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Are you in favor of vaccination passports for international travel?

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Too many travelers would use the ''honor'' system to lie about if they are vaccinated or not. the passports would help in stopping this and keep everyone safe.

15 ( +33 / -18 )

Where there is risk of vaccine injury there must be freedom to choose without negative consequences or discrimination.

-13 ( +20 / -33 )

Not for everyone the vaccination is available as a choice. I might have to wAit another year living in Japan. so im am excluded, not by choice but because of dysfunctional Japanese administration

12 ( +19 / -7 )

I would vote yes, but this might mean that those of us living in Japan might never travel.

18 ( +25 / -7 )

In principle, I am in favour. However, if somebody vaccinated comes to Japan, but that particular vaccine has not been approved by Japan, is that person rejected to enter?

7 ( +16 / -9 )

what pukey2 said

2 ( +7 / -5 )

This is a broad question. If it's specifically for the SARS-COV-2 virus, no. Not at all. It's not a virus that's harmful to the vast majority of people no mater what the fear mongers say, and the vaccines for it are still under clinical trials.

For other diseases, depends on what and where.

-11 ( +12 / -23 )

definitely NOT.

if there will be needed some covid test before travel abroad I am okay with it.

I am against vaccination and covid passes.i am againts to be used as part of some experiment during this plandemia.

-9 ( +16 / -25 )

I am against vaccination and covid passes.i am againts to be used as part of some experiment during this plandemia.

I'm ok with you being against vaccination and covid passes. I'm also ok with you not being allowed to travel because you haven't been vaccinated, and therefore can't get the passport.

3 ( +21 / -18 )

Vacc-Passes are pointless. You can still get, carry, and pass on the virus to others even if you are vaccinated. Vaccinations ONLY lessen the chance of the jabee from showing symptoms. If I put on a coat, it doesn't raise the temperature outdoors. Big Pharma is pushing all this peer-pressure, making unpaid employees (the public) promote sales. BTW, by now if you haven't gotten Covid-19, you are most likely naturally immune.

-6 ( +16 / -22 )

I'm ok with you being against vaccination and covid passes. I'm also ok with you not being allowed to travel because you haven't been vaccinated, and therefore can't get the passport.

Why should those who are afraid of the virus demand that those who are not afraid be excluded? Shouldn't it be the other way around? Those who are afraid ought to not travel, stay home, etc.

-5 ( +13 / -18 )

I'm ok with you being against vaccination and covid passes. I'm also ok with you not being allowed to travel because you haven't been vaccinated, and therefore can't get the passport.

Besides....if you're vaccinated you should me immune, right? So where's the danger to you from the unvaccinated?

-3 ( +12 / -15 )

Only good for people who are living in developed countries.

For another billion population. Not good. A young graduate boy in India has a big dream to study and work in UK to support his family.

With necessary vaccine passport, how will he? Next 10 years, he wouldn't able to, by that time he becomes hopeless with depression. Many similar examples like this but the most people living in developed countries don't care. All they want to do is travel for fun but there are many who needs to travel to support their family.

-7 ( +4 / -11 )

Why should those who are afraid of the virus demand that those who are not afraid be excluded? Shouldn't it be the other way around? Those who are afraid ought to not travel, stay home, etc.

This is apparently surprising to many people, but a person can actually care about others and not only himself!

Not everybody can be vaccinated, not every vaccinated people will be protected, so there is nothing special about caring enough for those people to support measures to decrease the transmission of the disease. Anybody can choose which of those measures to minimize risk they will take, for rational people that can properly the risk a safe and effective vaccination is the natural choice, but if other people are better by choosing non medical measures like social distancing, then they are free to do it.

8 ( +19 / -11 )

Where there is risk of vaccine injury there must be freedom to choose without negative consequences or discrimination.

There is virtually no risk. Literally 1 in a million and that is only with the AZ vaccine and only in certain age brackets.

And international travel is not a right. Don't want to get vaccinated? Fine, but you don't fly internationally.

And the vaccine prevents severe illness and death. You can still become infected and spread the virus, but the odds of becoming infected if you come into contact with an infected person drops something like 80-95% depending on the vaccine. In addition, you will shed much less virus for a shorter period of time, meaning you are less contagious.

Like it or not, vaccine passports (much like vaccination records for childhood illnesses at US Universities) are inevitable eventually.

7 ( +17 / -10 )

GdTokyoToday  03:25 pm JST

Like it or not, vaccine passports (much like vaccination records for childhood illnesses at US Universities) are inevitable eventually.

This is a pretty defeatist attitude. Stops short of government knows best, but you're arguing that we have no say in what happens to us in the grand scheme of things. In other words, suck it up and hand over your papers, bitte.

That worked well in the past. Oh, wait...

Over the last year people who dared to suggest the virus came from a lab leak were laughed at. That's just changed. The idea of covid passports will get the same treatment in due course, but it won't thanks to folks like you. But you'll benefit from their pushback because without their opposition, the kind of people who want to implement covid passports are unlikely to stop there.

You're welcome, in advance.

-6 ( +10 / -16 )

There is virtually no risk. Literally 1 in a million and that is only with the AZ vaccine and only in certain age brackets.

Tell that to those who already died from the vaccines, and to their families.

-11 ( +9 / -20 )

This is apparently surprising to many people, but a person can actually care about others

Care works both ways, which would include for those who wish to avoid vaccine injury or death. Therefore, let everyone make their own health decisions without punishment or discrimination.

-3 ( +10 / -13 )

You mean, do I want give up my medical privacy and be subject to discrimination based on my medical history? I'm gonna have to give that a resounding no.

-3 ( +11 / -14 )

@darknuts

You mean, do I want give up my medical privacy and be subject to discrimination based on my medical history? I'm gonna have to give that a resounding no.

Well said!

-2 ( +10 / -12 )

Care works both ways, which would include for those who wish to avoid vaccine injury or death. Therefore, let everyone make their own health decisions without punishment or discrimination.

Anybody can, I specifically said so in my comment, you can choose which way you are going to avoid spreading the disease, by keeping the social distancing measures everybody is expected to do or replace them with vaccination. There, no punishment, no discrimination.

0 ( +10 / -10 )

There, no punishment, no discrimination.

Denying travel or participation in any other aspect of civil life IS discrimination. You make your health choices and let others makes theirs without penalty.

-8 ( +9 / -17 )

Denying travel or participation in any other aspect of civil life IS discrimination. You make your health choices and let others makes theirs without penalty.

Again, that is not what is happening, everybody is subjected to social distancing measures including no travel, but those rational enough can replace them with immunization, if you choose to keep the other measures that is your choice to make, what you want is to have the "freedom" to put others at risk by not doing anything about it, that is not valid, you are not any special case to infringe on the rights of others.

1 ( +11 / -10 )

put others at risk by not doing anything about it, that is not valid, you are not any special case to infringe on the rights of others.

Again, it works both ways.....Vaccine recipients have no right to virtually force others to risk vaccine injury or death via denial of rights to travel, shop, enter public spaces or participate in any other aspect of civil life. You have absolutely no right to infringe on other's rights in that way. You can freely make your health decisions without legal consequences and so can others. That is equality.

-10 ( +7 / -17 )

Vaccine recipients have no right to virtually force others to risk vaccine injury or death

Vaccine do not "injure" or cause "death". Stop spreading dangerous false information.

9 ( +18 / -9 )

If it will allow me to travel again with relative freedom then absolutely no problem.

8 ( +15 / -7 )

the green pass is a discrimination, and if this means I will never go back to my country, I will accept cause I do not want to take vaccin.

-5 ( +7 / -12 )

There is virtually no risk. Literally 1 in a million and that is only with the AZ vaccine and only in certain age brackets.

And international travel is not a right. Don't want to get vaccinated? Fine, but you don't fly internationally.

And the vaccine prevents severe illness and death. You can still become infected and spread the virus, but the odds of becoming infected if you come into contact with an infected person drops something like 80-95% depending on the vaccine. In addition, you will shed much less virus for a shorter period of time, meaning you are less contagious.

Like it or not, vaccine passports (much like vaccination records for childhood illnesses at US Universities) are inevitable eventually.

disinformation at its best

-9 ( +8 / -17 )

@ConcernedCitizen

Let us say we accept your totally insane premise that vaccines injure/cause death in all but the rarest cases (which are the cases we need everyone else vaccinated against, to protect them).

You absolutely have the choice to opt out of society if you don't want to take a vaccine. You do not have the right to opt out of society and still benefit from the parts you like.

Somebody can opt out of having to get a license, but they choose to never [legally] drive. You can't complain the government is infringing on your rights by not letting you drive unlicensed. If you opt out of the vaccine, you are as much a risk to people around you as an unlicensed driver is to those cars around them and shouldn't be allowed in public flights.

Could an argument be made for chartered flights and/or personal aircraft? Maybe, but I don't think many folks railing against vaccines are in those camps.

8 ( +15 / -7 )

Vaccination passports.....then what happens when the inevitable holes in the system appear? Social credits like despotic China? And what happens when that fails? Mandated microchip implants in order to 'verify vaccination and contact trace'?

You see where this is going? No thanks!

-11 ( +7 / -18 )

Vaccine do not "injure" or cause "death". Stop spreading dangerous false information.

180 deaths after Covid-19 jabs till March 31, 75% within 3 days

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.timesofindia.com/india/180-deaths-after-jabs-till-mar-31-75-within-3-days/amp_articleshow/81978526.cms

Covid: Three deaths in Scotland linked to vaccine

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-57173286.amp

TGA finds NSW woman's death 'likely' linked to AstraZeneca vaccine

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.9news.com.au/article/8578db27-1126-4a86-9b57-2aad775f97d4

I could find many more articles but this should be enough.

I'm not saying 'don't take the vaccine!' I am sharing the truth of risk and saying that where there's risk there must be choice without penalty. Let everyone freely make their own decision.

-12 ( +6 / -18 )

Vacc-Passes are pointless. You can still get, carry, and pass on the virus to others even if you are vaccinated. Vaccinations ONLY lessen the chance of the jabee from showing symptoms.

Yeah!

Even if (a very big "if") we believe the pharma data on reduction of transmission it's only about a 40% reduction (if I remember correctly).

Can't see why anyone should be forced to take these unapproved vaccines (only authorized for emergency use).

-8 ( +6 / -14 )

I'd prefer a stamp in the passport, like a visa, certifying that you have been vaccinated. Of course, it might be possible to forge such a thing, but I'd still prefer it to a vaccine passport, whatever it is, or a smartphone app.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Not if it means people can't travel without it. Having a vaccination certificate like for Yellow Fever gives over certain privileges but also those without it can provide a test instead. Could also be used for large events like concerts, sports events.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Vaccination passports.....then what happens when the inevitable holes in the system appear? Social credits like despotic China? And what happens when that fails? Mandated microchip implants in order to 'verify vaccination and contact trace'?

The "slippery slope" argument is a complete rethorical fallacy. It stops at vaccine passports because they actually have worked in the past and will work now too.

I could find many more articles but this should be enough.

No it isn't. Deaths from the vaccine are still so rare they amount to statistical aberrations, and you still have much more chances of dying (and killing others around you) from Covid than from a vaccine. Stop spreading dangerous false information.

9 ( +15 / -6 )

 it's only about a 40% reduction (if I remember correctly).

You don't.

Can't see why anyone should be forced to take these unapproved vaccines 

Nobody's "forcing" you to do anything. But most restaurants will refuse you entry if you don't wear pants. So will airlines refuse you entry if you're not vaccinated. You're perfectly free to stay at your home and eat pantless and unvaccinated.

7 ( +15 / -8 )

The "slippery slope" argument is a complete rethorical fallacy. It stops at vaccine passports because they actually have worked in the past and will work now too.

Respectfully......don't kid yourself. The power hungry are never satisfied.

-11 ( +7 / -18 )

Voted no, this measure is eroding yet further our individual liberty, now we will need state permission to do what we previously could do freely.

Restrictive measures have been taken for a valid reason of fighting this disease but they must not be allowed to be carried on as the new normal.

-9 ( +7 / -16 )

virusrexToday  05:22 pm JST

Denying travel or participation in any other aspect of civil life IS discrimination. You make your health choices and let others makes theirs without penalty.

Again, that is not what is happening, everybody is subjected to social distancing measures including no travel, but those rational enough can replace them with immunization, if you choose to keep the other measures that is your choice to make, what you want is to have the "freedom" to put others at risk by not doing anything about it, that is not valid, you are not any special case to infringe on the rights of others.

You've got it backwards.

Vaccination against SARS-CoV-2 is not mandatory, and cannot ethically be made mandatory because no government has the moral right to force anyone to put anything into their body against their own will. This is premised on a person's body being their own property, and violating such sovereignty constitutes a crime. That's why people/corporate entities who injure others can be charged with a crime. What releases a government from the same responsibility?

Governments can offer vaccines like the covid-19 ones (or any others) under informed consent, with the risks and benefits clearly spelled out. But what's happening now is coercion, trying to scare people into taking vaccines that have only been given emergency authorization because it's been (falsely, but you'll obviously disagree) claimed that there are no other treatments. The relentless demonization of treatments like ivermectin and HCQ and doctors who have had success using them has mirrored the vitriol heaped on anyone suggesting that the virus leaked from the Wuhan lab. With even public health demigods like Fauci now having to acknowledge that this may be the case, the narrative you support is slowing splitting at the seams. I think this will eventually be followed by more information coming to light about dangerous side-effects produced by these experimental injections. Immunizations can only be regarded as a rational choice if the public is being provided with factual and honest information, not the fear-mongering hyperbole spouted by officials who flout their own rules and propagated by their media lapdogs.

Ultimately, because governments have demonstrated time and again that they cannot be trusted to provide accurate information about anything, public health included, due to glaring conflicts of interest, it's only rational for people to have the choice to take or decline a SARS-CoV-2 vaccine. After all, as you noted, no-one - and that includes a government or other entity - has the "freedom" to put others at risk. That includes using coercion or misrepresentation to put a substance into another's body through a medical procedure. A contract signed under duress or containing deliberate misrepresentations renders the contract void. As such, enforcing covid-19 vaccine passports makes them illegitimate because they'd be introduced through coercion and misrepresentation.

-12 ( +7 / -19 )

JsapcToday  05:51 pm JST

Vaccine recipients have no right to virtually force others to risk vaccine injury or death 

Vaccine do not "injure" or cause "death". Stop spreading dangerous false information.

Tell that to the healthy people who have got blood clots after taking one of these jabs.

-9 ( +7 / -16 )

Vaccination against SARS-CoV-2 is not mandatory, and cannot ethically be made mandatory because no government has the moral right to force anyone to put anything into their body against their own will.

I don't know where you are from, but in the case of the US, you MUST get certain vaccines to attend public schools, university, and in certain medical professions. There are fringe groups that get a small number of exceptions for religious or other purposes, but essentially it is mandatory. Take a look at one of the last guys who had polio and is in an iron lung his whole life and you will have a different perspective.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Again, it works both ways.....Vaccine recipients have no right to virtually force others to risk vaccine injury or death via denial of rights to travel, shop, enter public spaces or participate in any other aspect of civil life.

Wrong, vaccines are not the ones that do that, the pandemic is, the measures are an effective way to reduce the spreading, so everybody is required to do them, even if they are so self centered that they don't care about the people at risk, that is how society works. Vaccines are just an exit, but nobody is forcing anybody to take it, anybody can simply choose to keep doing their part in social distancing.

Even if (a very big "if") we believe the pharma data on reduction of transmission it's only about a 40% reduction (if I remember correctly).

That is false, this applies on top of the reduction of infection, obviously the 90% plus of people that do not become infected will not transmit the disease, only the small percentage of people that actually get the infection can do it, but thanks to the vaccination 40% of those will not transmit the disease anyway.

You've got it backwards.

Not at all, your argument is pointless precisely because vaccination is an option that people can choose instead of keeping with the social distancing measures that are the default. The rest of your argument is false according to the best available science so there is no merit in it. There is no conspiracy to hide medicines, masks and other measures do work and your personal opinion of the opposite is not enough to contradict the medical and scientific consensus that have proved so. Nobody has to trust any government, the whole scientific community is the one that proved measures work and vaccines work.

4 ( +13 / -9 )

Nobody has to trust any government, the whole scientific community is the one that proved measures work and vaccines work.

You're missing the point, as usual, just spouting the fallacy that "the whole scientific community is the one that proved measures work and vaccines work."

There is no "consensus" and claiming so is simply wrong.

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

You're missing the point, as usual, just spouting the fallacy that "the whole scientific community is the one that proved measures work and vaccines work."

There is no "consensus" and claiming so is simply wrong.

Sure, you can of course prove it by providing some recognized medical or scientific institutions that supoport your beliefs, because if you could not find even one, that would mean they are all in consensus of the opposite, right.

So, which institutions are those that say vaccines are unsafe or that measures don't work?

-4 ( +8 / -12 )

This is a pretty defeatist attitude. Stops short of government knows best, but you're arguing that we have no say in what happens to us in the grand scheme of things. In other words, suck it up and hand over your papers, bitte.

That worked well in the past. Oh, wait...

When you compare public health measures to the Soviets or the Holocaust, you disqualify yourself from the discussion.

People do have a say. It’s called Democracy. And the EU, a lot of Asian Democracies and everyone with a brain are going to say, “Want to visit? Have proof of vaccination.” We’ve done it for some countries with tropical diseases. We still do it for American universities. So too will it be with international travel. You’ll do it or you won’t visit certain countries.

And no, there is no proof that vaccines are dangerous. They are safe and effective and I’ll take the word of a PhD. and the world’s leading specialist in infectious diseases over the word of an anonymous conspiracy theorist every day of the week.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

Hell no.It's gonna be the new normal in discriminating in job interviews.Just the other day I read in the U.S. companies are re-hiring workers that got laid off last year.But the stipulation is you must have the vaccine passport.Big Brother/Communistic behavior seeping clearly into "democratic"countries in this pandemic. People who don't want to take the jab will be looked down at more than Trump supporters.And we know that was pretty low.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

I totally agree to vaccination. Because I wanna go abroad ASAP. But the side-effect is a little bit troublesome...

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

GdTokyoToday  08:39 pm JST

This is a pretty defeatist attitude. Stops short of government knows best, but you're arguing that we have no say in what happens to us in the grand scheme of things. In other words, suck it up and hand over your papers, bitte.

That worked well in the past. Oh, wait...

When you compare public health measures to the Soviets or the Holocaust, you disqualify yourself from the discussion. 

People do have a say. It’s called Democracy. And the EU, a lot of Asian Democracies and everyone with a brain are going to say, “Want to visit? Have proof of vaccination.” We’ve done it for some countries with tropical diseases. We still do it for American universities. So too will it be with international travel. You’ll do it or you won’t visit certain countries. 

And no, there is no proof that vaccines are dangerous. They are safe and effective and I’ll take the word of a PhD. and the world’s leading specialist in infectious diseases over the word of an anonymous conspiracy theorist every day of the week.

They're not public health measures when a tiny fraction of the people who get infected even show symptoms and even smaller fraction get sick or succumb - mainly the very elderly and those with significant comorbidities. It's overreach at best, flagrant authoritarianism at worst. It's not democracy when journalists are harrassed by the police for doing their job, it's verging on a police state: apparently Victoria Police think professional journalists need police accreditation to legitimately cover a story on the Melbourne lockdown. What was that about "papiere bitte"?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CUz8cqBy4o

Democracy is fragile at the best of times.

-6 ( +4 / -10 )

Tell that to the healthy people who have got blood clots after taking one of these jabs.

And what do you want to tell to the healthy people who died from Covid, exactly?

Also, do you have anything to tell yo your own parents who vaccinated the hell out of you when you were a baby in order for you not to die meaninglessly? So that you can now be on the internet and badmouth vaccines?

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

Respectfully......don't kid yourself. The power hungry are never satisfied.

And who's "the power hungry", exactly? Doctors? People trying to save lives?

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

I've been against all border measures, just as the WHO originally was, after the initial outbreak, when the illness became endemic to so many places around the world.

The measure is arbitrary, it doesn't stop the virus, since it is already inside the country, and unless you also have internal borders in your country, it is inconsistent.

On top of that, forcing vaccinations for international travel will mean that there will be a 3 tire system around the world for travel.

1st Tire are all the well connected and powerful, which can have exceptions specially made for them, and are allowed to travel without much problem.

2nd Tire is for vaccinated with (Accepted) vaccine passports, still with restrictions and hoops one have to take.

3rd is the rest, including people who cannot get vaccinated for medical reasons, people who are vaccinated but cannot get a "passport" for it, or the info they have is not "validated", people who cannot get vaccines, and people who should not be vaccinated in the first place, like small children. These people will have in many cases their lives destroyed.

Once again, this is a measure that is coming out of irrational fear and panic, it is not well reasoned, and it will create way more problems that what it supposedly solves... and it will be implemented in many places.

So get used to having to prove that the vaccine you took is "the good stuff", that and to have to probably vaccinate with different brands depending on the country you are going to, and still not be able to enjoy your freedoms as they once were.

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

I love all the pseudo-science people try to use to justify why they know more about the scientists. If I thought there was any chance their complaints would result in not implementing vaccine passports, I'd be worried. But as the overwhelming majority of the world population are not conspiracy theorists, we will go with the scientists, thanks.

Vaccine passports will work for keeping the virus contained to areas in which the unclean reside. Other areas will see the virus die out.

-6 ( +7 / -13 )

To Concerned Citizen, virtually every medicine has some form of side effects. Some are very minor, but several have extremely serious side effects. People take the medication because in the vast majority of the time they get better.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

Assorted vaccinations have always been required for travel to various countries. It's not a new idea.

A vaccine passport is inevitable. It should allow those who cannot be vaccinated for medical reasons to be able to declare this and be accepted for travel as long as they test negative before the flight.

Travel insurance for medical costs should also now be a requirement.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Only for certain countries and individuals with certain medial conditions

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

This is all going to die out come autumn when the seasonal flu over takes the CCP virus. By that time a majority of vaccinated and natural immunity. Then it will be back to normal as the every day people will be on edge of storming political power centers with pitchforks and torches.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

JsapcMay 31  11:51 pm JST

Also, do you have anything to tell yo your own parents who vaccinated the hell out of you when you were a baby in order for you not to die meaninglessly? So that you can now be on the internet and badmouth vaccines?

I've mentioned many times on this board that I'm not against vaccines per se (I had a whooping cough one a few short years ago with no reservations), just the COVID-19 ones because of the controversy around them - especially the disingenuousness of the people pushing for de facto mass vaccination for people who don't need it.

You might want to think things through a little before jumping to conclusions.

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

No, because vaccination is no guarantee that someone is free from Covid infection. If we're going to mandate any public health measures, a PCR test taken immediately before travel is far more accurate (and therefore reasonable).

Any attempt to expand vaccine passports beyond Covid 19 is also a non-starter when you consider that most Americans, Canadians, Australians and Western Europeans have never received the tuberculosis vaccine, while the majority of the world has. Any international vaccine passport which doesn't include TB would be pointless, but the wealthiest countries in the world aren't going to agree to a system that keeps most of their citizens grounded. It will drop off the agenda soon.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

No, because its discrimination. Vaccinating kids is just wrong as well. If you think a PCR test is accurate you are mistaken its 30% at best. Lockdowns don't work and neither do masks for the most part. You destroy your economies, you rule by fear, you shoot emergency approved vaccines into people over a virus that doesn't effect most people. The damage this virus has caused, because people are scared, is beyond measurement. Stop falling for the hype that governments and media spread to control you. There are a lot more seriously dangerous things all around you...

2 ( +7 / -5 )

If the 1 or 2 % of the population who are at high risk because of secondary illnesses are vaccinated then there is no need to vaccinate the rest of the world unless it is to fill the multinationals like Pfizers bank accounts!

0 ( +6 / -6 )

While I understand the inherent risks involved of someone not being vaccinated and contracting covid. I still wouldn't want the line crossed of someone's medical history now being subject to view by those that shouldn't have access to it. It might seem like a small compromise, but it can open the door to much larger things.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Proof of Vaccinations against various deceases have been in place for many decades.

Nothing new with Covid-19.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Also, do you have anything to tell yo your own parents who vaccinated the hell out of you when you were a baby in order for you not to die meaninglessly?

Did you consider that perhaps the vaccines you were given as a child went through the typical 5+ years of safety testing on animals and humans, unlike these human experiments which were developed in a matter of months?

4 ( +7 / -3 )

Did you consider that perhaps the vaccines you were given as a child went through the typical 5+ years of safety testing on animals and humans, unlike these human experiments which were developed in a matter of months?

I can't speak for the vaccines I was given as a kid, as I was a kid, and it was decades ago.

But I know that all the vaccinations I've given my children have been through the same 3-stage trial as the covid vaccines.

Did you consider that perhaps you have just enough information that you think you know what you're talking about, but actually don't have enough information to actually know what you're talking about?

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

Some people seem to think that foreigners won't be able to get the vaccine.

This is not true. Foreign healthcare workers and foreign residents over 65 have been/are being vaccinated.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Regardless of what anyone feels or says.

A vaccine "passport" or call it what you like is going to happen.

It will happen because each country can impose whatever rules they want on people entering.

The International Certificate of Vaccination or Prophylaxis (ICVP),

Has existed for decades a more modern one will be inevitable.

Without some form of agreed certificate those saying we don't need may find that in order to travel we will need to get a vaccine each country decides is the one they prefer.

So going to China non business need the Chinese Vaccine, returning to the UK need a different Vaccine, the USA another type, this could get messy.

So a single agreed upon document will make things far safer and simpler.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Freedom of choice, if you odnt want this experimental thing then you should not have to have it, and you should be able to carry on life as normal taking precautions as we have.

Let the neurotic control pro vax crowd get their vaccine if they want, let the rest of us make out own choices, if you are vaccinated then you have nothing to fear from the person who isnt and is taking reasonable measures and care.

Be a paranoid silly little freak by all means let those with a mind make their own choices, they are not interferring in your choice to get it.

-5 ( +4 / -9 )

I'm fine with all the anti vaxers who think Bill Gates is implanting chips in our bodies with the Covid vaccine. It means more space on the airplane for me since the airlines will refuse service to the Trump non Science conspiracy believers who refuse vaccines or vaccine passports. I will gladly get my vaccine passport since it gives me free upgrades on my flights and I won't be surrounded by any Trump Anti vax people when I'm flying. It's a double win for me.

Yes antivax Trump people please make your own choice of not getting the Covid vaccine. That's fine with me since I know you will not be sitting next to me on a flight.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

Did you consider that perhaps the vaccines you were given as a child went through the typical 5+ years of safety testing on animals and humans, unlike these human experiments which were developed in a matter of months?

And as we have progressed in the 50 to 60 years since most of those Vaccines were invented.

We also found that in most cases the animal testing was near pointless due to the biological difference between humans and other animals and is why very little animal testing is still done compared to even 30 years ago.

Do you compare your new cellphone or car technology based on the time it took 60 years ago to develop some new product or technology?

At the time the polio vaccine was developed a computer took up an entire floor of a large building and had less computing capabilitity than a laptop today.

It is called progress and science.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

But I know that all the vaccinations I've given my children have been through the same 3-stage trial as the covid vaccines.

I bet those vaccines got FDA approval, unlike the covid vaccines.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Nope, not at all.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

If it means I can return to Japan to see my friends, I'm all for it.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Where there is risk of vaccine injury there must be freedom to choose without negative consequences or discrimination.

I agree. Since there is no risk, your choice has a consequence.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Will being vaccinated mean the end of PCR tests?

Try to argue that point in Japan where you’ll be the odd one out and it will still be a requirement to fly....

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Tests for international travel will be needed for even the vaccinated who can still carry the virus.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Over the last year people who dared to suggest the virus came from a lab leak were laughed at. That's just changed. The idea of covid passports will get the same treatment in due course, but it won't thanks to folks like you. 

That’s a rather dubious connection.

On this vote the majority have spoken. Vaccine passports are popular. I expect you’ll have some theory as to why your opinion is a minority one but too bad.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

We do lots of things that are for the general good. Drive our cars at a speed limit and blood/ alcohol limit for example. Many people want to travel around the world without being vaccinated. That will put others at risk. It will also radically increase the cost of travel. I really cannot see much choice but to have vaccine passports if we want to lessen the spread of covid. Do not want to be vaccinated? That is your choice but please think of others and do not expect to be able to travel for a long time yet

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Gooch

...especially the disingenuousness of the people pushing for de facto mass vaccination for people who don't need it.

Except that without mass vaccination we don't achieve herd immunity. Without herd immunity, we face more and more variants that ARE harmful to those that weren't in danger previously. Already the India "Delta" variant is causing sudden onset diabetes and mucormycosis.

By not having the vaccine, people are making the world a less safe place.

You might want to think things through a little before jumping to conclusions.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

It was never needed for the flu, a mutating virus, and it shouldn’t be needed now.

vaccinate those who wish to take the vax and let’s be done.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

2020hindsightsToday  06:43 am JST

Gooch

...especially the disingenuousness of the people pushing for de facto mass vaccination for people who don't need it.

*Except that without mass vaccination we don't achieve herd immunity. Without herd immunity, we face more and more variants that ARE harmful to those that weren't in danger previously. Already the India "Delta" variant is causing sudden onset diabetes and mucormycosis.*

By not having the vaccine, people are making the world a less safe place.

You might want to think things through a little before jumping to conclusions.

There are other treatments available that both have an effective prophylactic outcome and treatment outcomes that do not require injecting experimental vaccines (they have only emergency authorization, granted under the false premise that no other effective treatments are available). If safety is your concern, look at these:

https://rumble.com/vht8r7-dr-peter-mccullough-md-blows-lid-of-vaccine-dangers-a-must-watch.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn_b4NRTB6k&t=524s

These are safe and tested as effective in practice, yet there's a concerted effort to discredit them in favour of the new vaccines, together with a fear campaign about a new variant every other day in order to justify de facto mandatory vaccination and the attendant vaccine passports that give you the "right" (LOL) to move around "freely." I'm not saying don't get a jab if you want one, but effectively mandating them to participate in society is a bridge too far.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

And this.

https://catallaxyfiles.com/files/2021/06/NSW-Police-Blow-Whistle-on-Virus-Deception.pdf

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Yep no jab no travel simple . Why should I risk my health when there is enough proof out there already showing that the vaccines reduce the spread and reduce the symptoms of Covid . Look at the stats in the UK , not really sure why people are still debating.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Gooch

There are other treatments available that both have an effective prophylactic outcome and treatment outcomes that do not require injecting experimental vaccines...

Considering that over 2 billion people have now been vaccinated, you can hardly call the vaccines "experimental".

Also, therapeutics are not enough. Even if they help with the disease, they won't get rid of this virus. The only thing that can get rid of Covid is a vaccine. That is a fact.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

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