S Korean MPs trigger Japan protest with island visit

Ch1n4SailorOct. 24, 2012 - 08:39AM JST Do the Japanese people not find it a bit strange that they are the only country in the world today that has 6 or 7 >ongoing disputes about remote isolated islands... Not a bit strange...?

Do Chinese people not find it strange that China leads all of Asia with over 17 territorial disputes with it;s neighbors?

If you don't find it strange, especially considering Japan's Aggressive past. So All the other countries are wrong, and >Japan is right...? Huh...? Can you take a step back and take in all the facts, the big picture...?

I guess China's ridicuolous number of disputes isn't strange when you consider China's AGGRESSIVE PRESENT.

The USA was already in Asia in both China and the PI to name 2. As for the rocks, the South Koreans are doing this for political support in the next elections. If Japan had done nothing about Korea it would be part of China now. Russia still would of attacked Japan. Think the best policy to Korea is to ignore them. When they do child like stuff say nothing. Maybe run a couple of patrol boats in international waters off of them.

And if you say that those territories that Japan took, such as Senkaku and doko islands, belong to the rightful owners, how did those rightful owners make claims thir territories during the past when the ancient ruling dynasty powers of ancient China claimed their territories and the Senkakus during the early periods of the dynasty era? BY FORCE they didn't negotiate with anyone on how this island is theirs. Either no one was there to claim it or the acting government at the time killed off their enemies and made self-imposed claims. This was of course before the ideas and territory settlement of modern-day countries were created of course. Therefore claims on territories are always done through FORCE AND VIOLENCE, even if Japan hadn't taken it away it would be fought by other people under different ideals.

AsianHomeTown

Yeah... No sorry gonna disagree with you on that one bro, nice try. Even if Japan hadn't occupied areas of Korea and China, the war between communism and Capitalism would still have taken place; Since In China, Chia Kai Shek and his KMT were trying to unify their country under the model of Western Nations as well as that of Japan. And Mao and his Communist brothers were being supported by the Russian Marxist Soviet Union, Since Russia has already established itself as a Communist Regime and was beginning to make moves to spread Communism throughout Europe and the world. So if Japan hadn't absorbed Korea, why would that not result in an internal Korean war for power struggle? I do know that Korea's former government before being absorbed as a Japanese colony was that ruled by a King and his royal subjects, however pressures from China would influence itself to adopt a more Western or Soviet Union approach, since China, whose economic influences stretches throughout the Asian atmosphere at the time, was having it's own power struggle to who would and what type of political power would take charge.

And now that you mentioned that if Japan hadn't attacked Pearl Harbor and occupied Korea, the US wouldn't enter the war. Yes you are probably right, and I say probably, that if Japan hadn't attacked pearl Harbor there wouldn't be a war in the Pacific, However knowing how Western regimes have a tendency to create a blame with their foes before going to war with them, US and it's western allies would still MOST LIKELY declare war on Japan, once the war in Europe was subsided, because their priorities would still be to hold on to their colonized territory and maintain extracting resources, since the two MAJOR WARS in Europe (WW1 AND WW2) depleted many major European power's money and resources. Japan had already begun to move throughout Asia due to their lack of natural resources and following the model of Western adoption of Colonization. If Japan hadn't colonized any country in Asia and remained neutral, the US and Western allied nations would still be involved with the Communist and Democracy/Capitalist wars in Asia, since their interests is to stop the tied of Communism from spreading and maintain trade and colonization.

Ch1n4Sailor　Absolutely... It would almost be funny, if it wasn't true, Do the Japanese people not find it a bit strange that they are the only country in the world today that has 6 or 7 ongoing disputes about remote isolated islands... Not a bit strange.

I do not think so. Each case is very different cases.

Can you take a step back and take in all the facts, the big picture...?

For the big picture, the issues are important.

So what? it's their land. A bunch of Japanese lawmakers just visited Yasukuni, did they not?

Absolutely... It would almost be funny, if it wasn't true, Do the Japanese people not find it a bit strange that they are the only country in the world today that has 6 or 7 ongoing disputes about remote isolated islands... Not a bit strange...? If you don't find it strange, especially considering Japan's Aggressive past. So All the other countries are wrong, and Japan is right...? Huh...? Can you take a step back and take in all the facts, the big picture...?

This iis one of those problems, when you don't have anything else to worry about. You guys don't have bigger things to worry about..? Like finding a Job, keeping a roof over your head and food on the table..?

As if the reactive protests from Japan are of any serious concern to anyone. Sounds pretty much business as usual to me.

crouching$amuraiHiddenNinja's. wrote ".yeah im sorry but im not gonna agree with you on that one. If anything those islands belong to the US since it is the US who won the war in the Pacific AND help maintain and protect the sovereignty of South Korea during the Korean war. Without US help and Japanese aid with fixing and repairing military equipment, Korea would be under North Korea's"

First of all if Japan had not invaded Korea in 1905 and bombed Pearl Harbor, then the US would not have entered the Pacific War during WWII. If Japan did not invade korea, Korea would never have been divided by US and Soviet Union..Therefore would never have been a Korean war..Therefore your reason is not logical..Japan started this mess by invading Korea and China and trying to take land away from the rightful owners..

Steve Mimitw at Oct. 24, 2012 - 02:58AM JST

"sake-english-teacher-town: ...."sanctions?" lol....I take it you are not international relations or economic student if you suggest the USA and/or Japan can place sanctions on China."

Yes, you read my English Correctly: "Sanctions" are comming to China by the next U.S. Administration (Obama or Romney). They have both spelled it out in their Presidential Campaigns & Presidential Debates. They are both fed up with China's Currency Manipulation, Copyright Infringement Violations, Computer Hacking Violations, Human Rights Violations, Territorial Insurrections and an Entire Laundry List more..."Sanctiions" - They've earned it. :)

whiskeysourOCT. 23, 2012 - 09:36PM JST Japan owns to many islands. Sorry Japan S. Korea is the rightful owner

Rightful? base on what? It has been considered as an illegal occupation since 1952.

Dokto is not the same island of Takeshima. It is only 32 Kilo meter from Kangwon Province maximum distance is 40 Kilo meter according to the several old Korean documents. Takeshima is 90 Kilo meter.

I respect the Korean's pride for Dokto but we may not mix the pride and the fact.

.

smithinjapanOCT. 23, 2012 - 05:21PM JST So what? it's their land. A bunch of Japanese lawmakers just visited Yasukuni, did they not?

You may say as I think first, otherwise it sounds as if it were the statement based on the fact.

Learn more history.

Follow international law? Who really obeys international laws? Certainly the US does not and it's allies - Can/Brits/Aussi, who why countries like Russia and China should? International laws are laws created to benefit the established rich nations of the West.

sake-english-teacher-town: ...."sanctions?" lol....I take it you are not international relations or economic student if you suggest the USA and/or Japan can place sanctions on China.

Very GOOD SAKETOWN! A + for you! unfortunately this doesn't really settle on our topic of Japanese nationalism resurgence. But since we're on the topic of settling issues with the International Law and committee and not winning the case in terms for the Chinese and S Koreans, they are abandoning the justification of keeping those territories through International Law and choosing instead to send their own authority to enforce their claims. That is why China is setting navy practices around Senkaku Islands and South China sea; to defend their territory under their self-imposed justification of ANCIENT TIMES. As well as the S Koreans who have already set up Coast Guard station on those islands. Seems like they want to settle things the old fashion way; military enforcement. Unfortunately for the Chinese, US carrier fleets have been sailing throughout the China sea several days ago to enforce International Law, as well as US diplomats continuing to uphold talks between S Korea and Japan to settle the issue peacefully. Hopefully the Chinese won't try to enforce their claims of territory like how they did with India, Russia, and Vietnam.

The U.S.-Japan Treaty prevents Japan from rebuilding its Military to the Pre-WW2 Levels. That will not happen again, however, the Japanese are not going to be pushed off of their Islands or their Soverign Territoires by other Asian Neighbors who use the Pre-WW2 "War Mongering Excuses" as a means to gain a footage on Japaese Controlled Natural Resources & Economic Zones resulting in a Grab Away Game with the Japanese.

South Korea and China are going to follow the rules of International Law or face the consequences by either the U.S. or Japan via sanctions or otherwise, AND if S.Korea & China have a case then take it up with the International Court of Justice at the U.N. That's why the U.N. set up the ICJ but S.Korea & China refuse to take their case to the ICJ because they know they are in violation of International Law and if decided by the Idependent Panel of the ICJ, then they'll lose their case.

And this is on the minds of the Japanese :)

SaketownOct. 24, 2012 - 01:54AM JST On the contrary, there is a Big Movement in Japan for a call to Nationalism and the return of the Right Wing. No doubt Shinzo Abe will be the next PM and South Korea including China are going to be grinding their teeth.

Oh, it looks like Koreans and Chinese have their own Ishiharas and Abes in abundance. It will be mutual grinding with an increasing speed and sound. Might want to buy more popcorn than initially planned, just in case...

showed the lawmakers shouting slogans with a placard reading "Dokdo is our land. We will defend it...

With such behavior, what kind of lawmakers are those??? The islands are currently Korean, but Lee Myung-Bak is, mildly saying, wrong for allowing this foolishness to go on. How can one seriously speak with the Korean leadership after that?

Oh really Saketown? So... despite the fact that yes there is Nationalism sentiment in Japan, which correct me if im wrong is in every country, do you really think the Japanese public will want a Right wing dominated government body who are hellbent on rebuilding their army and navy and having a war with China? And I am really amazed with your prediction on who will be the next PM! you must be so smart and observant with Japanese politics? SO tell me, even in Shinzo Abe becomes the PM, is the possibility of a resurgence of Japanese militarism going to happen? I surely doubt that. And yeah there are people in Roppongi who don't care about nationalism, as well as in shinjuku, harajuku, shibuya, ikeburo, kawasaki, yokohama, shinagawa, etc.

... I got my sofa and soda ready ;] p.s. popcorn tends to stick to your teeth, so be sure to floss up

crouching$amuraiHiddenNinja:

Just because the Japanese aren't talking about it in the Roppongi Bars doesn't mean they're not thinking about it.

On the contrary, there is a Big Movement in Japan for a call to Nationalism and the return of the Right Wing.

No doubt Shinzo Abe will be the next PM and South Korea including China are going to be grinding their teeth.

...I've got my Popcorn Ready ;)

seriously Smithinjapan, I don't know if you REALLY noticed or if you haven't notice, the majority of people in Japan don't care about nationalism. This isn't Pre WW2 era, most Japanese people only care about one goal, and that is doing business with everyone and making money. Providing food and housing for themselves. Those few old conservative men blaring loudspeakers, let them talk.

smithinjapanOct. 23, 2012 - 06:57PM JST "The trip—described as a government inspection session—was aimed at checking security measures around the islands which are guarded by the South’s coast guard, the aide told AFP." And yet if Japan did the same thing with the Senkakus a lot of Japanese would be puffed up with pride and saying >how great it is (save that they have no security measures besides the coast guard).

But they aren't doing the same thing so why are you going on your with your imaginary situation hust so you can spiuyt out your usual Japan bashing?

smithinjapanOct. 23, 2012 - 05:21PM JST So what? it's their land. A bunch of Japanese lawmakers just visited Yasukuni, did they not?

No it;s not, If it were, South Korea would have settled ts issue at the ICJ as Japan has tried 3 times. A cowardly nation.

And speaking of cowardly-

mithinjapanOct. 23, 2012 - 06:02PM JST "apigiulio: "At least the Japanese people will behave and not riot like the Chinese did." ore than likely, although you do get the wingers out in full force, truck speakers blaring, defacing flags (Ossan will deny it, but it happens), etc.

Bringing up other posters who haven't even seen the article and aren't even participating in the thread is cowardly. and childish. Looks like a national trait.

S Korea is the rightful owner... hmm... yeah im sorry but im not gonna agree with you on that one. If anything those islands belong to the US since it is the US who won the war in the Pacific AND help maintain and protect the sovereignty of South Korea during the Korean war. Without US help and Japanese aid with fixing and repairing military equipment, Korea would be under North Korea's Leadership. So stupid how South Korean president and lawmakers are making moves on setting government administration on those islands and pissing off Japanese officials, they're suppose to be allies with Japan under the US protection not fighting amongst each other. Everyone needs to seriously calm down and stop talking nationalism in the age of globalization.

Japan owns to many islands. Sorry Japan S. Korea is the rightful owner.

Eric-san, if you were born East Asian, you would understand what "land" means to us. It's a tradition to guard, we are not allowed to give in. @Papigiulio, most Chinese protested peacefully including cancellation of their autumn trips to Japan, which was most unfortunate for business. In the current case, both Japanese and Korean are right from their stands, they manifested in their own way.

The politicians from Japan/South Korea/China should meet on the islands in dispute and have a beer drinking contest. The group with the last man or woman standing gets final ownership of the land. It should be televised live for all to see.

I wonder which country will be mature enough to just drop the issue first by stopping stirring the pot? So far everybody seems to be more into scoring political points than actually doing something constructive.

Lee is an idiot if he says the reason he visited the island/s is to press Japan on the comfort women issue. Those issues should be treated completely separately.

"The trip—described as a government inspection session—was aimed at checking security measures around the islands which are guarded by the South’s coast guard, the aide told AFP."

And yet if Japan did the same thing with the Senkakus a lot of Japanese would be puffed up with pride and saying how great it is (save that they have no security measures besides the coast guard).

papigiulio: "At least the Japanese people will behave and not riot like the Chinese did."

More than likely, although you do get the wingers out in full force, truck speakers blaring, defacing flags (Ossan will deny it, but it happens), etc.

At least the Japanese people will behave and not riot like the Chinese did.

So what? it's their land. A bunch of Japanese lawmakers just visited Yasukuni, did they not?