Are EVs (electric vehicles) good for the environment?

To make the batteries in a Toyota Prius for example; the nickel is mined in Canada, which causes huge amounts of pollution, sulphur, acid rain etc. It's then loaded onto huge cargo ships on which it's shipped to Europe where it's refined. Then to China where it's turned into a sort of foam, then to Japan where it's put into the batteries and into the cars.

Anyone who says EV's are environmentally friendly have literally no idea what they're talking about. I'm not suggesting petrol or diesel cars are better, but EV's are definitely not friendly to the environment. It would be more friendly to buy a second or third hand petrol or diesel car and drive it until it can't be driven any more.

If scientists can work out how to make it quicker and easier, Hydrogen is absolutely the future.

EastmanToday 08:20 am JST

EVs are not green at all.

think about source of energy for their production,than about recycling of parts /say batteries/.

think safety/catching fire/,think fast lossing of market value by age/not mileage/.

EVs is way to nowhere.

The facts clearly show that EVs breakeven on carbon usage compared to ICEs in the US within two years:

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/when-do-electric-vehicles-become-cleaner-than-gasoline-cars-2021-06-29/

Of course they are not 'good' for the environment, but relatively speaking they are less bad.

EVs are just part of a long slow movement towards cleaner transportation that has seen the skies of many countries clean up markedly over the last six or seven decades. Personally I would love to invest in a hydrogen vehicle, like Matt above, if I ever buy another car. All things being relative, of course.

To make the batteries in a Toyota Prius for example;

The Prius is a hybrid, i.e., a petrol car that runs on petrol. It is not an electric car you plug in. Its extra battery is about 1/20th of the size/capacity of an electric car's.

As for whether EVs are good, they are not as good as walking, public transport, or bicycles. Many car journeys in many places are short enough for bicycles or public transport. Electric cars are better than regular cars though, because they can be run on renewable electricity. The challenge is to make more of that renewable electricity and less from fossil fuels.

They can be depending on several factors (what option are replacing, the origin of the electricity, etc.) so it is not like they automatically are good, they simply open the door for this to be possible.

Riding a bicycle, I would much prefer all traffic to be electric so I don’t get gassed. Looking off into the distance and seeing the brown smear of pollution, yeah I won’t miss that.

The resources used to make the electric vehicles are offset by using the cars because over time they pollute the air far less than gas-guzzlers that many people prefer to use. The production is at its beginning and the cars will only improve with time. And if the Middle East has less business, so what? It's not like they are invaluable allies.

No one ever considers the full carbon & environmental pollution footprint of EVs.

The production of batteries for EVs, which have an unbelievably high carbon & environmental footprint.

The generation of the electricity used to recharge EVs. It's not magical electricity, it has to be generated by some source.

Even if the source of the electricity is "green", such as solar or wind power, what is the carbon & environmental footprint of creating those sources of production.

People need to realize the push for EVs by those in control is not about the environment. You may think it is, but it's not. It's about control. They want to control how much you drive. And EVs will allow them to do that.

Of course, they will still have their private jets, private luxury yachts and chauffeured limos.

But you? You can eat cake.

zones2surfToday 07:09 am JST

Please see my previous post about the breakeven time for an EV in the US being two years.

Are EVs (electric vehicles) good for the environment?

On balance, they don't seem to be much better or worse than ICE vehicles, and more and more people are figuring out that they're not worth the high cost of buying one, even with subsidies. This is making auto makers who have invested a lot of money into EV development pretty nervous:

https://joannenova.com.au/2023/10/vw-orders-are-down-50-ford-loses-38000-on-each-car-toyota-chief-says-people-are-waking-up/#comments

I'm not anti-EV. My Dad has one and it's great to drive. But we're not under the illusion that he's helping to save the environment, "fight climate change(!)" or whatever. Anyone who believes that is deluded.

On reading the debate, the obvious question to be asked is "What is the environmental footprint" in the production of a standard petrol car, taking all components into account?

And then what is the environmental footprint of the whole process of drilling, pumping processing, refining and the distribution of oil based fuels?

These are pertinent questions when comparing EVs to Petrol cars.

Does anyone have up to date info?

People who think EVs are good for the environment are like people who think that sausages come from the supermarket

You want to do something good for the environment? Walk.

Simple EVs - try China (an unknown EV country in Japan).

Silicon, lithium and God knows what else they make batteries from are one thing, energy going in another.

Lots of EVs are top of the range, with lots of precious and rare-earth metals going into them. They are a thoughtless environmental problem.

A simple EV, without all that, with recyclable parts and infrastructure for that - sorry, but China produces a few with non-Chinese names.

Go from Japan, and Korea, to other places, even Europe and China where they have even long-term planned for this, and you can find.

But it is still a market driven endeavour, and a relatively closed market one at that.

About the best advantage of having a EV is where your work pays for the recharging. If your house solar and the solar batteries are low the energy from your EV is transferrable. topping up your house batteries. Other then that advantage , I still think EV a stop gap until Hydrogen ran transport is perfected.

A very informative article:

https://realclearwire.com/articles/2023/10/25/the_political_risks_of_mandating_evs_for_everyone_988506.html

EVs that run on lithium batteries have a huge carbon footprint during manufacture and disposal. Also 90% of the energy for charging comes from fossil fuel burning Power stations.

No way, never, biggest scam ever.

No way, never, biggest scam ever.

Indeed - especially those made in communist China and sold here in North America...

https://electrek.co/2023/05/23/tesla-flooding-canadian-ev-market-china-made-cars/

That's a real scam artist....and a CCP-lover, right?

Had to click ‘Don’t know’ because as yet EV battery production and disposal is no friend of the planet.

Kohakuebisu

The Prius is a hybrid, i.e., a petrol car that runs on petrol. It is not an electric car you plug in. Its extra battery is about 1/20th of the size/capacity of an electric car's.

Plug-in hybrids, including the Prius plug-in version generally have a reasonable enough range for a daily electric only city commute. They go on forever too so perhaps best of both worlds? For now.

Good for WHOSE environment? First World’s (users) or Third World’s (mining, battery recycling, etc.)?

Riding a bicycle, I would much prefer all traffic to be electric so I don’t get gassed. Looking off into the distance and seeing the brown smear of pollution, yeah I won’t miss that.

You aren’t old enough to have been enveloped in a cloud of noxious diesel fumes when riding behind city buses.

Everything is relative. Is your ICE car good for the environment? Is your smart phone good for the environment? Are humans good for the environment? Are we going to get rid of those too?

Our EVs run on the California Sun. Nothing cleaner than that.

Matt

Anyone who says EV's are environmentally friendly have literally no idea what they're talking about. I'm not suggesting petrol or diesel cars are better, but EV's are definitely not friendly to the environment.

There is where your argument falls over. Engineering is picking the right options to achieve your desired outcomes. If EV's are better for the environment that ICE cars, then they are environmentally friendly. Because the alternative is worse.

But the main thing that is lost in this question, is that environmentally friendly is a vague term. There are harms to the environment, but the biggest harm by far is the release of CO2 into the environment. EVs are better for the environment on this single measure, and that's the only one that counts.

ushosh123

Everything is relative. Is your ICE car good for the environment? Is your smart phone good for the environment? Are humans good for the environment? Are we going to get rid of those too?

Nobody is asking you to get rid of anything. But if EV's release less CO2 into the atmosphere than ICE cars, then choose that option.

Anonymous

Good for WHOSE environment? First World’s (users) or Third World’s (mining, battery recycling, etc.)?

Good point, the question is vague. But CO2 emissions are the most important measure by far.

Fake green

Plug-in hybrids, including the Prius plug-in version generally have a reasonable enough range for a daily electric only city commute. They go on forever too so perhaps best of both worlds? For now.

Plug in hybrids are a fine technology, especially ones that are efficient like the Prius and not inefficient when running on gasoline only, like the Outlander SUV.

I only commented in response to a poster who (incorrectly) chose the Prius to go on a rant about EVs. The Prius is an improved gasoline car, not an EV.

I suspect the Prius was chosen as it is the poster child of efficient cars that people have constantly attacked for twenty years now. Most anti-Prius comments are spurious and seem to be driven by people who are afraid someone might take their oversized or otherwise inefficient regular car away. It's basically tall poppy syndrome. Lets attack the efficient car so noone focuses on my inefficient one. The idea of the gubmint taking away rich people's luxury cars or sports cars or private jets is completely ludicrous. It is far more likely to lock up environmentalists or take away poor people's food stamps.

Butt the bird did not do that so all is ok to omoimasu

Indeed - especially those made in communist China and sold here in North America...

Well, if people want to buy into the scam that is on them, I don't need to partake in the brainwashing collective garbage.

https://medium.com/illumination/electric-vehicles-are-a-scam-e2ca66b8e2b6

That's a real scam artist....and a CCP-lover, right?

https://medium.com/illumination/electric-vehicles-are-a-scam-e2ca66b8e2b6

This person is arguing not only against EV but US car culture and suggests that cars should be provided free by the government.

I’m surprised you posted such a link.

This person is arguing not only against EV but US car culture and suggests that cars should be provided free by the government. 

I’m surprised you posted such a link.

No need to be surprised, looking beyond his idiotic socialistic views, but wants more fossil fuel driven cars and on that critical point I agree.

In terms of gas emission, EVs will us reduce the amount of carbon dioxides. However, I cannot make sure that building such cars itself is good for the environment as how production can affect it has not been discussed so much.