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U.S. government shutdown grinds on; Trump threatens emergency powers

81 Comments
By Richard Cowan and Jeff Mason

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81 Comments
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No wall for you.

11 ( +13 / -2 )

Go ahead, Cadet Bonespurs. We've known since you were first elected that you wanted nothing more than an excuse, a way to try and seize power and declare yourself Generalissimo Presidente for Life. You've spit in the face of the Presidency, you've spit on the US Constitution, and you've consistently tried to declare yourself god.

So go ahead, Cadet Bonespurs. Try it, and see how long it'll last. And if it does succeed, than the United States of America truly has passed away.

10 ( +11 / -1 )

Get that wall built, Mr President. We don’t care how you do it. That $18M from the crowdfunding site would get things started.

-14 ( +3 / -17 )

he is trying to destroy usa to please putin.

10 ( +14 / -4 )

You own this, GOP.

The President of the United States is having a meltdown live on national television.

Thanks Trump voters!

11 ( +14 / -3 )

If Trump is in fact addicted to Adderall like some are claiming and his behavior is this erratic, should the world worry more (he does carry the nuke football with him wherever he goes) about him maintaining his habit, or going through withdrawals?

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-snorted-adderall-apprentice-tom-arnold-noel-casler-1257787

6 ( +6 / -0 )

With all the money we waste on other BS, let him build it. If it actually works, the Dems can take credit for working with the President and making it happen. If it fails, like they are so confident that it will, then they win and have another notch in their belt for the next election. Either way, the government gets back to work.

-10 ( +3 / -13 )

Nope. No wall for Trump. Screaming children get a time out, not rewarded.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

Well, then it looks like the government is the one getting the time out. Good luck with that.

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

If it actually works

For $5 billion? If anyone looks at the math (and ladders) it's impossible. Now, if Trump shut down the government for 100 billion dollars for his 2,000 x 50ft wall that he promised, then I might understand his point (even though illegals will continue to use ladders, shovels (for the illegals themselves), and drones, and slingshots (for the drugs).

5 ( +7 / -2 )

For $5 billion? If anyone looks at the math (and ladders) it's impossible.

Which is why I added the second part...

If it fails, like they are so confident that it will, then they win and have another notch in their belt for the next election.

Everyone is so confident it won't work, then let him prove it. We've wasted billions on so much other stuff, just let him have this and watch him fail. Worst case scenario is somehow he actually builds the damn wall. Best case, he fails miserably and won't be able to ask for money like this again because the Dems will have the ultimate 'I told ya so'.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

We had a deal. Trump changed his mind because of stuff he saw on TV. It would be irresponsible for us to allow a Presidency to function that way.

And guess who gets the ratings boost with nightly outrages? Fox. The same people who no doubt helped change his mind. Self-serving swine.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

It would be irresponsible for us to allow a Presidency to function that way.

Except that you think anything that's happening right now isn't allowing it to function the way Trump wants it to?

Either he builds his wall, or he keeps the government shut down. Either way, he's sitting in the office gloating about what he's doing to the Democrats. He's still winning no matter what.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Great. He's winning.

No wall.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

@extank Either way, he's sitting in the office gloating about what he's doing to the Democrats. 

When trolling the libs/dems/left/Hillary/Obama is deemed something to gloat over, it just provides another example of how low Trump supporters have set the bar. But then Trump is known as the toddler-in-chief, an already low 'standing'.

That Trump has never cared about his country other than how he can use it to make more money for himself is one thing, but when dozens of millions of Americans (still a minority of Americans) laud him for his sleazy actions it shows how messed up the country is.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

but when dozens of millions of Americans (still a minority of Americans)

You would be very surprised about how much of a 'minority' it really is. You folks think that the Democrats stonewalling his every action is empowering his opposition, when it is doing exactly the opposite. Combine that with the left's seeming desire to run Hillary against him again, and 'Trump 2020' is closer than anyone would like to imagine...

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

More empty threats. Given that the man was rewriting the history of Soviet era Afghanistan the other day, I wouldn't believe a word he says.

A low person of low standing.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

A low person of low standing.

You'll get no argument from me there. Since Mattis abandoned ship, I lost the last bit of faith that anything remotely positive might come out of the administration.

But at the same time, if you think he'll cave to Congress, you are deluding yourselves. If he really is a stubborn child trying to get his way... well, I remember quite a few nights as a stubborn child going to bed hungry because I didn't get my way at dinner. I never gave in either.

If you're all right and he only cares about himself, you think he's going to give in... or double down?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

How about this, extanker. Pelosi announces that she agrees to Trump's demand. They schedule a time for the signatures. Pelosi shows up and says she's not signing until a new list of demands are met. Then she goes back to her office and gloats.

Would that get you on our side?

The only thing I would agree to is a tiny, token amount. Maybe $500 million. Then I want to see Trump go on stage after shutting down the government and hurting people and bragging to the world that he just secured funding for 2% of his wall. I'd really like him to emphasize that all of the pain was worth the 2% and he plans on shutting down the government again if he has to.

What Trump doesn't have is time. If he wants to tell everyone he will close the government for years, then great. He will be gone in less than 24 months, then we reopen the government and move on with our lives. No government = no wall.

And finally, if you've ever worked in real estate or a profession where you have to negotiate and make deals, one of the worst things you can do is make new demands in the 11th hour. You will be branded as a moving target for the rest of your career, people will know it, and they won't want to work with you. That's because people who move targets are committing a cardinal sin in business: wasting everyone's time.

We had a deal. Trump changed his mind. No wall.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

I think he is beyond reason and logic. He may well try to hold your country hostage but he won't be able to do it.

He doesn't understand the constitution and he underestimates the people.

Thoughts and prayers.l

6 ( +6 / -0 )

He has to see he is painting himself into a corner here, I expect more erratic behavior until this starts really falling apart. (as terrible as it already looks)

This has alway been my issue with the "good business man, good negotiator" line (accurate or not and in any country not just the states), Government isn't a business, all or nothing, no compromise, threats may work in a business arena, but in governance are what makes wars over peace, terrible dictatorships over freedom.

On a personal front, not looking forward to another trip shortly to the US with another shut down in action.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Would that get you on our side?

I don't think you even realize who's side I'm on. You're all downvoting my comments, thinking I'm a Trump supporter, when I'm here in the middle, laughing at all of you for being stubborn children.

I don't care who 'wins' anymore, I'm just looking at the most realistic ways to get the government running again. Let him try to build the damn wall if it means everyone gets back to work.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

@NZ2011

On a personal front, not looking forward to another trip shortly to the US with another shut down in action.

Unless you have business with the government, you'll be fine.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

extankerToday 08:47 am JST

Combine that with the left's seeming desire to run Hillary against him again...

Um... where are you getting that from? I haven't heard about anyone wanting Hillary Clinton to run again, except maybe Hillary Clinton herself.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Meanwhile, Mike Pence got a $10,000 raise during this government shutdown. Shows where Republican priorities lie

6 ( +6 / -0 )

Well unhappy unpaid boarder workers, on limited shifts have made getting in and out even more painful than it usually is in my previous experience.

Anyway.. Lets hope some sense happens soon. I hope 2019 is a year where we start working against opinion as fact, anti-intellectual, xenophobic based policy and actions around the world.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

extanker: I don't think you even realize who's side I'm on. You're all downvoting my comments, thinking I'm a Trump supporter, when I'm here in the middle, laughing at all of you for being stubborn children.

You think I think you're a Trump supporter? I'm arguing with you because I completely disagree with your point. When I say, "come to our side" I'm talking about our side in the debate.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@Simon Foston

Um... where are you getting that from? I haven't heard about anyone wanting Hillary Clinton to run again, except maybe Hillary Clinton herself.

It's been talked about in the news, even here on JT if I remember correctly. The Democrats have been considering it. They don't have anyone else at the moment...

@Superlib

You think I think you're a Trump supporter? I'm arguing with you because I completely disagree with your point. When I say, "come to our side" I'm talking about our side in the debate.

I think anyone who doesn't immediately condemn Trump is considered a Trump supporter here (and most anywhere else). Thing is, I won't come to your side in the debate because I'm not being idealistic, I'm being realistic. I don't believe Trump will give in. Someone needs to blink first, and it's not going to be him. You think a two year shutdown is fine as long as Trump doesn't get his wall. I just want to get the government back in business, I don't care who 'wins'.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Trump is a flip-flopper, but he also loves a good fight. That's where he's at with this one, he flip-flopped a few times, but then it turned into a fight he can use to get his base behind him, which has given him energy.

The good news is that because he is a flip-flopper, it means he can flop back again. Once enough Republican senators start to hear it from their constituents that they have had enough of this shutdown, Congress will eventually pass the bill to save their own hides, leaving the fight fully in Trump's hands. Without the backing of Congress, it will be interesting to see if and how long Trump holds out.

It's kind of worth it, so the people can see just how messed up the entire country can become by choosing a person entirely unqualified to be president. It's like the junky who can't rise until they've fallen to their lowest; they need the perspective of just how bad things can get, to act as a motivator to ensure things don't get that bad again. So the more Trump royally screws up the country, the more painful it will be, but will serve as more clear example of why people shouldn't elect a snake-oil salesman for president.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

So the more Trump royally screws up the country, the more painful it will be, but will serve as more clear example of why people shouldn't elect a snake-oil salesman for president.

Which is why I say to let him try to build the wall. Especially if everyone is so confident it will fail. More ammo against him.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

The real question is whether this is all just Trump distracting everyone from the fact that pretty much his entire inner circle has been found to have been corrupt and is either in jail, facing jail, or made a guilty plea. People talking about the shutdown means people not talking about whether or not the president is a criminal. Looking bad for shutting down the government may not be good, but looking bad for having screwed America is a lot worse!

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Pelosi shows up and says she's not signing until a new list of demands are met. Then she goes back to her office and gloats.

But that could go both ways, because the Republicans can easily throw it back to the Dems for the things they want to see done legislatively where they could go back and gloat. There are so many ways both sides an maneuver this politically.

The only thing I would agree to is a tiny, token amount. Maybe $500 million. Then I want to see Trump go on stage after shutting down the government and hurting people and bragging to the world that he just secured funding for 2% of his wall. I'd really like him to emphasize that all of the pain was worth the 2% and he plans on shutting down the government again if he has to.

For millions of people that live along the border and seeing how the Democrats for over 35 years been incognito on the border security issue, the risks are too great. There is that segment of the population as well that have had enough.

What Trump doesn't have is time. If he wants to tell everyone he will close the government for years, then great. He will be gone in less than 24 months,

...or 2024 if the economy keeps roaring on as the latest jobs report is going..

then we reopen the government and move on with our lives. No government = no wall.

That would be very difficult and would start burial proceedings for the Democrats.

And finally, if you've ever worked in real estate or a profession where you have to negotiate and make deals, one of the worst things you can do is make new demands in the 11th hour. You will be branded as a moving target for the rest of your career, people will know it, and they won't want to work with you. That's because people who move targets are committing a cardinal sin in business: wasting everyone's time.

But deals have been made in the 11th hour. Last ditch deals have been made.

We had a deal. Trump changed his mind. No wall.

We had a deal, No DACA, Democrats changed their minds, no Democrat progressive legislation.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

. People talking about the shutdown means people not talking about whether or not the president is a criminal.

Excellent point. Trump's always been a master media manipulator. And the wall issues are giant, shiny squirrels that keep reporters busy writing stories other than fire and car wreck of the day and more importantly not writing about all of the criminal issues surrounding Trump, his family and syndicate.

On a media reporting and government shutdown tangent, does anyone know if government contractors in Japan, for example those working for US Armed Forces Network and the government's other propaganda arms, are still getting paid?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

so if Dems won’t talk during a shutdown what would be their motivation to talk once Trump agrees to reopen the government? Keep it shut down. Declare a national emergency, get it done.

they lie right to his face. Pelosi said oh we aren’t trying to impeach you. Someone better tell the guy who filed articles of impeachment and the profanity screaming congresswoman that.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

I do believe that the dems are misreading how voters are thinking again.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Excellent point. Trump's always been a master media manipulator. And the wall issues are giant, shiny squirrels that keep reporters busy writing stories other than fire and car wreck of the day and more importantly not writing about all of the criminal issues surrounding Trump, his family and syndicate.

So border security is a shiny squirrel? Wow....just wow.....

On a media reporting and government shutdown tangent, does anyone know if government contractors in Japan, for example those working for US Armed Forces Network and the government's other propaganda arms, are still getting paid?

Not sure, but it doesn’t have anything to do with increased border security.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

anyone dissatisfied with their government job and not getting paid for a little while can just quit and get a non governmental job. trump has created millions of those too.

if it takes years that’s what it takes. Do you think Trump will get any praise if he reopens the government without a wall? Is he “statesmanlike?” Nope he will be mocked and attacked as being weak and having lied to his loyal supporters. So we are getting wall funding, be realistic. Wall, enhanced fencing, barrier, whatever.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Five billion is nothing compared to the 1.5 trillion unaccountable money lost in Iraq. Let him have it, it will fail anyway. But he was democratically voted in power on this issue and creating American jobs. 5 billion will create a lot of jobs building it.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Be interesting to see him use emergency powers. Don't know why he just didnt go for that and save everyone the drama, not to mention a shutdown.

Still, I cannot see a border wall over such a vast, vast area working.

Is there something wrong with a fence, 24/7 CCTV, drone patrols and border forces on standby?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Extanker: Ithink anyone who doesn't immediately condemn Trump is considered a Trump supporter here (and most anywhere else). Thing is, I won't come to your side in the debate because I'm not being idealistic, I'm being realistic. I don't believe Trump will give in. Someone needs to blink first, and it's not going to be him. You think a two year shutdown is fine as long as Trump doesn't get his wall. I just want to get the government back in business, I don't care who 'wins'.

Did your speech go as well as you thought it would? I mean, you didn’t quite get me to say what you wanted me to, but the delivery was nice.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

@bas4 So border security is a shiny squirrel? Wow....just wow.....

Reductionist thinking again, but border security does NOT equal wall. Trump's wall is a gigantic, shiny squirrel.

On a media reporting and government shutdown tangent, does anyone know if government contractors in Japan, for example those working for US Armed Forces Network and the government's other propaganda arms, are still getting paid?

@bas4 Not sure, but it doesn’t have anything to do with increased border security.

But it does have to do with spending more government money which could be much better used on infrastructure and any number of things that would benefit the US public and not just government contractors pushing propaganda.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The wall is something that the American electorate voted for by choosing Donald Trump.

He needs the money but Congress is blocking him and by that fact the American people.....

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

The wall is something that the American electorate voted for by choosing Donald Trump.

A wall paid for by Mexico was something that a minority of the American electorate voted for when choosing Trump.

So why are you people so weak on him being weak on Mexico? It makes no sense. That's what he promised to you, yet now you're trying to reframe it that he should be weak on Mexico and make America pay? Why do you people want to Punish America? Why do you hate America?

He needs the money but Congress is blocking him and by that fact the American people.....

Um no:

"If you say who gets fired, it always has to be the top. Problems start from the top, and they have to get solved from the top, and the president’s the leader, and he’s got to get everybody in a room, and he’s got to lead. And he doesn’t do that, he doesn’t like doing that, that’s not his strength."

"when they talk about the government shutdown, they’re going to be talking about the president of the United States, who the president was at that time. They’re not going to be talking about who was the head of the House, the head the Senate, who’s running things in Washington. So I really think the pressure is on the president."

“FACT – the reason why Americans have to worry about a government shutdown is because Obama refuses to pass a budget.”

The only one blocking America, by his own words, is Trump.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Look at bully boy in his Jesus Christ pose again. Pity me. Now he's threatening to invoke a false  'emergency' as an excuse for his stupid wall. This is unbecoming of a President and this is abuse of power, abuse of office and other crimes against the Constitution - dictatorial bullying actions and IMPEACHABLE OFFENSES!

1 ( +1 / -0 )

If you need a big laugh today check out the video on CNN of the reporter asking Trump why Mexico isn't paying for the wall.

Trump's response is an incredible stream of consciousness rant about how it's not a wall; it's a fence or anything you want to call it. Then amazingly continues to refer to a wall, a beautiful wall, and so on. I want to go on, but will just say check out the video.

I can not believe American's have not only given this person the Presidency, but continue to allow him to stay there.

It's easy to see why China is beginning it's move to global Hegemony.

Unbelievable.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

I just went and found that CNN video. So all he wants is a see-through steel wall.

Seems legit. Steel is known for its transparency factor, right?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Wrong again, as per usual. He has no idea of the scope of presidential powers because he's never read the constitution or other relevant documents, never been schooled by authorities on the subject, or even bothered to learn his job description. He is a civil servant, beholden to the citizens. Any attempt on his part to move unilaterally will be prevented by the courts, because the US is a nation of laws, not a monarchy. What an utter dunce. Someone needs to gag him and sit him in a corner.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

If your father was like Trump, that kept on ranting and raving, you'd have him committed to a mental facility. So does that make Trump better than say your father or family relative. Invoke the 25th amendment and get this idiot out of the WH.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Here's the situation. Trump knows that he can't get a real wall, but that he can get money for border security measures, including the reinforcement of existing structures. And he's actually OK with that. Problem is he promised his base a wall. They're slobbering for it. So what he wants now is for Democrats to somehow agree to semantically conflate border security with "a wall" so that he can claim victory.

Pelosi and Schumer know Trump's game, and they're not going to play it. Trump is going to end up with egg on his face.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

trump: It is all about me.

trump: Tough you are not getting paid.

trump: Tough you aint going to get your income tax return.

trump: Tough you aint going to get your food stamps to feed your families.

trump: I gave a $10.000 raise to those who work for me.

trump: See how I work, you say yes mr bone spurs, you keep your jobs.

trump: Those who voted for me have only yourselves to blame.

trump: Get over it people. IT IS ALL ABOUT ME !!

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Statistics show that illegal immigration outflow has superseded inflow for about a half-decade - that is, the number of illegal immigrants resident in the US continues to diminish. Does this sound like a "national emergency"?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

"Let them eat cake."

..... attributed to Marie Antoinette (and Donald J. Trump)

2 ( +2 / -0 )

*Look at bully boy in his Jesus Christ pose again. Pity me. Now he's threatening to invoke a false 'emergency' as an excuse for his stupid wall. *

What is up with liberals and wanting open borders?

*This is unbecoming of a President and this is abuse of power, abuse of office and other crimes against the Constitution - dictatorial bullying actions and *IMPEACHABLE OFFENSES

Maybe, but not enough to get 2/3 of the Senate to remove him, so that idea went out the window.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

@bass What is up with liberals and wanting open borders?

Dont know you should ask them not that I have heard any of them say they want open borders...but hey if that is how you want to spin it go for it...we do know how you love the ol spin....

4 ( +4 / -0 )

*He said he could declare a national emergency* "because of the security of our country, absolutely."

The greatest threat to the security of American citizens is not a border with people illegally crossing raping, robbing and murdering, but the the actions of legal American citizens killing 10,000s of other legal American citizens every year with guns.

When the deaths of Americans caused by illegals starts to approach even a few % of the homicides in the states, then perhaps Trump can be taken seriously.

ATM the Big threat is controlling the legals - divert wall money to save US lives.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Dont know you should ask them

Been doing that for 35 years and still silence. A shame.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

extankerToday 08:03 am JST

With all the money we waste on other BS, let him build it. If it actually works, the Dems can take credit for working with the President and making it happen. If it fails, like they are so confident that it will, then they win and have another notch in their belt for the next election. Either way, the government gets back to work.

You speak to much common sense, the Democrats whole plan is to obstruct, obstruct, obstruct they don't want the wall built and potentially give Trump an Ace for 2020.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Democrats have called the wall immoral, ineffective and medieval.

All emotional terms.

Let's use facts, ok?

Countries have the duty to control their borders, especially from people planning to do things against the laws of that country.

A fence/wall/barrier isn't 100% effective, but it will slow the entry rate. In places that didn't have barriers previously and have them now, illegal crossings have been reduced 80% according to CBP estimates. It just means that people have to cross legally at control points.

Medieval? Really? Seriously? Emotional much?

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Strangerland: So all he wants is a see-through steel wall.

Taken out of context. Certainly the facts should be enough to make a valid point, no need to make up hyperbole and FUD.

https://www.jr-art.net/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/l1080685_0.jpg is similar to what they want.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

A fence/wall/barrier isn't 100% effective, but it will slow the entry rate. In places that didn't have barriers previously and have them now, illegal crossings have been reduced 80% according to CBP estimates. It just means that people have to cross legally at control points.

The vast majority of undocumented immigrants do not enter through the southern border. Let's do let the facts speak for themselves.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Been doing that for 35 years and still silence. A shame.

Because an answer would dignify such an asinine question.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Yeah and while this guy whines and mopes around the White House, federal workers had to explain to their kids why Santa wasn't gonna come by their house on Christmas

2 ( +3 / -1 )

The vast majority of undocumented immigrants do not enter through the southern border. 

Never say that to a Trump supporter. Trump supporters only think that 100% of illegals jump the fence. It has to be a 2,000 mile x 50 ft wall. Trump supporters don't believe that Mexicans enter the US through airports or authorized checkpoints. They think 100% of them jump the wall/fence, which means it has to be 50 foot high.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

@Chip - The vast majority of undocumented immigrants do not enter through the southern border. Let's do let the facts speak for themselves.

I find it impressive that you have this data when the CBP doesn't. https://www.dhs.gov/publication/fiscal-year-2017-entryexit-overstay-report

They admit they can't count land crossings through approved and non-approved land crossings with either Mexico or Canada. They do count plane and ship crossing with great detail, mostly due to automatic data sharing systems.

I did find reports from 2006 by Pew Research, but nobody would assume that is still accurate.

Care to share a current, factual link/source?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The vast majority of undocumented immigrants do not enter through the southern border. Let's do let the facts speak for themselves.

No, they just magically and mystically vaporize in the US. Maybe they got help from Dr. Strange...the vast majority..

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

theFu: "Medieval? Really? Seriously? Emotional much?"

As opposed to the stable genius' temper tantrums and more time spent tweeting in one night than answering questions in his entire tenure? Who has skin so thin he has to call FOX to cry on air and hold fake meetings (with the wrong poster!) because he's not getting the attention Pelosi is? Hahaha.

bass4funk: "No, they just magically and mystically vaporize in the US."

Well, we know you can find quite a few on Trump-owned properties.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Well, we know you can find quite a few on Trump-owned properties.

But you’ll find the majority of them in California, Arizona, Nevada, Texas.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Do, you guys won’t complain when the next president closes government or declares a national emergency to get whatever their signature campaign issue was. Say... universal healthcare... or banning guns...

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Smith, I'm an issue person, not a republican or Trump supporter. On some issues I do support Trump and on others, I don't.

I don't have CATV. Haven't seen Fox News or CNN or MSNBC in about a decade. When I look at news from a website I don't know, I check a few "fact checking" website to get an idea how they lean. If they aren't mostly center (like JT, regardless of the wacko comments here), then I move onto a better source. Extreme people on both sides have taken to lying like never before. I suppose that makes sense with a liar-in-chief in office.

A complete border wall/fence/barrier isn't something I can get behind, but certainly having barriers for 30-50 miles along population centers inside Mexico does make sense. Let's make illegal crossings near cities require digging 15 ft down or hiding inside an onion container for 6+ hours. It shouldn't be a stroll without going through official checkpoints.

bass4funk No, they just magically and mystically vaporize in the US. Maybe they got help from Dr. Strange...the vast majority..

Many arrive through land, sea, air border control points, overstay different sorts of visas. It is unknown how many people enter the USA through land crossings, even at border controls, much less hidden inside different vehicles or crossing in remote area by walking for a few days. Every year the CBP makes a report to Congress with the data they do have. It is far from complete. I looked over the 2017 report (link is above) for plane and ship entires earlier today, as a rough estimate, about 0.8% of people overstay their visas in the USA more than 60 days. At least that's my guess. It is broken down by country and by how long they overstay. But some travelers will enter the USA in a plane, drive to Canada, and leave by plane that way, which doesn't show up in the "I've left the US" counts. There are lots of data issues, since land crossings don't have the same formal entry/exit record keeping that other entrance/exit methods provide.

Even counting all the people crossing in/out at land border points is beyond CBP today. It is a data acquisition problem currently. The CBP is making guesses for some of their patrolling without real data. I'm a data guy and want facts to help make the best decisions. That isn't always possible, so doing something could be better.

I'd be inclined to fix the data acquisition problem while building the border fences where they are known to be needed. Mexican passports/border cards have RFID inside. The US is working with Mexico to exchange this data. They get our data and we get theirs. Canada and the US have been sharing border crossing data for a long time.

Facts help us make and demand better decisions from our representatives.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

That $18M from the crowdfunding site would get things started.

so 18m in one month at this rate the wall will be paid for in about 106yrs LOL

3 ( +3 / -0 )

If Trump tries to invoke "emergency powers," he will be IMPEACHED immediately. Obstruction of justice and collusion with Russia.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Maybe, but not enough to get 2/3 of the Senate to remove him, so that idea went out the window.

start declaring emergencies to get your deluded pet projects bypassing the congress then Im not so sure that 2/3 would be that difficult, afterall once Pence is POTUS its highly doubtful hed want a wall or be a recalcitrant fool like Trump

3 ( +3 / -0 )

The wall is going to be built if Trump has to order the military to build it. I'm sure our troops in Syria would love to work on the wall rather than get shot at in Syria where they're not wanted.

"If Trump tries to invoke "emergency powers," he will be IMPEACHED"

No, he's not. Remember, it takes two thirds of the Senate to impeach. Hahahahahahahaha!

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

"once Pence is POTUS"

Doubtful. But it is highly likely that he will be VP for the next 6 years.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Since you conservatives are so convinced Trump cares about the safety of our country, how about he gets the money for his wall if he resigns?

We might as well give him the money and then watch as it takes years and years for all the litigation over condemning land and the environmental issues winds its way through the courts.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The Fu: I see your DHS report and raise you a DHS report:

https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/17_0914_estimates-of-border-security.pdf

1 ( +1 / -0 )

While it is hard to know exactly what the president has in mind, or whether he has any conception about what it would entail, one thing is clear: Not only would such an action be illegal, but if members of the armed forces obeyed his command, they would be committing a federal crime.

From the founding onward, the American constitutional tradition has opposed the president’s use of the military to enforce domestic law. A provision added to the law in 1956 declares that whoever “willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force” to execute a law domestically “shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years” — except when “expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress.”

Another provision, added to the law in 1981, requires the secretary of defense to “ensure that any activity (including the provision of any equipment or facility or the assignment or detail of any personnel)” must “not include or permit direct participation by a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps. So here again, we see the prevaricator-in-chief out of his depth for the 6000th-odd time.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Just build the wall already, problem solved. This steering action forces those countries who for decades, have been corrupt and lazy and sent their unskilled citizens to the US to send remittances back to their country. Force them to create a real economy, like the US did, and stop mooching off others.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

I wouldn't have a problem if less US military money is spent on killing people overseas and more is spent securing the US borders. Seems like a good idea. I'd like to see the DoD budgets reduced 1%/yr for the next 20 yrs with annual reviews for how the world is going. A day where China, Russia, Europe and the USA have no standing armies would be nice. Think of all the wasted money that could be used towards advanced, efficient power, fighting terrible diseases and protecting the environment instead? We are long away from that ideal world, unfortunately.

As for dealing with illegal immigrants to the USA, we need to look at the data and spend according to where it does the most good. Forcing the costs for Coyote services to go up helps the illegal immigration problem among other problems like imported drugs. I think the drugs should be legalized and taxed, then take that tax money for border security and getting people off harder drugs for the more recreational types like marijuana. Hopefully, the cost for a fun weekend smoking will drop to the same for alcohol.

Chip - nicely played. ;) I'll read that report. Thank you.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Is he going to do 'Something special'....like Hitler's seize the absolute power after the fire of Reichstag? Better watch careful!

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@superlib

Did your speech go as well as you thought it would? I mean, you didn’t quite get me to say what you wanted me to, but the delivery was nice.

Uh what? I didn't expect you to say anything at all (and really, I was not disappointed). You think I expected you to suddenly change your mind or something? I was just replying to your comment. But thanks for thinking it sounded nice, I guess...?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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