Australian prime minister survives leadership challenge by 48 votes to 35

Dutton, seriously?

Probably the most widely loathed minister in the government given he fronts immigration and refugee policy.

Turnbull needs to isolate the knuckle draggers from Queensland from his party. That should be seen as a Liberal party project actually. Its been dragging the coalition down for at least a decade. We have been debating energy policy for two decades and still can't get a consensus. Its a joke.

What does he have to fear? The National party in Australia are nowhere without their partnership with the Liberal party in suburban and city seats. They cannot afford to bite the hand that gives them a say in national politics. They sure won't get it from the Labor party or the Greens.

So still an American satilite state.

So still an American satilite state

An American ally. Sure, that's never going to change regardless of who is in power.

Election winds are blowing.

Dutton,

Probably the most widely loathed 

Liberal Party MP (maybe second after Abbott), now is mentioned as having a family trust set up maybe making him ineligible to be an MP.

Now, where are Turnbull's balls of leadership?

On that thought, where are ALP's Albanese's.

Liberal Party MP (maybe second after Abbott), now is mentioned as having a family trust set up maybe making him ineligible to be an MP.

Now, where are Turnbull's balls of leadership?

On that thought, where are ALP's Albanese's.

Actually yes probably second most loathed after Abbott by the citizenry at least.

You watch, Abbott will take a run at the leadership next....and lose. But even though these guys get tossed to the back bench and out of cabinet, they can still cause trouble from that position like Abbott has ever since he lost to Turnbull ages ago now. Unfortunately, until they are voted out by their constituents there is no way of isolating them. The same has happened to Labor in the past.

Labor will win the next election by a handy majority I think. And rightly so. Even though Shorten is a dud as a potential PM. Albanese or better still, Bowen imo would make a better PM. Even though I would prefer the LNP, they need to flush these brickheads from QLD out of the coalition, permanently. The LNP needs a reset of its members back towards a more sensible centre/right mix of people that can think into the future on energy policy and other issues, instead of the past....The National Party needs younger membership and there are plenty of younger Australians in the bush they could step up.

The mystery about Turnbull has always been his reluctance to face off with the knuckle draggers. He had so much genuine public support from all sides of politics when he first took office, mainly because people were sick of Tony Abbott's bruiser approach to things. But Turnbull squandered all that goodwill, and betrayed his own beliefs and principles to boot, in a series of backdowns which can only be interpreted as his always giving his No.1 priority to his own survival as PM.

Whether that's a fair assessment or not, it's certainly the way the electorate sees him now - as a man with no principles. Nothing is going to save him, either from the Neanderthals in his own party or from the voters, in the unlikely event he gets through to the next election. Some commentators are saying he may not even get through today.

No Australian PM has served their full term since John Howard lost in 2007. That's four in a row, five if you count the fact that Kevin Rudd had a go at it twice. Nothing could be more expressive of the short-term thinking of Australian politics than that.

I think it is a fair assessment. Although we are leaving out the role of voters in all this. Australian voters are hypercritical and many are now swing voters of course. Far more so than two or three decades ago.

Once upon a time you had hardcore Liberal voters, usually business people and the wealthy, hardcore Labor voters, the workers and the middle class and hardcore National voters that were all in the bush and that was it. You had the Greens just forming and the Democrats were the minority party that are now gone.

All you have left now, in 2018, is the hardcore National voters to some extent and even they get chipped away at by parties like the Shooters, Fishing & Farmers party.

It all swings around quite a bit. Its more volatile and unpredictable than it use to be.

Also, in terms of the LNP, it is always going to be a challenge for a Liberal PM to draw out a consensus from a coalition of people that come from the most wealthy city areas of Australia to the poorest rural areas of the bush. The concerns and needs of those two demographics are quiet different. But that's also what I like about the LNP, it is more representative of Australia as a whole I feel because it has that city/country union. Neither Labor and certainly not the Greens have that and I see no signs they ever will.

Having said all that I think the National party need to recruit a younger generation of leaders which are more likely to bridge that gap between the city and country, while still representing the views and fighting for the needs of the bush.

the electorate will not vote for either Dutton or Abbott - the Liberals are simply handing the next election to Labor if the go with either of these blokes.... It beats me why the Liberal party call themselves "liberals" these days - they are nothing more than a pack of right wing dog whistling reactionaries who have trouble seeing past their own survival...

Too bad not enough Australians have the wisdom to vote in Pauline Hanson.

Too bad not enough Australians have the wisdom to vote in Pauline Hanson.

Ha, ha, ha, she is just like the other politicians. By the way, her party is just as chaotic as the current government.

the electorate will not vote for either Dutton or Abbott - the Liberals are simply handing the next election to Labor if the go with either of these blokes.... It beats me why the Liberal party call themselves "liberals" these days - they are nothing more than a pack of right wing dog whistling reactionaries who have trouble seeing past their own survival...

I agree, the Liberal party have handed the next election to Labor on a platter, but to say that the majority of the Liberal party are dog whistling reactionaries is completely false. Its a minority of bad eggs, mostly National party members that think brown coal is gods gift to mankind.

Too bad not enough Australians have the wisdom to vote in Pauline Hanson.

Woah! Bro, bro!!! Care to rejoin us the real world please? LOL.

Its one thing to bring up controversial issues like immigration, islam etc, which she has frequently done and outline a position with some eloquence. Its another to rant "them asians!"

I have socks that are smarter than Pauline Hanson.

Its another to rant "them asians!"

Nah, she has stopped targeting asians. The One Nation candidate in my area in the last state election was a migrant from China. One time I saw One Nation supporters on TV that are asians. She is picking on Muslims now.

Literally rolling out the welcome mat to Bill Shorten. In spectacular fashion as well...

All he has to do is sit back and, really “enjoy the show”. He doesn’t need to do anything.

Nah, she has stopped targeting asians. The One Nation candidate in my area in the last state election was a migrant from China. One time I saw One Nation supporters on TV that are asians. She is picking on Muslims now.

Pretty transparent what she did though.

She picked up a couple of Asian faces as representatives to defeat the widespread idea she is a bigot, but it didn't work. People have not forgotten her rantings from 10 years ago or more. It was survival strategy.

True she is picking on Muslims now.

Her and her party are dead in the water I feel.

the electorate will not vote for either Dutton or Abbott - the Liberals are simply handing the next election to Labor if the go with either of these blokes.... It beats me why the Liberal party call themselves "liberals" these days - they are nothing more than a pack of right wing dog whistling reactionaries who have trouble seeing past their own survival...

Let's be honest, Dutton & Abbott are not Liberals. In any other country than oz (especially europe) they'd be members of a far-right party (and persona non grata in 'traditional' ones).

48 votes decided a leader for Australia ? What kind of majority joke.

@Goodlucktoyou - So still an American satilite state.

I think you have Australia confused with Japan.

Are England, NZ, Italy, Scotland third world countries?

Are Vietnam and Malaysia third world either at this point? Not really

China is no longer third world, it is well and truly middle income and rising

India, Philippines and South Africa are closer to the lower end but like I say, we only take the talented and wealthy.

The overwhelming majority of the Asian immigrant population live in the cities and that's not cheap. They are, on average, wealthier and more educated than the rest of Australia as a result.

The European immigrants are more likely to be spread around the whole country, city and country.

And since we mostly taking Indian and Asian immigrants now, that is the next step. To get them to look beyond Sydney and Melbourne because it is becoming totally economically inefficient to keep expanding these cities.

Where I live in a regional city the white Australian population is like 95%.

No Australian PM has served their full term since John Howard lost in 2007. That's four in a row, five if you count the fact that Kevin Rudd had a go at it twice. Nothing could be more expressive of the short-term thinking of Australian politics than that.

Thing is, oz best & brightest often choose to become investment bankers, doctors, lawyers etc rather than pollies (also true in other countries but imo not to this extent). Took me a while to get used to the astonishing mediocrity of oz pollies tbh. Most of them are/were an embarrassment on the international stage.

Thing is, oz best & brightest often choose to become investment bankers, doctors, lawyers etc rather than pollies (also true in other countries but imo not to this extent). Took me a while to get used to the astonishing mediocrity of oz pollies tbh. Most of them are/were an embarrassment on the international stage.

True. The best in this country head into the best and most lucrative professions. Or overseas, which is very common for the young.

I think the problem for the more small 'l' Liberal party supporters is that the party - and the coalition to which they belong - is also first choice for some truly backward-looking conservative voters (and politicians). In that sense the LNP is a 'broad church', as they always like to tell us, but for quite a while now it's been a church that's been wracked by a pretty serious schism. Turnbull encapsulates all that neatly, being the progressive who had the political capital to lead his party forward (in his own terms as well as mine) but who failed, due to various reasons, to do so.

Totally agree. It would be nice if the really backward looking conservatives joined Bernardi's Conservative party or the Liberal Democrats. Although, the Liberal Democrats brand themselves as Libertarian which in theory should be more free-wheeling in terms of immigration policy and other areas meaning hardcore knuckle dragging Conservatives might struggle there. Bernardi's party is a better bet for them. I both feel sorry for Malcolm Turnbull and let down by him. I like him as PM and as a small l liberal, but he just does not have the courage for the fight.

It seems to me, a non-LNP voter, that this tension between the two wings of the Liberal party is too deep to be resolved. Yet neither side has the courage or the honesty to call the split, the way the Labour party did back in the 1950s. Until they do so, the Liberals are going to seesaw between deep conservatism and weak progressivism - and to be the home of potentially progressive leaders who fail to enact policy they themselves believe in because of their fear of the "Others" in their own party. That's a failure of duty of which Malcolm Turnbull will always be a prime example.

Agree again, BUT I see hope. A lot of regional cities and towns are becoming more progressive over time. As city people move from the city to less expensive and better lifestyles in the country, this is having an impact in attitudes in the country. This is why I call for a younger generation to lead the National party because I think they will be able to resolve this schism, this split. And then you get the best both worlds and a party that representatives city, suburban and regional/rural Australia which would be very strong at the polls and that might actually be able to reach compromises and consensus to get things done. The trick, is how and how many new leaders can forge a path to leadership positions within the National party because there seems very little chance that Labor and certainly not the Greens are going to make inroads in enough rural areas. Labor, maybe. Its really a case of the National party undergoing a transformation.

Aussie backbenchers are very fickle when it comes to backing their "leaders".  Personally I blame Turnbull for the drought.

And since we mostly taking Indian and Asian immigrants now, that is the next step. To get them to look beyond Sydney and Melbourne because it is becoming totally economically inefficient to keep expanding these cities.

Agree with everything you wrote, Matt. Re Asian-Australians moving to the country, do you think regional Australia is ready for it (I.e. locals)? I don't think either side's ready, tbh.

And, for what it's worth, I don't think the majority of Chinese/Indian Australians will ever 'get' (as in embrace), the Australian country lifestyle tbh. Not for a long, long time I mean. I think most of them are in Oz for $ and biz opportunities (which is fair enough) rather than lifestyle.

Agree with everything you wrote, Matt. Re Asian-Australians moving to the country, do you think regional Australia is ready for it (I.e. locals)? I don't think either side's ready, tbh.

The numbers of Asian immigrants are growing in the country, for the reasons outlined, its a better lifestyle and housing is half the price. Also, some professionals are being directed out this way for hospital staff etc. At my local public hospital which is quite new and pretty big by all accounts, you see quite a few Indians and to a much lesser extent, Asian nurses etc, mostly Filipino and one or two trainee Chinese doctors.

And, for what it's worth, I don't think the majority of Chinese/Indian Australians will ever 'get' (as in embrace), the Australian country lifestyle tbh. Not for a long, long time I mean. I think most of them are in Oz for $ and biz opportunities (which is fair enough) rather than lifestyle.

Indian Australians are far more likely to come to the country because as I say, they come here as skilled migrants and are directed to public services, like hospitals. They also, like Chinese Australians, are quite fond of setting up small businesses for the long haul. My father lives in town on the coast, maybe 3000 people live there and he goes to an Indian doctor that has been in Australia for many years, the local BP is owned by Indians out of two petrol stations in his town and one of the local chemists is owned by a Vietnamese dude and he is really popular in the local community because he gives all the old ones their meds lol.

Certainly I think Indian Australians are more likely than Chinese to move to the country. The Chinese seem to really prefer city life, plus again, you have to consider they are most family based immigrants, like 2/3-1 ratio of family to skilled and they might have young kids they want getting good education at good universities. That's less available in the country.

the electorate will not vote for either Dutton or Abbott - the Liberals are simply handing the next election to Labor if the go with either of these blokes....

For the record Tony Abbott won in a landslide before he got backstabbed by Malcolm Turnball who struggled to win when he called an election, its Malcom Turnball the losing guy out of these three.

This is only Round One wait until the Second Round before claiming Peter Dutton or Tony Abbott is out.

Here's some facts mainstream Australians are sick of mass migration, most of these new migrants don't value add they just simply immigrate, and consume existing resources or infrastructure - this has just been confirmed by the Government's own Productivity Commission.

Here's a future prediction the Labor party gets elected for one Term, gets thrown out and a hard core Conservative Government gets elected to clean up the mess.

I think the period of time it takes an immigrant to 'embrace' a host country depends in large part on how willing the host country is to embrace the immigrant.

That's a fair point bigyen, that's why i said i didn't think 'either side was ready'. I have met quite a few East/South Asians who had moved to the country (all work in healthcare, mostly docs & pharmacists) and most had done so 'reluctantly' (i.e. they had no/little choice as matt explained in an earlier post). They told me life was ok but they still felt like they didn't fit in.

It's definitely easier to adapt to 'fairly prosperous' regional cities/towns like Newcastle, Wollongong, Bendigo, Geelong etc than (say) Kempsey or Lismore where even locals struggle to find jobs (and where ice and other drugs/social pbms are a major issue). That was the impression i got.

I think the period of time it takes an immigrant to 'embrace' a host country depends in large part on how willing the host country is to embrace the immigrant.

I knew a Japanese girl who had lived in Canada, America and Australia. She said that the worst racism she experienced was in Australia, where someone through a drink (like McDonalds) at her from a car, and told her to "go home ch#&$k".

mainstream Australians are sick of mass migration

If this is true why the current government, which wants to maintain high immigration intake, is in power? Can you name a council or state government that are formed by an anti-immigration party?

new migrants don't value add they just simply immigrate, and consume existing resources or infrastructure - this has just been confirmed by the Government's own Productivity Commission.

What I find on The Productivity Commission's website says that "The current immigration system has generally served the interests of the broader community well. The key question is whether current policy settings are set to deliver the best outcomes for the Australian community over the longer term."

https://www.pc.gov.au/inquiries/completed/migrant-intake/report

She said that the worst racism she experienced was in Australia, where someone through a drink (like McDonalds) at her from a car, and told her to "go home ch#&$k".

I have been living in Australia for 26 years. Have I experienced racism? Yes! How many times? Once!

There are 2.5 million people in Australia. It is native to think that all are nice. It is also wrong to say that Australians are racist because of the action of some people.

For the record Tony Abbott won in a landslide before he got backstabbed by Malcolm Turnball

You do remember that happened after the backstabbings between the two labor PMs, right? So you are saying when Peter D. becomes PM. Labor will win in a landslide in the next election.

For the record Tony Abbott won in a landslide before he got backstabbed by Malcolm Turnball who struggled to win when he called an election, its Malcom Turnball the losing guy out of these three.

He took a run at the leadership because Tony Abbott was on the nose with the public. That's how he got the job. And yes he struggled to win and won by a very slim majority indeed. Which just goes to show that LNP chances at the next election are poor. In fact, up until very recently, Turnbull had a 20 point preferred PM leadership gap over Shorten. 20 points. That's huge. But all the nonsense surrounding the NEG reminded people of just how utterly hopeless the LNP are when it comes to energy policy. It is without doubt their worst area of performance and people are well and truly sick of it. Now Shorten has come up purely on the back of that. Shorten himself has done nothing to earn that improvement in fortunes.

Here's some facts mainstream Australians are sick of mass migration, most of these new migrants don't value add they just simply immigrate, and consume existing resources or infrastructure - this has just been confirmed by the Government's own Productivity Commission.

Here's a future prediction the Labor party gets elected for one Term, gets thrown out and a hard core Conservative Government gets elected to clean up the mess.

You are partly right I think imo

People want an immigration drop, from the 190.000 a year to about 100 - 150k. Around that 100k mark was the norm up until 2004-5 and substantially less as you go back over time. Its dropped to 160,000 this last year yeah?

90% of immigrants end up in Sydney and Melbourne and people do not like the consequences in terms real estate prices, which are ridiculous, congestion on roads and public transport and the fact state governments have to pay crazy sums of money for new tunnels etc which ultimately detracts from other potential spending.

People are worried about Chinese nationalists as part of the Chinese immigrant intake. There is no doubt about that. And any influence they have on national politics.

Here's a future prediction the Labor party gets elected for one Term, gets thrown out and a hard core Conservative Government gets elected to clean up the mess.

I would not be surprised to see that at all, but I also wouldn't be surprised to see Labor get two terms especially if they can find a better leader than Shorten

Not business finish yet. There will be an another challenge coming soon. Turnbull, his bad Karma is coming and he has to go. The majority of Australian voters won't vote for the Liberal Party with Malcolm Turnbull as Party leader. Last Election, Turnbull had used $ 1.7 million his own money for reelection. I don't think, he will success this time, even if he put more his money than last election for the next election. Australians voters are sick of Turnbull and his buddies Julia Bishop and Christopher Pyne.

yoshisan88Aug. 21 05:38 pm JST

If this is true why the current government, which wants to maintain high immigration intake, is in power? Can you name a council or state government that are formed by an anti-immigration party?

Both the major political parties are pro immigration which is why they have gradually been losing first party preferences in the elections even in the local byelections all the Councillors that voted to allow a Mosque be built in Bendigo were thrown out at the following local election, secondly the Governments have been cutting immigration numbers 457 visa's have been cancelled, inbound numbers have been cut there was a report in the last few years that the number of student Visa Applications have been rejected at around 15,000 per year because they were no more than immigration scams.

What I find on The Productivity Commission's website says that "The current immigration system has generally served the interests of the broader community well. The key question is whether current policy settings are set to deliver the best outcomes for the Australian community over the longer term."

That particular report was completed in 2016, there was another one made public this year regarding the special Visa program and follow through "chain migration", there were a certain class of people allowed in on special Business or Investment Visa's in which they brought in their extended families - out of 1,000 Visa's issued these people brought in 6,500 relatives in which the productivity commission found these extra people added absolutely no added value to Australia - so if that is multiplied across the board and it would be, that means at least half the people who have immigrated to Australia in the last ten years have added No Value to Australia.

AkieAug. 21  12:32 pm JST

48 votes decided a leader for Australia ? What kind of majority joke.

I think that you don't understand the difference between a presidential democracy, such as the US, and a Westminster democracy such as the UK and Australia. In the Westminster system the party with a majority of seats forms government and chooses a party leader - the Prime Minister - from amongst themselves, which they are free to change from time to time. Turnbull was elected to Parliament with 52,353 votes in his electorate of 102,782 voters.

StrangerlandAug. 21  05:14 pm JST

I think the period of time it takes an immigrant to 'embrace' a host country depends in large part on how willing the host country is to embrace the immigrant.

I knew a Japanese girl who had lived in Canada, America and Australia. She said that the worst racism she experienced was in Australia, where someone through a drink (like McDonalds) at her from a car, and told her to "go home ch#&$k".

People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. The only racism I've encountered was in Japan - and that was continual and came from the Government, as well as individuals. And whilst I'm Anglo, non-Japanese Asians find Japan racist too. There are plenty of Japanese who've migrated to Australia and they'd hardly do that if it was a racist hell-hole.

Andrew CrispAug. 21  04:01 pm JST

the electorate will not vote for either Dutton or Abbott - the Liberals are simply handing the next election to Labor if the go with either of these blokes.... 

For the record Tony Abbott won in a landslide before he got backstabbed by Malcolm Turnball who struggled to win when he called an election, its Malcom Turnball the losing guy out of these three.

Abbott didn't win in a landslide, the ALP lost in a landslide. Abbott then got replaced because if the Liberals had gone to the election with him as the party leader they'd've been annihalated.

That particular report was completed in 2016, there was another one made public this year regarding the special Visa program and follow through "chain migration", there were a certain class of people allowed in on special Business or Investment Visa's in which they brought in their extended families - out of 1,000 Visa's issued these people brought in 6,500 relatives in which the productivity commission found these extra people added absolutely no added value to Australia - so if that is multiplied across the board and it would be, that means at least half the people who have immigrated to Australia in the last ten years have added No Value to Australia.

Seems clear that specific program needs reform or to be cancelled if that is the case, but you can't confuse it with the immigration program as a whole and declare half haven't contributed. A clear majority now come in under the skilled migration program so straight away they would be making a contribution of some kind.

SakurashinmachiToday 06:42 am JST

People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. The only racism I've encountered was in Japan - and that was continual and came from the Government, as well as individuals. And whilst I'm Anglo, non-Japanese Asians find Japan racist too. There are plenty of Japanese who've migrated to Australia and they'd hardly do that if it was a racist hell-hole.

Brilliant that's exactly my experiences in Japan, I have to admit things are getting better very slowly BUT would this be happening if the internal Japanese economy was not stagnating and the thirst for foreign dollars was not there.