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Trump to send more troops to Afghanistan as part of new strategy

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By Steve Holland and John Walcott

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New strategy is the old strategy which was not working. Winston Churchill once said "you can count on the American to do the right thing after they have tried everything else".

The right strategy is to pull out of Afghanistan.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

Just goes to show trumps true colours and that he works for military industrial complex just like his predecessors.

10 ( +15 / -5 )

Much like spending more to solve your pachinko losing streak.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

"My original instinct was to pull out," he said in his speech, but added that he was convinced by his national security advisers to strengthen the U.S. ability to prevent the Taliban from ousting the U.S.-backed government in Kabul.

He was hammering home the message that Afghanistan was a waste of "trillions of dollars" and that the troops had to come home.

Now he's changed his mind.

The liar.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

Just build a wall!

Problem solved....

8 ( +9 / -1 )

It's all starting in poor Afghanistan again.

Might as well transfer Kadena to Kabul.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

He was hammering home the message that Afghanistan was a waste of "trillions of dollars" and that the troops had to come home.

Now he's changed his mind.

No, listened to his Generals. Now that he's surrounded by the Washington machine and it off from Bannon and other outsiders, Trump now has to work with the very people he hates, so why are you guys complaining? You guys wanted him neutered and now he is.

The liar.

No, you want to get something done, you have to work with your team. All presidents lie, all of them.

-18 ( +2 / -20 )

Never reached the lofty heights of President nor even adviser status, but I do know

Macedonians never subdued completely Afganistn.

Indian Raga's never managed to subdue Afganistn

Britian, failed

Russia failed

Coalition failed

Americas longest war not going so well

So lesson 1 don't attack Afganistn

Lesson 2 reinforcing failure does not work out well.

now as I said I'm in no position to make national security decisions but I can speculate that these advisers need to read more books.

7 ( +10 / -3 )

No, listened to his Generals. Now that he's surrounded by the Washington machine and it off from Bannon and other outsiders, Trump now has to work with the very people he hates, so why are you guys complaining? You guys wanted him neutered and now he is.

First off; I'm not "you guys" and secondly; this is the latest in a long line of Trump's empty promises and u-turns being exposed. Whether he has Bannon or any of his imps advising, or not.

No, you want to get something done, you have to work with your team.

Which team? It seems to change by the hour. But at least you see that Trump cannot work in isolation. And by that turn; America cannot work in isolation.

All presidents lie, all of them.

Maybe. But I wouldn't claim to be certain on that. If you do accept that Trump is a serial liar; it seems odd that you place all your faith in him.

6 ( +9 / -3 )

I don't know if this good or bad, but still... so much for "America first" !

9 ( +9 / -0 )

Trump says Afghanistan and Pakistan pose the worst terrorist threat to America. Interesting his travel ban applies to neither country.

23 ( +23 / -0 )

Much like spending more to solve your pachinko losing streak.

Yes, the double down to win gambling strategy.

The fallacy with that strategy is that the gambler will eventually run out of money and be unable to double down. How long will the U.S. be willing to spend and die for that country, and to what end?

I agree with the generals that Pakistan safe haven's are key to any strategy in Afghanistan. I just hate to see America (and young Americans in harm's way) involved in nation building there solely to keep the country from turning into a modern day pirate cove for terrorists.

However, that strategy will also entail nation building in Pakistan to eliminate madrasas and the lawless areas. Dealing with Pakistan will also entail dealing with the India-Pakistan cold war/conflict so that Pakistan can move its forces to the West instead of on the Indian borders.

Don't expect any miracles out of this one. Trump's indifference to the military will either be a good thing or a bad thing depending on collateral deaths and whether the military angers or can win the Afghanistan public. The mainstream military (non-Spec Ops) doesn't have good track record at the heart's and minds game, and the Afghanistan public doesn't really care too much about outside help. So, I am not too optimistic.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Looks like the outsider who gained the support of those who hate the Washington establishment is continuing the same failed policy here.

Same old crap after a trash heap of lies on the campaign trail.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

I'll give him credit for listening to others for once, but I think his basic reluctance will show if casualties start to rise. I expect an "I told you so" moment somewhere down the line.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

It would have been cheeper to give every Afghanistan house free internet and not cost young Americans their lives, disfigurement, mental stress. Abdul sitting on his dirt floor inside his mud built house trying to feed his child brides might just think, hey this sucks!!! Might start thinking about education! The biggest fear for Taliban "education", bomb them they don't care but education they get so upset. They shoot young girls in the face for reading a book, Give them all the net. Problem solved.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

They shoot young girls in the face for reading a book, Give them all the net. Problem solved.

If only. It would probably be outlawed by the patriarchy in order to maintain their hold over the oppressed of Afghanistan.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

First off; I'm not "you guys" and secondly; this is the latest in a long line of Trump's empty promises and u-turns being exposed. Whether he has Bannon or any of his imps advising, or not.

No, as much as I hate this decision at least he's listening to his Generals and other military staff. It's what you guys wanted, a president who listens and not go off the rails and go rogue.

Which team? It seems to change by the hour. But at least you see that Trump cannot work in isolation. And by that turn; America cannot work in isolation.

Working together is fun.

Maybe.

No, not maybe. We never had a president that didn't lie. Even Washington lied.

But I wouldn't claim to be certain on that. If you do accept that Trump is a serial liar; it seems odd that you place all your faith in him.

If we did like you say, then we should have never given any president the benefit of a doubt. They all lie, comes with the territory. But at least on this, his taking leadership and not telling enemy about timetables, troop levels etc.

Same old crap after a trash heap of lies on the campaign trail.

At least he admitted that he did a flip flop on this one. Doesn't like it, but will listen to the military on this. The last president would have never done such a thing.

-11 ( +0 / -11 )

In an allusion to the Charlottesville uproar, Trump said:"We cannot remain a force for peace in the world if we are not at peace with each other."

I agree with his point for once but in reality America just exports wars, death and suffering. It's not right trying to get someone else's house in order, if yours is a mess.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

What does a businessman know about foreign affairs?? What does a businessman know about waging war?? N - O - T - H - I - N - G. That is why he has to leave it all to the Pentagon and the generals...and do they want war or no war?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

"Our troops will fight to win," he added.

Gee, if only someone had thought of this before! I thought our troops were fighting to tie.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

No, not maybe. We never had a president that didn't lie. Even Washington lied.

You mean all that stuff about the cherry tree was fake? Darn.

The last president would have never done such a thing.

What; change his mind? Like this?

http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/insidestory/2015/10/obama-afghanistan-151017192728663.html

Why was Afghanistan invaded, btw? Given that the 9/11 perps were mainly Saudis and masterminded by a Saudi.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Am I the only American tired of all this winning?

8 ( +10 / -2 )

"a fight to win."

@cricky above said it best: it's been shown throughout history wars there are un-winnable. To 'win' all guerrillas would have to be stopped, which is impossible given the various guerrillas in all the different tribes and factions vying for control in Afghanistan (and Pakistan). As rightwinger, 'realpoitik-er' Henry Kissinger says, 'If the guerrillas don't lose, they win.'

For those who think 'the generals know', I'll echo Clemenceau: War is too serious a matter to entrust to military men.

With Russia arming the Taliban, what will the US - Russia relationship be?

With China already holding resource related extraction contracts in Afghanistan, what will the US - China relationship be?

US, Russia and China: go home. Leave Afghanistan to the Afghanis.

It's a shame one of the ways Trump and the Republicans want to grow the US economy is by further expanding war efforts resulting in more deaths and more money spent on feeding the bloated military and NOT spending money on things that help middle and working class Americans.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Aren't the US forces getting spread a bit thin across the globe?

50%(4000 Troops) in Afghanistan, where do they come from?

Plus gear, etc air force also has many fighters down for maintenance and/or upgrades. Not looking promising right now.

Afghanistan is a tribal territory and outsiders are not welcome.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

It's a shame one of the ways Trump and the Republicans want to grow the US economy is by further expanding war efforts resulting in more deaths and more money spent on feeding the bloated military and NOT spending money on things that help middle and working class Americans.

To be fair, Trump used to say pretty much that. Strangely, his supporters didn't call him a hippie, pacifist, socialist with no idea about geopolitics living in a peppermint tea unicornverse at that time. They thought it was great.

Now he's done a complete U-turn, he gets points for listening to the military. They think that is great too.

It's all great!

3 ( +4 / -1 )

there are very few things i agree with trump on, but pulling out of afghanistan was one of them. over 2,000 soldiers have died and trillions have been spent on a war that we cannot, and will not, win. there is no such thing as "winning" in afghanistan because it lacks a strong central gov't, military and police force. the country is ruled by tribal leaders who have their own goals, none of which align with what the US wants.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

So he listens to his security and military advisers and changes his mind. He is stupid according to all of you so he should listen to others. Never listens, you all say.

Now he does listen and all you have is that he is a liar? But if he went against the national security and military advice you would complain too. So what's the point?

-11 ( +1 / -12 )

Nothing good will come from this. Even if the US is able to prevent terrorists from using Afghanistan as a base, there are plenty of other failed states where they can set up shop instead. The "war on terror" has become like a dog chasing its tail.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

So he listens to his security and military advisers and changes his mind. He is stupid according to all of you so he should listen to others. Never listens, you all say.

He is stupid. He came off sounding reasonable in the speech because he was saying what someone else told him to say. He will go off script very soon. Maybe he already has.

He did "rely" on the advice of his generals, which will only be good until things get difficult. Then he will stab his generals in the back.

The generals themselves I don't have a lot of faith in because they are the same crowd who thinks nation building is a thing. I don't think I have seen or heard of nation building ever be successful. The closest was the Special Forces (Green Beret) in Vietnam. The special forces were doing well with "nation building," but then the mainstream army generals thought they could do as good a job with young, uneducated and not highly trained troops. Needless to say, the mainstream army had the exact opposite effect. So, yea turning a bunch of high school grads with inadequate training loose on a foreign population isn't the best idea. I don't think the mainstream Army is adequately trained for that role.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

"US backed government in Kabul".  Which is corrupt.  Critiscises the US constantly.  allows extremists to flourish in its country.  and drugs (hurrah!!).  Is a source of 100,000's "refugees".

How much worse would things be if the US just left?

5 ( +5 / -0 )

bass4funk: "No, you want to get something done, you have to work with your team. All presidents lie, all of them."

hang on a sec... you say "No." he's not a liar, then you say everyone lies. Which is it?

At least now you guys can stop jumping into the time machine argument and saying Obama started this war, or that it's "his war now". Guess it's Trumps, and look how quickly he's back tracking (and you are, too!) on all the things you condemned about it!

2 ( +4 / -2 )

All presidents lie, all of them.

I thought you guys liked Trump because he's different. Now you seem to be defending him by saying that he's the same as every other president. Which is it? Do you like him because he's different or because he's the same?

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Do you like him because he's different or because he's the same?

Like Trump; I fear his core supporters are a tad bit confused when it comes to big issues like Afghanistan.

Just do a search on his Twitter history on his various comments on the country.

I swear, he comes out with all this bluster and then someone has a word in his ear and he's changed direction. Again.

The man hasn't got a clue.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Afghanistan's opium poppy production goes into more than 90% of heroin worldwide. Unless Trump starts to napalm the fields you will never stop terrorists there because this is a major source of the income that funds them.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

hang on a sec... you say "No." he's not a liar, then you say everyone lies. Which is it? 

No, generally speaking, he's pretty honest, but yes, everyone lies, now as far intentionally lying is concerned that's a different story. But it doesn't seem to do that as much, exaggeration does not necessarily constitute a lie.

At least now you guys can stop jumping into the time machine argument and saying Obama started this war, or that it's "his war now".

Thank God! Now it can be done in the right way. Not happy about it, but I could care less what the MSM think. I care what the people say that are on the ground fighting and Trump has listened to them, that's leadership and not leading from behind the way previous president did.

Guess it's Trumps, and look how quickly he's back tracking (and you are, too!) on all the things you condemned about it!

He didn't back track and neither did I. He admitted that he did a full flip-flop on this, but he decided to listen to his generals and the Pentagon and to follow their advice and as I said I don't like it but if anybody would know how this should be fought then it's the men and women in uniform. The previous president didn't listen to the military I didn't care about what was going on in Afghanistan, he just cared about his voter base and didn't care about anything else. In this kind of situation, the best thing to do is listen to the people that are fighting this thing.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

the best thing to do is listen to the people that are fighting this thing.

The generals are hardly fighting anything.

If you ask the advice of the real fighters, they would say let's go home, this place sucks and doesn't deserve us.

he just cared about his voter base and didn't care about anything else.

And Trump is different, how?

Everything he does is to maintain his voting base.

Trump's problem is that his voter base is like 35%, plus the not her or him crowd. He isn't increasing that base by narrowly addressing only the narrow minded views of 35% of voters.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The previous president didn't listen to the military

On occasion, sure.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/13/opinion/the-president-and-the-generals.html?mcubz=1

Barack Obama, fortunately, has returned to the tradition of earlier presidents; he not only fired his commander in Afghanistan, he also overrode the military leadership’s recommendation about how to attack bin Laden’s compound. Kennedy likewise made operational decisions, telling his admirals where and how to intercept Soviet ships bound for Cuba. (After the crisis, Kennedy fired the head of the Navy.)

he just cared about his voter base and didn't care about anything else

Except for the auto industry, veteran homelessness, improving schools nutrition etc

http://washingtonmonthly.com/magazine/januaryfebruary-2017/obamas-top-50-accomplishments-revisited/

4 ( +5 / -1 )

A war time president usually gets more support from the general public as long as the war is not on their own soil.

More created distraction from what's going on at home. If he thinks people will be focused abroad then no one will be focused on the Russia probe, his lies or his previous screw ups/failures.

It has been too soon for the general public to fall for the same scams and lies pulled by the Bush Jr. administration.

For some reason, Trump seems to think that the general public has the memory of a senior citizen with severe Alzheimer's disease.

.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

"  trillions have been spent on a war  " there you have it! civilization is built on waste (in more ways than one), and war is the ultimate in waste…

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Except for the auto industry, veteran homelessness, improving schools nutrition etc

And he got bin Laden!

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Guess it's Trumps, and look how quickly he's back tracking (and you are, too!) on all the things you condemned about it!

Thank God! Now it can be done in the right way. 

What way would that be? Please explain.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

@bass He didn't back track and neither did I. He admitted that he did a full flip-flop on this,

Is 'back track' different from 'full flip-flop'?

The previous president didn't listen to the military

Of course he did. Because he didn't start the wars rightists and the defense industries wanted him to start, and because he took the approaches he did in overseeing the US's ongoing wars does not mean 'he didn't listen to the military'. In a democratic republic, the president is the leader and is elected to make decisions - not the military. The US is not a state governed by the military. At least not fully and not yet. With Trump in charge...?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

focused on the Russia probe

You guys are STILL trying to say this is a 'thing'?

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

Trump outlines a revised vision, but few specifics, for the war in Afghanistan

Trump Outlines New Afghan Strategy With Few Details

Trump takes ownership of Afghanistan war with new announcement

Those are the headlines from 3 of the most Trump hating media outlets.

Double win for the media as they can attack him for not sharing details while also hitting him with the 'he is flip flopping again' attack. Then they get to put the entire thing on him and take it off of Obama, whose responsibility it really was.

It is very clear that he didnt want to do this, but he is trusting his advisers.

Time will tell if this was the right choice or not. I can also tell this is not the right thing to do based on who loved his speech. (McCain, Graham, Ryan). The so called 'base' isnt for this at ALL.

Yet President Trump feels this is the right thing to do, so we will support him until we can finish this up in a victory that he will get no credit for.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

@blacklab focused on the Russia probe

You guys are STILL trying to say this is a 'thing'?

Thank you for reminding readers of the ongoing Russia investigation. It's germane to the Afghanistan issue because of Russia's involvement there (especially Russia's arming of the Taliban) and obviously because of the alleged (and currently investigated) connections Trump, various members of his family and numerous members of his administration have with different Russian oligarchs. Given Afghanistan's wealth of resources and Putin's oligarchs quest for resource control, which might be in competition with US oligarch's push for control, the Russia issue should remain 'a thing'.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

No longer can Trump criticize what his predecessors did since he's now doing the same thing he criticized them for

7 ( +7 / -0 )

@blacklab It is very clear that he didnt want to do this, but he is trusting his advisers.

So if things continue to go south he and his supporters can blame 'his advisors' because Trump 'didn't want to do this'? I thought Trump and his supporters claimed Trump had all the really best ideas. Trump claimed he knew way more than the generals. And now he's saying they know more?

 so we will support him

By 'we' do you mean his loyal 35%? Will they be the ones putting their lives on the line for the benefit of the corporations interested in Afghanistan's resources? Will you and the others favoring war enlist, or maybe pay more in taxes to finance this ongoing mess?

until we can finish this up in a victory that he will get no credit for.

Poor Donny John.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

By 'we' do you mean his loyal 35%? Will they be the ones putting their lives on the line for the benefit of the corporations interested in Afghanistan's resources?

What?

Will you and the others favoring war enlist, or maybe pay more in taxes to finance this ongoing mess?

Some of us are already enlisted, so what's your point? Anyway, at least we don't have another weak president in the WH. Kudos!

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

For some reason, Trump seems to think that the general public has the memory of a senior citizen with severe Alzheimer's disease.

Not to make light of such a terrible illness but isn't there talk of Trump suffering from it?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

So after all that, I have no idea what you wanted Trump to do.

He said he would get us out of Afghanistan, and the base agreed.

But you guys hate Trump and every decision he makes is stupid because he is stupid.

So that would mean you would be against what Trump and his base want, you would want him to stay.

But now that he is staying, you are against that too?

So what did you originally want, the same thing Trump and his base wanted, to leave? So you were secretly in agreement with him the whole time until today when he chose something else?

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

I honorably served and I am against us getting involved over there any more. I think we should be spending our time and effort on Making America Great Again and America First.

But now that our leaders have decided to go and do this, we do need to take the handcuffs off our military and fight to win this once and for all. Unlike the previous administration.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

So what did you originally want

None of it. It's all a pain in the neck for commentators whether they are loyal to him or not.

But for the people who are suffering because of him; I imagine it's a lot, lot worse.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Not to make light of such a terrible illness but isn't there talk of Trump suffering from it?

I think that question should be given to the left to answer.

You've admitted several times you have never served in the US military, so it would be clearer to say 'some of Trump's 35% are already enlisted'.

That depends on your point of view. Wasn't in the military, but was in Iraq for 6 weeks during war, either way, you can't make generalizations without facts, but then again, the left do it daily.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

So just do the Obama 'ignore it' technique on Afghanistan too?

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

I think we should be spending our time and effort on Making America Great Again and America First.

What does the former actually mean?

As for the latter; that was tried before in the anti-war movement pre-Pearl Harbor. Lindbergh (aviator, eugenics fan and occasional anti-semite) was known to be sympathetic to the America First Committee but later, following the attack, put his lot in with defending the US.

The AFC was an odd mix of isolationists, left wingers and right wingers.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Make America Great again is everything that Trump promised to do in his Contract with America which led to his election victory.

https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/_landings/contract/O-TRU-102316-Contractv02.pdf

America First is unrelated to that group from long ago. Simply means that every decision will be made with the interests of America as the priority, not what 'the world' or other individual countries want. .

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Seriously, what is the position of the 'left' as it relates to Afghanistan, stay or go? Hillary wouldnt take a position and Obama said one thing (promised to leave) while doing another (staying), so it was totally unclear.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Whatever happens, if it successful then Trump will take the credit, if not, he will blame someone else.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Yeah thats pretty much the Dems position. No plan of their own to resolve this either way and wont take a position other than to say Trump doesnt have a plan. Well Obama didnt have a plan either, and Bush before him. Typical, 'no risk' obstructionist politics. At least Trump has taken an actual position and will move forward on it, thats a start.

http://thehill.com/policy/defense/347430-pelosi-trumps-afghanistan-speech-low-on-details

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

you can't make generalizations without facts, but then again, the left do it daily.

Can you back that up with source/link/citation/verification?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

No plan of their own to resolve this either way and wont take a position other than to say Trump doesnt have a plan.

Check out Breitbart. That's their position exactly.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Make America Great again is everything that Trump promised to do in his Contract with America which led to his election victory.

Yeah, I've seen that list of wild, isolationist, retrogressive & empty promises before. And all in 100 days. Woo hoo!

What does Make America Great actually mean?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

So the Democratic position on the issue is on Breitbart? No, that would be Trump's entire base not agreeing with this decision to stay.

Yet Obama stayed too so I see the Dem/liberal dilemma. If they say staying is correct they have to ageee with Trump but then if they say go they have to admit Obana lied about his promise to leave in the first place.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Whatever happens, if it successful then Trump will take the credit, if not, he will blame someone else.

Yeah....about that one...

https://youtu.be/tLteUGkvpOc

Can you back that up with source/link/citation/verification?

Turn on your TV it's all there. A smorgasbord of lies.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Turn on your TV it's all there. A smorgasbord of lies.

Uh uh. No time for Fox News, thanks.

Can you explain your unverified generalisations about alleged generalisations?

4 ( +5 / -1 )

I think some people here are making the mistake of thinking everyone can do screeching 180s on positions they've come to after years of consideration. I know some people are open-minded enough to have their positions changed after listening to the profound, flawlessly logical and meticulously researched ideas of a man like Trump, but not everyone is so flexible.

I liked his idea of pulling out of stupid stalemates - it often involves my country too. I've always been in this position.

I just don't have the ability to believe that and then 24 hours later see its polar opposite as satisfactory as well.

Can anyone teach me how to think this way? Does it involve joining a lunatic fringe?

3 ( +4 / -1 )

yeah says me and the document signed by the President of my country on "behalf of a grateful nation". But don't let that worry you doesn't mean my opinion means more and I am actually against Trump's decision while trusting that the generals can make it work.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Can anyone teach me how to think this way? Does it involve joining a lunatic fringe?

I dunno why but you've reminded me of Iron Maiden's "Can I Play with Madness", for some reason.

two officials who participated in the discussions said on Sunday, is that it was difficult to get Trump to accept the need for a broader regional strategy that included U.S. policy toward Pakistan.Trump received a wide range of conflicting options, the officials said.

And there you have it; he is unable to sustain his campaign promises because the reality is that there are experts and advisors that will disagree and contradict one another. This is, of course, normal in the WH but Trump is used to yes men and getting his own way.

Afghanistan is a disaster and sure, to justify his umpteenth u-turn, Trump will lay the blame on Obama. Who also changed his mind, of course.

But then go back even further and I'll ask again - why single out Afghanistan? Post 9/11?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Blacklabel: So the Democratic position on the issue is on Breitbart? No, that would be Trump's entire base not agreeing with this decision to stay.

Then we're all criticizing him, not just the Democrats.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

two officials who participated in the discussions said on Sunday, is that it was difficult to get Trump to accept the need for a broader regional strategy that included U.S. policy toward Pakistan.Trump received a wide range of conflicting options, the officials said.

____

Trump made it clear in interviews during the campaign, specifically on the The O'Reilly Factor," April 28, 2016 that he would stay in Afghanistan.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would stay in Afghanistan. It's probably the one place we should have gone in the Middle East because it's adjacent and right next to Pakistan which has nuclear weapons. So I think you have to stay and do the best you can, not that it's ever going to be great but I don't think we have much of a choice. That's one place, frankly, instead of going to Iraq we probably should have gone there first. I would say in Afghanistan and only, again, because of its location next to Pakistan.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Trump made it clear in interviews during the campaign, specifically on the The O'Reilly Factor," April 28, 2016 that he would stay in Afghanistan.

Trump made it clear on many occasions that he was against Afghanistan involvement.

Do not allow our very stupid leaders to sign a deal that keeps us in Afghanistan through 2024-with all costs by U.S.A. MAKE AMERICA GREAT!

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/21/what-trump-said-about-afghanistan-before-he-became-president.html

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Afghanistan is a disaster and sure, to justify his umpteenth u-turn, Trump will lay the blame on Obama. Who also changed his mind, of course.

I doubt it. Its a little different, this president does seem to listen closely to his Generals and the Pentagon, so you guys should be happy.

But then go back even further and I'll ask again - why single out Afghanistan? Post 9/11?

....or 1998...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I doubt it. Its a little different, this president does seem to listen closely to his Generals and the Pentagon, so you guys should be happy.

Again; I'm not "you guys".

Are the military listening to Trump; I wonder?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Didn't Trump say he knows more than the Generals?

5 ( +6 / -1 )

"Prove it."

Yeah, where are the democrats these days? 

That's just not on. That is beyond poor. It's an affront to this people on this site. It disgraces us all.

It's utterly diabolical.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Are the military listening to Trump; I wonder?

Yes. But they won't directly disobey an order or override the Commander in chief unless it something of a catastrophic magnitude that would require someone from the military branch intervening.

Didn't Trump say he knows more than the Generals?

Yes, he did, so did the previous president.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

I have a quote from Trump saying he knows more than the Generals. Can you show your quote from Obama? I mean, if you're going to criticize someone for claiming to know more than the Generals, surely we'd start with the guy who has been quoted saying as much.

Or were you just being a bit emotional?

6 ( +7 / -1 )

He has said that withdrawal would mean that gap is instantly filled by terrorists. So in other words. the U.S can never withdraw until all terrorists in the region are gone. So incredibly unlikely. Who is going to pay for this folly? Its already cost a fortune. Hope you guys are finally getting an oil pipeline or something because the U.S can not afford these adventures. Your country needs a massive renewal programme. Something Trump was right about.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Didn't Trump say he knows more than the Generals?

Yes, he did, so did the previous president.

You really need to back this one up.

"Yeah, where are the democrats these days?" just won't cut it.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Here is one where he publicly overruled his generals:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/11102943/Barack-Obama-silences-generals-on-US-ground-troops-in-Iraq.html

Another one:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/awkward-minuet-obama-and-the-generals/

The situation has become very dangerous for an administration that has overruled its commanders dramatically and frequently and is reportedly considering doing so again by announcing accelerations of the withdrawal of American forces from Afghanistan beyond what military commanders have recommended.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Bannon was the only one in the White House saying the US should stay out of foreign wars. He was ousted by the generals and chickenhawk Congresscritters, so the neocons are set on more wars.

War that suck trillions of dollars from the taxpayers with the only reward being more people who hate the US, turning some into terrorists to avenge the deaths of "collateral damage" family and friends killed by US bombs and bullets.

The neocons finally got to him, convincing him that Americans truly love war. And I guess it's time to admit it.

Americans love war. They love sending their sons and daughters off to some festering desert hellhole to get their legs blown off and die. They think it's patriotic to to cry into a folded flag with their child, spouse, sibling ripped apart in a casket.

And they get it all from Hollywood.

Watch how this post will get voted down because the Americans here love the Hollywood/first person shooter game version of war because they're not smart enough to think about it critically.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

Here is one where he publicly overruled his generals:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/11102943/Barack-Obama-silences-generals-on-US-ground-troops-in-Iraq.html

Another one:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/awkward-minuet-obama-and-the-generals/

I was really hoping bass would answer that. Is it your turn on the night shift?

Still; he overruled the top brass. But where did he actually **say** he knows more than the Generals?

Pedantic semantics but we need clarification on bass' claim. I need clarification.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

@Blacklabel

You disagree with the generals who advised Trump on Afghanistan. Does that mean you know more than them?

More importantly, did you say you know more than them?

You are more qualified than draft-dodging Trump to comment on the military. What do you think of Trump's comment about knowing more than the generals?

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Time for a history lesson! Chapter One: Vietnam.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The fools over at Breitbart are mighty pissed off.

Trump is such a dope.

And now he is off to Arizona to rile up his stupid followers. By pooping on brown people.

What a dope.

What you see here is a man with no plan. The TV President.

He is a dope. His followers, dopes.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

I heard the new Taliban has become a little less radical nowadays, and quite more nationalist. Another bad move Trump.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

No matter the circumstances, what Afghani wants a non Muslim invading force of thousands of soldiers in Afghanistan?

The population there is close to 100% Muslim so there will never be an acceptable way.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Toasted HereticAug. 22  10:56 am JST

"My original instinct was to pull out," he said in his speech, but added that he was convinced by his national security advisers to strengthen the U.S. ability to prevent the Taliban from ousting the U.S.-backed government in Kabul.

He was hammering home the message that Afghanistan was a waste of "trillions of dollars" and that the troops had to come home.

Now he's changed his mind.

The liar.

I don't know if I'd call him a liar, exactly. I think he just says whatever he thinks will make him sound good at the time and doesn't bother to check if he's right or not. No matter what he says it seems to go down well with gullible morons so he probably sees no reason to change. Not that he could if he wanted, he's clearly lost the plot ages ago.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Toasted HereticAug. 22  11:09 pm JST

Still; he overruled the top brass. But where did he actually **say** he knows more than the Generals?

Pedantic semantics but we need clarification on bass' claim. I need clarification.

But expect something about Democrats being in the wilderness and losing elections. That seems to be his new tic.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

I was really hoping bass would answer that. Is it your turn on the night shift?

I did.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/marc-thiessen-obama-overrules-his-generals-in-fight-against-islamic-state/2014/09/15/0cff59a0-3ce1-11e4-9587-5dafd96295f0_story.html?utm_term=.00ac0bb15ce0

He is a dope. His followers, dopes.

Liberals calling conservative dopes when they can't win elections, lose over 1000 legislative seats, the House, the Senate and they call us dopes??? Lol

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

every US president is the same, when it comes to war, they are just their to promote the war industry. selling weapons, using weapons is the only purpose of the any US president.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

bass4funkToday  11:45 am JST

"I was really hoping bass would answer that. Is it your turn on the night shift?"

I did.

No you didn't. You were asked to provide a specific example of Obama actually saying outright he knew more than the generals. Not examples of him not listening to them or over-ruling them. Perhaps if you're having trouble you could take a look for this kind of thing:

"There's nobody bigger or better at the military than I am." — June 2015 Fox News interview

"I know more about ISIS [the Islamic State militant group] than the generals do. Believe me." — November 2015

"So a general gets on, sent obviously by Obama, and he said, 'Mr. Trump doesn't understand. He knows nothing about defense.' I know more about offense and defense than they will ever understand, believe me. Believe me. Than they will ever understand. Than they will ever understand." — July 2016

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Well, I certainly didnt see that one coming... option D. Pile on more Troops. That said, it doesnt appear to be his plan, but that of Mattis. Hopefully we're not seeing a real life version of "War Machine" being played out in front of our eyes...

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt4758646/?ref_=nv_sr_1

One other thing that does stand out, is the Comment towards Pakistan. At last! Hopefully no further beating around the bush regarding that, Country.... and when their Army says that there are no Terrorist hideouts in Pakistan, sure he's right (from his own Country's perspective) - they have a different view to the rest of the World over which groups are Terrorists, and which aren't.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

".......as part of new strategy." The only thing new about this strategy is that it is 180 degrees opposite of what he said he would do. Come to think of it, that isn't new, either.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Out of this whole affair, seems Trump learned something, he criticized his predecessors for, that may serve him going forward:

Trump: "My original instinct was to pull out, and historically, I like following my instincts. But all my life I've heard that decisions are much different when you sit behind the desk in the Oval Office. In other words, when you're president of the United States."

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Or how to lie to get elected and then do like the others because money talk louder than ethics.....I feel sorry for those who voted him, well, actually not really !

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Terrible terrible decision by Trump. Like Obama before him, he promises to stop making wars and then goes straight ahead and does the opposite.

How long will it take American military generals and decision makers to realize that Afghanistan does not want American assistance? Its so embarrassing to see the number of countries the American have destabilized, the number of civilians killed, the number of service men and women killed, the dollars wasted etc etc. All for nothing.

Just pull out and tend to your own business please.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Its a good strategy. At least America steps up and cleans out the rat nests that is Radical Is.......Ter.......

More power to the U.S.A.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

The Taliban tried to surrender when the US first invaded. The tradition there has been that they would stop fighting in exchange representation with the government. That's how it's done there.

The US wouldn't let them surrender.

The US has no desire for peace and cares nothing about the lives of the people living int he countries invaded. War is the American God.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Afghanistan ,Pakistan, Saudi Arabia all harbor or fund terrorist yet none are on Trumps Muslim oops terrorist travel ban!?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Afganistan, soon, will be a battle ground for American and Russian backed forces.

Will see a RAMBO movie again after that battle.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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