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Senate seeks solution to open U.S. government; Trump insists on wall

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By Richard Cowan, Susan Cornwell and Steve Holland

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134 Comments

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A compromise is only possible when there are more than two options. There can be no compromise with an ultimatum. It’s literally impossible as there can me no meeting in the middle when there are only two options.

Trump created this ultimatum, and it’s two options; wall or nothing.

The democrats cannot comprise, as compromise cannot exist with Trump’s ultimatum shutdown.

You are asking where something that can’t exist is. Using a little logic you’d see how silly that question is.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

The Dems have no policy besides "oppose anything Trump does." Ever heard of compromise? If you think that will win you the election in 2020 you are sadly mistaken.

From CNN:

Both measures fell short of the 60 votes they would have needed to move forward in the upper chamber. The final vote tally for the GOP backed proposal was 50-47. The tally for the Democratic proposal was 52-44. Both would have needed 60 votes to advance.

So it seems that not only do the Democrats have a policy, but a policy that's more popular and passes by a larger margin than the GOP policy.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

what was their proposal again to secure and fund the wall?

It’s to not fund the wall. They have chosen the side of the ultimatum that trump forced them into with his shutdown.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

This is what has to happen. TSA workers should all walk off the job and shut the airports down. Once an airport is shutdown, and republican senators can't fly to their vacation homes, things will change.

8 ( +11 / -3 )

And the Marxist Brown shirts party of Pelosi, what was their proposal again to secure and fund the wall?

You've been repeatedly told the answers to your questions and you have repeatedly ignored those answers.

No, he ran on a campaign to build a wall, if the Democrats worry about democracy then maybe they shouldn’t usurp it.

He ran on a campaign to build a wall paid for by Mexico. Let's have a modicum of intellectual honesty today, please.

Acting as the opposition party is not usurping democracy.

8 ( +8 / -0 )

The Dems have no policy besides "oppose anything Trump does." Ever heard of compromise? If you think that will win you the election in 2020 you are sadly mistaken.

Stranger has explained the logic failure in the above a number of times now. Trump created a binary situation - money for the wall or nothing. In such a situation, there is zero room for compromise. Trump is the one who won't compromise.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

Trump and his GOP enablers in the Senate have no policies besides support everything Herr Diktator is told to do by Ann Coulter etal.

Trump ran on a platform of bringing US democracy down, and in that regards he's been successful.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

Posting a list of Trump's "accomplishments" listed on Trump's webpage.

I’d probably be more inclined to open one of his links to Hannity for any truth.

Partisanship is corrosive.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

 Sure, some Senior Republicans broke rank because they want a compromise, but they are not the President,

Even Bass knows that it's Trunp who isn't compromising.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Uh-huh...yeah, Plastic....lol

The link you posted says nothing to refute the facts I stated. I repeat: the FACT is that the vast majority of drug traffic does not pass through unprotected border areas (areas where Trump wants a wall).

My guess is you’re a sloppy reader and the finer points of that simple sentence slipped past your radar.

Uh-huh and lol all you want. Doesn’t change the facts.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Sorry, but you don’t know what I have seen or dealt with in my life.

Except for allthe personal anecdotes you use to try and support your positions. Through those, we have learned a lot about your alleged experiences.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

But as you said and as most of us supporters want is that he keeps his “campaign promise of building a wall.”

So you're cool with him lying to you sometimes. Got it.

So you are right, let’s build the wall regardless of who pays for it

Its not possible for me to be correct on this point as I never once said or implied a wall should be built.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Wolf:. President Trump has offered compromises - Pelosi has refused outright to even discuss their differences.

Whu do you come here and say those things? You all know we watched Trump take credit for the shutdown. We all know Trump backed out of the deal. And we all know Trump made additional demands and offered nothing in return.

Are you hoping some new visitor comes, doesn't know anything about the story, and you get some kind of credit for spreading disinformation?

Are you working to create a false reality in your mind where you can pretend all of your points are accurate?

Genuinely curious.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

@bass

but they are not the President, so it’s him and his policies that are on the line, not the Congress at this stage, this was Trump’s main campaign promise and I respect him more for not giving in.

So we should have a dictatorship?

Why should the country, the safety of the country and the constant flow of drugs, coyotes and illegals be allowed to enter so freely into our country?

They don't, its called border security. You are not an expert, neither am I, but the experts say the wall won't work.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

The total lack of empathy from the Trump bridge is appalling.

Ross looks like another version of Giuliani , a muddlehead who can't put together a rational thought.

Then there's Lara Trump who thinks people going hungry, losing their homes and not being able to afford medical treatment is a 'little pain'.

And who can forget Kevin Hasset who thinks the shutdown is a paid holiday for the federal employees.

The GOP is looking more and more like a pre-French revolution monarchy, totally out of touch with the common people.

Time for a revolution?

5 ( +5 / -0 )

@ulysses

Time for a revolution?

Nah, Trump is already done for. No need for that, 2020 is coming. The GOP is getting ready to hang him out to dry. If he delcares a national emergency, he's out of their books. If he doesn't open the government soon, the economy and employment he's worked for goes crashing down and the GOP can kiss the next election goodbye.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Bass for Funk,

Maybe you don't know, but it is Congress's job to apportion money and the executive's job is to see that that money is effectively spent in the way that Congress intended it as written in the law. In America the president's veto power gives him the power to sway how the money is apportioned, but to demand money is not really in the job description.

If Trump wants money for the wall, let him build a coalition that will pass a regular bill that funds the needed money. Let him keep making the case under normal Congressional procedure, not try to attach it to the government funding bill. He's hostage taking.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

@bas4 I’m talking about robbing Paul to give to Peter. I’m talking about stealing money from hard working Americans and giving it to others, thinking there nothing wrong with income redistribution.

See if I understand you correctly: Let's say Paul is a taxpayer in Omaha working for a local garage, and Peter is a 'journalist' working for the US military in Kyushu, that would be socialism?

5 ( +5 / -0 )

The Trumpsters here are in absolute meltdown - their Dear Leader has shown to be an impotent clown who can't accomplish anything. Their comments here offer weak "but what about" dodges or just completely ignore the issue. 

Trump shuts down the government after being humiliated by the far right, then brags he "owns the mantle" and is "proud to shut it down" - as people go hungry, air and sea ports are insecure, the food supply is less safe, and all other manner of threats.

To make things even worse - his far right cronies are outright mocking him - calling him a traitor, a supporter of amnesty, "Jeb"...  What's absolutely hilarious is the attempts by some Trumpsters here to label this humiliation as "constructive criticism" - sure, I bet Donnie just loves to get insulted and called names.

Then Nancy shows him who's the boss, and banishes him from the well of Congress - and he has to bow down and accept it.

Things are real bad in Trump World - and as Cohen gets set to testify before Congress, it will only get worse...

5 ( +6 / -1 )

@bass

The data provided in the link shows apprehension numbers, or in other words, how well the current border security (real security) is working without the wall. Thanks. And the majority are at ports of entry.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

bass4funkToday 12:34 pm JST

Well, I’ll drink to that even if it is lunchtime.

The way you keep throwing in references to booze it sounds like you drink all the time. Which could explain a lot about the stuff you write.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

@bass

we don’t agree. Btw, trump doesn’t read this thread. You don’t need to tell him to “hold the line”.

if we agreed upon anything, it’s that border security and America’s immigration policies need to be adjusted. Since you’ve never dealt with uscis you wouldn’t know, but they are not the most enjoyable lot to deal with. A wall isn’t going to help that, and it’s also not going to curb immigration. The curb on illegal immigration that it would have is not even worth mentioning, nor is it worth spending upwards of 25 billion. It won’t get built during Trumps presidency, it won’t get built period.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Limbaugh and Ingraham blasted Trump , negative coverage on Fox, Republicans Senators voted against Trump motions in the senate.

Boy o Boy, the Trump sandcastle walls are crumbling.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

As expected by anyone with any sort of wit (i.e. anyone who doesn’t slavishly adore Trump) the fatso President folded like a napkin. Well done Nancy!

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Billionaire US Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross didn't help his cause neither

https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/423026-backlash-as-billionaire-cabinet-member-dismisses-us-shutdown-hardship

Wilbur Ross shrugged off the impact of the shutdown -- now in its 34th day -- saying workers should just take out loans to cover their expenses.

Asked by CNBC television whether he was aware that some federal workers were getting food from homeless shelters, Ross said: "Well I know they are and I don´t really quite understand why."

Noting that the 800,000 federal workers currently working without pay will eventually receive their paychecks, Ross said "there´s no real reason why they shouldn´t be able to get a loan against it.

But for people living paycheck to paycheck, lenders don't easily give loans to them - or otherwise, the loans come with high interest rates

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Not only the President is to blame. The failed GOP have demonstrated without any doubt a complete lack care or concern for the country for which they swore an oath to the Constitution. Never should they again be in any position of power and at every opportunity anyone who associates themselves with this party must be voted out.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Six Republican senators voted in favor of the Dem-sponsored bill. Events are spinning out of Trump's control. His Commerce Secretary's, Wilbur Ross, recent "let them eat cake"gaffe will not help. Look for further GOP defections. Recent discussion regards the long-term damage Trump has inflicted on the GOP brand. If you're a young lawmaker, do you want to board this bandwagon?

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Id support more spending on border security, just not an ineffective vanity project.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

@wolfpack

The American people opposed Obamacare too and the Dems jammed it through Congress without any support at all from the opposition party.

Regardless of my opinion of Obamacare, it got through because it got the votes in Senate. That's all. With the wall, we already knew how unpopular with the majority of Americans it was and now we can see that it is unpopular with congress as well.

Right, so we can conclude that you're against Senate, House, the entire EC, "whatever you wanna call it", unless it gets Trump elected, or what the GOP wants. If not, you argue that the popular vote is more important. But shame on the Dems for doing it with Hillary.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

 And no, it wasn’t because of Russia, it was “the economy, stupid.” He promised a wall, and unlike every other presidential candidate that gives up on his campaign promises, Trump is trying to actually fulfill one. Novel idea, right?

This comment has about as much thought put into it as Trump gave to the dems compromise plan. Zero. Makes no sense, and I'm not sure why you bothered to try using that quote...

Every president has kept and dropped promises. Trump has done both as well.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

..or Pelosi that couldn’t care one iota what happens along the border or people that were greatly impacted by illegals.

oh you mean like the 800000 federal workers who cant even afford to feed their kids or pay their home loans and bills becuase Trump is holding them hostage to get his vanity wall.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Which one? The Democrat or the Republican One?

which Democrat dictatorship is that, last two Dem POTUS had the popular support of the American people. Last two Republican POTUS didnt.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

 Trump is trying and at least not bolting from Washington

He has nowhere to go. If he tries to go play golf at mar a lago he'll be destroyed.

Dems are starting to feel pressure and that’s slowly growing for the Dems to stop this

Not what polls say, not what today's vote says either...lol

I hope Nancy keeps on screwing up like this

What does "This" mean? lol You mean, making Trump eat his own shutdown and stop him from getting his way over the American way?

it makes it that much easier to retake the House back if they keep it up like this.*

They won't retake it, but you can dream. Too bad for you, you're lovely state of California is turning more blue by the day. Hope that makes you happy.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

There is only one reason why Trump flipped and now blames the dems for the shutdown and not himself, because he knows he's lost the support of a majority. The people don't back him, and the majority of congress doesn't either. Taking the heat like he said he would, that would be political suicide. Too bad he's already done that, he didn't need to say anything in the first place. He is funked.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

bass4funkToday 11:27 am JST

...hard working Americans...

You mean rich, corrupt Americans who continually pay themselves hundreds of times more than what the average employee gets and pay politicians to be their lackeys who let them keep on doing it.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Cohen gets set to testify before Congress, it will only get worse...

Cohen can't testify because Trum...the truth threatened him not to.

He's just been subpoenaed. Let's see what he's got to say!

4 ( +4 / -0 )

The Democrats' idea of border security would be some kids flying around some drones with little flashing red and blue lights on them.

First I've heard of that...And Trump's is what? Build a wall and take photos with it while they fly over, go under, take a boat, go through ports of entry, etc,etc,etc.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

the constant flow of drugs, coyotes and illegals

Some facts to keep things in perspective. First, the vast majority of drug traffic does not enter through unprotected border areas. Second, illegal immigration (including illegal border crossings, which are a minority of cases) has dramatically decreased in the past 15 years or so. In fact, there is a net migration outflow across the U.S.-Mexico border. Third, there is no real evidence that undocumented migrants commit crimes (other than visa violations) at a higher rate than anyone else. Fourth, there are more effective and cost-efficient methods of securing the border than a wall.

So why at this point is there an insistence on immediately constructing a border wall that would be costly, ineffective, and take 10 years to build? Why shut down government and threaten a national emergency at this point?

Because during the campaign Roger Stone got Trump to use "the wall" as a campaign strategy, and it worked, particularly with low-information voters who were looking to blame Mexicans for their own problems.

From the beginning it's been nothing but political theater, designed to prop up a highly unpopular fraudster president who depends solely on the support of his zealous base. It's rule by minority mob. Trump and his supporters believe that his 2016 election win gives the president full rights to get whatever he wants, and anybody who opposes Trump's agenda is out of line. It's pretty evident that Trumpsters have a pretty odd view of what democratic rule means, as evidenced by our resident journalist's comment below:

[Trump] ran on a campaign to build a wall, if the Democrats worry about democracy then maybe they shouldn’t usurp it.

Ergo, congress not giving the president what he wants is subversion of democracy. Bizarre.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

The Trumpsters here are in absolute meltdown - their Dear Leader has shown to be an impotent clown who can't accomplish anything. Their comments here offer weak "but what about" dodges or just completely ignore the issue. 

Where has he shown that? He’s given multiple chances, tried to compromise on some issues, refuses to budge on the wall, given Democrats incentives, they won’t do anything and if I see another photo of Menendez without his shirt I’m going to hurl.

Impotent... Two years and both houses and no wall.  Says Mexico will pay for the wall and no wall. Thinks he's worlds greatest deal-maker and no wall. He should change his tagline from "No collusion, no collusion" to "No wall, no wall"...

Trump shuts down the government after being humiliated by the far right, then brags he "owns the mantle" and is "proud to shut it down" - as people go hungry, air and sea ports are insecure, the food supply is less safe, and all other manner of threats.

Yes, they go hungry and the innocent residents along the border have to continue to suffer and we will be subjected to more Democrat abuse. They say, we want border security, but you don’t see it, but they expect you to believe them. This is a real Calvin and Hobbes moment.

Once again, this situation is not a cartoon, no matter how much you and Wilbur Ross say so...

To make things even worse - his far right cronies are outright mocking him - calling him a traitor, a supporter of amnesty, "Jeb"...  What's absolutely hilarious is the attempts by some Trumpsters here to label this humiliation as "constructive criticism" - sure, I bet Donnie just loves to get insulted and called names.

What? I guess in some imaginary world and in the depths of the liberal mind they want to see Trump squirm, but that’s not happening, he’s resolute, unwavering and unrelenting, so let Nancy do all the work, if she doesn’t and if she wants her liberal mostly union government worker base to suffer, go right ahead Nancy. That 34% disapproval from the incoming new congress is a slow ticking time bomb.

See above WRT "but what abouts" and dodges... When you bring up the Republican civil war and Coulter mocking and seriously dissing Trump, they change the subject every time.  Calling Trump "Jeb" is as humiliating as calling him "Hillary"...

Then Nancy shows him who's the boss, and banishes him from the well of Congress - and he has to bow down and accept it.

Things are real bad in Trump World - and as Cohen gets set to testify before Congress, it will only get worse...

Ok, so Nancy like a little kid shows him who’s boss?? Trump can do the SOTU somewhere else, that’s not going to stop him or keep him from his objective. Now real humiliation is when Pelosi tried to get on that plane and was told No.

Pelosi "threw him out of the House" - just like a parent treats a spoiled 2 year old - which is a pretty accurate analogy...

Absolutely priceless.

"Jeb" - absolutely agree - priceless

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Now real humiliation is when Pelosi tried to get on that plane and was told No. 

Absolutely priceless.

It's so funny when little kids wreck stuff when they don't get their way.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

No, it’s worse actually,

No, it actually isn't. You've been repeatedly provided the evidence to the contrary to your claim. That means you are intentionally misrepresenting reality. There is a word that perfectly describes people that do this.

but I forget we shouldn’t listen to the border agents, I mean, what do they know, they just patrol and catch these people, but I will say this, you are absolutely right when it comes to Mexicans, we do see a drop off, but when it comes to people from Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala, we see an increase in border crossings, but I guess caravans to liberals seem like party buses on their way to Disneyland.

It doesn't matter what nationality makes up the largest parts of a shrinking whole, what matters is its shrinking. Please stop trying to deflect away from reality just to feed your fear-driven, hyper-partisan diatribes.

No, because of the reasons I have outlined. Nothing manufactured, talk to officer Singh’s family or Kate Steinle. The border is a sieve and we see it for what it is and not for what we would like it to be.

You haven't outlined anything that is true. My question still stands: Why weren't you guys so scared in 2013 when you killed two immigration reform bills?

This nonsense started when your master Dumpster Fire Donny snapped his fingers. You all started frothing at the mouth and spewing incorrect information. That's called manufactured fear.

It's not to late to salvage what's left of your integrity and dignity. All you have to do is accept reality.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Trump caved. Master negotiator my aching arse! Har! SMh. ROFl. Kudos. Unicornverse. Lol. Oh my . . .

4 ( +4 / -0 )

@joeinmoskyoThe U.S. Senate, where democracy goes to die

The legislative branch was established by the the US Constitution. Curious that ultrarightists in the US and 'abroad' continue to attack basic elements of US democracy. It's still a minority of Americans who want a Russian style form of executive uber alles. Most Americans understand the horrors brought about by dictators like Hitler, Mussolini and Stalin.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Immediately following the failed effort, Democratic and Republican senators spoke on the Senate floor and urged quick passage of a three-week, stopgap funding bill to end the partial government shutdown for now. Some Democrats pledged to support more border security funding than was included in the Democrats’ bill that was blocked in the Senate on Thursday.

But the White House issued a warning. A three-week funding bill would "only work if there is a large down payment on the wall," spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said in a statement.

That pretty much says it all, doesn't it.  Open the government back up now to ensure security of our air and sea ports, put back to work those sworn to protect us, and allow government workers to provide for their families - BUT - the White House says, nah, let's keep it going...

The Trump Shutdown - Donnie's Dilemma - he's owns it lock, stock, and barrel - and the American people know it.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/poll-shows-a-vast-majority-of-americans-blame-president-trump-for-shutdown-2019-01-24

3 ( +4 / -1 )

The Dems have no policy besides "oppose anything Trump does." Ever heard of compromise?

funny thats exactly what Obama had to contend with the Republicans,

If you think that will win you the election in 2020 you are sadly mistaken.

they said that about the midterms also, it was a slaughter, history has shown its far more difficult to retain seats than lose them in the senate especially if there is a slowing economy, longer the shutdown goes the higher the risk to the economy. Many more Republican senate seats are up for reelection in 2020 than Democrat.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@bass

They are not American people? I mean the US citizens living along the border, they don’t matter?

Of course they are the American people, of course they matter...but you are saying that they are the only one's that should have a say in what happens to every American citizens tax dollars. So are the people in Maine not American people? Do they not matter. Only Bass matters in his wild imagination of how the government should work.

Funny, not according to the engineers, border security (I mean they would know since...that’s kind of their job.) so I trust them over any political hack.

DHS is lead by Trump's team, of course they are going to say it works. ANY other engineers will show you the flaws in this idea. A child can show you the problems with it, it doesn't take a rocket scientist. Political hack...right...

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@theFu

Trump offered 2 compromises for two different groups of people in the USA

Right, but NO compromise on his wall. That's what the original compromise was about...

The dems offered real compromises on the wall. Trump dismissed every one them.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Cohen gets set to testify before Congress, it will only get worse...

Cohen can't testify because Trum...the truth threatened him not to.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The Democrats remain more worried about illegals than U.S. citizens

Isn't that the whole idea, being worried about illegal immigrants and what to do with them and how to effectively stop them? The only people that say the wall will work is the DHS, who are instructed to say so by Donald Trump.

she's having issues reading the teleprompter.

Are you upset about the way Trump is made fun of every time he tries to read his speech or claims he "read" a book?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

And which the Democrats insist on obstructing in order to deny Trump another promise kept. Shameful

Trump already broke that promise. He said Mexico would pay for it.

One of the many problems with partisanship is that you allow your side to get away with things which are indefensible. The only way to keep compulsive liars and scammers like Trump in line is to hold their feet to the fire. Both sides should be slamming him for his idiotic pronouncements on the campaign trail. Remember his idea to throw all illegal immigrants out?

Trump scammed voters. He’s not the first to do it, but you can’t allow politicians to get away with this.

Stop the partisanship and smack lying politicians into line from both sides.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

There is still no connection between an open or closed government and the ability to make a deal on this. What changes to solve this if the government reopens? What can’t be agreed upon because it’s closed?

If there's no difference, then why not open it, and therby make our country much more safer (sea/air ports, FDA, air traffic controllers, FBI, etc.)

Or is it the Repubs could care less about securing our country from all manner of threats, as long as "Jeb" get's his trophy wall?

Given they had two years to build it and didn't, I think we know the answer...

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The cognitive dissonance in the brains of Conservatives and Trumpsters here is going off the scale...

Two of their conservative "icons" are locked in a war with one another...and they don't know what to do...

Trump puts out a proposal on the wall to defer DACA deportations - which far right crazies immeditaley label "amnesty"...oh my...

Then Coulter offers him some "constructive criticism" - "Donnie, you're no better than Jeb" - that's a bigger diss than Chuck or Nancy have ever done...

Want to watch a Trump supporters brain lock? Just ask them who's right - Icon Trump or Icon Ann?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

There is still no connection between an open or closed government and the ability to make a deal on this. What changes to solve this if the government reopens? What can’t be agreed upon because it’s closed?

Hmm, then Trump should lift his finger on the government. It's his call. 3 words, "government is open". Both parties have asked him, "why can't we look for a solution with the government re-opened?". The answer is simple, Trump needs leverage, and Trump needs to keep the far right on his side, Trump needs to try directing anger towards the dems from furloughed workers. Everything going on right now, could easily happen with government open. It's partial government shutdown, and partial Trump's 2020 re-election campaign, and it sucks.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

National Security and Immigration is NOT a political ideology or human rights or even a democracy issue

Actually, it is an issue involving political ideology, human rights, and democracy. Otherwise, the government wouldn't be shutdown, Trump wouldn't be calling it a "human rights crisis", and both parties would agree on what to do. SO, you're wrong...

The wall is a matter of necessity and effectiveness issue which dictates need. (Proven and requested by personnel at the actual physical border.)

Equal evidence shows its not needed, proven by personnel at the border and their capability to apprehend illegals both at ports of entry and unguarded areas.

The amount is a "cost" issue based upon "need" and "actual cost". (in this case was outlined by the request for funding.)

The only cost that's been outlined is for a small "down payment" on the wall, which Trump still says Mexico is paying for (they aren't).

Should I stop here? nah

The funding is a "priority" issue on the part of the Executive branch (President) and Legislative branch (Congress).

If only it were, Trump would have begun this 2 years ago. It's a priority now, that he's being shunned by the far right and losing base before the re-election.

Could go on and on, but it's not worth it...

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Blacklabel: Because as soon as the government is reopened Dems will pretend this topic doesn’t even exist. Only way to make them take action.

Ah, so putting people out of work is leverage for Trump.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

or he declares a national emergency and orders the military to do what our border patrol and I don't care what the fake polls say, the majority of Americans want done.

Why doesn’t he just declare martial law? That’s what fake leaders do. They make up emergencies and play tough guy.

BTW, the majority of Americans don’t want a wall. You’ve got no basis for your assertion that they do.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Nah. The Dems already put a bill on Trump's desk to fund it but he was going to lose his hostages so he refused.

Still the Trump shutdown, and people still agree by a wide margin.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Bass:. Anger goes both ways and the polls are slowly going up on the Democrats side

And if the polls suddenly switch and people start to blame the Dems, what does that do for you?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Reports are that an 'agreement' for a 3 week CR with NO WALL MONEY is no being agreed to.

In other words, Trump folded like the cheap suit he is.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Trump in a speech from the Rose Garden has surrendered to the Democrats. The US government will reopen without the wall. fufufu

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Yes, it is, unless you think the caravan and people coming in by the thousands are trying to sneak a Trip in Disneyland.

You've been repeatedly provided the evidence to the contrary to your claim. 

None of this changes the fact that border crossings south to north have been decreasing for 15 years and are now lass than crossings north to south. Keep thrashing about trying to convince everyone of something that does not reflect reality; it's entertaining to watch.

If Mexico and Tijuana thinks this is crisis and NOT manufactured and they are in an uproar, I think I’ll take their word over ANY liberal in the US,

Uh, okay. They were speaking specifically about the caravans that have you conservatives scared out of your minds, not border crossings in general. Nice attempt to spin that.

now spin it to me that Mexicans and the mayor of TJ is a racist, givr it your best shot, please.

Uh . . . I haven't once mentioned how racists conservatives are, so I'm not sure where you got that from. Try staying on point just once.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Trump concedes, agrees to short-term spending bill with no wall, to end longest government shutdown in US history

Long lines and chaos at TSA a major factor

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I'm beginning to think Trump might just be pushing Pelosi's buttons at this point, just to see how far he can get her to go, how big of a mess he can get her to make on her own side, then he can give in and end the shut down. I mean, we all know Trump has no problem sticking his fingers in his ears while everything falls apart around him.

His next tweet would be "I gave up on the wall because I care more about Americans getting back to work than the Democrats do!". He can just keep blaming the left for the wall not happening. He could even use it as a campaign promise for 2020... Even if it never happens, his supporters will eat it up.

A lot of Americans have short memories, especially ones who need their paychecks. Holding out might backfire on Pelosi when they see Trump is the one who got their paychecks started again, regardless of who got them stopped in the first place.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

It should be pretty clear from the votes, its a pretty even divide but the majority lies with "NO WALL". Why should the majority of American's be asked to pay for a wall that only Trump and the minority want? The vote did nothing but solidify the Democrats push for real border security over Trump's legacy project.

If you support the EC and Trump's election, you would also support the idea that America doesn't want the wall because that's where the majority of votes ended up in congress today. You silly people arguing against the popular vote, that the EC is more important, until now when it shows a majority toward what you don't like. And a popular vote shunned the wall as well.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

The U.S. Senate, where democracy goes to die. Why is it again that Wyoming (pop. 568,125) has the same amount of say as California (40,017,007)?

Oooh boy, this may blow your mind but once upon a time state governors selected state senators in lieu of elections. The role of the senator is to represent the wishes of their home state.

Now, seats within the House of Representatives are distributed based off of state population with the intention of representing the wishes of their districts.   

The two chambers exists as a check and balance on each other and the Legislative Branch as a whole serves as a check and balance on the Executive.

If we could abolish party politics and professional politicians then this is the best system of gov't in the world. IMHO

2 ( +2 / -0 )

@bass

Not really. If you live in Maine and never lived along the border, it’s stupid to even put yourself in a situation you have never been in. 

So it's not about the American people or the country, it's only all about the people on the border? But the tax payers in Maine need to pay for it and shouldn't be allowed to vote on it?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Dango bongToday 07:22 am JST

The Dems have no policy besides "oppose anything Trump does."

Then it's lucky for them that everything Trump does is stupid, isn't it?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

To say the least, but he (Trump) is weird and a liar betraying everyone!

He said (and it can be found on the Internet) that Mexico WILL pay for the wall.

NO, Mexico won't pay for it! And to shout down the government just because he doesn't get what he wants ..... childish!

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Trump can do the SOTU somewhere else

He can't do the SOTU somewhere else because he doesn't want to. Pelosi told him to kneel, he knelt. Get over it.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

is, there is a serious problem and 

It isn't as bad now as it was 15 years ago, and its only improving without a senseless wall in which you people are emotionally invested.

You guys scuttled two immigration reform bills in 2013. You weren't screaming about nonexistent hordes then, so what changed? Manufactured fear to feed emotion-driven individuals.

Mission accomplished.

i was thinking the same about you as well

I know you are, but what am I? Seriously? You just couldn't let it ride? Mature and sophisticated.

You are learning now, Plastic! Lol

You literally just admitted you don't care what the facts are. ROFL! Kudos! Oh my . . . Lol. Smh. Smfh. Unicornverse. HAR!!!

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Bass: The talking points from the Democrats is not going to sway anyone.

Hey, we got people to blame Trump and the GOP for the shutdown, so someone is listening. :)

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Two votes just failed in the US Senate - the Trump-backed bill failed with 50 votes; the Democrat-backed bill failed with 52 votes

Interestingly, despite the Senate being controlled by the Republicans, the Democrat-backed bill got 2 more votes than the Trump-backed bill

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Bass: And the Democrats spit in the faces of those that have died because of their unwillingness to take aggressive action on the Southern border to seal it.

And?

Superlib: And if the polls suddenly switch and people start to blame the Dems, what does that do for you?

Bass: Hopefully wake them the heck up.

So the polls go against them and they wake up. Are you expecting them to change their position?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The U.S. Senate, where democracy goes to die. Why is it again that Wyoming (pop. 568,125) has the same amount of say as California (40,017,007)?

Because the US is not a democracy. Read up on what a constitutional republic is and your question will be answered.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

The legislative branch was established by the the US Constitution.

You probably don't know this, so I'll explain: the U.S. Constitution provides for modification through the amendment process. Currently, there have been 27 such modifications.

Sure, let's just get rid of the legislative branch. Just give all the power to the president. Who needs those pesky other houses to keep him in check. I mean, it works for China right?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Sure, let's just get rid of the legislative branch.

Why would you do that?

I don't know, it was your suggestion.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@bas4 If the socialists keep going on this radical path, we may have to.

Re 'socialism', would you include the corporate farms (especially those in areas that have powerful politicians) getting billions of dollars in subsidies?

How about the contracts the US feds have

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_100_Contractors_of_the_U.S._federal_government

with the above 'private' corporations?

How about all the contractors here in Japan? How many working at bases in Okinawa, Yokota, Kyushu (Sasebo), etc., including those doing journalistic jobs, would you include as being part of a socialistic system?

Under your definition of socialism if you include the big war industries making billions off the federal government, it's clear no revolution is needed - they're already running the country.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Vernon WattsToday 11:45 am JST

Walls work!! Just ask old East Germans, the Israelis and the Pope!!!

The problem with emulating what the East Germans used to is that anything to do with the DDR is generally considered nowadays to be, well, kind of bad. And you might not have noticed that the walls used in Israel and the Vatican don't need to be quite as big or expensive as the one Trump wants along the US border. As for walls working, how about Constantinople in 1204 and 1453?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Serrano:

Both republicans and democrats give money to foreign countries. Its bipartisan.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

January 25, 2019 -- Trump Cave-In Day! That is how badly he wants to do his State of the Disunion speech!

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Trump caved -

Of course he did; he was on the losing side of this from the moment he told us he'd be proud to do it.

makes America an open borders state

Not even close, but if it makes you feel good after the humiliation of Trump, be my guest. Nobody likes to lose.

. Re-election chances are over.

Oh, they seemed to be over about two months into his flaming clown car of an administration. That said, never underestimate the power of stupidity.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The U.S. Senate, where democracy goes to die. Why is it again that Wyoming (pop. 568,125) has the same amount of say as California (40,017,007)?

If the Senate were the entirety of the legislative branch of government you might have a good point. As I am sure you know the House side of the bicameral Congress provides California an overwhelming voice in the legislative process over Wyoming.

People are forever mistakening the US for a pure democracy- it is not. It is a Constitutional Republic which seeks to protect basic rights from the passions of the majority rules mindset. This fact has been critical in overcoming blatant violations of human rights in the past - overturning the Dred Scott decision, ending slavery, and Jim Crow. Theoretically it is possible to overcome the protections on the rights of the minority via a Constitutional amendment - but amendments require way more than a simple majority.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

And a popular vote shunned the wall as well.

The American people opposed Obamacare too and the Dems jammed it through Congress without any support at all from the opposition party. Just saying..,,

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Why complain about senators from Wyoming when there are senators in Rhode Island, Connecticut and Delaware? The tiny states demanded a Senate since their number of House members was limited by geography limits.

Trump offered 2 compromises for two different groups of people in the USA. One group illegally there and another group invited for a period of time, but they were supposed to leave after a few years and haven't. These were real offers that the Dems rejected.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I am totally convinced that USA would do much-much better without this stupid government. Trump, please fully shutdown your useless government and go to Mar-a-Lago. Please never return. Please keep the government forever shutdown.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

oops missing word... above. funny words disappear in mid sentence... did spell check but...

"It is not about the type of security needed" (the "about" was missing in that sentence above)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The wall should be a giant supermagnet that pulls all knives and guns from the people coming in. Innocent people, please remember to remove any jewelry.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Plasticmonkey:

The American card is "national security." Try it, its fun.

A: you can't hold me without arrest warrant

B: national security

C: I'm a journalist, I have a right to show the world American abuses

B: national security

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The shutdown doesn’t worry me. What worries me is that millions of Americans can’t see the big picture. What we are watching on live tv is the dismantling of our government. It’s never been about destroying Trump. It’s about destroying the executive power and leaving two powers behind... the judicial and legislative branches. They wanted Trump to win so they could make a mockery of him and eradicate his position. So stop arguing about a silly wall and start discussing the “real” issue... what happens to America when we have a weak President, a power filled Congress, and legislative branch that is in bed with Congress? What happens to the checks and balances? Where does that leave “us”?

Do you get it now?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

There is still no connection between an open or closed government and the ability to make a deal on this. What changes to solve this if the government reopens? What can’t be agreed upon because it’s closed?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Sure, let's just get rid of the legislative branch.

Why would you do that?

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Nah. The Dems already put a bill on Trump's desk to fund it but he was going to lose his hostages so he refused.

And the Democrats spit in the faces of those that have died because of their unwillingness to take aggressive action on the Southern border to seal it.

Still the Trump shutdown, and people still agree by a wide margin.

At the same time, a slow anger is growing on mostly the government Democrat voters wanting the people they voted for to end this.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer had signed and supported for to build walls at the Southern border with Mexico, but now he opposed it with Nancy Pelosi.

Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer was an opportunist fake politician and he has no integrity to keep his agreement for to fund and build the border wall.

Nancy Pelosi was kept talking about border wall is immorality, but she seems to be starving 800,000 Federal employees and their family was no problem for her.

Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer are opposing the border wall because it will be built under President administration. If a Democrat President has planned to build border wall and then there will be no immorality issue with building border wall for Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer. They are fake anyway.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

The legislative branch was established by the the US Constitution.

You probably don't know this, so I'll explain: the U.S. Constitution provides for modification through the amendment process. Currently, there have been 27 such modifications.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Walls work!! Just ask old East Germans, the Israelis and the Pope!!!

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

The Trumpsters here are in absolute meltdown - their Dear Leader has shown to be an impotent clown who can't accomplish anything. Their comments here offer weak "but what about" dodges or just completely ignore the issue. 

Where has he shown that? He’s given multiple chances, tried to compromise on some issues, refuses to budge on the wall, given Democrats incentives, they won’t do anything and if I see another photo of Menendez without his shirt I’m going to hurl.

Trump shuts down the government after being humiliated by the far right, then brags he "owns the mantle" and is "proud to shut it down" - as people go hungry, air and sea ports are insecure, the food supply is less safe, and all other manner of threats.

Yes, they go hungry and the innocent residents along the border have to continue to suffer and we will be subjected to more Democrat abuse. They say, we want border security, but you don’t see it, but they expect you to believe them. This is a real Calvin and Hobbes moment.

To make things even worse - his far right cronies are outright mocking him - calling him a traitor, a supporter of amnesty, "Jeb"...  What's absolutely hilarious is the attempts by some Trumpsters here to label this humiliation as "constructive criticism" - sure, I bet Donnie just loves to get insulted and called names.

What? I guess in some imaginary world and in the depths of the liberal mind they want to see Trump squirm, but that’s not happening, he’s resolute, unwavering and unrelenting, so let Nancy do all the work, if she doesn’t and if she wants her liberal mostly union government worker base to suffer, go right ahead Nancy. That 34% disapproval from the incoming new congress is a slow ticking time bomb.

Then Nancy shows him who's the boss, and banishes him from the well of Congress - and he has to bow down and accept it.

Things are real bad in Trump World - and as Cohen gets set to testify before Congress, it will only get worse...

Ok, so Nancy like a little kid shows him who’s boss?? Trump can do the SOTU somewhere else, that’s not going to stop him or keep him from his objective. Now real humiliation is when Pelosi tried to get on that plane and was told No.

Absolutely priceless.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Ah, so putting people out of work is leverage for Trump.

Anger goes both ways and the polls are slowly going up on the Democrats side, Pelosi better be careful.....jus sayin’.......

Why doesn’t he just declare martial law? That’s what fake leaders do. They make up emergencies and play tough guy.

BTW, the majority of Americans don’t want a wall.

Naw, you’re wrong, not along the border, but nice try. That’s where it counts and if the BS Dems were for border security like they were in 2013 The people along the border and even in TJ wouldn’t have to suffer like this.

https://news4sanantonio.com/news/local/donations-to-build-border-wall-top-18-million

You’ve got no basis for your assertion that they do.

Except for reading border patrol stats.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Schumer denied a bill to pay the Coast Guard. he owns that now.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Trump caved - makes America an open borders state. Re-election chances are over.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Not only the President is to blame. The failed GOP have demonstrated without any doubt a complete lack care or concern for the country for which they swore an oath to the Constitution. Never should they again be in any position of power and at every opportunity anyone who associates themselves with this party must be voted out.

At this point, the Democrats are just as guilty of being part of the current political circus. Every single one of them should be replaced.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

The U.S. Senate, where democracy goes to die. Why is it again that Wyoming (pop. 568,125) has the same amount of say as California (40,017,007)?

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

PTown: Trump and his GOP enablers in the Senate have no policies besides support everything Herr Diktator is told to do by Ann Coulter etal.

If the President were actually ‘Herr Diktator’ there would be no partial shutdown. Do you know what a dictatorship actually is?

Stranger: The democrats cannot comprise, as compromise cannot exist with Trump’s ultimatum shutdown.

Actually there can only be compromise if the sides are willing to compromise. President Trump has offered compromises - Pelosi has refused outright to even discuss their differences. Pelosi wants Trump to totally cave. Trump is willing to partially cave. Time for Pelosi to partially cave and negotiate to meet him and the Senate halfway. That’s what Democracy is all about. It should also be said that Congress hasn’t even made the appropriation yet. That’s not Trump’s fault. - it’s not like he had vetoed the spending.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

The US is a representative democracy, not a direct one. Didn’t you guys figure that out when all the sore losers called for the end of the Electoral College?

Trump won, get over it. And no, it wasn’t because of Russia, it was “the economy, stupid.” He promised a wall, and unlike every other presidential candidate that gives up on his campaign promises, Trump is trying to actually fulfill one. Novel idea, right?

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

I don't know, it was your suggestion.

Was it? I'm glad you can put down words for me so you can argue against them. LOL!

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Lest one forget..., National Security and Immigration is NOT a political ideology or human rights or even a democracy issue. (In this case they are incontrovertibly "connected" by physical evidence of what is actually happening and costing.)

The wall is a matter of necessity and effectiveness issue which dictates need. (Proven and requested by personnel at the actual physical border.)

The amount is a "cost" issue based upon "need" and "actual cost". (in this case was outlined by the request for funding.)

The funding is a "priority" issue on the part of the Executive branch (President) and Legislative branch (Congress).

(The disagreement is based upon the priority as seem by political parties and politicians to "recognize and agree" and "accept" the "facts and requests" provided by the border personnel as being "worthy" for consideration to fund it. It is not the type of security needed.) (It also indicates that there is disagreement as to the "urgency" of the need to fund border security and the "priority" over other funding's such as foreign aid.)

The shutdown is a lack of responsibility issue on the part of those that "refuse" to hear and see the "views" of those who have the actual need. (The push by Trump is because of the "urgency" of the need based upon actual physical presence of the "threat" to border security besides just refugees. The wall is what the border personnel needs and wants. That resolves the physical threat at the border to allow security staff to properly monitor and secure the border.)

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

It isn't as bad now as it was 15 years ago, and its only improving without a senseless wall in which you people are emotionally invested.

No, it’s worse actually, but I forget we shouldn’t listen to the border agents, I mean, what do they know, they just patrol and catch these people, but I will say this, you are absolutely right when it comes to Mexicans, we do see a drop off, but when it comes to people from Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala, we see an increase in border crossings, but I guess caravans to liberals seem like party buses on their way to Disneyland.

You guys scuttled two immigration reform bills in 2013.

Well, if it would have covered voter ID, end chain migration and the visa lottery, they would have been onboard with it, of course.

You weren't screaming about nonexistent hordes then, so what changed? Manufactured fear to feed emotion-driven individuals. 

No, because of the reasons I have outlined. Nothing manufactured, talk to officer Singh’s family or Kate Steinle. The border is a sieve and we see it for what it is and not for what we would like it to be.

https://www.thisisinsider.com/migrant-caravan-mexico-northbound-united-states-2018-10

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

So what have the Democrats done, brought to the table, or worked with the President to do, that benefit America since Trump took office over two years ago? Nothing... unless "Resist and Obstruct" is worthy of their salaries the past two years... They have been getting well paid by Americans to hurt America. Meanwhile 800,000 who actually do work for America are not getting paid while the Democrats go on expensive taxpayer paid trips.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Why doesn’t he just declare martial law? That’s what fake leaders do. They make up emergencies and play tough guy.

Tell the Angel Moms and others who have lost family members to illegals' crimes that this is a made-up emergency.

BTW, the majority of Americans don’t want a wall. You’ve got no basis for your assertion that they do.

According to the polls, right? They didn't poll me or anyone I know. The polls also said Hillary had over 90% chance to win the 2016 election.

Question: If the Dems are so concerned about the shutdown and the affect on federal workers, why did they vote against a Republican amendment to allow the backpay to be paid federal workers during the shutdown?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

The idea is to stop the illegals from coming into our country... not monitor them coming into our country.

The wall will be built.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

"Democrats have said they're not willing to negotiate unless the government's open. Well they tried their effort. I voted for it. It didn't happen. Now they've got to negotiate," Romney said.

Time to thrown in the towel Nancy and build that wall.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

And if the polls suddenly switch and people start to blame the Dems, what does that do for you?

Hopefully wake them the heck up.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Of course they are the American people, of course they matter...

Then please don’t dismiss them, they live there. Listen to the people that work there day in and day out. They are the people we should always listen to, not some political hack.

but you are saying that they are the only one's that should have a say in what happens to every American citizens tax dollars. So are the people in Maine not American people? Do they not matter. Only Bass matters in his wild imagination of how the government should work.

Wild imagination? Dunno...seeing and reading about the hundreds of Angel parents that have suffered through the actions of illegals and the inaction of our government seems very real to me.

DHS is lead by Trump's team, of course they are going to say it works.

So if we had a Democrat president and he or she would say the same thing, you would dismiss that as well? Please answer the question.

ANY other engineers will show you the flaws in this idea. A child can show you the problems with it, it doesn't take a rocket scientist. Political hack...right...

The point of the wall cannot completely stop them because nothing can. I mean, you have people breaking out of prisons, so what does that tell you? But the point of it all is, to greatly slow them down it when you have a giant impregnable wall, it will do that and as long as it can help sold it down it gives a vital leg up to the border patrol to more easily apprehend them.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Trump insists on wall

Which is instrumental to southern border security. And which the Democrats insist on obstructing in order to deny Trump another promise kept. Shameful. The Democrats remain more worried about illegals than U.S. citizens.

Pelosi doesn't even know where she's at... she's having issues reading the teleprompter. She just hasn't been the same since that house fell on her sister.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

The Trumpsters here are in absolute meltdown - their Dear Leader has shown to be an impotent clown who can't accomplish anything.

Bwahahahahahahahahah

Oh my...

https://www.whitehouse.gov/trump-administration-accomplishments/

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

The link you posted says nothing to refute the facts I stated. I repeat: the FACT is that the vast majority of drug traffic does not pass through unprotected border areas (areas where Trump wants a wall). 

It does and the border patrol as well as the Pentagon and if you don’t want to believe the stats, I don’t mind at all, the bottom line is, there is a serious problem and No amount of liberals whining, screaming and trying use magic pixie dust to try and change the thought process and optics of what we see at the border.

My guess is you’re a sloppy reader and the finer points of that simple sentence slipped past your radar.

i was thinking the same about you as well

Uh-huh and lol all you want. Doesn’t change the facts.

You are learning now, Plastic! Lol

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

No, it actually isn't.

Yes, it is, unless you think the caravan and people coming in by the thousands are trying to sneak a Trip in Disneyland.

You've been repeatedly provided the evidence to the contrary to your claim. 

It doesn't matter what nationality makes up the largest parts of a shrinking whole

Actually, it really does.

You haven't outlined anything that is true.

I did numerous times.

This nonsense started when your master Dumpster Fire Donny snapped his fingers. You all started frothing at the mouth and spewing incorrect information. That's called manufactured fear. 

The talking points from the Democrats is not going to sway anyone. Let’s remember, optics is something that can’t be dismissed, liberals aren’t that talented, really! If Mexico and Tijuana thinks this is crisis and NOT manufactured and they are in an uproar, I think I’ll take their word over ANY liberal in the US, now spin it to me that Mexicans and the mayor of TJ is a racist, givr it your best shot, please.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Once an airport is shutdown, and republican senators can't fly to their vacation homes

Yeah! Nancy Pelosi hasn't taken any vacations to Hawaii or anywhere else during the shutdown! No, wait...

Amazing how Dems will approve tens of billions in aid to foreign countries but not a fraction of that for security for Americans.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Trump is just making sure he's giving the Dems enough rope to hang themselves with before they either cave or he declares a national emergency and orders the military to do what our border patrol and I don't care what the fake polls say, the majority of Americans want done.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Because as soon as the government is reopened Dems will pretend this topic doesn’t even exist. Only way to make them take action.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Id support more spending on border security, just not an ineffective vanity project.

For example?

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

Under your definition of socialism if you include the big war industries making billions off the federal government, it's clear no revolution is needed - they're already running the country.

I’m talking about robbing Paul to give to Peter. I’m talking about stealing money from hard working Americans and giving it to others, thinking there nothing wrong with income redistribution. Democrats don’t know anything about self-reliance or teaching people about self-reliance and the pitfalls of big government Raising taxes to about 74%? Yeah, good luck with that. Nancy and her goon squad can always charter a flight to Cuba.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

The Democrats' idea of border security would be some kids flying around some drones with little flashing red and blue lights on them.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

The way you keep throwing in references to booze it sounds like you drink all the time. Which could explain a lot about the stuff you write

I think if liberals would drink more they could maybe make a bit of sense, even legislate better, but alas.....

Less socialism and more adult beverages.

we don’t agree. Btw, trump doesn’t read this thread. You don’t need to tell him to “hold the line”.

Then you don’t need to excoriate him since he doesn’t listen.

if we agreed upon anything, it’s that border security and America’s immigration policies need to be adjusted. Since you’ve never dealt with uscis you wouldn’t know, but they are not the most enjoyable lot to deal with.

Sorry, but you don’t know what I have seen or dealt with in my life.

A wall isn’t going to help that, and it’s also not going to curb immigration. The curb on illegal immigration that it would have is not even worth mentioning, nor is it worth spending upwards of 25 billion. It won’t get built during Trumps presidency, it won’t get built period.

No, a wall will definitely help, even Democrats know this that’s why they voted for it back in 2013 whatever liberals want to call it, they wanted to seal the border and they now changed? What’s happened to them? Not radical enough? Back then, it seems every liberal was OK with it, and now they’re not in the living followers say well it’s not necessary even though the vast majority of their constituents don’t live along the border? Give me a break you have walls in your house, washed in his garage and waltz, share in all these other idiots celebrities have walls. They absolutely work.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Not only the President is to blame. The failed GOP have demonstrated without any doubt a complete lack care or concern for the country for which they swore an oath to the Constitution. 

Please tell that to the Democrats.

Never should they again be in any position of power and at every opportunity anyone who associates themselves with this party must be voted out.

So we should have an authoritative one party rule?

-7 ( +2 / -9 )

So we should have a dictatorship?

Which one? The Democrat or the Republican One?

They don't, its called border security. You are not an expert, neither am I, but the experts say the wall won't work.

Funny, not according to the engineers, border security (I mean they would know since...that’s kind of their job.) so I trust them over any political hack.

So it's not about the American people or the country, it's only all about the people on the border?

They are not American people? I mean the US citizens living along the border, they don’t matter?

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

Nah, Trump is already done for. No need for that, 2020 is coming. The GOP is getting ready to hang him out to dry.

I doubt that very much, without Trump the GOP like the Democrats have nothing but sleepy and boring candidates. Romney, Kasich? Seriously? And it’s worse on the Democrat side. Warren, Harris? Maybe, just maybe Biden...Kerry....lol.

If he delcares a national emergency, he's out of their books. If he doesn't open the government soon, the economy and employment he's worked for goes crashing down and the GOP can kiss the next election goodbye.

I don’t think so, seems more and more people are really want something done with the border and they see how Trump is trying and at least not bolting from Washington. Optics matter. The Dems are starting to feel pressure and that’s slowly growing for the Dems to stop this, personally, I hope Nancy keeps on screwing up like this, it makes it that much easier to retake the House back if they keep it up like this.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

Then it's lucky for them that everything Trump does is stupid, isn't it?

So that means the Democrats shouldn’t be in power at all then. Well, I’ll drink to that even if it is lunchtime.

Isn't that the whole idea, being worried about illegal immigrants and what to do with them and how to effectively stop them? The only people that say the wall will work is the DHS, who are instructed to say so by Donald Trump.

Not the border patrol, they are instructed to tell us the facts and as fro DHS. Then that means according to you, regardless of which party is in office we should never belive them, ever or even the Pentagon. How about the new incoming AG? He should be dismissed? Or is it, as long as these people go against Trump we will believe them, if not we will dismiss them.

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

Are you upset about the way Trump is made fun of every time he tries to read his speech or claims he "read" a book?

To be fair, the only President that was good at reading a TelePrompTer was Reagan.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

The data provided in the link shows apprehension numbers, or in other words, how well the current border security (real security) is working without the wall.

Actually, it does and doesn’t, slow down for a second and now to your point, if you build a wall and in conjunction with the border patrol and the work that they have been doing that will greatly even more so reduce the influx of immigrants illegally coming into the country, so on one hand you’re right in on the other hand Trump is right, so building the wall would make better sense as it would curb even more illegals from entering the country.

So we agree, Mr. President, hold the line.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

It should be pretty clear from the votes, its a pretty even divide but the majority lies with "NO WALL".

Not for the people along the border and not for the President. Sure, some Senior Republicans broke rank because they want a compromise, but they are not the President, so it’s him and his policies that are on the line, not the Congress at this stage, this was Trump’s main campaign promise and I respect him more for not giving in.

Why should the majority of American's be asked to pay for a wall that only Trump and the minority want? The vote did nothing but solidify the Democrats push for real border security over Trump's legacy project.

Why should the country, the safety of the country and the constant flow of drugs, coyotes and illegals be allowed to enter so freely into our country? Why does the entire country have to suffer because the Democrats have giant egos?

If you support the EC and Trump's election, you would also support the idea that America doesn't want the wall because that's where the majority of votes ended up in congress today. You silly people arguing against the popular vote, that the EC is more important, until now when it shows a majority toward what you don't like. And a popular vote shunned the wall as well.

Not really. If you live in Maine and never lived along the border, it’s stupid to even put yourself in a situation you have never been in. But at the same time, these people don’t want drugs, you can’t have it both ways. If you want to stop the flow of drugs and illegals, you need to secure the border, plain and simple.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

Then there's Lara Trump who thinks people going hungry, losing their homes and not being able to afford medical treatment is a 'little pain'.

...or Pelosi that couldn’t care one iota what happens along the border or people that were greatly impacted by illegals. Funny how the Democrats refuse to meet with Angel Mom's, but they want us to have empathy for people losing their homes and trying to equate that with someone who’s family member was murdered by illegals.

Time for a revolution?

If the socialists keep going on this radical path, we may have to.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

Some facts to keep things in perspective. First, the vast majority of drug traffic does not enter through unprotected border areas. Second, illegal immigration (including illegal border crossings, which are a minority of cases) has dramatically decreased in the past 15 years or so. In fact, there is a net migration outflow across the U.S.-Mexico border. Third, there is no real evidence that undocumented migrants commit crimes (other than visa violations) at a higher rate than anyone else. Fourth, there are more effective and cost-efficient methods of securing the border than a wall.

Uh-huh...yeah, Plastic....lol

https://drugabuse.com/featured/drug-trafficking-across-borders/

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

You've been repeatedly told the answers to your questions and you have repeatedly ignored those answers.

No, I never any specific “answers” just answers that liberals WANT you to accept.

He ran on a campaign to build a wall paid for by Mexico.

Yes, exactly, he campaigned on building the wall, ok, so Mexico won’t pay, I never expected that and most people don’t, but the Dems go on about Mexico, fine. But as you said and as most of us supporters want is that he keeps his “campaign promise of building a wall.” So you are right, let’s build the wall regardless of who pays for it, the Democrats need to stop usurping the political process

-11 ( +1 / -12 )

Trump and his GOP enablers in the Senate have no policies besides support everything Herr Diktator is told to do by Ann Coulter etal.

And the Marxist Brown shirts party of Pelosi, what was their proposal again to secure and fund the wall?

Trump ran on a platform of bringing US democracy down, and in that regards he's been successful.

No, he ran on a campaign to build a wall, if the Democrats worry about democracy then maybe they shouldn’t usurp it.

-12 ( +0 / -12 )

The Dems have no policy besides "oppose anything Trump does." Ever heard of compromise? If you think that will win you the election in 2020 you are sadly mistaken.

-14 ( +5 / -19 )

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