Trump says NFL insults about patriotism, not race

No, they're trying to draw attention to a problem that clearly many people still don't understand. I don't know how a protest can be more peaceful and respectful than silently kneeling.

The (mostly white) right want black people to keep it to themselves. No BLM protests, no silent kneeling, nothing. And if they don't obey; they are made out to be unpatriotic.

If you want to focus on the problem, you need to focus on the entire problem address them and not be politically selective.

Ok, so why do you seem to have a problem with blacks addressing their side of the problem?

Their problem is that cops are being racially selective. Selectiveness is built into the problem, so you really can't avoid it.

What do officer's deaths have to do with officers killing unarmed civilians.

If you want to focus on the problem, you need to focus on the entire problem address them and not be politically selective.

Now I’m not buying that crap one bit that Officer deaths are down.

What do officer's deaths have to do with officers killing unarmed civilians?

Yes, it has basis in real statistics. When you factor in population sizes, you're still 5 times more likely to be shot and killed by police while unarmed if you're black,

So are these...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/31/police-need-military-equipment-combat-rising-crime-rates-and-police-deaths-alfred-regnery-column/613471001/

despite the overall drop in police shootings. Here's an in depth analysis of the stats that goes beyond viral videos.

This was last years report.

http://time.com/4619689/police-officers-killed-2016/

Now I’m not buying that crap one bit that Officer deaths are down. My brother is a cop and I always hear about how these deaths are on the rise.

In NYC, home to America’s largest police force, officer-involved shootings have fallen by more than 90% since the early 1970s, and national trends have been similarly dramatic. So the larger question is whether what is being protested has some basis in reality beyond anecdotes and viral videos on social media.

Yes, it has basis in real statistics. When you factor in population sizes, you're still 5 times more likely to be shot and killed by police while unarmed if you're black, despite the overall drop in police shootings. Here's an in depth analysis of the stats that goes beyond viral videos.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?utm_term=.1467cccf3abb

These guys are saying, 'but my complaint is more important than your complaint.'

No, they're trying to draw attention to a problem that clearly many people still don't understand. I don't know how a protest can be more peaceful and respectful than silently kneeling.

There is no national database of police shootings, but the statistics that are available suggest that police today use deadly force significantly less often than in the past. In NYC, home to America’s largest police force, officer-involved shootings have fallen by more than 90% since the early 1970s, and national trends have been similarly dramatic.

 So the larger question is whether what is being protested has some basis in reality beyond anecdotes and viral videos on social media. An increase in press coverage of police shootings isn’t the same thing as an increase in police shootings.

Every one of us has things they would change about the country. But we put that aside for three minutes and come together as one. These guys are saying, 'but my complaint is more important than your complaint.' No. It's not. For those three minutes we have no complaints, only love of country and gratitude to veterans. Somehow the league has decided that players don't work for the fans anymore. Fans turn to speak.

This pretty much nails it.

https://youtu.be/DTfWdljzeNw

Naturally, most people don't know that the Star Spangled Banner has other verses.

In the War of 1812, the British took in almost 6,000 slaves from the US and protected them. They fed, clothed, trained and supplied some who wanted to fight against the US.

The poem is about the joy of Francis Scott Key (a slave owner) seeing those slaves killed by US soldiers.

In the peace treaty, the US demanded the return of property taken by the British and included the slaves as being property.

The real reason Trump is only concerned about attacking the NFL, condemning NFL players from not standing during the national anthem, while not saying a peep about fans who don't do the same (and even talk, drink, take photos) during the singing of the national anthem, and posting illogical tweets like "NFL ratings are down" and "I'm so glad I didn't purchase the Buffalo Bills", is because he was constantly rejected from the NFL from owning a franchise. He is still butt-hurt from that experience, and as experience has shown, Trump's feelings can easily be hurt and he tends to hold long grudges.

He was once so desperate to own a franchise in the NFL, that he used his ownership of a team in the failed USFL to try to do it. I even heard a story that told of how he was so thrilled to have signed Doug Flutie, that he tried to bully other USFL team owners to pay for Doug Flutie's contract. The reasoning being that signing a big name into the floundering USFL was going to increase profits, and so others should pay him for his crazy ideas. This tactic of his sounds eerily familiar.

The US takes this nationalism stuff too seriously, brainwashed from youth to support the almighty state. Not much different than North Korea in that people grow to hate those the most like them.

It's fitting that this is the NFL, another entitiy that takes advantage of the mental weakness of people. Why in the world would a sane person get emotional and obsessive about the outcome of something that has no effect on their lives?

Who cares if Team A beats Team B? The so-called fan gains and loses nothing from it.

Nothing. They don't own stock and they don't get any reward.

They are two businesses, not unlike two convenience store chains. Who cares if 7-11 sells more than Lawson?

Most of them have conned the public into building stadiums for them. Imagine if you could get politicians to build a facility for your business at no cost to you?

The worst part is the infiltration of the military into sports. The government has conned the public to pay for ridiculous glorification of the military in sports. Anyone who is a fan of the team sports industry will buy into joining the military.

The military needs a constant supply of fresh IED fodder to get their legs blown off in some middle eastern hell hole to keep the military/killing industry fat and rich.

Onoy after they've been in a hospital for months do they have the time to reflect on how they were hoodwinked into joining the military.

I overheard two morons in a store saying that people who don't stand and sing the anthem as loud as they can should be jailed because it's all about people in the military protecting their freedoms.

That's who they do in North Korea. Once again, you become what you hate.

No one is fighting to protect anyone's freedom. They're fighting to protect the industry profits and the goverment control of your emotions. To keep people occupied so they don't dig deeper to learn that the situation in Syria is about who will get to build an oil pipeline.

Freedoms? Nonsense.

Sorry for the long post. I didn't have time to write a short one.

I bet Trump has never even been to an NFL football game. If he had, then he would see how many fans don't even keep their mouths shut during the playing of the national anthem. I've even seen many drinking, laughing, taking photos, etc. At the very least, those athletes who take a knee are silent.

Says the bloke who cannot tolerate people kneeling silently. lol

No, when I pay money to see them do their job that they get paid to do, No, I don’t need to tolerate it and that sentiment is growing and the backlash is growing as well.

seriously bass, go into comedy full-time, you're wasted here.

I think so too. Kind words, made a lot of people laugh at NBC, runs in the family.

If the players were refusing to play, I'd understand your peeve. But the anthem happens before the game, yes?

It’s not about that, I don’t care about Kaepernick’s politics, I really don’t, when you are on the field, do your job, play and if you can’t or won’t, stay in the locker and if you proceed to spit on tradition, then we will hit you where it hurts and that’s in your pockets. If he stayed in the locker during the singing of the Anthem and then came out or went on CNN and complained to Anderson Cooper or Ellen, great! I support ya, bro! But as messed up as the world is, the absolute last place I want politics to intrude on is sports.

You have to wait while they play the song anyway, yes? So how does whether they stand, sit, kneel or do pirouettes during the anthem affect the game at all? What stops you doing your own thing during the anthem, and then settling down to watch the game?

Because it’s not the place to do it. This is why he won’t and can’t get signed anywhere, he’s a troublemaker and he proved that once again.

Stats from last year indicate that US police killed 1093 people, 170 of them unarmed. Of those 42 were Black and 95 were White. So it isn't 'one cop', White or otherwise, messing up.

Unarmed doesn’t mean you’re innocent or even complied with the officers demands. They have body cams, evidently, the videos show something that we as civilians don’t know about. We weren’t there, we don’t know all of the mitigating circumstances surrounding these shootings. As I said before, my brother is a cop and I’ve heard so many crazy stories of people armed and NOT armed, been on more than a dozen ride alongs and seeing how some of these people act, I’m not surprised if a person gets killed by a cop. It’s funny how the press want to paint a dark shroud over police conduct, but never take a look at the perpetrators that so, so often get themselves in bad situations.

*it seem he's more concerned with the NFL than with North Korea, the hurricane, and the hate crimes combined.  **when it comes to Trump the idea of "blacks" dictating how things should be done just doesn't sit fine with his psychology. *

What about the White players?

better to get them into line with "patriotism" excuse instead of just stating outright racism. expect Trumps channeled followers excuses in 3..2..1...

And the White players, they should get in line as well, righ?

Once again, Trump is so incapable of thinking that he doesn't realise how silly he sounds. The kneeling protest was and is very clearly and always about race, namely the treatment of young black men by police. Added to the fact that 70% of the players are black, and a similar or higher proportion in basketball, and the picture is completed. Does Trump seriously think that we are not aware of the background? Or that his repeating a false assertion in ever shriller tones will somehow make it less false? This is the most gullible fool any of us will be unluckily enough to have our lives messed up by. Really hard to fathom how the Republican party continues to indulge this moron. Hurry up Mueller, your country needs you.

Trump is hopelessly OUT OF TOUCH. His opinions are shared only by a small minority of Americans.

Not sure about that.

Alejandro Villanueva saw his jersey reach the top six in sales, after a game where he was the only team member to stand for the anthem (outside the locker room).

I suspect ticket sales will take a beating for teams that continue this childish game.

 it seem he's more concerned with the NFL than with North Korea, the hurricane, and the hate crimes combined. when it comes to Trump the idea of "blacks" dictating how things should be done just doesn't sit fine with his psychology. better to get them into line with "patriotism" excuse instead of just stating outright racism. expect Trumps channeled followers excuses in 3..2..1...

I would have stood up for the flag but that's because I've had relatives (some of whom were highly decorated) who have fought in most of America's wars ranging from those today going all the way back to the American Revolution in Pennsylvania. Some of those relatives are even buried in U.S. military cemetaries in foriegn countries where they gave their lives. For me, not standing to respect America's flag is almost the same as taking a dump on their graves and those of many other U.S. veterans who have served, fought and died for their country.

At the same time, America is a free country and I respect a person's expression if they choose to kneel rather than stand before the flag. I don't understand such thinking and don't like it but I respect their right. One thing's for sure, if I didn't stand for the flag during a high school football game when I was in uniform, I'd have been kicked off the field and team for good.

The left is so intolerant

Says the bloke who cannot tolerate people kneeling silently. lol.

The left for some odd reason think that they can just bully anyone in order to force their skewed worldview.....the left will use whatever dirty tactic they can.....I have every right to make sure their careers suffer

seriously bass, go into comedy full-time, you're wasted here.

when I pay big money for close up seats, I expect to watch some serious game and No, I don’t want my money back, I just want them to do their job. Imagine you are going on a serious business flight and at the last minutes, the pilots decided to take a knee and not fly, you’d be teed off and rightfully so.

If the players were refusing to play, I'd understand your peeve. But the anthem happens before the game, yes? You have to wait while they play the song anyway, yes? So how does whether they stand, sit, kneel or do pirouettes during the anthem affect the game at all? What stops you doing your own thing during the anthem, and then settling down to watch the game?

when it comes to one White cop messing up...

Stats from last year indicate that US police killed 1093 people, 170 of them unarmed. Of those 42 were Black and 95 were White. So it isn't 'one cop', White or otherwise, messing up.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2015/jun/01/the-counted-police-killings-us-database

your trying to boycott only affects the American pastime as a whole, including those players who do not partake in the protest

Yes.

They can peacefully stand in the locker room until the Anthem is finished and then come out, fine by me.

And several teams, like the Pittsburgh Steelers, Tennessee Titans, and Seattle Seahawks did just that, and still got backlash for it.

Two months into the season. Prove it.

Sure thing, homie.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-nfl-tv-ratings/

Its brilliant. It makes bigots like Donny angry, personally I find it hilarious.

I find it even more entertaining that ESPN and their mouse daddy is hemorrhaging money. Lol

http://www.businessinsider.com/espn-losing-subscribers-not-ratings-viewers-2017-9

Enjoy your NASCAR, patriot.

Hmmmm....could sworn I said that I don’t watch that, but I keep forgetting, libs only believe in what they want to believe in. Maybe they believe Hillary is in the WH as well. Lol

Obviously your scene; patriotic, flag-lubbering and all.

Yes, sir and proud of it.

Coming from the guy who links to wall builders and posts excerpts from works of fiction as if it were fact?

I’ve never done that, but nice try, homie.

Hilarious. Sorry Bass, a link to a news feed from "bluelives matter" makes not a coherent argument. What a joke.

Wow! Ok, so Black Lives Matter is important and whatever propaganda they spew is supposed to be believed, but a site that promotes the lives of the men in blue is just garbage? There lives aren’t as valuable as Black Lives, that’s what you are essentially saying. Now it’s official, the left is so far out there, it seriously better you guys don’t run anything let alone the govnerment. The sad thing is, all lives matter, not just Black lives. Wise up.

When he leaves office the country can get back to normal.

Until the next Democrat screws it all up again.

Trump is hopelessly OUT OF TOUCH. His opinions are shared only by a small minority of Americans. When he leaves office the country can get back to normal.

nd there are even more people that pay that don’t and the numbers are showing it, so you should get over yourself, if you disrespect the country and you don’t like what it has to offer, leave, but don’t punish the fans who really don’t give a crap about your personal strife.

Two months into the season. Prove it.

So he’s a Black man who grew up and is using his white privilege to hostage a game, real smart.

Its brilliant. It makes bigots like Donny angry, personally I find it hilarious. Enjoy your NASCAR, patriot. Obviously your scene; patriotic, flag-lubbering and all.

No, I never do. I leave that for the loose left.

Coming from the guy who links to wall builders and posts excerpts from works of fiction as if it were fact? Hilarious. Sorry Bass, a link to a news feed from "bluelives matter" makes not a coherent argument. What a joke.

Imagine you are going on a serious business flight and at the last minutes, the pilots decided to take a knee and not fly

irrelevant. If the players decide to take a knee and not play it might be relevant, but the games have not been affected. And your trying to boycott only affects the American pastime as a whole, including those players who do not partake in the protest. And it is starting to pass on to other sports as I'm sure you are aware but don't care about that either. If you don't give a damn about the players then you aren't a fan at all. And they are not disrespecting the flag, they totally respect the flag, hence the reason they choose that time to protest. They understand the strength of it better than anybody, the president and you included.

They have every right to do it.

They do and I have every right to make sure their careers suffer as a consumer and fan.

It didn't hurt you in any way whether you disagree or not. If you don't like it, you can take your money and walk.

I don’t know about you, but when I pay big money for close up seats, I expect to watch some serious game and No, I don’t want my money back, I just want them to do their job. Imagine you are going on a serious business flight and at the last minutes, the pilots decided to take a knee and not fly, you’d be teed off and rightfully so.

It only shows that you don't support them.

No, I don’t support them, especially Kaepernick who grew up a very privileged life, who was raised by a White family after his Black family gave him up. So he’s a Black man who grew up and is using his white privilege to hostage a game, real smart.

Plenty of people who pay do. Just get over yourself

And there are even more people that pay that don’t and the numbers are showing it, so you should get over yourself, if you disrespect the country and you don’t like what it has to offer, leave, but don’t punish the fans who really don’t give a crap about your personal strife.

No, that was in reference to the story you didn't read. Doh

Ah, ha...well, NASCAR is not my thing, homie. Never liked Dukes of Hazard either.

Nope, on the field. Where they've been protesting

Nope, get off the field or stay in the locker room until the anthem is finished.

I think you're making things up again, Bass.

No, I never do. I leave that for the loose left.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/09/160923121056.htm

https://bluelivesmatter.blue/category/war-on-cops/

You would have a valid as well as a respectable argument if I were to say, the players had NO right to protest at all, I never said, nor was I implying it, I think it's perfectly fine to protest, just not when I fork money to watch a game. 

They have every right to do it. It didn't hurt you in any way whether you disagree or not. If you don't like it, you can take your money and walk. It only shows that you don't support them. Plenty of people who pay do. Just get over yourself.

You seem to think that you are being bullied if you don't get your way or if we speak out against Donny.

No, but I do believe you guys like to bully people if they don’t believe as you guys do. I definitely believe that.

If kneeling hurts your feelings so much, turn the channel to Nascar. Douzo

No, I’ll just keep watching and use the power of my money and watch the numbers drop and at ESPN they are slowly getting that message and the NFL and NBA will get it as well.

And No, I don’t watch NASCAR. Say, did you just make a racist insinuation??

Dotard Trump is a warmonger, a bigot, a rogue leader who opposes a vast section of his people. His words and deeds show just that.

But how is he a warmonger? Did he fire missiles over NK? Did he fire them over Russia, Afghanistan? And how is he a bigot? Many of the Black athletes and some in the music industry said racial things as well, so then that makes them racists or do they get a pass?

The NFL and others are peacefully standing up to his crap. But apparently, for some, that's a bad thing.

They can peacefully stand in the locker room until the Anthem is finished and then come out, fine by me. Not on the field though.

And the far right wonder why antifa and other ordinary folk are enraged?

the racist and fascists ANTIFA enraged? Who cares and judging from the polls, looks like the NFL and NBA and teeing off a lot of people. Maybe how Trump made the comment wasn’t the smartest thing to do, but putting that aside, everything else was on point.

*You condemn all protests, be they peaceful or active. *

No, I don’t and I never said that, don’t even try and we already went through that.

Black people and other minorities clearly must not have their say. In any form. Because if the do; they are unAmerican. 

What you just said made me laugh so hard, not even going to comment on something so outrageously ludicrous, good lord.....

The mask has slipped.

On the left, oh, a very long time ago.

Dotard Trump is a warmonger, a bigot, a rogue leader who opposes a vast section of his people. His words and deeds show just that.

The NFL and others are peacefully standing up to his crap. But apparently, for some, that's a bad thing.

And the far right wonder why antifa and other ordinary folk are enraged?

You condemn all protests, be they peaceful or active. On the frontline, through the arts or sports.

Black people and other minorities clearly must not have their say. In any form. Because if the do; they are unAmerican.

Yeah, we see you now, Trumpists. Clearly.

The mask has slipped.

Odd that you'd choose this outdated legal standard to make your point. Its also worth noting that this is the same kind of reasoning governments in the southern US used to prevent civil rights marches.

Not outdated, the thing is, the left will use whatever dirty tactic they can to push their liberal progressive Identity politics agenda. You would have a valid as well as a respectable argument if I were to say, the players had NO right to protest at all, I never said, nor was I implying it, I think it's perfectly fine to protest, just not when I fork money to watch a game. The left for some odd reason think that they can just bully anyone in order to force their skewed worldview. The left is so intolerant, Kaepernick made a statement and so did Trump, so you didn't like what Trump had to say and I didn't like what the players did, both are Americans and both have a right to freedom of speech, so if you want me and others to be tolerant of these guys kneeling, then give back the same curtesy and allow the president the same privilege, that is, unless you guys are hypocrites.

You act like there's zero community outreach and action taking place to address crime in black communities,

So what is Chicago doing about it. Most Blacks in the city of Detroit can't read about the 8th grade level, what is the Black community doing about that? Where is Al Sharpton or Jessie Jackson or even Spike Lee? Why aren't they talking about the 70% fatherless Black communities? The left want to make Trump out as some racist person and all Whites as if they are the problem for all the problems Blacks are facing in this country, but if you speak about the truth as to what's going on, complete silence from the Black leaders, they are all incognito! It's very easy to point the finger at others and to use the race card, but when it comes to pointing out the huge problems in the Black community, crime, murder, drugs, lack of education, not a sound, but when it comes to one White cop messing up or the president saying something that makes the left uneasy, it's war on every White person, hate is not a one-sided issue, it goes both ways and when either side goes overboard, neither side will take it.

and yet you mocked Obama for being a community organizer. The problem can be addressed from multiple angles at the same time and it is.

I spoke the truth, there wasn't anything racist in what I said, nothing.

So does a high rate of black crime make it OK for cops to murder innocent and unarmed blacks?

A lot of Blacks in Chicago are being shot by Black police officers, so you are saying to me, we need to stop Black cops from killing their own?

The justice system seems to think so.

What does that have to do with these players taking the knee, if it is so unjust, write your local congressman, organize a rally, get some of these Hollywood douches off their couches and out of their Malibu homes and do something constructive for once instead of making stupid award shows and patting themselves on their backs congratulating each other on what movies they made and stared in. These people are so out of touch with reality, they should do something really positive instead of hurling humorless jokes that seems like THEY can only laugh at. Change the system, push for tougher legislation, do whatever it takes, but don't do it on the field when I pay money to watch a game, go back and do your job, you get millions to pay, NOT to go on about your political stances most people don't care about.

Just try to imagine yourself in that situation. The people who are supposed to protect you from murderers are murdering you and the courts seem to imply that it doesn't matter because you're black.

You make it seem like that thousands of Blacks are murdered on an hourly basis. So what do you think about police deaths climbing and at an alarming 19% don't blue lives matter as well?

He could redeem himself if he consistently avoided appearing racist or pandering to racists, but... Oh, right...

You cannot concretely prove that Trump is a racist.

And preach to the choir? The point of protests is to effect change.

Yes, they are doing that, people are turning the TV off and starting to NOT show up to the games, so on that part you are right.

You do that by reaching as many people as possible, including people with opposing views. Please read what I wrote about that.

I just said the same thing, go on Facebook, Instagram or any other social media site that will hear you out, leave the games out of this. When I pay money to watch a game, that is what I expect in return. So I am making it my business to tell them to stop.

Did you read my point and cleo's about why it does matter? Let me spell it out for you more plainly. Trump has no place lecturing others on patriotism (topic of article), because he's a draft-dodger.

He's done more for this country and for the city of NYC than all those guys combined and so he's a draft dodger, Clinton was as well, does that make him less patriot. Obama didn't even serve as a governor with zero experience does that make him less patriotic?

While Clinton (not the topic of the article) also dodged the draft, he doesn't have the gall to invoke patriotism or disparage actual war veterans.

Doesn't matter, draft dodging is draft dodging. If a White Supremacist steals a case of beer and a leftist ANTIFA does the exact same thing, that is called theft and would apply to both would it not or would it only apply to the White Supremacist because they are Neo Nazis? Give me a break! LOL

They're different people with vastly different circumstances surrounding them, so bringing up Clinton was a deflection on your part, nothing more.

No, it was an equal and fair comparison, but nice try.

How about how the Dallas Cowboys team took the knee last night?

Team owner Jerry Jones (a staunch supporter of Trump) and the coaches joined all the Cowboys players in locking arm-in-arm solidarity, and they all took a knee - before the national anthem

They then all stood up during the national anthem

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/09/25/cowboys-players-take-a-knee-with-owner-jerry-jones-before-standing-for-anthem/

“Our players wanted to make a statement about unity and we wanted to make a statement about equality,” Jones said at a postgame news conference. “They were very much aware that statement, when made or when attempted to be made in and a part of the recognition of our flag, can not only lead to criticism but also controversy.

“It was real easy for everybody in our organization to see that the message of unity, the message of equality was getting, if you will, pushed aside or diminished by the controversy. We even had the circumstances that it was being made into a controversy.”

The Cowboys “tossed around ideas” and sought a solution that promoted unity while satisfying both the group of players who wanted to kneel for the anthem and the group that wanted to stand for it. Once the compromise was reached, members of the Cowboys’ ownership group discussed the plan with representatives of the Cardinals’ ownership, the person with knowledge of the planning said.

It was the latest show of unity or protest by NFL teams since President Trump said Friday at a campaign rally in Alabama that owners should fire players who refuse to stand for the anthem.

Would that be a fair compromise?

Sorry, but I never said that, nice try. I am always for freedom of speech, but that doesn't mean you can shout fire in a crowded room

Odd that you'd choose this outdated legal standard to make your point. Its also worth noting that this is the same kind of reasoning governments in the southern US used to prevent civil rights marches.

Says they guy who demands people not be allowed freedom of speech so long as he's watching at that time.

Sorry, but I never said that, nice try. I am always for freedom of speech, but that doesn't mean you can shout fire in a crowded room, even free speech has its limits. If he decides to stay in the locker during the anthem, I have no problem with it and or if he wants to do it after the game, more power to you. By the way, NFL ratings went down by another 9%.

Why not heed your own advice and avoid looking at the screen so as not to see players kneeling during the anthem?

I often pay money and go to live games, so No. I didn't pay to watch a political stunt and stupid outbursts, if I wanted that, I would watch msnbc.

Surely you know the song and can make due with the tune. Or stare at the flag in your room. Or... does the "turn it off" only apply to others? 

Or I can do like everyone else stop watching, boycott them and hope the next time they get signed they get less money, so I want to make it as difficult for them as I possibly can as a fan.

THEIRS is to protest where they choose.

Yes, and mine is the right to make there life as difficult as I can. Again, do it on your own time, not when we as a fan, consumer pay money. I don't care about their politics and the most people don't care that's why the numbers are dropping.

Nixon and Johnson used to swear like troopers. JFK and Clinton used to womanise. so some of what DT does is not the first time.

He is indeed a narcissist and of questionable ability

So you're saying he has all of their faults, but none of their strengths?

bass4funk: "And we have the power to turn it off and more and more people are doing it."

Says they guy who demands people not be allowed freedom of speech so long as he's watching at that time. Why not heed your own advice and avoid looking at the screen so as not to see players kneeling during the anthem? Surely you know the song and can make due with the tune. Or stare at the flag in your room. Or... does the "turn it off" only apply to others?

"No, I do not. Again, off the field"

You have the power to turn it off, my friend. You said so yourself. Don't like them doing it on the field? Turn it off. THAT is your right. THEIRS is to protest where they choose.

And on Monday, keeping the issue alive for a fourth day, Trump insisted, "The issue of kneeling has nothing to do with race."

Trump has whole-heartily embraced the controversy, with his advisors believing it plays well with his largely white base.

Those 2 concepts above do not match

Also, the US college basketball champions Univ of North Carolina won't be going to the White House

https://www.tarheelblog.com/unc-tar-heels-basketball/2017/9/25/16358732/unc-tar-heels-basketball-white-house

Nixon and Johnson used to swear like troopers.  JFK and Clinton used to womanise.  so some of what DT does is not the first time.

He is indeed a narcissist and of questionable ability, but equally there does appear to be a tendency to construe everything he says and does in the worst possible light.

As long as Blacks don’t face the reality that is hitting them in this country...

You act like there's zero community outreach and action taking place to address crime in black communities, and yet you mocked Obama for being a community organizer. The problem can be addressed from multiple angles at the same time and it is.

So does a high rate of black crime make it OK for cops to murder innocent and unarmed blacks? The justice system seems to think so. Just try to imagine yourself in that situation. The people who are supposed to protect you from murderers are murdering you and the courts seem to imply that it doesn't matter because you're black.

I thought the left was a tolerent bunch, guess I was mistaken.

Oh, you're definitely mistaken, but not about that. I said he can continue to condemn. (You even quote me.) He could redeem himself if he consistently avoided appearing racist or pandering to racists, but... Oh, right...

No, I do not. Again, off the field, go on Rachel Maddow’s show or Anderson Cooper, they will book these guys on faster than a speeding bullet.

And preach to the choir? The point of protests is to effect change. You do that by reaching as many people as possible, including people with opposing views. Please read what I wrote about that.

Doesn’t matter, both he and Trump dodged the draft, that was my point, nothing more, that’s why I brought that up, please go back and read what I wrote about that.

Did you read my point and cleo's about why it does matter? Let me spell it out for you more plainly. Trump has no place lecturing others on patriotism (topic of article), because he's a draft-dodger. While Clinton (not the topic of the article) also dodged the draft, he doesn't have the gall to invoke patriotism or disparage actual war veterans. They're different people with vastly different circumstances surrounding them, so bringing up Clinton was a deflection on your part, nothing more.

People like you who don't care are forced to look at the problem because of the timing of their protest. Maximum conspicuousness is kind of the point...

And we have the power to turn it off and more and more people are doing it. The mouse network is already trying to save its prized ESPN from bleeding out and if this continues that network and the ticket sales from the NFL and NBA will cost these guys big.

If whites did the same they would be ridiculed because whites statistically aren't victims of police brutality on the level as blacks. What garbage are you talking?

Give me a break! Some of that is self-inflicted. By the way, during Hurricane Irma, what color were most of the looters? Perception is everything, yes, it’s not fair to always profile people, but a lot of the stereotypes and perceptions that people have of Blacks can’t be helped when people see images of looting, gang violence, knock out games etc. Whites didn’t conjure up these images, these are images that many of us see daily on the news and on the web, but the problem is, the left as well as many Black leaders either make excuses or run away from the issue, but at the same time are willing to hurl accusations without merit oftentimes. As long as Blacks don’t face the reality that is hitting them in this country, the high incarceration rate, the Black on Black high crime, drugs and gangs and open up to have a serious dialogue about race, these problems will never go away, they will only cement the images (often negative) in the people they are trying to persuade.

He already screwed up by being late and weak in his condemnations.

So he’s beyond redemption? I thought the left was a tolerent bunch, guess I was mistaken.

All he can do now is continue to condemn. Do you really not see the difference in responses though? How quickly and strongly he condemns peaceful protest for black rights?

No, I do not. Again, off the field, go on Rachel Maddow’s show or Anderson Cooper, they will book these guys on faster than a speeding bullet.

You're right, Clinton isn't wrapping himself in the flag and posing as a patriot while using locker-room language to slag off his fellow Americans.

Doesn’t matter, both he and Trump dodged the draft, that was my point, nothing more, that’s why I brought that up, please go back and read what I wrote about that.

No, I get the point and I do support their right to protest, just NOT when I pay money to watch a game and to hear your political statement, I don’t care!

People like you who don't care are forced to look at the problem because of the timing of their protest. Maximum conspicuousness is kind of the point...

Imagine if for example Whites were to do the same about police brutality, you know exactly what would happen, so please don’t give me that garbage.

If whites did the same they would be ridiculed because whites statistically aren't victims of police brutality on the level as blacks. What garbage are you talking?

By the way, how many more times does Trump need to condemn the White Supremacists? He already as well as the ANTIFA, What else is he supposed to do?

He already screwed up by being late and weak in his condemnations. All he can do now is continue to condemn. Do you really not see the difference in responses though? How quickly and strongly he condemns peaceful protest for black rights?

Clinton dodged the draft as well. I fail to see how that’s relevant to the conversation.

It's relevant for Trump and not Clinton, because Clinton doesn't go around questioning people's patriotism. Clinton doesn't tell POWs who did fight for the country that he likes soldiers who don't get caught like Trump did to John McCain.

Surely you don't think it's just black people from all walks of life who are sickened and protest at police brutality?

Dunno, you keep bringing up the race card, what do you think?

He sees them as the same thing. Whereas, they aren't. 

You think.

This is what he does. He would have seen the Selma march as anti-American

How would you know that?

NOT when I pay money to watch a game and to hear your political statement, I don’t care! Do it off the field

Best perhaps if they remove all political statements from the sports field. The national anthem is in itself a political statement. Would you agree to it not being played at non-political events like football matches? If not, why not? You don't want politics in sports, do you?

Imagine if for example Whites were to do the same about police brutality, you know exactly what would happen

Apparently a white player named Seth DeValve joined his black teammates in taking the knee in August. I have no idea what happened, except that he was interviewed by the media afterwards.

Clinton dodged the draft as well. I fail to see how that’s relevant to the conversation. 

You're right, Clinton isn't wrapping himself in the flag and posing as a patriot while using locker-room language to slag off his fellow Americans. Clinton isn't relevant to the conversation at all. So why bring him up?

bass4funk: "No, I get the point and I do support their right to protest,"

Obviously you do not.

" just NOT when I pay money to watch a game and to hear your political statement, I don’t care! Do it off the field, in the locker"

So... it's 'free speech' so long as it's done in places you approve of. That's not free speech, bud. Not what soldiers, now getting on knees in protest, fought and died for.

"We all need a break and time to escape if only for a few hours the problems of the world and now we have to be subjected to political grandstanding?"

This, from a Trump supporter? No one engages in political grandstanding more than Trump, on Twitter or otherwise. He took a small, personal protest and an exercise in freedom of speech, and turned it into a nationwide protest against him. The "unifier" indeed, if only against him.

Also, why is draft-dodging Trump trying to give lessons on patriotism?

I totally agree. I would rather believe an athlete, or former athlete, like San Antonio Spurs coach, Gregg Popovich, who actually served in the United States Air Force, and has been outspoken about Trump and his so-called patriotism, than draft dodger Trump. I would even believe a true war hero like Senator John McCain, over the fake patriot Trump.

Sorry, I don’t care what their personal beef is.

The voice of compassion.

Imagine if for example Whites were to do the same about police brutality, you know exactly what would happen, so please don’t give me that garbage.

Surely you don't think it's just black people from all walks of life who are sickened and protest at police brutality?

By the way, how many more times does Trump need to condemn the White Supremacists? He already as well as the ANTIFA

He sees them as the same thing. Whereas, they aren't.

This is what he does. He would have seen the Selma march as anti-American.

Once again, you miss the point... What are the athletes, both black and white, protesting about?

No, I get the point and I do support their right to protest, just NOT when I pay money to watch a game and to hear your political statement, I don’t care! Do it off the field, in the locker, go on any of the news networks, you’ll be booked all day guaranteed, but just not at a sports event. We all need a break and time to escape if only for a few hours the problems of the world and now we have to be subjected to political grandstanding? Sorry, I don’t care what their personal beef is.

Police brutality against blacks, i.e., they're standing for black rights. That gets a quick, passionate response from Trump while his response to white supremacists is coerced and tepid.

Imagine if for example Whites were to do the same about police brutality, you know exactly what would happen, so please don’t give me that garbage. By the way, how many more times does Trump need to condemn the White Supremacists? He already as well as the ANTIFA, What else is he supposed to do?

Also, why is draft-dodging Trump trying to give lessons on patriotism?

Clinton dodged the draft as well. I fail to see how that’s relevant to the conversation. But it was a different time then. Hippies everywhere.

Can you prove he singled out exclusively just the Black athletes only? He specifically called out the Black athletes and excluded the White ones?

Once again, you miss the point... What are the athletes, both black and white, protesting about? Police brutality against blacks, i.e., they're standing for black rights. That gets a quick, passionate response from Trump while his response to white supremacists is coerced and tepid.

Also, why is draft-dodging Trump trying to give lessons on patriotism?

"The violent left", "the sons of bitches".

But patriotic Dotard Trump who wants war with the DPRK to avoid closer scrutiny on domestic unrest and that other thing...

Oh, say can you see thru the Don's scary spite?

"I love everybody ... except anarchists (people who demonstrate against me) and sons of bit**es (people who demonstrate against the killing of American citizens)." Yeah, right.

Yeah... when you call Neo-Nazis "fine gentlemen" and black athletes "sons of b---hes",

Can you prove he singled out exclusively just the Black athletes only? He specifically called out the Black athletes and excluded the White ones?

it's OBVIOUSLY not about race at all. The man has shown his true colors yet again; he can't take it back.

I don’t think he wants to take it back.

Even the stuff about patriotism is a joke anyway.

To you perhaps, but not for the majority of Americans.

Trump wants power and dictatorship rules; that's not patriotism.

Thrn every leader of every country fits under that description.

@Laguna - points well taken. I am not sure I agree with your second point fully, but I can see how it can be interpreted that way.

@ Nan - so all of those who are patriotic are insane? Come on.....That is a bit over the top.

One other issue I found really troubling is the fact he used the term "sons of bitches". Seriously? Is that a way a President is supposed to talk?

Although I see this as bread and circuses (as I said in a different post) the way Trump is speaking and reacting to this certainly calls into question his fitness to be the Commander in Chief

Tokyo-Engr, two points:

The First Amendment arguably protects this type of speech (I qualify it as? courts have found certain restrictions apply when done on the employer's clock). Personally, I don't care whether they kneel or stand. In fact, the only silver lining I see in this is that what heretofore has been simple reflexive ceremony has become a reflective, conscious choice.

Trump made this about him, as usual, whether purposely or not. Stand now and you're unfortunately seen as standing with Trump. Is there nothing too sacred for this bum not to sully?

Politicians push patriotism because it is purely emotional.

There is no intellect involved, so it appeals to the less intelligent...which means they can get people to do anything in the name of their country, including flinging themselves in front of bullets to protect the oil industry.

Patriotism and nationalism- last refuges for the insane. Just look at Nazis under hitler!

@Laguna - I do not agree with all of your post however much of what you say is true.

However, one thing I found troubling is that Alejandro Villanueva, a combat veteran, felt he had to apologize for standing alone in the tunnel during the national anthem.

He has nothing to apologize for.

http://www.totalprosports.com/2017/09/25/steelers-alejandro-villanueva-publicly-apologizes-for-coming-out-during-anthem-embarrassing-teammates-video/

It is too bad that someone made him feel that he did something wrong by exercising his right to stand for the National Anthem.

Things are really spinning out of control, to the level of insanity, in the United States.

When white supremacists killed a woman in Charlottesville waving unpatriotic Confederate flags, Trump hesitated to denounce them and said some of them were good people. When athletes quietly and non-violently protest police brutality against blacks, he's quick to call them SOBs. Sure, nothing to do with race...

Trump's performance is quickly deteriorating from "sad" to "cringeworthily pathetic." At the address he gave in Alabama for Sen. Luther Strange a few days ago, Trump had to dig deep for a list of accomplishments:

We've got a lot of things done -- they hate to admit it -- including, we have a Supreme Court Justice, Judge Gorsuch, who will save, how about a thing called your Second Amendment? Right? OK, remember that?

Trumpeting the appointment of a judge is equivalent to showcasing your "Achievement Award for Showing Up." Sad.

And mentioning the Second Amendment? Time to bring up Clinton again!

If Crooked Hillary had won the 2016 election, you would not have a Second Amendment. You'd be handing in your rifles. You'd be turning over your rifles.

Like a middle-aged desk jockey who can't stop reliving his high school athletic glory days. Weak.

This of course riled the crowd of 'Bamans to chant

Lock her up!

to which Trump lamely responded

You've got to speak to Jeff Sessions about that.

temporarily forgetting he's still incensed at his own AG for recusing himself from any investigation into Trump's firing of Comey, his former FBI head. Lame.

That may be a reason why he went after the NFL. He knows that Alabama's love of football is matched by a deep inferiority complex and - how shall we say this? - deep ambivalence regarding people of color, and since his greatest hits are getting stale and he has zero accomplishments to point to (not even anything on the horizon), he likely panicked and made that up on the spot (it's difficult to imagine a speech writer drafting "SOB" into a speech). And now he owns it, whether his intentions were racist or not. (Hint: they probably were, but this cannot be proven and doesn't matter anyway.)

Tired of winning yet?

Based on his tweets, it seem he's more concerned with the NFL than with North Korea, the hurricane, and the hate crimes combined.

Yeah... when you call Neo-Nazis "fine gentlemen" and black athletes "sons of b---hes", it's OBVIOUSLY not about race at all. The man has shown his true colors yet again; he can't take it back. Even the stuff about patriotism is a joke anyway. Trump wants power and dictatorship rules; that's not patriotism.

The issue of kneeling has nothing to do with race. It is about respect for our Country, Flag and National Anthem. NFL must respect this!"

Why don't we just cut to the chase and get everyone to "Seig Heil"

The White House denied that Trump's "son of a bitch" remarks were unbecoming of his office.

Shows how much respect they have for the office.