all i know only China and SK are protesting.

Japan's neighbors should focus on Japan's current policies and not on symbolic gestures. A comment on a previous article put it best when comparing these visits to US officials paying respects at Arlington. Every trip to the cemetery isn't reaffirming their belief in dropping bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, its honoring those who died in defense of their nation.

How many Class A war criminals are interred at Arlington? How many people who dont want to be interred at Arlington are there? There is an even longer list of questions that I would like to pose but you should get the hint, you are talking apples and oranges here.

Japanese policies are dictated by the actions of it's elected leaders. So current policies should be focused on, then explain the turn towards militarism, changing history, education, everything that Abe is pushing for, and Yasukuni becomes a part of said policies as well.

Yawn!

People can't site religious freedom on this one. There are other, better, less controversial shrines 160 politicians can go to. By going to this shrine, they are provocatively declaring their ultra-nationalism.

They probabaly had a good chinwag and then came out looking solemn and all. Such nonsense!!!!!!

On this one I've got to side with Abe. Japan's neighbors should focus on Japan's current policies and not on symbolic gestures. A comment on a previous article put it best when comparing these visits to US officials paying respects at Arlington. Every trip to the cemetery isn't reaffirming their belief in dropping bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, its honoring those who died in defense of their nation.

On and on and on and on....no ending in sight for this story....

This game Abe is playing does not have a good ending I fear.