Nations strike climate deal with coal compromise

Science deniers do it all the time 

Can you give examples of who you class as science deniers in the field of climate science?

I've seen the term "denier" applied to people who are very knowledgeable in various fields of science but who question some of the models. They seem like intelligent people. Names that come to mind - Stephen McIntyre, Judith Curry, Roy Spencer.

P. Smith

Science deniers do it all the time by making claims such as climate change models are simplistic.

Can you list all the factors that go into every model, and can you explain how every model presents different results? Not holding my breath.

Brian Wheeway

Man is the most intelligent creature thats ever walked the planet, but were so b****y stupid in the same breath. what does it take to see the up and comming disaster thats looming?

Man is intelligent, but also a social animal that is largely informed by group think and group loyalty. Hence we see so many people fall for simplistic climate narratives based on simplistic models. It is difficult for people to go against the stream.

Man is the most intelligent creature thats ever walked the planet, but were so b****y stupid in the same breath. what does it take to see the up and comming disaster thats looming? its like standing on a railway rack with out a blind fold, and hundreds of people shouting to that person to move, yet they still stand there on the track with a speeding train hurtling towards them, they can see the train and hear it, it get closer and closer yet the still stand there, on the understanding its not going hurt, or it will stop. At what point do they move before its to late?

The population of China is 1.4 billion. World population 7.7 billion. China is 18% of the world's population. But it is producing 28% of the CO2.

A certain amount of China's CO2 production is a result of consumption in other countries. I've read it's about 12-15% of its total CO2 output. Who should bear responsibility for that part?

I still don't see why a per capita target isn't set and let countries work out how they achieve that. And adjustments could be made between countries for import-export arrangements. So say an initial target of 3 tons per person of CO2 is set worldwide (some would say it should be a net zero target, but one step at at a time). And then if one country exports heavily to another country, the exporting country can have its target raised in proportion while the importing country has its reduced. So China might have to reduce its per capita CO2 output from 7.4 tons and the USA from 15.5 tons. But if China continues to export goods to the USA, its target might be 3.1 tons while the USA's is 2.9 tons. Hmm, I wonder how the USA would react to that idea.

I'm taking my per capita numbers from the link below. I can't say how accurate they are. If someone has a better source, please let me know.

https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-per-capita/

zichi

Another COPOUT by the polluting nations. India a coal reduction, not coal out. Likely temperature increase of 1.85 degs. Not the hoped 1.5 degs.

Once again figures the correctness and significance of which nobody knows. It is all based on models, which as we know can be made to say whatever we want. It is amazing how many people have been hoodwinked into believing this.

Fact is that that the world and especially the developing world depends on coal. The way to change that is to promote the development of alternatives, not to fly to grandiose meetings and make bombastic feelgood declarations.

The hand wringing is ridiculous.CO2 levels have not been this low in 300 million years.

https://geocraft.com/WVFossils/Carboniferous_climate.html#anchor83826

What's the "carbon footprint" size of John Kerry's private yacht? You know, the one he registered in a state outside the one he lives in, in order to pay less tax? Because "do your fair share blah blah blah..." hypocrisy.

How much carbon was produced by Obama, in charge of absolutely nothing now, needing to fly in by private chartered jet? Just so he could repeatedly mispronounce the summit city's name as "Glass-Cow", and refer to Scotland as "this Emerald Isle"? lol.

What about the other thousands upon thousands of participants? How will their massive "footprints" be offset, now that it's clear all their jet-setting "summit" has produced is yet more Hot Air and Empty Promises?

Answer: by reducing YOUR living standards, YOUR spending power and comfort, while they go on maintaining their own elite-level everything, if not expanding to greedily acquire even MORE! It's what they do, but for YOU? Tsk-tsk, dirty peon polluters! Do As We Say...Definitely Not As We Do!

But hey, you have to simply laugh at the irony of the superannuated and baffled Biden wringing his hands over and over again about methane emissions...only to then let rip with some methane emissions of his own, so loud and so putrid, that even the Duchess of Cornwall "can't stop commenting about it"!

El. Oh. El. #COP Farce #Elite Fail

So Greta was right. Blah, blah and more blah.

@Zichi

Here is another fact related to CO2 ,

Oil Consumption by Country - USA ...934 gallons/per capita

Japan 481/per capita

India 51.4/per capita

Since all humans on this earth are entitled to clean air why only a handful of people have the right to pollute more than others

If all countries had their own Air space (Not in territorial terms) which coutries will have the most polluted air!

answer is evident

Even before the talks are over, nations already decided to back off from the pledge of coal burning.

What a big waste of time and energy..

I'm a realist. Platitudes from government mouthpieces solve nothing. The first step to addressing a problem is to be honest if there is a problem.

You cannot solve a problem if you can't tell the truth.

Everyone here has been in a situation in a company or culture where the truth is not spoken or people are afraid to speak the truth for fear of being ostracized and retaliated against for being "negative."

We have no leaders who speak the truth, only platitudes.

@Zichi

volume:

who creates the volume,the people their lifestyle,their consumption and wastage of natural resources ,eg plastic,

By per capita USA and Japan are the biggest polluters

they cannot just point out the volume without any relationship to the population of that country

india should never budge against these selfish demands from other much more polluting countries

Here is a thought, how about they ban themselves (climate change activist leaders) from using private jets and make all the climate conferences require to be done remotely through Zoom. So then at the very least, we can see that they actually are somewhat practicing what they preach and not just forcing the populations to change their habits and lifestyles.

@albaleo

Exactly, but a reduction in emissions has never been the primary goal of the climate agenda. Like most environmental regulation throughout history, it's mainly about vested financial interests raising the barriers to entry by banning cheaper technologies and methods of production that threaten their dominant position. It's not a coincidence that governments like Germany, Japan and France will be among the first to ban gasoline powered vehicles in the 2030s after their auto industries have invested billions into EV technology.

How long before private citizens from India and Australia are attacked physically around the world by people angry with their governments?

Feeling sorry for the little kids I see running around. The world they live in when they are in their 50s of 60s will be miserable.

Blah, blah, blah or more meaningless talk.

Myop:

Qatar comes out on top. Followed by Montenegro of all places! Little Falkland Islands come at number 14 - what the heck are they doing there?!

Does anyone really listen to Kerry? Seriously?

@Zichi

see for yourself which countries are biggest polluters

divide the figure with population and you get the real answer

it should be based on size of the country and population

https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-by-country/

Make sure to include multiple can openers in your prepper hideout, and learn how to make more.

Japan’s lobbying paid off then….

The GND evangelists in the US are anti nuclear power, hydro-electric power and coal. Relying on solar and wind is a fools errand. The Earths climate is constantly changing the COP 26 ‘get together’ has created enough hot air, methane and carbon from 400 private jets flown there too further create a crisis these talking heads are so concerned about.

The world's response to the pandemic was a forecast for COP26. Even when countries were faced with an existential threat, the science was politicized, or even worse, ignored. We knew we were going to get to this point in time back in the 70s, and the Global 2000 report published in 1980 forewarned the world, and yet even with the actionable intelligence very little was done and the issue was just kicked down the road.

Lets hope this sticks and everybody does their part!!!

Coal not only produce CO2,it produce arsenic over ling distances,where burnt Google Coal Arsenic

Thanks in part to the Russian Federation (aka USSR II).

Rather thanks to the US for ditching Europe and selling all LNG to Asia.

India has the 5th largest reserves of coal. Inspite of the fact that solar power generation is 75% cheaper in India than coal power generation, solar power is unreliable and the costs go up once battery and storage costs are added.

More than 90% Indians are connected to the grid but a growing economy means per capita consumption, though small today will go up in the next few decades. Solar power generation is growing rapidly in India but it will not be able to keep up with the demand, so India will not phase out coal.

Last but not the least, there is a huge coal lobby (referred to as the coal mafia) in the coal rich states in India which profits from illegal mining, pilferage and distribution of coal and they have enough resources to ensure that no harm comes to their revenue stream.

India is getting a lot of criticism that I don't fully understand. The numbers I can find show India's annual per capita CO2 emissions to be less than half of the world average (1.9 tons versus 4.8 tons). If all countries could achieve India's level of emissions, would we not solve or greatly reduce the CO2 problem? Instead of focusing on specific materials such as coal or gas, would it not be better to set per capita emission targets for countries.

John Kerry、is this some kind of sick joke? Seriously, this is laughable if it was indeed as isn't serious as we are daily reminded.

And fuel/power shortages in Europe.

Thanks in part to the Russian Federation (aka USSR II).

“Our fragile planet is hanging by a thread,”

Utter nonsense. Prepare for a colder-than-average winter. And fuel/power shortages in Europe.

India a coal reduction, not coal out.

Indian citizens are paying a price for poor air quality, pollution in some parts so bad schools and offices are being closed.

https://www.indiatoday.in/cities/delhi/story/delhi-govt-schools-offices-closed-construction-air-pollution-cm-kejriwal-1876393-2021-11-13

They achieved nothing. These gabfests are really getting beyond useless. All the bureaucrats who attended and presented their governments' positions on the issue have no real power. They were there only as window dressing. I've been at enough of those things to be critical. They're only junkets for the upper echelons. Been there, done that.

Retired now, so I really don't care anymore.

I don't care how or how much talking it needs to take... but I'm a 29-year-old man. In 2050, I will be only 58, I don't want my kids (in case I have someday) or anyone to suffer from climate change effects. I celebrate every single deal in climate regards.

Selfishness of the powerful must be set aside for the vulnerable.

"Please embrace this text so that we bring hope to the hearts of our children and grandchildren.”

I celebrate this part (quote) of the article.